Q3 2024 Plains GP Holdings LP Earnings Call
Operator: I would now like to hand the conference over to Blake Fernandez, Vice President of Investor Relations. You may begin.
We just raised.
Speaker Change: an automated message advising your hand is raised. To withdraw your question, please press star 11 again.
Speaker Change: I would now like to hand the conference over to Blake Fernandez, Vice President of Investor Relations. You may begin. Thank you, Tawanda. Good morning and welcome to Flames All-American third quarter 2024 earnings call.
Blake Fernandez: Thank you, Towanda. Good morning, and welcome to Plains All American Q3 2024 Earnings Call. Today's slide presentation is posted on the investor relations website under the news and events section at plains.com. An audio replay will also be available following today's call. Important disclosures regarding forward-looking statements and non-GAAP financial measures are provided on slide two. An overview of today's call is provided on slide three. A condensed consolidating balance sheet for PAGP and other reference materials are in the appendix. Today's call will be hosted by our Chairman and CEO, Willie Chiang, Executive Vice President and CFO, Al Swanson, as well as other management team members. With that, I will turn the call over to Willie.
Speaker Change: Today's slide presentation is posted on the Investor Relations website under the News and Events section at Planes.com.
Speaker Change: An audio replay will also be available following today's call. Important disclosures regarding forward-looking statements and non-GAAP financial measures are provided on slide 2.
Speaker Change: An overview of today's call is provided on slide 3. A condensed consolidating balance sheet for PAGP and other reference materials are in the appendix. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Today's call will be hosted by our Chairman and CEO Willie Chang, Executive Vice President and CFO Al Swanson, as well as other management team members. With that, I will turn the call over to Willie. Thank you, Blake. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us.
Willie Chiang: Thank you, Blake. Good morning, everyone, and thank you for joining us. Plains delivered another solid operational quarter as our business continues to strengthen. Based on year-to-date performance and our outlook for the balance of the year, we now expect to be toward the top end of our 2024 adjusted EBITDA guidance range of $2.725 to 2.775 billion, as we show on slide four. Permian volume growth remains on track with our original forecast of 200,000 to 300,000 barrels a day range for 2024, that's exit to exit, and we're seeing producer efficiencies offsetting lower than forecasted horizontal rig counts. Regarding our NGL business, we're on track to complete our Fort Saskatchewan fractionation expansion project on schedule and on budget in H1 2025.
Willie Chang: Twain's delivered another solid operational quarter as our business continued to strengthen.
Willie Chang: Based on year-to-date performance and our outlook for the balance of the year, we now expect to be toward the top end of our 2024 Adjusted EBITDA guidance range of $2.725 to $2.775 billion, as we show on slide four.
Willie Chang: Permian volume growth remains on track with our original forecast of 200,000 to 300,000 barrels a day range for 2024, that's exit to exit, and we're seeing producer efficiencies offsetting lower than forecasted horizontal rig counts.
Willie Chang: Regarding our NGL business, we're on track to complete our Fort Saskatchewan Fractionation expansion project on schedule and on budget in the first half of 2025.
Willie Chiang: We continue to pursue opportunities to advance our efficient growth strategy through bolt-on acquisitions, and we recently acquired the Five Stones Permian gathering system from Rattler Midstream. As shown on slide five, we continue to execute on what we believe is a long runway of bolt-on opportunities across our portfolio. Consistent with our investment framework, these transactions complement our existing base, creating incremental growth opportunities and enhance our financial profile. Before turning the call over to Al, I'd like to provide an update on our efforts to resolve the remaining contingencies related to our 2015 oil spill in California. We recently settled two lawsuits, and we have booked a charge of $120 million to our overall Line 901 accrual. With these two settlements, we believe we have resolved all material Line 901 claims against Plains.
Willie Chang: Additionally, we continue to pursue opportunities to advance our efficient growth strategy through bolt-on acquisitions, and we recently acquired the Five Stones Permian Gathering System from Rappler Midstream.
Willie Chang: As shown on slide 5, we continue to execute on what we believe is a long runway of bolt-on opportunities across our portfolio.
Willie Chang: Consistent with our investment framework, these transactions complement our existing base creating incremental growth opportunities and enhance our financial profile.
Willie Chang: Before turning the call over to Al, I'd like to provide an update on our efforts to resolve the remaining contingencies related to our 2020-2015 oil spill in California.
Willie Chang: We recently settled two lawsuits, and we have booked a charge of $120 million to our overall Line 901 accrual. With these two settlements, we believe we have resolved all material Line 901 claims against claims.
Willie Chiang: With respect to our $225 million claim for reimbursement of a prior class action settlement from our insurance carriers, we expect the majority of the claim, $175 million, to be resolved in Q1 2025, which we continue to believe that we are entitled to reimbursement. Overall, we view this settlement as prudent risk management, providing us with more certainty regarding our future cash flow, which allows us to more confidently focus forward on our strategic priorities. With that, I'll turn the call over to Al.
Willie Chang: With respect to our $225 million claim for reimbursement of a prior class action settlement from our insurance carriers, we expect a majority of the claim, $175 million, to be resolved in the first quarter of 2025, which we continue to believe that we are entitled to reimbursement.
Willie Chang: Overall, we view this settlement as prudent risk management, providing us with more certainty regarding our future cash flow, which allows us to more confidently focus.
Speaker Change: forward on our strategic priorities. With that, I'll turn the call over to Al.
Al Swanson: Thanks, Willie. We reported Q3 adjusted EBITDA and net CAA of $659 million. This reflects the benefit of higher Permian volumes across our gathering, intrabasin, and long-haul footprints and provides momentum for our accrual segment as we exit 2024. Slide six and seven in today's presentation contains walks that provide details on our Q3 performance. A summary of our updated 2024 guidance is on slide eight. Shifting to capital allocation, as illustrated on slide nine, for 2024, we expect to generate approximately $1.45 billion of adjusted free cash flow, excluding changes in assets and liabilities and including $140 million of bolt-on acquisitions with approximately $1.15 billion to be allocated to commons and preferred distributions. Please note that our adjusted free cash flow guidance has been updated to reflect our recent bolt-on announcement, charges associated with the previously mentioned legal settlements, and our updated commentary on full year guidance.
