Q2 2025 Tyler Technologies Inc Earnings Call

Abby: Ladies and gentlemen, hello and welcome to today's TYLER TECHNOLOGIES second quarter 2025 conference call. Your host for today's call is Lynn Moore, president and CEO of TYLER TECHNOLOGIES. At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. Later, we will conduct a question and answer session, and instructions will follow at that time. In order to address your questions and stay within the allotted time, please limit your question to one question per person. You may get back into the queue for a follow-up. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded today, July 31st, 2025. I would like to turn the call over to Hala Elsherbini, TYLER's senior director of investor relations. Please go ahead.

Or president and CEO of Tyler Technologies.

At this time, all participants are in a listen-only mode. Later, we will conduct a question and answer session and instructions will follow at that time.

Hala Elsherbini: Thank you, Abby, and welcome to our call. With me today is Lynn Moore, our president and chief executive officer, and Brian Miller, our chief financial officer. After I give the stakeholder statement, Lynn will have some initial comments on our quarter, and then Brian will review the details of our results and update on our annual guidance for 2025. Lynn will end with some additional comments, and then we'll take your questions. During this call, management may make statements that provide information other than historical information and may include projections concerning the company's future prospects, revenues, expenses, and profits. Such statements are considered forward-looking statements under the Safe Harbor provision of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995 and are subject to certain risks and uncertainties which could cause actual results to differ materially from these projections.

During this call management, may make statements that provide information other than historical information and may include projections, concerning the company's future prospects, revenues expenses and profits.

Hala Elsherbini: We would refer you to our Form 10-K and other SEC filings for more information on those risks. Also, in our earnings release, we have included non-GAAP measures that we believe facilitate understanding of our results and comparisons with peers in the software industry. A reconciliation of GAAP to non-GAAP measures is provided in our earnings release. We have also posted on the Investor Relations section of our website, under the Financials tab, a schedule with supplemental information, including information about our quarterly recurring revenues and bookings. On the Events and Presentations tab, we posted an earnings summary results slide deck to supplement our prepared remarks. Please note that all growth comparisons we make on the call today will relate to the corresponding period of last year unless we specify otherwise. Lynn?

Such statements are considered forward-looking statements under the Safe Harbor, provision of the private Securities, litigation Reform, Act of 1995, and are subject to certain risks and uncertainties, which could cause actual results to differ materially from these projections.

We would refer you to our form, 10K, and other FCC filings for more information on those risks.

also, in our earnings relief, we have included non-gaap measures that we believe facilitate understanding of our results and comparison with peers in the software industry,

A Reconciliation of gaap to non-gaap measures is provided in our earnings release. We have also posted on the investor relations section of our website under the financials tab, a schedule with supplemental information, including information about our quarterly recurring, revenues and bookings on the events and presentations tabs. We posted an earnings summary slide deck to supplement our prepared remarks.

Lynn Moore: Thanks, Hala. Our second quarter results again exceeded expectations and reflect continued momentum with double-digit total revenue growth, strong profitability, and exceptional free cash flow. Our performance continues to be supported by stable market demand and strong execution as we advance our cloud-first strategy. SaaS revenues grew 21.5%, marking our 18th consecutive quarter of SaaS growth of 20% or more. Transaction-based revenue growth was especially robust and ahead of plan, up 21.3%, as quarterly transaction revenues surpassed $200 million for the first time. Our non-GAAP operating margin expanded 200 basis points to 26.5%. In addition, free cash flow grew 80.9% to $88 million, significantly exceeding expectations. As we've discussed on prior calls, we operate in a market defined by inherently long sales cycles, particularly for larger deals, which can create quarterly variability but ultimately support long-term growth.

Please note that all growth comparisons we make on the call. Today will relate to the corresponding period of last year, unless we specify otherwise Lynn

Thanks Hollister.

Our second quarter results again. Exceeded expectations and reflect continue to continue momentum with double digit. Total revenue growth, strong, profitability and exceptional free cash flow.

Our performance continues to be supported by stable market, demand and strong execution. As we advance our Cloud first strategy,

SAS revenues grew 21.5% marking, our 18th consecutive quarter of SAS growth of 20% or more.

Transaction-based Revenue growth was, especially robust, and ahead of plan up. 21.3%, as quarterly transaction Revenue surpassed 200 million for the first time.

Our non-gaap, operating margin expanded, 200 basis points to 26.5%.

In addition, free cash flow grew. 80.9% to 88 million significantly. Exceeding expectations.

Lynn Moore: While we still are seeing some scattered delays or cancellations of procurement processes related to the macro environment and noise around federal funding, they are not material. Many of the sales processes that were delayed in Q1 were signed in Q2, and we saw a solid sequential improvement in SaaS bookings in Q2. We're seeing no fundamental change in public sector demand or purchasing behavior, and our sales pipeline remains strong, supported by generally stable and healthy budgets, with funding priorities increasingly aligned to technology investments that drive long-term efficiencies through digital modernization. In addition, client conversations at our recent Connect conference reinforce that the vast majority of TYLER clients do not expect federal funding, DOGE, or other macro factors to impact their spend with TYLER.

As we've discussed on prior calls, we operate in a market defined by inherently long sales Cycles, particularly for larger deals which can create quarterly variability. But ultimately support long-term growth

While we still are seeing some scattered delays or cancellations of procurement processes related to the macro environment and noise around Federal funding. They are not Material.

Many of the sales processes that were delayed in q1 were signed in Q2 and we saw solid sequential Improvement in SAS bookings in Q2.

We're seeing no fundamental change in public sector, demand or purchasing behavior and our sales pipeline remains strong supported by generally, stable and healthy budgets with funding priorities. Increasingly, aligned to technology Investments. That drive long-term efficiencies through digital modernization.

In addition.

Lynn Moore: Our cloud-first strategy is the foundation of our success and is anchored by unifying principles that drive toward a single release stream to better scale, innovate, and deliver improved time-to-value for our clients. By closely aligning our cloud strategy and client success efforts with our deliberate AI approach, we're unlocking the full potential of the cloud while creating deeper client connections through a unified experience that we believe will enhance cross-sell and upsell opportunities. Our team continues to execute at a high level against our strategic roadmap, reinforcing our leadership position in the public sector and advancing our four key growth pillars: completing our cloud transition, leveraging our large client base, growing our payments business, and expanding into new markets. I'd like to highlight a few second quarter wins that illustrate progress against our growth objectives, with a broader list of key deals included in our quarterly earnings deck.

Client conversations at our recent connect conference reinforce that the vast majority of Tyler clients do not expect Federal funding Doge or other macro factors, to impact their spend with Tyler.

Our Cloud first strategy is the foundation of our success and is an by unifying principles that drive toward a single release stream to better scale, innovate and deliver improved time to value for our clients.

By closely aligning, our Cloud strategy and client success efforts with our deliberate. AI approach, we're unlocking the full potential of the cloud while, creating deeper client connections, through a unified experience that we believe will enhance cross-sell and upsell opportunities.

Our team continues to execute at a high level against our strategic roadmap.

Completing our Cloud transition leveraging, our large client base. Growing, our payments business, and expanding into new markets.

Lynn Moore: Our largest SaaS deal of the quarter was an $11 million contract that expands our relationship with the Arizona Supreme Court for our enterprise supervision solutions. We signed a contract for a full enterprise justice on-premises to cloud migration with the Superior Court in Santa Clara County, California, the sixth most populous county in the state. This is our first California court flip and represents more than $1 million in SaaS ARR. It was another strong sales quarter in public safety, including a multi-jurisdictional, multi-product, competitive SaaS win with the West Suburban Consolidated Dispatch in the Chicago area, and a full public safety suite SaaS win in Anoka County, Minnesota, worth more than $1 million in ARR. The city of Dallas, Texas, expanded its contract for our priority-based budgeting solution.

I'd like to highlight a few second quarter wins that illustrate progress against our growth objectives with a broader list of key deals, included in our quarterly earnings deck.

Our largest SAS deal of the quarter was an $11 million contract. That expands our relationship with the Arizona Supreme Court for Enterprise Supervision Solution.

We send a contract full full Enterprise Justice on premises to Cloud migration with the Superior Court, in Santa Clara County, California?

The sixth most populous county in the state.

This is our first California, Court flip and represents more than 1 million dollars in SAS ARR.

it was another strong sales quarter in public safety, including a multi-jurisdictional multi-product competitive, SAS win with the West Suburban Consolidated dispatch in the Chicago area,

And a full Public Safety Suite. Sass win in a Noah County Minnesota worked more than 1 million dollars in ARR.

Lynn Moore: The city desired an accelerated deployment to leverage our AI-powered application to identify and prioritize the highest value budget initiatives for the city and its constituents. The state of Alabama Department of Revenue selected our AI-driven resident assistant solution. This win builds on our resident assistant projects currently in deployment in four other states, including Hawaii, Indiana, Mississippi, and South Carolina. We see a strong pipeline behind these wins as we build upon these successes. We were recently recognized as a leader and visionary in the first-ever Gartner Magic Quadrant for cloud-based ERP for US local government. We believe this represents a clear testament to the strength of our competitive position, innovation, and the differentiated value of our uniquely integrated suite of public sector solutions. Before I turn the call over to Brian, I'd like to highlight the acquisition of Emergency Networking earlier this week.

The city of Dallas, Texas, expanded. Its contract for our priority based budgeting solution.

The city desired, an accelerated deployment to leverage our AI powered application to identify and prioritize the highest value budget initiatives for the city and its constituents.

