Q3 2025 TFI International Inc Earnings Call

Speaker #1: Good day, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by. Welcome to TFI International's third quarter 2025 earnings call. At this time, all participant lines are in the listen-only mode.

Operator: Good day, ladies and gentlemen. Thank you for standing by. Welcome to TFI International's Q3 2025 earnings call. At this time, all participant lines are in the listen-only mode. Following the presentation, we will conduct a question-and-answer session. Callers will be limited to one question and one follow-up. Again, that's one question and one follow-up so that we can get to as many callers as possible. Further instructions for entering the queue will be provided at that time. Please be advised that this conference call may contain statements that are forward-looking in nature and subject to a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. I would also like to remind everyone that this conference call is being recorded on October 31, 2025. Joining us on the call today are Alain Bédard, Chairman, President, and Chief Executive Officer, and David Saperstein, Chief Financial Officer.

Speaker #1: Following the presentation, we will conduct a question-and-answer session. Callers will be limited to one question and one follow-up. Again, that's one question and one follow-up, so that we can get to as many callers as possible.

Speaker #1: Further instructions for entering the queue will be provided at that time. Please be advised that this conference call may contain statements that are forward-looking in nature and subject to a number of risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially.

Speaker #1: I would also like to remind everyone that this conference call is being recorded on October 31st, 2025. Joining us on the call today are Alain Bedard, Chairman, President, and Chief Executive Officer, and David Saperstein, Chief Financial Officer.

Speaker #1: I would now like to turn the call over to Alain Bedard. Please go ahead, sir.

Operator: I would now like to turn the call over to Alain Bédard. Please go ahead, sir.

Speaker #2: Well, thank you, for the introduction. Operator, and welcome everyone to this morning's call. Last evening, we reported our quarterly results that show additional progress with operating margins, especially for our US LTL.

Alain Bédard: Thank you for the introduction, Operator, and welcome everyone to this morning's call. Last evening, we reported our quarterly results that show additional progress with operating margins, especially for our US Less-Than-Truckload. In fact, across our entire company, the men and women of TFI International doubled down on our core operating principle, which is setting us up nicely for the eventual rebound in freight volumes. I'm also pleased with our free cash flow performance, as this is always one of our top priorities. At more than $570 million year-to-date, this was slightly above the nine-month results from 2024. We use our strong free cash flow to strategically invest in the long-term and, whenever possible, return the excess to shareholders.

Speaker #2: In fact, across our entire company, the men and women of TFI International doubled down on our core operating principle, which is setting us up nicely for the eventual rebound in trade volumes.

Speaker #2: I'm also pleased with our free cash flow performance as this is always one of our top priorities. At more than 570 million year to date, this was slightly above the nine-month results from 2024.

Speaker #2: We use our strong free cash flow to strategically invest in the long-term and, whenever possible, return the excess to shareholders. Speaking of which, as you may have seen in our press release yesterday, our board approved a 4% increase in our quarterly dividend to 47 cents per share, suggesting a yield of close to, 2%.

Alain Bédard: Speaking of which, as you may have seen in our press release yesterday, our board approved a 4% increase in our quarterly dividend to $0.47 per share, suggesting a yield of close to 2%. Equally important, during and subsequent to the quarter, we repurchased additional shares, which I'll speak to in a moment, while maintaining a very solid balance sheet. With that, let's review our overall Q3 results. We generated total revenue before fuel surcharge of $1.7 billion, and that compares to $1.9 billion in the year-ago quarter. In aggregate, we produced $153 million of operating income, or a margin of 8.9%. We've recorded an adjusted net income of $99 million as compared to $134 million in Q3 of 2024, and an adjusted EPS of $1.20 relative to $1.58 in the year-ago quarter.

Speaker #2: Equally important, during and subsequent to the quarter, we repurchased additional shares, which I'll speak to in a moment. While maintaining a very solid balance sheet, let's review our overall third quarter results.

Speaker #2: We generated total revenue before fuel surcharge of 1.7 billion and that compares to 1.9 billion in the year-ago quarter. In aggregate, we produced 153 million of operating income, or a margin of 8.9%.

Speaker #2: We recorded adjusted income of $99 million compared to $134 million in the third quarter of 2024, and an adjusted EPS of $1.20, relative to $1.58 in the year-ago quarter.

Speaker #2: Rounding out our consolidated results, our net cash from operating activities came in at $255 million, up sequentially but down from $351 million in the same quarter last year.

Alain Bédard: Rounding out our consolidated results, our net cash from operating activities came in at $255 million, up sequentially, but down from $351 million in the same quarter last year. Finally, our free cash flow from Q3 was nearly $200 million, also up sequentially. In addition, as I mentioned, this brought our year-to-date free cash flow to just over $570 million. Overall, when I look at our consolidated performance, first and foremost, I recognize the hard work of our team, with everyone across our segments working to make the most out of a subdued freight environment and, most importantly, setting us to capitalize on the next cycle. How did they do this? They focused on long-held core operating principle, ensuring quality of revenue and aiming for constantly improving efficiencies. Additionally, as we make meaningful progress on service improvement in U.S.

Speaker #2: And finally, our free cash flow from the third quarter was nearly 200 million, also up sequentially. In addition, as I mentioned, this brought our year-end to date free cash flow to just over 570 million.

Speaker #2: So overall, when I look at our consolidated performance, first and foremost, I recognize the hard work of our team, with everyone across our segments working to make the most out of a subdued frail environment and, most importantly, setting us to capitalize on the next cycle.

Speaker #2: How did they do this? Well, they focus on long-held core operating principle, ensuring that quality of revenue and aiming for consistent constantly improving efficiencies.

Speaker #2: Additionally, as we make meaningful progress on service improvement in U.S. LTL, it's gratifying to see the team recognized in this regard by leading third-party customer research firms.

Alain Bédard: LTL, it's gratifying to see the team recognized in this regard by leading third-party customer research firms. We very much appreciate their hard work. Now, let's take a closer look at each of our three business segments, beginning with LTL. This quarter, our LTL operation represented 40% of segmented revenue before fuel surcharge, which was down 11% versus a year ago to $687 million. Notably, our U.S. LTL operation showed additional progress on margin for a second quarter in a row, producing a 92.2 OR, which matched the performance of a year earlier. Total LTL operating income of $78 million was up sequentially from the second quarter, but compared to $96 million a year earlier. Our combined operating ratio for LTL was 88.8, and that's also improved sequentially, in fact, for the second quarter in a row, but still compared to 87.3 in the prior year Q3.

Speaker #2: So we very much appreciate their hard work. Now, let's take a closer look at each of our three business segments, beginning with LTL. This quarter, our LTL operation represented 40% of segmented revenue before fuel surcharge, which was down 11% versus a year ago, to $687 million.

Speaker #2: Notably, our U.S. LTL operation showed additional progress on margin for a second quarter in a row, producing a 92.2 OR, which matched the performance of a year earlier.

Speaker #2: Total LTL operating income of $78 million was up sequentially from the second quarter, but compared to $96 million a year earlier. Our combined operating ratio for LTL was 88.8, and that's also improved sequentially.

Speaker #2: In fact, for the second quarter in a row, but still compared to 87.3 in the prior year, third quarter. Our return investor capital for LTL was 11.9.

Alain Bédard: Our return on invested capital for LTL was 11.9%. Turning to Truckload, it was 39% of segmented revenue before fuel surcharge at $684 million, which compared to $723 million in the year-ago quarter, with tariff impacts on steel and other commodities still waiting on freight volumes. Operating income of $53 million compares to $70 million last year, and our Truckload OR came at 92.3 versus 90.6. Lastly, our Truckload return on invested capital was 6% for the quarter. Our third and final segment to discuss is Logistics, which produced $368 million revenue before fuel surcharge, or 21% of segmented revenue, and this compared to $426 million in the Q3 of 2024. Operating income came in at $31 million versus $49 million last year, and this represents a margin of 8.4% versus 11.4%. Our Logistics return on invested capital was 14.6%.

Speaker #2: Turning to truckload, it was 39% of segmented revenue before fuel surcharge at 684 million, which compared to 723 million in the year-ago quarter, with tariff impacts on steel and other commodities still waiting on freight volumes.

Speaker #2: Operating income of $53 million compares to $70 million last year, and our truckload operating ratio came in at 92.3 versus 90.6. Lastly, our truckload return on invested capital was 6% for the quarter.

Speaker #2: Our third and final segment to discuss is logistics, which produced 368 million dollars of revenue before fuel surcharge, or 21% of segmented revenue. And this compared to 426 million in the third quarter of 2024.

Speaker #2: Operating income came in at 31 million versus 49 million last year, and this represents a margin of 8.4 versus 11.4. Our logistic return investor capital was 14.6.

Speaker #2: So next, I'll move on to our balance sheet, which remains very strong, benefiting from the free cash flow I mentioned of nearly 200 million during the quarter and more than 570 million year to date, which is stronger than last year.

Alain Bédard: Next, I'll move on to our balance sheet, which remains very strong, benefiting from the free cash flow I mentioned of nearly $200 million during the quarter and more than $570 million year-to-date, which is stronger than last year. We end up September with a funded debt-to-EBITDA ratio of 2.4 times. From this position of strength, we were able to not only pay our dividend, which, as I mentioned, the board agreed to raise today, but we also repurchased a total of $67 million worth of shares during the quarter. That brought our total return of capital to shareholders to more than $100 million during the Q3 alone.

Speaker #2: We end up September with a funded debt to EBITDA ratio of 2.4 times. From this, position of strength, we're re able to not only pay our dividend, which I mentioned the board agreed to raise today, but we also repurchased a total of 67 million worth of shares during the quarter.

Speaker #2: That brought our total return of capital to shareholders to more than 100 million during the third quarter alone. As I mentioned, at the outset, this is one of our key business principles to return excess cash to shareholders, whenever possible, and I should add that subsequent to Q3, we also have repurchased an additional 17 million worth of share, as we continue to effectively reduce our share counts.

Alain Bédard: As I mentioned at the outset, this is one of our key business principles to return excess cash to shareholders whenever possible, and I should add that subsequent to Q3, we also have repurchased an additional $17 million worth of shares as we continue to effectively reduce our share count. Before we turn to Q&A, I'll provide a Q4 outlook. We expect Q4 adjusted diluted EPS to be in the range of $0.80 to $0.90. We now expect full-year net capex, excluding real estate, to be $100 to $175 million compared to $200 million earlier. Similar to last quarter, I'll note that our outlook assumes no significant change, either positive or negative, in the actual operating environment. With that, Operator, David and I would be happy to take questions. If you could please open the lines.

Speaker #2: So before we turn to Q&A, I'll provide a fourth quarter outlook. We expect fourth quarter adjusted diluted EPS to be in the range of 80 to 90 cents.

Operator: Thank you, Mr. Bédard. Ladies and gentlemen, if you do have any questions at this time, as stated, please press star one on your touch-tone phone. You will then hear a prompt that your hand has been raised. Should you wish to decline from the polling process, please press star followed by two. If you're using a speakerphone, you will need to lift the handset first before pressing any keys. Out of consideration to other callers on the line today and time allotted, we ask again that you please limit yourself to one question, one follow-up, and get back into the queue. Thank you. Your first question will be from Ravi Shankar at Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead, Ravi.

