Q1 2025 Genius Sports Ltd Earnings Call
Thank you for standing by my name is Julian, and I will be your conference operator today. At this time, I would like to welcome everyone to the Genius Sports first quarter 2025 earnings results.
Speaker Change: All lends have been placed on beautiful bits and a background list. After the speakers remarks, there will be a question and answer session. If you would like to ask a question during this time, simply press star followed by the number one on your telephone keypad.
Speaker Change: If you would like to withdraw your question, press power one again. Thank you. I would not like to turn the call over to Genius Sports. Please go ahead.
Speaker Change: Thank you and good morning. Before we begin, we'd like to remind you that certain statements made during this call may constitute forward-looking statements that are subject to risks that could cause our actual results differ materially from our historical results or from our forecast.
We assume no responsibility for updating forward-looking statements.
Speaker Change: Any such statements should be considered in conjunction with cautionary statements in our earnings release and risk factor discussions in our filings with the SEC, including our annual report on Form 20F filed with the SEC on March 14, 2025.
Speaker Change: During the call, management will also discuss certain non-GAAP measures that we believe may be useful in evaluating genius's operating performance.
Speaker Change: These measures should not be considered an isolation or as a substitute for geniuses financial results prepared in accordance with U.S. gap.
Mark Locke: With that, I'll now turn the call over to Mark Locke.
Good morning.
Mark Locke: And thank you for joining us today as we begin another year on a positive note.
Mark Locke: Throughout the first quarter we are tracking exactly in line with the guidance that we set in March highlighting the predictability of our business model.
Mark Locke: On today's call, I'll provide a quick summary of our results and cover four other key topics.
Mark Locke: First, I'm excited to share an update on our expanded NCAA partnership.
Mark Locke: Next, I'd like to highlight a few new products that we've launched since our last call.
Mark Locke: Then I'd like to share how these products launches are creating a powerful flywheel effect for the business.
First on the results.
Mark Locke: Our first quarter group revenue increased by 20% year-on-year to $144 million.
Mark Locke: This group revenue growth contributed to our group adjusted EBITDA at a 53% incremental margin once again demonstrating the operating leverage of our business model
Mark Locke: This has also translated to 800 basis points of year-on-year margin expansion to 14%.
Mark Locke: Nick will cover the numbers in more detail shortly. In the meantime, I'll quickly touch on the other topics for today's call.
Mark Locke: First, the most exciting business update came after the quarter end as we expanded our NCAA partnership through 2032. This is a perfect example of why our tech relationships with leagues are so important.
Mark Locke: For context, our NCAA relationship began in 2018, purely as a technology agreement with no sports betting component or official data rights.
Mark Locke: After six years of building technology solutions, which is now relied upon for over 70,000 NCAA games per year across all major sports, we've now secured exclusive data rights for March
at no out-of-pocket cost to Genius.
Mark Locke: This is the clearest demonstration of our strategic execution with leaks.
Mark Locke: We've leveraged our technology position to obtain exclusive data rights, again at no outer pocket cost, making this a significant and notable deal for us.
Mark Locke: We are now positioned to provide exclusive NCAA data and marks and logos to licences sportsbooks and ultimately drive greater revenue without any rights fees.
Mark Locke: We are also expanding our technology solutions for NTAA with Genius IQ, our next generation AI platform, which will unlock future opportunities across broadcast, augmented advertising, coaching insights,
Mark Locke: and other immersive fan experiences, creating the powerful fly wheel effect which I'll come back to shortly.
Mark Locke: You should keep this strategy in mind as I move to the next topic, which is our product development, beginning with SAOT.
Mark Locke: After several weeks of testing, we are proud to announce the English Premier League has officially gone on live with our semi-automated Offside Technology or SAOT for short.
Mark Locke: This is a milestone achievement for Genius Sports and offers a scalable solution for a universal
So why is it so important? [inaudible]
Mark Locke: First, this supported the growth of our sports tech revenue in the last two quarters.
