Q4 2024 ChromaDex Corp Earnings Call

Operator: Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by, and welcome to ChromaDex Corporation's fourth quarter of 2024 earnings conference call.

Ladies and gentlemen, thank you for standing by and welcome to <unk> Corporation's fourth quarter of 'twenty 'twenty Four earnings Conference call. My name is <unk> and that will be your conference. Operator today at this time all participants are in a listen only mode and as a reminder, discomfort.

Operator: My name is Prilla, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. And as a reminder, this conference call is being recorded.

This call is being recorded this afternoon <unk> issued a news release announcing the company's financial results for the fourth quarter of 'twenty 'twenty. Four if you have not reviewed this information both are available within the Investor Relations section of <unk> website, a triple double your dot com IDEXX dotcom.

Operator: This afternoon, ChromaDex issued a news release announcing the company's financial results for the fourth quarter of 2024. If you have not reviewed this information, both are available within the Industrial Relations section of ChromaDex's website at www.chromadex.com.

Ben Shamsian: I would now like to turn the conference over to Ben Shamsian, Vice President of Dayton Partners. Please go ahead, Mr. Shamsian.

Speaker Change: I would now like to turn the conference over to Dan Shan Shan Vice President of Lytham Partners. Please go ahead Mr assumption.

Rob Fried: Thank you, good afternoon, and welcome to ChromaDex Corporation's fourth quarter of 2024 results conference.

Speaker Change: Thank you good afternoon, and welcome to <unk> Corporation's fourth quarter of 2024 results Conference call.

Ben Shamsian: With us today are ChromaDex's Chief Executive Officer, Rob Fried, Chief Financial Officer, Ozan Pamir, and Senior Vice President of Scientific and Regulatory Affairs, Dr. Andrew Sha, who will join the call for Q&A. Today's conference call may include forward-looking statements, including statements related to ChromaDex's research and development and clinical trial plans, and the timing and results of such trials. Timing of Future Regulatory Filings Expansion of the sale of NIAGEN products and ingredients in new markets, business development opportunities, future financial results, cash needs, operating performance, investor interest, and business prospects and opportunities, as well as anticipated results of operations.

Speaker Change: With us today are <unk>, Chief Executive Officer, Rob Fried Chief Financial Officer, Ozark Premier and senior Vice President of scientific and regulatory Affairs after Andrew Schaap, who will join the call for Q&A.

Speaker Change: Today's conference call May include forward looking statements, including statements related to <unk> research and development and clinical trial plans and the timing and results of such trials the timing of future regulatory filings the expansion of the sale of nitrogen products and ingredients in new markets.

Speaker Change: Business development opportunities future financial results cash needs operating performance investor interest.

Speaker Change: <unk> business prospects and opportunities as well as anticipated results of operations.

Ben Shamsian: Forward-looking statements represent only the company's estimates on the date of this conference call and are not intended to give any assurance as to actual future results. Because forward-looking statements relate to matters that have not yet occurred, these statements are inherently subject to risks and uncertainties. Many factors could cause ChromaDex's actual activities or results to differ materially from the activities and results anticipated in forward-looking statements. These risk factors include those contained in ChromaDex's quarterly reports and Form 10-K most recently filed with the SEC, including results of operations, financial condition, cash flows, as well as impact of global markets and economic conditions on our business.

Speaker Change: We're looking statements represent only the company's estimates on the date of this conference call and are not intended to give any assurance as to actual future results because forward looking statements relate to matters that have not yet occurred. These statements are inherently subject to risks and uncertainties.

Speaker Change: Many factors could cause <unk> actual activities or results to differ materially from the activities and results anticipated in forward looking statements.

Speaker Change: These risk factors include those contained in <unk> quarterly report.

Speaker Change: <unk> Form 10-K, most recently filed with the SEC, including results of operations financial condition cash flows as well as impact of global markets and economic conditions on our business. Please note that the company assumes no obligation to update any forward looking statements after that.

Ben Shamsian: Please note that the company assumes no obligation to update any forward-looking statements as of the date of this conference call. We conform with forward-looking statements and to results or to changes in this expectation.

Speaker Change: Date of this conference call to conform with forward looking statements actual results or to changes in its expectations. In addition, certain financial information presented in this call references non-GAAP financial measures. The company's earnings presentation and earnings press release, which were issued this afternoon our avail.

Ben Shamsian: In addition, certain financial information presented in this call referenced non-GAAP financial measures. The company's earnings presentation and earnings press release, which were issued this afternoon, are available on the company's website, present reconciliation to the appropriate measures.

Speaker Change: On the company's website presents reconciliations to the appropriate measures. Finally this conference call is being recorded via webcast. The webcast will be available at the Investor Relations section of our website at Www Dot <unk> Dot com.

Ben Shamsian: Finally, this conference call is being recorded via webcast. The webcast will be available at the investor relations section of our website at www.chromadex.com.

Rob Fried: With that, it's now my pleasure to turn the call over to our Chief Executive Officer, Rob Fried. Thank you, Ben, and welcome, everybody. In the fourth quarter, we delivered record revenues of $29.1 million, a 37% increase year over year. and net income of $7.2 million. For the full year, we delivered net revenues of $99.6 million. 19% growth year over year and net income of $8.6 million. We generated $12.1 million in positive cash flow from operations in 2024, and we ended the year with $44.7 million in cash and no debt. It appears that the world is finally catching on to the importance of NAD, and the fact Nitrogen is the safest and most effective way to increase NAD levels, particularly in damaged cells.

That it's now my pleasure to turn the call over to our Chief Executive Officer, Rob Fried.

Speaker Change: Thank you Ben and welcome everybody.

Speaker Change: In the fourth quarter, we delivered record revenues of $29 1 million or 37% increase year over year.

Speaker Change: And net income of $7 2 million.

Speaker Change: For the full year, we delivered net revenues of $99 $6 million.

Speaker Change: 19% growth year over year.

Speaker Change: And net income of $8 6 million.

Speaker Change: We generated $12 $1 million in positive cash flow from operations in 2024, and we ended the year with $44 $7 million in cash.

Speaker Change: Cash.

Speaker Change: And no debt.

Speaker Change: It appears that the world is finally catching on to the importance of NAD and the <unk>.

Speaker Change: Fact.

Speaker Change: Nitrogen is the safest and most effective way to increase <unk> levels, particularly in damaged cells.

Rob Fried: In the fourth quarter, our e-commerce channel experienced robust organic growth. with net sales of $17.3 million, a 30% increase year over year. Our food-grade and pharmaceutical-grade nitrogen ingredient business had net sales of $5.3 million, a 96% increase year-over-year. True Knowledge and Distribution through our strategic partners, partners like Watson. remained consistently solid. The demand for NAD-boosting products continues to grow. We are seeing a proliferation of companies entering the arena that pursue misleading and dangerous practices. There are companies that knowingly infringe on the hard-earned patents of others. Companies that make false label claims. Companies whose sloppy manufacturing processes introduce dangerous endotoxins.

Speaker Change: In the fourth quarter, our E Commerce channel experienced robust organic growth.

Speaker Change: With net sales of $17 3, million% to 30% increase year over year.

Speaker Change: Our food grade and pharmaceutical grade Nisin ingredient business had net sales of $5 3 million or 96% increase year over year.

Speaker Change: Two nights and distribution through our strategic partners partners like Watson's.

Speaker Change: Remained consistently solid.

Speaker Change: As the demand for boosting.

Speaker Change: Boosting products continues to grow.

Speaker Change: We're seeing a proliferation of companies entering the arena that pursue misleading and dangerous practices.

Speaker Change: There are companies that knowingly infringe on the harder and patents of others there.

Speaker Change: There are companies that make false label claims.

Speaker Change: Companies, whose sloppy manufacturing processes introduce dangerous endotoxins companies that claim to be science based but have never conducted a single study.

Rob Fried: Companies that claim to be science-based, but have never conducted a single study. We're encouraged to see that Amazon and other marketplaces have taken some steps. police, We do hope to see more. We need to see more action taken by the FDA and the FTC to prevent companies from deceiving consumers. We'd also like to see the experts. of Advice on Podcasts and Newsletters Be more vigilant in screening brands. We plan to use our position as a leader in the industry to drive awareness to consumer safety and product safety. To be candid, I personally would not take a supplement that did not say ChromaDex or Niogen on the label.

Speaker Change: We're encouraged to see that Amazon and other marketplaces have taken some steps to police this activity we.

Speaker Change: We do hope to see more.

Speaker Change: We need to see more action taken by the FDA and the FTC to prevent companies from deceiving consumers and we'd also like to see the experts.

Speaker Change: We'll give advice on podcasts and newsletters.

Speaker Change: To be more vigilant in screening brands.

Speaker Change: We plan to use our position as a leader in the industry to drive awareness to consumer safety and product excellence.

Speaker Change: To be candid.

Speaker Change: Personally would not take the supplement that did not say <unk> or <unk> on the label.

Rob Fried: Last August, we launched our Niagen Plus product line and introduced Niagen IV and injections at clinics. through a compound pharmacist. The launch started off very strong with pharmaceutical grade ingredient quickly selling out. Due to issues in the supply chain, we were delayed two to three months. Pharmaceutical Grade Availability. We have now since resolved these Today Nigin IV is available in about 500 clinics nationwide. Niagen ID and Niagen Inject. are on pace for great growth in the second half. Last year, ChromaDex initiated communication with the FDA as part of the company's effort to pursue an investigational new drug application for the use of NR in the treatment of ataxia telangiectasia, AT.

Speaker Change: Last August we launched our <unk> plus product line and introduce <unk> and injections at clinics through a compound pharmacy network.

Speaker Change: The launch started off very strong with pharmaceutical grade ingredient quickly selling out.

Speaker Change: But due to issues in the supply chain, we would delays two to three months and pharmaceutical grade availability, we have now since resolved these issues.

Speaker Change: Today <unk> is available in about 500 clinics nationwide.

Speaker Change: <unk> IV and <unk>.

Speaker Change: <unk> injections.

Speaker Change: Are on pace for great growth in the second half of this year.

Speaker Change: Last year <unk> initiated communication with the FDA as part of the company's efforts to pursue an investigational new drug application for the use of that are in the treatment of ataxia till inject Asia.

Rob Fried: We continue to work with the agency to address its comments and its... With regard to the NOPARC study for the use of NR in the treatment of Parkinson's disease. The last participant was enrolled last June. So we expect that the study will be completed by June of this year. We will not be able to see results for some time thereafter, but we very much look forward to sharing more updates on this and other pharmaceutical plans in the near future. in the coming weeks.

