Q4 2023 ChargePoint Holdings Inc Earnings Call

Speaker 1: For a more detailed description of certain factors that could cause actual results to differ, please refer to our Form 10Q filed with the SEC on December 8, 2022, and our earnings release posted today on our website and filed with the SEC on Form 8K. Also, please note that we use certain non-GAAP financial measures on this call.

Speaker 1: over to Pestqua.

Speaker 1: Thank you, Patrick, and thanks to everyone for joining us today. Yesterday marked our second anniversary of being a public company, and I'd like to start by recognizing the team here at ChargePoint that has worked tirelessly to continue to evolve the company to fulfill the enormous role we play in the energy transition.

Speaker 1: Before I get into a bit of retrospective on the full year and what the road ahead holds for us, I'll review the fourth quarter results for fiscal 2023.

Speaker 1: Our fourth quarter grew 93% year on year and 22% sequentially, making another record quarterly revenue level for the company, while improving non-GAAP margins by three points to 23%, delivering on our expectations set on our last call that we would sequentially improve gross margins.

Speaker 1: However, on that same call we effectively raised the midpoint of our full year guidance by $5 million. The revenue results for the full year were slightly below the original guidance midpoint and 2.5% below the revised guidance midpoint. Fourth quarter revenue results were below the guidance range and 7% short of the midpoint.

Speaker 1: This was due to a combination of special circumstances. The first is a decrease in North American commercial demand during the month of December .

Speaker 1: The second, while overall supply chain limitations have eased, they persist for certain hardware products. Lastly, we just missed shipment cut-offs for some customers that caused a larger gap between billings in revenue than historical norms.

Speaker 1: To put that in perspective, the full year revenue was $468 million. Our business grew 94% this year versus last and over 90% year on year each quarter.

Speaker 1: We manage operating expenses through the year.

Speaker 1: to achieve the improving operating leverage you see. And this is foundational to becoming cashflow positive in calendar 2024. We are exceptionally proud of crossing through an annualized subscription revenue benchmark of $100 million.

Speaker 1: We also demonstrated growth in fleet as a major vertical globally in our European business across all verticals. Both of these outpaced the 94% growth rate of the company to gain ground as a percentage of overall revenue.

Speaker 1: A good example of our progress in fleet and the power of our ecosystem is the recent announcement of the United States Postal Service Award with our distribution partner Rexel.

Speaker 1: Partnerships like these are critical pieces of our differentiated business model. In the fourth quarter, over 70% of buildings were through our channel partners consistent with historical results.

Speaker 1: And even with limitations on vehicle supply in the vertical, fleet is already a significant component of our revenue and a coiled spring when the vehicles are readily available.

Speaker 1: This is an essential part of our growth strategy. Participating in nearly every vertical of EV charging in both Europe and North America not only fuels our growth but also provides resilience in the face of short-term emphasis as we shift across verticals and geographies.

Speaker 1: We benefited from this in COVID years and expect this diversity to be an asset as the market continues to develop for years to come.

Speaker 1: Let me give you a sense of where we have been this past year to help you gauge how well we are positioned for the future.

Speaker 1: We operate at the center of an expanding ecosystem that's highly invested in the electrification and mobility. We are now seeing that investment accelerate from those force multipliers. And this indicates that the ecosystem, not just the auto industry, is past the point of no return. Buttering Europe

Speaker 1: of an expanding ecosystem that's highly invested in the electrification of mobility. We are now seeing that investment accelerate from those force multipliers. And this indicates that the ecosystem, not just the auto industry, is past the point of no return. Some examples.

Speaker 1: ChargePoint now has over a dozen automotive partnerships live where ChargePoint's cloud service aggregates access to all major public charging networks in Europe and North America via the OEM Zindash system or companion app.

Speaker 1: Partners added this year include Lexus, Mazda, Toyota, and Fisker this year.

Speaker 1: Additionally, many auto OEMs offer our ChargePoint home charger and recommend us to their dealers for their charging needs.

Speaker 1: We added numerous fleet OEMs as partners as well. We continue to work with the iOS and Android platforms as well as the native Google car experience.

Speaker 1: We added UTA, a leading European fuel cart provider to our long list of payment partners. We added STEM and other partners to enable charging to be integrated into broader site-wide energy management.

Speaker 1: We continue to grow our channel partner network and launched our mobile application for installers as our first step in creating an education and support platform for these key players. We continue to work with governments in North America and Europe to shape policy and programs such as NEVI to remove barriers and ensure a vibrant and consistent charging market.