Mark Locke: Second, it reinforces our stickiness with one of the most important sports organizations in the world.
Mark Locke: Third, it opens doors to other leagues and federations who also view this as an opportunity.
Mark Locke: and fourth and most importantly, it allows us to install our genius IQ technology in hundreds of stadiums worldwide.
Mark Locke: The technology that enables SAOT is the same technology that drives other products like broadcaster augmentations, bet vision, augmented advertising, player tracking and so much more. Meaning technology distribution is key to our strategy.
Mark Locke: Again, the deal with UK Football and the NCAA are clear examples of what is possible when leaks rely on our technology and as we execute on our strategy.
Mark Locke: As an example, one newly launched product is called Performance Studio, which is being utilised by individual teams in the Premier League.
Mark Locke: Performance Studio is a new tool that lets coaches or analysts review key moments of a match in a three-dimensional format from different points of view, which you can see on Slide 8.
Mark Locke: Sticking with Soccer, we've also just announced the expansion of Bet Vision for Soccer, representing another milestone achievement for Genius.
Mark Locke: Bett Vision has proven to be a highly engaging platform so that we have thrilled to launch this product for a high-volume sport like soccer.
Mark Locke: This expansion marks a significant step forward as we aim to make this interface ubiquitous in sports betting.
Mark Locke: And lastly, as it relates to fan engagement, it's worth reminding you that we're not only creating new types of engaging experiences for fans, but also helping to integrate brands as the past of these new experiences.
Mark Locke: This is exactly how we gain momentum with our fan hub platform.
Mark Locke: After announcing the launch of Fan Hub late last year, we have already won many customers including Deep Blue and Ad Agency, Focus on Women's Sports, and Echo Point Media, a renewed partnership to promote ticket sales for the Indy 500 after we exceeded last year's targets.
Mark Locke: We have a robust and growing customer pipeline as these conversations continue to evolve and we believe this is shaping up to be one of the most exciting opportunities for our business and for the entire sports advertising ecosystem over the next several years.
Mark Locke: Each of these products I've described are interesting in isolation and are independently generating revenue today.
Mark Locke: Allow me to illustrate this using the products I've just described as examples of this flywheel which you can follow on slide 10.
Mark Locke: Starting from the top, Leeds and Teams depend on our technology for a wide range of opportunities. SAOT is a perfect example.
Mark Locke: This allows us to install our technology in venues and capture next-generation data.
Mark Locke: This next generation data then powers new types of sports betting or viewing experiences such as bet vision or alternative broadcasts of live sports that you've heard us highlight in prior quarters.
Mark Locke: Brett Vision is powerful because it is now becoming a destination for millions of fans to fully immerse themselves in live sports content, creating a highly engaged audience.
Mark Locke: In this example, Bett Vision gives us a real-time view of the audience and how they are engaging with live sport.
Mark Locke: In fact, that vision itself can be a potential source of proprietary ad inventory, allowing brands to integrate directly into the video player and be part of the experience.
Mark Locke: Many of these brands are also official sponsors of the leagues and teams.
Mark Locke: So as we provide more optionality, brands get more value after their official sponsorships, which flows back to the leagues and teams where the flywheel started.
Mark Locke: The reason I highlight this is because I wanted to share the strategic context for everything we do.
Mark Locke: As we continue to announce new products, technology agreements leads, alternative viewing experiences with broadcasters, expansion of bet vision or new fan hub partnerships, you should understand how they each fit together strategically.
Mark Locke: As a final topic, I'd like to take a moment to reiterate our confidence in the business and our financial outlook.
Mark Locke: First, we believe online sports betting is currently one of the most resilient components within consumer spending, and we expect the industry should continue to grow in any economic environment.
Mark Locke: More importantly, most of our revenue and a large proportion of our costs are highly predictable so our commercial model is structured to protect our downside and reduce any outside risk.