[Analyst 1]: Great. Thanks. Morning, Alain and David. Alain, I would love your overall thoughts on the state of the Less-Than-Truckload market today. Obviously, macro still remains pretty depressed, but you guys are taking idiosyncratic actions as well. If you just could address kind of where do you think volumes are going, what do you think the pricing environment is like, that'd be great.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Very good question, Ravi. I think that most of our peers so far, I mean, we're off to a very slow start in Q4 with all kinds of reasons. I mean, we have this special situation in the U.S. with the government shutdown and things like that. I mean, we anticipate that probably in our guidance, what we have in there is Q4 versus Q3, we'll probably see a deterioration of the OR between 200 to 300 basis points because of this slow environment, slow volume environment.

Alain Bédard: Now, going into 2026, we're starting to have a feeling that after three years of very, very hard, difficult freight recession, we believe that finally all the effect of that big, beautiful bills and the fact that the consumer will probably get some tax refund, etc., etc., the investment that will probably take place in the industrial sector in the U.S., we feel way, way, way better about 2026 than what we went through about 2025. What we were able to do with Q4 straight, I think it's a confirmation that the new team is really all hands on deck. We've been working on our costs. We've also been working and improving our service. That's been confirmed by the famous Mastio report. We are improving. We still have a lot of work to do, but still we're heading in the right direction.

Alain Bédard: I'm very happy with the team, with what the guys are working on right now. We're looking at 2026. We need to do some major investment in AI to help us reduce our costs and be more efficient, provide a better service. In that regard, we have some projects that should take place in 2026. Q4 2025, difficult all over for us, I believe, but I think that finally the sun is going to start coming up in 2026.

That's been confirmed by the famous Master report that we are improving, we're still have a lot of work to do, but still we're we're heading in the right direction. And and, and I'm very happy with the team with what the guys are working on right now. Uh, you know, we're looking at, uh, uh, 26, uh, we need to do some major investment in AI, okay? To help us reduce our costs and be more efficient provide a better service. Uh so in that regards we we have some some projects that should take place in 26. So I mean 2 425 difficult all over for us.

Believe, but I think that finally, the Sun is going to start coming up in 26.

[Analyst 1]: Understood. That's really helpful. I just got to very quickly address that as well, but if you can just talk about the progress you made with kind of fixing some of the internal initiatives in the Less-Than-Truckload business, how far along are you and kind of what do you think are the next few steps we can expect in the next quarter or two?

Alain Bédard: Yeah. One of the first things that we did, Ravi, with Cal and his team there, is we fixed the small and medium-sized business where we were way, we've lost too much of that in 2024. When Cal took it over with Chris and the rest of the team there, they said, "We definitely need to change that," right? What you see there in Q3 and also the improvement in Q2, some of that is the improved quality of revenue, quality of freight that we do. That's basically step number one. Step number two is we were a little bit too relaxed on some aspect of our business. For instance, our approach with temp account was, you deliver the freight and hope to get paid when an account does not exist with you. I don't think anyone is doing that, right? We were an exception in the U.S.

So, the 3 helpful, uh, I'm just going to give you very quickly address that as well. But uh, if you can just talk about the progress you made with, uh, kind of fixing some of the internal initiatives in the LTL business, uh, how far along are you and kind of, uh, what do you think are the, uh, next few steps we can expect in the next quarter or 2?

Alain Bédard: We fixed that in Q2 and for the rest of the year. Now if you order at Q4 straight and you have a shipment, we don't know who's going to be paying the bill. We hold on to the freight until we know who actually is going to be paying that bill. That's also another improvement that, because of past procedures, we were losing a lot of dollars because of that negligence of our process at the time. Now, we've hired a guy to run our fleet management team. I'll give you just a small example. Last meeting we had the other day in Dallas, it used to be that a truck, Q4 straight, gets into a shop and that truck is stuck there for 85 hours. Now we're down to about 45 hours. It's still too much, but that helps the cost because now the truck is available.

Yeah, well 1 of the first thing that we did Ravi with Cal and his team there is, we fixed this small and medium size business where we were way, we've lost too much of that in 24. And when Cal took it over with Chris and the rest of the team there, they said, well, we we definitely need to change that. Right? So what you see there, okay, in Q3 and also the Improvement in Q2, some of that is the improved quality of Revenue quality or Freight that we do. So that's basically step number 1, Step number 2 is, you know, we were a little bit too relaxed on on some aspect of our business. So for, for instance, our approach us with temp account was, you know, you deliver the freight and hope to get paid okay, when when an account does not exist with you. Uh, well, I don't think No 1 is doing that, right? So we were an exception in us, we fixed that in Q2. And and, and for the rest of the year,

Alain Bédard: You don't have to rent a truck for five days or six days because now, instead of being stuck there for like two weeks, now the truck is stuck there for now a week, right? These are all these small details that Cal and the team there are looking at. We have a new team also that's focusing on claims because our claim ratio at 0.7% of revenue is not good. I mean, it's never been good. We have to do something. If you look at our claim ratio in Canada, we're always in that 0.2% of revenue, which is normal, right? We're at 0.7%. Now we have a team that focuses on that day in, day out, in trying to get that 0.7% down to a more normal level, right? These are all small things that the guys are doing.

So now if you order, okay, T Force Freight and you have a shipment, we don't know who's going to be paying the bill, so we hold on to the freight until we know who actually is going to be, you know, paying that bill. So that's also another Improvement that, you know, because of past procedures. Uh, we were losing a lot of of dollars because of that, uh, negligence of of a, of our, you know, process at the time now. Also, we, we've hired a guy okay to run our Fleet Management, uh, team and I'll give you just a small example. Last meeting we had the other day in Dallas. Uh, it used to be that a truck, a T4 Street getting into a shop and that truck is stuck there for 85 hours. Well, now we're down to about 45 hours. It's still too much but that helps okay the cost because now the truck is available. So you don't have to rent a truck for 5 days or or 6 days because now

Instead of being stuck there for like 2 weeks now he the truck is stuck there for now a week right. So these are all these small details that tell and the team there are are looking at uh you know we have a new team also that's focusing on claims because our claim ratio at 0.7% of Revenue is not good. I mean it's never been good. Uh so we have to do something. If you look at our claim ratio in Canada, we're always in.

Alain Bédard: We'll be announcing also, Ravi, very soon, probably next week, that now within Q4 straight, we have. One executive that's going to be a Chief Commercial Officer for all of our Less-Than-Truckload operation in the U.S. This is because our focus is on quality of revenue, growing the number of shipments, and this is what I think that we will start to see in 2026.

1 Executive. That's going to be a chief commercial officer for all of our LTL operation in the US. So again, this is because our focus is on, you know, quality of Revenue growing, the number of shipments and this is what I think that we will start to see in 26.

[Analyst 1]: Very helpful. Thank you, Alain.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure, Ravi.

Very helpful. Thank you.

Pleasure, Robbie.

Operator: Next question will be from Jordan Alliger from Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead, Jordan.

[Analyst 2]: Hi. Thanks. Just maybe just following up on that, it sounds like real progress is being made, which is great. Hopefully next year will be better in terms of the underlying demand. In the context of that, how do you think now that sort of maybe it's getting to that point, how do you think either incremental margins or where Less-Than-Truckload or in the U.S. could ultimately get to? I mean, do you have any updated thoughts on that? Because clearly what you've done has improved the company versus the last time we had strength in the Less-Than-Truckload market.

Next question will be from Jordan alleger. From Goldman Sachs, please. Go ahead Jordan

Hi yeah, thanks. So I just maybe just following up on that sounds like um, real progress is being made which is great. So you know hopefully next year I'll be better and uh in terms of the underlying demand so in the context of that, you know, how do you think now that sort of maybe it's it's getting to that point. How do you think either incremental margins or where LTL or in the US could ultimately get to? I mean do you have any updated thoughts on that? Because clearly

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. Absolutely, Jordan. If you look at our U.S. Less-Than-Truckload versus our Canadian Less-Than-Truckload, in Canada, we have a deep bench and we've been at it for a long time. In the U.S., don't forget, we're in that business since we bought TForce Freight. Now we're beefing up our talent team, and that's going to help go through that period that hopefully is going to be some tailwind for the Less-Than-Truckload industry in general. We'll be, I think, well positioned to take advantage of that. The focus at TFI International with every business unit has always been do more with less, okay?

What you've done, you know, is improve the company versus the last time we had strengths in the LTL Market.

Yeah, yeah yeah, yeah, absolutely Jordan, then, and you know, we if you look at our us LTL versus our Canadian lto I mean in Canada, we have a deep bench and we've been at it for a long time in the US. I mean, don't forget, we're in that business since we bought UPS Freight and, and now we're beefing up our talent team, you know.

Alain Bédard: This is why, like I said earlier to Ravi, we are really focused in 2026, what kind of implementation we could do with the new AI tools that are available to be in a position to do a better job, provide better service at a better cost for all of our customers. There, I'm not just talking about Q4 straight, our Less-Than-Truckload, I'm talking about our Package and Courier in Canada, our PNC business in Canada. I'm talking also about our Truckload operation in the U.S. This is really going to be a big focus of ours in 2026 because now, contrary to 2024, this AI thing there is really something that's going to change a lot of stuff. We know that down the road, I don't know if it's 10 years from now, you'll be probably able to drive a truck with other drivers, right?

And uh and that's going to help go through that that period. That hopefully is going to be some Tailwinds for the LTL industry in general. And we'll be, I think well positioned to take advantage of that. But the focus of TFI with every business unit is always been do more with less, okay? And this is why, like I said, earlier to Ravi when is we are really focused in 26, what kind of implementation we could do with these new AI tools that are available to be be in a position to do a better job. Provide better service at a better cost for all of our customers and their I'm not just talking about t Force rate or LTL. I'm talking about our package in Canada our PNC business in Canada. I'm talking also about our truck load operation in the US you know this is really going to be a big focus of ours in 26 because now contrary

To 24. This AI thing there is really something that's going to change a lot of stuff. I mean we know that down the road.

Alain Bédard: When you think about that, all the edge that a non-union carrier has versus a union carrier, that edge down the road will probably disappear, right? It's like, this is 10, 15 years from now, I don't know. One thing is for sure is that us, we are embracing AI big time. We'll be investing on that. That's a big focus of ours in 2026. This market has been difficult for us for the last three years, okay? Hopefully the market turns in 2026. We don't control that. What we can control is our cost and our focus. This is something that I'm reviewing the plan for 2026 as we speak, next two weeks. It's a big focus of ours, Jordan.

I don't know if it's 10 years from now, okay? You'll probably be able to drive a truck with another driver, right? So when you think about that, you know, all the edge that a non-union carrier has versus a union carrier. Well, that edge down the road will probably disappear, right? It's like, you know, but this is...

[Analyst 2]: Okay. Great. I mean, I guess suffice it to say, I mean, without necessarily putting a number then and a time frame, I would suspect given what you've done, when we do get to a positive volume environment, you'd expect fairly quick reaction to the operating ratio to the improvement.