Al Swanson: Thanks, Willie. We reported third quarter adjusted EBITDA net to PAA of $659 million.
Al Swanson: This reflects the benefit of higher permeant volumes across our gathering, intrabasin, and long-haul footprints and provides momentum for our crew L segment as we exit 2024. Slide 6 and 7 in today's presentation contains walks that provide details on our third quarter performance.
Al Swanson: A summary of our updated 2024 guidance is on slide eight.
Al Swanson: Shifting to capital allocation, as illustrated on slide 9, for 2024, we expect to generate approximately $1.45 billion.
Al Swanson: of adjusted free cash flow, excluding changes in assets and liabilities, and including $140 million of bolt-on acquisitions with approximately $1.15 billion to be allocated to common and preferred distributions.
Al Swanson: Please note that our adjusted free cash flow guidance has been updated to reflect our recent bolt-on announcement, charges associated with the previously mentioned legal settlements, and our updated commentary on full year guidance.
Al Swanson: As Willie mentioned, we continue to advance our efficient growth strategy while maintaining financial flexibility. Our efforts were recently recognized by Moody's, resulting in an upgrade to Baa2 with a stable outlook. With the upgrade, we have now achieved our target of having a mid triple B rating at all three credit rating agencies. With that, I'll turn the call back to Willie.
Speaker Change: As Willie mentioned, we continue to advance our efficient growth strategy while maintaining financial flexibility. Our efforts were recently recognized by Moody's, resulting in an upgrade to BAA2 with a stable outlook.
Al Swanson: With the upgrade, we have now achieved our target of having a mid-BBB rating at all three credit rating agencies. With that, I'll turn the call back to Willie. Thanks, Al.
Willie Chiang: Thanks, Al. Well, we are optimistic on the future of the US energy industry, which we expect to benefit from improved energy policy, regulatory framework, and hopefully streamlined permitting, all critical to US energy security and our industry's ability to meet global energy needs safely, reliably, and responsibly. Our Plains portfolio is more resilient based on the work over the past several years, the investments we've made, and our focus on improving the durability of our earnings, which positions us well to navigate through a volatile macro environment with geopolitical unrest, potential OPEC supply changes, uncertainty around China, and broader economic activity. Our company remains well-positioned and our strategy is proven. We've made tangible progress across the three key tenets of our strategy: generate significant multi-year free cash flow, maintain capital discipline, and return capital to our investors while preserving financial flexibility.
Willie Chang: Well, we are optimistic on the future of the U.S. energy industry.
Willie Chang: which we expect to benefit from improved energy policy, regulatory framework, and hopefully streamlined permitting, all critical to U.S. energy security and our industry's ability to meet global energy needs safely, reliably, and responsibly.
Thank you.
Willie Chang: Our plan's portfolio is more resilient based on the work over the past several years, the investments we've made, and our focus on improving the durability of our earnings, which positions us well to navigate through a volatile macro environment with geopolitical unrest, potential OPEC supply changes, uncertainty around China, and broader economic activity.
Willie Chang: Our company remains well-positioned and our strategy is proven. We've made tangible progress across the three key tenets of our strategy, generate significant multi-year free cash flow,
Willie Chang: maintain capital discipline, and return capital to our investors while preserving financial flexibility.
Willie Chiang: The Plains team continues to deliver on our goals and initiatives, and our improved outlook provides us more confidence in the trajectory of our business and long-term focus on increasing return of capitals to unitholders. With that, I'll turn the call over to Blake to lead us in the Q&A.
Willie Chang: The Plains team continues to deliver on our goals and initiatives and our improved outlook provides us more confidence in the trajectory of our business and long-term focus on increasing return of capitals to unit holders.
Jeremy Goebel: Thanks, Willie. As we enter the Q&A session, please limit yourself to one question and one follow-up. For those with additional questions, please feel free to return to the queue. This will allow us to address questions from as many participants as possible in our available time this morning. The IR team will also be available after the call to address any additional questions you may have. Towanda, we're ready to open the call for questions, please.
Speaker Change: With that, I'll turn the call over to Blake to lead us into Q&A.
Blake Fernandez: Thanks, Willie. As we enter the Q&A session, please limit yourself to one question and one follow-up. For those with additional questions, please feel free to return to the queue.
Blake Fernandez: This will allow us to address questions from as many participants as possible in our available time this morning. The IR team will also be available after the call to address any additional questions you may have. Tawanda, we're ready to open the call for questions, please.
Operator: Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as a reminder to ask a question, please press star one one on your telephone and then wait to hear your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star one one again. Please stand by while we compile the Q&A roster. Our first question comes from the line of Michael Blum with Wells Fargo. Your line is open.
Speaker Change: Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, as a reminder to ask a question, please press star 1-1 on your telephone and then wait to hear your name to be announced. To withdraw your question, please press star 1-1 again. Please stand by while we compile the Q&A roster.
Speaker Change: Our first question comes from the line of Michael Bloom with Wells Fargo. Your line is open.
Willie Chiang: Hi, Michael.
Michael Blum: Thanks. Hi, good morning, everybody. I wanted to ask about your Permian gathering volumes this quarter. They look particularly strong to us, and I wanted to just understand better how much of that is being driven organically versus contributions from acquisitions, and is there anything you'd call out in terms of special items this quarter?
Speaker Change: Hi, Michael, thanks. Hi. Good morning. Everybody. I want to ask about your permean gathering volumes this quarter. They were pretty.
Speaker Change: particularly strong to us and I wanted to understand better how much of that is being driven organically versus contributions from acquisitions and is there anything you call out in terms of special items this quarter?
Jeremy Goebel: Michael, this is Jeremy. Good morning. We haven't split those out, but we've seen substantial growth on the organic side. That's probably the primary driver. Year over year, there was some modest growth from the acquisitions, but a substantial portion was organic growth from completions across the system.
Speaker Change: So we have, Michael this is Jeremy, good morning. We haven't split those out but we've seen substantial growth on the organic side. That's probably the primary driver. Year-over-year there was some modest growth from the acquisitions but substantial portion was organic growth from completions across the system.
