Q3 2025 Cadre Holdings Inc Earnings Call
Speaker #3: Ladies and gentlemen , today's call will begin momentarily . Until that time , you will be on music hold . Thank you for your patience .
Speaker #3: Good morning , and welcome to Cadre Holdings, Inc. Third quarter , 2025 conference Call . Today's call is being recorded . All lines have been placed on mute .
Speaker #3: If you would like to ask a question at the end of the prepared remarks . Please press Star Key . Then the number one on your touchtone phone .
Speaker #3: At this time , I'd like to turn the conference over to Matt Berkowitz of the JB Group for introductions and the reading of the Safe Harbor statement .
Speaker #3: Please go ahead , sir .
Speaker #4: Thank you . And welcome to today's conference call to discuss Cadre's third quarter results . Before we begin , I'd like to remind everyone that during today's call , we will be making several forward looking statements and we make these statements under the safe harbor provisions of the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995 .
Speaker #4: These forward looking statements reflect our best estimates and assumptions based on our understanding of information known to us today . These forward looking statements are to risks and uncertainties that face Khadr and the industries and markets in which we operate .
Speaker #4: More information on potential factors that could affect Cadre's financial results is included from time to time , and Cadre's public subject filed with the Securities and Exchange Commission .
Speaker #4: Please also note that we have posted presentation materials on our website at . Which supplement our comments this morning and include a reconciliation of certain non-GAAP financial measures .
Speaker #4: I'd like to remind everyone that this call will be available for replay through November 19th , 2025 . A webcast replay will also be available via the link provided in yesterday's press release , as well as on Cowdrey's website .
Speaker #4: At this time , I would like to turn the call over to Cadre's chairman and CEO Warren Kanders .
Speaker #5: Good morning and thank you for joining Cadre's third quarter earnings call . I am joined today by our president , Brad Williams , and Chief Financial Officer , Blaine Browers .
Speaker #5: This continues to be an exciting time for cadre marked by outstanding execution , discipline , growth and meaningful progress against our strategic objectives .
Speaker #5: The cadre operating model is driving improvement every day , which is clearly reflected in another quarter of strong results . In addition to delivering financial performance above expectations in Q3 , which Brad and Blayne will outline , we continue to capitalize on cadres robust M&A funnel with the agreement announced last week to acquire tier Tactical , a leading manufacturer of mission critical protective equipment .
Speaker #5: We again delivered on our commitment to expand our portfolio and enhance Cadre's market leadership across categories . Tier tactical brings world class engineering capabilities and global reach , which importantly includes relationships with key military customers in Northern Europe that we believe will help cadre unlock new growth opportunities in high value end markets .
Speaker #5: Under the leadership of Jason and Jane Beck , tier has seen impressive growth since its founding in 2010 and shares with cadre a long standing commitment to innovation , quality and a life saving mission .
Speaker #5: We are excited to partner with Jason and Jane and welcome them both as significant shareholders for Cadre. This agreement marks our sixth and largest acquisition since going public, along with our recent deals in the nuclear and robotics markets.
Speaker #5: It underscores our relentless focus on disciplined M&A that strengthens our diversified platform of durable safety businesses . In total , over the past 24 months , we have deployed more than 400 million consistent with this strategy .
Speaker #5: Looking ahead , we continue to see robust acquisition pipelines in both the public safety and nuclear markets . We will remain patient and disciplined in our approach to identify high quality , high margin businesses that align with our operating model and can deliver sustainable growth and strong cash flow generation over time .
Speaker #5: Before I turn it over to Brad , I want to thank our employees for their hard work and dedication in upholding our mission .
Speaker #5: Together , we save lives . The results this quarter once again demonstrate the strength of our culture , the resilience of our businesses and our team's ability to deliver consistent execution .
Speaker #5: We are confident that the foundations we have built will continue to drive long term value creation for our shareholders . With that , thank you for being with us today , and I will turn the call over to Brad .
Speaker #5: Brad , over to you .