The state of Alabama Department of Revenue selected. Our AI driven resident assistant solution.

This wind Bill Builds on our resident assistant projects, currently in deployment and 4 other States including Hawaii, Indiana, Mississippi and South Carolina.

We see a strong pipeline Behind These winds as we build upon these successes.

We were recently recognized as a leader in the Visionary quadrant in the first-ever Gartner Magic Quadrant for cloud-based ERP for U.S. local government.

We believe this represents a clear Testament to the competitive position Innovation and the differentiated value of our uniquely integrated Suite of public sector Solutions.

Lynn Moore: Emergency Networking, a TYLER partner since 2023, is a leading provider of cloud-native software for fire departments and emergency medical services agencies, including fire records management and patient care reporting with advanced analytics. The addition of Emergency Networking solutions expands our TAM and adds an important piece to TYLER's public safety portfolio, solidifying our position as a market leader in compliant fire and EMS records management, including the National Emergency Response Information System, or NERIS. We believe TYLER now has the most comprehensive suite of solutions for public safety agencies, from law enforcement to first responders to EMS agencies. Now I'd like for Brian to provide more detail on the results for the quarter and our updated annual guidance for 2025.

Before I turn the call over to Brian, I'd like to highlight the acquisition of emergency networking earlier this week.

Emergency networking, a Tyler partner since 2023 is a leading provider of cloud. Native software for fire departments and Emergency Medical Services agencies, including fire records management and patient care reporting with Advanced Analytics.

The addition of emergency networking Solutions, expands our Tam and adds an important piece to Tyler's Public Safety portfolio.

Solidifying, our position as a market leader in compliance fire and EMS records management. Including the National Emergency Response information system or nearest.

We Believe Tyler now has the most comprehensive Suite of solutions for Public Safety agencies from law enforcement to First Responders to EMS agencies,

Brian Miller: Thanks, Lynn. Total revenues for the quarter were $596.1 million, up 10.2%. Subscriptions revenue increased 21.4%. Within subscriptions, SaaS revenues grew 21.5% to $189.6 million. As we've discussed previously, there's often a lag from the signing of a new SaaS deal or a flip to the start of revenue recognition that can vary from one to several quarters. Because of this, as well as the timing of SaaS renewals and related price increases, SaaS revenue growth and SaaS bookings, both year over year and sequentially, may fluctuate from quarter to quarter. Transaction revenues grew 21.3% to $215.5 million, driven by higher transaction volumes from both new and existing clients, increased adoption and deployment of new transaction-based services, and higher revenues from third-party payment processing partners. As a reminder, Q2 is typically our highest volume quarter for transaction revenues, encompassing peak outdoor seasons along with tax filing deadlines.

Now, I'd like for Brian to provide more detail on the results for the quarter and our updated annual guidance for 2025.

Thanks, Lynn. Total revenues for the quarter were $596.1 million, up 10.2%.

Subscriptions Revenue increased 21.4%.

Within subscriptions, SAS revenues grew 21.5% to 189.6 million as we've discussed. Previously there's often a lag from the signing of a new SAS deal or a flip to the start of Revenue recognition that can vary from 1 to several quarters.

Because of this as well as the timing of SAS renewals and related price increases SAS. Revenue growth in SAS bookings, both year-over-year and sequentially. May fluctuate from quarter to quarter.

Transaction revenues grew 21.3% to 215.5, million driven by higher transaction volumes from both new and existing clients, increased adoption and deployment of new transaction Based Services and higher revenues from third-party Payment Processing partners.

Brian Miller: Professional services revenues declined 18.5% to $58.6 million, due to both an intentional focus on de-emphasizing low-margin services, as well as the impact of reserves related to projects that were in the implementation phase with agencies in two states. Total bookings for Q2 were 28.8%, up sequentially from Q1, and up 5.1% year over year, as some delayed Q1 decisions signed during Q2. SaaS bookings in total for Q2, including new SaaS deals, expansions, renewals, and flips, were solid, up 47.7% sequentially from Q1, and up 8.2% year over year. During the quarter, we added 172 new SaaS arrangements and signed 118 SaaS flips of existing on-premises clients, with a total contract value of approximately $91 million, up 35.2% sequentially from Q1, but down 28.4% year over year against a difficult comparison, reflecting the lumpiness of large deals.

As a reminder, Q2 is typically our highest volume quarter for transaction revenues encompassing Peak outdoor Seasons along with tax filing deadlines.

Professional Services, revenues declined, to 18 and a half percent to 58.6 million.

Due to both an intentional focus on de-emphasizing low-margin services, as well as the impact of reserves related to projects that were in the implementation phase with agencies in two states.

Total bookings for Q2 were 28.8%.

Up sequentially from q1 and up 5.1% year-over-year as some delayed q1 decisions signed during Q2.

Year-over-year.

During the quarter. We added 172 new SAS arrangements and signed 118 Sasse flips of existing on premises clients with a total contract value of approximately 91 million.

Up 35.2%, sequentially from q1.

Brian Miller: Total ARR from new SaaS deals was approximately $15 million, which more than doubled sequentially from Q1, but was down 7% year over year. The average ARR from new SaaS contracts was approximately $87,000, up 65.1% sequentially from Q1, and up 9.8% over last year. The number of SaaS flips grew modestly over last year to 118. Total ARR from SaaS flips was approximately $13.3 million, up 10.9% sequentially from Q1, but down 9.2% year over year. Our total annualized recurring revenue was approximately $2.07 billion, up 15.2%. Our non-GAAP operating margin expanded to 26.5%, up 200 basis points from last year. The margin expansion reflects a positive shift in revenue mix towards higher margin SaaS and transaction revenues, efficiency gains across our cloud operations, and favorable operating expense trends, including leverage in sales and marketing and G&A expenses.

But down 28.4% year-over-year against a difficult comparison reflecting the lumpiness of large deals.

Total ARR from New, South deals was approximately 15 million, which more than doubled sequentially from q1, but was down 7% year-over-year.

Average ARR from new. SAS contracts was approximately 87,000 up. 65.1% sequentially from q1 and up 9.8% over last year.

The number of SAS flips, grew modestly over last year to 118.

Total ARR from SAS flips was approximately 13.3 million up, 10.9% sequentially from q1, but down 9.2% year-over-year.

Annual annualised recurring Revenue was approximately 2.07 billion up 15.2%.

Our non-gaap, operating margin expanded to 26.5% up 200 basis points from last year.

Brian Miller: As we discussed on previous calls, merchant and interchange fees from our payments business under the gross revenue model have a meaningful impact on our overall margins as they are included in both revenues and cost of revenues. We incurred merchant fees of approximately $53 million in Q2 compared to $45 million last year. Cash flows from operations and pre-cash flow were robust at $98.3 million and $88 million, respectively, driven by higher margins and working capital improvements. The recent passage of the One Big Beautiful Bill Act provided a permanent repeal of Section 174, which required capitalization of R&D expenditures for tax purposes, along with favorable changes in the treatment of tax bonus depreciation.

The margin expansion, reflects, a positive shift in Revenue, mix towards higher margin, SAS and transaction revenues efficiency gains across our Cloud operations. And favorable operating expense Trends, including leverage in sales and marketing and GNA expenses.

As we discussed on previous calls, merchants and interchange fees from our payments business. Under the gross revenue model, have a meaningful impact on our overall margins, as they are included in both revenues and cost of revenues. We incurred, Merchant fees of approximately 50, 53 million in Q2 compared to 45 million last year.

Cash flows from operations and free cash flow were robust at $98.3 million and $88 million, respectively, driven by higher margins and working capital improvements.

Brian Miller: As a result, we currently expect that our cash tax payments in the second half of 2025 will be approximately $55 million lower than previously expected, adding approximately 200 basis points to our free cash flow margin for the year. Similarly, we expect that our cash tax payments in 2026 will be minimal. We ended the quarter with $600 million of convertible debt outstanding and cash and investments of approximately $895 million and net leverage of zero. In light of our strong second quarter results and our positive outlook for the balance of the year, we have revised our annual guidance for 2025 as follows. We expect total revenues will be between $2.33 billion and $2.36 billion. The midpoint of our guidance implies growth of approximately 10%.

The recent passage of the 1 big beautiful. Bill act provided a permanent repeal of section 174, which required capitalization of R&D expenditures for tax purposes, along with favorable changes in the treatment of tax bonus depreciation.

As a result, we currently expect that our cash tax payments in the second. Half of 2025 will be approximately 55 million lower than previously expected.

Adding approximately 200 basis points to our free cash flow margin for the year.

Similarly, we expect that our cash tax payments in 2026 will be minimal.

We ended the quarter with 600 million of convertible debt, outstanding and cash, and Investments of approximately 80095 million and net leverage of 0.

In light of our strong second quarter results, in our positive outlook for the balance of the year. We have revised our annual guidance for 2025 as follows.

Brian Miller: We expect GAAP-diluted EPS will be between $7.40 and $7.70 and may vary significantly due to the impact of discrete tax items on the GAAP effective tax rate. We expect non-GAAP-diluted EPS will be between $11.20 and $11.50. Our estimated non-GAAP tax rate for 2025 is expected to be 22.5%. We're currently evaluating potential impacts of the new tax bill on our tax rate going forward. We expect our free cash flow margin will be between 25% and 27%. We expect research and development expense will be in the range of $202 million to $205 million. Other details of our guidance are included in our earnings release and in the Q2 earnings deck posted on our website. I'd also like to add some additional color around our revenue guidance. Subscription revenues in total are expected to grow between 17% and 19%.