Speaker 1: Lastly, we announced partnerships with Volvo and Starbucks, as well as Mercedes-Benz and M&A Energy, to enable great brands serving the 30-minute retail economy with EV charging to create a fantastic road trip experience for EV drivers.

Speaker 1: Turning to network, general customer, and environmental statistics, we finished the quarter with over 225,000 active ports under management including over 18,900 DC ports.

Speaker 1: We'll just enter a third of our overall courts in Europe .

Speaker 1: We also provided our drivers access to over 465,000 rolling ports with over 445,000 of those ports in Europe , significantly strengthening our EU offerings for Seidos.

Speaker 1: We now call 80% of the 2021 Fortune 50 and 55% of the 2021 Fortune 500 as customers.

Speaker 1: and over 70% of billings from existing customers consistent with historical norms and our Land and Expand strategy.

Speaker 1: As of the end of the quarter, we estimate that our network has now fueled approximately 5.6 billion electric miles, avoiding approximately 224 million cumulative gallons of gasoline and over 1 million metric tons of greenhouse gas emissions.

Speaker 1: While we are facing many of the same headwinds as the rest of the space, the momentum of the ecosystem in which we operate and our differentiated business model are not only driving the near-term results we've seen, but position us to capitalize on what is clearly an inevitable long-term growth cycle. I'm proud of the ChargePoint team and our partners who made this year possible.

Speaker 1: Together, we are uniquely positioned to pursue this remarkable market opportunity. I am confident we are on the right trajectory heading into this year. Rex, over to you.

Speaker 2: Thanks, Ms. Squally. As a reminder, please see our earnings release where we reconcile or non-gap results to gap. Our principal exclusions are stock-based compensation.

Speaker 2: amortization of intangible assets and certain costs related to restructuring and to acquisitions. Also we continue to report revenue along three lines, network charging systems, subscriptions, and other. Network charging systems represents our connected hardware. Subscriptions include our cloud services connecting that hardware.

Speaker 2: Erasure warranties and retouchments at the service offerings where we bundle our solutions into recording subscriptions.

Speaker 2: The other consists of energy credits, professional services, and certain non-material revenue items. The other consists of energy credits, professional services, and certain non-material revenue items.

Speaker 2: Moving to results, fourth quarter revenue was strong at $153 million, up 93% year-on-year and 22% sequentially.

Speaker 2: But below are previously announced a guidance range of 160 to 170 million is just calling noted. Again, the shortfall was principally due to supply issues.

Speaker 2: with our DC product lines as availability was better, but that's still not sufficient to hit the significant ramp from the third quarter to the fourth quarter. A lack of linearity that forced shipments too late in the quarter to meet our revenue cutoff criteria and softer North American commercial demand than expected also contributed.

Speaker 2: Network charging systems at $122 million was 80% of fourth quarter revenue, up 109% year-on-year, and 25% sequentially.

Speaker 2: Subscription revenue at $26 million was 17% of total revenue, in line with its third quarter percentage contribution of 50% year-on-year and 19% sequentially.

Speaker 2: Importantly, as Pat mentioned, this quarter we hit a significant milestone of $100 million in annual run rate for this revenue line.

Speaker 2: Further, our deferred revenue from subscriptions, representing future recurring revenue from existing customer commitments and payments, continued to grow nicely, finishing the quarter at $199 million, up from $175 million at the end of the third quarter.

Speaker 2: Other revenue of $5 million and 3% of total revenue.

Speaker 2: Increased 37% year on year but was down 22% sequentially.

Speaker 2: largely due to the decreased values of LCFS credits.

Speaker 2: Turning to verticals, we continue to report them from a billings perspective, which approximates the revenue split. Fourth quarter billings percentages were commercial 69%.

Speaker 2: fleet 19%, residential 11%, and other at less than 1%, representing a several point gain for a fleet business versus last year. From a geographic perspective, fourth quarter North America revenue was 86%, Europe was 14% as our European business continues to expand.

Speaker 2: We were particularly pleased with this progress as cost reductions, higher ASVs, and incrementally lower supply chain headwinds more than offset certain product transition costs.

Speaker 2: Specifically, we saw a four-point drag from supply chain impact during the quarter.

Speaker 2: non-GAAP operating expenses for the fourth quarter were $81 million, a year-on-year increase of 5 percent, and a sequential increase of 2 percent. We continued to manage operating expenses carefully, and with several key product releases achieved earlier in 2022, new product introduction costs were lower in the fourth quarter.