Speaker Change: Sure.

Speaker Change: We continue to work with the agency to address its comments and feedback.

Speaker Change: With regard to the no part study for the use of NR in the treatment of Parkinson's disease.

The last participant was enrolled last June.

Speaker Change: So we expect that this study will be completed by June of this year.

Speaker Change: We will not be able to see results for sometime thereafter, but we very much look forward to sharing more updates on this and other pharmaceutical plans in the near future.

Speaker Change: In the coming weeks.

Rob Fried: We will be making an announcement that we are changing the company's name to better represent the evolution. of the company and the strategic direction. This has been a major undertaking internally, and we're excited to finally share the company name.

Speaker Change: We will be making an announcement that we are changing the company's name to better represent the evolution.

Speaker Change: Of the company and the strategic direction of the company.

Speaker Change: This has been a major undertaking internally and we're excited to finally share the company name.

Rob Fried: I believe this past year marks an inflection point for this company. and that it is the right time to change our name to better align with our mission.

Speaker Change: I believe this past year marks an inflection point for this company.

Speaker Change: And then it is the right time to change our name to better align with our mission.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Rob Fried: In summary, your company is healthy. Your company is growing. and your company is very well positioned.

Speaker Change: In summary, your company is healthy.

Speaker Change: Your company is growing.

Speaker Change: And your company is very well positioned for the future.

Ozan Pamir: Let's now turn it over to Ozan. Thank you, Rob.

Rosa: Let's now turn it over to ozone Rosa.

Ozan Pamir: It is a pleasure to speak to our investors, partners and employees who are here with us today. Having joined ChromaDex just a few months ago, I've been deeply impressed by the team's dedication and the clear vision driving this company forward. It's a privilege to be part of a team that is so committed to innovation and activity.

Rosa: Thank you Rob.

Rosa: It is a pleasure to speak to our investors partners and employees, who are here with us today.

Rosa: Having joined <unk>, just a few months ago I've been deeply impressed by the team's dedication and the clear vision driving this company forward.

Rosa: It's a privilege to be part of a team that just so committed to innovation and excellence.

Ozan Pamir: 2024 was a strong year for ChromaDex, as the company exceeded all targets on its financial As Rob mentioned, this past year was pivotal in building momentum for even greater In both the fourth quarter and full year of 2024, we delivered outstanding financial performance while advancing key strategic Before diving into the details of the quarter, I want to take a moment to highlight our full year performance. For the full year, we delivered total net sales of $99.6 million. and 19% Year of Year Inc. gross margins of 61.8%. Reflecting continued operational efficiency. Selling and marketing expenses down approximately 200 basis points as a percentage of net sales.

Rosa: 2024 was a strong year for <unk> as the company exceeded all targets on extra national outlook.

Rosa: As Rob mentioned this past year was pivotal in building momentum for even greater success.

Rosa: In both the fourth quarter and full year of 2024, we delivered outstanding financial performance, while advancing key strategic initiatives.

Rosa: Before diving into the details of the quarter I want to take a moment to highlight our full year performance.

Rosa: For the full year, we delivered total net sales of $99 6 million.

Rosa: And 19% year over year increase.

Rosa: Gross margins of 61, 8%.

Rosa: Reflecting continued operational efficiency.

Rosa: Selling and marketing expenses down approximately 200 basis points as a percentage of net sales.

Ozan Pamir: an increase in R&D investments of $1.1 million. and a decrease in general and administrative expenses of $6.6 million year over year, better than our outlook of down $1.5 million. And we achieved net income of $8.6 million, a sharp turnaround from a net loss of $4.9 million for the fiscal year 2020. and generated $12.1 million in operating. Our results are a testament to the company's strong financial discipline and focused expertise.

Rosa: An increase in R&D investments of $1 1 million.

Rosa: And a decrease in general and administrative expenses of $6 $6 million year over year better than our outlook of down one 5 million.

Rosa: And we achieved net income of $8 6 million.

Rosa: A sharp turnaround from a net loss of $4 9 million for fiscal year, 2023, and generated $12 1 million in operating cash flows.

Rosa: Our results are a testament to the company's strong financial discipline.

Rosa: Execution.

Ozan Pamir: Through diligent cost management and strategic resource allocation, we have driven growth, improved profitability, and enhanced operational efficiency, all while continuing to invest in innovation and the future of our region.

Rosa: Through diligent cost management and strategic resource allocation.

Rosa: Driven growth improved profitability and enhanced operational efficiency, all while continuing to invest in innovation and the future of our business.

Ozan Pamir: Now, let's review the fourth quarter financial performance. ChromaDex achieved total net sales at $29.1 million. 37% compared to the fourth quarter of 2020. Our TrueNigin-related sales increased by 29%. driven by a 30% growth in e-commerce and a 26% increase in combined Watsons and other B2B sales. Our total night and ingredient sales, including food grade and pharmaceutical grade, increased by 96%. Gross margins improved by 150 basis points at 62.5%. compared to 61% in the fourth quarter of 2021. This improvement is attributable to changes in our product and business. Driven by higher e-commerce sales and additional sales of pharmaceutical-grade niogen to support the Niogen Plus expansion.

Rosa: Now, let's review the fourth quarter financial performance.

Rosa: Robotics achieved total net sales at $29 $1 million.

Rosa: Up 37% compared to the fourth quarter of 2023.

Rosa: Our true 19 related sales increased by 29% driven by a 30% growth in E Commerce, and a 26% increase in combined Watson's and other details.

Rosa: Our total 19 ingredient sales, including food grade and pharmaceutical grade increased by 96%.

Rosa: Gross margins improved by 150 basis points to 62, 5%.

Rosa: Compared to 61% in the fourth quarter of 2023.

Rosa: This improvement is attributable to changes in our product and business mix driven by higher ecommerce sales and additional sales of pharmaceutical grade <unk> to support connection plus expansion.

Rosa: And driven by efficiencies in supply chain due to scale improvements in operational fixed costs and other savings initiatives.

Ozan Pamir: Selling and marketing expense as a percentage of net sales improved 90 basis. 29.9 compared to 30.8 percent. fourth quarter of 2023 as we continue to make measured investments to grow our sales channels. Research and development expenses were largely stable year over year as we steadily advanced development of the new NAD program. As reported, general and administrative expenses decreased by $4.4 million, driven by a $3.5 million reversal of loyalties and fees related to our agreement with December 2024, we announced a supplemental agreement with Dartmouth that waived these and a $1.3 million recovery of credit losses following the initial payment from the legal settlement with Elysium, recovering bad debt written off in 2019.

Rosa: Selling and marketing expense as a percentage of net sales improved 90 basis points to 29, 9% compared to 38% in the fourth quarter of 2023, as we continue to make measured investments to grow our sales channels with the shipments.

Rosa: Research and development expenses were largely stable year over year as we steadily advance development of new NAD precursors.

Rosa: As reported general and administrative expenses decreased by $4 $4 million, driven by a $3 $5 million reversal of royalties and fees related to our agreement with government.

Rosa: In December 2024, we announced a supplemental agreement with darkness that way these obligations.

Rosa: A $1 3 million recovery of credit losses. Following the initial payment from the legal settlement, Rick Elysium recovering bad debt written off in 2019.

Ozan Pamir: The second and final payment is expected in the first quarter. In the fourth quarter of 2024, we delivered operating income of $7.1 million versus a $200,000 operating loss in the fourth quarter of 2020. Total net income in the fourth quarter was $7.2 million or $0.09. Substantial increase from $0.1 million or approximately break even earnings per share in the prior year.

Rosa: The second and final payment is expected in the first quarter of this year.

Rosa: In the fourth quarter of 2024, we delivered operating income of $7 1 million versus a $200000 operating loss in the fourth quarter of 2023.

Rosa: Total net income in the fourth quarter was $7 $2 million or <unk> <unk>.

Rosa: Earnings per share.

Rosa: A substantial increase from $1 million or approximately breakeven earnings per share in the prior year period.

Ozan Pamir: Moving to the balance sheet and cash. Our balance sheet is stronger than ever. As a result of this year's growth, our balance sheet reflects a higher cash balance of $44.7 million with no debt, lower liabilities, and higher equity, reinforcing the financial stability and resilience of our people. For the full year 2024, our net cash provided by operations was $12.1 million, up from $7.1 million in the prior The increase was primarily driven by a $13.5 million improvement in net income, partially offset by a $3.5 million reversal of accrued royalties. $2.2 million in lower provision. Unknown Editor, Paris Bechert, Siddhartha R although, Rick Haas's Additionally, various changes in working capital contributed to the overall improvement in net cash provided by our program.

Rosa: Moving to the balance sheet and cash flow.

Rosa: Our balance sheet is stronger than ever.

Rosa: As a result of this year's growth.

Rosa: Our balance sheet reflects the higher cash balance of $44 7 million with no debt lower liabilities and higher equity reinforcing the financial stability and resilience of our business.

Rosa: For the full year 2024, our net cash provided by operations was $12 1 million.

Rosa: Up from $7 1 million in the prior year.

Rosa: The increase was primarily driven by $13 $5 million improvement in net income, partially offset by a $3 5 million reversal of accrued royalties.

Rosa: And $2 $2 million and lower provisions for credit losses, reflecting the recovery of losses from the legal settlement rather than provisions as in the prior year.

Rosa: Additionally, the various changes in working capital contributed to the overall improvement in net cash provided by operations.

Ozan Pamir: Finally, I would like to share our 2025 Full Year Outlook. Detailed information on key financial metrics can be found in our earnings fresh release along with the slide. As it relates to our full year 2025 net sales, we expect to maintain the momentum we built last year, projecting approximately 18% growth year-over-year. This outlook reflects continued expansion in our e-commerce.

Rosa: Finally, I would like to share our 2020 full year outlook.

Rosa: Detailed information on key financial metrics can be found in our earnings press release, along with the slide presentation.

Rosa: As it relates to our full year 2025, net sales, we expect to maintain the momentum we built last year.

<unk>, approximately 18% growth year over year.

Rosa: This outlook reflects continued expansion in our ecommerce business growth and established partnerships and further progress in our pharmaceutical grade ingredient business.

Ozan Pamir: Growth and Established Partnerships, and Further Progress in our Pharmaceutical Grade Increase We anticipate a modest improvement in gross margins as we continue to execute on supply chain optimizations and ongoing cost savings. Selling and marketing expenses are expected to increase year over year in absolute dollars, but will remain stable as a percentage of net sales, which was 29.6% in 2020.

Rosa: We anticipate a modest improvement in gross margins as we continue to execute on supply chain optimizations and ongoing cost saving initiatives.