Speaker #6: Thank you . Warren . On today's call , Blaine and I will provide a Q3 update and business overview , including recent trends , financial performance , and full year outlook , followed by a Q&A session .
Speaker #6: We'll Despite a dynamic operating environment . We continued to successfully implement our pricing strategy , which reflects both the strength of our brands and the value of our customers place on our mission critical products .
Speaker #6: begin on slide five . During the third quarter , we again delivered on our strategic objectives , advancing cadres track record of consistent and stable growth .
Speaker #6: Third quarter mix was positive , driven by strong demand for EOD and favorable product mix in our nuclear categories . Importantly , our organic backlog increased by $20 million sequentially , reinforcing our confidence in the outlook for the remainder of the year .
Speaker #6: Based on our discussion last quarter , you'll recall that we saw a higher mix of large opportunities that have been delayed . This significant backlog growth is a very promising sign , reflective of our progress booking .
Speaker #6: Some of these previously delayed opportunities . I will speak more about this progress shortly . In terms of capital allocation , cadre , strong free cash flow generation enables the company to make dividend payments while also supporting core organic growth and M&A objectives .
Speaker #6: Our November dividend will mark our 16th consecutive since our IPO . As you heard from Warren , we also delivered on our commitment to enhancing cadres market leadership through disciplined M&A .
Speaker #6: Our agreement to acquire tier tactical represents a significant step forward in advancing cadre strategic focus on mission critical products with high margins , strong cash flows and compelling growth tailwinds .
Speaker #6: It further opens the door to international markets and provides access to new customers based on long standing relationships that drive demand . Blaine will speak more about the deal shortly , specifically about tiers differentiated customer base , and highly unique manufacturing capabilities .
Speaker #6: Overall tier is exactly the kind of high quality , strategically aligned business we seek to add to our platform , one that enhances our leadership , accelerates growth and delivers long term value for our shareholders .
Speaker #6: Turning to slide six, I'd like to highlight another major win for the company in September. Cadre's EOD business, Met Inge, was awarded the BMO contract, known as the Blast Exposure Monitoring System, by the U.S. Department of Defense.
Speaker #6: This is a $50 million Idec contract signifying a major achievement for our team and a significant milestone in our work with the US military .
Speaker #6: Those who have followed us since our IPO know this award has been a part of our long term roadmap , and something that we have been working towards since 2019 .
Speaker #6: While the formal press release has been delayed due to the government's shutdown , the award information has been made public through Sam.gov and the DoD website .
Speaker #6: Links are available in the materials we shared yesterday . The BMO Award builds on Med Engine's legacy as the global standard in bomb suits , with market share of approximately 90% .
Speaker #6: Its reputation as the most trusted brand in the industry is based on decades of experience evaluating blast effects on personnel and protective equipment .
Speaker #6: For the last 20 years , the team has been designing , manufacturing , testing and commercializing several generations of wearable blast sensors , culminating in this latest technology .
Speaker #6: We're incredibly proud to win this award , which is a testament to Cadre's long term commitment to innovation and also positions med inj at the forefront of efforts to better understand and mitigate blast exposure in the field .
Speaker #6: Moving forward . Next on slide seven . We lay out industry tailwinds supporting Cadre's long term growth opportunity across both our core LA and nuclear safety sectors .
Speaker #6: On the law enforcement side , we see rising safety threats globally , coupled with resilient and growing spend on protection equipment . And both the US and in Europe .
Speaker #6: Sephora support for public safety is bipartisan . Turning to nuclear long term demand continues to be driven by policy and commercial tailwinds across our three market segments .
Speaker #6: Environmental management , National security , and nuclear energy . Support across these markets continues to build both in the public and private sectors , with the government clearing the path and private investment flowing in .
Speaker #6: Landmark announcements dominate the headlines from federal partnerships to state level investments . All reinforcing the recognition that nuclear must play a central role in achieving energy security and reliability .
Speaker #6: In this years ahead . Combined with nuclear material waste processing and expanding national defense initiatives . Today , nuclear Group is strategically positioned at the forefront of a rapidly evolving industry with large scale and collective capabilities to support the full nuclear lifecycle .
