Half Year 2022 Ryanair Holdings PLC Earnings Call

Welcome to the Ryanair h. 1f y 22 results throughout the call. All participants will be in listen-only mode.

I don't have to would still be a question and answer session during the Q&A in the interest of time. In the famous. Please, let me selves to two questions purpose, just to remind you this conference call is being recorded today. I'm pleased to present. My clothes are E1 are group, CEO. Please begin your meeting. Okay, good morning. Ladies and gentlemen, you're all very welcome to the this H1 results call. I'm here with Eddie Wilson and our team in London. Neil, Thomas, Fowler Tracy, Malloy.

CFO Reiner CFO are in Dublin.

A will as you know, I'd morning on the website, we posted up a the sheriff of the shareholder presentation. Did the an empty and a and a QA my says Ania but so will take you through the Presley's pretty quickly and asked me in for some comments and we'll leave as much room as we can for QA. We're pretty tight for X, we'll be finished. We have to finish on or before 11 o'clock. So if you see this morning, we reported a loss of 48 million of traffic has rebounded very strongly at lower fares.

I think what's interesting in these numbers is that in q1, the June fourth will be carried eight million passengers in the September quarter, that bounced back to 31 million passengers. Largely. Thanks to the success of the European Union's, digital COVID-19 certificate, which allowed a very strong traffic recover from the first of July onwards. I think what's also interesting in this morning's number is if you take the full half year our sectors and traffic has doubled the revenues have gone up by 83%. So clearly

We were discounting and price simulating into that recovery, but cast of Only risen by 63 percent. So the kind of very large cost savings that we have exploited as a result of COVID-19 will continue onwards and enable us to continue to pass, on much lower barriers to our customers and very much lead. The recovery of EU air travel since the 1st of July last nobody. No other area is recovering, as quickly as we are. We're now unexpected the second half of the year to be

I hear about 90% of our pre COVID-19 capacity. The load factors will continue to be a little bit lower, probably somewhere in the low 80 percents, as opposed to the low, 90% spree COVID-19, but all of that suggests that we will probably exceed, our current traffic guidance of ninety to a hundred million, as long as there's no adverse COVID-19 disruption between now and the end of March. I think we're looks like we're carrying probably about a hundred, three hundred four million passengers for the full year and we will continue. I believe to see

A very impressive performance of controlling unit costs, all of this would be done in an environmentally. I think sensitive manner. We taken delivery of the first of the GameChanger aircraft, where we'll have 65 of these aircraft in the fleet. For summer 2022, already. We're seeing these aircrafts, which have been operating in the fleet since June offer four percent more seats, but consumed 62% less Fuel and are cutting our noise emissions by 40%

Aunt. Tom Fowler in our sustainability team will working hard on developing the supply research and supply of a sustainable Aviation fuels. We continue to push the EU commission for reform of the single European sky so that we could minimize Air Traffic Control delays and inefficiencies that arise as a result of air traffic control and we're proud of our industry-leading. Be a - climate protection rating from the carbon disclosure project. We're committed to getting that to and a rating within the next two years.

Here's the COVID-19 and said the raft.

Travel recovery. Post COVID-19 July has been impressive and we take considerable heart from the eurocontrol have published numbers there for flights. In September Ryanair, was operating as a nine percent or ninety one percent of our pre COVID-19. Flights. Most of Europe's, like cars were operating at that between 50 and 60 percent of their pre covert flight volumes as were EasyJet. And others COVID-19 has can accelerate the collapse of

Of a significant amount of European airlines, including flybe Norwegian, German Wings level Stobart Etc. Alitalia has reformed as it a book with only 50% of its pre COVID-19. Fleet ta p is operating at about 65% of his pre-code Fleet as our loss and saas. And so we believe it's the summer of 2022. That would be materially less shorthold capacity. I believe it would be a double digit number sometime between 10 and 20 percent and therefore

Our 65 new aircraft deliveries means we are negotiating extraordinary COVID-19 recovery incentives, growth. Discounts games with our airport partners and increasing the European governments are care coming to the table. The Irish government. I think came up with a very Visionary COVID-19 recovery scheme. In the budget about two weeks ago. They're investing about 90 million in, for Aviation, much of which is being passed on by the Irish airports to the airlines in the form of lower.

