Q3 2025 DuPont De Nemours Inc Earnings Call

Speaker #3: Good morning, ladies and gentlemen, and thank you for standing by. My name is Kelvin, and I will be your conference operator today.

Speaker #3: At this time , I would like to welcome everyone to the third quarter 2020 earnings call . All lines have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise .

Speaker #3: After the speakers remarks , there will be a question and answer session . If you would like to ask a question during this time , simply press star , followed by the number one on your telephone keypad .

Speaker #3: If you would like to withdraw your question , please press star One again . Thank you . I would now like to turn the call over to Angie and Cristoforo .

Speaker #3: Please go ahead .

Speaker #4: Good morning and thank you for joining us for DuPont's third quarter 2025 financial results conference call . Joining me today are Lori Koch Chief executive officer and Antonella Franzen chief financial officer .

Speaker #4: We have prepared slides to supplement our remarks , which are posted on DuPont's website under the Investor Relations tab and through the webcast link .

Speaker #4: Please read the forward looking statement disclaimer contained in the slides . During this call , we will make forward looking statements regarding our expectations or predictions about the future .

Speaker #4: Because these statements are based on current assumptions and factors that involve risks and uncertainties . Our actual performance and results may differ materially from our forward looking statements .

Speaker #4: Our form 10-K as updated by our current and periodic reports , includes detailed discussion of principal risks and uncertainties which may cause such differences .

Speaker #4: Unless otherwise specified , all historical , financial measures presented today are on a continuing operations basis and exclude significant items . We will also refer to other non-GAAP measures .

Speaker #4: A reconciliation to the most directly comparable GAAP financial measure is included in our press release , and presentation materials , and has been posted to DuPont's Investor Relations website .

Speaker #4: As a quick reminder , on the basis of presentation for our third quarter financial results . Our total company net sales , operating EBITDA and adjusted EPs include segment results for Electronics Co and industrials Co , excluding results for the previously announced divestiture of the Aramids business , which is now reported as discontinued operations .

Speaker #4: I'll now turn the call over to Loree , who will begin on slide three .

Speaker #5: Good morning and thanks everyone for joining our third quarter call earlier today . We reported another solid quarter ahead of our previously communicated guidance .

Speaker #5: Third quarter sales of 3.1 billion grew 6% on an organic basis . Operating EBITDA of 840 million increased 6% year over year , resulting in an operating EBITDA margin of 27.3% .

Speaker #5: As a result of our strong third quarter financial performance and our expected operational improvements . We are raising our full year earnings guidance for the new DuPont .

Speaker #5: Antonella will provide further detail shortly . Third quarter saw organic growth across all businesses , with continued strong volume growth in healthcare and water , coupled with strength in electronics driven by AI technology .

Speaker #5: Demand in both interconnect solutions and semi . Today , we also announced Kappa allocation updates for the new DuPont . Both in the form of a quarterly dividend and a new share repurchase authorization .

Speaker #5: We declared our quarterly dividend under new DuPont in the amount of $0.20 per share , in line with our targeted 35 to 45% payout ratio .

Speaker #5: The Board of directors also approved a $2 billion share repurchase authorization , under which we expect to quickly launch an ASR in the amount of 500 million .

Speaker #5: Both of these actions underpin our commitment to a disciplined capital allocation model and are a testament to our financial strength and dedication to delivering value .

Speaker #5: Earlier this week , we announced the successful completion of the community Separation as a premier pure play technology solutions partner to the semiconductor value chain is well positioned to deliver growth and value creation for its shareholders .

Speaker #5: Turning to slide four . As part of Investor Day , I outlined a clear strategy for the new DuPont to drive value creation for all our stakeholders .

Speaker #5: Our strategy is focused around driving above market organic growth , building a robust business system , deploying a balanced allocation model , and consistently delivering results .

Speaker #5: We are already seeing progress against these value creation drivers . We have successfully repositioned ourselves and have a streamlined portfolio of leading businesses .

Speaker #5: The majority of which are aligned to secular end markets , which will enable strong organic growth . We saw nice growth in the third quarter and we continue to expect 2% organic growth for the full year .

Speaker #5: Our innovation engine continues to deliver . We announced the launch of our latest technology in Tyvek garments branded Tyvek . Apex . This latest technology for PPE provides enhanced breathability while maintaining the same level of protection and durability .

Speaker #5: The launch clearly demonstrates how we collaborate with customers and deploy our application development expertise to meet their needs . As I noted at Investor Day , we are driving towards building a robust business system , starting from a strong jump off point with a full suite of tools that are being actively deployed this quarter , we introduced a core set of enhanced KPIs that are focused on driving improvement for our shareholders , customers and employees .

Speaker #5: These KPIs were embedded in a refreshed set of management standards , which has added more visibility , rigor and structure to ensure we achieve our business objectives .

Speaker #5: On commercial excellence . We have advanced the framework across commercial enablement , sales effectiveness and strategic marketing . A key priority was focused on pipeline discipline .

Speaker #5: We have designed a more transparent , data driven process which links demand generation , opportunity , qualification and conversion metrics to deliver against our growth targets , specifically within our water business .

Speaker #5: We have taken a regional approach to the rollout and have improved pipeline rigor in North America and Europe , to sizable improvement in our opportunity funnel .

Speaker #5: We plan to launch in Asia later this quarter . We also continue to drive enhancements in operational excellence during the quarter , we rolled out an updated set of KPIs aligned with our focus on safety , quality , delivery , and cost .