Mark Locke: This is why we remain confident in generating at least $620 million in group revenue and $125 million in group adjusted EBITDA this year representing 21% revenue growth, over 300 basis points of margin expansion to 20%.
Mark Locke: Increased cash flow compared to last year and a meaningful step closer to our long-term target of at least 30% group-adjusted Eva-Dar Margin.
Mark Locke: As we continue to increase our cash flow in 2025 and beyond, we are sharpening our focus on capital allocation, which is why today we announce the authorisation of a share, repurchase programme up to a hundred million dollars.
Mark Locke: To be very clear, our capital allocation strategy is primarily focused on tech investment and M&A. Since we see several opportunities to drive growth and accelerate our long-term profitability targets.
Mark Locke: This program rounds out our Capital allocation strategy and adds a complimentary tool to deliver
Mark Locke: Again, this program is underpinned by a durable business model and predictable cash flow outlook.
Nick: With this in mind, I will now turn the call to Nick to discuss financial results in more detail.
Nick: Thank you, Mark. The first quarter was fairly straightforward, as we continue to demonstrate consistent revenue growth margin-expluch.
Nick: Our group revenue growth of 20% in the quarter was predominantly driven by our betting business.
which increased 44% year-on-year to $107M. [inaudible]
Nick: This was as a result of our successful contract renewals with sportsbook customers last fall.
Nick: and we're continuing to benefit from higher pricing, increased in-play betting.
and additional value-add products and services.
Grositner Betting, Revenue. [inaudible]
who's well-balanced in the quarter.
Nick: Locke, the highest rate of growth since winning the NSL four years ago .
and are more predictable betting revenue from contractual minimums.
increased by 36% year-on-year.
Nick: Also marking one of our strongest quarters in the last four years.
Nick: At the group level, our revenue growth was also well balanced geographically.
as Europe , the Americas and rest of the world.
Achieved growth of 16%, 23%, and 39% respectively.
Once again, demonstrating out global reach.
Nick: Driven by the innovative products built on Genius IQ technology, as Mark briefly described earlier, this includes products like SAOT.
Player Tracking Technology.
Performance platforms,
and broadcast augmentations as just a few examples.
You've heard why this technology is socially important.
to our strategic objectives. [inaudible]
Nick: But we're also generating incremental revenue from this in the meantime as well.
Nick: You may recall, a major revenue increased by 63% in June of 2024.
Paul, marking an outstanding quarter. [inaudible]
But of course, setting a high bar for you and your comparison.
Nick: Moving forward, we expect the evolution of fun hub will support growth and media rep news towards the back half of this year.
Nick: Lightly resulting in low-to-mid-teens growth for the four-year 2025.
Nick: First, our growth margins are more than double from 11% last year to 24% this year.
Nick: and similarly, our group adjusted EBIDAR marches, also in water doubled from 6% last year to 14% this year.
Lastly, on Cash,
Nick: We have historically seen cash outflows in the first half of the year followed by cash inflows in the second half of the year.
And we expect the task in this year will look similar.
Nick: As part of our guidance for the year, we still expect our four-year cash flow to be positive and meaningfully higher than our cash net inflow in 2024.
To close.
Nick: We are tracking right in line with our guidance set out in large and we remain incredibly well positioned.
Given our largely fixed cost-base. [inaudible]
Nick: Durable revenue growth drivers, and multitude of opportunities still ahead, as we continue our tech distribution, product adoption, and commercial execution.
With that? [inaudible]
We now complete our prepared remarks.
and Oprah the line to QA Day.
Nick: Thank you. We will now begin our question and answer session.
Nick: If you have dialed in and would like to ask a question, please press R1 on your telephone key battery through your hand and join the queue. If you would like to withdraw your question, simply press R1 again.
Nick: If you are called upon to ask your question and are listening while out speaker on your device, please pick up your hands that ensure that your phone is not on mute when asking your question.