Airfares, we've extended our long-term low-cost deal at Stansted Airport in London. In return for more aggressive COVID-19, traffic recovery. I think that's going to be a key concept bench for Rhino. The next number of years particularly in a market place where the owners of Heathrow have just jacked up fees to the Airlines and passengers by 50%. And still, you can play, it was still complaining that they're only getting low returns and they want to check them up, more gas leak. Will inevitably follow and raise these? So,

Instead and Ryanair I think will continue to be the low-cost Haven, our own Oasis of low-cost traffic recovery and growth for the next five years in London. And that situation is being mirrored by other EU countries as well. The UK has reduced a UK APD by 50%. Come on domestic routes. Even the Spanish government has decided that I enas charge would be frozen for the next five years, which gives us the capacity the opportunity to add significant capacity those markets while

While benefiting from low or in some cases, lower fares. As you have seen for next year. We're have announced 14 new basis, but more importantly than that is yet the aircraft allocations that are going to existing basis. Normally, on this presentation. I point you in the slide to the slide for which is the unit cost, slide this time on used. I'd point you to slide 13, which is where the aircraft growth has been allocated for 21 2022. We have 29,

Aircraft being allocated to new bases, ranging from Stockholm to Venice. I grab zadar.

Croatia children in Italy but much more aircraft being an alligator. Existing basis. 11 aircraft going into Vienna six aircraft going into standstill where we bought the EasyJet slots at Stansted. To continue that growth. Manchester three more aircraft taking up the an opportunity where Thomas Cook has shed capacity. There's more than 20 aircraft going into Italy for summer. 2022, Rome Milan, neighbors, bolonia again, where Alitalia has taken away.

Wait, a very significant amount of capacity. EasyJet is also either reducing or closing bases in Venice. And in Naples, and we're moving in there with lower cost aircraft taking up that capacity working with the airports to reverse their COVID-19, traffic declined, Italy, Spain. Portugal will continue to be Marcus where we will see, very significant capacity. Allocations by Ryan are on the back of lower airport, fees and Barry. And I think accelerated

Recovery into next year, as a result of that. We've significantly stepped up our growth projections for the next five years. Originally. We had very ambitious targets to grow to 200 million passengers. It is clear. However, that the growth is going to be faster and more aggressive than that. So, we now increase that growth profile for the next five years by another 10 percent up to 225 million passengers, and that means that next year, we expect to carry

65 million passengers, that's through the summer of 2022, into the air Market. The year ended March 2023, and we will build on that over the coming years. No, other airline in Europe, has the aircraft deliveries coming from Boeing. The we have over the next four or five years. All the airports and the government's I think across Europe, recognize that we will be the vehicle by which they will accelerate their COVID-19, traffic and tourism recovery. We have a big team of people this morning in London, at the World Travel Market.

Meeting government ministers. Airports and tours of boards all over Europe, and they are beating a path to our door. So I think the growth opportunity has never been more exciting. Certainly in my 30 years in this business. I've never seen a growth opportunity like this. I have never seen an opportunity where we have 210 aircraft coming to us for the next five years. And most of our competitors are either cutting their capacity, or don't have any aircraft orders at all for the next.

Five years. So we're expanding very much into a market of that is full of opportunity where there doesn't seem to be much competitor response at all. Touch briefly on the half-year results at again. I would point you. Well, the sectors and traffic more than doubled revenues up. 83% said, you'll revenues down as we stimulate a truck recovery. Ancillary revenues, preferment performing very strongly but operating costs increased by just 63% looking forward.

Over the next 12-18 months, we've hedged our fuel.

With a mix of jet swaps and caps were essentially 60% hedged out for the next 18 months to March of twenty twenty-three at around. $60, a barrel. We have swaps in place for a further 20 percent both for Q4 of f y, 22. And the first half of FY 23 to key summer months at around $70. A barrel, which means, you know, where insulated from the recent short-term Spike upwards in oil price.

Has and the market is in backwardation. So we continue to see significant opportunities to buy fuel forward. The reason we don't want to lock away 90% on a kind of a rolling jet swap basis is clearly we've learned from the COVID-19 experience that you know, there could be a return of some kind of lock downs. And therefore, we don't want to buy forward 90% but we think that balance have 60% 60% of Chess swaps hedging and 20% of caps. Is that the right place?

Be the balance sheet has recovered. Very strongly as bookings. Have recovered cash flows have are now at the, you have year-end were north of 4.2 billion. I would Point again. We repaid the 2014 Bond of 850 million, which was priced at just under two percent. In June of this year. We refinanced that with a new 1.2 million billion rather five-year bond, which we priced at less than 1% is.

