Q3 2025 Cmb.Tech NV Earnings Call

November 26, 2025

Speaker #2: Done in Q3? We achieved a TCE of

Speaker #2: done in Q3? We

Speaker #2: Q4 to date, we are strong. On the Kamsa Max and ...

Speaker #3: Good afternoon,

Speaker #3: And this meeting is being transcribed. Five.

Speaker #4: The CMB.TECH earnings conference call for the third quarter of 2025. My name is Alexander Saverys, and I'm joined by my colleagues Ludovic Saverys, Enya Dechkinden, and Joris Daman.

Speaker #2: Bit if the current markets stay.

Speaker #4: We have the usual topics we want to discuss with you today.

Speaker #4: today, starting with our

Operator: Welcome to the Audio Conferencing Center. Please enter a conference ID followed by pound. You're now joining the meeting.

Speaker #4: financials and the highlights of the Starting with our

Speaker #4: We will then move to the marine division.

Speaker #4: Market update, and we will move into the Q&A. I would like to...

Speaker #4: Close with the conclusion, starting with the financials and Q&A.

Speaker #4: highlights. And we'll therefore hand

Speaker #2: The main drivers for dry bulk, when we look at all the China steel mill utilization, it's China and Brazil iron ore.

Speaker #5: Thanks,

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Speaker #5: Ocean merger. We have roughly

Speaker #2: Exports there are also very... Exports there are also very.

Speaker #5: Water is being constructed. Over 200 and 50.

Speaker #2: segments more demand growth than

Speaker #2: supply growth of

Speaker #2: vessels. Sorry for vessels.

Speaker #5: Alex, you'll see that we finished. But if you move to the next slide, deck.

Speaker #2: Just, I was a bit too.

Speaker #2: Quick. Coal. But we believe definitely for the larger 27, except for.

Speaker #2: see that all numbers are you can see that all numbers are iron ore, coal, grain, and bauxite.

Speaker #2: positive expected positive for 26 and 27, except for.

Speaker #2: Sizes that iron ore and... Zooming in on the demands of sizes that iron ore and...

Speaker #2: bauxite are compensating or

Speaker #2: overcompensating the less demand

Speaker #2: For coal. Watch the space on.

Speaker #2: Grain as well. Not really a grain as well.

Speaker #5: quarter. The CapEx right now

Speaker #2: Big driver for Cape sizes, but important for...

Speaker #5: sits at 1.6

Speaker #2: our Panamaxes. The numbers

Speaker #5: billion and our equity on total assets, book equity.

Speaker #2: And with the

Speaker #2: recent peace agreement on tariffs

Speaker #5: governance still sits

Speaker #5: below 30.4%. We had a

Speaker #5: below above the

Speaker #2: Between China and the U.S., we're expecting that.

Speaker #2: demand hopefully to continue

Speaker #2: on the ton mile side. If we look at the existing fleet, you can compared to the existing

Speaker #2: the number of ships on order compared to

Speaker #2: see that in 2026 and

Speaker #2: 2027, we are going to add some Cape Sizes to the

Speaker #5: Declare an interim dividend of $5.

Speaker #2: Market. But all in all, including market.

Speaker #5: Cents per share, which is going to be

Speaker #5: Payable early share, which is going to be payable in early January. Fully funded. That we have happy to say.

Speaker #2: The number for Panamaxes is 14%. Order book to...

Speaker #2: Fleet, but also there to fleet, but also...

Speaker #2: With the demand figure, I think there, with the demand figure, I...

Speaker #2: and definitely looking positive for supply-demand should be balanced

Speaker #5: By own liquidity and sale of assets. Contract backlog funded.

Speaker #2: that market. An important number to

Speaker #5: But we definitely took a big step forward.

Speaker #2: scrapping. The next three slides

Speaker #5: In Q3, but more importantly, we will...

Speaker #5: million dollars on the VLC Dalma, the Dalma, the Cape Size Battersea.

Speaker #2: ore and bauxite trade. On all three, I can say that we are

Speaker #5: delivery of the VLC

Speaker #2: at a five-year highs in terms of we are at a five-year highs in

Speaker #2: You can see the numbers in terms of output.

Speaker #2: there on the slide. And we've basically tried as well to highlight the

Speaker #2: seasonality. Seasonality

Speaker #2: in the Atlantic Basin, in Australia,

Speaker #2: and for Guinea is dependent on rain. The rainy

Speaker #2: Season usually in Brazil and dependent on rain.

Speaker #2: Australia is in the first

Speaker #5: stage. Moving towards

Speaker #2: Quarter. However, in Guinea, that's quarter.

Speaker #2: and fourth quarters. So we see.

Speaker #5: excited with the timing of the acquisition of

Speaker #2: that the Guinea season can usually be in the third.

Speaker #5: increase in spot exposure

Speaker #5: On dry bulk, which is happening at the right moment, it's playing out.

Speaker #2: because when Australia and Brazil are

Speaker #2: And actually, in the rainy season of Guinea this year, it was less

Speaker #2: than expected. So we saw some good results, but it was less than expected.

Speaker #2: outputs regardless of the rainy

Speaker #2: season. The key

Speaker #2: takeaway here from this slide and from the Australia slide and from the slide and from the Australia

Speaker #2: volumes up, volumes at five-year

Speaker #2: highs, and the seasonality actually Q1 actually

Speaker #5: Moving to the next flow capacity, given the current markets that we have rates, this is a pure assumption. However, you could see this assumption: if the market today would continue that.

Speaker #2: supportive. I'd like to talk about our tankers.

Speaker #5: today would continue going today.

Speaker #2: Yorinav, our tanker division, our tankers.

Speaker #2: and Crude Oil

Speaker #2: Transportation. We have trading fleet

Speaker #2: of 10 VLCCs with another have trading fleet of 10 VLCCs with

Speaker #2: four Eco VLCCs on another four Eco

Speaker #2: Order. Some of the pictures that...

Speaker #5: liquidity over a year. On top

Speaker #5: Of the $420 million that we...

Speaker #2: Delivery of a couple of weeks ago, the Atrebates. We have another four.

Speaker #5: Happy to say, by the way, that we'll reduce.

Speaker #2: 30,500 dollars in We achieved

Speaker #5: end of this quarter. year.

Speaker #2: Q3. So far in Q4, we're at Q3.

Speaker #5: But this slide shows that with the spot exposure and the good market we have, we can generate meaningful leverage for the company. And if people sometimes don't like to spread out over...

Speaker #2: 68,000 dollars with

Speaker #2: 78% fixed. We believe that number can still go up.

Speaker #2: Go up. The fixings and the bookings that

Speaker #2: we have done in recent

Speaker #2: promising. We sold one

Speaker #2: We sold one older ship, the Dalma.

Speaker #2: which generated a capital gain of 26 Dalma, which generated a capital

Speaker #2: million. We've extended one ship by

Speaker #5: million dollars free cash flow per

Speaker #2: Then we delivered two vessels to.

Speaker #2: Hakata and the Hakone. On

Speaker #5: I'll move the floor back to Alex on.

Speaker #2: vessels on the water. We have another two

Speaker #5: The various marine divisions we expect will add 250 flow per quarter.

Speaker #5: Yes, thank you. Which is, I...

Speaker #2: The end of Q1. We sold one Suezmax in Q1.

Speaker #4: Ludovic, I want to take you through our five divisions and the markets in which they operate and what has happened in Q3 and is happening right now.

Speaker #2: Sophia, which was delivered, achieved strong results in Q3.

Speaker #2: 48,000 dollars and

Speaker #4: can see our usual slide

Speaker #4: With the five main topics to take you through our five.

Speaker #2: there we still have some days to fix.

Speaker #4: Markets we operate in: the tankers, dry bulk.

Speaker #2: So there is upside to that But again, some days to fix.

Speaker #2: When we look at the main drivers and the main indicators, we

Speaker #4: Markets, you see that we are.

Speaker #4: Still positive on tankers, positive on dry containers, chemicals, and the offshore.

Speaker #4: bulk, positive on the offshore

Speaker #2: see that a lot of

Speaker #2: indicators are

Speaker #4: market. We are cautious since

Speaker #4: A couple of quarters already on.

Speaker #2: Supply, year on year, it's still.

Speaker #4: supply-demand

Speaker #2: But let's look at what's coming. Zooming in on the...

Speaker #2: Demands, you can see that the

Speaker #4: where we're a little bit more cautious, containers, and

Speaker #2: Forecasts are that there will still be...

Speaker #4: Numbers for 2025 in containers were positive. But our...

Speaker #2: an oversupply of oil

Speaker #2: in the coming months and

Speaker #2: quarters. That leads to

Speaker #4: expected to be quite flat or even down a little.

Speaker #4: bit in 2026.

Speaker #2: That leads to more oil on the...

Speaker #4: Combined by

Speaker #2: Water. That leads to definitely in the

Speaker #4: 32%. And the fact that we are

Speaker #2: Because if we look at the supply of.

Speaker #2: Vessels, you see that this year there's.

Speaker #2: Been very little new ships coming on.

Speaker #4: Which represents today between 10 and a difficult time next year and probably.

Speaker #2: Up. So next year, 26, and in.

Speaker #2: 27, we will see more Suezmaxes and more Suezmaxes and VLCCs come to

Speaker #4: Container markets will have a difficult time expecting a gradual unwinding.

Speaker #4: Same can be said for chemical tankers, be thereafter.

Speaker #2: At the average age of the...

Speaker #4: of the number of ships coming on Supply-demand.

Speaker #4: stream. So we're also a little bit.

Speaker #4: Cautious on the chemical tankers. As you...

Speaker #4: know, our two divisions, Delphis and Bochem, are

Speaker #4: Which is by far our biggest exposure segment, starting with dry bulk.

Speaker #4: Mile demand growth for Cape Sizes this year is bulk, which is by far our biggest.

Speaker #4: There was an increase in tonnage this year of 0.8%.

Speaker #4: meaningful, but still positive. Expected

Speaker #4: to 3%.

Speaker #4: Also aging, 32% of the Capes.

Speaker #4: 15 years and plus, we

Speaker #4: believe that supply-demand fundamentals

Speaker #4: On dry bulk, we are actually very optimistic.

Speaker #2: rates for containers paid. It

Speaker #4: strong. On tankers, very strong.

Speaker #4: We are seeing demand growth this quarter.

Speaker #2: is now at a level

Speaker #2: Which is the lowest of the

Speaker #2: Past two years, the high order

Speaker #2: More than 30% of ships.

Speaker #2: on order, plus the

Speaker #4: supply-demand figures look very good

Speaker #2: unwind, lead us to

Speaker #4: for tankers. Last but not least, on

Speaker #2: being quite cautious on the supply.

Speaker #2: Demand should also be lower next.

Speaker #4: The offshore, offshore wind, but also offshore, has been postponed. But there...

Speaker #4: oil and gas. We have

Speaker #2: So, container markets could be in for a bit of a rough.

Speaker #2: Typical tankers, there are spot exposures that are also very limited. We have a couple.

Speaker #2: Of ships operating in a, all the rest is time charted. We basically our spot exposure.

Speaker #2: So that's basically our spot exposure.

Speaker #2: With all ships having been fixed, we.

Speaker #2: have one more chemical tanker that has

Speaker #2: already been christened, but that will deliver christened, but that will deliver soon soon coming to our fleet. Next

Speaker #4: to zoom in to

Speaker #4: Bosimar, and maybe go back one slide. You for offshore supply vessels.

Speaker #2: Year, we'll have to produce tankers coming to.

Speaker #4: from Golden Ocean that has been renamed to

Speaker #2: And then we have our ships in 28 and 29.

Speaker #4: Renaming program is in full swing. Here, one of the vessels from Golden Ocean that has been ...

Speaker #2: that were fixed to MOL that

Speaker #4: Our Panamaxes, but our renaming all our Capes.

Speaker #2: relatively limited. It's a less

Speaker #2: volatile market, but it has come

Speaker #2: Of last year and the year before. But we are still at very healthy levels.

Speaker #4: Cape sizes, and our Kamsarmaxes and Panamaxes. If we focus on the Newcastle.

Speaker #2: levels. And then I'll finish with wind.

Speaker #2: The offshore wind

Speaker #2: Division. Some of you might have seen in division.

Speaker #4: done in Q3? We

Speaker #2: Our press release, but also in a separate wind cuts.

Speaker #4: 29,500. And in

Speaker #2: press release that we ordered

Speaker #2: an enlarged version of the

Operator: Five.

Speaker #2: CSOV, which we call an

Operator: Good afternoon now, lads. This meeting is being transcribed.

Speaker #2: MPASV. And I'll say something about that.

Alexander Saverys: Welcome to the CMB.TECH Earnings Conference Call for the third quarter of 2025. My name is Alexander Saverys, and I'm joined by my colleagues Ludovic Saverys, Enya Derkinderen, and Joris Daman. We have the usual topics we want to discuss with you today, starting with our financials, and the highlights of the quarter. We will then move to the Marine Division market update, and we will close with the conclusion and Q&A. I would like to start with the financial highlights, and will therefore hand over to our CFO, Ludovic.

Speaker #2: In a second. But maybe first, zooming in.

Speaker #2: on our going

Speaker #2: Concern business. Already of one CSOV.

Speaker #2: We have our CSOVs. We took.

Speaker #2: Delivery already of one CSOV. That ship has been fixed on a...

Speaker #4: ships for

Speaker #2: Very short-term period for business already gave us earnings in the third quarter.

Speaker #2: Australia. It already gave us earnings in the

Speaker #4: strong. On the Kamsamax and

Speaker #4: Panamaxes, definitely a positive surprise for this year.

Speaker #4: Surprise for this year. We have seen.

Speaker #2: new multipurpose accommodation service

Speaker #4: The main drivers for dry bulk, when we look at all the

Ludovic Saverys: Thanks, Alex. If you move to the next slides, this is the typical overview of our company now post-Golden Ocean merger. We have roughly $11 billion worth of assets on the water and being constructed, over 250 ships. We'll go further towards the metrics at a later time in the slide deck. If you move to the next slide, Alex, you'll see that we finished the quarter with the result of roughly $17 million of net profits. Our EBITDA is at $238 million, where we end the quarter with ample liquidity. We have more than $555 million worth of liquidity in the company. The contract backlog stays the same, which means that we add a little bit compared to the natural attrition we have quarter on quarter.

Speaker #2: achieved good rates of close to 3.5

Speaker #4: China and Brazil's iron ore markets are seeing, in the larger segments, definitely more demand growth than previously anticipated.

Speaker #2: The slower period in Q4, our TCE sits.

Speaker #2: Dollars. Here you have a render of.

Speaker #4: But we are seeing, definitely, in the larger...

Speaker #4: supply growth of

Speaker #2: the newest new building

Speaker #4: Sorry for that. Just was a bit too.

Speaker #4: Zooming in on the demand for iron ore, coal, grain, and bauxite,

Speaker #4: Positive expected positive for 26, and you can.

Speaker #4: bauxite are compensating or

Speaker #4: overcompensating the less

Speaker #4: Demand for coal. Watch the space.

Ludovic Saverys: The CapEx right now sits at $1.6 billion, and our equity on total assets, book equity for the bond covenants, still sits above 30.4%. We had a pretty active quarter, obviously apart from finishing the merger with Golden Ocean. The board has decided to declare an interim dividend of $0.05 per share, which is going to be payable early January. Our CapEx program is now fully funded. Happy to say that we have signed all new loan agreements on remaining CapEx, and the equity component has been covered by all liquidity and sale of assets. Our backlog mentions still hovering around $3 billion, but we definitely took a big step forward again in our rejuvenation of the fleet, where we took delivery of seven new build vessels, which have been announced in our training updates.

Speaker #4: Not really a big driver for cape sizes, but important.

Speaker #4: for our Panamaxes. The

Speaker #4: positive. And with the

Speaker #4: recent peace agreement on tariffs

Speaker #4: Between China and the U.S., we're expecting.

Speaker #4: that demand hopefully to

Speaker #4: Continue on the ton-mile side. If we look at the number of ships on order.

Speaker #4: Continue on the ton-mile side. If we look at the number of ships on order...