Speaker 2: Stock-based compensation in the fourth quarter was $26 million. Recall that our annual refresh cycle will be in our second fiscal quarter. Looking at cash and equivalents, we finished the quarter with $400 million, slightly higher than $398 million at the end of the third quarter as we use our eight-year-old-time

Speaker 2: ATM or at the market offering program to raise $50 million in December .

Speaker 2: At the end of the fourth quarter, we had approximately 348 million shares outstanding.

Speaker 2: Turning to the year, annual revenue was 468 million up 94% year-on-year network charging systems.

Speaker 2: At 364 million with 78% of total revenue for the year and up 109% of your own year.

Speaker 2: Subscription revenue at $85 million was 18% of total revenue and up 59% year-on-year. Other represented the balance of 4%.

Speaker 2: Quickly covering verticals for the year, buildings by vertical. For the full year, we're commercial 69%, fleet 17%, residential 12%, and other 1%, like the fourth quarter, reflecting particular strength in fleet.

Speaker 2: From a geographic perspective, full year revenue from North America was 84%, and Europe was 16% as Europe outpaces our overall growth rate.

Speaker 2: fiscal 2023, our European business delivered 73 million in revenue of 190 percent year-on-year. Turning to gross margin, non-gap gross margin for the year was 20 percent, down from 24 percent the previous year, principally due to a higher mix of DC products and to an approximately five percentage point supply chain and logistics impact.

Speaker 2: Non gap operating expenses for the year were 324M.

Speaker 2: A year-on-year increase of 35% and managed well below our original targets for the year.

Speaker 2: Again, we are focused on delivering improved operating leverage as non-GAAP operating expenses as a percentage of revenue went from 103% in the first quarter to 53% in the fourth quarter. To maintain our path to profitability, we responded to fiscal 2023 gross margin shortfalls by spending $35 million less.

Speaker 2: and non-GAAP operating expenses relative to our original annual guidance and essentially kept quarterly non-GAAP op-ex flat each quarter of the year. Turning to guidance.

Speaker 2: As you all know, we guided for the full year last year on revenue, gross margin, and operating expenses. We did this because we were a newly public company and analyst estimates varied from our expectations too greatly across these measures.

Speaker 2: As we look at fiscal 2024, there's far less dispersion in external estimates. Accordingly, we believe annual guidance is not necessary this year.

Speaker 2: For the first quarter of fiscal 2024, we expect revenue to be $122 to $132 million, a year-over-year increase of 56% at the bid point. As you may recall, we typically see a seasonal drop in revenue from the fourth quarter to the first quarter as site hosts reload budgets and construction slows in the winter.

Speaker 2: However, keep in mind that in addition to being seasonally down from the 1st quarter, our 1st quarter historically contributes a significantly lower percentage of her annual revenue than quarters two through four.

Speaker 2: On other measures, we expect continued sequential improvement in gross margin this year as supply chain challenges continue to ease or cost down efforts continue, and we get the benefit of volume on newer products. Regarding operating expenses, we expect leverage to be lower in the first quarter or lower revenue but then to improve through the balance.

Speaker 2: of the year and for the year. Advances in these metrics are key to our commitments to turning cash flow positive in the fourth quarter of 2024.

Speaker 2: Reaching this milestone next year with the North American EV passenger fleet estimated by Bloomberg, and yet under 5% and under 8% in Europe should position the company well early in the industry's growth cycle.

Speaker 2: milestone next year with the North American EV passenger fleet estimated by Bloomberg and under 5% and under 8% in Europe should position the company well early in the industry's growth cycle. Operator, listen to Q&A.

Speaker 3: Thank you, sir. And ladies and gentlemen, if you have a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad. Once again, that is star one if you have a question. We'll go first to Colin Rush Oppenheimer.

Speaker 2: Thanks so much, guys. You know, I wanted to dig into the season alley piece of this. You see this in a variety of industries. And you know what it looks like has happened in the first quarter of your fiscal year, as you end up, you know, penciling out about 18 to 20 percent of the annual revenue. And you're guiding to something a little bit north of 50 percent here. I guess.

Speaker 2: What can you say about the backlog and your visibility into the balance of the year and how you're thinking about the seasonal trajectory of revenue throughout the balance of the fiscal year? Hey Colin, thanks for the question. So if you look at our Q&A outlook, as I said in the prepared remarks, it's a

We're a growth company, right? So you end up with a lower percentage in Q1 relative to the percentages for Qs 2 through 4. So you can extrapolate, I think, successfully from there. Looking at your models and our historical performance, I think that's something that you guys can do.