Rosa: Selling and marketing expenses are expected to increase year over year in absolute dollars, but will remain stable as a percentage of net sales, which was 29, 6% in 2024.

Ozan Pamir: As Rob mentioned, we will be announcing our company name change in the coming weeks. Targeted Marketing Investments to Support the Rebirth. At the same time, we will continue investing in resources to drive sales growth while maintaining operations. R&D expenses are also expected to increase year-over-year in absolute dollars, while remaining stable as a percentage of net sales at $6. as we continue to invest in NAD precursor development to support our innovation pipeline. General and administrative expenses are expected to increase by approximately five to six million dollars, primarily due to investments in business growth and the absence of the reversal of royalties and fees related to Dartmouth that I mentioned earlier.

Rosa: As Rob mentioned, we will be announcing our company name change in the coming weeks with targeted marketing investments to support the rebrand at the same time, we will continue investing in resources to drive sales growth, while maintaining operational efficiency.

Rosa: R&D expenses are also expected to increase year over year in absolute dollars, while remaining stable as a percentage of net sales at 6% as we continued to invest in NAD precursor development to support our innovation pipeline.

Rosa: General and administrative expenses are expected to increase by approximately $5 million to $6 million.

Rosa: Primarily due to investments in Bruce business growth and the absence of the reversal of royalties and fees related to Dartmouth as I mentioned earlier.

Ozan Pamir: In summary, 2024 was a defining year for ChromaDex, driving profitable growth through operational excellence and fiscal. The company's financial position is stronger than it has ever been, and I am confident that we can continue to carry the momentum into 2025 and beyond.

Rosa: In summary, 2024 was a defining year for chromatics driving profitable growth through operational excellence and fiscal discipline.

Rosa: The company's financial position is stronger than it has ever been and I am confident that we can continue to carry the momentum into 2025 and beyond.

Ozan Pamir: As Rob mentioned earlier, we will soon be changing the name of ChromaDex to better align with the company's mission and strategic direction. And I look forward to joining him and the rest of the leaders here to share the exciting announcement in the coming.

Rosa: As Rob mentioned earlier, we will soon be changing the name of chrome IDEXX to better align with the company's mission and strategic direction.

Rosa: Forward to joining him and the rest of the meters here to share the exciting announcements in the coming weeks.

Operator: Operator, you're now ready. Thank you.

Rosa: Operator, we are now ready to take questions.

Operator: We will now begin the question and answer session. If you have dialed in and would like to ask a question, simply press star 1 on your telephone keypad to raise your hand and join the queue. If you would like to redraw your question, simply press star 1 again.

Speaker Change: Thank you we will now begin the question and answer session. If you have the algorithm would like to ask a question. Since you press star one on your telephone keypad today, Mr. Han and join the queue. If you would like to withdraw your question simply press Star One again, which are called upon to ask your question.

Operator: If you are called upon to ask your question and are listening via a loudspeaker on your device, please pick up your handset and ensure that your phone is not on mute when asking your question. Again, please press star 1 to join the queue.

Speaker Change: Let's move now eager Android device. Please pickup your handset will share that your phone is not on mute when asking a question.

Speaker Change: Again, Please press star one to join the queue.

Jeffrey Cohen: And your first question comes from the line of Jeffrey Cohen with Lattinburg, Thailand. Please go ahead. Hello, Rob and Ozan. Thanks for taking our questions. thank you. Hey, Rob.

Speaker Change: And your first question comes from the line of Jeffrey Cohen with Ladenburg Thalmann. Please go ahead.

Jeffrey Cohen: Hello, Robyn thanks for taking our questions.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: Doug.

Rob Fried: So first thing, can you talk about the stick packs a little bit, as far as give us a sense of pull through on Amazon or your website and a sense of what's the milligram size and any comments as far as pricing? It's 300 milligrams per stick pack. It also has inulin in it, so it actually... as other. fiber benefits. We haven't really emphasized the stick pack. It's interesting, very, it's very rare that people ask us about stick packs, but sales of stick packs have, over the last couple of quarters begun to increase.

Doug: Hey, Rob So firstly could you talk about stick tax a little bit.

Speaker Change: As far as.

Speaker Change: Give us a sense of pull through on Amazon or your website or any sense of whats the milligrams size.

Speaker Change: As far as pricing.

Speaker Change: It is 300 milligrams per stick pack.

Speaker Change: It also has <unk> in it so it actually.

Speaker Change: As other.

Speaker Change: Fiber benefits, we havent really emphasized the stick pack, it's interesting Gary it is.

Speaker Change: A very rare that people ask us about stick thats, but.

Speaker Change: Sales will stick packs have over the last couple of quarters began to increase.

Rob Fried: So we expect in 2025 to initiate more of a marketing campaign behind it. We've noticed that the consumers for stick packs tend to be younger. and they also tend to be more in the exercise workout cohort group. Okay, got it, that's helpful.

Speaker Change: So we expect in $2025 to initiate more of a marketing campaign behind it.

Speaker Change: We've noticed that the consumers for stick packs tend to be younger.

Speaker Change: And they also tend to be more in the exercise workout.

Speaker Change: Horton.

Speaker Change: Okay got it thats helpful.

Ozan Pamir: Ozan, quick one for you, the 1.3 adjustment on the royalties for the fourth quarter, you expect, you said the second and final in the first quarter, that'll also be 1.3 as well? So that just to clarify, that's not a royalty adjustment. That's the Elysium settlement. The royalty adjustment relates to Dartmouth. We reversed $3.5 million in Q4 with regards to Dartmouth. that's not going to reoccur. However, the 1.3 million received from Elysium, the second payment of that is we are expecting by the end of March. That's going to be, again, 1.3. Okay, perfect. That's helpful.

Speaker Change: Quick one for you the 1.3 adjustment on the.

Speaker Change: Royalties for the fourth.

Speaker Change: Fourth quarter, you expect you said the second and final in the first quarter that will also be 1.3 as well.

Speaker Change: So just to clarify this letter royalty adjustment.

Speaker Change: The Elysium settlement.

Speaker Change: The royalty adjustment relates to Douglas, we reversed $3 million.

Speaker Change: Before.

Speaker Change: This progression darkness.

Speaker Change: That's not going to reoccur, however, the $1 3 million received from the <unk>.

Speaker Change: Second payment of debt as we are expecting.

Speaker Change: By the end of March.

Speaker Change: That's going to be again, one three.

Speaker Change: Okay perfect. That's helpful. Rob No Park study.

Rob Fried: Rob, on the NOPARC study, We would, should we expect a readout or some commentary from the company in the third quarter or the fourth quarter? We really don't know. You know, it's a double-blinded study. We expect them to share it with us, but we don't know for sure that they will once they have the data compiled. So if I gave you a rough estimate, it would probably be end of the third quarter, fourth quarter, beginning of fourth quarter. But that doesn't necessarily mean we'd go public with it. You know, there are factors like they may be submitting for publication and they may feel that it would impact their chances of getting published.

Speaker Change: We would should we expect to retail or some commentary from the company in the third quarter or the fourth quarter.

Speaker Change: We really don't know.

Speaker Change: It's a double blinded study.

We expect them to share it with us, but we don't know for sure that they will once they have the data compiled.

Speaker Change: So if I gave you a rough estimate would probably be.

Speaker Change: Ended the third quarter fourth quarter, beginning of fourth quarter, but that doesn't necessarily mean, we'd go public with it.

Speaker Change: There are factors like they may be submitting for publication and they may feel that impact their chances of getting published so I don't want to really create expectations.

Rob Fried: So I don't want to really create expectations around when you will hear. The only thing we feel comfortable saying right now is the last participant will be completed in June of this year. Got it.

Speaker Change: Around when you will hear the only thing we feel comfortable saying right. Now is the last participant will be completed in June of this year.

Rob Fried: And then lastly for us, could you talk about the food grade nitrogen segment sticking out? Because it's been extremely strong in the back half of 2024. So anything to call out there? Any sense of how that looks for 25 as a segment? Yeah, we expect it to continue to grow. We've added a couple of other partners. As you know, we're extremely selective. about to whom we supply Niogen as an ingredient. There are a handful of very good companies to whom we supply, including Nestle, H&H, Life Extension, Folia. We'll add one or two more. And those companies themselves are growing.

Speaker Change: Got it and then lastly for US could you talk about the.

Speaker Change: Food grade North <unk> segment.

Speaker Change: Sticking out because it's been extremely strong in the back half of 2024, so anything to call out there any sense of how that looks for 25 basis segment.

Speaker Change: Yes, we expect it to continue to grow we've added a couple of other partners as you know we're extremely selective.

Speaker Change: About two whom we supply nitrogen as an ingredient.

Speaker Change: There are a handful of very good companies to whom we supply, including Nestle HMH life extension.

Speaker Change: Bollea, we'll add one or two more and those companies themselves are growing we're seeing an increased awareness level of certainly of NAV.

Rob Fried: We're seeing an increased awareness level of, certainly of NAD. but of NIAGIN in particular. So we expect the ingredient business, the food grade ingredient business to grow nicely in 2025.

Speaker Change: But <unk> in particular.

Speaker Change: So we expect the ingredient business the food grade ingredient business to grow nicely in 2025.

Jeffrey Cohen: Perfect, that does it for us. Thanks for taking the questions. Thanks, Jeff.

Speaker Change: Perfect. That's helpful for us thanks for taking the questions. Thanks, Jeff.

Mitchell Pinheiro: Your next question comes from the line of Mitchell Pinheiro with Sturtevant. Please go ahead. Yeah, hey, good afternoon.

Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Mitchell Pinheiro with sturdy Ma'am. Please go ahead.

Mitchell Pinheiro: Yeah, Hey, good afternoon.

Rob Fried: I'm it. Hey, could you just expand a little bit on the drivers of your, your strong ecommerce performance in the fourth quarter. Well, as you know, we've always done extremely well on Amazon. But we've also now seen a nice improvement in our Shopify performance. And you know, for several orders, we've been talking about it as an underperformer. But you can't really flip a switch and improve your website e-commerce performance. It's. It's a function of many variables that take time to add up. SEO, search engine optimization. Ads, localizing the ads. So it's a combination of us improving our performance on Shopify.

Speaker Change: Hi, Mitch.

Speaker Change: Could you just expand a little bit.

Speaker Change: On.

Speaker Change: The drivers of your strong.

Speaker Change: E Commerce performance in the fourth quarter.

Speaker Change: Well as you know, we've always done extremely well.

