Q3 2024 Columbia Sportswear Co Earnings Call
Greetings, welcome to Columbia SportsWare's third quarter 2024 financial results conference call. At this time all participants are in a snowy mode.
A question and answer session will follow the former presentation. If anyone should require operator assistance during the conference, please press star zero on your telephone keypad. Please note this conference is being recorded.
I will now turn the conference over to your host Andrew Burns, VP of Investor Relations and Strategic Planning at Columbia Sportswear. You may begin.
Dear afternoon, and thanks for joining us to discuss Columbia Sports Work Company's third quarter results. In addition to the earnings release, we furnish an 8K containing a detailed CFO commentary and financial review presentation explaining our results.
This document is also available on our Invest Relations website, investor.clumbia.com.
Andrew Burns: With me today on the call, our Chairman, President and Chief Executive Officer Tim Boyle, Executive Vice President and Chief Financial Officer Jim Swanson, an Executive Vice President, Chief Administrative Officer in General Counsel Peter Braggon.
This conference call will contain forward-looking statements regarding Columbia's expectations, anticipations, or beliefs about the future. These statements are expressed in good faith and are believed to have a reasonable basis. However, each forward-looking statement is subject to many risks and uncertainties, and actual results may differ materially from what is projected.
Many of these risks and uncertainties are described in Columbia's SEC filings. We caution that forward-looking statements are inherently less reliable than historical information. We do not undertake any duty to update any of the forward-looking statements after the date of this conference call to conform the forward-looking statements to actual results or to changes in our expectations.
Andrew Burns: I'd also like to point out that during the call, we made reference to certain non-GAAP financial measures, including constant currency net sales.
For further information about non-GAAP financial measures and results, including a reconciliation of GAAP to non-GAAP measures and an explanation of management's rationale for referencing these non-GAAP measures, please refer to the Supplemental Financial Information section in Financial Tables included in our earnings release and the appendix of our CFO Commentary and Financial Review.
Following our prepared remarks we'll host a Q&A period during which we will limit each caller to two questions so we can get to everyone by the end of the hour. Now I'll turn the call over to Tim.
Tim: Thanks, Andrew, and good afternoon.
Overall, third quarter financial results reflect a continuation of the trends we've experienced all year.
Tim Boyle: The North American outdoor marketplace remains challenged and we are working to maximize sales in a soft consumer demand environment. Outside of North America, we continue to experience positive momentum in most direct and distributor businesses.
led by our China and Europe Direct business.
Third quarter net sales declined 5% year over year and came in at the low end of our guidance range. Despite this, we were able to exceed our diluted earnings per share guidance range through a better-than-planned gross margin and disciplined expense management.
Our financial position remains strong. We exited the quarter with cash and short-term investments of over $370 million dollars and no debt. We are on track to generate over $300 million dollars in operating cash flow this year.
Tim Boyle: In addition to investing in our business to drive long-term profitable growth, we are returning free cash flow to shareholders via dividends and share repurchases. Through the first three quarters of the year, our share repurchases totaled $231 million.
Tim Boyle: Highlighting our continued commitment to our capital allocation strategy, the Board of Directors has approved a new $600 million buyback authorization.
Tim Boyle: As we enter our peak sales season, there's no shortage of uncertainty. We await the arrival of colder weather in many regions of the world. With this in mind, we are taking a more cautious net sales outlook for the remainder of the year.
Despite the top-line pressure, we are slightly raising the bottom end of our diluted earnings-per-share guidance.
Before reviewing our results and outlook in more detail, I'd like to discuss Columbia's new growth strategy named Accelerate.
In recent months, the Columbia brand initiated Accelerate, a growth strategy intended to elevate the brand and attract younger and more active consumers.
Over the past 86 years, we've built an extraordinary company and one of the largest outdoor brands in the world.
Our top strategic priority is to accelerate profitable growth, and I know our company is capable of growing rapidly.
Tim Boyle: The Accelerate Growth Strategy is centered around several consumer-centric shifts.
and Enhanced Ways of Working.
Tim: First, we have strengthened our consumer segmentation framework to clearly define the growth opportunities ahead of us. We will continue to serve our existing consumers with accessible outdoor essentials while also focusing on bringing new, younger, active consumers into the brand.
We know that this consumer segment is the largest and fastest growing part of the outdoor market.
We already successfully serve this consumer outside the U.S. where we are seeing strong growth in markets like China and Europe.