Speaker #5: We also refreshed our toolkit around OE and reliability , which is driving reductions in unplanned downtime and improving our maintenance spend and wrench time on capital allocation .

Speaker #5: I highlighted earlier the dividend and share repurchase authorization that was approved by our board . In addition , we also announced in late September that we signed an agreement to acquire manufacturing capacity to expand our reverse osmosis footprint in China .

Speaker #5: This aligns with our local for local strategy and increases our capacity to meet growing demand for industrial water purification and reuse in the region .

Speaker #5: With this backdrop , I remain confident in delivering the medium term targets for 26 through 28 that we outlined for you at Investor Day .

Speaker #5: 3 to 4% organic growth , 150 to 200 basis points of margin expansion 8 to 10% EPs growth and generating strong free cash flow conversion at greater than 90% .

Speaker #5: With that , I'll now turn the call over to Antonella to cover the financials and outlook .

Speaker #4: Thank you , Larry , and good morning , everyone . We delivered another quarter of year over year growth in organic sales and operating EBITDA on volume strength across many key end markets .

Speaker #4: Operational focus by our teams drove solid financial performance in the quarter , including strong cash conversion beginning with third quarter financial highlights on slide five .

Speaker #4: Net sales of 3.1 billion increased 7% versus the year ago period on 6% organic sales growth and a 1% benefit from currency organic sales growth consisted of a 7% increase in volume , partially offset by a 1% decline in price .

Speaker #4: Organic sales included a $70 million benefit from order timing shifts into the third quarter . From the fourth quarter , due to system cutover activities in advance of the separation .

Speaker #4: Excluding this organic sales growth would have been 4% in the quarter from a segment view , both segments saw organic sales growth with industrials Co and electronics Co up 4% and 10% , respectively .

Speaker #4: All businesses had organic growth during the quarter , led by low teens . Growth in interconnect solutions , high single digit growth in both healthcare and water technologies in semi and low single digit growth in diversified industrials .

Speaker #4: We saw organic growth across all regions with North America and Asia-Pacific up 7% and Europe up 6% year over year . Third quarter operating EBITDA of 840 million increased 6% versus the year ago period as organic growth and productivity benefits were partially offset by growth investments and unfavorable mix .

Speaker #4: Operating EBITDA margin during the quarter of 27.3% was down approximately 30 basis points year over year due to unfavorable mix in electronics , Co .

Speaker #4: Turning to cash flow , we delivered transaction adjusted free cash flow of 576 million and related conversion of 126% . This was in line with our expected acceleration this quarter .

Speaker #4: Turning to slide six . Adjusted EPs for the quarter of $1.09 per share was flat with the year ago period . Higher segment earnings of $0.09 was primarily offset by a headwind from a higher tax rate year over year .

Speaker #4: Our base tax rate during the quarter was 24.6% . The prior year , base tax rate , which included discrete benefits , was 19.5% .

Speaker #4: Turning to slide seven . Industrials Co third quarter net sales of 1.8 billion were up 5% versus the year ago period on 4% .

Speaker #4: Organic growth . And a 1% benefit from currency organic growth included a benefit of approximately 30 million . In order timing shifts . Excluding this benefit , organic sales growth was 2% in the quarter .

Speaker #4: In line with our expectations for the third quarter . Health care and water sales were up high . Single digits on an organic basis versus the year ago period .

Speaker #4: Organic growth was led by continued strength in medical packaging , biopharma reverse osmosis and ion exchange , diversified industrial sales were up low single digits on an organic basis , as growth in industrial technologies was partially offset by continued softness in construction markets .

Speaker #4: Operating EBITDA for industrials Co during the quarter of 465 million was up 4% versus the year ago period on organic growth and productivity gains , partially offset by growth investments .

Speaker #4: Operating EBITA margin during the quarter was 25.9% flat , with the prior year absorbing a margin headwind from currency sequentially . Operating EBITDA margins improved 30 basis points .

Speaker #4: Turning to Electronics Co on slide eight, third quarter net sales of $1.3 billion increased 11% versus the year-ago period on 10% organic growth.

Speaker #4: And a 1% benefit from currency organic growth included a benefit of approximately 40 million . In order timing shifts . Excluding this benefit , organic sales growth was 7% in the quarter at that line of business level , organic sales for semiconductor technologies were up high .

Speaker #4: Single digits on continued strong end market demand , driven by advanced nodes and AI technology applications . Interconnect solutions also posted another strong quarter with organic sales up low .

Speaker #4: Teens , reflecting continued demand from AI driven technology ramps and benefits from content and share gains across advanced packaging and thermal management solutions .

Speaker #4: Operating EBITDA for electronics Co of 403 million was up 6% versus the year ago period , as organic growth was partially offset by growth investments to support advanced node transitions and AI technology ramps .

Speaker #4: Operating EBITDA margin during the quarter was 31.6% , down 140 basis points versus the year ago period , primarily due to unfavorable mix and currency headwinds .

Speaker #4: As a reminder , community management will host a call later today to provide a business update earlier this week , we announced the successful completion of the separation in connection with this transaction , we received approximately 4.2 billion of cash in the form of a dividend from Community , which will be used to reduce DuPont's debt and achieve the targeted capital structure that we outlined at Investor Day .