Speaker Change: So, obviously, we're expecting a decent positive cash flow this year. I think putting...
Nick: and putting up priorities in order of capital allocation. I think they're spending enough money at the moment in our...
Nick: I think we, M&A is obviously a big focus, but you know, we have to be very careful about what we're buying and
You know, you kiss a lot of frogs. [inaudible]
Nick: I think it's a phrase, and we're doing a lot of kissing, but we expect some of them will turn into princesses at some point. And then just having a share buyback, having a share buyback thing is really a good housekeeping for us. It allows us.
Nick: Great. And then just switching gears. Following the NCAA, you know, they've been pretty open about their desire to protect student athletes, notably to push to get player prop bands.
Speaker Change: Yeah, it's a really good question because we actually see it as a symbiotic. It's quite interesting that, you know, it's often pitched or the narrative is often that, you know, what the NCAA want to do is counter to what's best for the sports betting industry and I strongly disagree with that sentiment. You know, our view is, you know, is fundamentally you've got to start with responsible gaming, responsible gambling. I mean, you know, we've seen the stakes in other countries where they haven't put that as the number one priority and there's been heavy crackdown on the government. [inaudible]
Speaker Change: So there's a good history and good evidence in other markets in the UK of the sports books taking this really responsibly and working with the leagues to make sure that the types of bets that are being offered are the right types of bets. So I think when you look at this deal, what it's doing is it's allowing the NCAA to have real visibility on where the date is going, it allows the integrity of the sports to be improved and be protected and ultimately
Speaker Change: I don't think you're going to see disagreement from any of the sportsbooks about the way that the NTAA wants to protect their players and protect the types of bets that are being offered because in the end, as an industry, as an ecosystem, it's in all our interests.
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Great, thanks everyone.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Ryan Sigdahl, who is pre-volume capital group. Please go ahead.
Ryan Sigtal: Hey, good day, guys. I want to start on the ad tech revenue. How much of that decline in the quarter was expected versus softer spend? And then is that timing or is there a change in expectations from what you're hearing from your sports, what customers, or I guess, you know, potentially even market share changes?
Mark Locke: Sorry, Ryan, can you just repeat the question we missed a second part of that?
Yeah, just curious for more context around the ad.
Mark Locke: The media segment decline is a bit weaker than maybe where I was expecting. I know you have a tough comp but just curious for reasons there if it's a timing in spend or if it's a change in expectations from your sports for customers for the year overall. Thank you very much.
Mark Locke: Yeah, hey, Ryan, it's Nick. Yeah, I mean, it's broadly in line with what we expected. As you know, media revenue is always a little bit less predictable and can swing on whether someone spends on the 31st of March or the 1st of April , particularly obviously with March madness at that time of year. But no, it's broadly exactly how we anticipated it to be. I think as we said, it prepared for Mark.
Mark Locke: It's coming against a big quarter, I think it was 63% up year on year in 2024, and what I can say, and I think I said it in a couple of months again, it's a anticipating media to be double digits, low teens, growth year on year and therefore return to grow through Q2, Q3 and Q4.
Speaker Change: Thanks, Nick. For my second question, just on that vision you expanded with several soccer leagues or football leagues.
of that aunt.
Betting Data Customers, or Contracts.
Speaker Change: Can you say think about the ability to monetize your technology beyond existing relationships and then how that may or may not impact future data rights deals with your existing sportsbook leagues but also the other ones you're partnering with from a technology standpoint. Thank you very much.
Speaker Change: Sure, so just to give a bit of context on this, we launched that vision for NFL a while ago and we were running around, call it 270 games a year for that.
Speaker Change: Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel, Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel,
Speaker Change: And again, coming back to the principle of in-play is it's high margin betting. You know, the margins that we're generating from in-play, you know, three times what we're generating from the rest of the market. We're seeing enormous growth in that space. We're seeing huge numbers, millions and millions of people adopting that bet vision product and engaging with it. And, you know, we see it as a key driver to growth over the coming period. We're seeing huge numbers, millions and millions of people adopting that bet vision product and engaging with it.