Tim: In the coming seasons, our brand, product, and marketplace strategies in the U.S. will focus on reaching younger, more active consumers. We know that when we deliver the right product to the right consumers at the right time, we win in the marketplace.
The second shift is elevating consumers'
We're doing this with a refreshed, creative strategy that brings Columbia's unique brand personality to life.
Tim: We're embracing the spirit of the brand that our one tough mother, Gert Boyle, made famous.
Tim: We engineer exceptional products for whatever life throws at you, helping to keep consumers warm, dry, cool, and protected, and at the same time, we don't take ourselves too seriously.
The Columbia brand is fun, irreverent, and authentic, and this will become increasingly evident in our marketing.
To lead this new marketing direction, we recently hired Matt Sutton as the Columbia Brand Head of Marketing. Matt has extensive experience in brand and digital marketing and will be leading the strategic integration of the Columbia global marketing efforts.
We've also announced a new global ad agency of record, Adam and Eve, to help us bring our vision to life.
Tim: The third shift is around product. The foundation of our success is creating iconic products that are differentiated, functional, and innovative. Under the leadership of Woody Blackford, our product teams have a new product construct to drive growth with targeted consumer segments.
Consumers already trust the Columbia brand for its quality, value, and reliability. In the coming seasons, we will be emphasizing innovation and style with new products, as well as updates to our most iconic styles.
We're reducing our assortment to focus our efforts on fewer, more powerful collections with clear purpose.
The fourth ship in Xcelerate is elevating the position of the Columbia brand in the U.S. marketplace.
To activate our brand and product strategies, we will invest alongside our best-in-class strategic retail partners to elevate in-store presentations and bring our unique brand and products to life.
In our direct-to-consumer e-commerce business, we've already begun to evolve Columbia.com to be the best expression of the brand.
We want visitors that come to the site to see our latest products and innovations with enriched brand storytelling.
In our brick-and-mortar stores, we're focusing on enhancing our assortments and in-store presentations to tell better brand stories and drive sales.
The next shift in Accelerate is our integrated full-funnel marketing strategy.
We'll have a greater emphasis on the consistent year-round share of voice in the market. Not only are we planning to invest more into marketing, but we're also going to be more efficient with how and where we activate these demand creation investments.
We will be more differentiated with creative marketing activations and immersive ways to experience the brand.
Combined, our Accelerate product, marketing, and marketplace strategies are engineered to get the right product to the right consumers at the right place in time. This will enable us not only to meet our consumers where they are, but inspire them to go further with us.
We're excited to bring Accelerate to life. This will be a multi-year strategy that steadily builds momentum in the seasons ahead. As 2025 progresses, the changes we're making will be increasingly evident to consumers.
Tim: We will seek to balance brand investments with disciplined expense management to achieve our goal of profitable growth with operating margin expansion over time.
Speaker Change: I will now review our third quarter financial performance.
Net sales of $932 million declined 5% year-over-year, driven by a 9% decline in global wholesale net sales, partially offset by 2% direct-to-consumer growth.
Gross Margin expanded 150 basis points to 50.2%.
This was ahead of plan, driven by favorable international gross margin performance, lower than expected promotional activity in the U.S., and lower freight expenses.
SG&A expenses increased 3%, primarily reflecting higher DTC expenses, partially offset by lower supply chain expenses.
Favorable gross margin and SG&A underspend resulted in operating income and diluted earnings per share coming in at above our guidance range.
Speaker Change: Looking at our net sales by geography, U.S. net sales decreased 10%, primarily driven by mid-teens percent decrease in U.S. wholesale. As a reminder, our fall 24 order book in the U.S. was down a mid-single-digit percent.
While it's still very early in the season, wholesale sell-through has gotten off to a slow start. We expect sell-through to pick up with the arrival of cold weather.
USDTC net sales were relatively flat. Brick-and-mortar was up mid single digits percent, driven by a contribution from the temporary clearance locations, increased store productivity, and new stores opened over the last year.
U.S. e-commerce net sales were down high teens percent, reflecting challenging outdoor market conditions, as well as a shift in Columbia.com digital marketing strategies.
For my review of third quarter year-over-year net sales growth in international geographies, I will reference constant currency growth rates to illustrate underlying growth in each market.
Latin America Asia-Pacific region or LAAP net sales increased 18%.
China net sales increased low 20% with healthy growth across wholesale and DTC. Despite broader economic headwinds in China, the outdoor category continues to grow.
Columbia is capitalizing on this trend with localized product lines like Transit and unique brand activations that highlight Columbia's heritage and innovation.
During the quarter, Columbia hosted a hiking event in Changri La National Park.