From a backlog perspective, we actually did a nice job in Q4 of burning off some of the historical backlog. As we said in prior quarters, we don't actually think that backlog is necessarily a virtue. We're not a backlog business, particularly maybe that changes as fleet continues to become a broader.

part of the company's business, but you know, we're a land and expand business and we want product out the door and in people's hands and in the ground. So, you know, we're going to burn that down and it was a nice backstop for Q4. It's a decent backstop for Q1, but we're going to work that off as we go through next year.

Thanks so much. And then just in terms of the texture of the client engagement right now, can you talk a little bit about what trends you're seeing in terms of incremental customers that you're adding into that land, part of the land expand strategy and the velocity of sales in terms of whether it's accelerating or decelerating with existing customers as you get into the first part of the year? For people not to wish MapingEdible Candidates asame for HR plan, there is a fa

So, call it up. I think the easiest way to answer that is to point you at a statistic in our prepared remarks.

The rebuy rate as a percentage of our revenue in the quarter was very consistent with historical norms which indicates that the customer ad rate is holding.

There's no further color to add. Okay, I'll leave it there then guys. Thanks so much. Up next we'll hear from James West, Evercore ISI. Hey, good afternoon guys.

So Rex, a question for you is to clarify the revenue shortfall versus your guidance from the quarter. If you had made, if those shipments had gone out,

you know in time would you still have been within or even above your guidance range because it's not really a revenue you're not going to get it's going to come at a different time.

Yeah, that's a good question, right? So first thing I would say is we put a lot of pressure on ourselves going from Q3 to Q4. You know, it was a big uptick and we accomplished most of it. But I don't actually know the number, but I think that at the end of the quarter, the semi trucks were sort of lined up around the

Okay, got it. That's very helpful. Thanks. And then, another question maybe for Pat is, with your customer and customer engagement right now, do you have a sense for how much of your business is new customers putting up charging stations versus existing customers adding to their charging networks?

Yeah, I mean, I think that's just a different way of asking the same question that Colin asked previously. About 30% of the quarter was new customers, then there was no deal size anomaly in that. So if the revenue split percentage is very consistent with historical norms, the new customer ad rate is consistent with that.

Okay, good stuff. All right, thanks, guys. Our next question is Gabe Dowell, TD Cowen. Thank you. Hey, everybody. Good afternoon. Maybe just starting on the margin side, you obviously showed sequential improvement on a non-GAAP basis. Could you, Rex, maybe give us a little bit of a background on the

Just give us a little bit of color on the trajectory there and maybe what some of the puts and takes are with respect to margin. Is it fair to assume maybe you continue to turn out like 100 basis point improvement sequentially throughout the rest of the year? Let's see what these pictures give us in the next few minutes

Yeah, so, you know, if you look at the year, we were, you know, 17, 19, 20 and 23.

of course, through the year and we're hard at work in terms of driving that forward. The supply chain thing has been as high as six or seven, now it's more like four, that helps.

We banged through the fact that MIX shifted this year meaningfully in favor of DC, which is one good from a resilience standpoint, but it's not the highest.

margin product that we do. So we've managed to bank through that and those margins have come up nicely. Our ops team delivering meaningful cost downs. And then the price increases that we did last year. So mix makes it hard, but all these other factors are contributing to being able to add to the numbers. If you look to next year.

You'll note in my prepared remarks I gave AG we have lower revenue in Q1 therefore the operating expense leverage is going to go the wrong way for Q1 but then go back the right way in Q234. But I did say sequential improvement in gross margins throughout the year next year so you know I wouldn't put a number on it like is it one is it two don't know.

or can't guide, but I do think there's going to be a steady progression next year. Okay, thanks, Rex. That's helpful. And then maybe just going to your comment around seeing a little bit less demand in December . I mean, is that just seasonality? Obviously, you've been setting up a seasonally week one queue or...