Thanks, guys. Good luck.
Ernie McTernan: Your next question comes from the line of brand new Mark Ternan, with madam, please go ahead.
Ernie McTernan: Thanks, David, in question. Maybe just to start on media, understand the guidance of load of mid-teens growth through 25 in the difficult comparisons you had in the first quarter of this year. As we trend through the year, and we think about the year-of-year growth, how much of it is just
Ernie McTernan: You know, maybe existing contracts with sports folks, maybe in the U.S. vs. fan hub, really gaining traction here is embedded in that low-to-mid-teens guidance for growth.
Speaker Change: Hey, Bernie, essentially what's in the guide today is predominantly managed programmatic service from Sportsbooks and non-Sportsbooks. So, you know, as we redid the contracts back in last fall, as we've always had them, was minimum spending that, and we've been increasing to spend it and getting customers from non-Sportsbooks as well and you know, that's...
Speaker Change: Bill Tremd over the last three years. So that is predominantly what's in the guide. I think as Mark has said, possibly the last quarter, I look, we're very excited about Fun Hub and we can talk about that in more detail as to the rest of the Q&A. From a financial perspective, there's very little built into this guide really in relation to Fun Hub.
Speaker Change: That has always been, I anticipate, where there's any up size in our 620 million dollars of revenue that we've guided to and it'll have a much more significant financial impact in 2026.
Speaker Change: on Bet Vision for Soccer. Can you talk about the different opportunities sets of bet vision in the US versus Europe , because I think in...
Speaker Change: in the U.S. Part of the benefits of bet vision was to increase in play betting. In over in Europe , we've heard that in play betting is already 70-80% of handle. So maybe just thinking about the different monetization strategy of the opportunity set in Europe for the U.S. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yeah, I mean, that's a really good question. I mean, look, your assessment of the value of bad vision in the US.
is right and obviously soccer has benefit in the US but again that's quarter with the launch of basketball that will become even more relevant.
Speaker Change: Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel, Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel,
Speaker Change: So the fact that it's instantaneous reduces things like new bet delays with sportsbooks. So the combination of all of the benefits of automated data collection through the products sets that we're rolling out, the conversion of them into new bet types is going to give a whole new lease of life to some of the in play betting in the European market. And again, you've got to think of this in volume terms, you know, we're talking about, you know, hundreds of thousands of games over the next couple of years being pushed through bet vision of, you know, soccer.
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Great. Thank you both.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Ben Miller with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
Speaker Change: Great. Thanks so much for taking the questions. The NCAA deal seems to be another example of how product and value-added services are becoming more important in the League and Sports Book.
Speaker Change: Relationships and Negotiations. Did you provide any color on what product adoption or attach rates look like today among league partners and sports book customers and how that might differ across customer partner cohorts in terms of size or importance to genius?
I didn't know.
Can you hear me?
Speaker Change: Yeah, sorry, I wasn't, I didn't catch the end of your question again, but I think you're asking what is the shape of the NCAA deal look like within the schools? Is that, is that right? Well, just in terms of the, the, the, the product, an attach rates for the various products among sportsbooks and, and league partners, what does that look like today and where is their white space to maybe drive more of that into negotiations going forward? [inaudible]
Speaker Change: So, specifically to the sports books, historically we didn't have the betting, the betting rights for the NCAA. So, the NCAA deal that we've had in place, you know, since 2018 I think it has, has been a deal where we distributed our technology into, pretty much all the colleges to collect the vast majority of the data that they use to run their own infrastructure. But our ability and our right to use that in betting, you know, hasn't, hasn't been in place. That, as part of this new deal on this long term.