Speaker #6: On slide eight , I'll take a moment to zoom in on a couple of market trends , and their impacts on our core law enforcement business trends in North America .
Speaker #6: Law enforcement remained positive , highlighted by significant federal investment in government agencies , including substantial focus on recruitment . Looking at another market trend highlighted on the slide , new products and innovation drive everything we do at cadre .
Speaker #6: We continue to hear enthusiastic feedback about new products launched over the past 24 months , including our tactical carrier system , HyperX and the Safariland six hp package .
Speaker #6: The thinnest , lightest , and most protective hybrid ballistic armor on the market . Before I turn it over to Blaine , I would like to briefly address the macro environment .
Speaker #6: Last quarter , we spoke about how our full year outlook was slightly affected by our higher mix of large opportunities that have been delayed .
Speaker #6: There was a level uncertainty related to timing and whether these opportunities would be booked this year or early next year . We are pleased to report that we have made considerable progress in the third quarter , booking some of these reflected in the significant backlog growth that I referred to earlier .
Speaker #6: One of those opportunities is the Blast sensor five year idiq that the US Department of Defense has disclosed on its website , as well as Sam.gov .
Speaker #6: We received our first BMO purchase order for approximately $10 million , with shipments being planned throughout 2026 . Additionally , we received large duty gear , armor , crowd control , and EOD purchase orders in Q3 .
Speaker #6: Our expectation has not changed; we anticipate that other larger opportunities will book in the coming quarters as we continue to track well on these opportunities.
Speaker #6: I'll now turn the call over to our CFO , Blaine Browers , to speak to more more about M&A cadres . Q3 financial results and 2025 outlook .
Speaker #7: Thanks , Brad . I'll kick off my comments with the review of our latest acquisition , as well as our M&A strategy . More broadly .
Speaker #7: As Warren and Brad discussed , we've agreed to acquire tier tactical , especially provider of high performance advanced tactical gear , including soft armor , hard armor and tactical nylon products to US and Allied militaries and law enforcement agencies around the world .
Speaker #7: It is a business that fits squarely within the strategic criteria that define our disciplined approach to M&A , outlined on the right side of the slide .
Speaker #7: Key attributes include a leading market position , strong brand recognition , differentiated manufacturing technology , as well as exceptional product quality and commitment to innovation .
Speaker #7: A key point to underscore is that tier tactical is that the tier tactical customer base has minimal overlap with Cadre's existing Safariland armor business .
Speaker #7: On slide 11 , we showed tier and cadres global armor revenue by customer channel , which illustrates how complementary the two brands will be in the marketplace .
Speaker #7: Tier serves a worldwide customer base , including top tier special ops units , government agencies and militaries . You can see that 66% of its revenue is derived , derived from international customers .
Speaker #7: While US federal and US military totaled 27% . Both areas where Safariland does not have a major foothold today . In addition , tier brings significant hard armor capabilities via their large presses and autoclaves that will be a significant resource addition to the cadre Armor business .
Speaker #7: We are excited about how the strengths of both companies will complement each other and enable new growth opportunities in particular , we believe the cadre operating model will unlock significant value for both brands .
Speaker #7: Taking a step back in terms of M&A strategy , this latest transaction demonstrates that we are not done building upon our leadership positions and our core law enforcement , military categories .
Speaker #7: Despite our long term vision to launch multiple new verticals , we continue to see attractive opportunities to broaden our product range . Enter new markets , and increase customer wallet share .
Speaker #7: Overall, the M&A market remains strong, and we're excited about the prospect of add-on opportunities across both nuclear and core law enforcement targets.
Speaker #7: Moving forward . Turning now to a summary of Cadre's financial performance . Slide 13 details our third quarter results . Q3 net sales of 155.9 million increased 42% year over year .
Speaker #7: Of note , third quarter gross margin improved 610 basis points year over year and 180 basis points sequentially year over year . It's driven by favorable pricing .