Speaker #4: Turning to slide nine , which outlines our latest view on 2025 financial guidance . As a reminder , we provided an updated view of our full year 2025 expectations , reflecting the separation of community and the presentation of the Aramids business .

Speaker #4: As discontinued operations . As part of our Investor Day in mid-September . Also in the fourth quarter , we will be reporting under a new segment Structure of Healthcare and Water Technologies and diversified industrials in the appendix to the slide deck , we have included preliminary Recasted quarterly segment information for your reference from a top line perspective , our expectation of organic sales growth for the full year remains in line with the guidance we provided at Investor Day .

Speaker #4: We expect organic sales to be up 2% year over year on strong demand in healthcare and water , partially offset by ongoing weakness in construction and markets .

Speaker #4: Our current full year sales guidance of 6.84 billion reflects slightly lower currency benefits from our prior expectations . We are raising our full year operating EBITDA guidance to 1.6 billion , driven by our stronger third quarter performance .

Speaker #4: Underlying operational improvements across the businesses and lower corporate costs . We expect full year adjusted EPs to be $1.66 per share , an increase of about 16% year over year .

Speaker #4: Our full year base tax rate is expected to be about 28% , including about 200 basis points of headwind related to total company interest expense .

Speaker #4: That cannot be reflected as discontinued operations . We continue to expect that our go forward rate will be in the 25 to 26% range , consistent with the guidance provided at Investor Day for the fourth quarter , we estimate net sales of about 1.685 billion operating EBITDA of about 385 million and adjusted EPs of $0.43 per share .

Speaker #4: Our fourth quarter guidance assumes about 1% organic growth when normalizing for the third quarter timing tax shift on a reported basis , we expect a fourth quarter organic sales decline of about 1% versus prior year , as you will recall , we provided full year 2025 pro forma estimates as part of our Investor Day to serve as a baseline for our medium term targets .

Speaker #4: Our stronger underlying performance translates into revised full year 2025 pro forma estimates for operating EBITDA of 1.63 billion and adjusted EPs of $2.02 per share , compared to the 1.6 $2,000,000,002 per share .

Speaker #4: Our lower corporate costs are accelerating our run rate towards our expected 95 million public company corporate cost structure . I want to thank our employees for remaining focused on delivering these results , and for driving the successful completion of the separation .

Speaker #4: With that , we are pleased to take your questions and let me turn it back to the operator to open the Q&A .

Speaker #3: Ladies and gentlemen , we will now begin the question and answer session . During the Q&A , we ask that you please limit your inputs to one question and one follow up .

Speaker #3: I would like to remind everyone to ask a question . Please press the start button followed by the number one on your telephone keypad .

Speaker #3: If you would like to withdraw your question , please press star one again . One moment please . For your first question , your first question comes from the line of Jeff Sprague of Vertical Research Partners .

Speaker #3: Please go ahead .

Speaker #6: Hey . Thank you . Good morning everyone . Congrats on good morning Jeff Dunn . Good morning . Thanks . Yeah just I wanted to kind of focus more on just sort of the end market trends .

Speaker #6: And there's some color on page 12 that that helps . But but first this timing benefit is this something you did or kind of , you know , pushed on behalf of your customers so they wouldn't somehow be disrupted ?

Speaker #6: Maybe just give us a little sense of like , what what was behind that ? If you don't mind .

Speaker #4: Yeah . So Jeff , kind of the way to think about it is , as you would expect , the separation that we did really touched every legal entity within the organization .

Speaker #4: So in essence , we had a like Repipe everything in all of our financial systems to do that . So our customers were notified that we would be in a blackout period in early October as we did this after quarter end , and therefore we had some orders that were originally set to go out in the October time frame that our customers accelerated into the third quarter .

Speaker #4: Given we were going to be in a blackout period . So it was completely customer driven . Again , no changes really to our expectations of what we expected from an organic growth perspective .

Speaker #4: In the second half , but it clearly , you know , created a higher organic growth in the third quarter and a lower organic growth in the fourth quarter .

Speaker #6: Yeah . And then I think you're probably intentionally didn't say anything about 2026 today . But maybe give us some initial thoughts on sort of these exit rates that we're looking at here in Q4 .

Speaker #6: Again , outlined in , you know , on page 12 , what might be sort of the the pluses and minuses as we shift into next year , particularly interested in , you know , what you're seeing in the healthcare and water businesses , especially .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So we're exiting the second half at about 2% organic growth in line with where we are for the full year . So from an end market perspective , we would expect healthcare and water to be right in line with what we gave in our medium term targets , which is about 5% organic growth on average .

Speaker #5: And then on the diversified side in the 2% that will report for the second half . Shelter is still down , so it's going to be down about 1% in the second half .

Speaker #5: But full year it's about 4% . So given that that's about 25% of our revenues , if that were to seep , to normalize to flat , that would be a nice lift .

Speaker #5: As we head into 2026 . So no material changes . You know , we put the targets out just six weeks ago . We mentioned that in order to be able to deliver against expectations , we can't start in a hole .

Speaker #5: So we would expect our medium term targets to be something that we would consistently deliver . Well , obviously be paying close attention to the construction markets , though , and see how they play out .

Speaker #6: Okay , great . Thanks . I'll leave it there .

Speaker #5: Okay , great .

Speaker #4: Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Scott Davis of Melius Research . Please go ahead .