The well-attended event featured music and hiking in the first-of-its-kind event at this premier hiking destination. The event was amplified by celebrity brand ambassadors, whose online content generated millions of impressions.
China's e-commerce business continues to build momentum with several highlights in the quarter.
Speaker Change: Columbia had an incredibly successful Super Brand Day on Tmall, ranking third in sales volume across all outdoor brands.
Speaker Change: On TikTok, Columbia's first footwear store launched and is off to a strong start.
It's exciting to see the Columbia brand realize its full growth potential in this important region and it remains on track to be one of our fastest growing markets this year.
Japan net sales increased double-digit percent, aided by continued strength in international tourism.
Speaker Change: During the quarter, we appointed Jeff McPike as the new General Manager of Columbia Sportswear Korea. Jeff is a 25-year industry veteran with a passion for building innovative, omni-channel consumer experiences.
Speaker Change: His marketplace expertise will be instrumental in building the right strategy to drive our business forward in Korea.
LAAP distributor markets were up mid-20s percent, primarily reflecting robust Fall 24 orders.
Europe, Middle East, and Africa region, or EMEA, net sales increased 10%.
Europe Direct Net Sales increased low single-digit percent, led by a robust DTC growth.
The European team is doing an exceptional job of creating brand visibility and relevance with unique marketing activations like the Hike Society.
Speaker Change: This season, we hosted 90 Hike Society events, creating grassroots connections with young hikers and introducing them to Columbia technologies.
Our Europe Direct business remains on track to be one of our fastest growing markets this year.
Our EMEA distributor business increased by approximately 130% driven by a shift in timing of shipments as well as higher fall 24 orders on the strength of the Columbia brand in many distributor markets.
Canada net sales decreased 19% driven by lower wholesale sales. The Columbia brand remains well positioned in Canada with high brand awareness and consumer trust.
Speaker Change: Looking at performance by brand, Columbia brand net sales decreased 1%, primarily reflecting a challenging marketplace in the U.S. and Canada, partially offset by a continuation of healthy trends in most international markets.
This fall, we have several innovations that are integral to our product and marketing strategies.
OmniHeat Infinity remains our largest innovation platform and one of the fastest growing parts of our business.
Speaker Change: Our newest cold weather innovation, OmniHeat Arctic.
will be prominently featured in our DTC channels. As a reminder, OmniHeat Arctic starts with a translucent outer layer that lets solar energy in. Heat is then transmitted to an insulation layer close to the body for maximum warmth, mimicking the polar bear's warmth protection system.
I'd like to congratulate our Chief Product Officer, Woody Blackford, and our Vice President of Innovation, Haskell Beckham, who are honored by the American Association of Textile Chemists and Colorists for their significant contributions in developing new fabrications and technologies in the apparel industry.
Thank you for everything you do to make Columbia a leader in the outdoor space. Great work, team.
On the collaboration front, this fall we partnered with Disney on Mickey's Outdoor Club Collection.
Speaker Change: Inspired by the iconic artwork from the Mickey Mouse comic strip, this collection featured beloved Disney characters on a camping trip.
Speaker Change: Top Styles quickly sold out and the line was featured in numerous Disney focused and outdoor media outlets.
This holiday season, Columbia will launch our ninth annual Star Wars collection.
The first content promoting the collaboration will go live tomorrow and will feature a surprise appearance from a Star Wars special guest. Fans of Star Wars and NASCAR are going to want to see this.
Shifting to our emerging brands.
Mountain Hardware net sales increased 2% driven by DTC growth. The brand has several exciting brand and product activations for the balance of the year including an expanded Ghost Whisperer collection.
new snow sports offerings, and a soon-to-be-announced product collab. Mountain Hardware's product line and brand positioning are on track and the team is focused on accelerating growth.
Speaker Change: Croninet sales decreased 7% in the quarter.
I'm encouraged by the progress the Prada leadership team has made in recent months.
activating wholesale distribution, refreshing marketing, and recruiting new talent to the team. I'm confident these actions position the brand for growth starting with a positive order book for spring 25.
Speaker Change: Sorrell brand net sales decreased 39% driven by lower fall 24 orders and elevated clearance and promotional sales activity in the prior year.
The Sorrell team is focused on building brand, product, and marketplace strategies to drive the long-term growth potential that I know the brand is capable of.
This process will take time, and I expect sales trends will remain under pressure in the Spring 25 season.
I will now discuss our 2024 financial outlook.