Are you concerned at all with a lot of your tech giant customers in California kind of tightening the strings a bit on spending? Is that creeping into demand issues as well? Could you maybe help us think about that? Thanks, guys. Yeah. I think the easiest way to...

to put get some overarching color on that is the revenue diversity has increased meaningfully over time in the company. I made some comments in my prepared remarks about the increased percentage on fleet and Europe overall as a percentage of revenue and I'll remind you that it had to outpace what was already a blistering year-over-year growth rate.

that have more of a discretionary stance with respect to the timing around when they put in charging. And I want to emphasize this, eventually the attach rates prevail. And so in a set of verticals,

more so in North America than in Europe . You are seeing some delays or delays of ordering, but we don't see it as a fundamental shift at all. We see it as effectively aligned with the macro and with the increased resilience in the business, with respect to just the spread. There's no hotspots if you look at.

the residential business, commercial, fleet, then you look at the geographies, you've seen us make meaningful progress in all those fronts. So while there's definitely an economic overhang in a couple of verticals, I'm really very pleased that the business doesn't have any

significant overweight because if that were the case, I would comment otherwise. Our next question comes from Bill Peterson, JP Morgan. Yeah, hi. Thanks for taking the questions and apologize for the background noise. I wanted to ask what your thoughts were around Tesla and its network. I would think that

networks, of course Europe is setting the subset yourselves, but in terms of the competitive environment how could that play out?

Yeah, so no, I get the question often. And in fact, I think I've got it on several previous earnings calls. So the overarching response to that is,

The fast charge market in the passenger car sector serves a very narrow use case. It's for when you're driving beyond your battery range. So it is not the significant driver for our revenue. Now let's not be making any excuses or saying that you're right on Tesla opening up their network either. We're also seeing now tremendous, tremendous sudden attention.

from what we refer to as players in the 30-minute retail economy that traditionally served people on road trips that now want to embrace because the broader EV market has shown up. It's not one OEM now, it's a multiplicity of OEMs. They're all moving in the right direction with electrifying their offerings.

In fact, completely disinvesting in their ice cars. That's given the players in the 30-minute retail economy a lot of confidence that they can start to move the ball down the field with respect to investments at their own properties. So we see this as a massive opportunity with respect to placing

Fast chargers along with partners and if you see how Mercedes-Benz and Volvo, two announcements we made this year, have worked into a 30-minute retail economy sort of aligned network announcement, we think that's going to continue.

Thanks for calling there. You liken the feed opportunity to a coiled spring and lack of vehicles. We've talked about this. Are you seeing any signs that this should accelerate through the year? I know it's already a meaningful part of your business, but how should we think about your feed opportunity as this spring uncoils?

that the more granular commercial business has because passenger cars are increasing in diversity and availability from a lot of OEMs, while on the fleet side, we are severely vehicle limited, maybe with the exception of transit buses, but transit buses represent a very small, on a vehicle count basis, percentage of fleets globally.

So, hence the coiled spring analogy, if you're landing more than you're expanding, but the expanding has to follow, we're in good position when our customer base decides to actually get, well, when they can actually get vehicles and can expand. And if you look at the announcement we just made with USPS,

for example, you're starting to see the clouds break, so to speak, with respect to a very large fleet that's positioned across the United States start to get commitments from vehicle manufacturers that they're going to see those vehicles come in earnest. So as that, as things like that start to happen, I think you're going to see a much more balanced expand versus land mix, and it should result in an acceleration of revenue, even within our customer base. Up next, we'll hear from Kashi Harrison, Piper Sandler.

Good afternoon, everyone, and thank you for taking my questions. So just the first one for me, so the liquidity position improved a few million to 400 million in cash and short-term investments, 400 million. You mentioned the 50 mil ATM offering. Could you speak to the driver behind the utilization of the ATM in December , just given that you already had a pretty strong liquidity position before that? And then maybe just talk about how we should be thinking about strategically the strategy behind the ATM in the future. Sure, so as I mentioned, yes, we definitely capped the ATM in December for $50 million.

So I think that the need to address that will decline every time as those metrics get better. But the bottom line is we just need to maintain a strong balance sheet and relative. I think we have the best in the industry and we need to stay there. And then bottom line from would we use it again? You know, it's opportunistic. It's based on, you know, price and circumstances and timing and everything else. So.

We're just going to keep an eye on it. Okay. Fair enough. And then just my follow-up question. As you pointed out, I think both of you pointed out in the Parere remarks, you effectively held the non-GAAP OPEX flat all year, roughly $80 million, and the percentage of sales down to 50% from 100% earlier in the year. Can you talk about your operating expense strategy for calendar 23 as well? Should we expect flattish OPEX again, or should we expect a little bit of an uplift as the business is growing and there's also wage inflation? So just some thoughts on OPEX would be great. Exactly. You sort of answered your own question. So yes, there will be an uptick in Q1.

slowly higher the rest of the year. We will now hear from David Kelly. Jeff Rees. Hey, good afternoon, guys. I was hoping maybe to start you could update us on momentum in Europe . You delivered really meaningful growth in fiscal 2023 and the markets coming off of a really robust DB penetration ram last year. So,