Speaker #4: fleet, you can see that in 2026

Speaker #4: add some Cape Sizes to the

Speaker #4: But all in all, including 28, the order book to fleet is...

Speaker #4: only 9%. The number for

Speaker #4: only 9%. The number for and 2027, we are going to 28, the order book to fleet is only 9%. Panamaxes is 14%.

Speaker #4: Only 9%. The order book to fleet is only 9%. Panamaxes is 14%. The order book for 2027 is going to 28.

Speaker #4: think supply-demand should be balanced

Speaker #4: and are definitely looking positive both Panamaxes and Cape Sizes are at historical highs in terms of

Speaker #4: For that market, an important note is that historical highs in terms of average age, which always...

Speaker #4: bodes well for potential age, which always bodes well

Ludovic Saverys: We delivered two ships in Q3, but more importantly, we will generate another capital gain of roughly $50 million on the delivery of the VLCC Dalma, the Cape Size Battersea, Zhoushan, and the Suez-Macedonia in Q4. On top of that, we just announced the order of a multi-purpose accommodation service vessel, which is similar to our CSOV, but in a bigger format. Alex will discuss that at a later stage. Moving towards the coming quarters, we're quite excited with the timely acquisition of Golden Ocean, our big increase in spot exposure on dry bulk, which is happening at the right moment. It's playing out well. We have 55,000 shipping days in 2026, from which roughly 47,000 is spot. With a big focus on large tankers and large dry bulk, we're perfectly positioned to enjoy the good markets that we have today.

Speaker #4: Slides are providing you more trade. The Australia iron ore trade, ore trade, and the...

Speaker #4: ore trade, the Australia iron

Speaker #4: Guinea, iron ore and bauxite, and the Guinea iron.

Speaker #4: You can see the And we've basically tried as well to

Speaker #4: numbers there on the slide.

Speaker #4: highlight the seasonality.

Speaker #4: Seasonality in the Atlantic Basin, in Australia, and for Guinea is...

Speaker #4: The rainy season is usually in Brazil and Australia in the first...

Speaker #4: that's usually in the However, in Guinea, third and fourth quarters.

Speaker #4: that the Guinea

Speaker #4: Season can actually help our markets because when Australia and Brazil are.

Speaker #4: down, they are up. And actually, in

Speaker #4: The rainy season of Guinea this year, it down, they are up.

Speaker #4: So, we saw some.

Speaker #4: the rainy season.

Speaker #4: The key takeaway here from this.

Speaker #4: Slide and from the Guinea slide is that we are seeing volumes up, volumes at five-year highs, and the

Ludovic Saverys: Moving to the next slides, here we've made a simple assumption. If the market today would continue going forward, we would show what the free cash flow capacity is at current rates. This is a pure assumption, but you could see that at today's rates, we would add another $600 million of liquidity over a year, on top of the $420 million that we anticipate to pay back on the bonds and on the bridge financing. Happy to say, by the way, that we'll reduce the bridge by another $300 million by the end of this quarter. This slide shows that with the spot exposure and the good market we have, we can generate meaningful free cash flow, showing the operational leverage of the company. If people sometimes don't like to spread out over a year, you can easily filter this into quarter by quarter.

Speaker #4: supportive. I'd like to talk about

Speaker #4: Division and Crude Oil Jorinav, our tanker.

Speaker #4: Transportation. We

Speaker #4: VLCCs on order. Some of the...

Speaker #4: pictures that you have seen during this

Speaker #4: The VLCC that we took delivery of a couple of weeks ago, the Atrebates. We have another.

Speaker #4: weeks and months. We

Speaker #4: achieved 30,500 dollars in months.

Speaker #4: So far in Q4, dollars with 78% fixed. We believe

Speaker #4: we're at 68,000

Speaker #4: The

Speaker #4: fixings and the bookings that we have done

Speaker #4: weeks are looking very promising.

Ludovic Saverys: This would mean at today's market that we would add $250 million of free cash flow per quarter, which I think is a pretty strong sign of our operational leverage. I'll move the floor back to Alex on the various Marine divisions we have.

Speaker #4: Gain of $26 million. We've extended one ship by year: the

Speaker #4: two vessels to the new owners

Speaker #4: In Q3, the Hakata and the new owners in Q3.

Speaker #4: have 17 vessels on the the Suez Maxes, we have 17

Speaker #4: We have another two ships coming in the Hakone fleet next year at the end of Q4. On the Suez Maxes, we...

Alexander Saverys: Yes, thank you, Ludovic. I want to take you through our five divisions and the markets in which they operate, and what has happened in Q3 and is happening right now in Q4. You can see our usual slide with the five main markets we operate in: the tankers, dry bulk, containers, chemicals, and the offshore markets. You see that we are still positive on tankers, positive on dry bulk, positive on the offshore market. We are cautious, since a couple of quarters already, on containers and on chemicals. That has to do with the fundamental supply demand numbers.

Speaker #4: Suez Max, the Sophia, which was We sold one

Speaker #4: And the rates we achieved in Q3 were.

Speaker #4: strong. We're at 48,000

Speaker #4: Dollars and Q4 quarter to date, we

Speaker #4: are close to 60,000 dollars. Q4 quarter to date, we are close to

Speaker #4: But again, there we still have 60,000 dollars.

Speaker #4: So, there is upside to that number. When we look at

Speaker #4: Indicators, we see that a lot.

Speaker #4: of indicators are

Speaker #4: tanker fleet supply, year on

Speaker #4: fleet growth. But let's look

Alexander Saverys: If I start with the divisions where we're a little bit more cautious, containers and chemicals, you can see the demand numbers for 2025 in containers were positive, but are expected to be quite flat or even down a little bit in 2026, combined by huge order book in containers, 32%, and the fact that we are expecting gradual unwinding of the rerouting away from the Red Sea. That means ships will go through the Red Sea again, which represents today between 10% and 12% in ton miles. We think container markets will have a difficult time next year, and probably also the year thereafter. Same can be said for chemical tankers, be it to a lesser extent. Supply demand is a little bit overweight in terms of the number of ships coming on stream. We're also a little bit cautious on the chemical tankers.

Speaker #4: at what's coming. growth.

Speaker #4: Zooming in on the demands, you can.

Speaker #4: see that the forecasts are

Speaker #4: that there will still be an oversupply of.

Speaker #4: oil in the coming

Speaker #4: months and quarters. That

Speaker #4: leads to more storage.

Speaker #4: That leads to more oil in more storage.

Speaker #4: the water. That leads to

Speaker #4: Definitely, in the short term, better rates. Because if we look at the

Speaker #4: Supply of vessels, you see that this...

Speaker #4: year there's been very

Speaker #4: Little new ships are coming onto the water, but it's starting to creep up. So next,

Speaker #4: Year 26, and in 27, we will see short-term better rates.

Speaker #4: VLCCs come to the

Speaker #4: If you look at the average market.

Speaker #4: happens thereafter? A lot will depend on how

Alexander Saverys: As you know, our two divisions, Delphis and Bokem, are mainly covered by time charters and have very little spot exposure. If we turn to the other segments, starting with dry bulk, which is by far our biggest exposure today, we see that there was an increase in ton-mile demand growth for capesizes this year of 0.8%. Not very meaningful, but still positive. Expected to ramp up next year to close to 3%, combined with a supply figure where only 9% of the fleet is on order, where the fleet is also aging, 32% of the cape is 15 years and plus. We believe that supply-demand fundamentals on dry bulk are actually very strong. On tankers, we are seeing demand growth this year, next year in ton-mile.

Speaker #4: Containers have weakened. You can see, but it's starting to creep. A lot will depend on how many more tankers will be involved.

Speaker #4: the SCFI, which

Speaker #4: Reflects the freight rates for, see the SCFI, which reflects the freight.

Speaker #4: containers paid. It has slipped

Speaker #4: down and is now at has slipped down and

Alexander Saverys: We see that the fleet is growing, but because of all the inefficiencies that we are seeing in the market, and I'll talk about that in a minute, we still believe that definitely in the short term, the supply demand figures look very good for tankers. Last but not least, on the offshore, offshore wind, but also offshore oil and gas. We have seen the offshore wind markets grow, even though some projects have been postponed. Therefore, offshore supply vessels, there has been a lot of extra demand for the oil and gas from the oil and gas market. We are seeing offshore wind vessels going into the oil and gas market, and supply demand fundamentals definitely in that market are also positive. I'd like to zoom in to Bossimar and maybe go back one slide.

Speaker #4: a level which is the

Speaker #4: lowest of the past two

Speaker #4: The high order book, more than...

Speaker #4: 30% of ships on

Speaker #4: order, plus the Red

Speaker #4: Sea situation, which will Red Sea situation, which will.

Speaker #4: unwind, lead us to being quiet.

Speaker #4: cautious on the supply side.

Speaker #4: Demand should also be lower next year. So,

Speaker #4: Container markets could be up this year.

Speaker #4: for a bit of a rough

Speaker #4: patch. Typical patch.

Speaker #4: is also very limited. We have a couple of ships operating in a spool. So that's.

Speaker #4: is time-charted. We still have

Speaker #4: Quite an interesting order book. Tankers there are spot exposure. All the rest still have quite an interesting order book.

Speaker #4: With all ships having coming.

Speaker #4: Been fixed; we have one more.

Speaker #4: chemical tanker that has already been

Alexander Saverys: You see here one of the vessels from Golden Ocean that has been renamed to the Mineral Sakura. Our renaming program is in full swing. We are keeping the Golden Ocean or the Golden prefix for our Panamaxes, but are renaming all our capesizes and Newcastlemaxes to Mineral prefixes. We have three large divisions in dry bulk: our Newcastlemaxes, our capesizes, and our Panamaxes. We focus on the Newcastlemaxes first. What have they done in Q3? We achieved a TCE of $29,500. In Q4 to date, we are at close to $34,000. On our capes, the number for Q3 is $20,500, going up in this quarter at $26,200. You can see that we've already fixed quite a substantial amount of ships for Q4, but that number could still go up a little bit if the current markets stay strong.

Speaker #4: Coming to our fleet. Next year, we'll have.

Speaker #4: to product tankers coming to the fleet,

Speaker #4: which are fully fixed. And then we have our ships, the fleet, which are fully fixed.

Speaker #4: In 28 and 29 that were fixed.

Speaker #4: To MOL that will come later. But so...

Speaker #4: Our spot exposure on chemicals is relatively low, so our spot exposure on chemicals is...

Speaker #4: limited. It's a less volatile

Speaker #4: its very high levels

Speaker #4: of last year and the year before. But we are

Speaker #4: levels. And then

Speaker #4: I'll finish with wind cuts. The

Speaker #4: offshore wind cuts.

Speaker #4: Some of you might have seen in our press.

Speaker #4: Release, but also in a separate wind cuts press release that.

Speaker #4: we ordered a

Speaker #4: new CSOV, an enlarged a new CSOV,

Speaker #4: Version of a CSOV, which we

Speaker #4: call an

Speaker #4: MPASV. And I'll say something about that in a.

Speaker #4: Second. But maybe first, zooming in.

Speaker #4: Business. We have our CTVs. We have our ongoing concern.

Speaker #4: We have our CTVs fixed on a very short-term period for business in oil and gas.

Alexander Saverys: On the Capes and Max and Panamaxes, definitely a positive surprise for this year. We have seen rates better than anticipated. We achieved rates around $13,500 in Q3, but that's already come up in Q4 to $17,000. Main drivers for dry bulk, when we look at all the indicators, a lot of them are green. It's positive on the China steel mill utilization, it's positive on soybean imports to China, Brazil iron ore exports there are also very good. Of course, the dry bulk fleet supply is growing, but we are seeing definitely in the larger segments more demand growth than supply growth of vessels. Sorry for that, just was a bit too quick. Zooming in on the demand of iron ore, coal, grain, and bauxite, you can see that all numbers are positive, expected positive for 2026 and 2027, except for coal.

Speaker #4: of 27,000 dollars. The fourth

Speaker #4: second. And then looking at our

Speaker #4: Seasonally strong Q3, we achieved multipurpose accommodation service vessel. With our CTVs, you can see that.

Speaker #4: good rates of close to three and a half thousand dollars

Speaker #4: A day on average. The slower period: thousand dollars a day on average.

Speaker #4: in Q4, our TCE sits

Speaker #4: at at

Speaker #4: 2,800 dollars.

Speaker #4: Here you have a render of the

Speaker #4: Newest new building order for CMB.TECH. So we ordered one.

Speaker #1: Distinctions of design for 120 passengers the on board . But we've upsized it to 150 even to 190 passengers on board . a permanent gangway connection , which is better for oil and gas projects .

Alexander Saverys: We believe definitely for the larger sizes that iron ore and bauxite are compensating or overcompensating the lost demand for coal. Watch the space on grain as well. Not really a big driver for cape sizes, but important for our Panamaxes. The numbers there are very positive. With the recent peace agreement on tariffs between China and the US, we're expecting that demand, hopefully, to continue on the high side. If we look at the number of ships on order compared to the existing fleet, you can see that in 2026 and 2027, we are going to add some cape sizes to the market. All in all, including 2028, the order book to fleet is only 9%. The number for Panamaxes is 14% order book to fleet.

Speaker #1: It will be larger, so be it. It will have our charters. When we look at the market, it will be the only vessel type that can truly operate between, on the one hand, gas.

Speaker #1: Positive and the offshore wind on existing are ships already suited to do that, but this one will be even better suited.

Speaker #1: We have 110 100 ton subsea crane , is which installed when we , and look where that ship will compete , we see that the Flotel markets for oil and gas is one market that we will target at look at .

Speaker #1: Designated ships market; for those that also have crane capability, we see that there's actually not that many vessels. And when we look at that, on the water, and that are being built for this.

Speaker #1: markets Our everywhere , are but clearly , that will be interesting and something to follow is the Brazilian oil and gas market , where we see more 30 fpsos than entering service in the years , which will of vessels coming there .

Alexander Saverys: There, with the demand figure, I think supply and demand should be balanced and definitely looking positive for that market. An important number to highlight is the average vessel age. As you can see, both Panamaxes and cape sizes are at historical highs in terms of average age, which always bodes well for potential scrapping. The next three slides are providing you more information on the Brazil iron ore trade, the Australia iron ore trade, and the Guinea iron ore and bauxite trade. On all three, I can say that we are at five-year highs in terms of output. You can see the numbers there on the slide. We've basically tried as well to highlight the seasonality. Seasonality in the Atlantic Basin, in Australia, and for Guinea is dependent on rain. The rainy season, usually in Brazil and Australia, is in the first quarter.

Speaker #1: The reasoning behind this is we want to trade in the two markets. Eventually, this ship that we have up offshore needs a lot of wind for the next 2 to 3 hours. As the offshore wind is a little bit quieter, we can also go to one of the markets related to oil and gas.

Speaker #1: with this And building newest or with this addition to our fleet , we can end the part the of presentation and support to the Q and a Enya .

Speaker #2: Yes, we will now open the floor for questions.

Speaker #2: Raise your hand. Make sure to introduce yourself and unmute before asking your question. If you can't unmute, you can also use the Q&A section to ask your question.

Speaker #2: And you're a telephone , you dialing in with if can press star five to raise your star six to unmute . And have any follow up questions , of course you can reach out to us , but I will new open the floor for if you so you can raise your hands .

Alexander Saverys: However, in Guinea, that's usually in the third and fourth quarters. We see that the Guinea season can actually help our markets because when Australia and Brazil are down, they are up. Actually, in the rainy season of Guinea this year, it was less than expected. We saw good output regardless of the rainy season. The key takeaway here from this slide, from the Australia slide, and from the Guinea slide is that we are seeing volumes up, volumes at five-year highs, and the seasonality in Q4 and Q1 actually supportive. I'd like to talk about our tankers, URNAV, our tanker division, and crude oil transportation. We have a training fleet of 10 VLCCs with another four ECO VLCCs on order.

Speaker #2: The first one is through the Mercadal. Can you now unmute and ask your question, please?

Speaker #3: Yeah .

Speaker #4: Hi everyone . This is from Clarksons . First I wanted to ask you about the IMO . You know , the delayed the carbon pricing year by a at least .

Uh, carbon pricing, uh, by, uh, year at least. So, what's your verdict on this?