Speaker #7: The absence of inventory , step up amortization , in the prior year , and the cyber incident in 2020 . For illustrated on slide 14 is net sales and adjusted EBITDA growth year over year , including our 2025 guidance , which I'll discuss more in a moment .
Speaker #7: Our full year outlook implies a year over year revenue and adjusted EBITDA growth of 10.5% and 8.7% , respectively , at the midpoints on slide 15 , we present our capital structure as of June 30th , 20 , 2025 .
Speaker #7: Prior to the agreement to acquire tier Tactical , our pro forma net leverage will be around 2.7 times when the deal closes , we believe Cadre's strong free cash flow generation , coupled with the strength of our balance sheet , gives us ample financial flexibility to continue to pursue organic and inorganic opportunities ahead .
Speaker #7: We are reaffirming our 2025 guidance on slide 16. Net sales are expected to be between $624 million and $630 million. Our adjusted EBITDA guidance is between $112 million and $116 million, implying adjusted EBITDA margins of 18.2%.
Speaker #7: I'll now turn it back to Brad for concluding comments .
Speaker #6: Thank you . Blaine . We're excited . We're executing well against our strategic priorities and our strong Q3 results underscore the effectiveness of the cadre operating model and the dedication of our talented teams around the world .
Speaker #6: Complementing our core organic growth initiatives , we are particularly happy about the recent progress we have made on our M&A program . With the agreement to acquire Tier Tactical .
Speaker #6: We can't wait to get started and begin the integration process following the expected close in the first half of 2026 , supported by Cadre's entrenched positions and favorable industry trends across our law enforcement .
Speaker #6: First responder , military and nuclear and markets , we're excited to continue to build our platform and further enhance our market leadership . Moving forward .
Speaker #6: With that, operator, please open up the lines for Q&A.
Speaker #3: At this time , if you would like to ask a question , press star followed by the number one on your telephone keypad .
Speaker #3: Your first question is from the line of Larry Solo with CJS securities .
Speaker #8: Great . Good morning guys . Congrats on a good quarter . Really nice margin improvement sequentially . I think I was just at it because I guess year over year is a little tough to look at because of the the cybersecurity comp .
Speaker #8: But I don't know any thoughts , any color just on the the nice sequential improvement looks like gross margin was up almost 200 bips , which dropped to EBITDA .
Speaker #8: I imagine the operating model can't work that fast . So I'm just curious . Any thoughts on that ? And just color on how you know , cars is progressing under that operating model , which obviously you only have for a few months , but any thoughts on that ?
Speaker #8: Would be great to . .
Speaker #7: Yeah . Appreciate the question . Larry . And you know , when we look at the margin improvement , I'd say the really positive piece we see is it's pretty broad based .
Speaker #7: This isn't margin driven by one particular business . So sequentially we saw improvement really in all our major categories . And kind of with within that you're going to have some price sequentially .
Speaker #7: You know , a lot of that's written by productivity and then some positive mix in the quarter as well . But again , kind of going back , it is very broad based .
Speaker #7: This isn't , a case where one particular business was driving that improvement , but it's what we really like to see , which is everyone really executing well and seeing those margins drop through .
Speaker #6: And then , hey , Larry , it's Brad on the on the car side of things . You asked about the operating model and kind of where we're at on that really good progress .
Speaker #6: We've actually had the gentleman that leads our operating model has been over to Germany and also the UK meeting with Bindels and also the Polish miller businesses and taking a look at the progress they've made with the initial tools in the operating model .
Speaker #6: And you know , as of a week before last , the team reported just exceptional progress . So culturally they're excited about the tools they're adopting .
Speaker #6: The tools . You know , it takes a while to to learn these tools and master them as you go forward . But we're really excited about what's going on in the progress that's happening .
Speaker #8: Great . And just switching gears , if I can just on the edge and I know you discussed this a little bit more at your Analyst Day , $50 million , ID , I imagine .
Speaker #8: I suppose this could expand significantly over , you know , the longer term , it's a much larger market opportunity . And I think this is an exclusive award for you to .