Michael Blum: Okay, great. Thanks for that. I wanted to ask you basically a high class problem question. Your leverage is now meaningfully below your target range. Wondering what that means going forward. Do you think you may lower the target range for leverage? You've got excess capacity here for additional capital return. Just trying to think through the different options you have as leverage ticks below your target. Thanks.
Bye.
Okay. Great. Thanks for that.
Speaker Change: I wanted to ask you basically like a high class problem question, so your leverage is now, you know, meaningfully below your target range.
Speaker Change: So, wondering what that means going forward. Do you think you may lower the target range for leverage?
You've got excess capacity here for additional capital return.
Speaker Change: Yeah, just trying to think through the different options you have as leverage ticks below your target.
Willie Chiang: Yeah, Michael, this is Willie. Thanks for the acknowledgment of the lower leverage. We don't intend to lower our leverage range, which is 325 to 375x, any lower. We're pleased where we are. What we've really done is, with the announcement of this settlement on our California litigation, it gives us more confidence to execute against our strategy. What is that? Maximizing free cash flow. We've got a lot of self-help that's going on that, as we've shared, we did before in the group. We're focused a lot on optimization. We call it efficient growth. Certainly, capital efficiency is in there, we're also trying to do things without capital that improve our business, which is around optimizing our assets, our margins, working with our customers to get win-wins.
Willie Chang: Yeah, Michael, this is Willie. Thanks for the acknowledgement of the lower leverage. We don't intend to lower our leverage range, which is 325 to 375X.
Willie Chang: any lower. We're pleased where we are and what we've really done is with the announcement of this settlement on our California litigation it gives us more confidence to kind of execute against our strategy.
Speaker Change: And what is that? Maximizing free cash flow. We've got a lot of self-help that's going on, but as we've shared we did before in the group, we're focused a lot on optimization. We call it efficient growth. Certainly capital efficiency is in there, but we're also trying to do things without capital that improve our business.
Speaker Change: which is around optimizing our assets, our margins, working with our customers, kind of get win-wins.
Willie Chiang: With that, allows us to execute on the second pillar of our efficient growth strategy, which is really around bolt-on acquisitions. When you think about how we deploy capital, we think the bolt-ons for us offer the highest return opportunities for the unitholders. We've done a number of those, as you've seen. We continue to want to do more, and we think we're going to be able to certainly evaluate them, but we're going to stay very disciplined on what we pay for it because we want to stay true to not just growing, but growing the returns. Financial flexibility remains there. Then back to the last bullet point, as we think about returning cash back to shareholders, that's ultimately what we want to focus on and get to over multiple years. It gives us lots of flexibility to do many things.
Speaker Change: And with that allows us to execute on our kind of the pillar of the second pillar of our of our
efficient growth strategy, which is really around bolt-on acquisitions.
Speaker Change: So when you think about how we deploy capital, we think the bolt-ons for us offer the highest
return opportunities for the unit holders.
Speaker Change: We've done a number of those, as you've seen. We continue to want to do more, and we think we're going to be able to certainly evaluate them, but we're going to stay very disciplined on what we pay for it.
Speaker Change: because we want to stay true to not just growing, but growing the returns. Financial flexibility remains there and then back to the last bullet point as we think about returning cash back to shareholders. That's ultimately where we want to focus on and get to over multiple years. So it gives us lots of flexibility to do many things.
Willie Chiang: Also things like re-optimizing our balance sheet. If we aren't able to find opportunities for bolt-ons, we will look a little bit more towards some of those options. Hopefully, that helps.
Speaker Change: Also, things like kind of re-optimizing our balance sheet, and if we aren't able to find opportunities for bolt-ons, we will look a little bit more towards some of those options.
Michael Blum: Thank you.
Hopefully that helps.
Operator: Thank you. Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Spiro Dounis with Citi. Your line is open.
Thank you.
Thank you.
Thank you. Please stand by for our next question.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of Spiro Dunis with Citi. Your line is open.
Spiro Dounis: Thanks, operator. Morning, team. Maybe want to go back to volumes, if we could. I imagine you're in discussions now with producers as we head into the 2025 budget season and perhaps not ready to provide a final view on 2025. Just curious how these early conversations are going. If you could give us a sense of how the year is shaping up here.
Spiro Dunis: Thanks, operator. Morning, team. Maybe we want to go back to volumes, if we could. So, I imagine you're in discussions now with producers.
Spiro Dunis: as we head into the 2025 budget season and perhaps not ready to provide a final view on 25. Just curious how these early conversations are going, if you give us a sense of how the year is shaping up here.
Willie Chiang: Spiro, this is Willie. Obviously, we'll give guidance in February. The high level comment I'll make, and then Jeremy can add in as you see fit. 200 to 300,000 barrels a day in the Permian was our estimate this year. We expect to be within that range. It was more backend weighted. Going forward, although we don't have specifics, we would expect similar ranges of growth going forward.
Willie Chang: Spiro, this is Willie, you know what we haven't obviously we'll give guidance in February The high-level comment I would make and then Jeremy can add in as you see fits
You know.
Jeremy: 200,000 to 300,000 barrels a day in the Permian was our estimate this year. We expect to be within that range. It was more back-end weighted. And going forward, although we don't have specifics, we would expect similar ranges of growth going forward.
Jeremy Goebel: Yeah, Spiro, I would agree with that. What I would say is that producer forecasts are matching that from our initial dialogue, but they don't set their budgets until a bit later, and we'll tie those into our forecast for next year.
Spiro Dunis: Spiro, I would agree with that and what I would say is that producer forecasts are matching that from our initial dialogue but they don't set their budgets until a little bit later and we won't. We'll tie those into our forecast for next year.
Spiro Dounis: Got it. We'll wait on that then. Maybe just go back to capital allocation, but from a different perspective, maybe. I guess we've seen some healthy public valuation markers out there over the last three months or so. I guess I'm just curious, specifically around the crude pipeline side, what does that do to the bid-ask spread from here as you approach some of these bolt-on deals? Maybe as we think about it the other way, what are the trends thinking about the value of your stock here relative to some of those public markers and what that means for buybacks we track in this year?
Bye.