10, 15 years from now, I don't know. But 1 thing is for sure, is that us, we are embracing AI, big time will be investing on that. That's, that's a big focus of ours in 26. This Market has been difficult for us for the last 3 years, okay? Hopefully, the market turns in 26, we don't control that but what we can control is our cost and uh and our focus and this is this is something that you know I'm reviewing the plan for 26 as we speak uh next next 2 weeks. So it's it's a big focus of ours. Jordan

Okay, great. Um, I mean, I guess, suffice it to say I mean without necessarily putting a number then

um, and and the time frame, I I would suspect given what you've done when we do get to a positive volume environment, you'd expect

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah. For sure. Because don't forget, you know what, Jordan, if you look at what we were able to do with, sadly, 10% less top line in our U.S. Less-Than-Truckload. We maintained the same OR as the previous year, 92.2. That tells you the heavy lifting that our guys are doing today and becoming more process-oriented. I'll give you another example. Shipping shippers' load and count. You get a trailer and the load and count is from the shipper. If you don't check, maybe there's a mistake. We were too relaxed on that. Now Cal and the team say, "No more. No more." This is, we get a full trailer from the shipper, we have to check. If there's a shortage, we have to tell the customer right away and not wait and then get a claim three months down the road because there was a shortage.

Fairly, um, quick reaction to the operating ratio to the Improvement.

Yeah, yeah for sure because don't forget, you know what, George? If you look at what we were able to do. Okay with sadly, 10% less Top Line. Okay. In our us, LTL

And we maintain the same War as the previous year.

Uh, 92.2.

So that tells you the heavy lifting that our guys are doing today, okay? And and becoming, you know, more process oriented, you know, for I I'll give you another example. Shipping shippers loading count. Okay, so you get a trailer and the load and count is from the shipper, but if you don't check, maybe there's a mistake.

down the road, because there was a shortage

Alain Bédard: I mean, this is just being professional in our business, right?

I mean, this is just being professional in our business, right?

[Analyst 2]: Got it. Thank you very much.

Got it. Thank you very much.

Operator: Next question will be from Scott Group at Wolfe Research. Please go ahead, Scott.

Next question will be from Scott group at Wolf research. Please. Go ahead Scott.

[Analyst 3]: Hey, thanks. Good morning. I wanted to see if we can dig into the fourth quarter guidance a little bit. I think I heard you say, Alain, that the U.S. Less-Than-Truckload margins, 200 to 300 basis points worse, it's sort of hard to get all the way to that, to your guidance, unless I guess the rest of the business is doing particularly badly. Maybe, I don't know, you or David, maybe just walk us through some of the segment expectations that could be helpful.

Hey, thanks. Uh, good morning. So I wanted to see if we can dig into the fourth quarter guidance a little bit. So it's, I think I heard you say, Alain, that the U.S. LTL margins.

2 to 300 basis points, worse. It's, it's sort of

hard to get all the way to that, to, to your guidance, unless, like, the, I guess the rest of the business is doing, uh, particularly bad, uh, badly. Um, maybe I don't know you or Dave and maybe just walk us through some of like, the, the

Alain Bédard: You know what, Scott? That's a very good question. I've got David next to me. He's the Chief Financial Officer. I think I'm going to let that to David. He's the numbers guy.

Segment expectations that that could be helpful.

David Saperstein: Yeah. Hi, Scott. Embedded in that guidance is a U.S. LTL OR in Q4 of 96%. Specialized Truckload between 93% and 94%, and Logistics also between 93% and 94%. That Logistics piece is down substantially. When you run the numbers on what that suggests year over year, operating income contribution in Logistics is down by about half.

You know what Scott? That's that's a very good question. So I've got David next to me. He's, he's the CFO. So I think I've got to let that to David. He's the numbers guy. Yeah. Hi Scott. Um, so, so, yeah, embedded in that. That guidance is a US LTL, or in Q4 of 96.

Alain Bédard: Right. In Logistics, Scott, as you know, we move all the trucks that are being manufactured in North America for Paccar and Freightliner. These guys are down like 40%. That's a huge effect on us. Also, globally, our Logistics operation in the U.S. is also down. The Canadian ones are on plan, doing better. In the U.S., we're also down. We're running about 92% of plan right now. This is what we are showing there. I'll give you another example. Because of government shutdown, DOD is debt, Department of Defense. One of our divisions, 30% of the revenue comes from the Department of Defense, right? This is out of our control. The same thing with the OEM, selling less trucks. This is something that is out of our control, but we know it's short-term. It could be two quarters, three quarters. Those guys will be selling trucks soon.

Um, specialized truckload between 93 and 94, and Logistics also between 93 and 94. And, and that Logistics piece is, uh, is down substantially when you run the numbers on, what that suggests year-over-year? Uh, operating income contribution, the logistics is uh, is down by about half.

Alain Bédard: That's why we're also keeping the staff. We're keeping the team because we'll be suffering for a few quarters because of that situation, okay? We know that this freight is going to come back. It's the same thing with our Truckload operation that serves the Department of Defense. We know that this shutdown will stop at one point.

Right? And and and Logistics start, I mean as you know, we move all the trucks that are being manufactured in Northern America for Packard and freight liner. So these guys are down like 40%, so that's huge effect on us. And and also globally are Logistics operation. In the US is also down the Canadian ones are on plan doing better. But in the US we're also down we're running at about 92% of plan right now. So this is, this is what we are showing there. I mean like this, I'll give you another example. Because of government shutdown, DOD is dead Department of the defense. I mean, 1 of our division, 30% of the revenue comes from the Department of Defense, right? So this is out of our control, the same thing with the OEM okay selling less drugs, this is something that is out of our control but we know it's short term, it's could be 2. Quarters, 3, quarters. I mean those guys will be selling trucks, you know, soon. And

David Saperstein: In terms of rounding out the rest, Package and Courier and Canadian Less-Than-Truckload, we see those in the 82% to 83% range, and Canadian Truckload around 90%.

That's why we're also keeping the staff. We're keeping the team because, you know, we're we'll we'll be suffering for a few quarters because of that situation, okay? But we know that this uh, this rate is is going to come back and it's the same thing with our truck code operation, that service, the department of the defense. I mean we know that this shutdown will will stop at 1 Point.

Yeah. And then in terms of rounding out the rest uh PNC and Canadian LTL. We see those in the 8283 range and Canadian truck load around 90.

[Analyst 3]: Okay. Very helpful. Alain, it feels like on the US Less-Than-Truckload side, one of the messages in the last year or so is we got to get service better before we can start focusing on price. Where are we in terms of the ability to start getting a little bit more focused on price? Maybe just with that, it feels like we're seeing some stabilization in the GFP business. Is there any potential to start growing that business again?

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. You're absolutely right, Scott. GFP finally is we got some stability and now we can start growing again. Because the business we get from GFP comes mostly from the small and medium-sized account. Once you start growing back the small and medium-sized account, normally you should have a benefit to your GFP. In terms of the service, what I would say is that right now about 21% of our linehaul miles are on the rail versus 30% or 35% like it used to be. For sure, our four-day service has improved tremendously, right? We use less rail today than we were using about a year ago. That's number one. Next-day service, we're up to par. If we compare our next-day service to our peers, we're there. Where we still have issues is second-day and third-day service. The guys are working actively on that. We are improving.

Okay, very helpful. Um and then Elaine, it feels like on the US. LTL side 1 of the messages in the last year or so is we we got to get service better before we can start focusing on price. Um where are we in? In terms of you know the ability to start getting a little bit more focused on price and then maybe just with that you know it feels like we're seeing some stabilization in the the gfp business. Is there any potential to start growing that business again? Yeah.

You're absolutely right Scott. Gfb finally is we got some stability and now we could start growing again because the business we get from gfp comes mostly from the small and medium-sized account. So once that you start growing back, this the small and medium-sized account normally you should have a benefit to your gfp in terms of the service.

Alain Bédard: We're not where we should be. That is really the goal, to get this up to our peers on the second and third-day service. Slowly in 2026, and I think we'll get there, we can start being seen as a professional carrier that respects the commitment that they give to customers and get a price that is closer to the market versus right now we're still a discounter versus the market.

day service, and then

David Saperstein: Yeah. To follow up on what Mr. Bédard said on service, I think one of your peers pointed out that we were the most improved carrier in Mastio in this year's survey. I can tell you that that's underpinned by real data that we're seeing. Our small, medium-sized percent of revenue is higher than it was last year. We're at 27.4% relative to 26.7% last year this quarter. On service, we've improved 340 basis points in terms of our on time. Our missed pickups year over year, they're down 60%. Our reschedules are down 34%.

Slowly in 26 and I think we'll get there. We can start being seen as a professional carrier that respect, okay, the commitment that they give to customers and and get, you know, a a price that is closer to the market versus right now. We're still a Discounter, okay, versus the market.

You know to to follow up on what Mr. Barr said on service. I think 1 of your 1 of your peers pointed out that we were the most improved uh carrier in mastio in in this uh this year's survey. And and I can tell you that that's that's underpinned by real data that uh that that we're seeing. So our small medium-sized revenue or a small, medium-sized percent of Revenue is is higher than it was last year. We're a 27 point for relative to 26.70%. We've improved 340 basis points in terms of our on time our missed pickups year-over-year, they're down 60% and then our reschedules are down 34%

Alain Bédard: These are facts, Scott. I mean, this is going to help us, like you've asked the question, to get better profitability from the top line.

David Saperstein: Yeah, more freight.

So these are facts. Hey Scott. So I mean this is going to help us like you like, you've asked the question to get better better profitability from the Top Line.

Alain Bédard: More freight, sure.

David Saperstein: Better retention.

Alain Bédard: Yeah, less turnover. Less turnover.

David Saperstein: Turnover.

And more freight and more freight. Sure. Better retention. Yep. Let's turn over. Yeah, let's turn over, turn over.

[Analyst 3]: Makes sense. Thank you, guys. Appreciate the time.

David Saperstein: Sure.

Makes sense. Thank you guys. Appreciate the time.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure, Scott.

Operator: Next question will be from Walter Spraglin at RBC Capital Markets. Please go ahead, Walter.

Sure. Pleasure Scott.

[Analyst 4]: Yeah. Thanks very much, Alberto. Good morning, everyone. Alain, on 2026, you said the sun is coming up. You've been very pragmatic, very clear about when you see things that are poor and when you see things that are turning. That's very interesting for you to say and to hear you say. I'm just curious, is that a commentary on price? Is it a commentary on demand? Specifically, are you seeing any real evidence either from the CDL restrictions and English language proficiency requirements that are now being mandated? Are you seeing that impact today on price? Are you seeing any light at the end of the tunnel in terms of overall demand as you go into 2026?

Alain Bédard: Okay. Walter, let me be a little bit more specific. When I see the sun coming out, it's mostly the U.S. I think Canada, okay, because we still don't have a deal with the U.S. It's going to be probably the same in 2026 like we have been going through in 2025, right? On the U.S. side, if you look at our Truckload operation in the U.S., our velocity is down, our miles are down, but our revenue per mile is up until now, right? What we're starting to see is maybe a little bit of contraction in the offer. That could be, like you just said, Walter, this thing about the CDL, those permits that are not being renewed, the same is true of the English proficiency thing. The early stage, okay?

Next question will be from Walters crackling at RBC Capital markets. Please go ahead Walter. Yeah, thanks very much Alberta. Good morning everyone. Um, uh, and I, uh, on on 2026, you said the sun is coming up and you've been very pragmatic, very, very clear about when you see things that are poor and when you think that are turning. And so that's very interesting for you to say. And, and to hear you say and I'm just curious, is that a commentary on Price? Is it a commentary on demand? Uh, and specifically, excuse me, are you seeing any real evidence either from the CDL restrictions in English language, proficiency requirements. Uh, that are that are now being mandated is that, are you seeing that, uh, impact today on price? And are you seeing any light at the end of the tunnel in terms of overall, demand as you go into 2026?