Speaker #8: So I just color on that longer term opportunity . There .
Speaker #6: Yeah , absolutely . So if you remember back in IPO days , we had this listed as one of our kind of longer term opportunities .
Speaker #6: And you know , like a lot of , you know , bigger R&D projects like this with , you know , with us Department of Defense , things get pushed around and delayed so that that's where we kind of ended up at this point .
Speaker #6: But the good news is , you know , at this point , it looks like , you know , that award the 50 million ID IQ .
Speaker #6: And then the initial $10 million purchase order , which is great , by the way , for those that know , I'd , you know , sometimes those initial purchase orders aren't that large .
Speaker #6: So that just shows you the commitment . That's that's behind the program at this point from from the DoD . We're going to take one of these at a time .
Speaker #6: So this obviously gives us an upper hand on , you know , any competitors out there in the marketplace that , you know , I've been looking at blast sensors or working on blast sensor technology because now with this adoption for us , it gives us that opportunity to , you know , to take this technology to other countries .
Speaker #6: I won't disclose which countries have already reached out , but we've had other countries reach out asking for sensors , having meetings with our technical teams , etc.
Speaker #6: . So , you know , we'll see where it goes . But we feel like it's a good future forward with the Blast sensor program .
Speaker #8: Great . Thank you . I appreciate all that .
Speaker #6: Thanks , Larry .
Speaker #3: Your next question is from the line of Jeff Van Sinderen with B Riley Securities .
Speaker #9: Good morning everyone . Just wanted to touch on or circle back to I guess , gross margins as a leverage as we're thinking about Q4 , anything in the expected mix of business that's likely to impact gross margin ?
Speaker #9: Also realizing it's early and you haven't closed the tier acquisition yet , but assuming the closure of Teer and then second half contribution from tier next year , among other business inputs , would you expect gross margin to increase next year ?
Speaker #9: Just thinking about all that together ?
Speaker #7: Yeah , I appreciate the question . You know , for for gross margins in Q4 , you know , we expect them really to land somewhere between , Q2 and Q3 rates , maybe a little bit on the higher end range based on what we've seen in Q3 in the backlog , makeup for the rest of the year , and then , yeah , I think as you've seen before , if you look back to Q4 last year , you know , the operating leverage can be pretty powerful with bigger volume quarters .
Speaker #7: And that's what we kind of look at as the rest of the year . So very positive outlook for the remainder of this year .
Speaker #7: You know , when we layer in tier , keep in mind we'll have , inventory step up amortization as well as some intangibles amortization , which will impact the GAAP gross margin that will report .
Speaker #7: So there's probably , you know , a little bit of pressure there into next year . But that's really only at that gross margin line as we move down to adjusted EBITDA .
Speaker #7: Yeah . As we've said , it will be you accretive on the bottom line . So we're you're getting very excited about that and really bringing those two businesses together .
Speaker #7: As we talked about , we think there's tremendous value on both sides of the business . And looking forward to having the tier business join the Khadr family .
Speaker #7: And really, the opportunity for both sides to learn from each other.
Speaker #9: Okay . And I know you touched on this a little bit at the Analyst Day , but , you know , maybe you can kind of speak to the manufacturing capabilities of tier .
Speaker #9: And on that side of the business , how close will you be to vertical integration and manufacturing once you have tier in-house ?
Speaker #6: Yeah , great . Great question . Jeff . So , you know , just to kind of go over , you know , the capabilities that tier has and kind of contrast that to what our call it , our our , you know , our Safariland brand and a couple other our armor brands have .
Speaker #6: So first of all is the pressing capability . That's the biggest one from a equipment standpoint . So as materials , raw materials become more advanced in the armor market , you know , from suppliers like Honeywell and DSM and others , as those become more advanced , it they require a higher level of pressing capacity .
Speaker #6: And the reason you need that is to to press materials so that you can elongate molecules . And , and the raw materials so that , you know , you can continue to have strengthened materials within that process .