Point eight five percent for five-year money unsecured to an airline. It's extraordinary low-cost financing and I think it adds to our price leadership. Over all of our EU Airline competitors. Many of whom have been doing expensive, save at least backs on their Fleet in the last 12 months or been adding to their feet at very high prices. We were out there during COVID-19. We went to the our shareholders. First. We raised four hundred million by way of a rights issue and I think that gave the market significant confidence in the bond market.

With the very strong cash position. We take into the board, took the decision last week to repay the UK, CCF loan of 600 million Sterling. We've repaid that five months early because frankly, we don't need the money anymore. We are. And we are well funded for our capex for the next two years. I should highlight where again, looking strongly at the potential D listing for the London Stock Exchange. In my personal view. I think we will probably deal is sometimes

In the next six months, I think they, this is part of the function of Airlines self operate under a regulatory constraints, that we as an EU Airline must be 50%. Do you owned and controlled? We're a hundred percent. Do you control because we disenfranchised? All of the non-eu shareholders post brexit, but as, you know, from an ownership point of view, we had about 40 between 40, 44 percent of our stock is held in North America, in a DRS, which these about 55 56.

Send held her own in Europe in.

One reason was that UK holders. I became non-european post brexit. We've gone below 50% and I think the European commission wants us to be seen to be taking action. We've had our first for share sale in September last. Another step of that process is delisting from the London Stock Exchange, the trading, in our shares, in the edit in London has significantly diminished post brexit. Most of the trading in the ordinary takes place on the urine X talking.

Exchange in Dublin and Brussels and we would like to see that continue which where our primary listing will be. And I think it is likely that we will deal is from the lse. It won't have any material effect on our UK shareholders, but we do need to move some of our UK shareholders. Into being he you shareholders over the next 12 or 18 months looking for briefly on the Outlook. I think the outlook for traffic recovery remains very strong for the remainder are fight.

Eddie to that's why we've taken the traffic forecast up above the existing. Range of nice to do a hundred million pricing in the last week of the October midterm. Break was astonishingly strong. We think Christmas again, looks like it's going to be very strong forward. Bookings for Christmas are ahead of where they were here for COVID-19. We think they spring midterm break in February, will be strong. Easter will be strong and certainly summer 22. The forward bookings quite low at the moment. Our pricing.

Very strongly currently prices are about just over 5% ahead of where they were this time in 2019 for summer of 2020. Pre-K COVID-19. We think will continue to build on that and that would be a combination of less capacity in the short haul Market in Europe and increasingly people turning to Ryanair with some confidence because we're opening new routes offering more frequencies to the destinations that they want to travel to.

Racing. However, outside those Peak periods. I think will remain a challenging. We think November the 1st. Half of December 2nd, half of February, 2nd half of January. Early February will be challenging. But as I say, if you look at the last six months, when revenues have risen 83% costs of only reason 63%, we have a unique, cost-based Advantage. Now, over every other airline in Europe. I think one of the effects of COVID-19 is that cost Advantage has widened because of our low-cost financing

Most aircraft delivery, the sensible way that we've agreed to pay reductions with our people for last year and this year and we're looking forward. We want to begin that pay Restoration in April of next year, and I would will be restored over two or three year period. I think our people take some concerts in the fact that, you know, we minimize job losses. We kept people currently kept our pilots and chemical cards. That's been one of the reasons why Ryanair has been able to recover so strongly, since July.

Where many of our competitors EasyJet with and others are canceling. Flights are much slower into the recovery because they don't have enough current Pilots or cabin crew. However, it's very difficult. I can't give you any guidance for the full year, because if there's too much uncertainty over years, I think we would be strong. In terms of volume recovery, would be strong on the cost of Liberty, but the outturn for the full year, which we think is say that a modest loss of between a hundred to two hundred million is heavily dependent.

On pricing and years.

The remainder of this year and then we move into the summer 2022 FY 23. There's going to be a very strong traffic recovery. Somewhere around a hundred sixty-five million up at least 10% in are pretty cool but numbers and I personally believe that the pricing will be very strong or the recovery of the price will be very strong across summer 2022. And Ryanair is better positioned to capitalize on that recovery. Better than anything else, anybody else. That's all I want to add Neil.