Speaker Change: This outlook and commentary include forward-looking statements. Please see our CFO commentary and financial review presentations for additional details and disclosures related to these statements.
Looking across the global marketplace, there are many external risks and uncertainties.
outdoor industry and U.S. consumer headwinds, weather, geopolitical conflicts, supply chain disruptions, and the upcoming U.S. elections.
These factors, among others, have the potential to impact consumer demand and our operations.
With this uncertainty in mind, we are reducing our net sales outlook to reflect a 3 to 5 percent decline this year. Gross margin is now expected to expand 40 to 90 basis points.
SG&A is expected to be 42.8 to 43 percent of sales leading to an operating margin of 7.7 to 8.4 percent. The profit improvement program is on track to deliver approximately 90 million in cost savings this year.
We are slightly raising the low end of our diluted EPS guidance range, which is now 370 to 405.
As we noted on the last call, our Spring 25 order book reflects a return to growth in our wholesale business in the first half of the year. This order book reflects growth across Columbia, Prana, and Mountain Hardware, and growth in the U.S. and international markets.
Based on the spring 25 orders, we anticipate first half wholesale net sales to increase mid single-digit percent.
While we are not providing any full year 2025 guidance at this time, our objective is to deliver net sales growth and operating margin expansion.
We will provide our next update on 2025 when we report in February.
Speaker Change: In summary,
Speaker Change: I'm confident we have the right strategies in place to unlock the significant growth opportunities we see across the business. The Accelerate Growth Strategy provides clear strategic shifts that will unlock brand-right profitable growth for years to come.
We're investing in our strategic priorities with renewed emphasis.
Speaker Change: to accelerate profitable growth.
Speaker Change: Create iconic products that are differentiated, functional, and innovative.
Drive brand engagement with increased focused demand creation investments.
Enhance consumer experiences by investing in capabilities to delight and retain consumers.
Speaker Change: Amplify Marketplace Excellence that is digitally led, omni-channel, and global.
and empower talent that is driven by our core values.
That concludes my prepared remarks.
We'll welcome your questions for the remainder of the hour. Operator, can you help us with that?
Speaker Change: Certainly, at this time we will be conducting a question and answer session. If you would like to ask a question, please press star 1 on your telephone keypad.
A confirmation tone will indicate your line is in the question queue.
And the first question today is coming from Bob Durble from Guggenheim. Bob, your line is live. Hi, good afternoon.
Bob Durble: Do you believe those consumers are already in the channels that you're competing in? I'm just trying to understand, you know, sort of how do you get after...
you know, that segment of the consumer base. And the second question I have for you, Tim, is...
Bob Durble: You know, you said it's obviously weather, 75 or 80 today in New York, but like, warmer weather, slow start to the season. How do you feel like the channel is out there, you know, with many of your wholesale partners?
Great. Yeah, I can help you with both of those, Bob. As it relates to the younger consumers, we believe that they're already in the brand. We know they're in the brand internationally. We just need them to be more involved in the brand domestically.
And our expectation is that with the new marketing leadership and help from a creative agency that we've announced in the script today, that we're going to be...
Again, returning to a more differentiated approach.
Bob Durble: to a humorous
Bob Durble: Irreverent
brand personality where we can be really quite different and be more important to these consumers that we're trying to attract.
We believe that they're already in the brand and they know the brand well, it's just a question that we don't have enough of them. So that's the plan, is to spend more to get those folks, to spend it more efficiently and to get the messaging properly.
I believe the channel is in the proper position now.
And our customers have spent a lot of time cleaning up inventories with the old chemistry that was a problem for a few different geographies, but right now, the channel appears to be in good shape and we're just waiting for great weather to supercharge things.
Great, can I just follow up too?
So, just in terms of the marketing...
Is the plan to create like a one tough father strategy with you and Joe? Are you guys going to get back into the acting business? Or what are we looking for here?
My SAG card is expiring, and I think I'm done with that. No, this is going to be an approach that is going to be, frankly, quite interesting and different. And we've previewed it with a few customers. We're going to be showing it to a few more here in the next several days.
Bob Durble: interesting and good and we'll have to get in front of our investor groups here soon but suffice it to say that we're pretty excited about the opportunities going to give us.
Speaker Change: All right. We'll be watching. Thank you, Tim. Good luck.
Speaker Change: Thank you. The next question is coming from Lauren Facilescu.
Laurent Facilescu: from BNP Paribas. Laurent, your line is live. Oh, good afternoon. Thank you very much for taking my question. Tim, I wanted to follow up on the comment around...