Speaker #6: So just to give you an idea , Safariland capabilities from a pressing tonnage standpoint is anywhere from , you know , 250 to we max out around 500 tons of pressing capacity tier has two large presses at 7000 tons .
Speaker #6: Okay . So , you know , at this moment what we've been having to do with our heart armor business , I'm talking plates and shields with some of the newer materials is we have to go externally with a few other companies to press some of these materials so that we can get to the level of pressure that's needed .
Speaker #6: So we're very , very excited about these capabilities that the tier folks have in the Peoria facility . They're and , you know , as we go forward , you know , that that pressing capability will will be used by both companies .
Speaker #6: All right. And then.
Speaker #9: Your last .
Speaker #6: Was in terms of vertical integration , Jeff , the you know , you know , it's we will be know our vertical integration will not be any more than what it is today .
Speaker #6: Right . Because we press today tier presses today in the armour business . If we were going to go additional vertical integration into the supply chain , that would be into the raw material side of things .
Speaker #6: Ballistic materials , for example , nylon materials . And that that side of the supply chain , which we're definitely not in that space .
Speaker #9: Okay . Excellent . Appreciate that . It seems like overall it gives you a pretty nice competitive advantage . In manufacturing capabilities . Thanks for taking my questions .
Speaker #9: I'll take the rest offline okay .
Speaker #6: Appreciate it Jeff .
Speaker #3: Your next question is from the line of Egon McDermott with Jefferies .
Speaker #10: We're taking the question . Organic growth in the quarter looks to have been driven by armor and duty gear . Do you have a sense of how much of that is the step up in demand for these end markets versus easier cyber comps ?
Speaker #7: Yeah , you were a little a little tough to hear , but I think you were asking about organic growth for armor and duty gear and on a year on year , just because of the tough , tough cyber comp , is that correct ?
Speaker #10: That is . Sorry , if I'm not coming in clear .
Speaker #7: No , that's all right . That's all right . Yeah . The you know , when we look at it's a difficult number , let's maybe start with that .
Speaker #7: Trying to adjust out the cyber and spread it out . You know , when we look . Year on year , you know our sequentially we did see growth .
Speaker #7: And you the armor business . And when you kind of spread out prior year for duty gear our run rate is up from last year .
Speaker #7: So we're you know we look at that and say we're in a pretty good position . And then based on the bookings and large orders that have come in and outlook for the year , you know , we're pretty confident we'll have organic growth in those businesses .
Speaker #7: So very excited about kind of where they positioned and it Q3 makes it very difficult to kind of unpeel , but appreciate the question .
Speaker #6: Yeah , I would just add to that by saying just underscore , you know , last quarter we talked about the , you know , higher number of large opportunities that we had in our funnel that the teams were working on .
Speaker #6: And , you know , we got asked quite a few questions about our confidence level in those . And , you know , I think we're we've shown that right with our increase in our backlog .
Speaker #6: You know , backlog increase of 20 million , 10 million of that . And then another 10 million are these larger orders that we're tracking and doing really well on .
Speaker #6: So , you know , the teams lining up those orders , knocking them off one by one . And grabbing those wins . And as we get into , you know , the rest of the year , we've got additional opportunities that fall in that large order bucket that we spoke of last , last quarter .
Speaker #6: And we're still in that that lead position and really excited about those when when they do come through and some of those are are very noteworthy type opportunities that we're we can't wait to talk about externally .
Speaker #6: If we win those .
Speaker #10: That sounds great . And thank you . That's helpful . If I could maybe ask a follow up . You know , the offset I guess in the quarter was order timing in the nuclear business .
Speaker #10: And with , I think , 6.5 million taken out of the nuclear backlog last quarter , would you call out any risk in that end market in terms of demand or funding , whether it be us or international ?
Speaker #7: No . Great , great question . I mean , this is you're to be part of that . You know , alpha safety .
Speaker #7: And you think about that nuclear and business with large opportunities , you know , because it is more concentrated on fewer large opportunities .
