Q2 2023 Markel Corp Earnings Call
Good morning, Welcome Tomorrow, Calgroup second quarter 'twenty twenty-three conference call all participants will be in listen only mode.
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During the call today, we may make forward looking statements within the meaning of the private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. They are based on current assumptions and opinions concerning a variety of known and unknown risks actual results may differ materially from those contained in or suggested by such forward looking statements addition.
Information about factors that could cause actual results to differ materially from those projected in the forward looking statements is included in our most recent annual report on Form 10-K, and quarterly report on Form 10-Q, including under the caption Safe Harbor, and cautionary statements and risk factors.
We may also discuss certain non-GAAP financial measures during the call today, you may find the most directly comparable GAAP measures and a reconciliation to GAAP for these measures in our most recent Form 10-Q.
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I'd now like to turn the conference over to Tom Gayner, Chief Executive Officer. Please go ahead.
Good morning, good morning, Thank you.
Richmond, Virginia, I'd like to welcome you to the Markel group's second quarter conference call.
As indeed, Tom Gayner and serve as your CEO and it is my pleasure to welcome you to the call. This morning, I'm joined by our Chief Financial Officer, Teri Gendron, and our president of insurance, Jeremy Noble to share our results with you and to answer your questions.
Very pleased with the results we're reporting to you today each of our three engines insurance Markel ventures and investments produced positive thrust during the first half of 2023.
And our insurance operations, we enjoyed double digit growth in earned premiums and solid underwriting profitability. The combined ratio of 93% for the first half of 2023.
Importantly, we report those results with an ongoing commitment to putting enough insurance reserves in a way, which we believe will be more likely to prove redundant than deficient.
You can see that commitment through our years of reporting favorable loss development in the vast majority of the times. When we report to you each quarter's results. This quarter continues to show that same pattern of favorable development.
Unrelenting commitment at the Mark Halperin to our culture based on our values. The conservativism, we embrace in setting reserves demonstrates our words inaction.
But as Terry and Jeremy will provide more details on our insurance results in their comments.
Markel ventures produced excellent results during the first half of 2023 revenues rose to $2 5 billion compared to $2 3 billion, a year ago, and EBITDA reached $317 million versus 250 in the first half of 2022.
We did get to apply some capital at a couple of our existing businesses.
Added to their businesses with acquisitions of companies in their respective industries, and we love it when that happens.
We also continued the ongoing process of purchasing certain noncontrolling interests as originally planned.
Our publicly traded equity portfolio produced six month returns of 11, 9%. While this trail the white Hot return of 17% puts up at the S&P 500.
We remain a 100 basis points ahead of that index for over 30 years, we don't usually move ahead during spreads, but we do tend to outlast the competition when it comes to marathons.
During the first half of 2023, we repurchased $187 million of Markel group shares last year, we repurchased $126 million in the same time period.
We also made net purchases of publicly traded equity securities of $155 million compared to $63 million a year ago. The tax efficient net unrealized gain on our equity portfolio now stands at five 4 billion compared to $4 2 billion a year ago.
Well, we as a public company always provides you with the split times quarterly results. We are running a marathon not a series of spreads.
Split times that we are reporting to you today look good to me as the head coach, but I think these results demonstrate that we remain on track to produce excellent marathon results as we have over long periods before.
To put some actual numbers on that and quantify that I remind you that we consistently use rolling five year measurement intervals to gauge longer term progress at the Mark Halperin.
The last five years, including some of the most difficult insurance and investment markets we've ever faced.
Last five years also included the effects of some acquisitions and expansions into new businesses, which did not go as well as we would've hoped it first despite that we've made meaningful progress. Please.
Please consider the following.
Revenues in the first six months of 2018 were $3 6 billion.
Revenues in the first six months of 2023 five years later came in at $7 8 billion, an increase of 119%.
Underwriting profits in the first six months of 2018 were $209 million.
Underwriting profits in the first six months of 2023 were 264 million an increase of 27%.
Recurring investment income for the first six months of 2018.
$213 million recurring investment income in the first six months of 2023 was $329 million an increase of 54%.
The EBITDA of Markel ventures in the first six months of 2018 was $82 million the EBITDA Mark Hill ventures in the first six months of 2023.
$317 million, an increase of 284%.