We expect total revenues will be between 2.33 billion and 2.36 billion. The midpoint of our guidance implies growth of approximately 10%

we expect Gap, diluted EPS will be between 7 and 4000 and $7.70 and may vary significantly due to the impact of discrete tax items on the Gap, effective tax rate.

We expect non-gaap diluted EPS will be between $11.20 and $11.50.

Our estimated non-gaap tax rate for 2025, is expected to be 22.5%.

We're currently evaluating potential impacts of the new tax bill on our tax rate going forward.

We expect our free cash flow margin, will be between 25 and 27%.

We expect research and development, expense will be in the range of 202, million to 205 million.

Other details of our guidance are included in our earnings release and in the Q2 earnings deck posted on our website.

I'd also like to add some additional color around our Revenue guidance.

Brian Miller: Within subscriptions, SaaS revenue is expected to grow between 21% and 23%. Transaction revenues are expected to grow between 14% and 16%, with merchant fees up 7% to 9%. We now expect the majority of payment services under the Texas contract to continue through the end of 2025 or early 2026, with full-year revenues of approximately $41 million. Maintenance revenue is expected to decline 4% to 6%. Professional services revenue is expected to decline 3% to 6%. License revenues are expected to decline 16% to 18%. Hardware and other revenue is expected to grow between 3% and 5%. Now I'd like to turn the call back over to Lynn.

Subscription revenues and total are expected to grow between 17 and 19%.

Within subscriptions, SAS revenue is expected to grow between 21 and 23%.

Transaction revenues are expected to grow between 14 and 16% with Merchant fees up 7 to 9.

We now expect the majority of payment services under the Texas contract to continue through the end of 2025 or early 2026, with full-year revenues of approximately $41 million.

Maintenance revenue is expected to decline by 4% to 6%.

6%.

License revenues are expected to decline, 16 to 18%.

Hardware and other revenue is expected to grow between 3 and 5%.

Lynn Moore: Thanks, Brian. We closed the second quarter with strong performance and solid execution, positioning us well for the second half of the year. Our results reflect the competitive strengths of our diversified business, delivering the broadest, most integrated portfolio of public sector solutions to lead our clients' digitally empowered future. In May, nearly 7,000 clients, sponsors, and team members came together at TYLER Connect 2025 in San Antonio. At the conference, we previewed our AI strategic roadmap with resounding client interest and indications of elevated adoption readiness. Our AI strategy, rooted in three core pillars: productivity, decision-making, and service delivery, will include the introduction of new AI features for multiple products by year-end. We've also worked to standardize our monetization strategy, focusing on a value-based SaaS model that provides the predictability that our clients need.

Now, I'd like to turn the call back over to Lynn.

Thanks, Brian. We close the second quarter with strong performance and solid execution, positioning us. Well, for the second half of the year.

Our results reflect the competitive strengths of our Diversified business.

Delivering the broadest most integrated portfolio of public sector Solutions. Lead our clients digitally empowered future.

In May nearly 7,000 clients sponsors and team members came together at Tyler connect 2025 in San Antonio.

Conference, we previewed our AI, strategic roadmap with resounding client interests and indications of elevated adoption readiness.

Our AI strategy, rooted in 3, core pillars productivity, decision-making, and Service delivery will include the introduction of new AI features for multiple products by year end.

Lynn Moore: We also highlighted our increased focus on and investments in improving the client experience, including presentations by our new Chief Client Officer, Andrew Call. You may have seen our Form 8-K filed last week, announcing John Marr's intention to end his service on TYLER's board of directors, effective after the company's annual meeting of shareholders in May of '26. John joined TYLER through the acquisition of Munis, ultimately rising to president and CEO of TYLER. He joined the board of directors in 2002 and has chaired the board since 2017. John's impact on the company is immeasurable, and we look forward to celebrating him and his leadership next year. In the meantime, we extend both our profound thanks and our sincere congratulations to him.

We've also worked to standardize, our monetization strategy, focusing on a value-based SAS model. That provides the predictability that our clients need.

We also highlighted our increased focus on an investments, in improving the client experience, including presentations by our new Chief client officer Andrew call.

You may have seen our Form 8K filed. Last week, announcing John Marrs intention to end his service. On Tyler's board of directors effective after the company's annual meeting of shareholders in May of 26.

John joined Tyler through the acquisition of Munis, ultimately rising to President and CEO of Tyler.

He joined the board of directors and 2002 and is chair of the board since 2017.

John's impact on the company is immeasurable and we look forward to celebrating him and his leadership next year.

Lynn Moore: We're also grateful that he made this decision months before his actual board service ends so that we have time to execute a thoughtful and responsible board transition. To that end, the independent directors of the board discussed and unanimously agreed that their current intention is to nominate me as the company's next board chair. The independent directors also unanimously agreed that they would continue to appoint a lead independent director for so long as the board chair is not independent. On a personal level, I want to thank John for the remarkable ride we've had together since 1999. I'm deeply grateful for his leadership of the company and the board, but also in my own career at TYLER. I remain fully committed to executing our mission, building momentum on the initiatives we have launched, and delivering value to our shareholders, clients, and TYLER team members.

In the meantime, we extend. Both our profound. Thanks and our sincere. Congratulations to him.

We're also grateful that he made this decision month before his actual board service ends, so that we have time to execute a thoughtful and responsible board transition.

To that end independent directors of the board discussed and unanimously agreed. That their current intention is to nominate me as the company's next board chair.

In the independent directors. Also unanimously agreed that they would continue to point a lead independent director for so long. As the board chair is not independent.

On a personal level. I want to thank John for the remarkable ride. We've had together since 1999.

I'm deeply grateful for his leadership of the company and the board, but also in my own career at Tyler.

Lynn Moore: It's been a privilege to do that with John, and I'm as inspired as ever to continue writing more chapters in the incredible story that John helped write. Additionally, I'm pleased to announce the recent appointment of Ryan O'Connor as our senior vice president of payment strategy and operations, a newly created executive role to support strategic objectives and further expand our payments market opportunities. Ryan brings more than 30 years of experience in the payments industry and a proven track record of driving innovation and operational excellence. He'll be responsible for TYLER's overall payments strategy, technology, third-party payments partnerships, and day-to-day payments operations. Ryan's strategic counsel will be key in this next phase of our growth as we realize the full potential of TYLER's payments business. Now we'd like to open the line for Q&A.

I remain fully committed to executing our mission building momentum on the initiatives, we have launched and delivering value to our shareholders clients and Tyler team members.

It's been a privilege to do that with John.

And I'm as a inspired as ever to continue writing more chapters in The Incredible story that John helped write.

Additionally, I'm pleased to announce the recent appointment of Ryan, okay? Conor as our, senior vice president of payment strategy and operations

A newly created executive role to support strategic objectives. In further expand our payments Market opportunities,

Brian brings more than 30 years of experience in the payments industry and a proven track record of driving innovation and operational excellence.

He'll be responsible for Tyler's overall payment strategy technology, third party payments Partnerships and day-to-day payments operations.

Ryan, strategic Council will be key in this next phase of our growth. As we realize the full potential of Tyler's payments business.

Now, we'd like to open the line for Q&A.

Abby: Thank you. And we'll now begin the question and answer session. To ask a question, please press star one on your touch-tone phone. If you are using a speakerphone, please pick up your handset and then press star one. If you would like to withdraw your request, press star one a second time. As a reminder, please limit your question to one question so that we may stay within the allotted time. And we'll pause just momentarily to assemble our roster. And our first question comes from the line of Terry Tillman with Truist Securities. Your line is open.

Tone phone. If you are using a speaker-phone, please pick up your handset and then press star 1. If you would like to withdraw your request press star 1 a second time.

As a reminder, please limit your question to 1 question, so that we may stay within the allotted time and we'll pause just momentarily to assemble our roster.

and our first question,

Lynn Moore: Yeah, thanks. Good morning. And first, I guess I want to say congrats to John and all the best going forward. Hey, Lynn, Brian, and Hala. My one question, I'm going to focus on bookings, the SaaS bookings. I think there was some commentary in the prepared remarks about maybe some benefit from stuff from 1Q to 2Q actually materializing. But if I just look at the SaaS bookings, the 148 to 218, that is a substantial uplift sequentially and is higher than any bookings last year, including some quarters where there were some big deals. So just anything you could share more on that booking because I know part of the definition of the SaaS bookings is not just new deals, but also extensions and renewals. So maybe unpack a little bit more about around that SaaS bookings. Thank you.

it comes from the line of Terry Tillman with truist Securities. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Yeah, Terry. The real strength in the SaaS bookings this quarter, although the new deals, the new logo, new name deals, did improve pretty significantly from Q1 sequentially, and that did include the impact of some of the deals that we talked about in Q1 that were delayed. But really, the strength there was around inside sales, which would be expansions, additional sales to existing customers, and renewals. It was a very strong renewal period. Some of that is just timing of when some of the SaaS deals, especially multi-year deals, deals that we signed last year in a very strong bookings year, have renewed. And so that's really what drove most of that strength. But there's really four components there, as you mentioned: new names, additional sales to existing customers, renewals, and flips. And the latter three were all pretty strong this quarter.

You could share more on that bookings because I know part of the definition of the SAS bookings is not just new deals, but also extensions and renewals. So maybe unpack a little bit more about around, that SAS booking. Thank you.