Speaker #7: Just naturally we're going to see some some timing around that backlog build . And then backlog bleed as they execute on projects . But when we look ahead and , you know , look at the funnel of opportunities for , both the zircaloy businesses as well as the cars businesses , formerly cars businesses and alpha , you know , we're still very bullish on that .
Speaker #7: Look for for next year and beyond .
Speaker #10: Great . Thank you .
Speaker #7: Thank you .
Speaker #3: Your next question is from the line of Matt Koranda with Roth Capital .
Speaker #10: Hey guys . Maybe .
Speaker #11: Just attacking sort of the the growth question because I know the comparisons a little wonky from last year , attacking it from a different angle .
Speaker #11: What was the nuclear contribution , I guess , to product revenue in the third quarter between cars and Alpha ?
Speaker #7: So the cars businesses would be , you know , kind of right . What you'd expect based on what we disclosed for , for revenue , if you kind of split it out .
Speaker #7: So that gets some just a little bit under 20 million . And you know , Alpha was slightly less in the quarter than you'd expect on a run rate basis .
Speaker #11: Okay . All right . That helps . And then maybe just switching gears and thinking about the guidance that's implied for the fourth quarter .
Speaker #11: Just how the government shutdown might impact things if the shutdown drags on deeper into the fourth quarter . Is there any impact that's contemplated in the guidance , or how should we just be thinking about sort of delivery schedules and the disruption that could happen ?
Speaker #6: Hey , Matt . Brad , hey , appreciate the question . We have considered that in in the guidance overall . You know , there's a couple of our business units and a couple of our product lines that we're watching closely that are connected more to , you know , government being open and whether that's , you know , sign offs on various shipments that need to go out or just the fact that , you know , with the government shutdown , if folks aren't doing training and doing work to then pull through some of the shorter cycle type , you know , businesses that we have .
Speaker #6: So those are contemplated in the Q4 side of things . We're going to keep watching them . We've got our teams , we've got our hit list of which ones .
Speaker #6: Those are the teams go through those on a weekly basis . When they go through their their daily management sessions , daily and weekly , and they're on top of those to continue to push those as we go forward .
Speaker #6: So at this point , we're optimistic that we've got it covered in there .
Speaker #11: Okay . All right . Great . And then maybe just if I could sneak one more in . Great to see the Po on the blast sensor for 10 million .
Speaker #11: I know we're always asking for more detail here , but any thoughts on sort of the cadence of how that could be delivered ?
Speaker #11: Is it to be like lumpier within 1 or 2 quarters next year, or should we just kind of think about irritable delivery on that PO throughout next year?
Speaker #12: No .
Speaker #7: No , I think we expect it to be a bit lumpier . You know , there's kind of two wouldn't say challenges , but two things you got to think about .
Speaker #7: I mean , we have the you know , the first Po and the ID , you know , we'll work to deliver those as , as soon as possible to the end user , which likely kind of waits it towards the kind of front half to middle of the year .
Speaker #7: But we don't know yet . Right . And certainly the government shutdown isn't helping is kind of visibility on any follow on orders .
Speaker #7: And that's when we'll just have to to wait and see .
Speaker #11: Totally fair . All right . I'll leave it there . Thanks , guys .
Speaker #6: Thanks , Matt .
Speaker #3: Your next question is from the line of Jordan Lyons with Bank of America .
Speaker #13: Hey . Good morning . Thanks for taking the question . I just want to ask on your guide . Is there any downside risk just on if the government remains shut down through the rest of either the quarter or just late into November and then two , how are you guys thinking about opportunities for next year with the DHS funding from the reconciliation bill starting to go out for the World Cup ?
Speaker #6: Hey , I'll take the first part of that . So , you know , that's similar question to what , Matt , just asked in terms of the , you know , what's going on from a government shutdown perspective , what's affecting us .
Speaker #6: So , you know , again , you know , we feel like we've got any of those potential slippages covered in the , the Q4 guidance side of things or the full year guidance side of things .
Speaker #6: So but when you look at some of those opportunities within some of the business units , they , they do exist of potential delays .