Okay, so Walter let me a little bit more specific when I see the sun coming out. It's mostly the US, I think Canada. Okay, because we still don't have a deal with the US. Uh, it's going to be probably the same in 26. Like we uh have been going to in 25.

Our truckload operation in the U.S. Uh, our velocity is down. Our miles are down, but our revenue per mile is up.

Until now. Alright, so what we're starting to see is maybe a little bit of contraction in the offer, and that could be, like you just said, Walter, this thing about the CDL. Okay? Those permits are not being renewed. Okay, the same is true of the English proficiency thing.

Alain Bédard: I believe that this is going to help us correct the imbalance between the offer and the demand. Also, the fact that truck sales are down like 40%. That's also something that tells you that some capacity is running out of the system, right? Now, for us, Canadian, I'm sure you saw what Champagne was saying about his new budget that he's going to be talking about soon. Hopefully, in Canada, we'll have something similar with those Driver Inc. things there, where finally we were able to convince the federal government to say, "If you're a trucker, you have to issue either a T4 as an employee or a T4A as a subcontractor," right, Walter? The Canadian finally also could be of a help for us in 2026. Maybe not on the volume, but the offer could reduce.

The early stage.

Okay, but I believe that. Okay, this is going to help us correct. The imbalance between the offer and the demand. Okay. Also the fact that you know, the truck sales are down like 40% that's also something that tells you that some capacity is running out of the system right now for US Canadian. I'm sure you saw what champaing was saying about this? Is new budget that he's going to be talking about soon, okay? Hopefully in Canada will have something similar with the those driver Inc thing there. Okay. Where finally, we were able to convince the federal government to say. If you're a trucker, you have to issue either a T4 as an employee or a t4a as a subcontractor, right Walter. So the Canadian finally also could be of help for us in 26, maybe not on the vault.

Alain Bédard: As a matter of fact, we just saw one of the Driver Inc. up for sale. I mean, we're not going to buy a Driver Inc. company, but just to say that those guys are starting to feel, "Whoa, things are changing in Canada." I think that globally, the Canadian situation is going to be difficult in 2026 because we don't have a deal with the U.S. yet. I think we'll have one, but we don't have one yet. Maybe it's going to go all the way to the summer, 2026. I think that the U.S., that's going to change. That's going to change with all the benefits of this OBB, the big beautiful bill, and everything that's going on, the reinvestment. Trying to bring those jobs back into the— all of this, to me, is, "Guys, let's get ready," okay?

Call you, but the offer could reduce. As a matter of fact, we just saw 1 of the driver Inc up for sale.

Okay. I mean we're not going to buy a driver in company, but just to say that those guys are starting to feel whoa, things are changing in Canada. So I think that globally the Canadian situation is going to be difficult in 26 because we don't have a deal with the us yet.

I think we'll have 1 but we don't have 1 yet. Maybe it's going to go all the way to the summer. 26.

Alain Bédard: I think after three years of a freight recession that's been really, really bad, we're starting to see some capacity out. As a matter of fact, David, we have one of our peers in Alabama, 500 trucks. The guy is out.

David Saperstein: Bankruptcies. Yeah, exactly. We're seeing those come across our desk more and more now.

Alain Bédard: Exactly. We also have a freight guy, a freight broker, closing shops.

David Saperstein: As you become a bit more optimistic on 2026, does that change at all your strategy on M&A? Do you pull that forward at all? Is it contingent on the seller? Just curious your update on what you— and I'm talking not the tuck-ins, I mean a larger platform acquisition.

Engage with all the benefits of this OBB, the big beautiful bill, and everything that's going on with the reinvestment, okay? Trying to bring those jobs back into all of this to me is—guys, let's get ready. Okay, I think, after three years of a fraught recession, it has been really, really bad. We're starting to see some capacity out. As a matter of fact, we have one of our peers in Alabama with 500 trucks. The guy is out of bankruptcy. Yeah, exactly. We're seeing those come across our desk more and more now, exactly. You know, we also have a freight guy, a freight broker, okay? Closing shops. Yep.

So as you become a bit more optimistic on 26, then are, does that change at all your strategy on m&a? Uh, are you are, uh, do you do you pull that forward at all? Is it contingent on the seller? Uh, just curious your update on what you and I'm talking not not the tuck in, I mean a larger platform acquisition

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah. You know what, this takes time, right? We've been at it for quite a while. Because we don't have a deal, what we're doing is we're buying back TFI, right? That's what we've been doing. I think that in 2026, hopefully, we could have—it's always difficult to do a deal when the target doesn't want to sell, right? This is not easy to do, right? Sometimes you're better off to say, "You know what? Let's wait, okay, and let's work on a different file where at least you got a seller that's motivated," right? To me, I'm still convinced that 2026, probably mid-2026, later into 2026, we could do something of size. We have the capacity. We have the potential. We have the target, okay, to do that.

Yeah, yeah. So, you know what? Uh,

This this takes time, right? And uh we've been at it for, you know, quite a while and you know because we don't have a deal. What we're doing is we're buying back TFI, right? So that's what we've been doing. I, I think that in 26, hopefully we could have, you know, it's always difficult to do a deal when you know the target doesn't want to sell.

Right, this is not easy to do, right? So, you know, sometimes you're better off to say, you know what? Let's wait, okay? And let's work on a different file where at least you've got a motivated seller, right? So.

Alain Bédard: There again, I mean, TFI stock is so cheap that when we talk to our board, they say, "Hey, Alain, why would you invest $1 billion, $2 billion, $3 billion, okay? Why don't you just buy back TFI?" Okay? We've been doing that slowly, but now things could change with this macro environment. Maybe it's best to put the buyback on hold for now, although we have our board and the TSX approved the renewal of our NCIB. Maybe put that on hold for now, depending on the stock valuation, and get ready for the next step, the next chapter of our life on M&A.

to me I'm still convinced that 26 probably mid 26 later into 26. We could do something of size we have the the capacity we have the potential we have the target, okay? To do that.

Uh, But there again I mean GFI stock is so cheap that you know when we talk to our board they say hey Elaine why would you invest 1 2 3 billion dollars? Okay why don't you just buy back TFI okay? And you know we've been doing that slowly but now things could change with this macro environment and maybe it's best to you know put the buyback on hold for. Now although we we we have our board and the TSX approved, the renewal of our ncib, but maybe put that on hold for now depending on the stock valuation and and get ready for the next step. The next uh, chapter of our life on emanate.

David Saperstein: Thank you very much for the color as always, Alain.

Thank you very much for the color, as always, and I.

Alain Bédard: Thank you, Walter.

Operator: Next question will be from Jason Seidel at TD Cowen. Please go ahead, Jason.

Thank you, Walter.

Next question, will be.

[Analyst 5]: Thank you, Alain Bédard. Good morning. Getting back to your comments about a potential trade deal with the U.S., I share your hopes that it's sooner versus later. If it is later, have you given any thoughts to maybe some further cost reductions that you might have to take given that you saw CN out there the other day laying off about 400 people?

Thank you, operator Elaine David, good morning. Um, getting back to your comments, uh, about, uh, you know, a potential trade deal with the US and I, you know, I I, I share your hopes that it's sooner versus later, but if it is later, um, have you given any thoughts to maybe some further, you know, cost reductions that you might have to take given that, you know, you saw CNN out there the other day laying off about 400 people.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. You know what, Jason? I don't know that. What I could tell you, though, is that because we're embracing AI, I think that with this tool, we'll be in a position to do more with less. I think that to do some layoff right now of quality people that are part of our team, the same story is true of our Logistics, right? As I was saying, Jason, about our truck-moving operation, we know that this is just a few quarters. We are suffering because we're keeping our people, right? These are good people. They're doing a good job. We'll be suffering on that. We are still suffering on the Canadian side in our Truckload sector. As an example, steel, okay? Steel is dead for us. We are a big steel hauler. What do you do?

Yeah. Well you know what? Jason

I don't know that what I could tell you though is that because we're so embracing AI. I think that with this tool will be the position to do more with less, I think that uh, to do some layoffs right now of quality people, that's that are part of our team. The same story is true of our Logistics, right? So as I was saying, Jason about our truck moving up operation, we know that this is this is just a few quarters. So we are suffering because we're keeping our our people, right? Because these are good people. They're they're they're doing a good job. So so we'll be suffering on that. And we are still suffering on the Canadian side in our truckload sector as an example steel. Okay. Well steel is dead for us, but

Alain Bédard: Now we have those trucks parked, and we have those drivers at home because that's the only thing we could do. We have to protect our staff because the problem is when this business gets back on track, you don't want to have to rehire drivers and at the same time also rehire the staff. This is why by investing more in technology through this AI thing there, we'll be able to be better positioned to be fast, to react much faster to market conditions.

We are a big steel hauler so what do you do? I mean now we have those trucks parked and we have those drivers, you know, you know, at home because that that's the only thing we could do. But then we have to protect our staff because the problem is, when this business gets back on track, you don't have to be, you know, we hire drivers and at the same time also we hire the staff. So this is why by investing more in technology through this AI thing there. I mean, it will be able to be better positioned to, to be fast to react much faster to Market condition.

[Analyst 5]: Alain, as the follow-up there, as we think about JHT, can you give us some numbers in terms of how much of a drag it's placing on the margins at Logistics? In terms of the AI, how quickly do you think some of your investments are going to bear fruit that we can see as we move throughout 2026?

Follow up there, you know, as we as we think about jht. So can you give us some numbers in terms of how much of a drag its placing on the margins at Logistics and in terms of the AI? Uh, how quickly do you think, you know, some of your Investments are going to bear fruit that you know, we can see as we move throughout 26.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. I'll give you an example, Jason, about the AI. When I'm talking to Kyle and his team at TForce Freight, I'm saying, "You know what, guys? We have to find a solution if Waymo can run taxi in Austin, Texas without a driver." I mean, how can we not run shunters in our yard without a driver, right? Is there a way, guys? Let's wake up and smell the coffee. Let's open our mind that we have to change. If Waymo is able to run cab in Austin, in a city, why can't we run shunters in a yard without the drivers? These are all things that we're looking at, Jason, to be more efficient, right?

Yeah, I I'll give you an example. Json about the AI. So, when I'm talking to K and his team at T4 straight, I'm saying you know what guys? We have to find a solution. If who can, you know, run taxi in Austin, Texas without a driver. I mean, how can we not run shunters in our yard with other driver?

Right? Is there a way guys? Let's wake up and smell the coffee? Let's open our mind that we have to change and if if way more is able to run Cab in a in Austin in a city, okay why can't we run shunters in a yard?

Okay, without the drivers.

So, these are all things that we're looking at, Jason, to be more efficient.

David Saperstein: Sales augmentation as well.

Alain Bédard: Right.

David Saperstein: Right? Increasing the productivity massively of salespeople in terms of.

Alain Bédard: Exactly.

David Saperstein: Prospecting, in terms of identifying targets that fit, because it's not just names. It's, "Okay, what's their business look like? How does that fit with our network?" The solutions can do a lot of that work, and then increase the velocity of the contacts and the outreach and the back and forth. It's remarkable. That's another important application that we're looking at right now and we're rolling out right now.