Speaker #7: Good morning, Lori and Antonella. I'll echo what Jeff said: congrats! You guys have done a lot of wood shop in the last few years, particularly in the last few months.

Speaker #7: It's kind of a lot of moving parts and head spinning a little bit . But if we can just start with a little bit of minutia , what what's your what's your plan with the balance sheet ?

Speaker #7: I think you're something like 0.8 times pro forma leverage . Now , still have some liability issues . You got to manage . But what what is kind of the plan and target there .

Speaker #7: And will there be a you know I saw the the buyback announcement , but will there be other deals like spectrum things like that , that you guys could be potentially looking at in 26 .

Speaker #4: Yeah . So let me start with from a balance sheet perspective . So we would expect our pro forma debt to be around 3.25 billion .

Speaker #4: And Our target is to stay below two times . From that perspective , in terms of where we expect to be on the balance sheet , as you saw this morning , you know , we did announce the $2 billion share repurchase authorization , and we expect to I would say , imminently , start an ASR in the size of about 500 million that we will do .

Speaker #4: we would expect to have $1 billion of cash on the balance sheet . So our starting point , net debt to EBITDA leverage is around 1.7 times .

Speaker #4: And then clearly , as we progress during the year , as we mentioned at Investor Day , you know , we would have a balanced approach .

Speaker #4: We would continue to look at share buybacks . We would continue to look at M&A activity . But we're clearly in a very good spot from a balance sheet perspective .

Speaker #4: Quite honestly , Scott , to be able to do both , you know , we have a really strong balance sheet going in .

Speaker #4: We have the proceeds that will be coming in in the first quarter as well . And as we talked about at the Investor Day over the next three years , even accounting for dividend payments and share creep , we would have about another 500 million a year .

Speaker #4: That is deployable in free cash flow .

Speaker #5: Yeah. And on the opportunities you had mentioned, Spectrum. So we did actually complete a small tuck-in acquisition in the water space recently.

Speaker #5: So we bought row capacity in China . That really helps with our footprint there . And enabling us to be local for local .

Speaker #5: Given that China is the largest footprint for us . So we'll continue to be opportunistic . We're looking in all spaces in the health with respect to not only additional spectrum like assets in the CDMO space , but also potentially in med packaging and other areas that have nice secular growth .

Speaker #5: And then we'll also be opportunistic as we can in addition to water opportunities . So so we've got a really rich pipeline and as Antonella mentioned , the strong balance sheet to be able to be to be proactive with it .

Speaker #5: And we'll be prudent . So , you know , we'll have a profile on a return that we want to deliver . So we would get to ROIC greater than WACC by year five .

Speaker #5: And a nice path line to a to a net synergy number that is in line with with our affordability range .

Speaker #7: Okay . That's that's helpful . And then I Investor day , you talked a little bit about renewed focus on lean and operational excellence .

Speaker #7: I think you made a hire in that regard on Chief Operations. I think title, whatever you call it. But can you just talk about what you're trying to achieve on that front?

Speaker #7: I don't have a great sense of where you are today . And as it relates to lean In , the . Yeah , in your current portfolio , just talk a little bit about the opportunity and what you're planning for here .

Speaker #7: Thank you .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So we picked up Dave Cook from Danaher . So he was the ops leader for Paul . And we were fortunate to get him into our organization .

Speaker #5: And he's made an impact already . And just the couple of months that he's been here . So we started down the path a few years ago on an OpEx framework that deployed lean tools as well as some Six Sigma tools .

Speaker #5: And within a continuous improvement mindset . So we're going to take that baseline that we have and kind of put it on steroids and make sure that it's influences truly the way that we work .

Speaker #5: And so we've rolled out enhanced management standards , which really will dictate how we monitor the performance in our business . And solve problems in our businesses to make sure that we have a continuous improvement mindset .

Speaker #5: So we've identified eight core KPIs for them are shareholder or financial related . Two of them are customer related , and two of them are employee related .

Speaker #5: And they will form the basis of our our monthly business reviews and allow us to be able to understand performance and understand improvement opportunities .

Speaker #5: So it's really a cultural change around a continuous improvement mindset . Looking for net productivity opportunities , year in , year out .

Speaker #7: Interesting . Sounds interesting . Congrats on hiring David . We've heard good things . Thank you . I'll pass it on . Thanks .

Speaker #8: Great .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Steve Tusa of JP Morgan. Please go ahead.

Speaker #9: Hi . This is Chigusa Kotoku on for Steve . Thanks for taking my question . I'm just following up on the the 80 over 20 initiatives that you talked about at Investor Day on on the flip side , there's probably some opportunity to prune the portfolio around the edges .

Speaker #9: But if you can talk about any opportunities you're seeing , there would be great . Thanks .

Speaker #5: Yeah . Thanks . So we had mentioned an investor Day to as part of the team refresh , we brought in Beth Ferreira who had a background at it , who was well-versed within the 80 20 framework .

Speaker #5: And so she's actively deploying that toolkit across the diversified industrials businesses to see opportunities for us to to improve margins across that side of the portfolio .

Speaker #5: I think as far as pruning , you know , we had mentioned that we have a goal to be able to continue to work the portfolio towards more secular based end markets .

Speaker #5: And so today , we're about 50 with respect to healthcare and water . And the diversified businesses and ideally , we would be more like two thirds , one third .

Speaker #5: So I don't really want to comment on what businesses those would those would entail . But the goal is to continue to get more into the secular base .