That you want to add to that from an MD and a or a cost point of view. That was a fairly comprehensive rooms. Rude. It's just a couple of seconds. I'll re-emphasize just on the costs as the load Factor recovers. We've seen unit costs, start to track back down again. We were in the turkeys, in the first half of the year 38 euro per passenger and we would hope as we get back up towards 90 percent load factors and more gamechangers in the fleet that will see that recover to pre COVID-19 levels and then some

On the hedging as Michael said, very well. At least well insulated against any spikes that might happen on both. The jet cyber equally on the carbon. We're a hundred percent engine are eua the 24 Euro for shear and about 70% hedged on eua to 40 Euro for next year. Balance sheets. Very strong, triple be racist. We reduced our Nest - play almost 800 million in the first half of the Year down to 1.5 billion and that gave us the confidence.

Dance, as Michael said, the payoff to see cff last week. The 600 million financing that we had and then the London Stock Exchange. We're seeing less than R less than 10% of volumes on the ordinary share going through London at this point in time. So there's been a complete migration over to euronext Dublin and the NASDAQ. So I think the board will be in a position to make a decision on that in the not too distant future next number of months. Anyhow, and that that's about it, Michael.

Okay, we'll open up for questions. Answered, please. And can we limit everybody to know more than two questions, please? Thank you. The first question comes from the line of Duane pfennigwerth. That ever court is. I please go ahead. Your line is open. Hey, good morning. So you touched on it in your script, but but from a yield recovery perspective into the holidays. Can you talk about Advanced book loads versus Advanced book yields? The question being how much of your December corsia?

Sure has already been booked at sharply lower yields.

Kids, I wouldn't get into that kind of analysis. I mean, you know, I think they did guidance. I've given you is that this is December bookings, which, you know, drives a huge amount of Q. Three are very strong forward, bookings are strong pricing is robust. I think we're going to see. There's a huge, I think, pent-up demand for people to reunite to see friends and families over this Christmas post, the 18 months COVID-19, but now, we're entering November today and what's unusually? We're entering November.

Very close to where we entered.

Amber are October a month ago in terms of the load factors and that's unusual because October generally has the benefit of the school's midterm break. November doesn't have anything in it like that at the pricing in November's and it's been weaker, but we would expect that. Remember the, you know, the the budget pricing is also week in November the 1st half week of December. So again, I would give you no more Dwayne, then say we will we did 31 million passengers in the second quarter. I think we will exceed do probably Thirty 1 million.

In the same, maybe fractionally more through the third quarter, the December quarter, but it's too early, too much of the years is driven by the closing. Bookings for the next six weeks in November. The, for the next six weeks of November and the first two weeks of December to give you any real guidance on years. Okay, great. And then just for my follow-up on labor. Availability. Are you seeing any pockets of challenge there or is the restructuring of weaker carriers? Making that more?

And thanks for taking the questions. Pleasure. There's no, there's no strict, reside in the door. I think we sing no stress on the pilot side, a huge surplus of Pious. In fact, you know where we we now gone by and we've opened a new training center in Dublin, where training at the way about 650 odds, Pilots going through the cadet program, which is more than we will need for most next year. And I don't see any pilot shorts to the next couple of years in Europe. Certainly, without a bit of

You to train up to a thousand Pilots a year. I don't see also because we're training on 737s, as Norwegian has kind of imploded J2 has now. Moved over playset, has moved away from Boeing place. A big order with Airbus. I think we'll probably be the only significant employer or 737 pilots in Europe for the next five years. Cabin crew, there be pockets of tightness there. I think most that I see in the UK, you know, we have a large and mobile population across the

Being Union, where we hired lots of Eastern, Europeans, Italian, Spanish, Portuguese, boys, and girls who want to go fly for a couple of years. I think the UK will be more challenging and you know, no, great surprise. Post brexit. There's a much more restrictive Visa regime here. And while we prepare a hype a relative to kind of, you know, the retail and hospitality industry here in the UK. I mean our cabin crew, earning between 25 and 40 thousand Sterling per annum it does.

Take some time across the UK basis to train cabin, crew. I mean, we're seeing a lot of people join us from retail here in the UK, apply to him retail and from Hospitality. So I think there were, we don't see any issues in terms of availability, but there will be pinch point. I think in the UK and that's something, you know, where we'll manage our way through it. I think you see many other Employers in the UK bemoaning, many of whom were leading brexit proponents, such as well as running pubs and booty.

the UK now looking for

Visas extra Visa so they can hire people. They should have told us that before they were advocating for brexit, but they are where we are. I think the UK will be challenging, but I think we're well positioned to hire more or to hire and train. Sufficient camera crew for the summer of next year. And in a marketplace where most of our growth is still taking place across the European Union. The airport aircraft being based at European airports, Eddie. And you would have on the labor side there. Since you were told, there was some pressure as well. Ground handling.