Hey, so sales documentation as well, right? Right? Increasing the productivity, massively of sales people in terms of prospecting, in terms of identifying targets that fit, you know, because it's it's not just names. It's it's okay. What's their business look like, how does that fit with our Network? The the solutions can can do a lot of that work and and and then increase the the velocity of

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah.

[Analyst 5]: No, that's some good color. The margin hit from JHT?

Of of the contacts and the the Outreach and the back and forth. It's it's uh it's remarkable. So these that's another important application that uh, that we're looking at right now and, and we're rolling out right now. Yeah, yeah. No. That's that's some good color. And the, the margin hit from jht.

Alain Bédard: JHT, I mean, the margin at JHT is probably depending on what you talk about. If you're talking about trucks that move from Mexico to the U.S. or Canada, I mean, the margin is not the same because we use a Mexican partner to move that truck from Mexico into the U.S. or Canada. Also, don't forget that we have experienced drivers in there. We also have a Logistics division. When the volumes are down, our Logistics division is very small because the Logistics gets the overflow. Right now, there's no overflow. This is why. As you know, Jason, in our Logistics, the margins are really good on the overflow. This is a little bit of a complex story. What I can tell you is that JHT is a diamond for us because it's very well-run.

Well, ght, I mean the margin of ghd is probably depending on on what you talked about. If you're talking about trucks, that move from Mexico, okay To Can, to the US or Canada. I mean, the margin is not the same because we use a, a Mexican partner to move that truck from Mexico into, uh, into the us or, or Canada. Uh, also don't forget that, uh, you know, we have experienced drivers in there. We also have a Logistics Division. So when the volumes are down, are Logistics Division, okay, is very small, okay? Because the logistic gets the Overflow. So right now, there's no overflow. So, so this is why, and as, you know, Jason, you know, in our logistic, the margin are really good. Okay, on the Overflow. So this is, this is a little bit of a complex story. But what I can tell you is that, you know,

Alain Bédard: I mean, the guys, and this is why we're suffering so much right now because the volumes are down, but we probably have 50% too much staff for the volumes we have. We're keeping those guys, right? When things go back to normal volume with Freightliner and Packard, we want to be there. We want to be there to be able to service them, right?

DHT is a diamond for us because it's very well-run. I mean, the guys and this is why we're suffering so much right now because the volumes are down, but we probably have 50% too much stuff for the volumes we have, but we're keeping those guys.

Right. Because when things go back to normal volume with Freightliner and Packard, we want to be there; we want to be there to be able to service them, right?

[Analyst 5]: Makes sense. Gentlemen, appreciate the time.

Makes sense.

Gentleman, appreciate the time.

Alain Bédard: Always a pleasure, Jason. Thank you.

[Analyst 5]: Same.

Always a pleasure Jason. Thank you, same.

Operator: Next question will be from Conrad Gupta at Scotia Capital. Please go ahead, Conrad.

[Analyst 6]: Thanks, Alfredo. Good morning, Alain and David. Thanks for taking my question. Alain, you mentioned AI quite a lot on this call and technology, and I'm pretty sure I think that's the next evolution for you guys and everybody in the industry. I think though you reduced the CapEx guidance for this year, I'm just curious. When you think about the year or years ahead to invest for technology and for eventual rebound in volumes, I mean, how do you see the capital planning for those things? I mean, should you see a significant increase in CapEx for that?

Next question, will be from carard Gupta at kosha Capital. Please go ahead. Conor

Thanks a lot. Good morning LA and David. Uh thanks for taking my question. Um, I you mentioned about AI quite a lot on this call uh and technology and I'm pretty sure I think that's the that's the next Evolution for for you guys and everybody in the industry. Um you know I think though you you reduce the capex guidance uh, for this year I'm just curious, you know, when you think about the year or years I had um to invest for technology and for uh, you know, eventual rebound and volumes. I mean, how do you see the capital planning? Uh, for those things? I mean, like, should you see a significant increase in capex for that?

[Analyst 5]: On the AI, no, these are licenses. It might be $30 per person per month, $35. Depends on what exactly we're talking about. These are light, very nimble tools that we add on. Like in sales, you'll add it on to your CRM. I wouldn't, first of all, that's not going to be CapEx. It would be expense, and it will not be noticeable. We're not building data centers and that kind of thing. We're just customers and adopters of the technologies that are out there. As it relates to regular CapEx on trucks, there's no question that this is a very, very light year, right? At the outset of this year, we set out to do $200 million of net CapEx. Normal for this business would be more around $300 million.

[Analyst 5]: The volumes are so low, we're driving so few miles, and we had excess equipment from the Daseke acquisition that we're able to reduce the CapEx without really meaningfully aging the fleet. That's fine. You should think about a more normal net CapEx number for us to be around $300 million. That also will take place in a year where there's more normal earnings, right? Free cash flow would be higher than it is this year, even with that increased CapEx.

Year. Right. At the outset of this year, we, we set out to do 200 million of of net capex. Normal for this business would be more around 300 but the volumes are so low. We're driving. So a few miles that we and we had excess equipment from the dassie acquisition that we're, we're able to reduce the capex Without Really meaningfully aging, the fleet and um, and and so that's fine. But you should think about a more normal net capex number for us, uh, to be around 300. But that's also has we we'll take place in a year where there's more normal earnings.

Alain Bédard: The other thing too is that our CapEx has been delayed at TForce Freight because the supplier was not sure because the trucks, they are assembled in Mexico, right? All this tariff thing situation. The trucks have been delayed by about three months. Right now, we're getting trucks in October, November that were supposed to come in Q3, right? Some of the trucks also will come in Q1 2026 that were supposed to be part of 2025. This is why this revised CapEx that you see is exceptional that we're so low in a year like 2025. I mean, if things come back like we think they will in the U.S., we should get back to a more normal environment, okay, of activity, miles, and freight. For sure, we'll be back to normal CapEx.

Right? So, free cash, uh, flow would would be higher than it than it is this year, even with that increased capex. And and the other thing too is that our, our capex has been delayed at T4 straight because the supplier was not sure because the trucks, the they are assembled in Mexico, right? And and all this tariff thing situation, uh, you know, the trucks have been delayed by about 3 months. So right now we're getting trucks in October and November that we're supposed to come in Q3, right? And some of trucks also will come in q1 26, that were supposed to be part of the, of, uh, of 25. So this is why this revised capex that you see is be, its exceptional, you know, we're so low in, in the year, like 25. I mean, we should, if, if things come back like we think they will in the US, we should get

Back to a more normal environment, okay of activity, miles and and Freight. So for sure we'll be back to normal capex.

[Analyst 6]: Makes sense. Thanks for the comment on that. Just quickly to follow up, you mentioned Daseke. In terms of access equipment, where's the integration process on Daseke now? I mean, it's been a while, I guess, right? You had Daseke in the system. I'm sure, like obviously, the volumes are soft and all that. What you can control from the sell-to-sell perspective, are you fully done there or there's more to do?

Alain Bédard: You know what? On the Daseke, on the financial side, we're done. By the end of 2025, we're done. Fleet management, financial. They run MIR now, like Contrans. They also run on Infineon for financial, like Contrans, which is our Truckload division, right? This is done. In terms of the day-to-day TMS, we're still working on McLeod and TMW, updating those systems, and also making sure that we have visibility across all the divisions because Daseke was more of a siloed kind of company. That is going to change during the course of 2026. Sales is also something that we're working on at our U.S. Truckload operation. This is something I'm still discussing with my friend Steve, how are we going to go about the commercial operation in 2026? This is still something that needs to be ironed out.

Makes sense. No, thanks for the call on that and just quickly to follow up. Um, you mentioned dansky, um, in terms of Access Equipment regarding integration process on that ski now, I mean, like, it's been, it's been a while I guess, right? You had that ski in in the system and I'm surely going to see the volume of soft and all that. But, uh, you know what, you can control from the self self perspective, like are you fully done there or there's more to do,

You know what? The

On the desk key on the financial side, okay? So, uh, we're we're done okay by the end of 25, we're done okay, Fleet Management Financial so they run near now, okay. Like contrast, they also run on Infinium for financial like contracts. Okay, which is our truckload division, right? So this is done in terms of the day-to-day TMS, okay? There was still, we're still working on ML and tmw, okay. Updating those system and also making sure that we have visibility across all the division because Dashi was more of a siloed kind of companies, okay? So that is going to change during the course of 20.

Alain Bédard: For sure, we need to invest more on the commercial side of our U.S. specialty Truckload because I believe that with everything that's going on in the U.S., we need a sales team that is aggressive because there's going to be more business.

26 says, is also something that we're working on at uh at our us truck load operation. And you know, this is something I'm still discussing with uh, with my friend Steve. Okay. How we going to go about, uh, the commercial operation in 26, this is still something that needs to be ironed out, but for sure, we need to invest more on the commercial side, uh, of our us specialty truck load because I believe that with everything that's going on in the US, uh, we need a sales team that are aggressive because there's going to be more business.

[Analyst 6]: Makes sense. Thanks for the time, Alain Bédard and David Saperstein. Thank you.

Makes sense. Uh, thanks for the time, David. Thank you.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure.

Pleasure.

Operator: Next question will be from Ken Hekster at Bank of America. Please go ahead, Ken.

[Analyst 7]: Hey, great. Good morning, Alain and David. Can you address the start in October on volumes relative to the down 7% tonnage in the fourth quarter, 11% shipments?

Next question will be from Ken Hexter at Bank of America. Please go ahead, Ken.

Hey, great. Good morning, uh, alen David, um, can you address? Uh, the start in in October on, on volumes relative to the down 7% poundage in in the fourth quarter of 11 minutes?

[Analyst 6]: Yep.

[Analyst 5]: Yeah. I mean, the start to October, we're not in the habit of giving monthly data, as you know, but the start to October is soft, like the industry leader pointed out when they reported recently.

Yep.

Uh, yeah, I mean, the start the start to October, we're not in the habit of giving a a monthly, uh, data as you know. But the start to October is is, is soft like uh, the industry leader, uh, pointed out, uh, on uh, when, when they reported recently,

[Analyst 7]: I just want to understand if it accelerated because I guess, David, just to clarify, right, when Alain said LTL 200 to 300 basis points deterioration, you said 96, which would be a 380 basis point sequential deterioration. I just want to know, was there anything in there that's getting worse, or I didn't know if the volumes were accelerating on the downside, just understanding what was in the numbers there.

[Analyst 5]: Yeah. No, listen, the 96 is what's embedded in the guidance. That's what our current forecast says, and that is driven by our observation of the first month of the quarter. Yes, October was weaker than it usually is, weaker than expected.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Ken, because me, I'm always being optimistic. This is why me, that's the target when I talk to Kyle. David is the CFO. He's the numbers guy. Sometimes we have different perspectives. You got to trust probably better David because he's the numbers guy.

Embedded in the guidance. That's that's what our our current forecast uh says. And that is driven by uh our observation of the first month of the quarter. So uh yes, October was was weaker than it. Usually is weaker than expected.

Yeah.

Yeah, you know, Ken because me I'm always being optimistic. This is what this is. Why me? I I that's the Target when I talk to Cal but you know, David is the CFO, he's the number's guy. So sometimes we, you know, we have different

[Analyst 7]: Okay. Just following up on that, the Logistics, you said similarly, right, the OR deterioration. You mentioned the JHT. Is that getting more expensive or deteriorating OR because of what's going on in terms of reduced capacity availability from ELP and the CDLs you're talking about? I just want to understand kind of the negative mix. Was it really just on the top line, like you're talking about with Less-Than-Truckload and the volumes, or is it the cost side kicking in as well?