Speaker #5: You know , mid-single digit growth .

Speaker #9: Okay . Great . Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of John McNulty of BMO Capital Markets . Please go ahead .

Speaker #10: Yeah . Good morning . Thanks for taking my question . Maybe just a quick one on the pro forma EBITDA forecast inched up a little bit .

Speaker #10: Admittedly not a huge amount , but it's it's a pretty brief amount of time . And I think you attributed it to stronger underlying business performance .

Speaker #10: I guess . Where is the area that you're being surprised on and is it on the volume front , or is it more on the cost and efficiency side ?

Speaker #10: Would you say . ?

Speaker #4: I would say it's more on the margin side . So what you see us kind of putting through in the pro formas is really how we exceeded or how we raised our guidance this year related to the segment performance that we had .

Speaker #4: So you see that kind of flowing through the performance from foremost . So it's from the margin perspective and better operational performance that we had .

Speaker #4: .

Speaker #10: Got it . Okay . And then with regard to M&A , I mean , you made the reverse osmosis asset acquisition . So clearly some things out there on your radar , you know that you're opportunistically going after I guess , can you give us a little bit more color as to what you see in the pipeline ?

Speaker #10: If there are , you know , a lot of targets out there at this point , if it's a little bit scarce , I guess how you're thinking about that .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So we have a robust pipeline . I would say it is deeper on the healthcare side than it is on the water side .

Speaker #5: Just given the the fragmentation that exists in healthcare and the consolidation that exists in water . So water there still opportunities , you know , probably to go beyond the filtrate , the water filtration assets that we have today .

Speaker #5: And to potentially other areas within the water value chain . And on the healthcare side , it's pretty deep . Just given , as I had mentioned , the fragmentation that exists on the CDMO side .

Speaker #5: So there's there's lots of players , the majority of them on both sides actually are owned by private equity . So that , gives us the opportunity to be able to transact at some versus having to try to shake something loose from a strategic .

Speaker #5: And so , so it's deep . And we we're actively pursuing opportunities and reviewing opportunities with , with our strategy and M&A teams .

Speaker #10: A great thanks very much for the call . And congratulations on the split .

Speaker #4: Thank you .

Speaker #8: Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Chris Parkinson of Wolfe Research . Please go ahead .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Chris Parkinson of

Speaker #11: much for taking my question . So when you take a step back as an independent company and you look at your strategy and margins point and market performance , whether it's this quarter or what you are forecasting or preliminary basis for 26 , what do you think the street is missing the most about the independent companies outlook ?

Speaker #11: And what are you the most enthusiastic about now that you have full independence ?

Speaker #5: Well , I think if I speak in today and now , I think the street is confused on our numbers , just given where the pre trading is .

Speaker #5: So , you know , there was a lot of noise obviously around the numbers with Aramis coming out as a disc ops and maybe consensus not getting fully reset .

Speaker #8: But we had a .

Speaker #5: Beat and raise . We beat our Q3 numbers and new DuPont raised our side of the numbers as well . So I think that's one kind of short term confusion .

Speaker #5: I think longer term it's just the view on who we are . And so I think there's still a view that potentially we're a chemical company versus we have significantly transformed the portfolio to a multi industrial .

Speaker #5: And we've got the financial performance that is right in line with the multi industrials . And so you know we would expect that we would continue to rerate up towards more of that multi industrial multiple .

Speaker #5: So I think that's one of the biggest points is that we have a much more streamlined simplified portfolio . And a refreshed team to be able to continue deliver .

Speaker #11: Got it . And just very quickly , as a follow up on to portfolio , you have a pretty well-rounded enhanced lineup of everything from ultra to Ro and everything else within the filtration side .

Speaker #11: Do you have the willingness or desire to get further into metering or anything else ? Kind of as a tangential kind of growth theme in terms of how that market is evolving over the next , you know , three , five , ten years .

Speaker #11: Just I'd love to hear about your strategy broader than it's been over the last , let's say , five or so . Thank you .

Speaker #8: Yeah , we .

Speaker #5: Do have a strategy to go beyond just the water filtration . We're obviously the largest player in all the key technologies . So to get larger there via acquisition could be tricky from a regulatory perspective , I would say metering is not one that we're actively looking at .

Speaker #5: Just given the valuations are quite high . But we are looking at opportunities more potentially either in systems plays or potentially other areas of filtration beyond just , you know , generally water .

Speaker #5: So we do have within our ion exchange resins business some water filtration around food and beverage . And microelectronics and dairy . So potentially are there some opportunities there that kind of take us beyond traditional industrial wastewater purification and desalination ?

Speaker #11: Very helpful . Thank you so much .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Josh Spector of UBS . Please go ahead .

Speaker #12: Yeah . Hi . Good morning . First , I just wanted to try to ask on the cash and the balance sheet comments .

Speaker #12: I think some of our math is that you're upcoming cash might be closer to one and a half to 2 billion before buybacks .

Speaker #12: Just given where cash sits today in fourth quarter free cash flow . I don't know if that's wrong . From the math or if the 1 billion in cash is a target .

Speaker #12: So just curious , can you help bridge us for the moving pieces between three Q and year end , please ?

Speaker #4: Yeah . So you have to keep in mind a couple of things . So one , the cash on the balance sheet at the end of Q3 is the cash position for both , you know , the new DuPont as well as community .