1H25 Wholesale Growth of Mid-Single Digits. Can you unpack that a little bit more for the audience? What's driving that growth? Is it just easier year-over-year compares?
Laurent Facilescu: Is it driven by pricing, restocking, and I noticed you mentioned that growth will be coming from all regions, but are all regions equal in that nature, or should we think about just more growth coming from international, at least for spring 2025?
Speaker Change: Yeah, that's right, Luke.
Retailers who were cautious about placing orders in the prior periods for, again, chemistry that was going to be fragile from a selling perspective.
So, there will be improvements really in almost every market, not all to the same extent, but I just might point out that our international business has performed.
and I think we're doing much better than our domestic business, and our expectations are that those markets will continue to improve, maybe more rapidly than the U.S.
And then, Ron, maybe just a couple added comments to that. In terms of pricing versus stocking, as it relates to the spring 25 season.
By and large, you know, we've held price for the season aside from whatever mixed shifts there might be with with what's sold in And I think that Tim's point Joseph is you think about regional growth opportunities and don't we're calling for a bit single-digit rate of growth
a reasonable chunk of that just given the sheer reliance on the U.S. business and the Columbia brand, you can assume that the U.S.-Columbia is generally following suit with that overarching first half expectation.
Speaker Change: Okay, very helpful Tim and Jim and then just sort of follow up on more maybe more
Speaker Change: on margins, you know.
With regards to the Accelerate Plan, I think, Tim, you mentioned a higher and more efficient demand creation. I know demand creation last year was 6%. Where do you want it to go through this Accelerate Program?
Jim, for you, on the cost savings program, the $90 million for 2024, I'm just curious to know how much you've realized so far, the first, you know...
for the first few quarters. And how should we think about for the fourth quarter? And then for 2026, I know you're not commenting on about 2025 financial targets but like, should we think about that 125 to 150 kind of balance between the two years that remain for this profit improvement plan?
Speaker Change: Let me make sure I get my questions out of the way and then I'll turn it over to Jim here. The margins are planned to be quite strong.
certainly in comparison to last year. The marketing rates will be established as we go into the end of the year, but suffice it to say they're going to be increasing amount of spend in marketing as well as a more efficient use of the market.
Speaker Change: We haven't settled on a firm number yet, but we know we need to spend more and we're building those additional costs into other parts of the business so that we can offer growth and an expanding operating margin as well.
And then, Laurent, as it relates to the profit improvement program, you know, we're well along this year in achieving the targets that we'd set. In fact, earlier in the year, we said that'd be $75 to $90 million.
with the revisions and updates we're making today. We believe that we're tracking to the high end of that. You know, we're really pleased with the performance across the business in that regard. Certainly a component of that is attributable to getting our inventories clean and less supply chain and inventory carrying costs. But broader than that, a lot of optimization efforts going on across our supply chain and just a focus on discipline cost management. So,
Speaker Change: Happy to see that we're progressing in that regard and as it relates to the out years and it can be premature in terms of kind of breaking down detail, I think when we come around to our call in February, I'll provide a bit more detail on what our expectations are for 25.
Okay, very helpful and best of luck with the holiday season.
Speaker Change: Good luck.
Thank you. The next question is coming from John Kernan from TD Count. John, your line is live.
John Kernan: Hey, good afternoon guys. Thanks for taking the questions.
Tim, what do you think the catalyst is for improved spending on outdoor categories?
The competition seems fairly high. The macro seems somewhat depressed, but what do you think gets us out of this slump? You are calling for You know mid single-digit wholesale growth next year, which is which it's a nice Uplift what do you think sustainable growth looks like and what's the catalyst for it in the outdoor industry?
Speaker Change: was on the screen.
I really am not so showing great confidence with my technology. I definitely am not giving it enough emphasis. I'm not saying that they are doing anything and starting以 what we've been doing which is better and finish services. And we're not talking about it in a differentiating enough way. And that for me will be the key in terms of things.
Speaker Change: making us a bigger business in the U.S.
just overall. You know, secondarily, we've talked for a long time about the opportunities categories where we're underperforming, specifically footwear, and those areas are going to get much greater emphasis from a product standpoint and a marketing standpoint.
Understood, that's helpful. Maybe just a follow-up question on the margin structure of the business.
Speaker Change: And the SG&A rate is going to sit somewhere in the low 40s, gross margins now above, you know, above 50%.
Speaker Change: You look back at the business versus its own history, the SG&A rate is really the reason for the margin de-leverage overlap.