Speaker Change: Amazon.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: But we are also now seeing a nice improvement in our <unk>.

Speaker Change: <unk>.

Speaker Change: Performance and you know for several quarters, we've been talking about it as an underperformer.

Speaker Change: You can't really flipped the switch and improve your website E Commerce performance.

Speaker Change: It's a function of many variables that take time to add up.

Speaker Change: Search engine optimization.

Speaker Change: As final localizing the ads.

Speaker Change: It's a combination of us improving our performance.

Speaker Change: Shopify.

Rob Fried: General increased awareness of NAD in general, which is in large part because of the launch of our Niogen IV business. and then a tremendous amount of publicity that ChromaDex and TrueNigin have received over the last several months.

Speaker Change: General increase awareness of <unk> in general, which is in large part because of the launch of our nitrogen business.

Speaker Change: And then a tremendous amount of publicity that chrome at X and <unk> have received over the last several months months.

Rob Fried: And then, I always ask this, but... was the growth driven by strong new customers, recurring, how would you characterize? There is a slight increase in recurring customers, but it's mostly new to brand.

Speaker Change: Okay and then.

Speaker Change: <unk> asked this but.

Speaker Change: Was the growth driven.

Speaker Change: Strong new customers Youre carrying how would you characterize.

Speaker Change: That there is a slight increase in recurring customers, but it's mostly new to brand.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Rob Fried: Unknown Speaker And then, you know, obviously, the NIAID Gen IV, the injectables, I'd love to learn a little more about maybe what you learned on your initial ramp. Unknown Speaker Maybe where Case of clinic additions throughout 2025, perhaps where you would expect to end, roughly, in the number of clinic additions. and then And finally, how confident are you in your supply chain? ability to keep up with demand. I know it had a little bit of a slower start. I'm just curious where are we up to speed or are there always going to be risks related to supply chain supply?

Speaker Change: And then.

Speaker Change: Obviously the.

Speaker Change: <unk> the Injectables.

Speaker Change: Love to learn a little more.

Speaker Change: About maybe what you learned on your initial ramp.

Speaker Change: Maybe where the.

Speaker Change: The pace of clinic additions throughout 2025, perhaps where you would expect to end roughly in the number of clinics.

Speaker Change: And then.

Speaker Change: And finally, how confident are you in your supply chain.

Speaker Change: <unk> to keep up with demand I know it had a little bit about.

Speaker Change: A slower start I'm, just curious where are we up to speed or are there always going to be risks related to supply chain.

Speaker Change: Why.

Rob Fried: I think there will always be risk. But you have to recognize that the pharma grade. supply chain is completely different than the food grade supply chain. It's a different group of companies. process is somewhat different. It's everything has to be FDA approved and tested and sterilized and retested. So it's a new area for us, and we've now been working on it for actually several years. And we had a couple of hiccups. The hiccups that we had had nothing to do with the quality. In all, we always reach the absolute tip-top highest level of purity and quality whenever we do the tests.

Speaker Change: I think there will always be risks.

Speaker Change: You have to recognize that the pharma grade <unk>.

Speaker Change: Supply chain is completely different than the food grade supply chain.

Speaker Change: It's difficult both companies.

Speaker Change: Process is somewhat different.

Speaker Change: Everything has to be FDA approved and tested and sterilized and retested.

Speaker Change: So it's a new it's.

Speaker Change: A new area for us and we've now been working on it for actually several years and we had a couple of hiccups. The hiccups that we had had nothing to do with the quality and all we always will.

Speaker Change: We always reached the absolute tip top highest level of purity and quality whenever we do the tests. It has to do with things like having the appropriate license for wet to warehouse the product before you ship it to a pharmacy or ship it to a clinic. These are tactical things.

Rob Fried: It has to do with things like having the appropriate license to warehouse the product before you ship it to a pharmacy or ship it to a clinic. These are technical things. or filling out the right paperwork when you're transferring it from one place to another. And these are the kinds of things that have been a learning experience for us and have been frustrating for us because the demand is there. But we think we've resolved it, and so we expect in the second quarter, certainly by the third quarter, that we'll really get back going in terms of sales.

Speaker Change: Filling out the right paperwork when you're traveling it from one place to another.

Speaker Change: These are the kinds of things that had been a learning experience for us have been frustrating for us because the demand is there but.

Speaker Change: But we think we've resolved it.

Speaker Change: And so we expect in the second quarter, certainly by the third quarter that will really get that going in terms of.

Speaker Change: Sales.

Rob Fried: I don't think that we will have a problem with supply. Right now, our manufacturing partners, in this case, it's Dr. Reddy's. And we have a nice rhythm going. And, of course, we still have the relationship with W.R. Grace, who's also capable of doing pharma grade if needed. We think we've smoothed out the difficulties. And look, we've been at it for a couple of years here. And we've ordered an ample amount for certainly for the next year or probably two years. So we think we're in pretty good shape in terms of supply. But yes, it's an anything could happen.

Speaker Change: I don't think that we will have a problem with supply.

Speaker Change: Right now our manufacturing partners in this case, it's it's doctor readiness and.

Speaker Change: And we have a nice rhythm going and of course, we still have the relationship with WR Grace who is also capable of doing pharma grade if needed.

Speaker Change: Think we smooth smoothed out the difficulties we've looked at we've been added for a couple of years here and.

Speaker Change: And we've ordered an ample amounts were certainly for the next year or probably two years. So we think we're in pretty good shape in terms of supply.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Rob Fried: There could be problems. We try to anticipate as much as we can. We've We beefed up our staff and internal staff in that area, putting much more focus on it. We expect that to be an important growth area for the company in the coming years.

Speaker Change: Anything could happen there could be problems.

Speaker Change: We try to anticipate as much as we can.

Speaker Change: We'd be used up our staff and internal staff in that area.

Speaker Change: Putting much more focus on it we expect that to be an important growth area for the company in the coming years.

Rob Fried: And what have you learned with the, just as... you know, from the clinics, the customers at the IV clinics, and any learnings there? I mean, is it an easy switch for people that were doing the NAD plus IV? Are people aware of your new product? Are they selling it in the clinics where you're where you're presently? I'm just curious what the learnings might be, or do you need to step up marketing, if you could talk about that. Yeah, it's like a whole smorgasbord of questions loaded into one. I thought you were supposed to only ask one question, Mitch.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: And what did you learn.

Speaker Change: Just as.

Speaker Change: From the clinics.

Speaker Change: The customers at the IV clinics, and whether any learnings there.

Speaker Change: I mean is it an easy switch for people that were doing the <unk>.

Plus IV.

Speaker Change:

Speaker Change: Our people aware of your new products really selling it.

Speaker Change: In the clinics where your.

Speaker Change: Presently.

Speaker Change: Pet products and like I, just curious what the learnings might be.

Speaker Change: Do you need to step up marketing if you could talk about that I appreciate it.

Speaker Change: Yeah, it's like a whole smorgasbord of questions loaded into work.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Mitchell Pinheiro: So when you ask one question Mitch.

Rob Fried: Okay. No. Yeah. We learned quite a bit. Yes, it is an easy transfer from NAD IV consumers to Niagen. In fact, I can tell you with confidence that anybody who has experienced NADIV that then tries They're used to taking hours to get the NAD IV ingested, and they're used to experiencing these terrible side effects, nausea, sweats. They take Diagen IV, it takes a few minutes with none of those side effects and much higher NAD levels. So over the next day or two, they experience the much greater level of benefits than they might with just pure NAD.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Yes, we learned quite a bit yes, it is easy.

Speaker Change: Transfer from NAV.

Speaker Change: Ivy.

Speaker Change: <unk> two <unk> in fact.

Speaker Change: I can tell you with confidence that anybody who has experienced an IV that then tries <unk> IV as hoped.

Speaker Change: Okay. They are used to taking hours to get the NID IV ingest it and they are used to experiencing these terrible side effects nausea sweats.

Speaker Change: They take that as an IV. It takes a few minutes with no none of those side effects and much higher <unk> levels. So over the next day or two they experienced a much greater level of benefits than they might with <unk>.

Speaker Change: Just pure R&D.

Rob Fried: We had announced back in November, I think, 300 clinics. I think this morning we announced that we're up to around 500. Our expectation is we'll be at least double that by the end of the year. There are plenty of clinics that are interested in this. One of the issues is what they call the BUD, the expiration date, and that just takes time to make sure that When the pharmacy ships it to the clinic, that the clinic has enough time to sell it. And that's just time. So, I think sometime in the second quarter that there'll be ample time for the clinics to sell out.

Speaker Change: We had announced back in November I think 300 clinics I think this morning, we announced that we're up to around 500.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Our expectation is we'll be at least double that by the end of the year.

Speaker Change: Okay. There are plenty of clinics that are interested in this but one of the issues is what they call. The <unk> exploration date and that just takes time to make sure that.

Speaker Change: The pharmacy ships it to the clinic that the clinic has enough time to sell it.

Speaker Change: And that's just time.

Speaker Change: So I think some time in the second quarter.

Speaker Change: <unk>.

Speaker Change: There will be ample time for the clinics to sell out and so right now they are somewhat reluctant to order. They generally were order once a consumer comes in a patient comes in and requests it.

Rob Fried: So, right now they're somewhat reluctant to order. They generally will order once a consumer comes in, a patient comes in and requests. but they don't want to inventory it because the expiration date is fairly short. But that will correct itself in the next month or two. And many of them are already quite aggressively marketing it to their consumers. We work with these clinics. Our marketing department coordinates with some of these clinics, like Restore is one clinic, one franchisee that has, franchisor that has numerous clinics. We work with them to create some consumer marketing campaigns and we expect to do more of that coming into the future.

Speaker Change: But they don't want to inventory it because the exploration date is fairly short, but that will correct itself in the next month or two.

Speaker Change: <unk>.

Speaker Change: Many of them are already quite aggressively.

Speaker Change: Marketing it to their consumers.

Speaker Change: We work with these clinics our marketing department has coordinates with some of these clinics like restore is one clearly one franchisee that has franchisor that has numerous clinics, we work with them to create some.

Speaker Change: Tumor marketing campaigns, and we expect to do more of that coming into the future. You may also have heard.

Rob Fried: You may also have heard many people who have experienced NAPIV just on their own, talking about it on podcasts or on social media. There's Whitney Cummings and Kathy Hilton, we've heard them speak about it. There is a fertility clinic, a well-known podcaster's got one called the Egg Whisperer, who's written quite a bit about it, saying that her patients have benefited by taking 2-Niogen. So it's sort of picking up a little bit of organic awareness on its own, even without us doing much marketing. But yes, we plan to market the Niogen IV and the Niogen shot.