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Speaker Change: Great. And then Nick, just on the reiterated 25th guide, you've made a lot of progress on sportsbook and renegotiations over the past few quarters. How should we think about what might still be outstanding there, especially internationally, and what's contemplated in the guide around that?
Speaker Change: Yeah, hey, Ben, I've always said before, renegotiation of sports books is something we do on a daily basis.
We have the...
Speaker Change: slightly strange situation in 2024 where we ended up really negotiating all of the US deals at the same time I think as we said at the time they will be staggered over the next coming years.
Speaker Change: None of them are one year deals, so we're not renegotiating any with the major US sports books this fall. There are some other international sports books that naturally we would do and renegotiate through 2025.
Speaker Change: We've taken a reasonable view, given the fact that we've now got a lot of track history, both now in the US, particularly in Europe , of what those renegotiations look like, and we've built any sensible, upside-up, both in terms of product and price within the 2025 guide.
Great, thanks so much.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line with Jed Kelly with Open Eimer. Please go ahead.
Jed Kelley: Very great. Thanks for taking my question. You know, nice announcement on the NTAA.
Can you talk about how that potentially allows you to-
Jed Kelley: You know, potentially get the college football contract for the SEC Big 10, some of the other other leagues and and where you are there. And then interesting on the replay technology, you know, I think it's pain point for sports fans here in the US is just.
Jed Kelley: The amount of time replay reviews take. Is there an ability to sort of grow your sports tech revenue by introducing your replay technology more with the other big four sports? Thanks.
Jed Kelley: Yeah, so on the NSAA, obviously we can't comment on any individual conferences, but I mean, suffice to say that our technology is...
Jed Kelley: Distributed in pretty much all of those conferences and all of those leads and it is the data and the technology stack that collects.
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Jed Kelley: In terms of the replay stuff, I mean it's quite interesting having us sort of making the American based.
Jed Kelley: Investor Base, because the product that we put out, semi-automated offside tracking, S-A-O-T, is
Jed Kelley: Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
out this. So, you know, taking that, that, um,
Jed Kelley: Approach and taking that level of expertise that we have in applying it to US Sports is absolutely something that is available to us and something that we obviously think a lot about. You know, the key to us being able to do that is the deployment of our technology within the stadiums, within the grounds. Again, we focus on volume, so we focus on soccer, we focus on basketball. But again, all of these relationships, the likes of them.
How much are you putting the review time down by? [inaudible]
Jed Kelley: It depends on the review, but down from six to four minutes, it's probably not a unreasonable statement.
All right, well, good job and thanks.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Clark Lampen with BTIG, please go ahead.
Clark Lampkin: Hi, good morning. Thank you very much for taking the questions. I have to mark, I wanted to start by following up I guess on sort of first party technology. It sounds like there's a lot of really interesting extension opportunities that stem from having, you know, the newest, I guess sort of, you know, state of the art first party tech in stadiums. [inaudible]
Clark Lampkin: Hopefully this makes sense, but in instances where you don't have that in place, does it in any way limit the opportunity to capitalize on...
Clark Lampkin: Augmentation or some of the other sort of value drivers that stem from having a better capture. And then the second question for either Mark or Josh.
Speaker Change: Momentum on the fan hub side certainly seems to be picking up. I know you guys are hosting a new front later this week. I'm curious if you could give us a sense for where you're seeing the most traction with the pitch right now. And I know macro impacts were downplayed, but I'm curious if there's been...
Speaker Change: Any pause in client interest or delays or sort of elongation of the sales cycle as a result of the current macro backdrop? Thank you.
Yeah, okay.
Speaker Change: So it's quite a lot on in that. Okay, so to get you your first question, um...
Speaker Change: The first-party technology. Look, so the way that we have always run our business, the principles of it, we just don't believe in these big bags, we don't believe in having to have all the technology or the product rolled out before we make incremental revenue. So the distribution of genius IQ, or as we...