For the last five years. How do we think about SG&A rate? Going into fiscal 25 and fiscal 26. There's obviously been some cost savings programs announced, but how do you I guess stop the D leverage of sales and SG&A
Well, the first order of business is going to be growing the top line, which is...
a focus of the company.
but there are other levers we have available to us and maybe I'll ask Jim to just talk about a few of them because many of them are underway. Yeah you know we do have this profit improvement program that we've initiated you know it's up in some of the efforts that we have on going into 25 and 26 is how do we
to reduce our total cost of our supply chain. That had gone up by several points over this five-year time frame that we're talking about. And certainly we believe there's efficiency in how we streamline our operations, our processes, our product flow, and there ought to be savings attributable to that.
Speaker Change: And so we're, you know, I think as a management team, you know, we're focused on...
Speaker Change: The discipline that we need to have to get that SG&A back down to more appropriate levels while at the same time there needs to be some balance in it because as Tim's touched on, we want to make sure that we're also fueling growth and making right investments along the way from a demand creation perspective and putting the energy behind our brands.
Yes, so I think at the end of the day, this is about growing the business.
Tim Boyle: We think we can control costs as well as anybody, but we have to have growth and we intend to have growth.
Understood. Maybe just one final question on the Wholesale Channel commentary.
How would you describe the U.S. wholesale channel? It's not, you know, international trends are above domestic. Just curious, you know, as you look into Fiscal 25, the order books, and maybe even some of the near-term sell-through dynamics that are going on, how would you characterize the North American wholesale channel?
It will clearly in North America there's been significant consolidation at the retail
Tim Boyle: market.
for many, many years, and that puts more leverage in the hands of the retailer. So we have to be better, we have to be a preferred supplier, and we have to have greater sell-through, which is gonna be driven by great product and supercharged by great marketing.
Speaker Change: Got it. Best of luck into the fourth quarter, guys. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question will be from Paul LeJouez from Citigroup. Paul, your line is live.
Thanks, it's Tracy Kogan filling in for Paul. I had a question about your gross margin. It came in better than planned in third quarter and I think you mentioned that there were lower promotions.
in the U.S. market. So I was just wondering if you could characterize the current promotional environment. And then, secondly, I was wondering what was built into your guidance for 4Q in terms of promotion. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yeah, we would expect promotions to be stronger, frankly, as we approach the holiday season. And then the gross margin improvement was due to a number of
certainly terror free charges and then first boss
coming into the country.
Our expectations are for further promotions, but we built those expectations into our guidance today.
Yeah, Tracey, maybe just a couple added comments I would make. You'll recall in July we lowered our full year gross margin.
Tim Boyle: forecast.
In light of some of the promotions that we were seeing during the second quarter, just in anticipation of a more promotional environment, that didn't play out quite to the degree that we had anticipated.
in the third quarter, so things were a bit better.
With that said, and as Tim touched on, it's still a very promotional environment.
And so, as we've...
Tim Boyle: provided an update to our outlook. We've not increased the bottom end of our range, you know, with the expectation that there are going to be promotions out in the marketplace and we're going to need to react in order to spur the demand. And so that's essentially what's baked into our
4th quarter guidance as you think about the year-on-year change and of course we're going up against much easier comps just given how warm it was through the entirety of the fourth quarter last year. The world where we see the benefit in the gross margin expansion and Q4 is going to come through
Tim Boyle: cleaner inventories with less wholesale closeout sales in the fourth quarter this year. When we think about our own direct-to-consumer business and margins they're really on par with where they were a year ago from a promotion and from an overall margin standpoint.
That's very helpful. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question will be from Alex Perry from Bank of America. Alex, your line is live.
Alex Perry: Hi, thanks for taking my questions here. I wanted to ask about your exposure to potential China tariffs. Can you just remind us?
Yeah, we strategically began our move out of China several years ago.
The imposition of tariffs, the products that we make, the commodities that we engage in, both food and apparel, are among the most highly tariffed in the United States, some of the product carrying as much as nearly 40% duties. And that has not...
Tim Boyle: translated into increased investment in domestic production. So we believe the argument about tariffs in improving the domestic production of items such as forward imperils are fallacious.
Additionally, the expectations around our international business and the impacts of a trade war beginning are...
concerning but you know we we consider ourselves to be very adept at
Tim Boyle: Managing Tariffs
and duty rates globally show that we're very successful at that with our international business.
Tim Boyle: Bye.