The carbon pricing, uh, by, uh, year at least. So, what's your verdict on this?

Alexander Saverys: Some of the pictures that you have seen during this presentation highlight the new VLCC that we took delivery of a couple of weeks ago, the Akrebates. We have another four coming in the following weeks and months. We achieved $30,500 in Q3. So far in Q4, we're at $68,000 with 78% fixed. We believe that number can still go up. The fixings and the bookings that we have done in recent days and in the coming weeks are looking very promising. We sold one older ship, the Dalma, which generated a capital gain of $26 million. We've extended one ship by year, the Donusa. We delivered two vessels to the new owners in Q3, the Hakata and the Hakone. On the Suezmaxes, we have 17 vessels on the water. We have another two ships coming in the fleet next year at the end of Q1.

And have you seen any change, I guess, in terms of...

And how do you see it changing? I guess, in terms of...

And how do you see that it has changed? I guess in terms of...

And how you see it and how it changed. I guess in terms of.

Let's say interest or demand for a dual-fuel technology after that.

Let's say interest or demand for dealership technology after that.

Let's say interest or demand for a due technology after that.

Let's say interest or demand for deal technology after that.

Yep. And thanks for the. I think it's a question many people have um, well first on the delay, uh whether it's going to be a 1 year delay or 2 years delay or 3 it is a, we don't know. Um we have of course not based on strategy uh on the IMO coming to fruition in 2028. Uh it definitely helps our business case uh but our strategy on dual fuel engines is based on finding

Yep. And thanks for the. I think it's a question many people have um, well first on the delay, uh whether it's going to be a 1 year delay or 2 years delay or 3, this is a, we don't know. Um we have of course not based on strategy. Uh on the IMO coming to fruition in 2028. Uh it definitely helps our business case uh but our strategy on dual fuel engines is based on finding like

Partners to Charter these vessels and use the technology to decarbonize.

Alexander Saverys: We sold one Suezmax, the Sophia, which was delivered in Q4. The rates we achieved in Q3 were strong, were $48,000. Q4 quarter to date, we are close to $60,000. There we still have some days to fix, so there is upside to that number. When we look at the main drivers and the main indicators, we see that a lot of indicators are positive. Also on the tanker fleet supply, year on year, still a moderate fleet growth. Let's look at what's coming. Zooming in on the demand, you can see that the forecasts are that there will still be an oversupply of oil in the coming months and quarters. That leads to more storage. That leads to more oil on the water. That leads to, definitely in the short term, better rates.

Certainly helps our business case, uh, but our strategy on dual fuel engines is based on finding like-minded Partners, uh, to, uh, Charter these vessels and use the technology to decarbonize. We have the EU legislation which is in place, which is definitely supportive. Uh, IMO would have been a very nice to have, it's not a must-have for strategy, and for our plans, um, our opinion on whether, uh, eventually they will find an agreement on the IMO level is that, we don't know, uh, but we do see that after the failure of IMO, there's a lot more discussion between, uh, countries on a bilateral basis to

Like-minded partners, uh, to, uh, charter these vessels and use the technology to decarbonize. We have the EU legislation which is in place, which is definitely supportive. Uh, IMO would have been a very nice to have; it's not a must-have for strategy and for our plans. Um, our opinion on whether, uh, eventually they will find an agreement on the IMO level is that we don't know, uh, but we do see that after the failure of IMO, there's a lot more discussion between, uh, countries on a bilateral basis.

See what can be done on certain trade lanes? Say, Australia to China, for instance, or a trade that is linked to Europe. So the last words have definitely not been said, but it will not change anything in our strategy.

To see what can be done on certain trade lanes, say Australia to China for instance, or trades that are linked to Europe. So the last words have definitely not been said, but it will not change anything to our strategy.

Helps our business case, uh, but our strategy on dual fuel engines is based on finding like-minded partners, uh, to, uh, charter these vessels and use the technology to decarbonize. We have the EU legislation which is in place, which is definitely supportive. Uh, the IMO would have been a very nice to have; it's not a must-have for our strategy and for our plans. Um, our opinion on whether, uh, eventually they will find an agreement on the IMO level is that we don't know, uh, but we do see that after the failure of the IMO, there's a lot more discussion between, uh, countries on a bilateral basis to see what can be done on certain trade lanes. Say Australia to China, for instance, or trades that are linked to Europe. So the last word has definitely not been said, uh, but it will not change anything to our strategy.

We have the EU legislation which is in place which is definitely supportive. Uh, IMO would have been a very nice to have, it's not a must-have for strategy, and for our plans, um, our opinion on whether, uh, eventually they will find an agreement on the IMO level is that, we don't know, uh, but we do see that after the failure of IMO, there's a lot more discussion between, uh, countries on a bilateral basis to see what can be done on certain trade Lanes. Say Australia to China, for instance, or a trades that are linked to Europe. So the last words has definitely not been said uh, but it will not change anything to our strategy.

Okay, fair enough. Uh, one question on your, let's say, investment philosophy. Uh, so you ordered a few large, uh,

CEOs of these, I guess you can call it.

Okay, fair enough. Uh, one question on your, let's say, investment philosophy. Uh, so you ordered a few large CEOs of these, I guess you can call it.

Um, but how do you think about opportunities in other segments, like dry bulk and tankers? Are you looking to invest more there, or maybe trim or sell?

Um, but how do you think about opportunities in other segments, like dry bulk and tankers? Are you looking to invest more there, or maybe between, or sell?

Those segments.

And those segments?

Alexander Saverys: If we look at the supply of vessels, you see that this year there's been very little new ships coming on the water. It's starting to creep up. Next year, 2026, and 2027, we will see more Suezmaxes and VLCCs come to the market. If you look at the average age of the fleet, this new supply should definitely be manageable. In the very short term, maybe even medium term, we are still bullish on rates for tankers. What happens thereafter? A lot will depend on how many more tankers will be ordered and added to the order book. We are not at the single-digit numbers anymore. For the VLCCs, we're at 15% order book to fleet, and Suezmaxes, 20%. It's not what it used to be.

Well, um, I think we've invested already a lot over the last 2 to 3 years at the right time, I would say. Um, we will always look opportunistically at new buildings, but today clearly, we think new buildings are quite pricey. That doesn't mean we would not order, uh, if it's the right value and if we believe.

Well, um, I think we've invested already a lot over the last 2 to 3 years at the right time, I would say. Um, we will always look opportunistically at new buildings, but today, clearly, we think new buildings are quite pricey. That doesn't mean we would not order if it's the right value and if we believe that it will.

Alexander Saverys: I would say that in the short to medium term, things are still looking very good. Also, the age of the fleet is supportive. On containers, we can be quite brief. As you know, the exposure we have on containers is limited. Actually, it's zero. We have fixed all our ships, the four vessels on the water, to CMA CGM. We have one ship coming next year on a 15-year charter. The market on containers has weakened. You can see the SCFI, which reflects the freight rates for containers paid. It has slipped down and is now at a level which is the lowest of the past two years. The high order book, more than 30% of ships on order, plus the ready situation with the fuel unwind, lead us to being quite cautious on the supply side. Demand should also be lower next year.

Well um I think we've invested already a lot over the last 2, 3 years at at the right time, I would say, um, we will always look opportunistically at new buildings, but today clearly, we think new buildings are quite pricey. Uh, that doesn't mean we would not order uh, if uh, it's the right value and if we believe uh, that it will create value for us and and our balance sheet can take it. Um, we just saw that we ordered uh this extra wind vessel which is really an offshore vessel, uh we think there's very good value there. We think this is also. Something. CNB Tech can perfectly do even if we have more options that we can declare going forward. Um, so but that's on the new building side on the second hands. You have seen, and we will continue to do that. That we're clearing out our older vessels. Uh, because we just think rates are very good. Uh, and and the prices for secondhand tonnage, are at a level where we rather sellers than buyers. Um, we still have a couple of older vessels, don't be surprised if we clear them out.

Well um I think we've invested already a lot over the last 2, 3 years at at the right time, I would say, um, we will always look opportunistically at new buildings, but today clearly, we think new buildings are quite pricey. Uh, that doesn't mean we would not order uh, if uh, it's the right value and if we believe uh, that it will create value for us and and our balance sheet can take it. Um, we just saw that we ordered uh this extra wind vessel which is really an offshore vessel, uh we think there's very good value there. We think this is also. Something. CNB Tech can perfectly do even if we have more options that we can declare going forward. Um, so but that's on the new building side on the second hands. You have seen and we will continue to do that. That we're clearing out our older vessels. Uh, because we just think, uh, rates are very good. Uh, and and the prices for secondhand tonnage, are at a level where we rather sellers than buyers. Um, we still have a couple of older vessels, don't be surprised if we clear them out.

Uh, but then there will come a point where we're very satisfied with the age profile of our ship, and we're very satisfied with basically staying on the market and enjoying the good markets.

But then there will come a point where we're very satisfied with the age profile of our ship, and we're very satisfied with basically staying on the market and enjoying the good markets.

Will create value for us and and our balance sheet can take it. Um, we just saw that we ordered uh this extra wind vessel which is really an offshore vessel, uh we think there's very good value there. We think this is also. Something. CNB Tech can perfectly do even if we have more options that we can declare going forward. Um, so but that's on the new building side on the second hands. You have seen and we will continue to do that. That we're clearing out our older vessels. Uh, because we just think, uh, rates are very good. Uh, and and the prices for secondhand tonnage, are at a level where we rather sellers than buyers. Um, we still have a couple of older vessels, don't be surprised if we clear them out but then they will come a point where we're very satisfied with the age profile of our ship and we're very satisfied of basically staying on the market and and enjoying the good markets.

Uh that it will create value for us and and our balance sheet can take it. Um you just saw that we ordered uh this extra wind vessel which is really an offshore vessel. Uh we think there's very good value there. We think this is also. Something. CNB Tech can perfectly do even if we have more options that we can declare going forward. Um, so but that's on the new building side on the second hand you have seen. And we will continue to do that. That we're clearing out our older vessels. Uh, because we just think, uh, rates are very good. Uh, and and the prices for secondhand tonnage, are at a level where we rather sellers than buyers. Um, we still have a couple of older vessels, don't be surprised if we clear them out but then they will come a point where we're very satisfied with the age profile of our ship and we're very satisfied of basically staying on the market and and enjoying the good markets.

Okay, uh, last question on the dividends. So this is the $0.05.

Okay, uh, last question on the dividends. So this is the 5 cents.

Okay, uh, last question on the dividends. So, this is the 5 cents.

You know, second quarter in a row. So that makes it tempting to think this is some type of minimum level going forward, or should investors?

You know, second quarter in a row. So that makes it tempting to think this is some type of minimum level going forward, or should we invest?

You know, second quarter in a row. So that makes it tempting to think this is some type of minimum level going forward, or should investors?

Expect, uh, you know, dividends are flexible going forward.

Alexander Saverys: Container markets could be up for a bit of a rough patch. Tankers, their spot exposure is also very limited. We have a couple of ships operating in a spool, so that's basically our spot exposure. All the rest is time chartered. We still have quite an interesting order book coming, with all ships having been fixed. We have one more chemical tanker that has already been christened, but that will deliver soon, coming to our fleet. Next year, we'll have two product tankers coming to the fleet, which are fully fixed. We have our ships in 2028 and 2029 that were fixed to MOL that will come later. Our spot exposure on chemicals is relatively limited. It's a less volatile market, but it has come off its very high levels of last year and the year before.

I think, uh, Alisa, if I'll take it, um, we have a fully discretionary dividend policy. Um, I think we've been pretty clear, uh, that every quarter the board will decide, you know, what we'll do with the cash that we have.

I think, Alex, if I'll take it, um, we have a fully discretionary dividend policy. Um, I think we've been pretty clear, uh, that every quarter the board will decide, you know, what we'll do with the cash that we have.

I think, uh, Alisa, if I'll take it, um, we have a full discussion here on dividend policy. Um, I think we've been pretty clear, uh, that every quarter the board will decide, you know, what we'll do with the cash that we have.

And I check to see, um, that with the minimum cash flow generation that we are seeing in Q4 and that we're expecting in Q1, um, there will definitely be a further look at how to reward the shareholders. Whether that be share buybacks, dividends, or an accelerated clearing out of some of the bonds. Some people have mentioned the bridge financing or just reducing leverage. I think it's about the markets and the way we positioned ourselves in there.

I think it's these markings, the way we positioned ourselves in there.

Alexander Saverys: We are still at very healthy levels. I'll finish with wind cut, the offshore wind division. Some of you might have seen in our press release, but also in a separate wind cut press release, that we ordered a new CSOV, an enlarged version of the CSOV, which we call an MPASV. I'll say something about that in a second. Maybe first zooming in on our going consumer business. We have our CTVs, we have our CSOVs. We took delivery already of one CSOV. That ship has been fixed on a very short-term period for business in oil and gas in Australia. It already gave us earnings in the third quarter of $27,000. The fourth quarter, rates are going up to $118,000, with most of the days already fixed. We have ordered this new multipurpose accommodation service vessel, which I will discuss in a second.

So, that it goes very fast, um, and that, uh, I don't think we're there to say minimum dividends. We don't say, you know, maximum dividends. Um, we're there to, uh, to balance between rewarding shareholders and strengthening our balance sheets to be positioned for opportunities when they present themselves, whether it's organically or through M&A.

So, that it goes very fast, um, and that, uh, I don't think we're, we're there to say minimum dividends. We don't say, you know, maximum dividends. Um, we're there to uh, to balance between reward and shareholders and strengthening my balance sheets to be positioned for opportunities when they present themselves. What is organically or, uh uh, through m&a.

So, that it goes very fast, um, and that, uh, I don't think we're, we're there to say minimum dividends. We don't say, you know, maximum dividends. Um, we're there to, uh, to balance between rewarding shareholders and strengthening our balance sheets to be positioned for opportunities when they present themselves, whether it's organically or, uh, uh, through m&a.

Okay, perfect. I'll turn it over. Thank you, guys.

Thanks.

Thanks very much.

And moving on. Um, you can now unmute and ask a question, please.

Yeah, hi. This is Eric from Carto. I’m just following up a little bit on the SMPP because you haven't... I mean, do you have a sort of target list of the vessels you could dispose of? I'm thinking especially on the tank side now, where you know, SMPP markets are.

Yeah. Hi. This is Eric from Corretto. Uh, just following up a little bit on the SMPP because you haven't, I mean, do you have a sort of target list of the vessels you could dispose of on? I'm thinking especially on the tank side, now where, you know, SMP markets are.

Yeah, hi, this is Eric from Correcto, just following up a little bit on the SMPP because you haven't. I mean, do you have a sort of target list of the vessels you could dispose of? I'm thinking especially on the tanky side, now where you know, SMP markets are.

Are interesting, but cash flows are also fantastic, right? So how do you balance that short-term cash flow versus, you know, potentially realizing some of these elevated asset values?

Are interesting, but the cash flows are also fantastic, right? So how do you balance that short-term cash flow versus, you know, potentially realizing some of these elevated asset values?

You are interesting, but the cash flows are also fantastic, right? So how do you balance that short-term cash flow versus potentially realizing some of these elevated asset values?

Alexander Saverys: Looking at our CTVs, you can see that as a seasonally strong Q3, we achieved good rates of close to $3,500 a day on average. The slower period in Q4, our TCE sits at $2,800. Here you have a render of the newest new building order for CMB.TECH. We ordered one ship with another options for five vessels. It is based on our existing CSOV design for the 120 passengers on board, but we've upsized it to 150 to even 190 passengers on board. It will have a permanent gangway connection, which is better for oil and gas projects. It will be larger, so positive for our charters. When we look at the market, it will be the only vessel type that can truly operate between oil and gas on the one hand and the offshore wind on the other.

It all depends on the price. Um, but I think, Eric, you will agree with me: if you're getting north of $50 million for 18-19 year old VCCs, there's a good case to say that you should sell. Other people might say no, keep it on the spot market and trade it out for another year. Um, we are more in the first camp.

It all depends on the price. Um, but I think Eric you will agree with me if you're getting north of fifty million dollars for 1819 year old vcc's. Uh, there's a good case to say that you should sell uh other people might say no keep it on the spot market and and trade it out for another year. Um we are more in the first camp.