How are you thinking about the regional opportunity across the pond in 2024? I think about it the same way we think about the opportunity in North America, frankly, and it's driven by, as you said, the differential is driven a little bit by a differential in SCSI.

car penetration from a new car sales perspective. But our strategy is virtually identical in Europe as it is in North America with respect to product, foreign offering, business model, etc. And I'll just remind you that we've said on many of these calls that have the roof of our...

forecasting and modeling, it's all factored off of new car projections, net new vehicles in the install base in the markets we serve. You had a kind of sub-question in there about the sub-regions. We are serving predominant markets in New York. We're not in every country, but the ones we're not in are small. And so we are, you know, we're just assuming that across the entire continent of Europe , we should be able to, you know, continue to be successful with the product line that we've been successful with on the previous year. There's no real difference.

Okay, got it. That's helpful. And then one quick follow up on the supply chain situation. I guess are you saying improvement Q1 today relative to the fourth quarter? And how should we think about that four point margin headwind? I think you referenced. Does that continue to lessen here into 2024? Thank you. Well, no one has, I mean, as we said many times, no one has a perfect crystal ball on that one. So taking maintaining a vigilant stance with respect to supply chain is what we're doing. What we have said before and what I can can repeat now based on our experience in Q4 is that the supply chain hotspots of narrow considerably.

from the peak of the crisis. So we have all our management bandwidth looking at a much smaller set of problems. The problems, you know, you couldn't, you may still have issues with availability of supply of a fewer number of components that still limit your build. But it's certainly a lot easier to put in mitigation strategies around right now and we hope that over the year supply comes into alignment with demand. And it's too hard to call exactly what quarter we can say.

comment am I thinking about that correctly?

I'm only chuckling just because I did not say consensus. What I said was, and this is an important distinction, you know, analysts develop their models and then they make

judgments based on why I believe this. I think this is going to be better, this is going to be worse, and they come to a conclusion. And we use the word dispersion. Last year, through no fault of their own, because we're a newly public company and who could have modeled us from the outside last year, I wouldn't expect you guys to be able to do that. So everybody, the numbers were all over the place. So I felt like we needed to help get it centered.

But I think the dialogue we've had with analysts over the last year and people's understanding of the business and their ability to form their own conclusions about what the outlook should be is absolutely improved versus last year. And so I just think having you be 100 percent the author of where you are is the right answer. Okay. Now that's it. Thank you for the clarification. The other question I was curious if you could add to color too is any thoughts on the NEVI program and your strategy and how you benefit from that over the next couple of years and how you're positioned there? So as we look at the NEVI program not unlike how we've –

approach many other programs that are similar in color. It's a very corridor oriented program. It's implemented by each state. So each state has its own take on the federal guidelines. And we're quite used to that. Our policy team has been instrumental in commenting and helping to shape the program. So it offers what we think is a good platform for a broad range of our customers to be able to take advantage of it. And that's the key there is the broad range of our customers. So how we approach it, because we don't own and operate stations ourselves, and how we have approached similar programs in the past. It was not a departure and approached all is we look into our current customer base and our potential future customer base. We do deep analysis. We have this capability internally deep analysis on the state's requirements of where exactly they want to charge us. We look at the correlation between available utility capacity availability of partners that we have that are in good locations facing, etc. construction. You know, ease or

statement isn't appropriate, but it needs to be well aligned with quick serve brands, both food services and retail, etc. So we create a vibrant and enjoyable experience for EV drivers because that enables more and more EV adoption to accelerate, which enables the balance of our business. So we care about it deeply. We'll take our next question from Matt Somerville, DA Davidson. Thanks Ben. Just to clarify what I'm heard in the chat,

just having a hard time really understanding why there's roughly a $25 million sequential reduction there. Maybe a little more help.

That's a fair question. The thing I would represent to you is you go back to history with the company in like, you know, private land. We've been very consistent. Two things are being consistent. One, he was loved to keep for last year was unusual. It was the first time I did it for five years. We were starting that time.