Speaker Change: Got it. Got it. We'll wait on that then. And maybe just to go back to capital allocation, but from a different perspective, maybe. I guess we've seen some healthy kind of public valuation markers out there over the last three months or so. And I guess I'm just curious, specifically around the crude pipeline side, I guess I'm just curious, what does that do to the bid-ask spread?
Speaker Change: From here as you approach some of these bolt-on deals and maybe as we think about the other way How is what are the current thinking about the value of your stock here? Relative to some of those public markers and what that means for buybackness buybacks and attractiveness here
Jeremy Goebel: Spiro, I'll take the first part. On the valuation, every asset is unique. Some of the ones that you saw have specific attributes around acre dedications, producer forecasts, et cetera. One asset doesn't necessarily set the market for everything. It does say that midstream assets are highly valued, and we're very happy with the assets that we own. We'll be disciplined. We take a very intensive approach to how we look at transactions. I don't think it impacts our valuation with respect to how we look at assets and our cash flow requirements. We certainly pay attention to that. We understand markets, and we understand the dynamics of each asset, and we'll look at them each individually. As far as the valuation question, I'll turn that to Willie.
Speaker Change: So, Spear, I'll take the first part. On the valuation, every asset's unique. Some of the ones that you saw have specific attributes around acres dedications.
producer forecasts, etc.
Speaker Change: So, one asset doesn't necessarily set the market for everything. It does say that midstream assets are highly valued and we're very happy with the assets that we own.
We'll be disciplined, we take a very...
Speaker Change: Intensive approach to how we look at transactions, and I don't think it impacts our valuation with respect to how we look at assets and our cash flow requirements.
Willie Chang: But we're certainly pay attention to that we understand the markets and we understand the dynamics of each asset And we'll look at them each individually as far as the valuation question. I'll turn that to Willie
Willie Chiang: Spiro, I think you realize this. For us, because of our asset base and the integrated nature of what we do, a lot of times we're able to capture synergies that others aren't. That adds to the comments that Jeremy talks about on our view that we should be able to, really at any valuation, be able to capture more value than others on the bolt-ons. As far as the valuation for Plains, I'll give you a short answer. We think it's lower than it should be, and it's our efforts to drive the value higher.
Spiro Dunis: Spiro I think you realize this for us because of our asset base and the integrated nature of what we do
Willie Spiro: A lot of times we're able to capture synergies that others aren't.
Willie Spiro: So, that adds to the comments that Jeremy talks about on our view that we should be able to, really at any valuation, be able to capture more value than others on the bolt-ons. As far as the valuation for planes, I'll give you a short answer. We think it's slower than it should be, and it's our efforts to drive the value higher.
Spiro Dounis: Yep, fair enough. I'll leave it there. Have a good week. Have a good weekend, gentlemen.
Speaker Change: Yep. Fair enough. I'll leave it there. Have a good week. Good weekend, gentlemen. Thanks, Gerald.
Willie Chiang: Thanks, Spiro.
Operator: Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Jeremy Tonet with J.P. Morgan Securities. Your line is open.
Please stand by for our next question.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of Jeremy Tonette with J.P. Morgan Securities. Your line is open. Thank you. Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of Jeremy Tonette with J.P. Morgan Securities.
Jeremy Tonet: Hi, good morning.
Willie Chiang: Good morning, Jeremy.
Hi, good morning.
Jeremy Tonet: Hey, I just wanted to touch base a little bit more on the bolt-ons, if I could. Just wanted to see your current thoughts, I guess, on the water business as far as water disposal is concerned, a real important part of the activity in the Permian. Just wondering, is that a line of business where you could see activity going forward or just doesn't fit your business profile?
Good morning, Jeremy.
Speaker Change: I just wanted to touch base a little bit more on the bolt-ons if I could and you know just wanted
Speaker Change: important part of you know the activity in the Permian and just wondering is that a line of business where you could see activity going forward or just doesn't fit your business profile?
Willie Chiang: Well, Jeremy, this is Willie. I am not going to comment on specifics. For us, the tenets are can we offer synergies on the business around water? We do not have any real exposure to it now. If there was an asset and something that would fit well into our business, we would absolutely look at it. We have tended not to get into that because we have been focusing more on our own asset base and tending to the knitting a little bit. We do not not look at it, but nothing really to share with you specifics on whether we would or would not get into the business.
Speaker Change: Well, Jeremy, this is Willie. I'm not going to comment on specifics.
You know, for us, the tenants are...
Can we offer synergies on the business around water?
Speaker Change: We don't have any real exposure to it now. If there was an asset and something that would fit well into our business, we would absolutely look at it. We've tended not to get into that because we've been focusing more on our own asset base and tending to the knitting a little bit.
Speaker Change: We don't not look at it, but nothing really to share with you specifics on whether we would or wouldn't get into the business.
Jeremy Tonet: Got it. That's helpful there. Then maybe just looking up north for a minute, your Canadian platform, just wondering how you think about that. At this juncture, do you see more growth initiatives beyond what's announced via bolt-ons or organic? How do you see yourself, I guess, within the competitive landscape there?
Got it, that's uh...
Speaker Change: helpful there. And then maybe just looking up north for a minute, your Canadian platform, just wondering, you know, how you think about that at this juncture? Do you see, you know, more growth initiatives beyond what's announced, be it bolt-ons or organic, or how do you see yourself, I guess, within the competitive landscape there?
Willie Chiang: Well, I'll start. If you think about the Canadian business, our team's done quite a bit of work up there to focus the efforts around two big core areas. One in Edmonton and the other one over in Eastern Canada, and optimize around that. The expansion of our Port Saskatchewan is critical to improving our fee-based durability of cash flow there. We're shifting more to fee-based versus margin related. There are some other opportunities up there that we would put the same lens on. If it's something that is around the integration benefit that we can get synergies on, we're definitely open to that. The focus right now is to get the Port Saskatchewan project complete on schedule and on budget.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Well, I'll start. If you think about the Canadian business, our team has done quite a bit of work up there to focus the efforts around two big core areas, one in Edmonton and the other one over in Eastern Canada, and optimize around that. The expansion of our Port Saskatchewan is critical to improving our fee-based...