Speaker #4: So there is some cash that will go over to Q3 as part of the separation . So again on a pro forma basis , we expect to be at around the billion dollars is what the new DuPont will have as a cash position , which quite honestly is a pretty healthy spot to be in as we move forward , given the size of the organization .

Speaker #12: And is that before or after the ASR ?

Speaker #4: That would be before the ASR . That is our pro forma cash that we expect to keep . The other thing to keep in mind is as we get towards the end of the year , between the timing of when certain separation costs would be paid , you know , we are obviously said we're going to move pretty imminently on the ASR .

Speaker #4: So clearly that's before we get to year end . In terms of doing that . So there will be some cash out the door related to that , that will have before year end .

Speaker #4: There's also timing of separation costs . So there is the potential that by end of year we may have a little bit of commercial paper that's on hand , but clearly as we mentioned before , we do have a nice amount of proceeds coming in the door in Q1 of 26 related to the midst divestiture .

Speaker #12: Thanks . And if I could just follow up quickly on margins . I mean , you reiterated your improvement plan over the next few years .

Speaker #12: I guess assuming that the macro demand is a bit softer next year , do you see a bigger opportunity to pull forward some productivity and get more margin expansion , or is that more of a volume dependent type profile where you'd need to get a stronger macro to achieve that ?

Speaker #4: I mean , as we did our walk that we talked about on Investor Day , you know , we did have a portion of the margin expansion that would be coming from our revenue growth .

Speaker #4: And as Laurie mentioned earlier , I would keep in mind that when you look at our health care and water business , as we exit this year and go into next year , we are still in a very good position to be able to grow at mid-single digit growth .

Speaker #4: And you really only need a little bit of growth . I would say on the diversified industrial side of the house , to kind of get to , I would call it the low end of or our organic revenue growth CAGR as we move forward .

Speaker #4: So that was a piece of it . So we feel really good that we're positioned to do that . In addition , we had about 40 basis points of margin expansion over the three year period coming from the removal of our stranded costs .

Speaker #4: Clearly that's 100% in our control . And as I mentioned at the Investor Day , the plan would be to get that out by the end of year two .

Speaker #4: So you'd have that margin improvement in the first two years of the plan , and then you heard Lori talk a little bit earlier about our lean initiatives and how we're operating as a new company going forward .

Speaker #4: So we do have another additional up to 50 basis points coming from productivity , greater than inflation . And I would say , you know , the teams are doing a really good job relative to that .

Speaker #4: We even saw underlying margin improvement this quarter . And we would expect to continue to see that as we go forward .

Speaker #12: All right. Thank you.

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of John Roberts of Mizuho . Please go ahead .

Speaker #13: Thank you . Where are we on the discussions with MSCI on reclassification and will we get a pro forma balance sheet at some point , or just wait until we get the year end balance sheet for new DuPont ?

Speaker #4: Yeah . So a couple of things . Let me take the good old question first , because it's one of my favorite topics .

Speaker #4: So I would say , you know , we are continuing to make progress towards an industry classification change . As I'm sure you've seen , you know , we got there semiconductor classification , which we obviously positioned for .

Speaker #4: So that has worked out well . I would say the way that S&P and MSCI work , they do kind of wait for your publicly filed information .

Speaker #4: So I think they'll see clearly the new DuPont as we get to this upcoming 10-K filing . But we will continue to push on that .

Speaker #4: I would say the one thing that that I would always , you know , recall is that the fact that really our valuation is really going to dependent more so on our consistent performance , more than any classification .

Speaker #4: But I would tell you that I'm on a personal mission related to our ethics code, to ultimately have that appropriately reflect the DuPont portfolio that we have today in terms of pro formas.

Speaker #4: On Monday , this past Monday , we did file an 8-K that did show , you know , pro forma information . So some of that is actually already out today .

Speaker #4: And that already out as of now . And then clearly as we get to the end of the year , you know , all of our financials will clearly show both electronics and aramids as discontinued operations .

Speaker #4: So you'll have a nice 10-K with historical periods . All recasted for the new DuPont as we go forward .

Speaker #13: Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Alexey Efremov of KeyBanc Capital Markets . Please go ahead .

Speaker #14: Thanks and good morning , everyone . This is Ryan on for Alexey . Just want to echo some of the earlier comments in my congratulations on getting everything done .

Speaker #14: You know , the earlier part of the call kind of focused a lot on maybe where you could go with the portfolio , but I was hoping to kind of focus on , you know , what you currently have .

Speaker #14: And especially in the healthcare business , there's a lot of talk in the slide deck about medical packaging and biopharma . This year , but maybe we could get some additional color kind of on on what's going on in medical device space .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So we're really excited about all aspects of the portfolio . But the healthcare and water with the mid-single digit growth are areas that will continue to differentially invest .

Speaker #5: And so we saw nice growth across the broader healthcare business . And so we kind of said mid to high single digit growth on a full year basis for healthcare and water .

Speaker #5: Combined , the healthcare business would be north of that average . And so it was really a combination of nice performance across . Livio , which is our biopharma business .

Speaker #5: And so I think as you've seen across many of the peers that have exposure in biopharma . This was a nice year with like kind of completion of the destock and a return to really nice growth .

Speaker #5: We saw really nice growth in in the med packaging . And then to your question specifically on on healthcare and the med device space , we're seeing nice growth too as we exit the year .