So, it's Q1 is always lighter. It varies in terms of percentage. I don't think this year's depth from Q4 to Q1 is extraordinary. We're surprising it's just kind of what we're used to. We know the reasons for it, which we explain. And then, you know, we think of ourselves as a growth company. So, when you take Q1 and you look at that and go, okay, that's a baseline for the year and how does it grow from there, there's pretty decent information in our history that would allow you to extrapolate. So, I guess the net of it is, I'm not concerned with Q1. So, you kind of think about the portfolio of the position without one sheet. How should we be thinking about, you know, M&A?

over the course of your fiscal 24 and maybe what sort of technological or otherwise innovation, you may be intellectual property, you may be looking to add to the portfolio. You have things that are actionable in your pipeline. How should we be thinking about M&A over the next 12 months or so? Thank you. M&A, you've had your referring to hergers and acquisitions? Yeah, I did. Yeah, it was hard to just turn that. We have a partner called M&A, so I heard it that way. Please put it that way. We think about acquisitions as we have a very full...

technology portfolio and lots of very good stuff in the pipeline. What I've commented on before is that we, due to the fact that our portfolio is well built out, with the exception of a few things that have not emerged yet that are deep in R&D, we have the ability now to rebalance where we put the R&D resources to look at the scale technologies necessary to deal with streamlining customer onboarding, ongoing customer interaction.

and the like. And remember, we have a very, very deep channel business. So we have to do, we have to have core product services technologies that enable that all the way through the channel. And I made some references to that in my remarks. So as a result, we don't see a deep need from an M&A perspective at all on a technology basis. The way we look at M&A opportunity is customer acquisition capabilities. So if there's a good customer base with low liabilities on the install base and it's a practical integration, we would certainly consider it. But that's really the lens that we're looking at it from. It is not a technology lens. Next up from Credit Suisse is Mahiq Menloy.

Hi, good evening, Grafen. Thanks for putting me the questions here. Sorry for missed this earlier, but could you? Hi, can you hear me? Yep. Perfect. There's a few on gross margins. I'm sorry for missed this earlier. Please talk about how should we think about the gross margins in Q1 and through the year. Specifically, as we have this higher mix of DC, should we expect this continue linear trend here? So I think, I think so. First thing is, and I said earlier.

DC mix historically last year was a challenge, but actually we are improving things markedly on the DC front, so it's going to be less of a problem. And that's everything from cost reductions volume because our major new X-REST plus platform is brand new and very small volumes. But there's a combination of things that are going to make that better. We also think that the supply chain side of the picture is going to continue to ease. So I haven't put a number on it, but I have said I think it's just going to progress steadily throughout the year. I would be severely disappointed if it was flatter down.

in any given quarter. But I think our outlook is quite positive that we can continue to drive the margins sequentially up this year, given a lot of the operational initiatives that we have in the company. Just one on the balance sheet. On Kashy's question, he talked about maintaining balance sheet at a healthy level with the prime driver here for the ATM. Just curious if you could characterize the, like I should think about that as a minimum cash balance or some of the metrics to think about that. It's honestly, I haven't fixed the number.

I don't mind the $400 million number, but I haven't fixed the number in stone on that. As we grow the business, we may look at other financing opportunities, and then the nice thing is, we expect our quarterly loss position to continue to decline nicely between now and cash-lapositives next year. So there's a balance there. But if we continue to grow the company, and it gets meaningfully bigger than it is today, you're going to want to have a decent balance sheet, and I kind of think that's where we are now. So how we maintain that, and what we do to maintain that, that's another question, but we're in a pretty good spot right now. We will take the next question from Oliver Hling, TPH. Good afternoon, everyone, and thanks for taking my question. Just had one.

sort of a multi-prone question. But you just wanted to try and get an update with more details around progression of your build cycle over the past quarter. Is it something that still remains fairly back in the quarter weighted or is it something that started to really smooth itself out, given how there's a backlog to kind of get through? And when thinking about the ability to manufacture these chargers at the factory, how close have you all progressed towards full utilization relative to what unconstrained capacity sits at today? So I'll take the second part of that question first. We use external contract manufacturers as partners from a build perspective. So utilization of capacity is not a factor here. We use cms that have substantially broad capacity capabilities. So access to capacity on the upside is not an issue because we'll see that we'll see that coming with adequate list. We need time and the excess capacity is not a factor.

in our financials from a factory perspective. With respect to build linearity, we have much better build linearity now. And our build linearity previously was largely driven not by factory issues, so to speak. It was driven mostly by supply chain and getting adequate parts, adequate fully populated kits to assembly lines in a smooth manner. And because the supply chain crisis has certainly smoothed out, but I think equally importantly, our investments in supply chain management, not only in our own staff, but in process improvements with our CMs, that's dramatically improved the linearity of build. So that's much less of a factor now. With a few hotspots, and the last comment I'll make is, while Rex commented on

continued limitations. The limitation ceiling keeps rising it's just that the growth rate has continued to rise so we maintain some limitations because we have to mitigate limitations on a few components that limit us.