Perspective. But, you know, you'll probably get more trust with David because he's the numbers guy.

[Analyst 5]: No, it's not the cost side. It's not like it's harder for us to get capacity. It's a combination of— Remember, our Logistics brokerage, the brokerage portion of our Logistics, most of it's Less-Than-Truckload. If Less-Than-Truckload is off to a slow start in Q4, the same is going to be true for our Less-Than-Truckload brokerage in terms of demand. The majority of the drag in that segment is coming from the truck-moving business and the dynamic that we've talked about in terms of holding on to our people during that period.

Um, and then just following up on on that. Um, the logistics, you know, you got, similarly, write the O deterioration, you mentioned the jht or, or is that getting more expensive or deteriorating a lot because of what's going on, in terms of reduced capacity, availability from ELP. And, and the CDLs you're talking about, just want to understand kind of the negative mix. Was it really just on the the Top Line like you're talking about with LTL on the volumes or is there, is it the cost side kicking in as well?

No, it's it's not the cost side. It's not like it's harder for us to get capacity. It's a combination of

We we remember our our, our Logistics broker The Brokerage portion of our Logistics, most of its LTL. So if LTL is off to a slow, start in, in Q4, the same is going to be true for our LTL Brokerage in terms of demand and, and then, uh, but but but the, the majority of the drag in that segment is coming from the truck moving business. And, uh, the dynamic, that, that, that we've talked about, in terms of

You know, holding on to to to our people during that during that period.

[Analyst 7]: Alain, I guess just to wrap up.

Alain Bédard: Yep.

And then, I guess, just to wrap up.

[Analyst 5]: I was just going to add, Ken, that this is the old red is killing us at GHT because, like David is saying, we're keeping the staff. We're keeping the team because we know this is short-term. Please go ahead.

Okay, yep.

No, I was just going to add that again.

[Analyst 7]: No, no. Exact same issue, right, which is short-term on that because you mentioned the government shutdown. It's surprising because it seemed like a lot of companies were avoiding that thing. We don't really move that stuff. It sounds like, I guess, you're seeing not only direct business, particularly for the Department of Defense customer, but I guess the derivative of that. Is that kind of having another flow through on other derivative customers, increasing that demand or not necessarily at this point, too early?

Excuse me. I was just going to have Ken that this is the overhead is killing us at ghd. Because, like David is saying, is we're keeping the sap, we're keeping the team because we know this is short term, so yeah, excuse me, please go ahead. No, no, no, exact same issue, right? Which is short term on that because you mentioned the government shutdown. It's surprising because it seemed like a lot of companies were were avoiding. That thing. It we don't really move that stuff, but it sounds like I guess you're seeing not only Direct business where a particular for the dod customer, but but I guess the derivative of that is that kind of having another flow through on other or derivative customers.

Increasing that demand or or not necessarily at this point too early.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. One thing is for sure, Ken, is that everything is slow right now because think about the fact that some people are not being paid or delayed in the payment of their salary. For sure, the demand is slow right now, and it will correct itself as soon as there's a deal in the U.S. We don't know when. I think it's going to be soon. The Department of Defense is a big part of our specialty truckload, Ken. I mean, 30% of our business normally is moving freight for the Department of Defense. This is just one example that this is why our guidance for Q4 is exceptionally low. This is not normal for us. It's like a perfect storm where our logistics has been affected badly, okay? Our truckload, the same.

Yeah.

Yeah. Well, 1 thing is for sure. Ken is that everything is slow right now because think about the

You know, the the fact that, uh, some people are not being paid or or delayed in in the pay payment of their salary. So for sure, the demand is is slow right now and it will correct itself as soon as uh, you know, there's a deal in the US. Uh we don't know when I think it's going to be soon. Uh, and and DOD, it's a big part of our specialty truck load and can I mean, 30% of our business normally is moving Freight for for the Department of Defense. So it it's just 1 example, that this is why our our

Alain Bédard: Also, the fact that in Canada, I mean, it's pretty difficult as we speak, right, because of the trade between the two countries. It's like a perfect storm for us. $0.80 to $0.90, I mean, EPS for us is not normal. It's exceptionally low, okay? We have to give guidance that is proper.

[Analyst 7]: Yeah. One more on that real temporary question. I don't want to talk about the government shutdown on the post office. The post office is threatening, I guess, to make drastic changes of changing how many days you get deliveries and things like that. Is that a huge potential for Package and Courier, or is that a cost issue? I just want to understand if that longer term, not just the takeaway of the strike, minimal volumes. I'm thinking bigger picture, long term. Does that change the structure for your Package and Courier business?

Our guidance for Q4 is exceptionally low, this is not normal for us, but it's like a perfect storm where our Logistics has been affected badly. Okay, uh, you know, our truck load the same. So, you know, and and also the fact that in Canada, I mean it it's it's pretty difficult as we speak, right? Because of the trade between the 2 countries, so it's like a perfect storm for us but 80 to 90 cents. I mean, EPS was not normal. It's exceptionally low, okay? But we have to give guidance that uh is proper.

Alain Bédard: For sure, Ken. If finally these guys in Ottawa decide to, because you're talking about Canada, right, Ken?

Yeah 1 more on that real temporary question but and I don't want to talk about the the government shutdown on the post office. But the post office is threatening I guess to make drastic changes of you know changing how many days you get deliveries and things like that. Is that a huge potential for PNC? Or is that a a cost issue? I just want to understand if that longer term not not just to take away of the strike, you know, minimal volume. So I'm thinking bigger picture long term, does that change the structure for your PNC business?

[Analyst 7]: Yeah, just Canada. Yeah.

Alain Bédard: You're talking about Canada. For sure, I mean, I think that the guys in Ottawa now wake up and see that things have to change. Things have to change, and we are way more efficient than them, okay? Whatever change they do, it should help us in the longer term, Ken, in Canada.

Well, for sure, Ken. If these guys do not well decide to, because you're talking about Canada, right? Ken: Yeah, yeah, just Canada. Yeah, yeah.

[Analyst 7]: Yeah, okay. All right. Thank you.

Yeah, yeah, yeah, yeah. You're talking about Canada. So for sure, I mean I think that the guys in Ottawa now wake up and you know they see that they things have to change. Things have to change and we are way more efficient than them, okay? So you know, whatever change they do. Okay. It it should help us on on on the longer term k in Canada. Yeah.

Okay.

Alain Bédard: You know what? I'll give you an example of what's going on. Credit cards, okay? Credit cards from financial institutions used to be with Canada Post. Now it's mostly us, right? A year ago, there was another strike. We did that. They went back to Canada Post. The discussion we're having with them, this is going to be a permanent change because I think the financial institutions are sick and tired of back and forth.

All right, thank you. You can. You know what? I'll give you an example of what's going on credit cards.

Okay, so credit cards from financial institutions used to be with Canada Post.

Now, it's mostly us, right?

And you know, a year ago there was another strike. So we did that, then they went back to Canada Post but now the discussion we're having with them, this is going to be a permanent change.

Because I think the financial institutions are sick and tired of the back and forth.

[Analyst 7]: Wonderful. Alain, David, thank you very much for the time.

Alain Bédard: Very good, Ken. Pleasure.

Wonderful. All right. David, thank you very much for the time.

Very good Ken pleasure.

Operator: Next question will be from Cameron Dirksen at National Bank Capital Markets. Please go ahead, Cameron.

Next question will be from Cameron Dirksen.

[Analyst 8]: Yeah, thanks. Good morning. Question on the Canadian Less-Than-Truckload. Shipments down quite a bit there, I think 12%, but revenue per shipment was nicely positive. Just wondering if you can describe, I guess, what you're seeing in the Canadian Less-Than-Truckload space. Are you just being more selective in the business that you're chasing there?

National Bank Capital markets, please go ahead Cameron. Yeah, thanks. Uh good, good morning. Um, question on Canadian LTL, you know, shipments down quite a bit there. I think 12%. But you know, Revenue per shipment was uh, was nicely positive. Just wondering if you could describe. I guess the, you know what, what you're seeing in the Katie and the LTL space are, are you just being more selective in the business that you're that? You're chasing, their

Alain Bédard: No, no, Cameron. It's just our customers, the wait for shipment is down, right? I mean, they're less busy. We're not losing customers, major customers. One that I think of. We've lost one customer that I'm thinking of, yes. In general, there's no churn in customers, unusual. It's just like lower activity, Cameron.

No, no Cameron. It's just our our customers the way for shipping is down, right. Uh, so I mean, they're less busy and and us, I mean we're not uh, losing customers, uh, major customers uh, 1 that I think, are we? We've lost 1 customer

Thinking of. Yes. Okay. But in general, we're not. There's no churn in customers unusual. It's just like lower activity, Cameron.

[Analyst 8]: Okay. Just on going back to your comments around, I guess, the Driver Inc., and hopefully this change in the government will actually result in some change as we look ahead to next year. If that does happen, what is that impact on your business? Is this something where you just expect that some of these Driver Inc. carriers will just not be able to be in the market at all, and so there's a volume positive for you, or is it more just that they're underpricing in the market and this will just lift the pricing across all carriers if they don't have that benefit anymore?

Okay.

And, uh, just on going back to your comments around, I guess, the driver Inc., and you know, hopefully this has changed in the government, will actually, uh, result in some change as we look ahead to next year if that does happen.

Alain Bédard: Yeah. Yeah. We know these guys have been cheating all along. We know that now, if they have to issue T4A, the cheating is going to disappear. If you look at the evolution of our OR in Canada, the Canadian Truckload, it's just a disaster because we used to run 80 to 85 OR, and now we're running a 90 OR. Why is that? Because we have to be more competitive, etc., etc. This was always unfair competition to us. We think that now with these new issues, you're going to start to see some change. Another thing that's important to notice is the safety record of those guys is not good. People are starting to understand. We've got customers now that are stating, "We don't want to deal with those Driver Inc. anymore," right? We have one, a paper guy big in Quebec that said, "Hey, you know what?

What does that impact on on your business? Is this something where you just expect that? Uh, some of these driver in carriers will just not be able to be in the Market at all. And so there's a volume positive for you or is it more just that they're underpricing in the market and this will just lift the pricing across all all carriers. If they if they, if they don't have that benefit anymore.

Yeah, yeah, yeah. Well, we know these guys have been cheating all along and and we know that. Now if they have to issue t4a, the cheating is going to disappear. So I mean, if you look at the evolution of our or in Canada, the Canadian truck notes, I mean it's just a disaster because we used to run 80 to 85 war and now we're running a 90 War. Why is that? Well, I mean because you know, we have to be more competitive, etc, etc! So this is this was always unfair competition to us. So we think that now with this new issues, okay, you're going to start to see some change. And another thing also that's important to notice is the safety record of those guys is not

Alain Bédard: You have to certify that you're not a Driver Inc." Because more and more, there's also not just the cost, but the safety of these guys has been questioned now, right? This is why, to me, in 2026, when I look at Canada, the market's going to be probably a little bit more difficult, but the supply is going to be also much less. We'll probably be in a better position in 2026 than we were in 2025 because slowly, those Driver Inc.s will have to adjust. They will have to adjust the rates. They cannot cheat because right now, a Driver Inc. guy is not paying any taxes. Now he gets a T4A. Whoops. Revenue Canada is aware of him. If he doesn't pay his taxes, then he's going to end up with a little bit of an issue.