They know, keep it on the spot market and and trade it out for another year. Um, we are more in the first Camp, I think tonnage, which is older than 15 years old at current valuations. And again, it will depend on the bid and it will depend on the price. Uh, we are more sellers than, uh, than keeping it uh, in our Fleet. Uh, that doesn't mean, uh, we will do it at any cost.

Uh, I think tonnage that is older than 15 years at current valuations. And again, it will depend on the bid, and it will depend on the price. Uh, we are more sellers than, uh, than keeping it in our fleet. Uh, that doesn't mean we will do it at any cost.

Will keep it on the spot market and and trade it out for another year. Um, we are more in the first Camp, I think tonnage, which is older than 15 years old at current valuations. And again, it will depend on the bid and it will depend on the price. Uh, we are more sellers than, uh, than keeping it uh, in our Fleet. Uh, that doesn't mean uh, we will do that any cost.

I think tonnage, which is older than 15 years old at current valuations. And again, it will depend on the bid and it will depend on the price. Uh, we are more sellers than, uh, than keeping it uh, in our Fleet. Uh, that doesn't mean uh, we will do that any cost.

And what about on the modern investors, though? I mean, to lock some of them up to sort of the risk a little bit to your cash flows. Is that something you're looking at?

Alexander Saverys: Our existing ships are already suited to do that, but this one will be even better suited. We have a 100-ton subsea crane, which is installed. When we look at where that ship will compete, we see that the flotile market for oil and gas is one market that we will target. When we look at designated ships for that market that also have the crane capability, we see that there's actually not that many vessels on the water and that are being built for this. Our markets are everywhere, but clearly one of the markets that will be interesting, and something to follow, is the Brazilian oil and gas market, where we see more than 30 FPSOs entering service in the next two to three years, which will need a lot of support vessels coming there.

Yes, so a very good question. Eric, I think we've mentioned this in in previous calls as well, uh, and we've been very open about that. Uh, if we see, uh, good levels to take some cover, we will definitely do it. We like to have 40,000 spot days, uh, but at 1 Point, uh, you know, we also want to use the market to, to take some cover. Keep the young vessels in our Fleet, uh, but take some TC covered now as we've not announced a lot of time charges. It also means that right now, uh, both on tankers and on dry bulk, we've not been tempted by numbers that are good enough for us to take action,

Yes, so a very good question. Eric, I think we've mentioned this in in previous calls as well, uh, and we've been very open about that. Uh, if we see, uh, good levels to take some cover, we will definitely do it. We like to have 40,000 spot days, uh, but at 1 Point, uh, you know, we also want to use the market to, to take some cover. Keep the young vessels in our Fleet, uh, but take some TC cover now, as we've not announced a lot of time charges. It also means that right now, uh, both on tankers and on dry bulk, we've not been tempted by numbers that are good enough for us to take action,

Yes, so a very good question. Eric, I think we've mentioned this in in previous calls as well, uh, and we've been very open about that. Uh, if we see, uh, good levels to take some cover, we will definitely do it. We like to have 40,000 spot days. Uh, but at 1 point, you know, we also want to use the market to, to take some cover. Keep the young vessels in our Fleet, uh, but take some TC cover now, as we've not announced a lot of time charges. It also means that right now, uh, both on tankers and on dry bulk, we've not been tempted by numbers that are good enough for us to take action,

Very good. I'm finally should be read anything into the fact that you're not changing the prefix on the panamax camps or Fleet of gold motion. No, no, that's a good question. Uh, looking back in the CMB days. We had a cmbb prefix. Uh, look, we're we're very happy and proud, uh, that Golden Ocean. Uh, is now part of our company, even though we're not using the brand name, uh, any longer

very good. I'm finally should be read anything into the fact that you're not changing the prefix on the panamax camper Fleet of Google. No, no, no, that's a good question. Uh, looking back in the CMB days. We had a cmbb prefix. Uh, look, we're we're very happy and proud, uh, that Golden Ocean. Uh, is now part of our company, even though we're not using the brand name, uh, any longer

Alexander Saverys: The reasoning behind this is that we want to trade in the two markets. Eventually, this ship will end up in offshore wind, but as long as the offshore wind is a little bit quieter, we can also go to oil and gas. With this new building or with this newest addition to our fleet, we can end the part of the presentation and go to the Q&A. Anja. Yes, we will now open the floor for questions. If you would like to ask a question, please raise your hand. Make sure to introduce yourself and unmute before asking your question. If you can't unmute, you can also use the Q&A section to ask your question. If you're dialing in with a telephone, you can press star five to raise your hand and star six to unmute.

very good. And finally, should we read anything into the fact that you're not changing the prefix on the panamax camper Fleet of gold motion? No, no, it's a good question. Uh, looking back in the CMB days. We had a, a cmbb prefix. Uh, look, we're we're very happy and proud, uh, that Golden Ocean, uh, is now part of our company, even though we're not using the brand name, any longer, uh, you know, we like, uh, to respect the Golden Ocean history, and then keep

Very good. I'm finally should be read anything into the fact that you're not changing the prefix on the panamax camps or Fleet. So, we will not, no, no, that's a good question. Uh, looking back in the CMB days. We had a, a cmbb prefix. Uh, look, we're we're very happy and proud, uh, that Golden Ocean. Uh, is now part of our company, even though we're not using the brand name, uh, any longer, uh, you know, we like, uh, to respect the Golden Ocean history, and then keep them as part of

Longer, uh, you know, we like, uh, to respect the Golden Ocean history and keep them as part of our name and our brands by keeping the golden prefix on the Panama access.

Them as part of our name and our brands by keeping the golden prefix on the Panama access.

Longer, uh, you know, we like, uh, to respect the Golden Ocean history, and then keep them as part of our name and our brands by keeping the golden prefix on the Panama access.

Of our name and our brands by keeping the golden prefix on the Panama access.

Excellent, thank you very much, guys.

Thanks Eric.

Thank you.

Kristoff, somewhere you can now use and ask your questions.

In case of somewhere, you can now unmute and ask your questions.

Somewhere, you can now unmute and ask your questions.

Stop somewhere; you can now unmute and ask your questions.

Yes, uh, good afternoon. Cristo is KBC Security. Thank you for taking my questions. If you have been addressed, uh, already, so, but maybe, uh, first, one on, um, to go a little bit deeper into, uh, IMO, uh, that was already touched upon. Um,

Yes, uh, good afternoon. Christopher KBC security. Thank you for taking my questions. If you have been addressed, uh, already, so but maybe, uh, first, 1 on, um, to go a little bit deeper into uh, IMO, uh, that was already touched upon. Um,

Yes, uh, good afternoon. Christopher from KBC Security. Thank you for taking my questions. If you have been addressed, uh, already, so maybe, uh, first of all, to go a little bit deeper into, uh, IMO, uh, that was already touched upon. Um,

Alexander Saverys: If you have any follow-up questions, of course, you can reach out to Luis. I will now open the floor for questions, so you can raise your hand. The first one is for the Merkavel. You can now unmute and ask your question, please. Yeah. Hi, everyone. This is Rodan from Clarksons. First, I wanted to ask you about IMO, the delayed carbon pricing by a year at least. What's your verdict on this? Have you seen any change, I guess, in terms of the interest and demand for a dual-fuel technology after that? Yeah. Thanks, Rodan. I think it's a question many people have. Well, first, on the delay, whether it's going to be a one-year delay or two-year delay or three-year delay, we don't know. We have, of course, not based our strategy on the IMO coming to fruition in 2028.

If if the conditions would be right to consider uh, new build ordering, um, you would you for sure order, you know, ammonia or or H2 ready uh, or fitted vessels or could you nowadays also consider, uh, LNG, uh, ready or fitted? Uh, vessels. Um, and then secondly, um, just with regards to the decision of of, of, of, of the IMO. What impact does it have on your business plan? For H2 industry? And in fact, thank you.

If if the conditions would be right to consider uh, new build ordering, um, you would you for sure order, you know, ammonia or or H2 ready uh, or fitted the vessels or you nowadays also consider uh, LNG, uh, ready or fitted, uh, vessels. Um, and then secondly, um, just with regards to the decision of of, of, of, of the IMO. What impact does it have on your business plan for H2 industry? And uh, in fact, thank you.

If, if the conditions would be right to consider, uh, you built ordering, um, you would you for sure order, you know, ammonia or or H2 ready, uh, or fitted the vessels or could you nowadays also consider, uh, LNG, uh, ready or fitted? Uh, vessels. Um, and then secondly, um, just with regards to the decision of of, of, of, of the IMO. What impact does it have on your business plan for H2 industry? And uh, in fact, thank you.

Yep, and thank you, Kristoff. Um, so

We are more convinced than ever that, uh, ammonia is a very good choice to decarbonize. The reason is not only because we are now getting very close to showing the world that the technology actually works.

Alexander Saverys: It definitely helps our business case. Our strategy on dual-fuel engines is based on finding like-minded partners to charter these vessels and use the technology to decarbonize. We have the EU legislation, which is in place, which is definitely supportive. IMO would have been very nice to have. It's not a must-have for our strategy and for our plans. Our opinion on whether eventually they will find an agreement on the IMO level is that we don't know. We do see that after the failure of IMO, there's a lot more discussion between countries on a bilateral basis to see what can be done on certain trade lanes, say, Australia to China, for instance, or trades that are linked to Europe. The last word has definitely not been said, but it will not change anything to our strategy. Okay, fair enough. One question on your investment philosophy.

To convince people like ourselves, but also partners that want to decarbonize their fleet, to go for ammonia. So in short, right now we're not looking at any LNG projects. Never say never, but our choice of fuel is still ammonia.

To convince people like ourselves, but also partners that want to decarbonize their fleet, to go for ammonia. Uh, so in short, uh, right now we're not looking at any LNG projects. Never say never, but our choice of fuel is still ammonia.

But also because we have seen uh, and over the last 12 months in China and in India, uh, tremendous Evolution on increasing the availability of the green ammonia molecules and reduction the cost of the green ammonia molecules. Um, so on IMO, even though as I just said, I don't think there will be a lot of movement, uh, in the next couple of years and and I hope we, we will be surprised. We still think that technology and cost and availability of molecules will be the main driver to convince people like ourselves, but also partners that want to decarbonize their Fleet to go for ammonia. So, in short right now we're not looking at any any, uh, LNG projects, Never Say, Never, but our choice of fuel is still ammonia.

But also because we have seen, uh, over the last 12 months in China and in India, uh, tremendous evolution in increasing the availability of the green ammonia molecules and reducing the cost of the green ammonia molecules. Um, so on IMO, even though, as I just said, I don't think there will be a lot of movement, uh, in the next couple of years, and I hope we will be surprised, we still think that technology and cost and availability of molecules will be the main driver to convince people like ourselves, but also partners that want to decarbonize their fleet to go for ammonia. So in short, uh, right now we're not looking at any, uh, LNG projects. Never say never, but our choice of fuel is still, uh, ammonia. On your second question on H2 infrastructure and the H2 industry, you know, these all are very small divisions. Uh, they are supporting the business we do on the development of hydrogen and ammonia engines on the industry side, and they are trying to develop molecules, producing molecules, but also...

On your second question on H2, infra H2 industry. You know, these all are very small divisions. Uh they are supporting the business we do on the development of hydrogen and ammonia engines on the industry side. And they are trying to develop molecules producing molecules but also sourcing molecules on the uh, H2 infra side. Um, there, uh, we have a lot of ongoing discussions with suppliers, uh, in China and India, uh, to buy molecules for our Fleet.

Sourcing molecules on the uh H2 infra site. Um there uh, we have a lot of ongoing discussions with suppliers uh, in China and India, uh, to buy molecules for our Fleet of next year. Nothing we can announce yet, uh, but as soon as we have news on that, we will definitely uh let you know.

On your second question on H2, infra H2 industry. You know, these all are very small divisions. Uh they are supporting the business we do on the development of hydrogen and ammonia engines on the industry side. And they are trying to develop molecules producing molecules but also sourcing molecules on the uh, H2 infra side. Um, there uh, we have a lot of ongoing discussions with suppliers, uh, in China and India, uh, to buy molecules for our Fleet of next year. Nothing we can announce yet, uh, but as soon as we have news on that, we will definitely uh let you know.

Of next year, nothing we can announce yet, but as soon as we have news on that, we will definitely let you know.

On your second question on H2, infra H2 industry. You know, these all are very small divisions. Uh they are supporting the business we do on the development of hydrogen and ammonia engines on the industry side. And they are trying to develop molecules producing molecules but also sourcing molecules on the uh, H2 infra site. Um, there uh, we have a lot of ongoing discussions with suppliers uh, in China and India, uh, to buy molecules for our Fleet of next year. Nothing we can announce yet, but as soon as we have news on that, we will definitely uh let you know.

And maybe just as a follow-up, I mean, any any

Alexander Saverys: You ordered a few large CSOVs, I guess you can call it. How do you think about priority knowledge segments like tribals and tankers? Are you looking to invest more there or maybe trim or sell in those segments? Well, I think we've invested already a lot over the last two or three years at the right time, I would say. We will always look opportunistically at new buildings. Today, clearly, we think new buildings are quite pricey. That doesn't mean we would not order if it's the right value and if we believe that it will create value for us and our balance sheet can take it. We just saw that we ordered this extra wind vessel, which is really an offshore vessel. We think there's very good value there.

Okay, and maybe just as a follow-up. Um, I mean, any, any change in the attitudes or the, um, appetites of of, of minor to conclude long term Charters, uh, since the decision of the IMO has been made public.

Okay. And maybe just as a follow-up, I mean, any change in the attitudes or the, um, appetites of minors to conclude long-term charges since the decision of the IMO has been made public?

Change in the attitudes or the, um, appetites of minors to conclude long-term charges, uh, since the decision of the IMO has been made public.

That's again a very good question, Kristoff. Um, I think the street categories of people, uh, people like us that were convinced before the IMO discussion, uh, that we should decarbonize our fleet, and we have a couple of customers, as you saw in April with the deals that we announced, uh, that will continue down that path. So people that were convinced are continuing to engage with us and continue their investments.

That's again a very good question, Kristoff. Um, I think there are three categories of people. Uh, people like us that were convinced before the IMO discussion that we should decarbonize our fleet, and we have a couple of customers, as you saw in April with the deals that we announced, who will continue down that path. So, people that are convinced are continuing to engage with us and continue their investments.

We will continue down that path. So, people that work convinced are continuing to engage with us and continue their investments.

You down that path. So, people that were convinced are continuing to engage with us and continue their investments.

Alexander Saverys: We think this is also something CMB.TECH can perfectly do, even if we have more options that we can declare going forward. That's on the new building side. On the second hand, you have seen, and we will continue to do that, that we're clearing out our older vessels because we just think rates are very good, and the prices for second-hand tonnage are at a level where we're rather sellers than buyers. We still have a couple of older vessels. Don't be surprised if we clear them out. There will come a point where we're very satisfied with the age profile of our ship, and we're very satisfied of basically staying on the market and enjoying the good markets. Okay. Last question on the dividends. This is the $0.05 second quarter in a row.