The total number of shares of Markel outstanding five years ago was $13 9 million. The total number of shares of Markel today is $13 3 million a decrease of four 3%.
The price per share of five years ago on June 32018 was $1084 five years later share price stood at $13 85, an increase of 28%.
This combination of facts along with many other factors seems to have created a situation where many of the indicators of the economic value Mark calculate seem to have appreciated at a faster rate than that of the share price.
Response to those circumstances, we've repurchased shares in recent years. Additionally, our rate of repurchases was higher in the first half of 2023 than any other period.
Now I'll turn things over to our CFO Teri Gendron to provide you with some details from the quarter and then to Jeremy noble to discuss our insurance operations. I'll then return with just a few brief comments about our ventures and investment results and then we'll open the floor for your thoughtful questions.
Thank you Tom and good morning, everyone.
As Tom mentioned each of our three engines produced a solid quarter strong revenue growth within our insurance operations higher profitability within Markel ventures and excellent returns for longer.
So the benefits of our diversified re engine architecture.
Starting off with our underwriting operations gross written premiums grew 7% to $5 4 billion for the first half of 2023 compared to $5 billion in 2022.
Our increased premium volume reflects new business and more favorable rates across many of the product lines within our insurance segment.
Hey, Nice notable most notable growth came from our personal lines Marine and energy property and general liability product lines, while we saw lower premium volume within our professional liability product lines.
Our consolidated combined ratio for the first half of 2023 with a 93% compared to a 90% for the first half of last year.
The increase was driven by a higher attritional loss ratio and expense ratio in 2023 within our insurance segment.
Prior year loss reserves developed favorably by $139 million in the first half of 2023 compared to $123 million in the first half of 2022.
We experienced favorable loss reserve development across multiple product lines in 2023.
Notably across our international professional liability product lines.
Turning to our investment results.
Net investment gains and $110 million to $857 million in the first half of 2023 were driven by favorable market value movements.
This compares to net investment losses of $1 9 billion for the first half of 2022, driven by unfavorable market value movements.
As you've heard US say many times before we focus on long term investment performance expecting variability in equity markets and the timing of investment gains and losses from period to period.
As Tom noted, we will continue to measure our investment returns over longer periods of time.
With regard to net investment income, we reported $329 million in the first half of 2023 compared to $189 million in the same period last year.
The increase is largely attributable to higher interest income from our money market and short term investments due to higher short term interest rates in 2023.
Additionally, interest income on our fixed maturity securities increased reflecting a higher yield and higher average holding compared to last year.
During the first half of 2023, we recognized net unrealized gains are available for sale investments of $30 million within other comprehensive income primarily related to the positive impact of net foreign exchange movements on our fixed maturity portfolio <unk>.
This compares to net unrealized losses of $882 million for the same period last year corresponding to the impact of increases in interest rates on our fixed maturity portfolio.
Recall that we typically hold our fixed maturities until they mature and we generally expect unrealized holding gains and losses attributable to changes in interest rates to reverse in future periods.
It's mature.
Our fixed maturity portfolio had an average rating of AAA as of June 30, and there are no current or expected credit losses within the portfolio.
Now I'll cover the results of our Markel ventures segment.
The increase reflects organic growth and improved pricing across several of our businesses.
EBITDA from Markel ventures increased 27% to $317 million for the first half of 2023 from $250 million during the same period last year.
The increase was driven by our product businesses, which had higher margins in 2023 compared to 2022, and we found material and freight costs stabilize.
Looking at our consolidated results.
Our effective tax rate for the first half of 2023 with 21% compared to 22% in the same period last year.
We reported net income to common shareholders of $1 2 billion for the first half of 2023 compared to a net loss to common shareholders of $986 million in the same period, a year ago with the change largely attributed to the year over year swing and our public equity portfolio evaluation.
Comprehensive income to shareholders for the first half of 2023 with $1 2 billion compared to a comprehensive loss to shareholders of $1 7 billion in the first half of 2022 with swings in both fixed maturity and public equity valuations as the largest drivers.
Operating cash flows in the first half of 2023.
<unk> strong cash flows from each of our operating engines with the most notable year over year increase coming from our Markel ventures operations.
Total shareholders' equity stood at $14 2 billion at the end of June compared to $13 2 billion at the end of the year.
Overall, we're very pleased with our performance during the first two quarters of 2023, and we remain confident in our ability to continue building long term shareholder value.