Good. So people are starting to understand; we’ve got customers now that are stating, 'We don’t want to deal with those driver rigs anymore.' Right? So we have one, you know, a paper guy big in Quebec that said, 'Hey, you know what? You have to certify that you’re not a driver rig,' because more and more there’s also not just the cost, but the safety of these guys has been questioned now. Right? So, this is like, to me, in '26, when I look at Canada.

Uh the the Market's going to be probably a little bit more difficult but the supply is going to be also much less so we'll probably be in a better position in 26. Then we were in 25 because slowly, okay, those driver Rings will have to adjust, they will have to adjust the rates. They they cannot cheat because right now, a driver ain't guy is not paying any taxes. Now he gets a t4a whoops. Uh, Revenue Canada is aware of of him and if he doesn't pay his taxes, then he's going to end up with a little bit of an issue.

[Analyst 8]: Good. No, that makes a lot of sense. Appreciate the time. Thanks.

Good. Tom makes a lot of sense. I appreciate the time. Thanks.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure.

Pleasure.

Operator: Next question will be from Brian Ossenbeck at JP Morgan. Please go ahead, Brian.

Next question will be from Brian, awesome, back at JP Morgan. Please go ahead, Brian.

[Analyst 1]: Hey, good morning. Alain, David, thanks for taking the questions. Just going back to the Mastio survey and the big improvement you noted, when do you start to get credit for that? Is that something that you do it once? Obviously, it's continuous, but you get some credit the first time you make a couple of big steps, and then they start to give you more volume and then maybe more price later. Just related to that, I'm trying to understand how you can be pretty good on four-day service and next day, but not necessarily two to three day. What's the part I'm missing there? Thanks.

Alain Bédard: Okay, Brian. I'll let David talk about that, the Mastio report. What I can tell you is that the four-day, where we were able to make some changes, is that we moved freight from rail to road, right? When you do that, you are in control, right? This is why we're doing really well on four-day versus what we used to do. Next day, because we come from the UPS environment where everything was kind of next day, these guys have always been good on next day. It's just a continuation of what these guys have done all along. The second day and the third day, this has been the issue, where we're not acting as being professional. We don't monitor. We just let the other guy do the job. Now it's a focus of ours because this is a big issue.

Alain Bédard: You have a commitment that you give to a customer that's going to be there in three days, but it's not there in three days. It's there in five days. That doesn't work, right? You got to be having process in place that you manage that. This is something where in the old days, there was no real focus. Now, through this new focus of the team, it has been a major focus of ours. We know that second day and third day, we were not as good as our peers, right? We're getting there because we're making a lot of changes and a lot of improvements. That's the difference between four days, two days, three days, Brian.

Thanks okay. Brian well I'll let David talked about that, but the master report. But what what I can tell you is that the 4-day, okay, where we were able to make some changes is that we move Freight from rail to Road, right? So when you do that, you are in control, right? So, this is why we're doing really well on 4 day versus what we used to do. And next day next day, because we come from the UPS environment where everything was kind of next day, these guys are always been good on the next day so we're just it's just a continuation of what these guys have done all along the the second day and the third day, this has been the issue. Okay? Where, you know, we're not acting as being professional, we don't matter, we don't monitor, we just let the other guy do the job. So now it's a focus of ours because this is a big issue because you have a commitment that you give to a customer, that's going to be there in 3 days, but it's not there in 3 days. It's there, in 5 days. Well, that doesn't work.

Right? So you got to be, you know, having processes in place that you manage that. So this is something where, you know, in the old days there was no real focus. And now, through this new focus of the team, it’s been a major focus of ours. We know that second day and third day, okay? We were not as good as our peers, right? But we're getting there because we're making a lot of changes and a lot of improvements.

[Analyst 1]: Yeah. In terms of how you get credit, in our experience so far, we would expect to see the impact first on volumes, right? Your turnover and your churn come down. You're able to retain more business that you get. You start to get more wallet share from the same customer. Remember, our customers, a lot of the big customers, use all of us, right? They use lots of carriers. It's just a question of how much they're allocating to each one. You do a good job, start to get a little bit more. The first place that we would expect to see it is on volume. Pricing will come later. Pricing, frankly, is going to be a little bit of a function of this supply-demand imbalance correcting itself or at least normalizing and the market being a little bit more balanced, right?

So that's the difference between, oh, 4 days, 2 days, 3 days, right?

Yeah, in terms of how you get credit in our experience so far, we expect to see the impact first on volumes, right? So your turnover and your churn comes down, you're able to retain more business that you get. Then you start to get more wallet share from the same customer because remember, our customers...

[Analyst 1]: When the market's more balanced and our service is improving and we're getting more freight from people, we can start to see a pricing. The other thing I'll point out on this is that the beauty is that we've made big improvements, but there's still a long way to go, right? We're not best in class yet. We've still got another hundreds of basis points to improve on time. We can drive our missed pickups way down further, reschedules way down further. Our claims can come down way further. We're still in the early stages, and there's a lot more value for us to create for our customers in the form of better service and ultimately for our shareholders when that plays through to the numbers.

A lot of the big customers use all of us, right? They use lots of carriers it's just a question of how much they're allocating to each 1 and so you you do a good job, start to get a little bit more. So the first place that we would expect to see it is on volume pricing, will come later and pricing, frankly is going to be a little bit of a function of this Supply demand imbalance, uh, correcting itself, or at least normalizing and and the market being, uh, a little bit more balanced. Right when there's the Market's more balanced and our service is improving and we're getting more freight from people. And then then we can start to see uh uh a pricing. The other thing I'll point out on this is that the beauty is that we've made big improvements but there's still a long way to go, right? We're not we're not best-in-class yet. We still got you know, another

Alain Bédard: Yeah.

Hundreds of basis points to improve on, on, on time. Uh, we can drive our missed pickups way down further reschedules. Way down further. Our Claims can come down way further. So we're, we're, we're still in the early stages and there's a lot more value for us to, uh, create for our customers, in the form of better service. And, and ultimately, for our shareholders, when that plays through to the numbers,

[Analyst 1]: The relative size of the two to three day sounds like that's probably the bigger chunk of the market or the opportunity relative to maybe the four and the next day.

Yep.

Alain Bédard: Yes, absolutely, Brian. I would say that next day for us is about not even 20% of our volume today, and four days is probably about the same. The big chunk of our business is between two and three days. This is where we are the weakest today, and this is where our focus is. Guys, this is where we have to work on, right? We made some major improvement on the four days. We're good there. We're good on the next day service, fine. Let's do the job on the two and three days, and we are improving. Absolutely.

And is the relative size of the the 2 to 3 day. Sounds like that's probably the bigger chunk of the market, or the opportunity relative to maybe the 4 and the next day.

Yes, absolutely. Yeah, fine. Because I would say that the next day for us is about, uh, not even 20% of our volume today.

Uh, and four days is probably about the same.

So, I mean, the big chunk of our business is between 2 and 3 days, and this is where we are the weakest today. And this is where our focus is, is guys, this is where we have to work on, right? So we, we made some major improvements on the 4 days. There. We're good. We're good on the next day service. Fine. But let's let's, uh, do the job on the 2 and 3 days and we are improving, absolutely.

[Analyst 1]: Okay, thanks very much for your time.

Okay. Thanks very much for your time.

Alain Bédard: Let's go, Brian.

Operator: Next question will be from Tom Wadowitz at UBS. Please go ahead, Tom.

That's good. Bye.

Next question will be from Tom Witts at UBS. Please go ahead, Tom.

[Analyst 9]: Good morning. Alain, I wanted to get your thoughts on just the size of the terminal network for U.S. LTL and where you would want to be for shipments. I think that was something where you inherited some or you bought something that had over 30,000 shipments a day, I don't know, 33, whatever it was. It went down on your own initiatives and the cycle went down. I think that has been a component that you're like, "We can't be a 90 or mid-80s OR company if we're just way underutilized." How do you think about where the network is and how much volume is a piece of ultimately getting to the goals, like maybe how large that gap is? That seems like a factor that would ultimately matter as well.

Uh, yeah, good morning. So, uh, Elaine, I wanted to get your thoughts on just kind of, uh,

The size of the terminal Network for us, LTL.

And where you would want to be for shipments, I think that was something where, you know, you kind of you inherited some or you bought something that had over 30,000 shipments a day. Look, I don't know 33, whatever it was.

Alain Bédard: You're absolutely right, Tom. As a matter of fact, in Q4, we'll probably swap three terminals with one of our peers to readjust the size of our terminal versus those guys, right? This is an ongoing thing that we continue to do. Cash-wise, probably in our Q4, between what we're buying and what we're selling, we should see a net positive between $40 million and $50 million U.S. in Q4. Still, even with that, going into 2026, I would say that we probably have another 2,000 doors too many. The challenge that we give our team is that the network was probably built to support 40,000 shipments a day, and we're doing half of that, right? Organically, it's going to take us some time. Can we go organically from 20,000 shipments a day to 40,000 shipments a day? That takes a long time. This is for sure.

How do you think about where the network is and how much volume is a piece of ultimately getting to the goals? Like maybe how large that gap is because that seems like a factor that would ultimately matter as well.

Yeah. Absolutely right Tom. And as a matter of fact, uh, in Q4 we'll probably swap, 3 terminal with 1 of our peers, to readjust the size of our terminal. Okay? Uh versus those guys, right? So this is an ongoing thing, okay? That we continue to do. Uh,

Cashwise probably in our Q4 between what we're buying and what we're selling. We should see a net positive between 40 and 50 million Us in Q4, uh, but still even with that going into 26. I would say that, uh,

Alain Bédard: There's more to go. There's more to come into adjusting our network to today's reality, and we'll keep doing that. We're talking to all of our peers all the time. What's the number of doors that we would need today? Probably more like 5,000 to 6,000 to 7,000 doors, but these doors have to be in the right location, right? That's the other thing that we're working on. In some areas, I'll give you an example. Dallas, I don't have too many doors in Dallas, right? We're doing well in Dallas, and we are increasing our volume in Dallas. Chicago, the same, right? We got areas that we are growing. You say, "Your volume is down." Yes, because in other areas, we are losing, right? We were working on balancing the network, absolutely, like everything else, Tom.

We probably have another 2,000 doors to many, okay? Now, the challenge that we gave our our team is that the network was probably built to support 40,000 shipments a day, and we're doing half of that, right? So organically is, is going to take us some time and but can we go organically from 20,000 shipments a day to 40,000 shipments a day? That takes a long time. So this is for sure, there's more to go, there's more to come into, adjusting our our

Our Network, okay? To today's reality and we'll keep doing that. Uh, so uh, we're we're talking to all of our peers all the time and and what's the number of doors that we would need today. Probably more like 5 to 6 to 7000 doors, but these doors have to be in the right location, right? So, that's the other thing that we're working on, uh, in in some areas. I'll give you an example, Dallas.

I don't have too many doors in Dallas. Yeah. Because we're doing well in Dallas and we are increasing our volume in Dallas. Chicago, the same, right? So we've got areas that we are growing. Okay? Now you say, well, your volume is down. Yes. Because in other areas we are losing, right? But we are working on balancing the network, absolutely, like everything else, Tom.