Speaker #5: And so we actually just announced that we are bringing in a new leader for the healthcare business to lead the spectrum . And Livio businesses .

Speaker #5: He joins us from a long history of running other types of cdmos . So he starts Monday and we're really excited to have him join the portfolio as well .

Speaker #5: So we look for for nice growth from that business . And then ideally being able to be opportunistic and add to it as we go forward .

Speaker #14: Great . That's that's helpful . And then just on the construction market , you and a number of players in the space have just kind of been talking about softer market conditions .

Speaker #14: So just kind of wondering , you know , what your outlook is . I know it's still early kind of getting into 26 , but just maybe if you can give us some high level commentary about how you're thinking about it , thanks .

Speaker #4: Yeah. So, a little bit of reminders of kind of where we've been related to our shelter business. That's what's tied to the construction market.

Speaker #4: So when we look actually at 2024 , I would say we were in a relatively good position . We actually held flat with the market .

Speaker #4: And as you know , I would say over the last at least four years , we've all been in that , you know , second half of the year , recovery .

Speaker #4: And then it kind of gets punted to the next year . And those are the early thoughts I would tell you as you start to read different reports that are out there related to the construction market , that the second half of next year would start to get better .

Speaker #4: As Lori mentioned earlier , we do expect the shelter business to be down around 4% organically this year . So we do feel we're at a relatively low level at this point .

Speaker #4: You know , so we really aren't going to be expecting a significant amount of growth next year . But quite honestly , even getting to flat actually has a nice impact on our overall organic growth .

Speaker #4: So we do expect a little bit of growth in shelter next year . Again , though , off of a pretty low bottom here .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Matthew Deyoe of Bank of America . Please go ahead .

Speaker #15: Good morning everyone , yeah , congrats on the formal separation . It's been a long road . I think if we look under the surface at New pro forma industrial Co , I think the comment was industrial organic sales were plus 4% extra .

Speaker #15: You know , and then 2% ex the pull forward . Can you just parse that out a little bit on the segment basis .

Speaker #15: Just trying to get a sense for like volume and price in healthcare and water versus diversified industrials . Co you know , just trying to get a little bit more granularity on what the pro forma business is doing here .

Speaker #4: Yep . So on a reported basis , healthcare and water were up high single digits . I would say if you kind of adjusted that for the pull forward impact , we were at mid-single digits and diversified industrials was up on a reported basis organically in the low single digits .

Speaker #4: And I would say if you adjust for the pull forward , I would have been pretty relatively flat .

Speaker #15: All right . And then you said shelter was minus four on the year as we just look at like three Q into 4QI can't I'm not sure if you said it or not , but like where is where is that construction business ?

Speaker #15: Comping . Is it like minus two minus three in in this quarter or in three Q or maybe a little bit more help there .

Speaker #4: Yeah , I would say , you know , in the third quarter , you know , relative to the pull forward we had , it was like down around 2% .

Speaker #4: We do expect as we get into the fourth quarter , we're down more in that , you know , 3 to 4% range .

Speaker #4: But I would say, when you look at the overall 4% for the year, we were down more in the first half of the year than we are in the second half of the year.

Speaker #15: Thank you for the context . I appreciate it .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Vincent Andrews of Morgan Stanley . Please go ahead .

Speaker #16: Hey , good morning and congrats . This is Turner Hendrix on for Vincent . I was just wondering if you could provide some color on your confidence in the 3 to 4% top line algorithm for 2026 ?

Speaker #5: Yeah . So , you know , as we had mentioned , we don't expect to start in the hole to be able to achieve our medium term targets of 3 to 4% over the 26 to 28 time frame .

Speaker #5: So if we look at our performance in the in the second half of 2025 , which can be an indicator of what you might be looking into in the beginning of 2026 , our healthcare and water business is performing in line with our medium term targets .

Speaker #5: So with that being , you know , around the 5% , about half our company , so you get 2.5% organic growth straight from that .

Speaker #5: And as we had mentioned , the shelter business , which is about 25% of portfolio in the second half , is down about 2.5% .

Speaker #5: We don't expect it to continue to be down next year , but we're not really expecting any material growth . But just the absence of a negative brings an opportunity incrementally from the second half .

Speaker #5: And as as we look at the rest of the industrial tech portfolio , which makes up about 30% , we would expect to see sort of , you know , at minimum low single digit growth .

Speaker #5: We had mentioned the whole portfolio should be at average 2% for the industrial technology side . And so if you take that piece , you can generally only get to your medium term targets at the midpoint range with really just the big inflection point being cooperation of the shelter markets and no longer being a drag on the total organic growth .

Speaker #16: Great , great . Appreciate the color . And I wanted to circle back as well on the building . And construction discussion . Specifically on the NC margins .

Speaker #16: How are they ? How much are they holding the segment margin back at this point , given the weakened demand environment and how much lift could there be if conditions begin to improve ?

Speaker #16: And would this be in addition to the 150 to 200 basis point improvement that you all are targeting , targeting for 2028 overall ?

Speaker #4: Yeah , I would actually say I believe you mentioned the construction market . So the shelter business , I would say overall actually the business has actually been doing pretty well from a margin perspective .

Speaker #4: So I would do a nice shout out and kudos to the team that despite the fact that , you know , volume has been down , they have been significantly driving productivity .

Speaker #4: Watching costs , making sure that , you know , we are positioned for the current market environment that we're in . So that should set us up nicely , nicely for when we get back to being in growth mode in the construction space .