Speaker Change: Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Speaker Change: Broadcast as well as providing advertising in true on it as well. That is able to be done off a third party to the streams, and that's something that we've proven now, you know, fairly, fairly concise, you know, go conclusively in lots of areas. The distribution of genius IQ into the stadium, this first party technology, really what that allows us to do is to go to the next stage of...
blog at GeraldTaylor.com
in our software set. And that philosophy hasn't changed. It's just that we're now getting to probably the most exciting time I've ever known in genius.
Speaker Change: where we're actually getting real traction, real clients, we're getting these new products that are launching on a very, very regular basis now. You've seen an awful lot of product come out of this business in the last six to nine months.
Speaker Change: and that product adoption is really good. So, you know, we're really, really starting to get the flywheel that I sort of mentioned in the in the earnings script, really spinning. So, we're feeling extremely positive about our products set. In fact, I'm out of honestly, I couldn't be more excited about it. So, from the
Speaker Change: From the out-tech side, I mean to tackle the first question, have we seen a slowdown or a pause? I think there's been a couple of conversations when the sort of tariffs came in that gave a bit of pause for thought with some of the advertisers. But again, I think it's sort of noise. I mean, this is going to be passing. Again, as Nick said earlier, we've been extremely cautious with our assessment of the contribution from fan hub this year. It's only a few minutes.
Speaker Change: The augmented ads, the bet vision, the live data from sports, all of those things are coming together to provide us with ways of augmenting and advertising on unique inventory that we're creating. So unique inventory in bet vision, in the partnerships that we're doing with our sports leagues. All of the product that we're starting to put out in the market allows us to leverage all of those parts of our ecosystem, all of the data we have, to provide a really solid advertising.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Torch Nikons with B-Reiled Disco Head.
Josh Nichols: Thanks for taking my question. Just one question for me. Just wanted to dive into that vision a little bit more. He had a lot of success with the NFL.
Speaker Change: And now you're expanding soccer, very high volume sport of course, like two things, one, there's too much in the guide for this bet vision expansion into the soccer or is that more an optionality and then secondly, if you could just dive a little bit into what you think the longer term.
Josh Nichols: Opportunities, given the traction you've seen with the NFL over the past couple seasons. [inaudible]
Mark Locke: Yeah, hey Josh, just I'll take the one on specifically on the guide and I'll hand over to Mark to talk about the long term.
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Mark Locke: And I'll hand over to Mark to talk about the longer-term vision.
Mark Locke: Yeah, it's the longest vision of that vision, not the easiest statement, is really to become as ubiquitous as possible. But we want to, you know, we cover an awful lot of sports, again, you know, we're sort of up in the news.
Mark Locke: somewhere around 90,000 soccer games a year, through 60,000 basketball games a year, and we see that vision as a great, as a great, um...
Mark Locke: Distribution for that. And again, our strategy is kind of working exactly as we said, we said that we'd roll out soccer, you know, this quarter we'd have, you know, 18,000 games in that, we've got fast people coming next quarter. It's about making that distribution real, making sure that we're getting it out there, making sure that we're adding additional product to bet vision, you know, whether that's the way that we're augmenting those broadcastle, whether it's functionality in terms of betting, or whether it's frankly additional betting markets that we're able to offer. All of
Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Appreciate it. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Your next question comes from the line of Chad Beynon with Macquarie. Please go ahead.
Speaker Change: and Opportunity, or would you rather leave that to kind of the regulatory groups to determine how this fits into sports betting engagement and overall wagering markets going forward? Thanks.
Speaker Change: It's pretty interesting isn't it? I mean pretty fast moving as well. And we're really right in the middle of this. There's obviously a lot of, I mean, you know, you read the press every day, there's, you know,
Speaker Change: and various different evolutions. I mean, if you take it to a higher level, we see this as pretty positive to be honest with you. It's an additional opportunity for us, additional product for us, additional partners for us, and we think that that's quite, there's an opportunity for us.