There's another category of people and that's still the vast majority. In shipping that take a very much wait and see attitudes, and then don't do anything. Uh, and basically, wait to see how this will evolve and then the, the category in between people that were hesitating a little bit. I think we definitely lost part of them, uh, that they are not looking at it anymore, and more than the camp of wait and see, but some others, uh, still continue to engage and ask questions, so it's a little bit of everything. Uh, the conclusion further is simple, uh, had the IMO. Um, decision been taken, uh, a couple of, uh, weeks ago. It would definitely have propelled our business plan to a much higher speed

There's another category of people and that's still the vast majority. In shipping that take a very much wait and see attitude, and then don't do anything. Uh, and basically, wait to see how this will evolve and then the, the category in between people that were hesitating a little bit. I think we definitely lost part of them, uh, that they are not looking at it anymore and more than the camp of wait and see, but some others, uh, still continue to engage and ask questions, so it's a little bit of everything. Uh, the conclusion for us is simple. Uh, had the IMO. Um, decision been taken, uh, a couple of, uh, weeks ago. It would definitely have propelled our business plan to a much higher speed

There's another category of people and that's still the vast majority in shipping that take a very much wait and see attitudes, uh, and then don't do anything. Uh, and basically wait to see how this will evolve and then the, the category in between people that were hesitating a little bit. I think we definitely lost part of them, uh, that they are not looking at it anymore and more than the camp of wait and see, but some others, uh, still continue to engage and ask questions, so it's a little bit of everything. Uh, the conclusion for us is simple. Uh, had the IMO. Um, decision been taken, uh, a couple of, uh, weeks ago. It would definitely have propelled our business plan to a much higher speed

There's another category of people and that's still the vast majority. In shipping that take a very much wait and see attitudes and then don't do anything. Uh, and basically, wait to see how this will evolve and then the, the category in between people that were hesitating a little bit. I think we definitely lost part of them, uh, that they are not looking at it anymore and more than the camp of wait and see, but some others, uh, still continue to engage and ask questions, so it's a little bit of everything. Uh, the conclusion for us is simple. Uh, had the IMO. Um, decision been taken, uh, a couple of, uh, weeks ago. It would definitely have propelled our business plan to a much higher speed

But it doesn't slow down our business plan, and it doesn't change our business plan, but it would definitely have helped.

But it doesn't slow down our business plan, and it doesn't change our business plan; however, it would definitely have helped.

But it doesn't slow down our business plan, and it doesn't change our business plan, but it would definitely have helped.

Okay, clear. Thank you very much.

Thank you very much.

Okay, clear. Thank you very much.

Thank you. So

Thank you, k.

Then the next one is Chemo MO.

You may now unmute please.

Alexander Saverys: That makes it something to think this is some type of minimum level going forward, or should investors expect dividends are flexible going forward? I think, Alex, I'll take it. We have a fully discretionary dividend policy. I think we've been pretty clear that every quarter, the board will decide what we'll do with the cash that we have. It's fair to say that with the meaningful cash flow generation that we are seeing in Q4, that we're expecting in Q1, there will definitely be a further look at how to reward the shareholders, whether that's share buyback, whether that's dividends, whether that's an accelerated clearing out of some of the bonds. Some people have mentioned the bridge financing or just reducing leverage. I think these markets, the way we positioned ourselves in there, show that it goes very fast.

Hi, good afternoon. This is Man. I'm from Valley Investors Edge.

Hi, good afternoon. This is Clemen. I'm from Bali Investor's Edge.

Hi, good afternoon. This is Clemen. I'm from Valley Investor's Edge.

Hi, good afternoon. This is Kim, and I'm from Valley Investors Edge.

I wanted to start by asking about your interest expenses for the quarter. Did those include any one-offs? Or is it, let's say, a clean quarter?

Um, good question, Clemens. Um, there are two things. Obviously, when you do leveraged buyouts...

Um, those bridges are somewhat more expensive. Um, we had $1.3 billion. We've reduced that to close to $220 million, uh, in the quarter. Um, but that definitely has explained our Q2 and Q3 figures of elevated interest expense. On the second point, there is obviously when we did those um acquisitions, both from a year-and-a-half point of view, but also gold notion.

Um, good, good question, Clemens. Um, there are two things, obviously, when you do leveraged buyouts. Um, those bridges are somewhat more expensive. Um, we had $1.3 billion; we've reduced that to close to $220 million at the end of the quarter. Um, but that definitely has explained our Q2 and Q3 figures of elevated interest expense. The second point there is, obviously, when we did those acquisitions, both from a year-and-a-half point of view, but also go notion.

Um, good, good question, Clemens. Um, there are two things, obviously, when you do leveraged buyouts. Um, those bridges are somewhat more expensive. Um, we had $1.3 billion; we've reduced that to close to $220 million at the end of the quarter. Um, but that definitely has explained our Q2 and Q3 figures of elevated interest expense. The second point there is obviously when we did those acquisitions, both from a year-and-a-half point of view, but also go notion.

Alexander Saverys: I don't think we're there to say minimum dividends. We don't say maximum dividends. We're there to balance between rewarding shareholders and strengthening our balance sheets to be positioned for opportunities when they present themselves, whether it's organically or through M&A. Okay. Perfect. I'll turn it over. Thank you, guys. Thanks, guys. Thanks, Rodan. Moving on, Eric Havels. You can now unmute and ask your question, please. Yeah. Hi, this is Eric from Pareto. Just following up a little bit on the SMP because you haven't—I mean, do you have a sort of target list of the vessels you could dispose of? I'm thinking especially on the tankers side now, where SMP markets are interesting, but cash flows are also fantastic, right? How do you balance that short-term cash flow versus potentially realizing some of these elevated asset values? It all depends on the price.

We had a back financing of really leveraging the fleet to be able to pay back. Um, and those refinancing, you always incur arrangement fees with the banks, and these you have to write off over the length of the, um, the financing. So if you refinance $2 billion over 5 years and you pay a percent arrangement fee, um, you're going to add $4 million of, uh, interest expense every year. And as we've been doing a lot of these, um, these obviously are increasing, uh, the total interest expenses. Um, that said, I think only in the last 3 weeks, we've been able to look at our total financing package, uh, where we had an average of, you know, so for plus 275 throughout all our financing.

We had back financing of re-leveraging the fleet to be able to pay back, um, and those refinancing, you always incur arrangement fees with the banks, and these you have to write off over the length of the, um, the financing. So if you refinance $2 billion over 5 years and you pay a percent arrangement fee, um, you're going to add $4 million of, uh, interest expense every year. And as we've been doing a lot of these, um, these obviously are increasing the total interest expenses. Um, that said, I think only in the last 3 weeks we've been able to look at our total financing package, uh, where we had an average of, you know, so for plus 275 throughout all our financing.

We had a back financing of re-leveraging the fleet to be able to pay back, um, and those refinancing, you always incur arrangement fees with the banks, and these you have to write off over the length of the, um, the financing. So if you refinance $2 billion over 5 years, you pay a percent arrangement fee. Um, you're going to add $4 million of, uh, interest expense every year, and as we've been doing a lot of these, um, these obviously are increasing, uh, the total interest expenses. Um, that said, I think only in the last 3 weeks, we've been able to look at our total financing package, uh, where we had an average of, you know, so for plus 275 throughout all our financing. Now we are actively working, building per building to reduce that by 100 to 125 basis points. So this is more going to be a topic of 2026 of optimizing.

We had a back financing of really leveraging the fleet to be able to pay back. Um, those refinancing agreements always incur arrangement fees with the banks, and these have to be written off over the length of the financing. So if you refinance $2 billion over 5 years and you pay a percent arrangement fee, um, you're going to add $4 million of uh interest expense every year. And as we've been doing a lot of these, um, these obviously are increasing the total interest expenses. Um, that said, I think only in the last 3 weeks we've been able to look at our total financing package, uh, where we had an average of, you know, So for plus 275 throughout all our financing. Now we are actively working on building per building to reduce that by 100 to 125 basis points. So this is more going to be a topic of 2026 of optimizing.

Our financing portfolio and costs, as part of, I would say, integrating the businesses and optimizing our balance sheets.

We are actively working building per building to reduce that by 100 to 225 basis points. So this is more going to be a topic of 2026, optimizing our financing portfolio and costs as part of, I would say, integrating the businesses and optimizing our balance sheets.

No, we are actively working building per building to reduce that by 100 to 125 basis points. So this is more going to be a topic of 2026, optimizing our financing portfolio and costs as part of, I would say, integrating the businesses and optimizing our balance sheets.

Thanks to the caller. That's helpful.

Thanks for the caller. That's helpful. My second question is also on the modeling side. Should we expect GNA to come in at around $34 million as well in Q4?

Thanks for the caller. That's helpful. My second question is also on the modeling side. Should we expect DNA to come in at around $34 million as well in Q4?

My second question is also on the modeling side. Should we expect DNA to come in at around 34 million as well in Q4?

Alexander Saverys: I think, Eric, you will agree with me if you're getting more than $50 million for 18, 19-year-old VLCCs, there's a good case to say that you should sell. Other people might say, no, keep it on the spot market and trade it out for another year. We are more in the first camp. I think tonnage, which is older than 15 years old at current valuations, and again, it will depend on the bid and it will depend on the price. We are more sellers than keeping it in our fleet. That doesn't mean we will do it at any cost. What about on the—I mean, on the modern vessels though, to lock some of them up to sort of de-risk a little bit your cash flows, is that something you're looking at? Yes. A very good question, Eric.

And secondly, where do you see the run rate on the GNA front? Once you've realized any potential synergies from the merger with Golden Ocean?

Alexander Saverys: I think we've mentioned this in previous calls as well, and we've been very open about that. If we see good levels to take some cover, we will definitely do it. We like to have 40,000 spot days, but at one point, we also want to use the market to take some cover, keep the young vessels in our fleet, but take some TC cover. Now, as we've not announced a lot of time, it also means that right now, both on tankers and on dry bulk, we've not been tempted by numbers that are good enough for us to take action. Very good. Finally, should the reason be linked to the fact that you're not changing the prefix on the Panamax Carso fleet of Golden Ocean? No. That's a good question. Looking back in the CMB days, we had a CMB prefix.

Fees and others, and we've been doing that for two years in a row, doing multiple billion-dollar transactions. That has not helped RSNA, full stop. Um, it is a review that we're making while we are integrating the teams, optimizing the insurance packages, the IT systems, and everything. Like in normal M&A processes, this will be optimized to put the actual figure elements. I think it's hard to say. I think, uh, 2026, give us a couple of quarters and you'll see, uh, those LGN in naturally, uh, uh, uh, normalized, I would say.

Advisory fees and others, and we've been doing that for two years in a row, doing multiple billion-dollar transactions, uh, that has not helped RSNA full stop. Um, it is a review that we're making, uh, while we are integrating the teams, optimizing the uh, insurance packages, the IT systems, and everything, like in normal M&A processes. This will be optimized to put the actual figure elements. I think it's hard to say. I think, uh, 2026—give us a couple of quarters and you'll see, uh, those LGN naturally, uh, normalize, I would say.

Yeah, I think it's a, it's a valid question. Uh, when you do large scale transactions, you always incur a lot of lawyer, fees auditor fees, you know, Financial advisory fees. And other time, we've been doing that 2 years in a row, doing multiple billion dollar transactions. Uh, that has not helped rsda full stop. Um, it is a review that we're making, uh, while we are integrating the teams, optimizing the uh, Insurance packages, the it systems, and everything, like in normal, I mean, a processes this will be optimized. You put the actual figure elements. I think it's hard to say I think, uh, 2026 give us a couple of quarters and you'll see uh, those LG in naturally, uh, uh normalize I would say

Yeah, I think it's, uh, it's about question. Uh, when you do large scale transactions, you always incur a lot of lawyer fee, auditor fees, you know, Financial advisory fees and others. Then we've been doing that 2 years in a row doing multiple billion dollar transactions. Uh, that has not helped rsna full stop. Um, it is a review that we're making, uh, while we are integrating the teams, optimizing the uh, Insurance packages, the it systems, and everything, like in normal, Mna processes, this will be optimized. You put the actual figure elements. I think it's hard to say, I think, uh, 2026 give us a couple of quarters and you'll see uh, those as in naturally. Uh uh normalize I would say

Makes sense. Thank you. And final question for me, does the 1.5 7 7?

Makes sense. Thank you. And final question for me: does the $1.57 billion in remaining commitments include the capex on the recent CSOV new build Edition?

No, that's a good point. So, uh, the Q4 will add that, uh,

Currently, as Alex mentioned, it's 1 ship. Um, we can't disclose the uh the new Google price. Uh but it's somewhat higher, I would say than your smaller csov. Uh, but that is going to be added to the uh the the total capex.

No, that's a good, good point. So, uh, and the Q4 will add that, uh, currently, as Alex mentioned, it's 1 ship. Um, we can't disclose the, uh, the new build price, but it's higher, I would say, than your smaller CSOV. Uh, but that is going to be added to the, uh, the total capex.

Okay, perfect. I'll turn it over. Thank you for taking my questions.

No, that's a good point. So, uh, in Q4, we will add that, uh, currently, as Alex mentioned, it's one ship. Um, we can't disclose the uh, the new Google price, but somewhat higher, I would say, than your smaller CSOV. Uh, but that is going to be added to the uh, the total capex.

The next step is Christopher. You can now unmute and ask your question, please.

Been mixed up is Christopher you can now I'm using a screw question, please.

Alexander Saverys: Look, we're very happy and proud that Golden Ocean is now part of our company. Even though we're not using the brand name any longer, we like to respect the Golden Ocean history and keep them as part of our name and our brands by keeping the golden prefix on Panamax's. Excellent. Thank you very much, guys. Thanks, Eric. Eric, you still somewhere? You can now unmute and ask your questions. Yes. Good afternoon, Christoph Samak, ABC Securities. Thank you for taking my questions. A few have been addressed already. Maybe first, to go a little bit deeper into IMO that was already touched upon, if the conditions would be right to consider new build ordering, would you for sure order ammonia or H2 ready or fitted vessels, or could you nowadays also consider LNG ready or fitted vessels?

Hello, good afternoon. Um,

Okay, perfect. I'll turn it over. Thank you for taking my questions.

You.

The next step is Christopher. You can now unmute and ask your question, please.

When do the options on the CSVs lapse? When is the delivery of the optional vessels?

Distance on the CSVs, or lapsing. When is the delivery of the optional vessels?

Can you comment a bit on, uh, when the options on the CSVs are lapsing? Um, when is the delivery of the optional vessels?

You know, in order to declare them, would you need to see any long-term contracts in the division? Or, to put it differently, what do you need to see to declare these options?

You know, in order to declare them, would you need to see any long-term contracts in the division? Or to put it differently, what do you need to see to declare these options?

Yeah.

We have, um, we have a lot of time.

We have, um, we have a lot of time, uh, so close to a year to declare the option. Um, and then, of course, the options thereafter, because the earlier we declared earlier, the vessels could deliver, we're looking at deliveries in 2028 and 2029, um, answer in terms of contracts. Uh, it's not a must-have to have a contract to lift the option. Of course, if we get a contractor straight away, we could, we could lift the option earlier, uh, but we could also lift without a contract.

Close to a year to declare the option. Um, and then, of course, the options thereafter, because the earlier we declare, the earlier the vessel could deliver. We're looking at deliveries in 2028 and 2029. Um, answer in terms of contracts. Uh, it's not a must-have to have a contract to lift the option. Of course, if we get a contractor straight away, we could lift the option earlier, uh, but we could also lift without a contract.

Yeah, we have, um, we have a lot of time, uh, so close to a year to declare the option. Um, and then, of course, the options thereafter, because the earlier we declare, the earlier the vessels could deliver. We're looking at deliveries in 2028 and 2029. Um, in terms of contracts, it's not a must-have to have a contract to lift the option. Of course, if we get a contractor straight away, we could lift the option earlier, uh, but we could also lift without the contract.

Perfect. Um, and moving over to the tanker division. Um,

Perfect. Um, and moving over to the tanker division, uh, division. Um,

Alexander Saverys: Secondly, just with regards to the decision of the IMO, what impact does it have on your business plan for H2 industry and infra? Thank you. Yeah. Thank you, Christoph. We are more convinced than ever that ammonia is a very good choice to decarbonize. The reason is not only because we are now getting very close to showing to the world that the technology actually works, but also because we have seen over the last 12 months in China and in India tremendous evolution on increasing the availability of the green ammonia molecules, and reduction in the cost of the green ammonia molecules.

What type of, um, time charter levels would you need to see in order to be risk estimates here? It's a sort of...

What type of, um, time charter levels would you need to see in order to be risk estimates here? It's a sort of.

Seems like, uh, rates are starting to move up, quite quite fast. So, um, and obviously, where, where do you pick the 5 year? What what do you pay the 5 year for modern vlcc.

Seems like, uh, rates are starting to move up quite, quite fast. So, um, in August, where do you pick the 5-year? What do you pay the 5-year for modern VLCC?

Uh, what do you think?

Uh, what do you think the...

Uh, what do you think?

Uh, probably, uh, just below 50 or something or.