Speaker #16: Great . Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Patrick Cunningham of Citigroup . Please go ahead .

Speaker #17: Hi . Good morning everyone . This is Rachael Leigh on for Patrick . Can you expand more on the strategic rationale for the row acquisition in China ?

Speaker #17: Understand it enables you to be more local for local , but can you touch more on the technology value add perspective and specifically what you're seeing in terms of water market growth in China ?

Speaker #5: Yeah . So the acquisition was more one of a capacity add . So on the ion exchange side , we've got five different plants across the globe .

Speaker #5: So we're able to be local for local on the row side . Prior to this acquisition we really had membrane capacity really only at one spot for the most part in in the US .

Speaker #5: And nothing , nothing outside of the US of any materiality . And we had started to build fabrication capabilities outside the US through contract manufacturers .

Speaker #5: And we had established capabilities within the Asia Pacific region . But it was really important that we also get membrane capacity in Asia , just given that it's about a third of our sales and there's , you know , growing local for local preferences in the region .

Speaker #5: So it really doesn't give us any additional technology . We've got the leading technologies that will continue to protect here in the US operations .

Speaker #5: It just gives us more local production capabilities for membrane within the China region .

Speaker #17: Got it . That's that's very helpful . And then going to diversified industrials side , it seems like organic sales grew better than expectations due to industrial technologies .

Speaker #17: Can you touch more on maybe how auto aerospace or other businesses perform better than prior expectations . Thank you .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So on the diversified side , we had a little bit better performance than we had expected . A lot of that was related to the timing shift .

Speaker #5: So for my full year perspective on organic basis , we continue to expect to be at 2% . And it really hasn't materially changed across any of the lines of business are reporting units , but to your question , we did see nice improvement on the kind of general next gen mobility space , which would include both the automotive and the aerospace side .

Speaker #5: So we had mentioned at Investor Day , I believe that we are starting to feel a little bit momentum building in the auto space .

Speaker #5: And we saw that play out in Q3 . And so that revisions that have been happening in the last few months have been improving with respect to auto builds .

Speaker #5: And so we're cautiously optimistic that we keep on pace there . And the improvement that we've been seeing . More importantly , has been in the US and North America markets , which is where we're outsized .

Speaker #5: Exposure is versus China . So we'll remain optimistic on the automotive piece . And then the EV piece that we've talked about , too , continues to perform really well .

Speaker #5: So we've got share gains realized and more opportunities coming in the pipeline with one opportunities with with the EV battery space .

Speaker #17: Thanks very much .

Speaker #3: Your next question comes from the line of Mike Season of Wells Fargo . Please go ahead .

Speaker #18: Hey good morning and congrats as well . Just curious , I think the case to change the code is pretty straightforward . But if it doesn't change , it stays in chemicals .

Speaker #18: Why do you think that is ? And then if you are stuck with us , you know , who do you think would be good comps relative to your performance ?

Speaker #18: You know , for investors to look at , is it more like an Ecolab or Sherwin ? Just , you know , just curious if that if that sort of scenario unfolds .

Speaker #4: Yeah . So I would say it's not a straightforward process . One might think that it should be , but it's clearly not in terms of having the classification change .

Speaker #4: So as I mentioned earlier , we will continue down that path at the end of the day , our performance will drive our valuation , and that's what we're focused on .

Speaker #4: So as an organization , nothing will change in terms of our strategy , how we're expected to perform and what we would do relative to peers .

Speaker #4: Quite honestly , none of the chemical peers would be our peers that we should be compared to . I mean , we just have very different portfolios , so there is no comparison to the others that are listed within specialty chemicals .

Speaker #4: We would continue to say for no matter who's following us and reporting on us , that at the end of the day , you really got to look at the multi industrial peers to kind of compare our performance .

Speaker #18: Got it . Thank you .

Speaker #3: Your last question comes from the line of Aaron Viswanathan of RBC Capital Markets . Please go ahead .

Speaker #19: Yeah thanks for taking my question . You commented on you know , maybe some some details on your healthcare portfolio . Could you also comment on the water side ?

Speaker #19: You guys recently completed that acquisition in China . What else are you guys looking at ? And I guess how how are you prioritizing capital allocation towards this business ?

Speaker #19: Thanks .

Speaker #5: Yeah . So on the on the water space and we'll look to see if we can be opportunistic to add to our filtration water filtration capabilities .

Speaker #5: But as I mentioned they might be a little bit more minimal because of the consolidation that exists in the space as well as our market leadership positions have across the core technology .

Speaker #5: So we'll look more broadly into potentially systems plays or some services plays . I had mentioned that probably would be off the table just given the high valuations that come along with those assets , and we'll continue to be prudent to ensure that we can get a return that's in line with our expectations .

Speaker #5: But , you know , I think that the pipeline is rich on both sides to healthcare and water will differentially invest in those businesses , both from an R&D and a capital perspective , to ensure that we're getting outsized returns .

Speaker #5: And we'll bias our M&A activity towards those businesses as well .

Speaker #19: Thanks .

Speaker #3: There are no further questions at this time . And with that , I will turn the call back to Angie and Cristoforo for closing remarks .

Speaker #3: Please go ahead .

Speaker #5: Great .

Speaker #20: Thank you , everyone for joining our call for your reference , a copy of our transcript will be posted on DuPont's website . This concludes today's call .