And in places where you're making like Germany in particular where you're making a transition from government funds of schemes. And attracting people, like Berlin was a particular issue for all airlines are over the last number of weeks, but I think most of that will watch out as people migrate off those government-sponsored scheme. And I would Echo with Mike would say there in terms of the UK. It's more of a it's no more than a sort of a supply chain issue that it will work itself anxious and bought for work.

I have to hire more people locally here in the UK and that is going to be more challenging because I'm the pilot side. Given the structure of pilot recruitment. You should be your have to be ahead of where you want to be for next summer. Like, 18 months ago, which we wear and we've got zero, Trisha non-pilots at the moment and put the cabin crew. You're catching up for about 18 months worth of recruitment. But where we are ahead of it, but it was going to be any constriction at all. It would be in the UK.

We have the ability to move people around as well. So I have a concert. Yeah, I would contrast that with a number of our competitors in Europe who are carbon canceling, huge amounts of flights scheduled deferring base openings because they're massively short about camera crew and Pilots, some of our lower fare competitors, just followed a lot of people fact, a lot of people into COVID-19. And now, you know, if there is a takes a while to train those people get them back. I think we sum up by luck and Summer by pore size.

Continue to keep all of our pilots and cabin crew on the payroll and current. And why I think we are doing so well in the into the recovery.

Thank you. Thanks to a next question, please. Thank you. That comes from the line of Alex Irvin at Bernstein. Please go ahead. Your line is open. Hi, good morning to for me, please. First of all, on your 225 million passenger Target, you planning, any changes to network structure or productivity in order to achieve this? What gives you the confidence to hit it with just 620 aircraft? That's looks like higher passengers per aircraft than you've had previously. And then secondly, on ancillary spend per Passenger, please.

This is continue to be very strong as chocolate recovers. Is this 22? 23 Euro, starting to look like a new normal and can you please talk about the headwinds and Tailwind to ancillary spend over the next 12 to 18 months. Thanks. Okay. I'll take a network and Neal. I might ask you to come in on the ancillary spend, quite just other network. I mean that, yeah, we have far more growth opportunities Alex out there than we can cope with it. The moment. I mean, if I could take my 20 summer 2023 deliveries, which is another 55 aircraft. I could allocate all of those aircraft at the

Meant for summer 2020.

We have airports at queuing up, looking desperately competing with each other. Looking towards to, I give them significant allocations of aircraft. We have to be so much judicious in how we allocate those aircraft over the next year, or two much of it is driven by us, being opportunistic and taking, you know, whichever airports come up with the biggest discounts on which governments come up with the best incentives. But also, you know, we're trying to fill out gaps that I think will never occur again, like, you know, I

To Vienna, for example, we're going to base 11 additional aircraft in Vienna. Next summer. We're Austrian are have materially reduce their capacity. With who two years ago. We're talking about a 20 aircraft base. Are now in Retreat. They're down to five and I suspect, they get to zero fairly quickly level, which was talking about having a 10, or 14 aircraft based have gone bust and there are huge opportunities there. So, Manchester, we're adding three aircraft for next year, straight on the back of the Thomas Cook.

And where we're going to place more than 20 new aircraft into Italy. Next year taking up huge, swades of capacity that have been abandoned by the Alitalia restructuring and in airports where, you know, they are to be fair to the Italian very Adept at incentivizing us to return to Rapid traffic growth in that market. And the government has also reduced the Municipal Taxes as well. So I think, where we

We will it be much of a network change. No, I think if you take our 210, Max order load Factor recovery back up to 91. In fact, I think it'd be oh, it may well because the capacity constraints the next couple years. We had the load Factor may even go back above ninety one. Ninety, two percent. We might get to 94 95 percent. We will need to continue to have a maintain an Airbus Fleet within the louder Europe operation and I think there we will need a few more aircraft to

225 million passengers, but we're seeing remarkable opportunities out there at the moment. I think this is still a number of quite a lot of white tails out there. And this, the older generation aircraft, the NG's, and the seals at the end Jesus on the Boeing and the seals on the Airbus are becoming increasingly available as very attractive, lease rates. So, I think we'll be opportunistic bolted with the the airport to use. We do and with the aircraft yield we do but I

have a nothing but confidence will get 2 and 25 million in the next five years. If I think we go over that figure, but we need more aircraft to get over that bigger. Neil. Ancillary. Yeah, Alex. Thanks for the question. Yeah, I think kind of 2122 is the new Norm going forward. We did a lot of work last year during the downtime in relation to the Namek, pricing on ancillary products. Pick the likes of the the priority boarding in the seats that's ticking as the volumes grow. So we're seeing strong.