Speaker #6: But we feel like we're covered at this point .
Speaker #7: And then on the your question about the DHS and World Cup , you know , it . We would likely expect some uptick in spending around security .
Speaker #7: You know, I think it's difficult for us at this point to really point to a particular product or opportunity just because it hasn't kind of gone through the funnel.
Speaker #7: But the great news is the teams are out there staying close to our end users , our customers , our distributors , and just making sure we're in a position to fulfill those needs .
Speaker #7: If and when they ask us . But at this point , really difficult for us to put an estimate out .
Speaker #6: I just add to that , you know , when you think about security , when it comes to those kind of larger scale events like that , you know , if there's any federal folks involved , state and local , when you go head to toe , when you look at those those folks , right , with the tier acquisition , with Safariland products , whether it's holsters , body armor , you know , there's helmets involved , shields involved , crowd control products , you name it .
Speaker #6: That type of stuff . You know , that's that's why we continue to build out in our public safety side of things . You know , we've been in it for a long time , very comfortable with public safety .
Speaker #6: Who's out there , who's in the market , opportunities to go after this is squarely within what we do . So , you know , I'm sure when that tends to move forward as it firms up , you know , with the breadth of products we have , we're going to be right in the mix of that .
Speaker #6: .
Speaker #13: Great . Thank you guys .
Speaker #6: Thank you . Thank you .
Speaker #3: Your next question is from Mark Smith with Lake Street .
Speaker #14: Hi guys . I wanted to ask about input costs and inflation . Is there anything that you see kind of going up significantly and similar with that , you know , is anything changed in your outlook or ability to to take price at and above inflation ?
Speaker #7: No thanks . Great question . You know , our inputs have tracked pretty consistently what we've seen recently . Obviously there's some variability coming into the year with , you know , tariffs and the likely impact .
Speaker #7: But we haven't seen any price come through from destocking from any of our suppliers. So it's one where we're staying close to.
Speaker #7: But that has not been anything unexpected at this point. And you know, we don't have any indications that next year is going to be significantly different.
Speaker #7: So we're , you know , comfortable there , staying close to it . You know , the other piece is we kind of look to kind of the two pieces to counteract any of that pressure .
Speaker #7: If it was to occur right on the price side , as you asked . Nothing's changed in the dynamic . It is one a tool we need to be and will continue to be thoughtful and application of it .
Speaker #7: Right ? No different than how we always approach it . That , you know , we want to be thoughtful , make sure we're getting the value that the products deserve based on their performance in the field .
Speaker #7: The second piece is really that model , right ? And making sure we're leveraging those tools to offset whether it's material or labor inflation or drive increased throughput , throughput or better margins .
Speaker #7: So as we kind of look at it , we feel pretty good about that material inflation environment as we see it today . We also feel really good about the tools we can leverage to to counteract that .
Speaker #7: And really maintain the business and the margins .
Speaker #14: Okay . And then I also want to ask about new product mix . And I know this is tough with , you know , nuclear and acquired business .
Speaker #14: And maybe not as much on a year over year comp , but just as we think about the legacy business , how have new products mixed here recently versus kind of historical averages and then I'm curious , similar to that with tier , if there's a history or legacy of of innovation and new product mix that drives that business .
Speaker #7: Yeah . No , it's a it's a tough number . You know , for us to track . But I can tell you when we look at a couple of the business specifically , you know , compared to what we've historically done , you know , our portfolio is significantly refreshed in the last few years .
Speaker #7: You know , we're seeing gains in those markets with those new products . So that's , you know , very exciting for us .
Speaker #7: And , you know , on the tier , tier was really , you know , built on innovation . And , you know , Jason and Jane and the rest of the team have done a fantastic job of innovating both , you know , around the tactical that the carrier .
Speaker #7: The nylon , as well as the body armor . So , you know , we expect as we bring these two teams together that will really get the best of both worlds and continue that innovation journey for both of us .
Speaker #7: So very excited about the future .
Speaker #14: Great . Thank you .
Speaker #6: Thanks , Mark .