But we also have to exceed our growth rate. And that's, I remind you when you're doubling effectively, which is, you know, what we did year over year. And we had a very consistent growth rate, quarter over quarter, if you look at, you know, a given quarter to the year prior, that's a huge issue. You have to overcome a growth rate and do better on top of that.

which we think we're putting in all the mechanisms necessary to do it going into this year. Okay, that makes sense. Thanks for the time guys. We'll go next to Steven Foxx, Foxx Advisors. Hi, good afternoon. I just had one question. After listening to the preparing marks, I mean, you made a lot of progress on the ecosystem in the past year. And so with a lot of major names, and I'm just curious why at this point, not focus more on the expand piece of land and expand as opposed to adding smaller customers that, you know, on a time one basis, maybe you do better with scaling established customers and also helping, you know, improve the margins, etc.

I'll just carry on how you will react to that question. Thank you. So it doesn't improve the margins because cost of sales is not a component in margins. And with the expand pieces remitted by again, the attach rates to vehicles. So we're expanding effectively with the net new vehicles in the serving sphere of our customers within any geography.

And you can't push them past the utilization boundary. They're not gonna lean in, we can't push the lean in to an arbitrary degree. Also, if you look at the dividend that pays forward, the new customers, the dividend that pays forward, we have an incredibly low churn rate on customers, and that's been a historical asset for the company. And since we do wanna take advantage, we don't wanna stall our future growth, so we're not gonna shift emphasis, we're gonna maintain the emphasis on a balance between new customer ad and expansion in the similar proportions that we've had before. I will tell you that our channel sophistication is improving continuously. It's something we've invested in since.

year, you know, kind of later into the year early into 24, you guys get closer to that cash inflection. Is there, you know, I guess an expand element that sort of helps you out in the op-ex foreign? I guess I'm just sort of thinking like, you know, lower SNM for unit or everyone or you want to think about that given, you know, sort of this, this dormant fleet story that, that sort of waiting in the background, if you will. So the way we think about that as you refer to it, that the...

the effectively the untapped potential in fleet because our customers are vehicle limited in fleet for the most part. As I've also mentioned before, but in different contexts, we can afford the investment in fleet because it has a lot of commonality with respect to the investment from an ethics perspective and the balance of the verticals that we go after in the balance of the geographies. Now there are some fleet specific features that we have to invest in, but for us, it's incremental, very incremental. Even the same hardware platforms, sometimes different configuration, but same hardware platforms. So where am I going with this? Operating leverage over the year we just closed, we think is pretty phenomenal because it is showing that the trajectory of the ethics, that's everything from R&D to sales and market, GNA, everything is, it's on a very different trajectory as we add revenue. We weren't putting the company in peril this year.

In fact, we're making some very strategic investments to improve what we think is our long-term ability to have a great customer experience at even larger scale this year. So we think that the continued things that you saw from a directional perspective in the year we just closed will continue through this year. And Rex made one notable exception in that because the Q1 revenue is seasonally down for the company, you may see a small retreat in operating leverage only in that quarter, but it should return to normal increase in operating leverage or a similar one that you saw in the previous year. Got it, very clear. And then just on, I guess, sort of the growth outlook generally, is there anything that you would sort of think about downstream beyond sort of the utilization rate or just sort of getting vehicles in people's hands that's constraining you guys? That's constraining you guys today. I'm thinking about utility interconnection, anything that's sort of hampering your abilities that's a little outside of your control that we should be aware of. Thanks.

So the utility interconnect question is a very good one and it's hard to model because the utility interconnect delays certainly are there and they vary depending on the circumstances of the, you know, the site, right? How much spare capacity is there and what are you trying to do with that site? What the way I think you should think about it is the active ports under management is is normalizes out the pipeline delay from initial order and shipment to actual installation and activation, which we do see variance. We do see a big variance, but because we have a long pipeline with effectively no air gaps. What you see show up today is the result of utility interconnect deadlines that are coming to an end, right? On projects that we affect effectively sold maybe six months ago in some instances, but then we can actually ship the product until they actually need it and it goes into the ground. So some amount of delay and if you look at the new port ad rate, you can kind of.

sort of see the shadows of it, that delay is built into our numbers already. And everyone, at this time, there are no further questions. I'll hand the conference back to our speakers for any additional or closing remarks. Thanks for your time today. And ladies and gentlemen, that does conclude today's conference. Thank you all for your participation. You may now disconnect.