[Analyst 9]: Is that an issue on service that if you kind of rationalize, or it's not its size of terminal for you, it's not necessarily like reach of the network?

Alain Bédard: No, it's not an issue for service, Tom. I mean, no.

Is that an issue on service that, if you, you know, kind of rationalize or it's not, it's size of terminal for you. It's not necessarily like reach of the network.

No, it's not an issue for service Tom. I mean no,

[Analyst 9]: Okay. Great. Thanks for the time.

Alain Bédard: Thank you, Tom.

Okay. Okay, great. Thanks for the time.

Thank you, Tim.

Operator: Next question will be from Benoît Poirier at Desjardins Capital Markets. Please go ahead, Benoît.

[Analyst 10]: Thank you very much. Thanks, Alain, for the great comments about the impact of regulation on both sides of the border. Obviously, you mentioned some color about 2026 being more of a sunny picture, especially on the US Less-Than-Truckload. I'm just curious what kind of OR could you produce in a flat volume environment in 2026 and maybe another scenario where you see a more bullish stance in terms of volume?

Questions will be from benua Paris at the J Capital markets. Please go ahead Benoit.

Hey, thank you very much. And, uh, thanks for the great comments about the impact of Regulation both sides of the Border. Um, obviously you mentioned some caller about, uh, 2026 being more of a sunny picture, uh, especially on the US LTL. I'm just curious, what kind of War could you produce in, in a flat volume environment in 2026 and maybe another scenario, where you see a more bullish sense? Uh, uh in in terms of volume,

Alain Bédard: I think if everything stays the same, I think that in this kind of an environment where the volumes are light, etc., etc. If you look at our Q2, if you look at our Q3, for sure, last year's Q1 was a disaster for us at 99. I mean, I don't think that we'll be in that position. Can we say no volume growth, okay, for 2026 versus the same kind of environment 2026 that we've been seeing in 2025 with the investment that we're doing in our cost management and all that? Probably a 200 basis point globally improvement, 2 to 300 basis point versus what we are delivering in 2025 into 2026.

Well, I think uh, if if everything stays the same, I think that uh, you know, in this kind of an environment where the volumes are light, etc, etc.

Um, you know, if you look at our Q2, if you look at our Q3 for sure, last year's Q1 was a disaster for us at 99. I mean, I don't think that there will be in that position. So can we say no volume growth, okay? For 2026 versus the same kind of environment, 2026, that we've been seeing in, in, uh, in 2025 with the investment that we're doing in our cost management and all that. So, uh, probably a 200 basis point global improvement, 200 to 300 basis points versus what we are delivering in.

In 25 in 226.

[Analyst 10]: Okay. That's very great color. With respect to the Chief Commercial Officer role, is it fair to say that the candidate has already been identified and is coming from the outside? I'm just curious to see how it will change the jobs performed by Carl and the team overall.

Okay, that's very great, caller. And just with respect to the Chief Commercial Officer role, is it fair to say that the candidate has already been identified and is coming from the outside?

I'm just curious to see how the it will change the jobs performed by uh calling the team. Uh overall.

Alain Bédard: No, the guy comes from the family. The guy is within TFI International.

No, the guy got on the Family.

Okay, the guys is within is within TFI

[Analyst 10]: Okay. That's great color. Okay. Thanks for the time, Alain.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure, Benoît. Thank you.

Okay. Okay, that's great caller. Okay, thanks for the time. Uh, and I

Operator: Next question will be from Bruce Chen at CIFO. Please go ahead, Bruce. Hey, guys. This is actually Prunella, full on for Bruce. Appreciate all the color here. Quick one. Wanted to ask about CapEx. In terms of CapEx budget from here, how would you expect it to trend going forward? What investments are sort of needed as far as maintenance and potentially growth?

thank you.

Please go ahead Bruce.

Hey guys, uh, this is actually pernella full on for Bruce. Um appreciate all the color here. So uh, quick 1.

Uh, wanted to ask about capex uh in terms of capex budget from here. How would you expect it to Trend going forward? What investments are sort of needed as far as maintenance and potentially growth?

Alain Bédard: Yeah. For this year, we've updated our guidance to $150 million to $175 million net capex for 2025. In normal years, it would be more like $300 million, okay? That's all maintenance capex. The way that we think about capex is really about maintaining the fleet that we need. We're not seeking to grow the fleet organically. When volumes turn, we just use that opportunity to get more productivity out of our assets, use that opportunity to take the highest paying freight, and we get the operating leverage that way.

Yeah. Yeah. So so for this, this year we're we we've updated our guidance to 175 so 150 to 175, net, capex for 25. Um and

In normal years, it would be more like 300, okay? And that's all maintenance capex, the way that we think about uh capex is really about

You know, maintaining the fleet that we need, we're not seeking to grow the fleet organically. When volumes turn, we just use that opportunity to get more productivity out of our assets. We take that opportunity to focus on the highest paying freight, and we get the operating leverage that way.

Operator: All right. Awesome. Thanks, guys.

All right, awesome. Thanks guys.

Alain Bédard: Pleasure. Thank you.

[Analyst 1]: Next question will be from Ari Rosa at Citi Group. Please go ahead, Ari.

Pleasure. Thank you.

Next question will be from Ari, Rosa at Citi group. Please go ahead. Sorry.

[Analyst 2]: Hey, good morning, Alain. David, thank you for taking my question. I wanted to ask about tariff impacts and what you're seeing there. To what extent do you think tariffs are kind of holding back business, whether it's cross-border or in Canada, versus how much of the volume weakness is related to cyclical factors or underlying economic factors that would be independent of the tariffs? To the extent that we get a little bit more tariff clarity, do you see that as a positive or an incremental positive into 2026?

Hey, good morning, Ellen David. Um, thank you for taking my question. So I I wanted to ask about uh, tariff impacts and what you're seeing there, you know, to what extent do you think tariffs are kind of holding back business? Uh, whether it's cross border or in Canada, versus how much of kind of the volume weakness is related to kind of cyclical factors or kind of underlying economic factors that would be independent of, of the terrorists. And then to the extent that we get a little bit more tariff Clarity. Do you, do you see that as a positive or an incremental positive into 2026?

[Analyst 3]: If you don't know the rules, everybody sits on the sideline, right? The problem we have right now is that we don't have a deal. I mean, Mexico or Canada, both countries, big traders with the U.S., we don't have a deal, right? This is why it's so important that in 2026, at one point, there has to be a deal between the three countries, right? In the meantime, in terms of not knowing where we're going, for sure it's a big effect, right? If you take the aluminum, I was reading what the president of Rio Tinto is saying. I mean, aluminum is not affecting them, the tariff, okay? What they're doing is they're shipping some of their aluminum from Canada to Europe. It's affecting me because I don't have any ships, right? Down the road, this is temporary. For sure, this will change.

Well, what they

for sure.

if you don't know the rules,

Sidelines.

Right? And and the problem we have right now is that we don't have a deal. I mean, Mexico or Canada.

Uh, both countries are big traders with the U.S. We don't have a deal. All right, so this is why it's so important that in 2026, at 1 point. Okay? There has to be a deal between the 3 countries, right? So, and in the meantime, okay, in terms of not knowing where we're going, right for sure. It's a big effect, right? If you think about aluminum, okay? I was reading what the president of Rio Tinto is saying; I mean, aluminum is not affecting them, okay?

Okay, the Tariff, okay. Uh so but what they're doing is they're shipping some of their aluminum from Canada to the Europe.

[Analyst 3]: As soon as we have clarity on tariff, finalized all that, that product will go back to the U.S., right? We need to have a deal between the three countries. Once we have that, whatever it is, then we know what to do and what kind of adjustment will be needed, and then it's going to be clear sailing.

Well, it's affecting me because I don't have any ships, right? But down the road, okay, this is temporary. I mean, for sure, this will change. As soon as we have Clarity on tariffs, finalized all that. I mean, that product will go back to the US, right? Uh, so it's just, we need to have a, a, a deal between the 3 countries. And once we have that, whatever it is, okay? Then we know what to do and what kind of adjustment will be needed and and then it's going to be clear sailing.

[Analyst 2]: Let's hope we get some clarity on that in the months ahead. Just as a follow-up, Alain, I wanted to ask about how you're thinking about the dynamics between Less-Than-Truckload and Truckload right now. Do you think there's a lot of Less-Than-Truckload volume that's slipped into the Truckload market? Obviously, if we get some tightening here because of some of these enforcement actions, how positive of an effect can that have for the Less-Than-Truckload market?

[Analyst 3]: When you think about that, you're a truckload guy. You're stuck, okay? What do you do? You try to get the good heavy 5, 10 pallets of LTL, and you give the shipper a good rate, right? Right now, what's happening in the LTL industry is that there's lots of freight that's been moved to the truckload guys, and this is good rates, good freight for LTL. We'll see what happens. When the truckload guys get busier, are they going to walk away from that freight because now, you know, they don't need to do that? Probably. Experience tells us that this is what happens, okay? We'll probably see that sometime in 2026, hopefully, okay? Who knows when, right?

Yeah, well, let's let's hope we get some clarity on that in the, in the months ahead. Um, and then just as a follow-up, uh, and I wanted to ask about, uh, how you're thinking about the Dynamics between LTL and truckload right now. Uh, do you think there's a lot of LTL volume that's slipped into the, into the truckload market. And obviously, if we get some tightening here because of some of these enforcement actions, how positive of an effect can that have uh, for the LTL Market.

Well, that's for sure. I mean when you think about that you're you're a truck little guy, you're stuck. Okay, so what do you do? I mean, you try to get the the good heavy 5 10, pallet of LTL and you give the shipper a good rate, right? So right now, what's happening in the LTL industry is that this

there's lots of freight that's been moved to the truckload guys and this is good rates. Good rates for LTL so we'll see what happens when the truckload guys. Get busier. Okay, are they going to walk away from that phrase because now you know, they don't need to do that.

probably experience tells us that this is what happens, okay, but

Well, we'll probably see that sometimes in 2026. Hopefully. Okay, but who knows when, right?

[Analyst 2]: Okay. Appreciate the thoughts.

Okay, I appreciate the thoughts.

[Analyst 1]: Thank you. At this time, Mr. Bédard, we have no other questions registered. Please proceed.

[Analyst 3]: Thank you, operator, and we appreciate everyone joining us today. Thank you for your interest in TFI International. We look forward to finishing the year strong, and our confidence will be entering 2026 in a position of strength. I look forward to seeing many of you at several investors' conference and will be attending before year-end. As always, please don't hesitate to reach out with any further question. Have a terrific Halloween and have a great weekend, guys. Thank you.

And at this time we have no other questions registered, please proceed.

Well, thank you operator, and we appreciate everyone joining us today. Thank you for your interest in TFI International. We look forward to finishing the year strong and our confident will be entering 26 in a position of strength.

[Analyst 1]: Thank you, sir. Ladies and gentlemen, this does indeed conclude your conference call for today. Once again, thank you for attending. At this time, we do ask that you please disconnect your lines.

I look forward to seeing many of you at several investors conference and we'll be attending before year end. And as always, please don't hesitate to to reach out with any further question. I have a terrific uh, Halloween and have a great weekend, guys. Thank you.

Thank you, sir.

Ladies and gentlemen, this is indeed concluded your conference call for today. Once again, thank you for attending. And at this time we do ask that you, please disconnect your lines