Yeah. Terry. Um,

The the real strength in the in the SAS bookings. This quarter, although the the new deals, the new logo, new name deals. Um, did improve pretty significantly, from from q1 sequentially and that did include the impact of some of the deals that, uh, that we talked about in q1 that were delayed. Um, but really the strength there was around, um, inside sales, which be expansions additional sales to existing customers and, um, renewals it was a very strong renewal period. Um, some of that is just timing of when, um, some of the, uh, SAS Fields, especially multi-year Deals Deals that we signed last year, in a very strong, bookings year, um, have renewed and, um, so that's really what drove, most of that strength. But there's really 4 components there. As you, you mentioned, new names exist, additional sales to existing customers. Um, uh, renewals and flips. And the latter 3 were all pretty strong this quarter.

Lynn Moore: Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Aleksei Gogolev with JP Morgan. Your line is open.

Thank you.

Brian Miller: Hello, everyone. Lynn, yesterday we've heard TenneBook call out improving federal spending environment. How have TYLER's sales cycle evolved since Q1, and what specific improvements are you observing in the pipeline as macro begins to improve?

And our next question comes from the line of Alexey Google with JP Morgan. Your line is open.

Hello everyone. Uh Lynn, uh, yesterday we've heard uh tenable call out, improving federal spending environment.

I'll have, uh, Tyler's sales cycle evolved since Q1, and what specific improvements are you observing in the pipeline as macro begins to improve.

Lynn Moore: Yeah, Aleksei, that's a good question. And you're right. I think, you know, if you step back and look at the broader economy, you go back just three months ago, there was kind of a lot of noise going on on a lot of things, whether it was DOGE or whether it was tariffs. And things seem to be stabilizing on a more broader level, I think. Reports recently, inflation's down. GDP, I think, was around 3% this past quarter, reflecting, I think, both a change in import exports. I think there Q1, there was a lot of pre-tariff imports coming in. Wages are up. You know, there's an expectation of rate cuts coming. So I think some of that market uncertainty is starting to loosen on the broader environment.

Yeah, like say um, that's a good question and and you're right. I think

Lynn Moore: You know, what we're seeing is there was a little bit of uncertainty, I think, coming out of Q4, really into Q1 around that broader environment. But, you know, in our business, those deals don't go away. So when we talk about our pipeline remains strong, it does remain strong. And even when there's been a little bit of a delay in some decisions, we're still delivering mission-critical systems to our clients. They have to have them. The demand doesn't go away. And I think you're starting to see that. And we're seeing that in market activity. An anecdote, for example, in our ERP space, RFPs are up, I think, 25% since Q1. So, you know, as I said, the demand doesn't go away. The pipeline is still there and robust. And we are starting to see decisions.

You know, if you step back and look at the broader economy, um, you go back to just 3 months ago, there was kind of a lot of noise going on, um, on a lot of things, whether it was Doge or whether it was terrorists. Um, and and things seem to be stabilizing on a more broader level. I think, um, reports recently inflation's down. Uh, GDP. I think, was around 3%, uh, this past quarter, um, reflecting. I think both a, a change in uh, import exports. I think they're q1. There was a lot of, uh, pre tariff Imports coming in wages are up, um, you know, there's an expectation of rate Cuts coming, so I think some of that market uncertainty is is starting to uh is starting to loosen on the broader environment. Um, you know what we're seeing? Is there there? There was a little bit of uncertainty. I think coming out of Q4 really in the q1 around that broader environment. Um and but

Lynn Moore: And I think as we continue throughout the year sequentially, we'll be seeing those increase in those decisions more back to what we were accustomed to the last several years.

Brian Miller: Thank you, Lynn.

You know, in our business, those those deals don't go away. So when we talk about our pipeline remains strong, um, it does remain strong. And, and even when there's been a little bit of a delay in some decisions, uh, we're we're still delivering Mission critical systems to our clients. They have to have them, um, that demand doesn't go away and, and I think you're starting to see that. And, and we're seeing that in in Market activity, um, an anecdote for example, in our Erp space rfps are up. I think 25%, since q1. So, um, you know, as I said, the demand doesn't go away, the pipeline is still still there and robust and we are starting to see uh decisions and I think as we continue throughout the year sequentially, um we'll be seeing those increase in those decisions, more back to our what we are accustomed to the last several years.

Thank you, Lynn.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Ken Wong with Oppenheimer. Your line is open.

And our next question comes from the line of Ken.

Brian Miller: Great. Thank you for taking my question. You know, I realize that everyone's still digesting all the potential OBVA impacts. Any thoughts on, you know, as more responsibility is pushed down to states, specifically around things like Medicaid, and that they're already stretched thin, any concerns this could potentially influence buying behavior in the near term?

Great. Thank you for taking my question. Uh, you know, I realized that everyone's still digesting all the the potential obba impacts, uh, any any

As more responsibility is pushed down to State, specifically around things like Medicaid, you know? And that they're already stretched thin, any concerns. This could potentially influence buying behavior in the near term.

Lynn Moore: Yeah, Ken, that's not something that we're hearing, and particularly when you talk about things being pushed down to the states. I mean, what we see is pretty normal budgets. I think NASBO recently came out with a report that state budgets are relatively flat over the past couple of years, and those budgets the last few years have been elevated. And just as a reminder, even in our state business, our DSD business, I think less than 15% of our deals are actually coming from state-funded expenditures as opposed to transaction-based funding. So that's a small percentage of our business. But what I would say is we're not seeing any real change due to that, due to the One Big Beautiful Bill Act.

Uh, yeah. Can I that's not something that we're hearing? Um, and particularly, uh, when you talk about things being pushed down to the States, I mean, um, what we see is is pretty normal budgets. Um, I think nasbo recently came out with a report that state budgets are are, are, are relatively flat over the past couple years and, and those budgets the last few years have been elevated. Um, and just as a reminder, um, Even in our, our state business, our DSD business, I think less than 15%, um, of our deals are actually coming from state funded expenditures as opposed to, uh, transaction based funding.

Brian Miller: Fantastic. Thanks for the caller.

Fantastic. Thanks for the color.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Michael Turin with Wells Fargo Securities. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Hey, great. Thanks. Good morning. I appreciate you taking the question. Brian, I was hoping we could just go back to some of the free cash flow commentary and unpack it a bit more. I guess with Q2 specifically, I'm wondering if anything in terms of transactional performance at all impacts seasonality of free cash flow or anything we should be mindful of. And then the commentary on the bill impacts, was that 200 basis points for the full year? Just given the change in the second half assumptions, anything additional you can add just there and in terms of seasonality as we're updating our forecast and just trying to get a bit more calibration around some of the changes there is helpful. Thank you.

And our next question comes from the line of Michael Turin with Wells Fargo Securities. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Yeah, yeah, the 200 basis points is the impact of that $55 million lower cash tax payments for the full year. So that is the impact on the full year margin. In terms of seasonality, it was a really strong seasonally, the second quarter is the strongest quarter for transaction revenues. But this quarter was especially strong and exceeded the expectations around the cash flow from those transaction revenues with higher volumes and some of the newer contracts that we've signed in recent quarters coming online. The third quarter is still our biggest free cash flow quarter by a wide margin, and that continues to be the expectation, especially because we still have a lot of maintenance, the majority of which renews in the third quarter or that we collect the cash for in the third quarter.

Hey great. Thanks. Good morning. I appreciate you taking the question, Brian. I was hoping we could just go back to some of the free cash flow commentary. Um, and unpack it a bit more, I guess, with Q2 specifically I'm wondering if anything in terms of transaction outperformance, it all impacts, um, Susan Ally, a free cash flow or anything, we should be mindful of, and then the commentary on the bill impacts was that 200 basis points for the full year. Um, just given the change in the second half assumptions, anything additional you can add just there and in terms of seasonality as we're updating our forecasts and and just trying to get a bit more calibration around some of the changes that are helpful. Thank you. Yeah, yeah. The 200 basis points is the, it's the impact of that. 55 million dollars, lower cash tax payments uh, for the full year. So that is the impact. Um on the the full year margin um, in terms of seasonality, um, it was a really strong seasonally. The second quarter is the strongest quarter for, um,

Brian Miller: So the really big change to the second half assumption is around the lower cash taxes. So we really expect that we won't pay any meaningful federal cash taxes for the next year and a half, almost.

For transaction revenues. Um, but this quarter was specially strong and exceeded the expectations around the cash flow from those transaction revenues, um, with higher volumes and um, some of the newer, um, contracts that we've signed in, in recent quarters coming online. Um, the third quarter is still our biggest free cash flow quarter by by a wide margin and, and that continues to be the expectation. Um, especially because we still have a lot of Maintenance that, uh, uh, the majority of which renews in the third quarter um, or that we can't collect the cash for in the third quarter. Um, so, um, the really big change to the second half assumption is around um the lower cash taxes. So we really expect that that we won't pay any meaningful Federal cash taxes uh for the next uh um year and a half almost

Brian Miller: Thanks very much.

Thanks very much.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Matt Van Vliet with Cantor. Your line is open.

And our next question.

Brian Miller: Yeah, good morning. Thanks for taking the question. I guess when you look at the pipeline for cloud flips, I'm curious on how that was trending into your Connect User Conference, how the conference helped support that. And then as you look towards the back half of the year, how should we think about the progress of cloud flips and the magnitude of the ARR flipped over?

On the line of Matt vanlee with Cantor, your line is open.