Alexander Saverys: On IMO, even though, as I just said, I don't think there will be a lot of movements in the next couple of years, and I hope we will be surprised, we still think that technology, cost, and availability of molecules will be the main driver to convince people like ourselves, but also partners that want to decarbonize their fleet to go for ammonia. In short, right now, we're not looking at any LNG projects. Never say never, but our choice of fuel is still ammonia. On your second question on H2 infra and H2 industry, these are very small divisions. They are supporting the business we do on the development of hydrogen and ammonia engines on the industry side, and they are trying to develop molecules, producing molecules, but also sourcing molecules on the H2 infra side.

So clearly that's not something we would do right now. I mean, we could still change our mind, of course. Um, but I think, uh, you know, the market would need to be higher on long term, and I'm talking 5 to 10, in order to consider. So current rates are, for us, for our modern tonnage, and a stress on modern tonnage. Uh, we would need to see more.

So clearly that's not something we would do right now. I mean, we could still change our mind of course. Um, but I think, uh, you know, the, the market would need to be, uh, higher on on long term and I'm talking 5 years plus then. In order to consider so current rates are for us for our modern tonnage and a stress on Modern tonnage, uh we would need to see more.

Yeah, so clearly that's not something we would do right now. I mean, we can still change our mind of course. Um, but I think, uh, you know, the, the market would need to be, uh, higher on on long term and I'm talking 5 years plus then in order to concern. So current rates are for us for our modern tonnage and a stress on Modern tonnage, uh we would need to see more.

Yeah, so clearly that's not something we would do right now. I mean, we can still change our mind of course. Um, but I think, uh, you know, the, the market would need to be, uh, higher on the on long term and I'm talking 5 years to us then in order to concern. So current rates are for us for our modern tonnage and a stress on Modern tonnage, uh we would need to see more.

And final one for me, um, in terms of the bond process you had ongoing, um, can I just come a bit, um, how you're looking to refinance the material next year? And is it still only dependent on the instrument with um, equity covenant and not value, just the equity?

And final 1 for me. Um, in terms of the bond process you had on going. Um can I just come to bit um how you're of looking to to refinance the very next year and it is, it's still the only depth instrument with um, Equity Covenant, and not value just equity.

And final 1 for me um in terms of the bomb process you had on going, um can I just come to bit um how you're of looking to to refinance the material next year? And it is it still the only depth in man with an equity Covenant and not value just the equity

And final one for me, um, in terms of the bond process you had ongoing, um, can I just come to a bit, um, how you're looking to refinance the material next year? And is it still only dependent on the Equity Covenant, and not value, just the equity?

Yeah, um, great question. I think we stopped the bond process because we had much cheaper alternatives.

Yeah, um, great question. I think we stopped the bond process because we had much cheaper alternatives. Uh, Christopher. Um, so in that same flow, we are anticipating paying back the bonds with our own free cash flow, sales of assets, and all liquidity. Uh, we don't anticipate the bond process.

Yeah, um, good question. I think we stopped the bond process because we had much cheaper alternatives. Uh, Christopher. Um, so in that same flow, we are anticipating paying back the bonds with our own free cash flow, sales of assets, and our own liquidity. Uh, we don't anticipate the bond to.

Alexander Saverys: There, we have a lot of ongoing discussions with suppliers in China and India to buy molecules for our fleet of next year. Nothing we can announce yet, but as soon as we have news on that, we will definitely let you know. Okay. Maybe just as a follow-up, I mean, any change in the attitudes or the appetite of miners to conclude long-term charters since the decision of the IMO has been made public? That's again a very good question, Christoph. I think there's three categories of people, people like us that were convinced before the IMO discussion that we should decarbonize our fleet. We have a couple of customers, as you saw in April with the deals that we announced, that will continue down that path. People that were convinced are continuing to engage with us and continue their investments.

Yeah, um, great question. I think we stopped the bond process because we had much cheaper alternatives. Uh, Christopher. Um, so, in that same flow, we are anticipating paying back the bonds with our own free cash flow, sales of assets, and all liquidity. Uh, we don't anticipate the bond prices to be.

It is to be re-initiated anytime soon. It's a cheap bond at 6.25%. Uh, so we'll probably leave it running until September 26th. Um, and if you know the way it's continuing, not just the bond but also on the bridge, we feel that we can pay this with our own means. Uh, so we don't foresee any equity or debt capital markets in the coming quarters.

We initiated anytime soon. It's a cheap bond, 6 and a quarter, uh, so we'll probably leave it run until September 26th. Um, and if you know the way it's, it's continuing, not just the bond, but also on the bridge, we feel that we can pay this, uh, uh, with our own means. Uh, so we don't foresee any equitation or debt capital markets in the coming quarters.

Uh Christopher um so in that same flow uh we are anticipating paying back, the bonds with our own free cash flow sales of assets and own liquidity. Uh we don't anticipate the bond process to be re-initiated anytime soon. It's a cheap bonds 6 and a quarter uh so we'll probably leave it, run until September 26th. Um, and if you know the way it's, it's continuing not just the bond, but also on the bridge, we feel that we can pay this uh uh with our own means. Uh, so we don't foresee any uh Equity issuances or debt Capital markets in the coming quarters.

Is to be initiated anytime soon. It's a cheap bonds 6 and a quarter uh so we'll probably leave it, run until September 26th. Um, and if you know the way it's it's continuing not just the bond, but also on the bridge we feel that we can pay this uh with our own means. Uh so we don't foresee any uh equitation or debt Capital markets in the coming quarters.

Thanks a lot, guys. That's it from me.

Thank you, thanks.

The next step is, uh, Axle. You may now unmute and ask your question, please.

Next up is, uh, Axle. You may now unmute and ask your question, please.

Next up is Axle. You may know I'm using a few questions, please.

Alexander Saverys: There's another category of people, and that's still the vast majority in shipping, that take a very much wait-and-see attitude and that don't do anything, basically waiting to see how this will evolve. The category in between, people that were hesitating a little bit, I think we definitely lost part of them, that they are not looking at it anymore and are more in the camp of wait-and-see. Some others still continue to engage and ask questions. It's a little bit of everything. The conclusion for us is simple. Had the IMO decision been taken a couple of weeks ago, it would definitely have propelled our business plan to a much higher speed. It doesn't slow down our business plan, and it doesn't change our business plan. It would definitely have helped. Okay. Clear. Thank you very much. Thank you, Christoph.

Uh, potential removal of U.S. sanctions on Russian oil to influence the, uh, the tanker market and the tank rates. Second question, uh,

See, uh, potential removal of, uh, U.S. sanctions on Russian oil to influence the, uh, tanker market and the tanker rates. Second question. Uh,

Thank you. Uh, three questions for me. Uh, one: How do you see the potential removal of U.S. sanctions on Russian oil influencing the tanker market and the tank rates? Second question, uh,

if uh,

The guinea volumes on the RN have just started. Uh, replaces the Australian exports to China. How do you see this? Uh,

The Guinea volumes on the RN are just starting to, uh, replace the Australian exports to China. How do you see this?

The Guinea volumes on the RN have just started, uh, replacing the Australian exports to China. How do you see this? Uh,

The Guinea volumes on the RN have just started, uh, really placing the Australian exports to China. How do you see this? Uh,

Uh, Outlook, uh, all this, uh, influencing the

Uh, Outlook. Uh, all this, uh, inference in the...

Uh, Outlook, uh, all this, uh, inference in Europe, bullish outlook on the uh, tribal market on the for a large tribal carriers. And thirdly, what kind of, uh, optimal financing structure, kind of leverage? Are you looking for, uh, after you're taking delivery?

Europe, bullish outlook on the uh, tribal Market on the for a large tribal carriers. And thirdly, what kind of, uh, optimal financing structure? Kind of Leverage? Are you looking for, uh, after you're taking delivery?

Euro bullish outlook on the uh, tribal Market on the for a large tribal carriers. And thirdly, what kind of, uh, optimal financing structure, kind of Leverage? Are you looking for, uh, after you're taking delivery?

Uh, uh, your new billing program.

Uh, your new billing program.

Uh, uh, your billing program.

Alexander Saverys: Next is Clément Moret. You may now unmute, please. Hi, good afternoon. This is Clément. I'm from Value Investors Edge. I wanted to start by asking about your interest expenses for the quarter. Did those include anyone else, or is it a clean quarter? Good question, Clément. There are two things. Obviously, when you do leverage buyouts, those bridges are somewhat more expensive. We had $1.3 billion. We've reduced that to close to $220 million end of quarter. That definitely has explained our $2.3 figures of elevated interest expense. Second point there is, obviously, when we did those acquisitions, both from a year-and-a-half point of view, but also Golden Ocean, we had a back financing of re-leveraging the fleet to be able to pay back.

Okay, I'll take the two first questions and then maybe do the week. You can comment on our finance structure. Um, so on Ukraine, I think the easy thing to say is that before the fully fledged war started in 2022, or when you look at the effect of the war, it was definitely positive for crude oil tankers. Uh, so if we were to unwind it, one might say logically it will be negative.

Okay, I'll take the two first questions, and then, uh, maybe do the week; you can comment on our finance structure. Um, so on Ukraine. I think the easy thing to say is that before, uh, the fully fledged war started in 2022, um, or when you look at the effect of the war, it was definitely positive for crude oil tankers. Uh, so, uh, if we would unwind it, one might say logically it will be negative.

Okay, I'll take the first two questions and then maybe do the week. You can, uh, comment on our finance structure. So, on Ukraine, I think the easy thing to say is that before the fully fledged war started in 2022, when you look at the effect of the war, it was definitely positive for crude oil tankers. So, if we were to unwind it, one might say logically, it will be negative.

Uh, relief of sanctions on Russia could be negative for our markets. Uh, because then you unwind everything that has been put in place over the last 2 or 3 years. But in practical terms, uh, I think there will be a lot of, uh, different, uh, levers that will play, uh, an impact on that. So, the short answer to your question is we don't know what the impact will be.

Alexander Saverys: Those refinancings, you always incur arrangement fees with the banks, and these you have to write off over the length of the financing. If you refinance $2 billion over five years, you pay a percent arrangement fee, you're going to add $4 million of interest expense every year. As we've been doing a lot of these, these obviously are increasing the total interest expenses. That said, I think only in the last three weeks, we've been able to look at our total financing package, where we had an average of SOFR plus 275 throughout all our financings. We are actively working billion per billion to reduce that by 100 to 125 basis points. This is more going to be a topic of 2026, of optimizing our financing portfolio and costs as part of, I would say, integrating the businesses and optimizing our balance sheets.

Uh, uh, relief of sanctions on Russia could be negative for our markets. Uh, because then you unwind everything that has been put in place over the last 2 or 3 years. But in practical terms, uh, I think there will be a lot of uh, different, uh, levers that will play, uh, an impact on that. So, the short, the short answer to your question is we don't know what the impact will be, um, on Guinea cannibalizing Australian volumes, because I think that's what you mean. Um, I think two things need to be said there. Um, on iron ore specifically, uh, you have to know that at the very beginning, all the volumes are going to China and are actually being transported by Chinese ships, which is taking away capacity. So it's supporting the market in general. Uh, going forward, of course, as we see a ramp-up, there would be any kind of cannibalization.

In our opinion, it's, uh, way too early to say, and actually, we don't know. Maybe in theory, uh, uh, relief of sanctions on Russia could be negative for our markets. Uh, because then you unwind everything that has been put in place over the last 2 or 3 years. But in practical terms, uh, I think there will be a lot of different, uh, levers that will play, uh, an impact on that. So, the short, the short answer to your question is we don't know what the impact will be, um, on Guinea cannibalizing Australian volumes, because I think that's what you mean. Um, I think two things need to be said there. Um, on iron ore specifically, you have to know that at the very beginning, all the volumes are going to China and are actually being transported by Chinese ships, which is taking away capacity. So, it's supporting the market in general. Uh, going forward, of course, as we see a ramp-up, and there would be any kind of aiz.

Um, on guinea cannibalizing Australian volumes, because I think that's what you mean, um, I think two things need to be said there. Um, on iron ore specifically, you have to know that from the very beginning, all the volumes are going to China and are actually being transported by Chinese ships, but it's taking away capacity, so it's supporting the market in general. Uh, going forward, of course, as we see a ramp-up, and there would be any kind of...

In our opinion, it's, uh, way too early to say, and actually, we don't know. Maybe in theory, uh, uh, relief of sanctions on Russia could be negative for our markets, because then you unwind everything that has been put in place over the last 2 or 3 years. But in practical terms, uh, I think there will be a lot of different, uh, levers that will play, uh, an impact on that. So, the short, the short answer to your question is we don't know what the impact will be, um, on Guinea cannibalizing Australian volumes, because I think that's what you mean. Um, I think 2 things need to be said there. Um, on iron ore specifically, you have to know that at the very beginning, all the volumes are going to China and are actually being transported by Chinese ships, but it's taking away capacity, so it's supporting the market in general. Uh, going forward, of course, as we see a ramp-up, and there would be any kind of...

The logical immediate effect is that you're replacing short-term mile with long-term mile.

The logical immediate effect is that you're replacing short tone miles with long tone miles.

The logical immediate effect is that you're replacing fourth tone mile with long tone mile.

A logical immediate effect is that you're replacing short tone mile with long tone mile.

So the effect is, uh, relatively positive.

On top of that, uh, you would see that the price of iron ore starts falling, uh, you might push out, uh, some um, uh, producers that have a higher Break, Even level. And again, there we think that will rather stimulate the high or the long-term mile than the short term mile.

If on top of that, uh, you would see that the price of iron ore starts falling, uh, you might push out, uh, some um, uh, producers that have a higher Break, Even level. And again, there we think that will rather stimulate the high or the long-term mile than the short tone mile.

All in all cannibalization of volumes uh of Australian volumes and replacing them by Guinea volumes. Um, we think it will definitely have an impact on the market, but on a net, net basis, it could actually be positive.

All in all, the cannibalization of Australian volumes and replacing them with Guinea volumes, we think it will definitely have an impact on the market. But on a net, net basis, it could actually be positive.

All in all, the cannibalization of Australian volumes and replacing them with Guinea volumes, we think it will definitely have an impact on the market. But on a net-net basis, it could actually be positive.

Alexander Saverys: Thanks for the call. That's helpful. My second question is also on the modeling side. First, should we expect G&A to come in at around $34 million as well in Q4? Secondly, where do you see the burn rate on the G&A front once you've realized any potential synergies from the merger with Golden Ocean? Yeah, I think it's a bad question. When you do large-scale transactions, you always incur a lot of lawyer fees, auditor fees, financial advisory fees. Other than that, we've been doing that two years in a row, doing multiple billion-dollar transactions that have not helped our G&A. Full stop. It is a review that we're making while we are integrating the teams, optimizing the insurance packages, the IT systems, and everything like in normal M&A processes. This will be optimized. To put it in actual figure terms, I think it's hard to say.

Alexander Saverys: I think 2026, give us a couple of quarters, and you'll see those energy and naturally normalize, I would say. Makes sense. Thank you. Final question for me. Does the $1.57 billion in remaining commitments include the capex on the recent CSOV new build addition? No, that's a good point. In Q4, we'll add that. Currently, as Alex mentioned, it's one ship. We can't disclose the new build price, but it's somewhat higher, I would say, than your smaller CSOV. That is going to be added to the total capex. Okay. Perfect. I'll turn it over. Thank you for taking my questions. You're done. Next up is Christopher. You can now unmute and ask your question, please. Hello. Good afternoon. Can you comment a bit on when the options on the CSOVs are lapsing and when is the delivery of the optional vessels?