Speaker Change: We, you know, there are, you know, there's some sort of, you know, questions around how far this is going to go and again, I'm...
Speaker Change: Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel Unknown Executive, Mark Locke, Brandon Bukstel
Speaker Change: on their own. I think that's a really interesting question and one that could have some very, you know, extremely positive ramifications, you know, if those things were to go through. So, you know, it's an interesting time. It's, you know, it's, it's, you know, it's worth keeping an eye on and again, worth us.
Speaker Change: Evolving our relationships with those parties and continuing to make sure that we're well positioned to provide the right place.
Speaker Change: Great, thanks. And then Nick, another one in terms of what would go into the guidance, I think last year or last earnings call you mentioned, 30% in play for NFL for the season. So I'm guessing that was for
Speaker Change: Q4 and kind of the spillover into Q1 but how are you thinking about that in-play percentage in the guide is there an expected increase getting to the natural levels that we see in other markets. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yeah, I'm anticipating there to be a small up increase in the back end of the year for the new 25, 26 NFL season, but not a remarkable fee change. If there is, that's upside to the guide. I'm expected to be a couple of percentage points.
Great, thank you both.
Mike Hickey: Your next question comes from the line of Mike Hickey with Benchmark, please go ahead.
Just um.
Mike Hickey: prediction market question. Obviously, a lot to learn, but you have experienced their market.
Mike Hickey: in Europe and other regions. And you said it's a sort of a probably a win for you guys. Over time, do you see the necessity for live data mark in his markets or is the opportunity for you more in the media side or fan engagement opportunities?
Mike Hickey: Okay, thanks. And then on your buyback, there just may be a clarification, obviously in our view at least, your stocks don't seem very up to buy you here. Are you in sort of, is this more opposable? Is there anything you can do to hold with the definition of capital on the buyback? Or is this sort of a...
Speaker Change: Gradual sort of grind here. I'm really sorry. I can't hear what you're saying.
I don't know if it's your line or not.
That's much better.
All right, so I've got headphones walking out on me.
Speaker Change: Yeah, sorry, on the buyback, just a clarification. Is this more opportunistic or should be sort of the sea of like a core link cadence or grind here? Obviously your stock in our view at least seems very undervalued, so it seems like a good allocation to us.
Speaker Change: Okay, good. Last clarification for us on the NCAA deal. Congratulations, obviously a big man for you. Just wanted to clarify, I guess, the monetization piece. Obviously, the data.
writes what we're not in your original agreement.
Speaker Change: Just wasn't sure like, you know, and probably wasn't baked into your guide for this year. Obviously, we're through March Madness now. I'm guessing that's sort of the big event where you look to next year. But how much monetization is that for you in the near term? And in fact, is that upside to your 25th guide? Thanks.
Speaker Change: Hey, Michael Nick. You're right. You kind of have slightly answered your own question there, Mike. Obviously, the line share that the financial aspect is much madness. We're through that now, and therefore, I'm expecting there to be a most of the monetization to happen in 26, not in 25.
Unknown Speaker 0
Thanks for joining us. Appreciate it.
Speaker Change: And your next question comes from the line of Eric Martinuzzi with Blake Street Capital Markets. Please go ahead.
Yeah, a question for you, Nick, on the cash used.
Speaker Change: Q1 of 2025 versus Q1 of 2024. So, help me understand maybe some one or two puts and takes that bridges
Speaker Change: Yeah, hi, hi, okay, I'm Pedro Marks, I reiterated what I've said previously, you know, we were obviously significantly cash positive as an operating cash flow in 2024, the net cash flow as well, I'm expecting that to again happen in 2025, although I expect that to be increased proportionate with the increase of the bidar that we're delivering in 2025 as both to 2024.
Speaker Change: As far as individual courses are concerned, I'm expecting 25 really to follow the same sort of seasonal pattern as 24 and that's really a working capital outflow probably in Q1 and Q2 and then significant working capital inflows.
You know, thank you.
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