Speaker Change: Many people who have.

Speaker Change: Experienced.

Speaker Change: Ivy just on their own and talking about it on podcasts or social media.

Speaker Change: Whitney Cummings, and Cathy referred them spirit.

Speaker Change: Speak about it.

Speaker Change: There are there is fertility clinic.

Speaker Change: A well known podcast series got one called the egg Whisper who's written quite a bit about it saying that her.

Speaker Change: Our patients have benefited by taking two nitrogen so it sort of picking up a little bit of organic awareness on its own even without us doing.

Speaker Change: Doing much marketing, but yes, we plan to market the <unk> IV and the NIAID Jean shops in the coming months, we will be able to release, an at home version, where people can inject <unk> and shot of smaller dose of NIH and shot.

Rob Fried: In the coming months, we will be able to release an at-home version where people can inject a Niagin shot, a smaller dose of a Niagin shot to themselves, sub-Q, at home. And we are very hopeful that that will hit a nice market. We know that the GLP-1 agonists are doing quite well. We think that most of these people that want to stay thin also want to stay young, so we think that there's space for NIGE and IV as well.

Speaker Change: Themselves sub Q at home and we are very hopeful that that will hit.

Speaker Change: Nice market, we know that the.

Speaker Change: The <unk> one agonists are doing quite well, we think that most of these people that want to stay thin.

Speaker Change: Also want to stay young.

Speaker Change: So we think that there is space for <unk> IV as well.

Rob Fried: Thanks for the answers. Much appreciated. Thank you, Mitch.

Speaker Change: Thanks for the answers much appreciate it.

Mitch: Thank you Mitch.

Susan Anderson: Your next question comes from the line of Susan Anderson with Canaccord Genuity, please go ahead. Hi, good afternoon. Alec Legon for Susan. Question on every day, there's a new headline on tariffs. Any thoughts on how it might potentially impact sourcing or even parts of your international business? Hong Kong.

Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Susan Anderson with Canaccord Genuity. Please go ahead.

Speaker Change: Hi, Good afternoon, Alex leg on for Susan question on every day, there's a new headline on tariffs.

Speaker Change: Any thoughts on how it might potentially impact sourcing or even parts of your international business like Watson's in Hong Kong and if so do you have any plans or what actions can you take to mitigate that.

Rob Fried: And if so, do you have any plans or what I It's possible that tariffs and I'll let Ozan if you want to answer this as well, it's possible that tariffs will have a small impact on the Watson business and on the food grade, the pharma grade Niagen business, but we think we're talking about very small amount won't have a meaningful impact on our business overall. The bulk of our material, the food-grade nitrogen material, is made all here in the United States, and the vast majority of our sales are also here in the United States. And just to add to that, with regards to Canadian tariffs that, you know, were just passed today, you know, if you look at the list of products that are posted that are having tariffs on from the Canada side.

Speaker Change: It's possible that tariffs I'll let.

Speaker Change: Wanted to answer this as well as possible tariffs will have a small impact on the Watson business and.

Speaker Change: The food great pharma grade nitrogen business, but we think we're talking about very small amount won't have a meaningful impact on our business overall.

Speaker Change: The bulk of our material the food grade <unk> material is made off here in the United States and the vast majority of our sales are also here in the United States.

Speaker Change: And just to add to that.

Speaker Change: So with regards to Canadian tire.

Speaker Change: We're just passed today.

Speaker Change: If you look at the list of <unk>.

Speaker Change: <unk> there.

Speaker Change: Posted did that are having tariffs on from the Canada site supplements are not part of that list.

Ozan Pamir: Supplements are not part of that list. So we don't expect any impact on our sales to Canada as well. Got it.

Speaker Change: So we don't expect any impact on our sales to Canada as well.

Rob Fried: And then just to follow up on innovation, you mentioned the future subcutaneous injection, I guess, any other innovations that you're able to talk about? We do plan to... either introduce one or two new formulations that are of supplements that are complementary to truniogen or reformulate a couple of the formulations that we have, such as the TruNiogen Immune product, and we do have a product that we refer to as TruNiogen Beauty that we sell in Asia. So we are, and then there was one question about stick packs. So these are three other product innovations that we're working on, expect to have some update developments later in the year.

Speaker Change: Got it and then just to follow up on innovation you mentioned.

Speaker Change: Feature subcutaneous injection I guess any other innovations that youre able to talk about.

Speaker Change: For the year.

Speaker Change: We do plan to.

Speaker Change: Either introduce one or two new formulations that are.

Speaker Change: Of supplements that are complementary to <unk> or reformulated, a couple of the formulations that we have such as.

Speaker Change: The <unk> immune product and we do have a product that we refer to as <unk> in beauty that we sell in Asia. So we are and then there was one question about stick packs. So these are.

Speaker Change: Three other product innovations that we're working on expect to have some.

Speaker Change: Update developments later in the year.

Susan Anderson: That's very helpful.

Operator: Best of luck. Best of luck the rest of the year.

Speaker Change: That's very helpful.

Speaker Change: Best of luck the rest of year.

Operator: Thank you.

Speaker Change: Thank you.

Bill Dezellem: Your next question comes from the line of Bill Dezellem with Titan Capital Management. Please go ahead. Thank you.

Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Phil The Jelen with Titan Capital Management. Please go ahead.

Rob Fried: Congratulations on a terrific quarter. A group of questions. Let's start with the food grade ingredient, if we could, being up over 60 percent, you know, along with your e-commerce sales being very strong. Is this just another data point indicating that you're hitting that tipping point with awareness, or were there some initial orders or non orders that don't happen every quarter, maybe that just popped into the fourth quarter that that led to a larger, that larger 60 percent plus sort of growth on that to line item? It's more difficult to predict the ingredient business because it's a B2B business.

Speaker Change: Okay. Thank you congratulations on a terrific quarter.

Speaker Change: Group of questions.

Speaker Change: Let's start with the food grade ingredient, if we could being up over 60%.

Speaker Change: Along with your ecommerce sales being very strong.

Speaker Change: Just another data point, indicating that youre hitting that tipping point with awareness or were there some.

Speaker Change: Initial orders or non <unk>.

Speaker Change: Orders that don't happen every quarter it may be.

Speaker Change: That just popped into the fourth quarter that led to a larger that larger 60% plus sort of growth on that line item.

Speaker Change: Well, sorry, it is more difficult to predict the ingredient business because it's a <unk> business. The order comes in you fill the order.

Rob Fried: The order comes in, you fill the order. But this has been steadily going on now for several quarters. Our partners to whom we're supplying Niagen are doing quite well, and they extend their forecast for the year are pretty aggressive, too. So we expect this Niagen ingredient business to continue to grow.

Speaker Change: But this has been steadily going on now for several quarters.

Speaker Change: Our partners to whom we're supplying <unk> are doing quite well and they extend therefore cast for the year a pretty aggressive too. So we expect this <unk> ingredient business to continue to grow.

Bill Dezellem: Thank you.

Rob Fried: Then I want to talk a bit about the about the IV business for a moment. Has the shortage of the IV product accelerated interest at all? And where I'm going with this question is sometimes scarcity is the single best selling point. And have you seen any of that take place? Initially, we saw a little bit of that, of people ordering it and clamoring for it and emailing about it and saying they want it and they want it. But the thing is, this problem we've experienced has been going on for a few months. So, yes at first, but no after a while.

Speaker Change: Thank you.

Speaker Change: Then I wanted to talk a bit about the.

Speaker Change: About the IV business for a moment.

Has the shortage.

Speaker Change: The IV product accelerated interest at all and where I'm going with this question is sometimes.

Speaker Change: Scarcity is the single best.

Speaker Change: Selling point.

Speaker Change: Have you seen any of that to take place.

Speaker Change: Initially there we saw a little bit of that as people.

Speaker Change: Ordering it and Clamouring for E mailing about it saying they wanted they wanted but the thing is this problem. We've experienced has been going on for a few months.

Speaker Change: So.

Speaker Change: Yes at first but no after a while to just what we did we solve the supply chain problem will get back to marketing and selling a great product.

Rob Fried: It's just what we did. We solved the supply chain problem, get back to marketing and selling a great product.

Bill Dezellem: Great.

Rob Fried: And as for the supply chain problem, Rob, I apologize, my, my schedule did not allow me to come to this properly prepared. But what was the impact in the fourth quarter and in what you would anticipate in the first quarter from the supply chain issues with the IV? Well, the pharma ingredient business is part of the overall ingredient business, but we do break it out. And you can see that in the third quarter and the fourth quarter, it was in the area of about a million dollars a quarter, maybe even a little less. And then, you know, my expectation is we'll probably be in that neighborhood in the first quarter too.

Great and as for the supply chain problem, Rob I apologize my my schedule did not allow me to come to this set properly prepared but what was the impact.

Speaker Change: In the fourth quarter, and what you would anticipate in the first quarter.

The supply chain issues with the IV.

Speaker Change: Well the pharma ingredient business as part of the overall ingredient business, but we do break it out.

Speaker Change: And you can see that in the third quarter and the fourth quarter was in the area of about $1 million a quarter, maybe even a little less.

Speaker Change: And then.

Speaker Change: My expectation is we will probably be in that neighborhood in the first quarter too.

Rob Fried: But then I think starting in the second quarter, maybe as late as the third quarter, you're going to start seeing a more dramatic rise in sales of farm and niogen ingredient to the IV space. So I think that if we're right and that growth happens, let's say in the third quarter, it's growth that would have been experienced in the first quarter. It was just about a several-month delay. And I did hear you say that that is that is now completely behind you at this point. with the exception of this thing called BUD, the expiration date, which means, which just takes time.

Speaker Change: But then I think starting in the second quarter, maybe as late as the third quarter Youre going to start seeing a more dramatic rise in sales of <unk> pharma <unk>, an ingredient to the IV space.

Speaker Change: So I think that if we're right and that growth happens, let's say in the third quarter. It's growth that would have been experienced in the first quarter. It was just about it.

Speaker Change: A several month delay.

Speaker Change: And I did hear you say that that is that is now completely behind you at this point.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: With exception of this thing called the exploration date, which mean, which just takes time. It has nothing to do with the supply chain manufacturing process, but we haven't experienced any supply chain issues.

Rob Fried: It has nothing to do with the supply chain manufacturing process. But we haven't experienced any supply chain issues. in several weeks. And we have plenty of material now. So I think it's all behind.

Speaker Change: In several weeks and we have plenty of material now so.

Speaker Change: I think it's all behind us.