It's on the structure and then, uh, uh, axle on the optimal loan to value. I mean, we are indicating a 50% loan to value, um, throughout the the cycle. Uh, we're we're somewhat north of that. Um, so uh, after the full delivery new building program, um, assimilated, you know, and and most of it is going to be end to 26. I think out of the 1.5 billion uh we're taking a delivery of 1 billion worth of ships in. 26 so thereafter. It's only a few ships that are on long-term Charters. Um, we're definitely targeting the the 50%, but in your 50%, I think it's important to look at. What is the the costs of those financing uh, where we still have some expensive? Leases on on boards, we still have bonds, we still have Bridges. I think it's also the work in the next 2 quarters to take out. I would say, the more expensive depth replace it by uh inexpensive financing which is a a readily available for

It's on the structure and then, uh, uh, axle on the optimal loan to value. I mean, we are indicating a 50% loan to value, um, throughout the the cycle. Uh, we're we're somewhat north of that. Um, so uh, after the full delivery new building program, um, uh, assimilated, you know, and and most of it is going to be and 26, I think out of the 1.5 billion, uh we're taking a delivery of 1 billion worth of ships in. 26 so thereafter. It's only a few ships that are on long-term Charters. Um, we're definitely targeting the the 50%, but in your 50%, I think it's important to look at. What is the the costs of those financing uh, where we still have some expensive? Leases on on boards, we still have bonds, we still have Bridges. I think it's also the work in the next 2 quarters to take out. I would say, the more expensive depth replace it by uh inexpensive financing which is a readily available for

It's on the structure and then, uh, uh, axle on the optimal loan to value. I mean, we are indicating a 50% loan to value, um, throughout the the cycle. Uh, we're we're somewhat north of that. Um, so uh, after the full delivery new building program, um, assimilated, you know, and and most of it is going to be and 26, I think out of the 1.5 billion, uh we're taking a delivery of 1 billion worth of ships in. 26 so thereafter. It's only a few ships that are on long term Charters. Um, we're definitely targeting the the 50%, but in your 50% I think it's important to look at. What is the the costs of those uh financing uh where we still have some expensive? Leases on on boards. We still have bonds, we still have Bridges. I think it's also the work in the next 2 quarters to take out. I would say the more expensive depth replace it by uh inexpensive financing which is a a readily available for companies.

Companies like us, um, at this stage.

Is like us, um, uh, at this stage.

Like us, um, uh, at this stage.

Thank you. Just a short follow-up. Uh, maybe you partly answered that earlier, but could we then expect, uh,

A fixed payout ratio or so an explicit dividend policy, different from what you have or don't have today.

Thank you. Just a short follow-up. Uh, maybe your party answered that uh, earlier, but uh, could we then expect a fixed payout ratio? Uh, also an explicit dividend policy, uh, different from uh what you uh have or don't have today?

Thank you just just a short follow-up. Um, maybe you're partly answered that uh earlier but uh could we then expect uh a fixed payout ratio. Uh also an explicit dividend policy uh different from uh what you uh have or don't have today.

They're often. No, I think no, we don't have. It's, uh, fully discretionary dividend policy. I think, um, while our balance sheet and our company is still in transition. I think that's a, an important 1 to say. Uh, we need to keep the flexibility to decide on every dollar that goes down on that m&a. New builds, rewarding shareholder to share by back or dividends so we're not going to go for a fixed payout uh in uh uh any time in the short future.

There often. No, I think, no, we don't have. It's, uh, fully discretionary dividend policy. I think, um, while our balance sheet and our company is still in transition. I think that's a, an important 1 to say. Uh, we need to keep the flexibility to decide on every dollar that goes down on that m&a. New builds, rewarding shareholder to share by back or dividends so we're not going to go for a fixed payout uh in uh uh any time in the short future.

There often—no, I think—no, we don't have. It's, uh, fully discussed in your dividend policy. I think, um, while our balance sheet and our company are still in transition, I think that's an important one to say. Uh, we need to keep the flexibility to decide on every dollar that goes down on that M&A, new builds, rewarding shareholders through share buybacks or dividends. So we're not going to go for a fixed payout in, uh, uh, any time in the short future.

There often. No, I think, no, we don't have, it's, uh, fully discussion. New dividend policy. I think, um, while our balance sheet and our company is still in transition. I think that's a, an important 1 to say. Uh, we need to keep the flexibility to decide on every dollar that goes down on that m&a. New builds, rewarding shareholder to share by back or dividends so we're not going to go for a fixed payout uh in uh uh any time in the short future.

Okay, many thanks. That's all from me.

And we have a few questions, uh, in the Q&A.

Questions, uh, in the Q&A. So I will ask them.

Alexander Saverys: In order to declare them, would you need to see any long-term contract in the division, or what do you need to see to declare these options? Yeah. We have a lot of time, so close to a year to declare the option. Of course, the options thereafter. Of course, the earlier we declare, the earlier the vessels could deliver. We're looking at deliveries in 2028 and 2029. In terms of contracts, it's not a must-have to have a contract to lift the option. Of course, if we get a contract straight away, we could lift the option earlier, but we could also lift without a contract. Perfect. Moving over to the tank division, what type of time shuttle levels would you need to see in order to de-risk estimates here? It seems like rates are starting to move quite fast.

Uh, the first one, is it correct that the 2026 FCF is sensitive? I think this is not a projection. We are not believing that this could hold on, uh, for.

Uh, the first one, is it correct that the 2026 FCF is sensitive? I think this is not a projection. We are not believing that this could hold on for.

For a year, because we don't know. We are in a kind of market where it could go any way right now. Supply and demand looks positive. Like Alex mentioned, we just want to show the free cash flow capacity.

Yeah, because we don't know, we are in a kind of market where it could go anywhere right now. Supply and demand looks positive. Like Alex mentioned, we just want to show the free cash flow capacity.

Uh, in the Q&A. So I will add them. Uh, the first one. Is it correct that a 2026 FCF sensitivity assumed $180,000 a day in VLCC rates for the whole of 2026? If so, can you provide more color on the factors behind such an assumption? Sure, 818. So 118 and 180, I think this is not a projection. We are not believing that this could hold on for a year because we don't know. We are in a kind of market where it could go anywhere right now. Supply and demand looks positive. Like Alex mentioned, we just want to show the free cash flow capacity.

Alexander Saverys: Obviously, where do you pick the five-year? What do you pick a five-year for modern VLCC? What do you think? Yeah, probably just below $50 million or something, or? Yeah. Clearly, that's not something we would do right now. I mean, we can still change our mind, of course. I think the market would need to be higher on long-term, and I'm talking five years plus then, in order to consider. Current rates are for us, for our modern tonnage, and I stress on modern tonnage, we would need to see more. Final one from me. In terms of the bond process you had ongoing, can you just comment a bit on how you're sort of looking to refinance the bond maturing next year? Is it still only debt instrument with an equity covenant and not value, just equity? Yeah. Great question.

If at $118,000 a day for 4 years for VCCs, which is relatively small in our policy exposure compared to our dry book, where we anticipate $34,000 on Newcastle, as we're actually at $44,000 right now if you look at the market. So it's just an assumption to show the operational leverage and the free cash flow generation capacity of our company. Hence, it is strengthened by the belief that we will be able to pay back the bridges and the bonds, as well as our new build capex. Just buy on cash code, we're fixing Q4 already, you know, deep down Q4, and we're starting to fix Q1.

If at 118,000 day for a full year for vcc's, which is relatively small in our policy exposure, compared to our dry bulk where we anticipate 34,000 on new customers. As we're actually we're at 44,000 right now. If you look at the the market. So it's it's just an assumption to show the operational. Leverage and the free cash flow generation capacity of our company. Hence, it is stren by the belief that we will be able to pay back the bridges, and the bonds, and our new build capex. Just buy on cash flow. We're fixing Q4 already, you know, deep down Q4, and we're starting to fix q1.

To Q4 and Q1. There is a good likelihood that we are hovering around elevated levels.

Is it going to be 118? We don't know. But is it going to be 34 for new customers? We don't even know as well. This could go up.

Is it going to be 118? We don't know, but it's going to be 34 for new customers. We don’t even know as well. This could go up.

Is it going to be 118? We don't know. But is it going to be 34 for new customers? We don't even know as well. This could go up.

All right then. Um, the second question. Um, what are your expectations for the Sim do mine opening? How important is the service for the offshore oil market OC to you going forward? There are some very old special vessels in operation by competitors. What are the depreciation rates?

Right then. Um, the second question, um, what are expectations for the Sim and do mine opening? How important is the service for the offshore oil market to you going forward? There are some very old special vessels in operation by competitors. What are the depreciation rates?

Right then. Um, the second question. Um, what are your expectations for the Sim? And do mind opening, how important is the service to the offshore oil market OC to you going forward? There are some very old special vessels in operation by competitors. What are the depreciation rates?

Okay. So on Sim, I think we've highlighted this already many times. That is, of course, going to be a meaningful impact as it ramps up to its full capacity of 120 million tons of extra iron ore.

Okay. So, on Sim, do I think we've highlighted this already many times? Uh, that is, of course, going to be a meaningful impact as it ramps up to its full capacity of 120 million tons of extra hour and/or.

Okay. So on Sim, I think we've highlighted this already many times. Uh, that is, of course, going to be a meaningful impact as it ramps up to its full capacity of 120 million tons of extra iron ore.

Okay. So on Sim, do I think we've highlighted this already many times? Uh, that is, of course, going to be a meaningful impact as it ramps up, uh, to its full capacity of 120 million, tons of extra hour an hour,

Alexander Saverys: I think we stopped the bond process because we had much cheaper alternatives, Christoph. In that same flow, we are anticipating paying back the bonds with our own free cash flow, sale of assets, and own liquidity. We do not anticipate the bond process to be reinitiated anytime soon. It is a sheet bonds, six and a quarter. We will probably leave it run until 26 September 2026. The way it is continuing, not just the bond, but also on the bridge, we feel that we can pay this with our own means. We do not foresee any equity issuances or debt capital markets in the coming quarters. Thanks, guys. That is it from me. Thank you. Thanks. Next up is Axel. You may now unmute and ask your question, please. Thank you. Three questions for me.

Um, I think on the offshore Market uh we can be very clear. We have our ctvs for the offshore wind specifically we have 6 covs which are very meaningful investment of you know close to half a billion dollars uh where we definitely want uh to continue to fix them. Well, short term, and long term. Uh, we have now 1 extra Co XL, uh, if it is successful, if we see traction with our customers, we will definitely order more.

Um, I think on the offshore market, we can be very clear. We have our CTVs for the offshore wind specifically. We have 6 CS OVs, which are a very meaningful investment of, you know, close to half a billion dollars, where we definitely want to continue to fix them, both short term and long term. We have now 1 extra Co XL; if it is successful and we see traction with our customers, we will definitely order more.

Um, I think on the offshore Market uh we can be very clear. We have our ctvs for the offshore wind specifically. We have 6 CS ovs which are very meaningful investment of you know close to half a billion dollars uh where we definitely want uh to continue to fix them. Well short term, and long term. Uh we have now 1 extra C of VXL. Uh, if it is successful, if we see traction with our customers, we will definitely order more.

Um, I think on the offshore Market uh we can be very clear. We have our CTV for the offshore wind specifically, we have 6 CS ovs which are very meaningful investment of you know close to half a billion dollars uh where we definitely want uh to continue to fix them. Well, short term, and long term. Uh, we have now 1 extra series of excel, uh, if it is successful, if we see traction with our customers, we will definitely order more.

And the last question. Oh, depreciation rates with the depreciating, I think, 20 years to scrap now on OSVs. The scrap is relatively light, so you can assume close to zero. But these are the depreciation rates that we use on the offshore investments.

And the last question. Oh, depreciation rates—uh, we're appreciating, I think, 20 years to scrap now on OSVs. The scrap is relatively light, so you can assume close to zero. But these are the depreciation rates that we use on the offshore investments.

And the last question. Oh, depreciation rates with the appreciate, I think 20 years to scrap now on OSVs. The scrap is relatively light, so you can assume close to zero. But these are the depreciation rates that we use on the offering investments.

And the last question. Oh, depreciation rates, with the appreciation, I think 20 years to scrap now on OSVs, the scrap is relatively light. So, you can assume close to zero, but these are the depreciations that we use on the offering investments.

And we have one more question live. So, Kirin, you can now unmute and ask your question.

Alexander Saverys: One, how do you see potential removal of US sanctions on the Russian oil to influence the tank market and the tank rates? Second question, if the Guinea volumes on the R&R just started really replaces the Australian exports to China, how do you see this outlook? How is this influencing the British outlook on the tribal market, on the large tribal territories? Thirdly, what kind of optimal financing structure, what kind of leverage are you looking for after you're taking delivery of your new billing program? Okay. I'll take the two first questions, then maybe Ludovic, you can comment on our finance structure. On Ukraine, I think the easy thing to say is that before the fully fledged war started in 2022, or when you look at the effect of the war, it was definitely positive for crude oil tankers.

Good afternoon. Good morning everyone, uh, from in. Um, I have a couple of questions, my first question is with regard to the tariffs. Um, have you have you calculate what the impact was of terrorists on your company? Let me say between first of April and the end of September. That's my first question. And the second question is about. Let me say, if you look at your uh, your fixed, your fixed contracts. 295 I think 294 in that range, what do you think it will be at the end of 202025?

Good afternoon. Good morning everyone, uh, from in. Um, I've got a couple of questions. My first question is with regard to the tariffs. Um, have you have you calculate what the impact was of tariffs on your company? Let me say between first of April and the end of September. That's my first question. And the second question is about. Let me say, if you look at your uh, your fixed, your fixed contracts. 295 I think 294 in that range, what do you think it will be at the end of 202025?

Good afternoon. Good morning everyone, uh, from in. Um, I've got a couple of questions. My first question is with regard to the tariffs. Um, have you have you calculate what the impact was of terrorists on your company? Let me say between first of April and the end of September. That's my first question. And the second question is about. Let me say, if you look at your uh, your fixed, your fixed contracts. 295 I think 294 in that range, what do you think it will be at the end of 202025?

That's why my 2 questions. Okay, thank ya. Thank you, Ken. I'll answer your second question first. Um, we have the intention, of course to increase it. I think we've been very vocal about that. Uh, we want to take more cover when markets are high. Uh, we don't have a fixed Target because a lot will depend on the market and what people are willing to offer us. But we definitely want to grow, uh, our fixed contract cover. Um, the first question on the tariffs, uh,

That way my 2 questions. Okay. Thank ya. Thank you, Ken. I'll answer your second question first. Um, we have the intention, of course to increase it. I think we've been very vocal about that. Uh, we want to take more cover when markets are high. Uh, we don't have a fixed Target because a lot will depend on the market and what people are willing to offer us. But we definitely want to grow our fixed contract cover. Um, the first question on the tariffs, uh,

That, where are my 2en? I'll answer your second question first. Um, we have the intention, of course, to increase it. I think we've been very vocal about that. Uh, we want to take more cover when markets are high. Uh, we don't have a fixed target because a lot will depend on the market and what people are willing to offer us. But we definitely want to grow our fixed contract cover. Um, the first question on the tariffs, uh,

Alexander Saverys: If we would unwind it, one might say logically it will be negative. In our opinion, it's way too early to say, and actually we don't know. Maybe in theory, relief of sanctions on Russia could be negative for our market because then you unwind everything that has been put in place over the last two, three years. In practical terms, I think there will be a lot of different levers that will play an impact on that. The short answer to your question is we don't know what the impact will be. On Guinea cannibalizing Australian volumes, because I think that's what you mean, I think two things need to be said there.

Apart from the effects on, um, the market in general, with rerooting of ships. And, and, and what this has had on some of our vessel fixtures, we have actually none or very little impact on terrorists. Our container ships. Container ships are the ones that are more affected our chartered out. Uh, so there it is, of course, an issue for our customer, but not directly for us. And on the 2 other segments that would call, uh, the United States or would carry good Goods to, and from the United States, it's drivable and it's oil. Uh, and on drywall, we do very little to the United States, uh, on oil. As you know, this has been Exempted. So, um, in short the impact of terrorists on us on us, on CNB, Tech specifically, uh, has been close to zero. Of course, the side effects of on the broader Market of rerouting of ships and people wanting to have Japanese or Korean build chips to go to China and vice versa, uh, for China, uh, that we have felt a little bit but I must

Apart from the effects on, um, the market in general, with rerooting of ships. And, and, and what this has had on some of our vessel fixtures, we have actually none or very little impact on terrorists. Our container ships. Container ships are the ones that are more affected our chartered out. Uh, so there it is, of course, an issue for our customer, but not directly for us. And on the 2 other segments that would call, uh, the United States or would carry good Goods to and from the United States is drivable and its oil. Uh, and on dry bulk, we do very little to the United States, uh, on oil. As you know, this has been Exempted. So, um, in short the impact of terrorists on us on us, on CNB, Tech specifically, uh, has been close to zero. Of course, the side effects of on the broader Market of rerouting of ships and people wanting to have Japanese or Korean build ships to go to China and vice versa for China. Uh, that we have felt a little bit but I must

Say that right now. The effects are very limited.