With that I'll turn it over to Jeremy to talk more about our insurance engine.
Thanks, Terry and good morning, everyone.
Great to be with you. This morning to recap our insurance engine results the first half 2023.
The midpoint of the year, we continue to remain focused on achieving profitable growth across all of our insurance businesses.
I am pleased to report that we are well on our way to achieving that goal with revenues across our insurance operations totaling $4 1 billion for the year up 7% from last year, while generating pre tax operating income of $325 million.
Additionally, we continue to invest the float created by our underwriting operations at attractive yields let.
Let me now share a few thoughts on our first half results from across our collection of insurance businesses, which include our insurance and reinsurance underwriting operations State National program services and the filler insurance linked securities.
We are also growing in many of our other product offerings, including inland marine binding personal lines programs in select marine and energy classes within the London market.
As we have discussed in recent quarters. The current market cycle is nuanced with each product line, having a bit of its own story.
Fortunately, our breadth of product offering when combined with our exceptional underwriting talent allows us to develop robust go to market strategies byproduct.
We have continued to decrease our writings in certain of our professional liability lines, most notably in the large account public DNO space as we continue to remain uncomfortable with the rate decreases and loss cost trends in these products.
Affectional aligned space has also been impacted by changes in the broader economy, including a slowdown in M&A and public listings.
We remain resolute in our disciplined approach to underwriting and are walking away from business that we believe is not adequately priced does not meet our profitability targets.
Within our insurance segment, we produced a combined ratio of 93 for the first half of the year up five points from a year ago. This was primarily due to higher attritional loss ratios in our professional liability and general liability product lines.
We recognize that the economic and claims environment that will exist in the future. When we ultimately settled claims on these long tail lines is uncertain.
Given recent trends our view is that it's best to err on the side of caution and building more of a margin of safety to address the inevitably unpredictable nature of estimating future loss cost.
We also continue to maintain a cautious approach relative to recognize some prior accident year loss takedowns, however across all of our insurance product lines, we realized $124 million of favorable development on prior year's loss reserves for the first six months of the year contributing a four point benefit to the combined ratio.
Prior accident year loss take downs decreased slightly from a year ago, representing a one point increase in the year to date combined ratio.
This was driven largely by two offsetting factors.
We realized a more meaningful amount of favorable loss development on our professional liability book within our international operations compared to a year ago due to benign experience across several product classes.
Worth, noting we continue to remain cautious on prior year loss reserve development trends on our professional liability lines within our U S and Bermuda risk managed portfolio.
Second.
Offsetting the increased takedowns within our international professional liability lines was adverse development within our U S. Casualty book, most notably our excess and umbrella product line.
This was primarily on the pre Covid 2017 to 2019 accident years, whereas loss experience continues to outpace expectations.
Our loss reserving philosophy remains unchanged, we continue to hold loss reserves at levels more likely to prove redundant than deficient and react quickly when loss trends outpaced expectations are strengthening loss reserve levels.
Further we are generally not taking credit for favorable trends observed in the 2020 and later accident years, where we expect the benefits of improved underwriting conditions could lead to greater long term profitability.
Turning next to the reinsurance segment or re underwriting actions within the portfolio over the past few years continued to deliver profitable improvement. We produced a combined ratio of 93 for the first half of the year and improvement in the combined ratio of four points.
Premium volumes decreased by 4% from a year ago.
The decrease in gross written premiums within the reinsurance segment was due to lower premiums in our professional liability lines, partially offset by higher premiums in our marine and energy lines, bringing.
Premium volume trends are impacted by both premium adjustment activity and timing differences related to renewals.
This continues to be most notable in our transactional liability book within our professional liability product lines, where deal flow continues to remain slow resulting in ultimate.
Lower premium adjustment activity has the effect of increasing our current year attritional loss ratio, which is offset by a decrease in our prior accident years' loss ratio.
Overall, the combined ratio within our reinsurance operations improved year to date in 2023, given the losses incurred last year on the Russia, Ukraine War.
As well as experiencing greater favorable prior year loss reserve development in the current year.
Next I'll touch on our program services and other fronting operations and ILS operations, both of which are reported as part of our other operations.
Total premium production within our program services and other fronting operations totaled $1 $5 billion this year versus $1 $4 billion a year ago.