Speaker Change: Durability of cash flow there, we're shifting more to fee-based versus margin-related.
Speaker Change: There are some other opportunities up there that we would put the same lens on if it's something that is around the integration benefit that we can get synergies on, we're definitely open to that, but the focus right now is to get the Fort Saskatchewan project complete on schedule and on budget.
Jeremy Tonet: Got it. Very helpful. I'll leave it there. Thanks.
Speaker Change: Got it. Very helpful. I'll leave it there. Thanks. Thanks, Jeremy.
Willie Chiang: Thanks, Jeremy.
Operator: Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Neal Mehta with Bank of America. Your line is open.
Please stand by for our next question.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of Neal Mitra with Bank of America. Your line is open.
Neal Mehta: Hi, thanks for taking my question. I guess this is directed to Jeremy. I just wanted to understand how maybe some of the crude flows are changing with less heavies coming down to the Gulf Coast, how that's impacting basin, your shipping storage assets, and maybe even the Rockies, just your entire system, if there's changes at all.
Speaker Change: Hi, thanks for taking my question. I guess this is directed to Jeremy.
Speaker Change: I just wanted to understand how maybe some of the crude flows are changing with left heavies coming down to the Gulf Coast, how that's impacting basin, you know, your cooking storage assets, and maybe even the Rockies, just your entire system, if there's changes at all.
Jeremy Goebel: Thanks, Neal. TMX startup is looking like it is running close to 400,000 barrels a day, 50,000 to 100,000 barrels a day of light. That has reduced exports from the Gulf Coast of heavy by about 150,000 to 200,000 barrels a day. That has been the impact on the heavy side. Throughputs to our shipping through the summer were all-time records. Our specific facility and our refinery-focused assets and types in and out are close to records. We have not seen much impact to our assets there. On the light side, the combination of the light barrels being exported plus reductions in some of the DJ and Rockies flows has actually improved basin flows, and you saw that in the quarter. We expect that to continue as Permian production grows and those dynamics continue.
Speaker Change: Thank you, Neil. So, TMX startup that's looking like it's running close to 400,000 barrels a day.
50,000 to 100,000 barrels a day, live.
Speaker Change: That has reduced exports from the Gulf Coast of heavy by about
Speaker Change: 150,000 to 200,000 barrels a day. So that's been the impact on the heavy side. Through pushing through the summer, we're all-time records. So our specific facility in our refinery focused assets.
Speaker Change: and types in and out are close to record, so we haven't seen much impact to our assets there.
Speaker Change: On the light side, the combination of the light barrels being exported plus reductions in some of the DJ and Rockies flows has actually improved basin flows, and you saw that in the quarter, and we expect that to continue.
as permeate production grows and those dynamics continue.
Neal Mehta: Okay, perfect. I wanted to ask a general question. We've seen some peers acquire crude gathering in the Permian, and I know that's something you've been doing on the bolt-on side as well. On the NGL side, you can direct barrels down your own pipeline. Is there any context on the sides of the customer or whether you can actually create an integrated system there, or does the customer kind of choose the pipeline? I understand in your case, your biggest exposure is to Corpus, so people would want to go there. Is it all like the NGL business, or does every customer get to choose?
Barbara.
Okay, perfect. I wanted to ask a general question.
Speaker Change: You know, we've seen some peers acquire crude gathering in the Permian, and I know that's.
Something you've been doing on the bolt-on side as well.
And, you know, on the NGL side, you can direct.
barreled down your own pipeline.
Speaker Change: Is there, you know, any context on the size of the customer or
Speaker Change: whether you can actually create an integrated system there, or does the customer kind of choose the pipeline? And I understand in your case, you know, your biggest exposure is to Corpus, so people would want to go there, but...
Speaker Change: Is it all like the NGL business or does every customer get to choose?
Willie Chiang: Hey, Neal, this is Willie. Let me ask you to clarify. Were you asking about Canadian integrated NGL or crude oil in Permian?
Speaker Change: Hey, Neil, this is Willie. Let me ask you to clarify. Were you asking about Canadian integrated NGL or crude oil in Fermion?
Neal Mehta: I'm sorry, crude oil in the Permian. The gathering systems that you acquired, do those customers have the choice of-
Speaker Change: I'm sorry, Crudo and the Permian, the gathering systems that you acquired, do those customers have the choice of choosing the crude pipeline that they want?
Blake Fernandez: Choosing the crude pipeline that they direct their barrels on, or do you have some optionality to move the barrels for them?
Speaker Change: direct their barrels on, or do you have some optionality to move the barrels for them?
Jeremy Goebel: It's a good question. It's a function of who the customer is and who the shippers are on the lines connected to the gathering system. The answer is, it depends, but in many cases, Plains Marketing is the shipper on a lot of our assets, and we can structure that to where we're the first purchaser, or we buy and sell and give it back to that customer at different locations. We purchase it there, we move it to market, and then we give them another barrel back at a different location. There's lots of flexibility, and that's one of the benefits of our assets. We don't force anyone to go anywhere. We have substantial liquidity to fill our pipes and most of everyone else's. The uniqueness of our asset is we don't force them to a destination.
Speaker Change: So it's a good question. It's a function of who the customer is and who the shippers are on the lines connected to the gathering system
Speaker Change: And so the answer is, it depends, but in many cases Plains Marketing is the shipper on a lot of our assets. And we can structure that to where we're the first purchaser or we buy and sell and give it back to that customer.
Speaker Change: at different locations. So we purchase it there, we move it to market, and then we give them another barrel back at a different location.
Speaker Change: So, there's lots of flexibility, and that's one of the benefits of our assets. We don't force anyone to go anywhere. We have substantial liquidity to fill our pipes and most of everyone else's. So, the uniqueness of our asset is we don't force them to a destination. They can get to Midland, Crane, or any of the other export destinations, and they get to any of the pipes out of the basin. So, I think one of the uniqueness that allows us to grow our position is not forcing anyone to a specific location, and having substantial liquidity to keep our pipelines full and do that.