Bill Dezellem: Great, thank you and congratulations again on great.

Speaker Change: Great. Thank you and congratulations again on a great quarter.

Bill Dezellem: Thank you, Bill.

Speaker Change: Thank you Bill.

Raghuram Selvaraju: Your next question comes from the line of Ram Selvaraju with HC Wainwright, please go ahead. Thank you so much for taking my questions and congrats on all the progress. Really impressive operational performance. Thank you, Rob. Firstly, I was wondering if you could – thank you.

Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of from Silvan <unk> with H C. Wainwright. Please go ahead.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Silvan: Thank you so much for taking my questions and congrats on all the progress really impressive operational performance. Thank you.

Silvan: I was wondering if you could thank you and I was wondering if you could comment on potential tailwind in 2025% from two areas. In particular, one is <unk> and IV uptake and the other is potential acts act session of <unk> adoption to what was <unk>.

Rob Fried: And I was wondering if you could comment on potential tailwinds in 2025 from two areas in particular. One is Niadin IV uptake, and the other is potential accession of NR adoption to what was previously a segment of the market that was being served by nicotinamide mononucleotide or NMS. We still do see some NMN in the market, but much, much less than we did. And as you know, the FDA has been very consistent about upholding its ruling that there's a drug preclusion application and NMN is not a legal dietary supplement and is reserved only for drug use.

Silvan: Previously a segment of the market that was being served by nicotinamide mono nucleotide or NMM.

Silvan: We still do see some and then in the market, but much much less than we did in.

Silvan: As you know the FDA has been very consistent about Holt upholding his ruling that theres a drug preclusion application not illegal dietary supplement is reserved only for.

Silvan: Drug use there is a group that was selling at a man that has funded a lawsuit against the FDA and the FDA has said that they will issue a final ruling on this in.

Rob Fried: There is a group that was selling NMN that has funded a lawsuit against the FDA, and the FDA has said that they will issue a final ruling on this. in July, but you could see both ChromaDex and the drug company that was the reason for the drug preclusion called Metro Biotech have published statements to the FDA against the claims made by this group. We are confident that the FDA will show the integrity and continue to keep NMN out of the market. We're not seeing NMN as a major force in the marketplace presently.

Silvan: In July.

Silvan: But you could see both <unk> and the drug company.

Silvan: That was the reason for the drug to preclusion called Metro biotech have published statements to the FDA.

Silvan: Against the claims made by this group we are confident that the FDA will show the integrity and continue to keep that and then out of the market.

Silvan: We're not seeing it and then as they.

Silvan: Major forces in the marketplace presently.

Rob Fried: There are, though, as I alluded before. Does. of companies jumping on the NAD bandwagon these days. Some are just blatantly infringing on patents, blatantly missing label claims, and just selling the ingredient. There are companies out of Asia that claim to be selling some NAD precursor of some sort at cheap prices. So we are, and we're seeing some really egregious, fraudulent acts in the marketplace of people trying to get a piece of what is really an exciting and growing market. Is that an issue for us? And we're working very hard to identify these bad actors and notifying companies inside the industry, regulatory authorities, and the retailers like Amazon.

Speaker Change: There are though as I alluded before.

Silvan: Dozens.

Silvan: Of companies jumping on the bandwagon these days.

Silvan: Some are just blatantly infringing on patents late really missing label claims and just selling the ingredient there are companies out of Asia that claim to be selling some NAD precursor of some sort at cheap prices.

Silvan: So we are in.

Silvan: We're seeing some really egregious fraudulent acts in the marketplace of people trying to get a piece of what is really a.

Silvan: Exciting and growing market that an issue for us.

Silvan: And we're working very hard to.

Silvan: To identify these bad actors and notifying companies inside the industry regulatory authorities and the retailers like Amazon.

Rob Fried: to limit that, and some of them are taking action. We'd love to see TikTok shop. Pay attention to this. There are many of these infringers and fraudulent players selling on TikTok Shop. TikTok Shop doesn't seem to care. I would think that they would, given the state of their company right now and the scrutiny they're getting from the government.

Silvan: To limit that and some of them are taking action wed love to see tick tock shop.

Silvan: Pay attention to this there are many of these infringers and fraudulent players selling on tick tock sharp tick tock shop doesn't seem to care.

Silvan: I would think that they would given the state of their company right now and the scrutiny they are getting from the government.

Rob Fried: And anybody who's listening to this call who feels like writing a letter or an email to TikTok Shop, informing them that they are not policing and they are creating real risk to consumers in America for allowing these fraudulent companies to sell their products on TikTok Shop, that would be one way that you guys could help your company. But NMN isn't the big deal as these others. There's another thing we're seeing is a lot of companies selling quote NAD Yeah, you know, NAD itself, the molecule NAD is not bioavailable. So there are exactly zero studies that show that swallowing NAD increases NAD levels.

Silvan: And anybody who's listening to this call who feels like writing a letter or an E mail to tick tock.

Silvan: Informing them that they are not policing and they are creating real risk to consumers in America for allowing these <unk> companies to sell their products I'll take top shop that would be one way that you guys could help your company.

Silvan: But <unk> isn't the big deal is these others. There is another thing we're seeing is a lot of companies selling <unk>.

Silvan: Yes.

Silvan: <unk> itself the molecule is not bio available.

Silvan: So there is there are exactly zero studies that show that swallowing NID increases NAD levels. So it doesn't it's just simply too large a molecule.

Rob Fried: It doesn't, it's just simply too large a molecule and has a similar problem to NMN in that it's a nucleotide, meaning there's a phosphate group on the perimeter blocking entry into the cell. So people who are hearing about NAD, going out and buying a supplement that says NAD, it's not even just that you're you're taking a product that doesn't do anything, you probably are doing some harm. Why do I say that? Well, these people who get NAD IV and it takes three hours and they have these cramps and stomach aches and sweats and fevers, there's a reason why.

And has the similar problems and that it's a nucleotide bean and Theres, a buffet groupon the parameter blocking entry into the cell.

Silvan: So people who are hearing of that.

Silvan: Buying a supplement it says.

Silvan: Okay.

Silvan: It's not even just that you are.

Silvan: Taking a product that doesn't do anything you're probably youre doing some harm why do I say that well. These people will get NAV IV and it takes three hours and they have these cramps and stomach aches and sweats and fevers.

Silvan: There is a reason why.

Rob Fried: because NAD endeavoring to get into the cell creates friction. It creates this friction that leads to information. At taking NAD, the one study we did where we compared NAD IV to NIAGEN IV showed all the biomarkers of inflammation in NAD. So, it not only doesn't do much. It also creates inflammation, but that doesn't stop dozens of companies from jumping on the NAD bandwagon and selling NAD.

Silvan: Because NID endeavoring to get into the cell creates friction.

It creates this friction.

Silvan: It leads to inflammation.

Silvan: At <unk>.

Silvan: The one study, we did where we compare to an IV to <unk> IV showed all the biomarkers of inflammation.

Silvan: So not only doesn't do much.

Silvan: It also creates inflammation, but that doesn't stop dozens of companies from jumping on the bandwagon and selling NAV.

Rob Fried: The fact of the matter is, there's really only one good, safe, trustworthy company in the NAD space that does the studies, that meets label claims, that has a top-shelf quality department, that gets regulatory approvals, that gets intellectual property, and that you can trust. And it's a company. And to the extent that you guys can help us spread that word, I think you'd help, you'd be very helpful to the general consumer base that's now growing in, of growing interest in the NAD.

Silvan: The fact of the matter is there's really only one good safe trustworthy company in the space that does the studies that meets label claims that Hasnt op shelf quality department that gets regulatory approvals that gets intellectual property and that you can trust in this company.

Silvan: And to the extent that you guys can help us spread that word I think you'd hope you'd be very helpful to the general consumer.

Speaker Change: Base, that's now growing of growing.

Silvan: Interest in the space.

Raghuram Selvaraju: Thank you very much for that.

Speaker Change: Thank you very much for that just 222 related things if I may.

Raghuram Selvaraju: Just two related things, if I may.

Raghuram Selvaraju: Firstly, I was wondering if you could comment on the potential market opportunity, the size of the total addressable market and what you expect to be possible upside scenarios, if the Parkinson's disease study that's currently ongoing were to report positive data, and what implications that might have for ChromaDex.

Speaker Change: Firstly I was wondering if you could comment on the potential market opportunity the size of the total addressable market and what you expect to be possible upside scenarios. If the Parkinson's disease study. That's currently ongoing work to report positive data and what implications that might have for chrome IDEXX and <unk>.

Rob Fried: And also, if you could maybe talk about future potential avenues to positioning NR as an Rx product, if that might include a possible spin out, a pharmaceutical initiative of some kind, or indeed, broader corporate rebranding. Thank you.

Speaker Change: Also if you could maybe talk about fuel.

Speaker Change: Future potential avenues to.

Speaker Change: Positioning NR as an Rx product if that might include a possible spin out.

Speaker Change: Our pharmaceutical initiative of some kind or indeed broader corporate rebranding. Thank you.

Rob Fried: Yes, well, as you know, we are planning to do a corporate rebrand, and we expect in the next few weeks to announce the new name. Stay tuned for that, and thank you for asking about RX. The Parkinson's study, as we said, will be completed if the protocol in June. We won't know the data for quite a while, but There are 10 million people globally diagnosed. with Parkinson's disease.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: You know we are planning to do a corporate rebrand and we expect in the next few weeks to announce the new name.

Speaker Change: Stay tuned for that and thank you for asking about Rx.

Speaker Change: <unk>.

Speaker Change: The Parkinson's study as we said will be completed.

Speaker Change: The protocol in June.

Speaker Change: We won't know the data for quite a while but.

Speaker Change: There are 10 million people globally diagnosed.

Speaker Change: With Parkinson's disease.

Rob Fried: And I ask you this question, Ron. If you were somebody diagnosed with Parkinson's disease or a family or related to somebody with Parkinson's disease, And you read that there was a Phase III clinical study completed from a very reputable Parkinson's researcher. and you read it in a very reputable journal, Parkinson's Journal, or you read it in maybe one of the foundation websites, or you read it in the news media, of a dietary supplement that had statistically significant therapeutic value. for Parkinson's that was completely safe and was on the market. What percentage of those 10 million do you think would go out or whose doctors would recommend them to go out and seek that dietary supplement?

Rob Fried: I asked you this question Rob.

Rob Fried: If you were somebody diagnosed with Parkinson's disease, or a family or related to somebody with Parkinson's disease.

Rob Fried: And you read.

Rob Fried: That there was a phase III clinical study completed from a very reputable Parkinson's researcher.