The trade wars are not good and not easy to win. And then Alex, just to elaborate on our sourcing exposure, that China, our footwear category is about 20%, and apparel is a low single-digit percent, so it's, in the grand scheme of things, it's quite small, as Tim described.
really helpful and then I just wanted to follow up to the prior question actually on the gross margin so
Speaker Change: Can you just, it sounds like lower closeout cells, you know, is part of that.
Can you maybe just talk about other pieces in there that would be driving the expansion and then, you know, do you expect those Talwinds that you're seeing in the fourth quarter and the third quarter here to continue, you know, as we move in through the first half of next year? Thanks.
Yeah, Alex, I just reiterate, by far and away, the single most meaningful impact to why we would anticipate 4 quarter gross margin expansion is going to be a function of having much cleaner inventory than we did a year ago. And where we see the biggest benefit of that is in our wholesale business where we anticipate a much lower percentage.
of our total business is being done through closeout sales. And then as I touched on,
We do have a much better assortment of inventory in the outlets in terms of the composition between what's special makeup and what is true excess inventory going through there.
Tim Boyle: But we do, to the point made earlier, you know, we do anticipate that promotions are going to remain and marketing will remain a bit higher, and so we've taken a, I think, the best approach or most reasonable approach we can to the margin outlook that we're providing here today.
Perfect. Very helpful. Best of luck going forward.
Speaker Change: Thank you.
Thank you. The next question will be from Mitch Kunitz from Seaport Research Partners. Mitch, your line is live.
Yeah, thanks for taking my questions.
Mitch Kunitz: Tim, we've talked about the weather on this call and how it's been a warm start to the season. I'm just curious...
Mitch Kunitz: The assumptions that are embedded in your your outlook Are you are you essentially assuming normal weather for November December are? Are you expecting it to continue to be warm? What's sort of the underlying assumption that gets you to your guide?
Well, certainly through the month of October, as we've seen, it's been quite warm, and that's had a dampening effect on sell-through across both our wholesale and our DTC business.
and that.
Speaker Change: That's certainly been picked up in the updated outlook that we're providing here today. As we get into the latter part of the year, going up against the warm weather we had last year, we are anticipating some improvement, such that things moderate a bit, Mitch, but we're certainly not expecting, you know...
Speaker Change: a polar freeze that amplifies demand in any meaningful way. So we've taken as close to a middle-of-the-road approach as we can. Now, we all know that there's a weather and a seasonal component to our business that we're dependent upon.
And Tim, you know, you've been doing this for a long time. When do you really need...
John Kernan: the weather to turn. We get the impression that you know it's better for the cold weather to come before
Speaker Change: you know, maybe Black Friday and things get too promotional, you know, the best bet for full-price sell-through is before, you know, the market turns promotional going into the holidays. So is there sort of like a
Speaker Change: a line in the sand where you think that's where you need the weather to come before retailers kind of hit the panic button and start putting everything on sale that's somewhat seasonal in nature?
Speaker Change: Yeah, I mean, these are difficult to read, frankly, but, you know, in my opinion, it's never too early to start snowing, Labor Day would be okay.
But what the expectations are that, you know, the severity of the weather and where the weather occurs. As an example, we've had pretty good weather in Europe, our business in Europe is quite good based on the fact that we had more normalized weather there, as well as in China.
But yeah, so you know the weather's going to have to get here eventually and it's a our expectations are that we built
the proper focus on the quantity of inventory that we need to move and at the promotional cadences that we think are better than our goals, and so it's hard to give you a date.
That's part of the reason why we've widened the guidance range to, or kept that wide, not narrowed that in as we've gotten into the latter part of the year, just given the degree of uncertainty around that aspect of our business.
And then maybe a last one on Sorrell.
Tim, you've kind of talked about that being a billion, having sort of a billion dollar
This year are you you know, are you see I know that and it sounds like the spring order book is down So at least the first half of next year. It looks like that that business is continue to kind of get will go lower
Are you seeing any, you know, green shoots yet? I know there's been a management change there and you kind of altered the strategy, but any green shoots that gives you confidence that there's still a billion dollar potential with that brand?
Yeah, I mean, I think it's a it's a very unusual product
and brand with a very unusual background and personality. We just have to harvest that. So if you're looking for green shoots, it's really the men's product.
was virtually abandoned in the prior periods and so I think there's real opportunity there just to...
to take advantage of the popularity of the brand itself with men, and then we just have to get our products correct here for the...
who's a female shopper.
and it's going to be important that we have the right approach to marketing that product as well.
Okay, thanks. Good luck.
Speaker Change: Thank you very much.