Jeremy Goebel: They can get to Midland, Crane, or any of the other export destinations, and they get to any of the pipes out of the basin. I think one of the uniqueness that allows us to grow our position is not forcing anyone to a specific location and having substantial liquidity to keep our pipelines full and do that. Neal, I'll thank you in advance. You helped us with our calling card with our customers. It's flow assurance, reliability, quality control, and access to multiple markets. We think we have the ability to be able to offer customers all those things and perhaps differentiates us from some of our other competitors.
Speaker Change: You know, Neil, I'll thank you in advance you helped us with our calling card with our customers. It's flow assurance, reliability, quality control, and access to multiple markets. So we think we have the ability to be able to offer customers all those things and perhaps differentiates us from some of our other competitors.
Neal Mehta: Okay. Yeah. That's a great answer. I really appreciate it.
Speaker Change: Okay, yeah, that's that's a great answer. I really appreciate it.
Jeremy Goebel: Thanks, Neal.
Operator: Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of AJ O'Donnell with TPH&Co.. Your line is open.
Thank you, Neal.
Please stand by for our next question.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of AJ O'Donnell with TPH. Your line is open.
AJ O'Donnell: Morning, everyone. Just a quick question from me, or a couple questions from me. First, starting with the CapEx budget. Looks like it came down a bit for 2024. I was just wondering if you could maybe expand on some of the details of driving the change there. Is it related to anything with project timing, cost savings, or something else?
AJ O'Donnell: Good morning, everyone. Just a quick question for me, or a couple questions for me. First, starting with the CapEx budget.
AJ O'Donnell: Looks like it came down a bit for 2024. I was just wondering if you could maybe expand on some of the details of driving the change there. Is it related to anything with project timing, cost savings, or something else?
Chris Chandler: Morning, AJ. This is Chris Chandler. Yeah, we did lower our guidance from $375 million to $360 million net to Plains. This was primarily driven by deferral of spending for several projects in the development phase. This, as you heard earlier, does not change the timing of our Fort Sask expansion project that's currently in field construction and on track to begin in H1 2025. I'd also note that while spending is being deferred to 2025, we still expect 2025 to be within the previously stated investing capital range of $300 million to $400 million net to Plains.
AJ O'Donnell: Good morning, AJ. This is Chris Chandler. So yeah, we did lower our guidance from 375 to 360 million net to planes. This was primarily driven by deferral of spending for several projects in the development phase.
AJ O'Donnell: This, as you heard earlier, does not change the timing of our Fort Sask expansion project that's currently in field construction and on track.
AJ O'Donnell: to begin in the first half of 2025. I'd also note that while spending is being deferred to 2025, we still expect 2025 to be within the previously stated investment capital range of $300 to $400 million net to Plains.
AJ O'Donnell: Okay, great. Thanks for that. Maybe just one more on oil growth in the Permian. Now that we're most of the way through the year, I'm just curious if you can give us some guidelines about how much you've seen so far this year and maybe how much more we could expect in Q4 now that we have incremental gas egress online from Matterhorn.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Okay, great. Thanks for that. Maybe just one more on oil growth in the Permian.
Speaker Change: Now that we're most of the way through the year, I'm just curious if you can give us some guidelines about how much you've seen so far this year, and maybe how much more we could expect in Q4 now that we have incremental gas egress online from Matterhorn.
Jeremy Goebel: Thank you, AJ. This is Jeremy. I would say we're certainly within the range now, but typically you see things slow down as you go into potential weather and then you go into December. Last year was particularly strong in Q4, which muted some of the growth this year because you had a real reduction in January of this year. Since July, we've seen steady growth across our system and other systems in the basin, and we certainly feel confident in the $200,000 to $300,000 a day range.
Speaker Change: Thank you, AJ. This is Jeremy. I would say we're certainly within the range now, but typically you see things slow down as you go in. Potential weather and then you go into December.
Speaker Change: Last year was particularly strong in the fourth quarter, which muted some of the growth this year because you had a real reduction in January of this year, but since July we've seen steady growth across our system and other systems in the basin, and we certainly feel confident in the $200,000 to $300,000 a day range.
AJ O'Donnell: Great. Appreciate the detail. Thanks, guys.
Great. Appreciate the detail. Thanks, guys.
Jeremy Goebel: Thanks, AJ.
Operator: Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Manav Gupta with UBS. Your line is open.
Thanks, A.J.
Please stand by for our next question.
Bye.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of Manish Gupta with UBS. Your line is open. Good morning, guys. A quick question. Last quarter, you did raise the guidance. Now, obviously, you have indicated you're coming in to the top end of that guidance. So, help us understand a few things which are going your way, which have allowed you to kind of raise guidance for two quarters in a row now. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you. Thank you.
Manav Gupta: Good morning, guys. A quick question. Last quarter, you did raise the guidance. Obviously, you have indicated you're coming in to the top end of that guidance. Help us understand two things which are going your way, which have allowed you to raise guidance for two quarters in a row now.
Blake Fernandez: Yeah, this is Al. Just basically, we're seeing slightly better performance across our business, both on the crude side and the NGL side. Volumes have been a little bit stronger than we had assumed on the Permian. The NGL business as well, better recoveries off the fracs. It's no one thing. What I would say is it's a fairly small percentage type of change. If you look and take the high end, we're kind of indicating trending towards the high end. The high end relative to beginning of the year guidance is 3.7%. There's no one attribute. It's across both segments and multiple areas inside of each of the segments.
I'll see you next time.
Al Swanson: Yeah, this is Al. Just basically, we're seeing slightly better performance across...
Al Swanson: Across our business both on the crude side and the NGL side Volumes have been a little bit stronger than we had assumed on on the Permian And the NGL business as well better recoveries off the fracks
And so it's no one thing and.
Al Swanson: What I would say is it's a fairly small, you know, percentage type of change if you look.
Al Swanson: And take the high-end, we're kind of indicating trending towards the high-end. The high-end relative to beginning of the year guidance is 3.7%. But there's no one attribute, it's across both segments and multiple areas inside of each of the segments.
Manav Gupta: Perfect. My quick follow-up is, can we get some more commentary around the Pipestone Gathering System acquisition? Why was it the right fit and the benefits of this deal?
Speaker Change: Perfect. My quick follow-up is, can you get some more commentary around the five stone gathering system acquisition? Why was it the right fit and the benefits of this deal?