This 5% increase in operating revenues for the first six months of the year was due to an expansion of existing programs and the addition of new programs are.
Our state National team continues to perform extremely well and we are pleased with our business development pipeline you see.
Within our Nyphil ILS operations revenues and expenses for the first six months of the year were down due to the impact of the sale of our velocity MGA operations in the first quarter of 2022, and the sale of our velocity MGA operations in the fourth quarter of 2022.
In addition revenues within our fund management operations are down from last year due to lower assets under management, which stand at $7 2 billion at the end of the period as.
While our current results and to fill a reflect the lower levels of AUM being experience results for the second quarter generated a pretax operating profit.
Current pricing environment for catastrophe exposed property risks has created an attractive return proposition for investors.
Turning to current market commentary and outlook submission activity and new business opportunities generally remains strong outside of professional lines, particularly for our excess and surplus lines operations clients are still turning to specialty market solutions, given current levels of uncertainty and ongoing economic <unk>.
Activity and see the attractiveness of our breadth of product offerings.
Just a couple of comments on rate across our portfolio.
As I mentioned before each product area and region of the World has its own story, but broadly speaking rates are holding up fairly well and by and large in our estimation are keeping up with and in some cases are slightly ahead of our view of trends. We have many products where rates are up 5% to 10% for most product lines as rate adequacy is in.
Question, we are seeing success pushing for rate.
Equally we can see evidence of reducing new business policy retention and quote and bind rates when we arent getting the traction we need.
We're also able to push on terms and conditions as well as structure or shape the portfolio if it helps towards desired retention.
This is what I would expect to see under the circumstances and as a demonstration of our commitment to underwriting discipline.
Biggs exceptions of property lines, where rates are accelerating more meaningfully from the start of the year and risk managed large account D&O where prices continue to decrease somewhat inexplicably.
Im at a loss for wide public D&O pricing continues to deteriorate as well as professional liability pricing trends generally we remain cautious in these areas, which is contributing to our shrinking exposure.
Generally speaking, we're focused on maintaining rate adequacy across the entirety of our portfolio, where we are unable to obtain sufficient rate increases were effectively adjust terms and conditions or limits. We are walking away from accounts that do not meet our profitability targets.
These actions may have the effect of slowing the topline growth trend from what we've seen in the past couple of years, but given the breadth of product offering. We have we are confident we will find pockets that are attractive to grow and we remain very optimistic longer term profitable growth objectives. I think we are very well positioned as we approach the latter half of 'twenty three.
Ahead to 'twenty four thank you and with that I'll turn things back over to Tom. Thank you Jeremy as Terry reported we enjoyed an excellent first half and our Markel ventures operations.
<unk> and the people of those organizations continued to do a great job of serving their customers and their associates.
Total revenues Adventures rose, 8% in the first half from $2 3 billion to $2 5 billion EBITDA rose, 27% from $230 million to $317 million.
One of the very encouraging points about this comparison is that its largely organic it's largely apples to apples and not due to additional acquisitions I hope you take some comfort in seeing these results I know that idea.
The acquisition of additional businesses within our platforms of existing businesses is one of our favorite ways to deploy capital and I'm encouraged to see the maturation and ongoing development of this aspect of Markel ventures.
We remain interested in additional platform acquisitions at Markel ventures, but remain disciplined in our approach.
Remain involved in a few conversations but I have nothing to report to you on that front and all I can say is that we continue to work at the task and we will be both opportunistic and disciplined and considering opportunities.
And the investment engine you can see the effect of higher interest rates and solid equity performance shine through.
Recurring investment income grew 74% from $189 million to $329 million in the first half and new money investment rates continued to be higher than the fixed income maturities rolling off as they mature.
We continue to purchase only the highest credit quality securities that we can find and remained roughly matched and duration and currency to our insurance liabilities.
In our equity portfolio, we earned 11, 9% returns in the first half and we purchased $155 million net of new holdings compared to $63 million a year ago.
We continue to find securities, which meet our hurdle rates for new investments. We also have cash flowing in to fund the growth of our insurance and ventures operations and repurchase Markel group shares all at the same time.
Correct.
As is always the case there are challenges at your company there always will be.
That will always be the case and there never is a time when we're not worried about something we're working on some problem that's reality.
The good news is that <unk> got decades to judge us by to ascertain whether we're up to those challenges or not.