Yeah, good morning. Thanks for taking the question. Um, I guess when you look at the pipeline for cloud flips um, curious on on how that was trending into, um, your connect user conference, how how, you know the conference helps support that and then as you look towards the back half of the year, um, how should we think about, you know, the the progress of cloud flips?

Um, and the magnitude of the the are flipped over.

Lynn Moore: Yeah, man, I think I'll start. Brian, you may want to jump in with some specifics, but I think generally speaking, as every quarter goes by and as more clients successfully flip to the cloud, it creates more momentum. I've got a phrase I've used around TYLER, momentum creates momentum, and we're seeing that. I think the SaaS flip that we did in California is a good example. I think I can't remember exactly when it was, maybe a year and a half ago, two years ago, when we did our first statewide court flip in Idaho, and we talked about how that reference would create more momentum, and we're seeing that.

Lynn Moore: You know, I think the other thing is it's one of the things that I think also drives the elevated interest in AI is just some of the unique factors that are going on in the public sector, one being the changing workforce and really the reductions in workforce, which also is going to be driving as people retire, continue to retire, and they're having more difficulty hiring than, say, in the public sector. I think that's also going to continue to fuel momentum in our cloud flip business.

Yeah, man. I think, um, I'll start Ryan. You may want to jump in with some specifics but um, I think generally speaking is every quarter goes by and as more clients successfully flip to the cloud, it creates more momentum. I've got a phrase I use around Tyler, momentum creates momentum, um, and we're seeing that. Um, I think the the SAS flip that we did in California is a good example, I think, um, I can't remember exactly when it was maybe a year and a half ago, 2 years ago, when we did our first Statewide Court flip in Idaho and we talked about how that reference would create more momentum. And and we're seeing that um, you know, I think the other thing is it's 1 of the things that I think also drives. Um the the elevated interest in in AI is is just some of the unique factors that are going on in the public sector, 1 being the, the changing Workforce and and really the reductions in Workforce, which um, also is going to be driving. Um, as people retire continue to retire and then, and they're having more difficulty hiring than say in the public sector. Um, I think that's also going to continue to fuel momentum

Brian Miller: And with respect to the flips this year, it is a little bit more back-end weighted toward the second half of the year. I think our assumption around flips this year really hasn't changed from where we started out the year. We expect the number of flips to grow around 25% year over year. I would say that our client base, our on-prem client base, is still more heavily weighted towards large customers. As Lynn said, we've only flipped at this point one of our state courts customers, a big presence in California with counties that we just flipped the first county there. So the timing of the bigger flips really impacts that ARR, and it can be somewhat unpredictable. We still see the sort of the peak of the flips, especially around the bigger customers, somewhere in that 2027, 2028 timeframe.

In our Cloud flip business.

And, and uh, with respect to the flips this year, um, it is a little bit more back-end weighted towards the second half of the year. I think, our assumption around flips this year, um, really hasn't changed from where we started out the year. We expect the number of flips, to grow around 25% year-over-year. Um,

Brian Miller: And we're working with customers all across our on-prem base to develop timelines for when they'll flip. I think with virtually every customer now, it's a matter of when and not whether they'll flip. But we still see that peak a couple of years down the road.

Brian Miller: Great. Thank you.

Timelines for when they'll flip, but I think with virtually every customer now, it's a matter of when and not whether they'll flip. Um, but uh, we still see that Peak, um, a couple of years down the road.

Great. Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Soket Kalia with Barclays. Your line is open.

And our next question comes from the line of socket. Kalia with Barclays.

Lynn Moore: Hey, great. Hey, guys, thanks for taking my question here. Great to see some of the stabilization. Brian, maybe for you, again, it was really good to see the SaaS bookings this quarter and that sequential growth. You know, I noticed that you narrowed the SaaS revenue growth for the year just a little bit. It's really not that material, but I was just wondering if you could just talk us through what were some of the puts and takes that you considered when doing that. And then just broader, remind us what you said about the long-term model here with SaaS growth at Analyst Day. You know, if I remember correctly, it was kind of a two-stage sort of model. Wanted to see if you could just remind us about what that two-stage sort of said about SaaS growth. Thanks.

Hey great. Hey guys, thanks for taking my question here. Great to see some of the stabilization.

Um,

Brian Miller: Yeah, sure. Yeah, as we look at the, you know, just as we get further in the year, now halfway through the year, we just have more clarity and are able to narrow that range. I think the biggest variables around the SaaS growth in the current year, it's not as much the current year bookings. As you get into the second half of the year, they don't have much impact on the current year revenues. But really fully understanding the timing around the start of revenues around those bookings in the first half of the year, more information around the timing of flips and when those revenue shifts from maintenance to SaaS will occur. So those are the biggest factors that enabled us to kind of narrow that range down a little bit, but really no fundamental changes there.

Brian May, maybe maybe for you again it was it was really good to see the SAS booking this quarter and that's sequential growth. You know, I noticed that you narrowed the SAS Revenue growth for the year just a little bit. It's really not, not that material, but but I was just wondering, if you could just talk us through what were some of the puts and takes that that you considered, when, when when doing that, and then just broader remind us what you said about the long term model here with SAS growth at analyst day. You know, if I remember correctly, it was kind of a 2-stage sort of model wanted to wanted to see if you had, if you, if you could just remind us about what that 2 stages sort of said about SAS growth, thanks.

Yeah, sure. Um yeah. As we look at the, you know, just as we get further in the year now, halfway through the year, uh we just have more clarity and are able to to narrow that range. I think the biggest variables around the SAS growth um, in the current year. It's not as much the current year bookings. Um, as you get into the second half of the year, they don't, they don't have much impact on the current year revenues. Um, but really

really, um, fully understanding the timing around, uh, the the start of revenues around, uh, those bookings in the first half of the year, um, more, uh,

Brian Miller: In terms of the Investor Day targets, we talked about, you know, long-term between the time of the Investor Day and 2030, recurring revenues in total growing 10% to 12% CAGR with SaaS in the high teens, kind of a 20% CAGR through 2025. As you've seen, we're ahead of pace on that. But as we get through that peak of the flips, it starts to move more towards that high teens over that total period, but, you know, kind of low 20s up through the peak of the flips and then slowing down as we get on the downside of the flip chart.

More information around the timing of flips and and, uh, when um, those Revenue, um, shifts from, from maintenance to, to sass all all our. So, um, those are the biggest factors that enabled us to kind of narrow that range down a little bit. Um, but, uh, really no fundamental changes there, in terms of the investor day targets. Um, we talked about, um, um, you know, long-term between, um, 20, uh, the time of the investor day in 2030. Um, recurring revenues, um, in total growing 10 to 12%. Kegger, um, with SAS in the High Teens, um, kind of a 20 percent kegger through 2025. Um, we, as you've seen, we're, we're ahead of pace on that. Um, but, uh, as we get through that peak of the flips, um, it, uh, it starts to move more towards that High Teens over that total period, but, uh,

Lynn Moore: Makes a ton of sense. Thank you.

uh, you know, kind of low 20s, um, up through the peak of the flips and then, um, um, slowing down as we get on the downside of the, uh, the flip, the chart,

Makes a ton of sense. Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Joshua Riley with Needham. Your line is open.

And our next question comes from the line of Joshua Riley with nem. Your line is open,

Brian Miller: Yeah, thanks for taking my question. As we enter the second half of the year here, how should we think about the pipeline for big deals? I know specifically there's two states with RFPs for statewide court management contracts. Any update on how these are progressing and just the overall pipeline for big deals? Thank you.

Lynn Moore: I think, Josh, as we said, just generally our pipeline is solid. I'm aware generally I probably can assume which deals you're talking about. We always have a good pipeline in the court space. Those bigger deals in courts, you know, tend to be lumpy. We expect some large RFPs to be coming out over the next several quarters. We expect to be extremely competitive in those deals. The timing of those is always a little bit uncertain, but even if RFPs were to be announced in the next, you know, quarter, say, it would take some time to get through the process and get those signed.

Uh yeah. Thanks for taking my question. Uh, as we entered the second half of the Year here, how should we think about? Uh, the pipeline for big deals? I know specifically there's 2 States with rfps uh, for Statewide Court, management contracts. Any any update on how these are progressing, and just the overall pipeline for big deals. Thank you.

I think Josh, um,

Brian Miller: I'd say at a high level, the mix of large deals in our pipeline is pretty consistent with what we've seen over a long period of time. But as Lynn said, it's really hard to, it's harder on the bigger deal to predict the timing until they actually get down to an award. Oftentimes, even when they have published timelines for procurements, they don't stick to them too religiously. So, but I'd say that broadly, the mix of large deals in our pipeline is consistent with kind of our historical norms.

As we said, just generally dark pipeline is is is solid. Um, I'm I'm aware generally, I probably can assume which deals you're talking about. We we always have a a good pipeline in the court space. Um, those bigger deals in quartz, you know, tend to be lumpy, uh, we expect, uh, some large rfps to be coming out, um, over the next several quarters. Um, we expect to be extremely competitive in those in those deals. Um, the timing of those is always a little bit uncertain. But even, you know, even if even if rfps were to be announced in the next you know quarter say it would take some time to get through the process and get those signed.

Brian Miller: Thank you.

I'd say the high level, um, the mix of large deals in our pipeline is pretty consistent with what we've seen over a long period of time. Um, but as 1 said, it's really hard to uh, uh, it's harder on the bigger deals to uh um, predict the timing until they actually, um, get down to an award. Um, oftentimes they're, they're even when they have published, uh, timelines for procurements. Um, they they don't, uh, stick to them to religiously. So, um, but I did, I'd say the broadly, the the mix of large deals in our pipeline is consistent with kind of our historical norms.

Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Rob Oliver with Baird. Your line is open.

And our next question comes from the line of Rob Oliver with Beard. Your line is now open.

Lynn Moore: Great. Thank you. Good morning. My question is on cross-sell. Brian, I think you mentioned from the SaaS revenue in the quarter, there was a good contribution from inside sales and cross-sell. So, Lynn, my question for you is, and particularly coming out of Connect, you've know, you've done a lot to kind of change the culture internally at TYLER and to drive cross-sell. So, you know, two areas of focus. One, where are you seeing kind of the bulk of the cross-sell today and, you know, I guess within product sets? And then how are you seeing the evolution of kind of the one TYLER where you're, you know, creating a pipeline of ability to cross-sell, say, Public Safety into Munis and, you know, Odyssey into Munis and vice versa? Thanks very much. Yeah, sure, Rob.

Lynn Moore: I think that last point is pretty important, the one TYLER initiative, which really encompasses a lot of things and will become foundational for future cross-sell and upsell. And it's more than just things we're doing around our sales teams and how we're now quoting people. And even when we've talked recently about building out a state sales team, which is still in the early stages, but it extends into things like how we're approaching the cloud, how we're approaching cloud living, how we're approaching client experience, trying to give all of our clients a single unified experience, both from sales to support to implementation. That's what's going to continue to drive more and more cross-sell and upsell. We're seeing those opportunities really, I'd say, just kind of consistently across the board.

Sell uh, Brian. I think you mentioned, uh, from the, uh, SAS Revenue in the quarter. There was a a good uh, contribution from from my sales and cross sell. So Lynn, my question for you is and particularly coming out of connect. Um, you know, you've done a lot to kind of change the culture and internally at Tyler, uh, and to drive cross sell. So, you know, 2 areas of focus 1, where are you seeing kind of the bulk of the Cross sell today, um, and and, and, uh, you know, I guess within product sets and then, how are you seeing the evolution of kind of the 1 where you're, uh, you know, creating a pipeline of ability to cross? Sell say, Public Safety into into munis? And, uh, and, you know, Odyssey into into mutuus. And, and, and, and vice versa, um, thanks very much.

Yeah, sure. Um, I think, um,

that last point is pretty important. The the 1 Tyler initiative, uh, which really encompasses a lot of things and will become foundational, uh, for future cross sell and upsell. Um, and it's, it's more than just things we're doing around our sales teams. Um, and how we're how we're now quoting people. And even when I we we talked recently about building out a state sales team which is still in the early stages but it's it extends into things like how we're approaching the cloud. How we're approaching Cloud living, how we're approaching client experience, trying to give all of our clients a single unified experience.

Lynn Moore: I'd say we're still early in the process of capitalizing on the cross-sell upsell opportunities as we continue to build out that sort of one TYLER foundation that makes that, for lack of a better term, sort of helps grease the skids for those types of sales. So I continue to see that as one of our long-term growth drivers as we can continue to get more and more of our TYLER products into each of the client's hands.

Both from sales to support to implementation. That's what's going to continue to drive more and more cross-sell. And upsell, we're seeing those opportunities, really? Um, I'd say just kind of consistently across the board. Um, I'd say, we're still early in the process of capitalizing on the cross, sell upsell opportunities. Um, as we continue to build out that sort of 1, Tyler Foundation, um, that makes that that for black or better term. Sort of helps Grease the skids for those types of sales. Um so I can continue to see that as as 1 of our long-term growth drivers, as we can continue to get more and more of our Tyler products into each of the client's hands.

Brian Miller: Great. Thank you.

Great. Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Jonathan Ho with William Blair. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Hi, good morning. And let me echo my congratulations as well. In terms of the transaction-based revenue, you know, what maybe drove the strong performance this quarter? Can you just unpack that for us a little bit more? And you know, what maybe causes us to drop back down to more normalized levels over the balance of the year? Thank you.

And our next question comes from the line of Jonathan hoe with William Blair, your line is open.

Brian Miller: Well, there's a couple of things. Our TYLER payments revenues, and as we've talked about, we have a focus on, it's a cross-sell focus really into bundling payments in an integrated manner with new TYLER software sales, as well as back into our installed base. And we've had a lot of success with that really over the last year and continue to work with existing customers to add payments to their software solutions. So we've seen good growth in that. We've also seen growth in the revenues that we get from third-party payment relationships with some of our customers. And we've seen nice growth there. And then in new payment relationships, some of which are really what I kind of like to refer to as SaaS as a transaction where we're providing software but getting paid for it with transaction revenue.

Hi, good morning, and let me echo my congratulations as well in terms of the transaction-based revenue. You know what? Maybe drive the strong performance this quarter. Can you just unpack that for us a little bit more? And you know what? Maybe causes us to drop back down to more normalized levels over the balance of the year. Thank you.

Well, there's there's a couple of things um, our our Tyler payments revenues. Um, and as we've talked about um we have a focus on um uh it's a cross sell Focus, really into to bundling payments um in an integrated manner with new

Brian Miller: So, for example, the California Parks contract that we talked about last year went live last August. So that's still providing growth for us that wasn't in there last year. Some of our digital titling solutions that are paid for with transaction revenues, we went live, for example, in the state of New Jersey with that. The Florida payments contract continues to grow as we went live, actually, last July with SunPath, the toll roads in Florida. So that's new revenue on a year-over-year basis. And then Texas, which is going away at some point, continues to have higher volumes as well. So we saw some increase there. So it's really volumes, new customers, and some of those new customers being cross-selled. I guess the things that would, some of the volumes can be seasonal, somewhat.

Tyler software sales as well as back into our installed base. Um, and we've had a lot of success with that, um, really over the last year and continue to um, uh to uh, work with existing customers to add payments to, to their software Solutions. Um, so we've seen good growth in that. Um, we've also seen growth in the revenues, uh, that we get from third-party payment relationships, um, that that with some of our customers and we see nice growth there and then in um, uh, new new payment relationships. Um, some of which are really what I kind of like to refer to as SAS as a transaction where we're providing, um, software but getting paid for it with transaction Revenue. So, for example, the California Parks contract that we talked about, um, last year. Um, went live last August, so that's still providing growth for us. That, that wasn't in there last year.

Um, some of our digital titling solutions that are paid for with transaction revenues. Um, we, uh, went live, for example, in the state of New Jersey with that. Um, the Florida payments contract continues to grow, um, um, as we went live, um,

Brian Miller: And over time, I think as we continue to mine the existing customer base, at some point, we'll sort of reach a peak there and have fewer opportunities or have worked through most of those opportunities. I think we're still some time away from having fully penetrated our customer base, but eventually, we'll get there.

um,

Lynn Moore: I think to add to that, Jonathan, just two things. And it was kind of, I think you may have covered it, Brian, but we're getting better at accelerating onboarding of our payment streams. And we also have some initiatives around trying to help increase adoption within our client base. So all the things that Brian mentioned, plus those two factors as well.

Brian Miller: Thank you.

Over time, I think um as we continue to mine the existing customer base um at some point we'll sort of reach a peak there and have fewer opportunities or have worked through most of those opportunities. Um, I think we're still some time away from um, having a fully penetrated our customer base but uh, eventually um we'll get there. I think I think to add to that. Jonathan just just 2 things and it was kind of I think you may have covered it Brian but we're getting better at accelerating on boarding of of our payment streams. And um we're also have some initiatives around trying to help increase adoption within our client base. So um, all the things that that Brian mentioned plus plus, those 2 factors as well.

Thank you.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Alex Zukin with Wolf Research. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Hey, guys, thanks for taking the question. Echo the congrats. I guess maybe just two quick ones for me. First, around the kind of macro timing impacts, is there kind of maybe gauge the level of conservatism still embedded in the outlook for those events, just given the kind of maybe lower macro impacts that we've seen thus far? That's just the first one, and then I have a quick follow-up.

And our next question comes from the line of Alex. Zukin with wolf research, your line is open.

Hey guys, thanks for taking the question. Um, Echo the congrats I guess maybe just 2 quick ones for me. First around the the kind of macro timing impacts is there kind of maybe gauge the level of conservatism still embedded in the outlook for those events. Just given the kind of maybe lower macro impacts that we've seen thus far, that'll that's just the first 1 and then I have a quick follow-up.

Lynn Moore: Yeah, I mean, as I mentioned earlier, I think there has been a little bit of a macro, cloud may be the wrong word, but you know, hanging around. What's going on in the general economy, I think, should free up some of that maybe uncertainty or, you know, we experienced earlier, but it's short-lived. I mean, as I said earlier, the demand hadn't gone away. The pipeline hasn't gone away. In terms of conservatism in the remaining outlook for the year, given the timing of even if we start seeing more deals and the timing of them getting online, I wouldn't think that there's really any conservatism right now in our approach for the rest of 2025.

Yeah. I mean, as I mentioned earlier, I think, um,

Brian Miller: Got it. And then, Brian, maybe just on the free cash flow raise, I guess, you know, 200 basis points add from the bill, you increased it by 100. Maybe what's that delta tied to? And then given that's a half-year number, should we kind of, I know we're not guiding to it yet, but as we kind of tune our models for next year, should we assume, you know, kind of a 400 to 500 basis point impact from that for next year on, you know, on top of what we may have been modeling previously?