Speaker Change: Thank you and once again it's star 1 if you wish to ask a question today. The next question is coming from Jonathan Komp from Baird. Jonathan your line is live.
Yeah, hi, good afternoon. I just want to follow up on the commentary around the wholesale outlook into the first half of 2025. I know
Yeah, again, as I said that there's been a significant amount of consolidation on the retail trade in North America. We have
Speaker Change: So, the expectation is that as we continue to improve our marketing efforts, improve our spend, improve our performance...
We've got, you know, unique positioning in our PFG fishing product, which is one of the few brands that has a really honest-to-goodness spring business, and those are going to be areas where we need to emphasize our points of differentiation.
Speaker Change: against our competitors and that will give us a better business in the wholesale trade in North America.
Okay, great. And then just one follow-up related to the Accelerate strategy. I'm just curious...
You've obviously been, you know, in the mode of reducing costs and driving margin expansion through cost cuts. How are you thinking about that balance? Is there any risk that you went too far in some of the cost actions? And I guess, why does it make sense to...
Speaker Change: Target Margin Expansion, while you're also now putting more effort behind accelerating the growth. Just want to hear the thoughts there. Thank you.
Speaker Change: across all categories.
and promotional activities that we believe are going to be important to regain the strength of our brands.
Speaker Change: Thank you. Bye.
Speaker Change: Okay, much appreciated. Thank you.
Thank you. The next question today will be from Mauricio Serna from UBS. Mauricio, your line is live.
Mauricio Serna: Great. Thanks for taking my questions. I wanted to just ask about the Q3 sales figure. Just want to make sure with the puts and takes that you mentioned on the wholesale shipments, you know, was there like a net impact on wholesale shipments? I think there was like a pull forward from EMEA, but then some delays in.
and the other, like Europe Direct, which just wanted to make sure there wasn't any, you know, impact from that front. And then.
Maybe could you elaborate a little bit more on how you're thinking about the overall, you know, outdoor industry demand in the U.S. going into 2025, just given that we're lapping a couple of years of tough dynamics. Thank you.
I can hit the first part of that, Maurizio, with regard to the timing shifts that we saw in the quarter.
So this is the Fall 24 season, and we did it intentionally when you look at the overall season.
Mauricio Serna: or if you look at the quarter, rather, the wholesale business was down 9%. Our projection for the full season is to be down 4%, so you can see that some of that's shifting into the fourth quarter, some of which was planned, some of which was not, and the unplanned components are a result of some of the supply chain disruptions that we had during the quarter.
relative to the plan we had, the guidance we provided in July, that timing shift is in the order of magnitude of about 15 to 20 million dollars and that would have impacted our North America business and to a degree our European business. Those are the two that were most impacted.
The market is very strong for outdoor apparel products. We see no movement towards more formal apparel, either in the office or...
casually. It's really a function of people being comfortable in the outdoors and comfortable in outdoor apparel.
Our expectations are that the business is going to continue to grow. We need to be getting a bigger piece of the existing pie.
And just to be clear, that $15, $20 million, that's shifted out of Q3 into Q4 or the other way around. Just wanted to make sure.
I understood that. And just also following up on the Q4...
Just given how the weather's been trending, just curious to hear if you have any sort of cancellations or is this like still too early in retailers?
Mauricio Serna: would probably wait.
in case one of us gets it. Yeah.
The first component of that shift of $15 to $20 million, so if you look at the outlook that we provided in July, on the high end of our revenue outlook, we missed by about $27 million.
Mauricio Serna: That is...
Speaker Change: 15 to 20 million. I know that's shifting from Q3 into Q4 where we've got later shipments.
as a result of some of the disruptions we've seen supply chain-wise. So Banco Dash, the East Coast Pork Strike.
Mauricio Serna: and so forth.
And then as it relates to the fourth quarter, you know, we haven't necessarily seen meaningful cancellations as of yet. You know, certainly we're a little bit later.
in our deliveries, relative to where we ordinarily would like to be, given some of the supply chain impacts that we've seen, but nothing that's been outsized relative to historic levels at this point.
Speaker Change: Understood. Thank you so much.
Thank you and there were no other questions at this time. I would now like to hand the call back to Tim Boyle for closing remarks.
Thank you everybody. I want to thank everyone for listening in.
We are very excited about the Xcelerate
and what it means for our company.
be thrilled once that happens. So thanks for listening in. We look forward to talking to you next quarter.
Thank you. This does conclude today's conference. You may disconnect your lines at this time. Thank you for your participation.