Jeremy Goebel: Sure. This is just bread and butter for us. It's an asset that was already connected to us. The mainline interbasin flows flow to us, and it got us closer to the Rattler guys. We do some oil business with them, and it integrated the barrels into the system. This was very similar to many of the other ones done, but just on a smaller scale.
Speaker Change: Sure, this is just bread and butter for us. It's an asset that was already connected to us, the mainline intrabasin flows flowed to us and it got us closer to the Rattler guys. We do some on-haul business with them and it integrated the barrels into the system.
Speaker Change: Very similar to many of the other ones done, but just on a smaller scale.
Manav Gupta: Thank you. I don't have any further.
Jeremy Goebel: Thanks, Manav.
Thank you, I'll turn it over.
Operator: Our next question comes from the line of John Mackay with Goldman Sachs.
Thanks, Bernal.
Please stand by for our next question.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of John McKay with Goldman Sachs. Your line is open.
John Mackay: Hey, good morning. Thanks for the time. I wanted to circle back maybe just on the capital efficiency side. I know you guys aren't giving 2025 guidance here, but I guess just high level. As we continue to see the producers basically be able to be more efficient in the Permian, longer laterals, et cetera, does that mean for Plains, your effective gathering CapEx per barrel can continue to decline from here? I'm just trying to think about framing that up versus your high level $300 to 400 million run rate, whether that can come down further over time.
Speaker Change: Hey, good morning. Thanks for the time. I wanted to circle back maybe just on the capital efficiency side. I know you guys aren't giving 25 guidance here, but I guess just high level as we continue to see the producers
Speaker Change: basically be able to be more efficient in the Permian, longer laterals, etc. Does that mean for planes, you're kind of effective?
Speaker Change: gathering CapEx per barrel can continue to decline from here. I'm just trying to think about framing that up versus your high-level 300 to 400 million run rate, whether that can kind of come down further over time.
Jeremy Goebel: Sure. I think there's two components to it. One is higher recoveries is fewer connection points and less wells to chase. The second is larger developments. Four to eight well pads versus historical one to two well pads. They want fewer emissions points. They want higher recoveries. That's aligned with connecting fewer locations for us. It might be bigger batteries, which that's fine for us. The other piece of this, fewer emissions points means they come back in behind existing well sites. One perfect example of that is historically, when it was all virgin territory, it's each location you'd connect one or two wells and every one's a new connection. Now, close to 40% of all of our connections in the Permian are behind pipes, meaning we've already got facilities. We're just rotating out pumps and meters based on size, but the facilities are already there.
Speaker Change: Sure, I think there's two components to it. One is higher recoveries is fewer connection points and less wells to chase. The second is larger developments, four to eight well pads versus historical one to two well pads. They want fewer emissions points.
Speaker Change: They want higher recoveries. That's aligned with connecting fewer locations for us. So it might be bigger batteries, which...
Speaker Change: That's fine for us. The other piece of this, fewer emissions points, means they come back in behind existing well size. One perfect example of that is, historically,
Speaker Change: When it was all Virgin Territory, it's each location, you'd connect one or two wells and everyone's a new connection. Now close to 40% of all of our connections in the Permian are behind pipe.
Speaker Change: Meaning, we've already got facilities, we're just rotating out pumps and meters based on size, but the facilities are already there. So that capital efficiency is something we've been seeing for five years and we'll continue to do that. And Chris and his team evolved how they do business to manage the changes in the producers.
Jeremy Goebel: That capital efficiency is something we've been seeing for five years, and we'll continue to do that. Chris and his team evolve how they do business to manage the changes in the producers.
Willie Chiang: Yeah, John, this is Willie. Just one thing to add. Obviously for us, more volume that's stable is better for companies like us. My expectations are as continued progress goes on efficiency and technology, we hopefully avoid large new wells coming on, big declines, and anything that smoothes that out obviously has advantages and allows us to be more capital efficient and then help our producer partners.
Speaker Change: Yeah, John, this is Willie. Just one thing to add. Obviously, for us,
more volume that's stable is better for companies like us.
Speaker Change: So, my expectations are, as continued progress goes on efficiency and technology, we hopefully avoid large, large new wells coming on, big declines, and anything that smooths that out obviously has advantages and allows us to be more capital efficient and help our producer partners.
John Mackay: That's great. That's helpful. Thank you. Maybe just second one, going back to, I think, Neal's question. We're a few years out now from the Oryx acquisition, standing up the big JV. Part of the story at the time was looking to redirect maybe eventually some of those volumes onto the Plains long-haul pipes. Maybe if you could just tie that back into your comments earlier on the general flexibility you guys are giving shippers, and then maybe specifically just an update on how that Oryx strategy has played out. Thanks.
Speaker Change: That's great. That's helpful. Thank you. Maybe just second one, going back to, I think…
Speaker Change: Neil's question, you know, we're a few years out now from the Oryx acquisition, standing up the big JV. Part of the story at the time was, you know, looking to redirect maybe eventually some of those volumes onto the plane's long-haul pipes.
Speaker Change: So maybe if you could just kind of tie that back into your comments earlier on the general flexibility you guys are giving shippers And then maybe specifically just an update on kind of how that Oryx strategy is has kind of played out. Thanks
Jeremy Goebel: Sure. I'd say it's actually been better than we expected. Both us and our partners are very happy with the JV. What I would say is the Oryx shippers now have more choices than they did before, and we hope to offer better service to give them the barrel at one location and get it back. They still have their old options, they have the new one. Our pipes have maintained being full. It's been good for our Wink to Webster customers. We're the largest origin point for Wink to Webster. They're a big consumer of barrels in the Permian Basin. It's been good for our long-haul pipes and our third parties because we maintain connectivity there. That's more of a defensive strategy in the case the pipes aren't full, but the basins continue to grow and our pipes remain full.
Speaker Change: Sure, I'd say it's actually been better than we expected. Both us and our partners are very happy with the JB.
What I would say is, the orcs...
Shippers now have more choices than they did before.
and we hope to offer better service.
Speaker Change: to give them the barrel at one location and get it back. So they still have their old options, they have the new ones, R-Pythons means.