There has been a little bit of a macro Cloud, maybe the wrong word but you know, hanging around, um, what's going on? The general economy, I think is, uh, should should free up some of that, uh, maybe uncertainty or, you know, we experienced earlier. But it's short-lived. I mean, it's, it's as I said earlier, the, the demand hadn't gone away, the pipeline hasn't gone away in terms of conservatism and the remaining outlook for the year, given the timing of, even if, if we start seeing more deals in the timing them getting online, I wouldn't, I wouldn't think that there's there's really any conservatism right now in in our approach for the rest of 2025.

Brian Miller: Yeah, no, I wouldn't do that. I think that would probably be overly aggressive. I mean, I think the difference is really around just the impact of higher margins and higher earnings. So that's flowing through into cash, especially on the transaction side because the cash flow characteristics of the transaction revenues are really strong. We get the cash when the transaction takes place. So those are the biggest factors, the tax change and just the higher earnings and particularly transaction revenues. So I think your starting point is going to be probably somewhere around where we are this year. And then the impact of basically no federal cash taxes next year, which would have been, you know, probably in the $100 million range, but that impact on next year.

Got it and then Brian maybe just on the free cash flow raise, I guess. Um you know 200 basis points add from from the the bill. Uh, you you increase it by 100. Um, maybe what's that Delta tied to? And and then given that's a half year number, should we kind of? I know we're not guiding to it yet, but as we've kind of tune our models for next year, should we assume, you know, kind of a 4 to 500 basis point impact from that for next year on, you know, on top of what, what we may have been modeling previously.

Yeah, no, I, I wouldn't do that. Um, I think that would probably be, um, overly aggressive. Um, I think the difference is really around, just the impact of higher margins, and higher earnings. So that's flowing through in the cash, especially on the transaction side because the the cash flow characteristics of the transaction. Revenue is a really strong. We get the cash, uh, when the transaction takes place. So um, those are the biggest factors the the tax change in just the the uh, higher earnings and, and particularly transaction revenues. Um, so I think uh, your starting point is going to be probably somewhere around where we are this year. Um, and then um, the, uh,

impact of

Basically no federal cash taxes next year. Um, which would have been, you know, um, probably in the hundred million dollar range. Um, but uh,

Lynn Moore: Got it. Thank you, guys.

That will impact the next year.

Got it. Thank you guys.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Charlie Strauser with CJS Securities. Your line is open.

Brian Miller: Hi, good morning. Just a personal thanks to John for the 23-plus years we've known each other. And thanks to him and you, Brian, especially, you know, introducing us to the TYLER story at the very early days. And really, that's all I had for you guys. And then just thank you.

And our next question comes from the line of Charlie, strausser with CJs Securities. Your line is open.

Hi. Good morning. Just a personal thanks to John for the, uh, 23-plus years we've known each other, and, uh, thanks to him and you, Brian, especially, for introducing us to the Tyler story.

At the very early days and, uh, really, that's all I had for you guys and just thank you.

Brian Miller: Thank you, Charlie. Appreciate that.

Abby: And our next question comes from the line of Gabriela Borges with Goldman Sachs. Your line is open.

Thank you, Charlie. Appreciate that.

Speaker 8: Hi, good morning. Thank you. I wanted to follow up on the prior commentary on the potential for flips to grow around 25% year over year. Give us a little bit of a sense of how this progresses from here. I think in the past, you've talked about peak flips being in 2027, 2028. So do you think that 25% can accelerate, or are we talking number of flips versus percentage growth? Maybe just a little color on where we go from here on the flips.

And our next question comes from the line of Gabriela Borges, with Goldman Sachs, your line is open.

Lynn Moore: Yeah, the 25% is number of flips. And really, the dollar value of the flips or the size of the flips, the ARR from those is the bigger factor.It's

Hi, good morning, thank you. I wanted to follow up, um, the prior commentary. Um, the potential for flips to go around 25% year of the Year. Give us a little bit of a sense of how this progresses from here. I think in the past, you've talked about Peak flips being in 2027 2028. So, do you think that 25%, 10 acceleration, or are we talking number of flips versus percentage growth rate, maybe just a little collar on why we go from here on the flips.

Yeah. The the 25% is number of flips and really the uh,

Brian Miller: a little bit hard to predict, but likely, you know, 26 is probably something like another 25% on top of where we are in '25. And then, you know, acceleration from that to peak in '27 and '28. So we're probably looking at something like a 25% increase year over year, ballpark, over the next couple of years, and with larger and larger continuous increase in the number, in the average dollar value of those flips as well. Certainly coming up around quarter to quarter. But we're still probably on that kind of trajectory over the next couple of years till we get to the peak.

Um, they are from those is the bigger factor. Um, it says a little bit hard to predict but, um, likely, you know, 26 is probably something like another 25% on top of, uh, where we are in 25. And then, um,

Um, you know, acceleration from that to Peak in 27 and 28. So, we're probably looking at something like a 25% increase year-over-year in ballpark over the next couple of years. Um, and with larger and larger, uh, with an

Continuous increase in the number in the average dollar value of those flips as well.

Abby: I got you. And so even if the number of flips, percentage growth, is getting to improving, the dollar value associated with that flip will be going up.

Um, certainly around quarter to quarter, but uh, but we're still probably on that kind of trajectory over the next couple of years till we get to the peak.

Brian Miller: That's correct. That's the trend we expect over the next couple of years, the dollar value increasing more than probably the number of flips.

I got you. So even if the numb, the number of flips percentage growth is steady to improving the dollar value associated with that. Flips will be going up.

Abby: Yeah, that's right.

Brian Miller: Especially as you get to the large court flips, some of those, the statewide courts, the large counties are multimillion dollar annual maintenance revenue streams. And we're continuing to see a pretty consistent around that 1.7x uplift from maintenance to SaaS.

That's correct. That's the trend. We expect over the next couple of years, the dollar value increasing more than probably the number of flips. Um, especially you get some large core flips. Some of those. Um, um, the Statewide courts, the uh um uh large counties are are multi-million dollar annual maintenance revenue streams, um, and and we're continuing to see a pretty consistent um, around that 1.3.

Abby: Very helpful. Thank you.

7x uplift uh, from maintenance to SAS.

Very helpful. Thank you.

Hala Elsherbini: And our next question comes from the line of Mark Chappelle with Loop Capital Markets. Your line is open.

Lynn Moore: Thank you for taking my question and a nice job in the quarter. Lumen, I was wondering if you could just provide some additional details around emergency networking. The acquisition just announced. It looks like a nice little pickup, but maybe just some additional information such as maybe number of employees or customers, were they a regional player, and were they profitable?

And our next question comes from the line of Mark Chappelle with loop capital markets. Your line is open.

Thank you for taking my question, and nice job on the quarter. Lumen, I was wondering if you could just provide some additional details around emergency networking, the acquisition just announced.

Brian Miller: Yes. Thanks, Mark. That's a good question. So as we said, you know the primary solution is really in fire records and patient care reporting for EMS. Fire records has always been part of our public safety suite, but something that we actually have not been investing in significantly is we focus more on our CAD and our police records. They've got a cloud-native multi-tenant offering. We've been partners with them for probably two years to help fill that gap. And part of this is it's what we've called internally a partner-to-acquire model. So we kind of tested them out. We've got to know them as people, got to know the culture, got to experience whether or not that product is portable and can move up market the way we expected that it could, and then it's approved that. There's some new compliance standards in this space.

Uh, looks like a nice little pickup, but, uh, maybe just some additional information such as maybe number of employees or customers. Were they a regional player? Uh, and, and, and were they profitable?

Brian Miller: The space has seen a lot of consolidation recently. We talked about it being compliant with NERIS, the National Emergency Response Information System. That's where all these agencies are, most of them are on what's called NFIRS, and they're required to move in the beginning of '26. They've got that solution compliant. It's one of the things that we find really exciting about it. Shortly before, after LOI, but shortly before closing, they had just closed on a statewide Pennsylvania deal, which has garnered a lot of interest. So we think we've got the best solution out there in the market. We're excited about it. It is a small company, you know, several million in revenues, a little more than around break even. But we believe that we can take this now and do what we've done traditionally with some of these tuck-in acquisitions. It rounds out our portfolio.

Uh, yes. Uh, thanks Mark. It's a good question. So as we said you know the the primary solution is really in fire records and and patient care reporting for EMS. Um, fire records has always been part of our Public Safety Suite, um, but something that we actually have not been investing in, uh, significantly, as we focus more on our Cad and our, our, our, uh, police records. Um, it's they've got a cloud native multi-tenant offering. Um, we've been partners with them for probably 2 years to help fill that Gap. Um, and part of this is is it's it's it's what we've called internally a partner to acquire model. So we we kind of tested them out. Uh, we've got to know them, as people got to know the culture, um, got the experience, whether or not that product is portable, and can move up Market the way. We expected it that it could, and it has proved that, um, there's some new compliance standards, uh,

Brian Miller: It makes us even more competitive. And with the sort of urgency around this regulatory compliance change and what we've seen with success in the market, we're really pretty excited about it.