Rob Fried: And you read it in a very reputable journal Parkinson's Charles you read it and may be one of the foundation websites.

Rob Fried: You read it in the news media of a dietary supplement that had statistically significant therapeutic value.

Rob Fried: For Parkinson's that was completely safe and was on the market.

Rob Fried: What percentage of those $10 million do you think would.

Rob Fried: Go out or whose doctors would recommend them to go out and seek that dietary supplements.

Rob Fried: Seek the one that actually did the study. Seek the one that has the intellectual property. Seek the one that is safe and that approved by all of the regulatory bodies. If it was just 5% You're talking about very, very dramatic, significant numbers. You could do the math. I'm sure you have. It's a very significant math. Now that obviously there's an assumption there that the study is going to come back positive, but we have no knowledge of it. It's a double-blinded study. We don't know the results at all, nor do the researchers. But the earlier studies, the phase one studies that were published and even the preclinical studies and the mechanisms of action suggest that there's a pretty good chance.

Rob Fried: The one that actually did the study seek to one that has the intellectual property seek to one that is safe and that approved by all of the regulatory bodies.

Rob Fried: If it was just 5%.

Rob Fried: You are talking about very very dramatic significant numbers.

Rob Fried: You can do the math I am sure you have it's a very significant manner now that obviously there is an assumption there that the study is going to come back positive, but we have no knowledge of it. It's a double blinded study we don't know the results at all nor the researchers.

Rob Fried: But the earlier studies the phase one studies that were published in even the preclinical studies and the mechanisms of action suggests that there is a pretty good chance.

Rob Fried: So we think that that's one area with great upside potential for. True Knowledge. But as you said, in terms of Rx, in terms of drug approval. As you know, Rom, ChromaDex has a large portfolio of precursors for NAD, not just nicotinamide riboside or nicotinamide riboside chloride. We have other precursors. some of which are bio-equivalent or even bio-superior, that we think might be better candidates for drug approval. So, ChromaDex could conceivably use one of those other molecules that we have many, many years of patents on for actual drug approval separate from sales of dietary supplement for Parkinson's disease or the other diseases.

Rob Fried: So we think that that's one area with great upside potential for.

Rob Fried: Sure.

Rob Fried: But as you said in terms of Rx in terms of drug approval.

Rob Fried: As you know.

Rob Fried: <unk> has a large portfolio of precursors for NAV, not just nicotinamide riboside.

Rob Fried: Nicotinamide Riboside fluoride, we have other precursors.

Rob Fried: Some of which are bio equivalent or even bio superior.

Rob Fried: We think might be better candidates for drug approval.

Rob Fried: Chroma next could conceivably use one of those other molecules that we have many many years of patents on.

Rob Fried: For actual drug approval separate from sales of dietary supplement for Parkinson's disease or the other diseases remember ataxia telangiectasia, which is another one.

Rob Fried: Remember ataxia telangiectasia, which is another one that we've already published a phase two clinical on that orphan disease. These are two diseases which are high profile for us.

Rob Fried: That we've already published the phase II clinical on that orphan disease. These are two diseases, which are high profile for us.

Rob Fried: Now, so then you ask the question, will there be a spinoff? So we have said in the past that we don't intend to dilute our our investors further by raising money to pursue drug approval. So if it turns out that the capital that we have is insufficient to get there because we didn't get a licensing deal from a pharma company or the cost of the study is too much, if we were in that place, yes, we would do a spin out. and perhaps just simply raise money for the spin-out if needed. I don't expect that to happen, but it is a possibility.

Rob Fried: So then you ask your question will there be a spin off so we have said in the past that we don't intend to dilute our.

Rob Fried: Our investors further by raising money to pursue drug approval. So if it turns out that the capital that we have is insufficient to get there.

Rob Fried: Because we didn't get a licensing deal from a pharma company or the cost of the study is too much. If we were in that place, yes, we would do a spin out.

Rob Fried: And perhaps just simply raise money for the Spinout if needed.

Rob Fried: Expect that to happen.

Rob Fried: But it is a possibility.

Rob Fried: The other reason for considering a spin-out would be that certain pharma companies are not as interested in a supplement business as they are in a pharmaceutical business and are very interested in both Ataxia and Parkinson's and our molecule or our molecules for that pursuit. And they might be interested in doing business with us just for those businesses and those molecules. So that's another reason potentially to do a spin out.

Rob Fried: The other reason for considering the spinout would be that certain pharma companies.

Rob Fried: Are not as interested in the supplement business as they are.

Rob Fried: Pharmaceutical business.

Rob Fried: <unk> are very interested in both the taxi in Parkinson's and our molecule or molecules for that pursuit and they might be interested in doing business with us just for those businesses and those molecules. So that's another reason potentially to do a spin.

Rob Fried: <unk>.

Rob Fried: But I appreciate you bringing it up because between Parkinson's and Ataxia and the RX strategy and the Niagen injection strategy and the Niagen IV strategy as well, it just increased awareness and brand awareness for Niagen and True Niagen. We think we have several possible shots on goal for this company, ChromaDex, to really realize its potential. All the while, we are focused on operating a good, healthy business that's cash flow positive and growing. Thank you.

Rob Fried: But I appreciate you, bringing it up because between Parkinson's and ataxia and the Rx strategy and the <unk> injection strategy in the nitrogen IV strategy as well as just increased awareness and brand awareness for <unk> and <unk>. We think we have several possible shots on goal.

Rob Fried: Well for this company chrome at X too.

Rob Fried: Really realize its potential.

Rob Fried: All the while while we are focused on operating a good healthy business that's cash flow positive in.

Rob Fried: <unk> growth.

Sean McGowan: And your next question comes from the line of Sean McGowan with Rock Capital. Please go ahead. Thank you. Hi, guys. A couple questions.

Sean McGowan: Thank you and your next question comes from the line of Sean Mcgowan with Roth Capital. Please go ahead.

Sean McGowan: Thank you hi, guys couple of questions.

Ozan Pamir: One, Omar, could you just clarify, I think I know the answer, but could you clarify on the GNA expectation for the year? Do you mean five to six million dollars higher than the reported gap number for full year 2024? Yeah, I do. And let me clarify that. So we reported almost 18.4 million in GNA expenses. That includes the reversal of that three and a half million of Dartmouth royalties and the receipt of $1.3 million from Elysium. So if you adjust for those, you know, for, you know, normal operations, from that it would be about one to two million dollar increase.

Speaker Change: One Omar could you just clarify I think I know.

Speaker Change: The antibody could you clarify on the G&A expectation for the year do you mean.

Speaker Change: $5 million to $6 million higher than the reported GAAP number for full year 2024.

Speaker Change: Yes, I do and let me clarify that.

Speaker Change: So we reported $18 almost $18 4 million and G&A expenses.

Speaker Change: That includes the reversal of about $3 5 million of Dartmouth royalties and the receipt of $1 3 million from Elysium.

Speaker Change: So if you adjust for those.

Speaker Change: Four.

Speaker Change: Normal operations.

Speaker Change: From that it would be about $1 million to $2 million increase.

Ozan Pamir: Okay, based on the reported numbers, it's 5 to 6. Based on the reported numbers, it's 5 to 6. Right.

Speaker Change: Alright.

Speaker Change: Okay based on reported numbers despite.

Speaker Change: On a reported numbers by six.

Ozan Pamir: It turns out to be a lower full-year number for 25 than I had expected, so I'm pleased.

Speaker Change: Alright.

Speaker Change: That would be a lower full year number for 'twenty five that I had expected so I'm pleased.

Ozan Pamir: On that Elysian Matthew is on the Dartmouth royalty thing. Is there going to be any effort to get back any prior, you know, paid and booked royalties on that? Or is that water under the bridge? The Dartmouth royalties, all of the previously accrued ones have been reversed and we're no longer accruing any royalties, so there's really nothing left there. Right, but those were those were accrued but unpaid, right, is my understanding. If you go back, you know, I'm talking about back to the point where you were not only recruiting them, but you were paying them, you're not going to go back and try to get previously paid.

Speaker Change: Yes on that Elysium.

Speaker Change: Matthew even on the darkest royalty thing.

Speaker Change: Is there going to be any effort to get back any prior paid and booked royalties on that or is that what are the bridge at this point.

Speaker Change: The government royalties all of the previously accrued once have been reversed and we're no longer accruing any royalty so.

Speaker Change: There's really nothing left there.

Speaker Change: Alright, but those were those are accrued but unpaid right if I understand correctly. If you go back.

Speaker Change: Talking about back to the point, where youre not only recruiting but you were paying them you're not going to go back and try to get previously pay no. We're not going to go after them for that.

Ozan Pamir: No, we're not going to go after them for that. No, that's not that's not our goal. Right. Got it. Just want to be clear on that.

Speaker Change: Not that it's not our goal alright.

Speaker Change: Alright got it just want to be clear on that.

Ozan Pamir: Yeah, is in terms of relative margin contribution, I believe we've talked about this before that nitrogen IV is higher margin than the overall average. That's right. Correct. And when the Niagen injectable, you know, at home injectable, would that be comparable to Niagen IV? It'll probably be lower. Probably below. Okay. helpful.

Speaker Change: Yes. It is.

Speaker Change: In terms of relative margin contribution I believe we've talked about this before that.

Speaker Change: <unk> IV is higher margin than the overall average that's right.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: And when the <unk> injectable at home injectable would that be comparable to <unk> and IV.

Speaker Change: It will probably be lower.

Speaker Change: Probably.

Ozan Pamir: And did you did you offer any specifics on the timing of when that home injection kit would be available? We didn't, but we're circling third quarter. Okay. All right. Helpful.

Speaker Change: Hey.

Speaker Change: Helpful and did you did you offer any.

Speaker Change: Specifics on the timing of when that home injection would be available.

Speaker Change: We did but we're circling third quarter.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Rob Fried: And last question. Can you comment on The frequency of people doing NIGE and IV, like what portion of them are coming back? Are they coming back once a month or, you know, any kind of update on that? So we were able to make up a small amount of of pharma-grade material for Niagen, and we went out into the marketplace in September, and we sold really well for the first two. Two and a half months, but then we ran out of material. So we really don't know about repeat users because we didn't have material to supply to the clinics.

Speaker Change: Alright helpful.

Speaker Change: Last question.

Speaker Change: Can you comment on.

Speaker Change: The frequency of people doing an IV.

Speaker Change: Portion of them are coming back are they coming back once a month or any kind of update on that would be helpful.

Speaker Change: So we were able to make up a small about of.