Speaker Change: maintain being full. It's been good for our Wing-to-Webster customers. We're the largest origin point for Wing-to-Webster. They're a big consumer of barrels in the Permian Basin. It's been good for our long-haul pipes and our third parties because we maintain connectivity there.
Speaker Change: That's more of a defensive strategy in the case the pipes aren't full, but the basins continue to grow and our pipes remain full. So at this point, it's...
Jeremy Goebel: At this point, it's been perfectly fine and the optionality's been good with our customers, and it's candidly allow us to integrate other parts of their business, maybe where we didn't do business with them, to integrate more pieces of their acreage to give them more options and let them trade across the platform.
Speaker Change: been perfectly fine and optionality has been good with our customers and it's candidly allowed us to integrate other parts of their business, maybe where we didn't do business with them, to integrate more pieces of their acreage to give them more options and let them trade across the platform.
John Mackay: Makes sense. Appreciate time.
Thanks. It makes sense. Appreciate the time.
Operator: Thank you. Please stand by for our next question. Our next question comes from the line of Neal Dingmann with Truist Securities. Your line is open.
Thank you.
Please stand by for our next question.
Cool.
Speaker Change: Our next question comes from the line of Neil Dingman with Truer Securities. Your line is open.
Neal Dingmann: Thanks for the time. Good morning, guys. My question is really just on overall producer volumes and activity. I'm just curious, now when you look at what your operators are currently doing to sort of wind down the year on oil and NGL volumes, is that on track, kind of what you were thinking to end the year and start the next year? Are you still noticing any material, I don't know, either Delaware infrastructure or other constraints impacting which might be even higher activity?
Neil Dingman: Thanks for the time. Good morning, guys. My question is really just on overall.
Neil Dingman: Producer volumes and activity. I'm just curious now when you look at what your operators are currently doing to sort of wind down the year with on oil and NGL volumes. Is that on track? Kind of what you were thinking to end the year and start the next year?
Neil Dingman: You know, are there, you know, are you still noticing any material, I don't know, either Delaware infrastructure or other constraints impacting, which might be even a higher activity?
Jeremy Goebel: Sure. That's a good question. New Mexico gas evacuation is probably the biggest constraint we've seen this year. While not perfect, I think Kinetik referenced it on their call that there's still some gas in the Northern New Mexico. The industry solved bottlenecks. They and others are solving the bottlenecks. That's gas getting to market. That will help our gathering systems as well. By and large, you've seen most of those bottlenecks go away. Water is another one, but the industry is dealing with it. What I would say is prudently and responsible development by the upstream folks. I think the biggest surprise to us was the continued efficiencies of the producers. You've heard that on their calls, and they continue to get better. The consolidation has actually driven that in the right direction for us, the industry as a whole.
Yeah, so that's a good question, so
Yes.
Neil Dingman: New Mexico gas evacuation is probably the biggest constraint we've seen this year. While not perfect, I think Kinetic referenced it on their call that there's still some gas in the northern New Mexico.
Neil Dingman: That's getting... Look, the industry solves bottlenecks. They and others are solving the bottlenecks. That's gas getting to market. That will help our gathering systems as well. But by and large... ... ... ... ...
Neil Dingman: You've seen most of those bottlenecks go away. Water is another one, but the industry is dealing with it. And so what I would say is...
Neil Dingman: Prudently and responsible development by the upstream folks. I think the biggest surprise to us was the continued efficiencies of the producers and you've heard that on their calls and they continue to get better and Consolidation has actually driven that in the right direction for for us the industry
Jeremy Goebel: We're cautiously optimistic, and everything's on track to as good or better than we expected going into next year.
Neil Dingman: As a whole, so we're cautiously optimistic and everything's on track to as good or better than we expected going into next year.
Neal Dingmann: Yeah, that's really nice to hear. Maybe just a quick follow-up on the NGL segment. Again, just curious, how different now operations financially should we think about this segment now that you're able to do, I think you described it last quarter as more of a integrated value chain now after those 15 year plus contracts. I'm just wondering now that you've done that, what sort of differences should we be looking for operation financially?
Speaker Change: Yeah, it's really nice to hear and then maybe just a quick follow-up on the NGL segment.
So, again, I'm just curious.
Speaker Change: you know, how different now operation financially should we think about this segment now that you know you were able to do? I think you described it last quarter as more of an integrated value chain now after those 15 year plus contracts. I'm just wondering now that you've done that, you know, what sort of differences should we be looking for operation financially?
Jeremy Goebel: Yeah. Go ahead, Willie.
Willie Chiang: I think the biggest takeaway is as we've been able to swap margin-based business to fee-based business. As we go forward, our goal is obviously to do more of that. You should see a little more flatness in the saddle. We have less. We had some contracts roll off that we were sharing and some price benefits of higher frac spreads, but now it's going to be steadier with the volumes going through the systems. Anything to add, Jeremy?
Speaker Change: Yeah, I think the biggest takeaway is that as we've we've been able to swap
Margin-based business to fee-based business.
Speaker Change: And as we go forward, our goal is obviously to do more of that, so you should see a little more flatness of the saddle. We have less, we have some contracts roll off that we were sharing in some price benefits of higher frac spreads, but now it's going to be steadier with the volumes going through the system.
Jeremy Goebel: Nope.
Anything to add, Jeremy? Nope.
Neal Dingmann: Okay. Thank you all.
Willie Chiang: Thanks, Neal.
Bye.
Great. Thank you all.
Operator: Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, I'm showing no further questions in the queue. I would now like to turn the call back over to Willie Chiang for closing remarks.
Thanks, Neil.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Ladies and gentlemen, I'm showing no further questions in the queue. I would now like to turn the call back over to Willie Chang for closing remarks.
Willie Chiang: Well, thanks so much everyone for dialing in, your continued interest in Plains. We'll give you more updates in February, but we'll see you on the road and have a nice weekend everyone. Thank you.
Willie Chang: Well, thanks so much, everyone, for dialing in your continued interest in planes. We'll give you more updates in February, but we'll see you on the road, and have a nice weekend, everyone. Thank you. Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.
Operator: Ladies and gentlemen, this concludes today's conference call. Thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.
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