Think the preponderance of evidence would suggest that we are the.
The additional good news is that the values and the culture. We have developed over decades to guide our actions and decisions remains unchanged. We're committed to continuing on that path to building one of the world's great companies with our win win win architecture and I look forward to answering your thoughtful questions and working on the future.
Slight year would say to infinity and beyond with that we welcome your questions.
We will now begin the question and answer session to ask a question you May Press Star then one on your Touchtone phone.
Using a speakerphone please pick up your handset before pressing the keys to withdraw your question. Please press star one again at this time, we will pause momentarily to assemble our roster.
Thank you good morning, good morning.
I wonder if there's any more detail you can provide on the reserve development that Youre seeing you described in the 2017 the 2019.
<unk>.
Social inflation medical inflation, just a little more on that would be interesting.
Yes, sure market said, it's Jeremy.
It's very similar to what we've talked about in recent quarters, and I think what's being reported broadly across industry.
In years like 2015 to 2019, our view now is it's not going to be ultimately profitable as we believed at the time and Thats because the time that has passed since then and so you get into that confluence of events rising economic inflation compound the aspects of that the impacts of Covid the court closure.
As the lag in sort of reporting and then certainly to the point that you raised I mean, social inflation is a very real thing so the cost of handling and adjusting in settling claims has gone up and the role and the prominence of litigation financing has been rising and so ultimately we're witnessing pockets.
Activity, we allow a bit of time to make sure that we think that there is a trend there and as we see that trend and we're reacting very quickly and we're asking to try to push hard to get ahead of that and put that behind us.
In those years more recently a lot of changes that have taken place so pushing rate improving terms and conditions addressing limits attachment points segmentation strategies, we've seen deductibles rise so lots of things that have improved the overall health of the portfolios, but we are we are left to address.
Yes, those older years.
I appreciate the detail.
Workers comp line, how are you approaching that at this point.
What are you seeing any medical inflation pick up there.
Yes, great Great question, so so within workers comp it continues to be a great.
Recall, our workers' comp book.
Is pretty sort of niche within the broader segment. So it's a lot of very sort of micro workers comp and some of the trends that we would see would be a little bit different than maybe broader workers' comp more broadly.
That line of business has been very profitable for us we've consistently seen reductions in prior year loss reserves over time, we still see some of that to the levels aren't as significant.
We're very focused on reviewing that trend.
And that book has not been.
Well.
So we'll see.
We're paying very very close attention to that.
And then one other question the program services fronting Big increase this quarter I think for the six months it's been.
Not quite as big.
The timing issue on renewals or is there some new business this quarter.
Yes.
It's a handful of things so within our state National business really pleased with where we stand there we are.
Standing a few very strategic relationships.
<unk>, probably done a little bit better and retention of some of the programs than we would've anticipated we've on boarded a number of new programs.
And equally I think the pipeline, let's see national looks very good so.
Some of that played out in the in the second quarter and.
<unk> were up modestly year to date also within that total fronting space and some of the fronting we do associated with our Nephila operations. When we offer a rated balance sheet. So we've seen some opportunistic growth in that space because of.
The attractiveness of the property catastrophe environment more broadly so.
So let's sort of timing.
You never know with our state National platform, we have some very large deals and there's always an ebb and flow of what's kind of coming in and what's what's leaving the platform, but feel really really good about where we're positioned right now.
I appreciate it thank you.
Sure.
Your next question comes from the line of John Fox of Fenimore asset management. Please go ahead.
Thank you.
Mark asked two of my question. So I will go with the third.
Well first of all great results. Thank.
Thanks, Chuck. Thank you. Thank you for that.
I just wanted to ask if I'm looking at this the right way Tom I heard you talk about the investment income.
Potential to continue to grow in.
I'm wondering if you're under <unk>.
Selling it.
When I look at the Q.
This is about $13.
$7 billion in bonds at fair value.
Which assuming you get without any credit.
Hits, and it's yielding less than 3% at this point.
So it seems to me there's a couple of hundred million dollars of investment income.
Latent earnings power, that's going to earn in over the next few years as those bonds mature my looking at that the right way yes.
Okay.
And what keeps me awake to where do you my answer yes.
And that magnitude seems reasonable yes.
Okay, great. Thank you.
Youre welcome two.
Two words.