Penetration coming.

On those two products, equally the onboard span the starting to ramp up again. As we're getting more people, flying on the aircraft. And with the, the UK, now, outside of Europe were able to offer, Judy free on our uke. You flights. See, I think we'll continue to see these kind of levels FY. 22 will probably end up somewhere close to 22. Maybe just under 22 Euro passenger.

Great. Thank you very much. Thank you. Alex. Next question, please. Thank you. That comes from the line of milk Glen at Credit Service near

You obviously have less control. Do you need to change your Approach at all? In terms of working more closely with your your suppliers in the UK or do anything differently this time around. And then the second question, if we won structural difference, you have from the recovery from the global financial crisis, is the multi AOC or multi Airline strategy. I'd like to understand what what benefits do you think this provides Ryan are in this recovery situation?

Ation, and is there a next leg to the multi AOC strategy that we should be forceful about at this point?

Okay, I'll ask Eddie, maybe, take the labor market. Give you the check. Do we need to change your approach and I'll deal with them oclc strategy Eddie? Yeah, I mean we're talking about the UK in particular. I mean we have we made a change just prior to COVID-19 where we have locked away, our sort of cells handling and modeling stamp set. So we are actually in control of that are at our major base. So anywhere where we see, you know, any sort of potential.

A weakness. And in terms of dealing with hard party handlers. We, we are now more adapt as at looking at a South handling and we've done that. Also in Poland, and we've done it in Spain very successfully at all bases. So we're much more in control of that. And so I don't see any real change to that. I think you were just see like I have no difficulty on same pay rates or that we have on the ground handling side, and I think it's temporary in terms.

Of the washout that you will see are people migrating of government schemes. I think I just it's been well, then today's on the cabin crew side. There is a particular difficulty of the UK. We will get through it. I don't necessarily agree with you about the sort of migration P of people out of the industry. It's still relatively attractive to work in aviation. You know, if you're a cabin crew member, you're still restricted from work and maximum of 900 hours a year and that's essentially a part-time job.

You know, when you look at her, they would move.

In other parts of the hospitality industry. So I think we're I think we're on top of it. But we do have a, we have a challenge in the UK over the next number of months. But we are, we are Adept at this particular issue of a solving neighbor issues. Like, I don't, I don't see it. I don't see a difficulty and we have plenty of I suppose, Elbow Room with having 86 bases around Europe. If you even if you were to move across any sort of short-term,

Operational problems but I don't see anything. I agree and you know, I think nobody if you look at the strength of our recovery post July, you know where we are now operating night, many eurocontrol produced numbers there for the month of September where we are. The we are operating 91% of our pre COVID-19 capacity EasyJet doing about 60 percent of its pre-code capacity. Lufthansa Air france-klm less than 50 printed every COVID-19 capacity. We were out the door with our pilots in our cabin crew. All of whom are delighted to be back working again.

You know, and I think there's certainly a significant lift internally. I think in the morale of the, the team generally on the multi AOC strategy look, we originally move towards that when we unionized in 2017, 2018. The biggest amount we had from was from our people. They wanted local contracts and paying local tax that they were paying local social tax. Wanted local labor tax. We were operating on this. Terrible burden in Ireland of this Finance act 127, be there.

Cause we were Irish owned and managed. All of our people had to pay their taxes in Ireland, Ireland, Moscow has this reputation as being a great tax Haven, which is it may or may not be if you're a corporate. But if you're an individual, you're generally paying their marginal rate of tax, had some reason, you know, 35 37 thousand Euros per annum. So the only way out of that was to go with the multi AOC strategy. We moved all of our Eastern European people onto the buzz AOC, we

Malta air with the Maltese AOC meant. We moved our people in France, in Italy in Germany on to Maltese Contra The Maltese employment. So they could pay their taxes locally in Germany in Italy, in France had the benefit of local contracts, thankfully. But as usual, after the horse has bolted, the Irish government in this week's budget, two weeks ago, has finally abandoned section 1227 B, which means, you know, the few remaining people we have the remainders we have now.