In this space. Um, the, the space is seen a lot of consolidation recently. Um, there's there, we talked about it being compliant with nearest, the National Emergency, uh, response information system. Um, that's where people, uh, all these agencies are, most of them are on what's called nfirs and they, they're required to move in the beginning of 26. They've got that solution compliant. Um, it's 1 of the things that we find really exciting about it shortly before after Loi, but shortly before, um, closing, uh, they had just closed on a Statewide Pennsylvania deal, um, which has garnered a lot of interest. So, um, we think we've got the, the best solution out there in the market. We're excited about it. It is a small company, um, you know, several million in revenues, uh, a little more than around Break Even. But we believe that, uh, we can take this now and do what we've done traditionally with some of these tuck in Acquisitions. It, it rounds out our portfolio. It makes us even more competitive and with the sort of urgency around this regular

Compliance change. Um, and what we've seen with success in the market, we're really pretty excited about it.

Lynn Moore: Thank you. Sounds like a nice pickup.

Thank you. Sounds like a nice pickup.

Brian Miller: And the impact is I'll add on the impact from emergency networking, although it's relatively immaterial, is included in our guidance for the year.

And the impact of, I'll add on the impact, uh, from emergency networking although it's um uh, relatively immaterial is included in our guidance for the year.

Hala Elsherbini: And our next question comes from the line of Trevor Walsh with Citizens. Your line is open.

Lynn Moore: Great. Thanks, team, for taking the question. Lynn, I appreciated all the color around kind of DOGE maybe taking a bit of a backseat or at least the noise around that diminishing and that kind of being a good, I guess, confirmation of stronger budgets at the state level. But have you seen anything, I guess, within the confines of your federal business? I know it's small, but just has that pressure released there? And maybe just in that broader question, just give us an update on kind of where the opportunities might lie as you go more towards that part of the customer base. Thanks.

And our next question comes from the line of Trevor Walsh with Citizens. Your line is open.

Points of your federal business. I know it's small but just has that pressure. Um, released there and maybe just get in that broader question. Um, just give give us an update on kind of what where the opportunities might lie.

Brian Miller: Yeah, Trevor, and you're right. Our federal business is a pretty small piece of our business, less than 5%. What we're seeing right now is that projects haven't been taken away. As you know, Q3 is the biggest quarter for that. So it's still a little TBD. But I think, generally speaking, I don't see a material change in our outlook. There will be pockets in federal, but as we mentioned in our opening remarks, while there has been some scattered stuff across our diversified portfolio, we don't view any of it as material.

Towards that, uh, part of the, uh, the customer base thanks.

Uh, yeah, Trevor and and you're right, our federal business is pretty small piece of our business less than 5%. Um, what we're seeing right now is that projects haven't been taken away? Um, as you know, Q3 is the biggest uh, quarter for that. So it's still a little TBD. Um, but I think generally speaking, um,

I don't see a material change in our Outlook. There will be Pockets um in federal, but as we mentioned, um, in in our opening remarks, um, while there has been some scattered stuff, uh, across our Diversified portfolio, uh, we don't view any of it as material.

Hala Elsherbini: And our next question comes from the line of Kirk Matern with Evercore ISI. Your line is open.

And our next question comes from the line of Kirk Matern with Evercore ISI. Your line is open.

Speaker 8: Hi. This is Bill on for Kirk, and thanks for taking my question. How should we think about trailing 12-month bookings numbers? Is it still a bit too lumpy? Should we look at it more over a trailing two-year basis?

Brian Miller: Well, the lumpiness probably does sort of point you towards looking at it over a longer basis to get a more accurate trend. We pointed out in the past, and we'll remind people that last year was a record year for SaaS bookings. We had a number of very large deals, and particularly in the third and fourth quarters. So we do face difficult comps with that just really strong that just a lot of it based on timing, but a lot of those came together in the third and fourth quarters of last year. We had large SaaS deals in courts in Arizona. We had a large resident portal deal in Maine. These were $15, $20 million kinds of deals. So I think the longer, a little bit longer look back probably gives you a more accurate trend that eliminates a little bit more of that lumpiness.

Hi. This is Phil on for Kirk and thanks for taking my question. How should we think about trailing 12 months? Bookings numbers is it still a bit too lumpy? Should we look at it more over a trailing 2-year basis?

Well, the lumpiness probably does, uh, uh, sort of point you towards looking at it over a longer basis to get a, a more accurate Trend. Um, well, we pointed out in the past, um, and we'll remind people that last year, was a record year for SAS bookings. We had a number of very large deals, um, and, and uh, particularly in the third and fourth quarter, so we we do face, uh, difficult comps, um, on, uh, with that just really strong. The just a lot of it based on timing, but a lot of those came together in the third and fourth quarters of last year. Um, we had large SAS deals in courts in Arizona, we had a large uh um

Resident portal deal in Maine, these were 15 20 million dollar kinds of deals. Um, so I think the longer um,

Brian Miller: But as we said, the pipeline, we're really happy with the pipeline, and the outlook for bookings in the second half of the year is solid. But it is up against a really tough comp from the last two quarters or last year's last two quarters. So just keep that in mind.

A little bit longer. Uh, look back, probably gives you a more accurate, uh, uh, Trend. Um, that eliminates a little bit more of that lumpiness, but as we said the pipeline, um, we're really, um, happy with the pipeline and, uh, um, the uh, the Outlook is, uh, for bookings in the second half of the year, um, is solid. But, uh, it is up against a really tough comp from the last 2 quarters or the last last year's last 2 quarters. So, um, uh,

Just keep that in mind.

Speaker 8: Great. Thanks for taking my question.

Great. Thanks for taking my question.

Hala Elsherbini: And our next question comes from the line of Keith Housem with North Coast Research. Your line is open.

Speaker 9: Good morning, guys. Hey, just a question for you on bookings. As I look at the bookings here, you know, obviously, it's not quite, you know, what you guys are growing in terms of revenue. But in terms of your revenue, what do you guys recognize as perhaps not recording your bookings? Is there a gap there in terms of payments or whatever not might you see in revenue, but not in bookings?

and our next question comes from the line of Keith how with North Coast research, your line is open

Brian Miller: Well, payments doesn't show up in bookings at all. Well, it shows up in bookings when the revenue is recognized. So if we sign a new payments deal because or or other transaction-based deal, you won't see that show up in current quarter bookings because even though the revenue stream may be very predictable and a lot of comfort around that, it is dependent on the transaction. So it doesn't go into the bookings number. So new transaction deals, and as I mentioned, we're doing regularly doing deals where we're delivering software, but it's being paid for through transaction revenues. And so those won't show up in that bookings number, but they will show up in revenue growth.

Good morning, guys. Hey, this question for you. Um, bookings. As I look at the bookings here, um, you know, obviously it's not quite, you know what you guys are growing in terms of Revenue, but in terms of your Revenue, what's the guys recognized, as perhaps not recorded in your bookings? Is there a Gap there in terms of payments or whatever? Not might, you see in Revenue but not in bookings.

Brian Miller: So there's kind of this hybrid model we have in many cases, which provides us with a strong competitive advantage of being able to deliver software and get paid under a transaction model, especially at the state level. And but that does have the impact of really kind of understating bookings, especially around the software.

Well, payments doesn't show up in bookings at all. Um, well, it shows up in bookings when the revenue is recognized. So if we sign a new payments deal because or or or other transaction based deal, um, you won't see that show up in current quarter bookings because even though the revenue stream may be very predictable, um, and uh, uh, um, a lot of, uh, Comfort around that, um, it is dependent on the transaction. So, it doesn't go into the bookings number. So, um, so new transaction deals. And as I mentioned, we're doing um, regularly doing deals that where we're delivering software, um, but it's being paid for through transaction revenues. Um, and so those won't show up in that booking as number, but they will show up in in Revenue growth. So there's there's kind of this hybrid model we have in many cases. Um, which provides us with a

Brian Miller: Yeah, Keith, like a good example, our ERP suite signed this past quarter a deal in Florida, I think with the city of I don't know how to pronounce it, of Apopka, I think, Florida. You know, that was a 370-ish thousand annual ARR for SaaS. But we expect 330,000 in transactions a year. So it's about a $700,000 a year ARR. But of course, a lot of most of that transaction doesn't show up in bookings.

Brian Miller: Another example, we signed a deal with the state of Oklahoma for our cashiering product. There is a small SaaS fee associated with it, and it's $140 some thousand dollars a year. But with transaction revenues associated with it, it's a million dollars of ARR. But all that showed up in the bookings was 144,000. So that's why we have sort of de-emphasized backlog in bookings in favor of total ARR.

Transactions a year. So it's about a 700,000, a year ARR. Um but of course a lot of most of that transaction doesn't doesn't show up in bookings. Just another example we signed a deal uh with the state of Oklahoma for our cashiering product. Um there is a small SAS fee associated with it, you know 140 some thousand dollars a year. Um but with

Transaction revenues associated with it, it's a million dollars of ARR, um, but all that showed up in the bookings was 144,000. So, um, uh,

that's why we've, um,

We have sort of deemphasized backlog in bookings, in favor of total ARR.

Hala Elsherbini: And ladies and gentlemen, that concludes our question and answer session. I will now turn the call back over to Mr. Lynn Moore for closing remarks.

Brian Miller: Great. Thanks, Abby. And thanks, everybody, for joining us today. If you have any further questions, please feel free to reach out to Brian Miller or myself. Thanks, everybody. Have a great day.

And ladies and gentlemen, that concludes our question and answer session. I will now turn the call back over to Mr. Linmore, for closing remarks.

Hala Elsherbini: And this concludes today's call, and we thank you for your participation. You may now disconnect.

Great. Thanks, Abby, and thanks, everybody, for joining us today. If you have any further questions, please feel free to reach out to Brian Miller or myself. Thanks, everybody, and have a great day.

And this concludes today's call and we thank you for your participation.

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