Again, if you have a question. Please press Star then one our next question will come from the line of Scott <unk> with RBC capital markets. Please go ahead.
Yes. Good morning. The first question I had was on the insurance unit premium growth there it ticked up a little bit versus Q1.
And just curious how youre feeling about just overall pricing new business environment.
Are you constructive in terms of growth for the rest of 'twenty three 'twenty four it sounded like you were.
Based on the commentary about most pricing I mean, there's a few areas.
But just anything you can talk about that it is the growth just being impacted mostly by professional liability and DNO, but the rest of the portfolio Youre feeling pretty good about in terms of.
You had <unk> 23 and 24.
I think thats pretty well said Scott I don't have a lot to add to that there is a number of product classes and I mentioned some of those earlier, where we feel its very attractive we're seeing great opportunities to grow mentioned property and inland marine and personal lines and binding surety programs Marine and energy in London.
So that's one of the benefits we have of having a very broad and diversified product portfolio. We can really sort of choose our points that are most attractive in the insurance market cycle and we've talked about the fact is pretty nuanced right now CFM strategy around each major product line Youre exactly right we were.
Large professional liability lines writer and so because of one part a lack of activity in the space that reduces exposure being brought to the market overall and also how the pricing environment is looking not just in public D&O I mean, that's the.
That's the Best example, but we're we're being cautious and thoughtful around.
<unk> other other lines as well and because we have a large book that way some of the growth opportunity casualties is an area where the growth is more tempered compared to last couple of years, but it is a good example of where we are able to push rate and we're certainly able to sort of have sort of segmentation strategies about how.
And where we choose to play in the casualty lines. So overall fuel okay in that space as well. So I think I think the growth opportunities remain out there and we're pretty confident about our platform given the breadth of product offerings.
Okay, Great that's helpful detail.
Wanted to follow up one quick question too on the.
This is based on some of that.
Uptick in cases and claims obviously youre seeing something but.
Is it just kind of early signs and you're putting up Ivy and are just to be conservative on that or just.
Anything you can touch on the actual activity that youre seeing there.
Yes, I understood.
Completely pinpoint Scott beyond just suggesting.
Yes, within our actuarial models, especially when you're starting to talk about those older years. So.
These are on sort of really the 17% to 19 year tried several years. These are would be maturing well under their cycles without a lot of history with these programs and we would be seeing this point.
More reported loss activity than we would've anticipated been anticipating.
I don't Im not drawn to a specific element with regards to frequency versus severity. It's just in total the claims reporting pattern the volume of activity.
It is more significant than what we would expect and then you extrapolate that so.
A little bit of out.
A little bit more reported activities than what we would've expected in our underlying models. If we concerned that that can become a trend we extrapolate that and we take a more significant movement right. So the total dollars in the period of actual versus expected on that loss activity.
Pales in comparison to the total amount of loss development, we recognized in the period. So now, we'll wait and see how that sort of trends and develops over time, but a lot of that is now sitting in <unk>. We continue to be very very cautious to respond quickly on that back into development.
Got it.
Last question just on Markel ventures, Tom could you comment on just you mentioned, some conversations and discussions youre, having and how those have kind of trended just.
The number of them this year versus last year.
Anything you can add there and is deal pricing still.
Holding you back a little bit is that is that still the case now or just just any update on kind of what youre seeing in terms of potential M&A for ventures sure, but let me give you some precise answers on that so.
The conversations we're having now reported some conversations a year ago almost none so just a few more people to talk to and the GAAP would be in pricing.
And.
Remaining disciplined and being a different kind of a buyer than the other buyers that are out there.
That's something obviously sellers are aware of.
We can bridge those gaps and get close in some markets are the markets. We just have to wait.
Look the tide rollout a little bit.
We've been doing that for a while and this is not unprecedented first markel ventures deal. We did was in 2005, we didn't do the second one until I think three years later in 2008. So we're used to periods, where we just talked to people.
Wait for the stars to align.
Yes.
Better than non right. So that is correct.
Right.
Alright, Thanks, a lot.
Thank you.
This concludes our question and answer session I would like to turn the conference back over to Tom Gayner for any closing remarks.
Thank you very much for your ongoing support and interest we look forward to catching up with you in another 90 days B well.
The conference call has now concluded. Thank you for attending today's presentation you may now disconnect.
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