Speaker Change: Pharma grade material for Nigeria that we went out into the marketplace in September we sold really well for the first two.

Two five months, but then we ran out of material.

So we really don't know about repeat users because we didn't have material to supply to the clinics. So we really cant answer that question right now.

Rob Fried: So we really can't answer that question right now. Okay, great, very nice.

Speaker Change: Okay, Alright fair enough.

Rob Fried: All right, that's it for me. Talk to you guys later. Thanks.

Speaker Change: Alright Thats it for me talk to you guys later thanks.

Speaker Change: Thanks.

J.P. Mark: And your next question comes from the line of J.P. Mark with Farmhouse Equity Research. Please go ahead. Hi, I'm Robin Ozan. Thanks very much for taking my question and congratulations on a great quarter. Thank you.

Speaker Change: Thank you. Our next question comes from the line of JP, Mark with farmhouse equity research. Please go ahead.

Speaker Change: Robyn Thanks, very much for taking my question and congratulations on a great quarter.

Speaker Change: Thank you.

Rob Fried: So, quickly, I'm wondering about the possibility of a partnership with a clinical lab for NAD plus testing. And my thought was that maybe there's no financial, necessarily financial benefit or upside, but if you had more data from lots and lots of patients who are taking NAD plus or doing infusions, would that be helpful? Have you looked into partnerships with clinical labs for doing blood tests? Checking and that sort of thing. Is that something on your agenda? Are you talking about NAD or are you talking about NIAID? Well, I guess the NAD plus products, so NAD plus levels.

Speaker Change: So quickly I'm wondering about the possibility of a partnership with the clinical lab for energy plus testing and my thought was that maybe.

Speaker Change: There's no <unk>.

Speaker Change: Financial necessarily financial benefit or upside, but if you had more data from lots and lots of patients who were taking NAV plus are doing infusions would that'd be helpful. Have you looked into partnerships with clinical labs for doing blood testing and checking and that sort of thing is that that something on your agenda or not.

Speaker Change: Are you talking about are you talking about nitrogen.

Speaker Change: Well I guess any products, so any level of any new plus levels.

Rob Fried: It's very important for people to understand that NAD itself is not bioavailable. So these people that are... I'm sorry. Go ahead. No, go ahead. Yeah, so people who are getting NAD IV or even taking NAD. that there is a there is a increase, a small increase in their NAD levels. But the reason for that is because the NAD molecule is breaking down in the bloodstream into smaller molecules. And one of the smaller molecules it breaks down into is NR. And then the NR will be taken, a small amount of NR will then get taken up into the cell.

That level is very important for people to understand that.

Speaker Change: <unk> itself is not.

Speaker Change: Bio available.

Speaker Change: These people that are you.

Speaker Change: I'm sorry go ahead no go ahead.

Speaker Change: Please.

Speaker Change: Yes, so people who are getting <unk>.

Speaker Change: Or even taking a nap.

Speaker Change: There is a there is a increase a small increase in <unk> levels, but the reason for that is because the molecule is breaking down in the blood stream.

Speaker Change: Into smaller molecules and one of the smaller molecules it breaks down into his NR.

Speaker Change: And then the <unk> will be take a small amount of NR will give then get taken up into the cell, but they have to go through quite a process to get it there which creates a lot of agony in inflammation and other issues.

Rob Fried: But they have to go through quite a process to get it there, which creates a lot of agony and inflammation and other issues. The other issue about, you see a lot of companies emerging talking about NAD levels in the And we do, in fact, have a kit that we sell to some people who are constantly asking for my NAD levels. The problem with measuring your NAD levels in the blood. is it really isn't a great indicator of much. You really want to measure your NAD levels in the cells, in the tissue cells. But even then, you really want to measure them in the damaged tissue cells, which is very difficult to do in humans.

Speaker Change: The other issue about you see a lot of companies emerging talking about NAD levels in the blood and.

Speaker Change: And we do in fact have a kit that we sell to some people who are constantly asking what levels.

Speaker Change: So probably when measuring <unk> levels in the blood.

Speaker Change: Is it really isn't a great indicator of much you really wanted to measure <unk> levels in the cells in the tissue.

Speaker Change: But even then you really want to measure them in the damaged tissue.

Speaker Change: Tissue cells is very difficult to do in humans, it's kind of easy to do.

Rob Fried: It's kind of easy to do in rats and mice. But unless you're going to do a biopsy, it's quite difficult to do in a human. You can do it in the brain with an MRI. You can measure MAD levels in the brain with MRIs, and we've done that. And it's one of the reasons we're so aggressive with these neurodegenerative diseases like ataxia and Parkinson's and Alzheimer's, because they're all neurodegenerative diseases. And we can measure MAD levels as well as the therapeutic benefits of taking truniogen. So we could conceivably partner with some of these clinics that are out there in the MAD business or selling MAD or doing MAD IV, but we're not very confident in the quality of the data that it would deliver.

Speaker Change: Thats in mice.

Speaker Change: But unless you're going to do a biopsy, it's quite difficult to do in the home and you can do it in the brain.

Speaker Change: Within MRI, you can measure <unk> levels in the brain with Mris and we've done that and it's one of the reasons were so aggressive with these neuro degenerative diseases, like ataxia, and Parkinson's and Alzheimer's because theyre, all neuro degenerative diseases, and we can measure <unk> levels as well as the therapeutic benefits.

Speaker Change: Of taking too large so.

Speaker Change: So we could conceivably partner with some of these clinics that are out there in the business.

Speaker Change: Or selling or doing any <unk>.

Speaker Change: But we're not very confident in the quality of the data that it would deliver.

Andrew Sha: So it might be more of a marketing exercise than a science. Andrew, is there anything you want to add to that? I think you covered it, Rob. Yeah. Oh, OK. Great. Thanks.

Speaker Change: So it might be more of a marketing exercise than a science exercise.

Andrew Schaap: Andrew is there anything you want to add to that.

Andrew Schaap: I think you've covered it Rob.

Andrew Schaap: Okay, great. Thanks, yes.

Andrew Sha: So just to see if I can summarize, so if you actually had an MRI, that could actually give you some useful information then, and that's obviously going to be super expensive, but is there a point in doing that for, you know, people who are really, really interested in knowing? Andrew, you want to take that? Well, I think one of the challenges there is the availability of that technology. So it's non-invasive. But today, it's quite. to do that. So it would be the availability and the affordability, but certainly would be preferred from an invasiveness standpoint because it doesn't require a biopsy.

Andrew Schaap: So.

Andrew Schaap: Just to see if I summarize that right. So if you actually had an MRI.

That could actually give you some useful information.

Andrew Schaap: That's obviously going to be super expensive, but is there a point in doing that for people who are really really interested in knowing.

Andrew Schaap: Andrew you want to take that.

Andrew Schaap: Well I think.

Andrew Schaap: One of the challenges there is the availability of that technology. So it's noninvasive.

Andrew Schaap: But today, it's quite expensive.

Andrew Schaap: To do that so.

Andrew Schaap: Would be the availability and the affordability, but certainly would be preferred from invasiveness standpoint, because it doesn't require.

Andrew Schaap: The biopsy.

Rob Fried: Right, so if someone has a real keen interest and money is not an object here, right, that's an avenue that they could theoretically pursue. Yes, yes, the group in Norway that Rob referred to earlier that's doing the Parkinson's disease research has routinely implemented this technology in measuring brain NAD levels. I don't know that it's a large portion of the NOPARC study, but they have done it in smaller and they continue to implement it in smaller studies. All right, so I wasn't thinking about like research or clinical settings, I'm talking about individuals who, and as Rob alluded to, there are people who are really keen to know their levels, right?

Andrew Schaap: Right. So someone has.

Andrew Schaap: Keen interest and money is not an object here right.

Andrew Schaap: And Avenue that takes it theoretically pursue is that right.

Andrew Schaap: Yes, yes.

Andrew Schaap: <unk>.

Speaker Change: The group in Norway that Rob referred to earlier Thats doing the Parkinson's disease research.

Speaker Change: Has routinely implemented this technology in measuring bringing in a day levels.

Speaker Change: I don't.

Speaker Change: No that it's.

Speaker Change: A.

Speaker Change: A large portion of them No park study, but they have done it in smaller studies.

Speaker Change: And they continue to implement it in smaller cities.

Speaker Change: Alright, so I wasn't thinking about like research or clinical saying I'm talking about individuals who.

Speaker Change: And as Rob alluded to there are people, who are really keen to know their levels. So in theory. If you have the money and you want to do this you can do it and there might be some benefit obviously to getting the data from <unk> point of view that you can actually.

Rob Fried: So in theory, if you have the money, and you want to do this, you can do it. And, and there might be some benefit, obviously, to getting the data from ChromaDex's point of view, that you can actually, you know, prove things or show things or market things or whatever. Is that right? Or am I just missing the point? I guess that's theoretically an idea. It's expensive, but there are people out there that are so committed to anti-aging research. and their body, that they might actually do that. So let's...

Speaker Change: Things or show things or market things or whatever is that right or am I missing the boat.

Speaker Change: So I guess that's theoretically.

Speaker Change: It's expensive, but there are people out there that are so committed to anti aging research.

Speaker Change: And their bodies that they might actually do that so.

Operator: We'll think about that. Okay, great. Thank you so much. I appreciate you taking my long way. Thanks for the questions. And that concludes our question and answer session.

Speaker Change: We'll think about that.

Speaker Change: Okay, great. Thank you so much I appreciate you taking my long winded Charles here. Thanks.

Speaker Change: Thanks for the questions.

Speaker Change: And that concludes our question and answer session I will now turn the conference back over to Darren Thompson for closing remarks.

Ben Shamsian: I will now turn the conference back over to Ben Shamsian for closing remarks. Thank you, Operator. There will be a replay of this call beginning at 7.30 p.m. Eastern Time today. The replay number is 1-800-770-2030 and the replay ID is 858-4242. Thank you, everyone, for joining us today and for your continued support of ChromaDex. And this concludes today's conference call. You may now disconnect. Thank you.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Darren Thompson: Thank you operator, there'll be a replay of this call beginning at 730 PM Eastern time today. The replay number is one 870 702030 and the replay.

Speaker Change: 8584242, Thank you everyone for joining us today and for your continued support of Chrome IDEXX.

Speaker Change: And this concludes today's conference call you may now disconnect.

Speaker Change: Thank you.

Operator: Please wait, the conference will begin shortly.

Speaker Change: Please wait the conference will begin shortly.

Speaker Change: [music].

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Sure.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Okay.

Speaker Change: Yes.

Speaker Change: [music].