People wanting to have uh Japanese or Korean build ships to go to China and vice versa, uh, for China. Uh, that we have felt a little bit but I must say that right now. The effects are very limited.

Uh, Japanese or Korean ships are built to go to China, and vice versa for China. Uh, we have felt a little bit of that, but I must say that right now the effects are very limited.

Say that right now. The effects are very limited.

Now that does that, also mean that the end of terrorists is, uh, does not have any impact in, let me say, 2026.

Now, does that also mean that the end of terrorism is, uh, does not have any impact in, let me say, 2026?

Now, does that also mean that the end of terrorists does not have any impact in, let me say, 2026?

Well, well, okay then. I think, uh, now I'm talking as a shipping player in general. Terrorists are always bad.

Well, well, again I think, uh, now I'm talking as a shipping player in general. Terrorists are always bad.

Alexander Saverys: On R&R specifically, you have to know that in the very beginning, all the volumes are going to China and are actually being transported by Chinese ships, which is taking away capacity supporting the market in general. Going forward, of course, as we see a ramp-up and there would be any cannibalization, the logical immediate effect is that you're replacing short ton mile with long ton mile. The effect is relatively positive. If on top of that, you would see that the price of R&R starts falling, you might push out some producers that have a higher break-even level. There, we think that will rather stimulate the high or the long ton mile than the short ton mile. All in all, cannibalization of volumes, of Australian volumes, and replacing them by Guinea volumes, we think it will definitely have an impact on the market.

Well, well, okay, then I think, uh, now I'm talking as a shipping player in general. Tariffs are always bad. We prefer not to have any tariffs because then trade can flow freely, and that means more opportunities for our ships to trade. So, uh, again, I don't want to, um, create the wrong impression. We are, uh, very much in favor of tariffs going away because that creates more trading opportunities for our ships. If you go on a micro level, what has happened in the United States compared to our fleet? Daily impact has been limited.

We prefer not to have any tariffs because then trade can flow freely, and that means more opportunities for our ships to trade. So, again, I don't want to create a wrong impression. We are very much in favor of tariffs going away because that creates more trading opportunities for our ships. If you go on a micro level, what has happened in the United States compared to our fleet is that the impact has been limited.

My final question is about the, let me say the the order ratio for the VCS to is Max, that is now above 12%. As I understand from your graphs

My final question is about the, let me say the the order ratio for the VC's to as Max that is now, uh, above 12%. As I understand from your graphs,

My final question is about the let me say the the order ratio for the VC's to as Max that is now above 12%. As I understand from your graphs

um,

What is the delivery time of these vessels? That's mostly 26/27. Is there anything to add to that in terms of when it is coming and what the impact might be?

What is the delivery time of these specials? That's mostly the 26th or 27th. Is there anything to add in terms of when it is coming and what the impact might be?

Alexander Saverys: On a net basis, it could actually be positive. It's on the structure. Actually, on the optimal loan-to-value, I mean, we are indicating a 50% loan-to-value throughout the cycle. We're somewhat north of that. After the full delivery new building program assimilated, and most of it's going to be end 2026, I think out of the $1.5 billion, we're taking a delivery of $1 billion worth of ships in 2026. Thereafter, it's only a few ships that are on open charters. We're definitely targeting the 50%. In your 50%, I think it's important to look at what is the cost of those financings. We still have some expensive leases on board, we still have bonds, we still have bridges.

Mention 26, 27. We don't see any meaningful capacity that can still be added to the order book, but 28, we are seeing new yards or existing yards with extra capacity still coming on stream. So that number by 2028 could still go up. That's my belief.

Yeah, so it's 15% for VLCC and 20% for S-Max. So it's actually higher than the 12% you mentioned. Um, 2627—we don't see any meaningful capacity that can still be added to the order book. But by 2028, we are seeing new yards or existing yards with extra capacity still coming on stream. So that number by 2028 could still go up. Uh, that's my belief.

26 27. We don't see any meaningful capacity that can still be added to the order book by 2028. We are seeing new yards or existing yards, with extra capacity, still coming on stream. So that number by 2028 could still go up. That's my belief.

And today again, if you would want to jump on these slots, I mean, we had one shipyard in China offering early slots for N2728, but any conventional yard that you see in the new flow, you know, uh, on the specific Shipping News.

And today, Ken, if you would want to jump on these slots. I mean, we had one shipyard in China offering early slots for $27 million, $28 million, but any conventional yard that you see in the news flow, you know, on the specific shipping news.

Alexander Saverys: I think it's also the work in the next two quarters to take out, I would say, the more expensive debt, replace it by inexpensive financing, which is readily available for companies like us at this stage. Thank you. Just a short follow-up. Maybe you partly answered that earlier, but could we then expect a fixed payout ratio or an explicit dividend policy different from what you have or don't have today thereafter? No, I think no, we don't have. It's a fully discretionary dividend policy. I think while our balance sheet and our company is still in transition, I think that's an important one to say. We need to keep the flexibility to decide on every dollar that goes down on debt, M&A, new builds, rewarding shareholders for share buyback or dividends. We're not going to go for fixed payouts anytime in the short future. Okay. Many thanks.

You are starting to talk n28 if you deliver to the if you order today. Beginning 29 even 2030. So shipyards are, you know, getting you know a filled up with the current slots. As Alex mentioned, you can have new yards, you can have new capacity coming online as well. Um, but definitely the, the, the traditional delivery when the delivery time for VLC and SW, Maxes are quite long now.

You are starting to talk n28 if you deliver to the if you order today. Beginning 29 even 2030. So shipyards are you know getting you know filled up with the current slots. Now as Alex mentioned you can have new yards, you can have new capacity coming online as well, um, but definitely the, the traditional delivery, when the delivery time for VC and SW, Maxes are quite long now.

And today again, if if you would want to jump on these slots, I mean we had 1 Shipyard in China offering early slots for n 2728 but any conventional yard that you see in the news flow you know uh on on the the specific Shipping News, you are starting to talk n28 if you deliver to the if you order today. Beginning 29 even 2030 so shipyards are you know getting you know filled up with the current slots. Now as Alex mentioned you can have new yards, you can have new capacity coming online as well. Um, but definitely the the, the traditional delivery, when every time for VC and SW, Maxes are quite long now.

And today again, if if you would want to jump on these slots, I mean, we had 1, Shipyard in China offering early slots for n, 27 million 28, but any conventional yard as you see in the new flow, you know, uh on on the specific Shipping News, you are starting to talk n28 if you deliver to the if you order today. Beginning 29 even 2030. So shipyards are you know, getting in a filled up with the current slots as Alex mentioned you can have new yards. You have new capacity coming online as well. Um, but definitely the the, the traditional delivery, when the delivery time for VC and SW, Maxes are quite long now.

Okay, thank you.

Thank you. We have two additional questions written.

Thank you with 2 additional questions uh, written.

So, the Q4 2025 bookings for VCCs look low versus the market rates. Can you comment on why?

Oh,

It has to do with the trips that our vessels have been doing, and I'm assuming people are referring to some of our peers as well. There's some creative bookkeeping sometimes related to low discharges or discharge-to-discharge, but there is also the fact that some of our vessels are slightly older. Of course, our earnings are less than those of more modern vessels operated by our peers. We just took delivery of one very modern ship, but we still have some tonnage that is 13 years old, which is logically earning a little bit less because the vessels burn more fuel.

Or, uh, it has to do, uh, with the trips that our vessels have been doing. And I'm supposing people are referring as well to some of our peers. There's some creative bookkeeping sometimes: low to discharge, or discharge to discharge. But there is also the fact that some of our vessels are slightly older, and of course, our earnings are less than more modern vessels that are operated by our peers. We just took delivery of one very modern ship, but we still have some tonnage which is 13 years old and which is logically, then, earning a little bit less because the vessels burn more fuel.

And then, the last one: can you discuss the relationship between nukes and capes historically? And going forward, will this change?

And then, the last one, can you discuss the relationship between nukes and capes historically? And going forward, will this change?

Alexander Saverys: That's all for me. Thank you. There were a few questions in the Q&A, so I will ask them. The first one, is it correct that the 2026 FCF sensitivities assume $118,000 a day in VLCC rates for the whole of 2026? If so, can you provide more color on the factors behind such an assumption? Sure. It's 118. That's 118 and not 180. I think this is not a projection. We are not believing that this could hold on for a year because we don't know. We are in a kind of market where it could go any way right now. Supply demand looks positive, like Alex mentioned. We just want to show the free cash flow capacity.

What the relationship is they they move the same cargo. 1 ship is just 5, m wider and Carries 25,000 to 30,000 tons more. Um Cape sizes. Traditionally have been the Workhorse of the fleet but Newcastle Maxes are taking this over now because it is relatively cheaper just to build a slightly bigger ship, uh, than than, than a cape size 180k. So same same cargo, same trade.

What relationship is they? They move the same cargo. 1 ship is just 5 m wider and Carries 25,000 to 30,000 tons more. Um Cape sizes. Traditionally have been the Workhorse of the fleet but Newcastle Maxes are taking this over now because it is relatively cheaper just to build a slightly bigger ship, uh, than than, than a cape size 180k. So same same cargo, same trade.

What relationship is they? They move the same cargo. 1 ship is just 5 m wider and Carries 25,000 to 30,000 tons more um Cape sizes traditionally have been the Workhorse of the fleet but new custom axes are taking this over now because it is relatively cheaper just to build a slightly bigger ship, uh, than than, than a cape size 180k. So same same cargo, same trade.

Perfect. I think that concludes the questions.

All right, well then, we will close this earnings call by thanking all of you for having dialed in. We look forward to speaking with you in the following weeks, months, or maybe on the next earnings call. Thank you very much. Thank you. Bye bye.

All right, well then, we will close this earnings call by thanking all of you for having dialed in and looking forward to speaking to you in the following weeks, months, or maybe on the next earnings call. Thank you very much. Thank you. Bye-bye.

All right, well then, we will, uh, close this earnings call by thanking all of you for having dialed in and looking forward to speaking to you in the following weeks, months, or maybe on the next earnings call. Thank you very much. Thank you. Bye-bye.

Alexander Saverys: If at $118,000 a day for a full year for VLCCs, which is relatively small in our spot exposure compared to our dry bulk, where we anticipate $34,000 on new customers, where actually we're at $44,000 right now if you look at the market, it's just an assumption to show the operational leverage and the free cash flow generation capacity of our company. Hence, it is strengthened by the belief that we'll be able to pay back the bridges, the bonds, and our new build capex just by own cash flow. We're fixing Q4 already, deep down Q4, and we're starting to fix Q1. Q4 and Q1, there is a good likelihood that we are hovering around elevated levels. Is it going to be 118? We don't know. Is it going to be 34 for new customers? We don't even know as well.

The meeting will start shortly.

The meeting will start short.

Alexander Saverys: This could go up. Right. The second question, what are your expectations for the Simandou mine opening? How important is the service to the offshore oil market, OSC, to you going forward? There are some very old vessels in operation by competitors. What are our depreciation rates? Okay. On Simandou, I think we've highlighted this already many times. That is, of course, going to be a meaningful impact as it ramps up to its full capacity of 120 million tons of extra R&R. I think on the offshore market, we can be very clear. We have our CTVs for the offshore wind specifically. We have six CSOVs, which are a very meaningful investment of close to half a billion dollars, where we definitely want to continue to fix them well, short term and long term. We have now one extra CSOV, Excel.

Alexander Saverys: If it is successful, if we see traction with our customers, we will definitely order more. The last question on depreciation rate, we depreciate, I think, 20 years to scrap. Now, on OSVs, the scrap is relatively light, so you can assume close to zero. These are depreciation that we use on the offshore investments. There is one more question live. Kiren, you can now unmute and ask your question. Good afternoon. Good morning, everyone. Kiren Mul from ING. I have a couple of questions. My first question is with regard to the tariffs. Have you calculated what the impact was of tariffs on your company, let me say, between 1 April and the end of September? That's my first question.

Alexander Saverys: The second question is about, let me say, if you look at your fixed contracts, 295, I think, 294 in that range, what do you think it will be at the end of 2025? Those are my two questions. Okay. Thank you, Kiren. I'll answer your second question first. We have the intention, of course, to increase it. I think we've been very vocal about that. We want to take more cover when markets are high. We don't have a fixed target because a lot will depend on the market and what people are willing to offer us. We definitely want to grow our fixed contract cover. The first question on the tariffs, apart from the effect on the market in general with rerouting of ships and what this has had on some of our vessel fixtures, we have actually none or very little impact on tariffs.

Alexander Saverys: Our container ships, container ships are the ones that are more affected, are chartered out. There it is, of course, an issue for our customer, but not directly for us. On the two other segments that will call the United States or carry goods to and from the United States, it's dry bulk, and it's oil. On dry bulk, we do very little to the United States. On oil, as you know, this has been exempted. In short, the impact of tariffs on us, on CMB.TECH specifically, has been close to zero. Of course, the side effects on the broader market of rerouting of ships and people wanting to have Japanese or Korean build ships to go to China, and vice versa for China, that we have felt a little bit. I must say that right now, the effects are very limited.

Alexander Saverys: Now, does that also mean that the end of tariffs does not have any impact in, let me say, 2026? Well, Kiren, I think now I'm talking as a shipping player in general. Tariffs are always bad. We prefer not to have any tariffs because then trade can flow freely, and that means more opportunities for our ships to trade. Again, I don't want to create a wrong impression. We are very much in favor of tariffs going away because that creates more trading opportunities for our ships. If you go on a macro level, what has happened in the United States compared to our fleet, then the impact has been limited. My final question is about the, let me say, the order ratio for the VLCCs to its max. That is now above 12%, as I understand from your graphs. What is the delivery time of these vessels?

Alexander Saverys: That's mostly 2026, 2027. Is there anything to add to that in terms of when it is coming and what the impact might be? Yeah. It is 15% for VLCCs and 20% for Suezmax markets, so it is actually higher than the 12% you mentioned. For 2026, 2027, we do not see any meaningful capacity that can still be added to the order book. For 2028, we are seeing new yards or existing yards with extra capacity still coming on stream, so that number by 2028 could still go up. That is my belief. Today, Kiren, if you would want to jump on these slots, I mean, we had one shipyard in China offering early slots for end 2027, beginning 2028.

Alexander Saverys: Any conventional yard, as you see in the news flow on the specific shipping news, you are starting to talk N28 if you deliver today, if you order today, beginning 29, even 2030. Shipyards are getting filled up with the current slots. Now, as Alex mentioned, you can have new yards. You can have new capacity coming online as well. Definitely, the traditional delivery time for VLCCs and space markets are quite long now. Thank you. Thank you. We have two additional questions written. The Q4 2025 boom for VLCCs looks low versus the market rates. Can you comment on why? It has to do with the trips that our vessels have been doing. I'm supposing people are referring as well to some of our peers. There's some creative bookkeeping sometimes, load to discharge or discharge to discharge.

Alexander Saverys: There is also a fact that some of our vessels are slightly older and, of course, are earning less than more modern vessels that are operated by our peers. We just took delivery of one very modern ship, but we still have some tonnage, which is 13 years old and which is logically then earning a little bit less because the vessels burn more fuel. The last one, can you discuss the relationship between NOTES and CAPES historically and going forward? Will this change going forward? Well, the relationship is they move the same cargo. One ship is just 5 meters wider and carries 25,000 to 30,000 tons more. CAPES sizes traditionally have been the workforce of the fleet, but new customers are taking this over now because it's relatively cheaper just to build a slightly bigger ship than CAPES size 180,000. Same cargo, same trades. Perfect.

Alexander Saverys: I think that concludes the questions. All right. Well, we will close this earnings call by thanking all of you for having dialed in, and looking forward to speaking to you in the following weeks, months, or maybe on the next earnings call. Thank you very much. Thank you. Bye. The meeting will start shortly. Raise hand is disabled. This meeting is no longer being.

Q3 2025 Cmb.Tech NV Earnings Call

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