Spain and Portugal our own with from 1st January, move on to paying local taxes in their country. Which regular reserving. It also means we will no longer have the penalty that we have in the past of paying high Irish marginal tax rates for our pilots and our cabin crew who will now benefit from, you know, generally speaking because of the situation with t AP and Iberian Spain at the pilots and camera crew, have some advantageous sort of tax expenses treatment. They're an hour.

Our people will now begin to share those more advantageous personal kind of tax regimes in those National country. So, that was very much, the driver oven. It's also the create an opportunity to I think, where we can develop more management Talent, you know, we now have five Airlines, we have, you know, for other CEOs. We have it's created new opportunities for people to get promoted into, you know, leading positions commercial drawing. We have five commercial directors, five CFOs.

the five operations directors, so it's

Very good way of us getting more people to come up through the management chain, and create opportunities for people to get promoted into senior positions. And I think would be a trauma training ground for I hate to say it, but for the next group, or for the next round of the, next round of management replacement, and we need more of those skills and talents coming through, we've seen a large measure of, you know, that be that we promoted a lot of women, which I'm

Equally proud of to senior management positions. Now again using those multi AOC. So we're bringing a lot of middle management Talent through that was challenged us for our positions. In the next I should say, four or five years of maybe, I might hope to be the challenge for opposition to the next five or ten years, but nevertheless, so there have been opportunities that have come up apart from, you know, but there must be a Leo seems really set up to to avoid or bypass the the Irish 127 be, but now we have, I think, four or five aoc's.

And we're very proud of the way those are lines and the management teams. I think they're all building an individual culture. They're like, the people in. Both are very proud to work for Buzz. People in Malta, are proud to be working for more chair and the same with louder Europe as well.

Thank you. Thanks. See you next question. Please. Sounds from the line of James Hollins attack, sex, and gambling.

I'm warning, you may need to actually yet. But and on the the listing, I mean, historically talked about a potential agreement between the EU and UK on reciprocity of of sheldor ownership. Is this something you no longer expecting? And perhaps more importantly do your UK shareholders and already care about you. D listing. The second one is on buying and leasing other. Aircrafts the think when your video there you talked about not selling anymore are equal, but you've got the 2983 twenties up early.

The sending 2223 winter. Do you think it's something where your by somebody's whitetails soon in order to, you know, a certain address that issue or perhaps looks obvious extend releases and then to expect Boeing to hold good on, delivering up to 65 by the summer given the historic issues. Thanks. Yeah. Thanks James. Couple of quick answers that look daddy listing? I think is an inevitability post. Brexit. The, as we said, the market of the trading volume Sue London are tiny. Now.

Now usually outweighed by was training to the urinate and Dublin in Brussels. And I think Europe is going to be particularly given the fraud state of relations. I think between Europe and the UK, the European commission. And I think bled largely by the French and the Germans for obvious reasons are going to be much more aggressive about ensuring that European airlines are majority. You owned a controlled from 2022 onwards. We've already had our force force force, a compulsory share, disposal delisted from the air.

See is another measure that we want to be seen to be taking so that we are clearly doing everything we can over a reasonably short period of time to move back to being majority, you owned as well as being EU controlled to our UK shareholders care. I don't think so. You know that we have a number of very significant UK. She Rose who've been holders for a long period of time. They get the business model. They understand the strategy, but we do want to kind of, you know, there where there has been a number of quite

the number of your small, UK investors, buying our shares since brexit, who shouldn't be buying our shares, you know, we don't you're not allowed to buy our shares unless you can fill in the fourth the crest form saying that you're an EU shareholder. And, you know, we just have to work our way through that on the the aircraft leasing me to get 225 million passes over the next five years. We clearly would have to slow down our aircraft sales program. That's the obvious way of getting there. We take the 210 aircraft from Boeing but there are opportunities out there at the moment, sir.

In both fight tears of Airbus.

Acos and Boeing NGS. And also the leasing companies are becoming much more aggressive. Like nobody really wants the older 12, 14 year-old seos, rngesus. The fleet race continued to fall. For those I think again will be opportunistic about adding maybe another 30 40 50 of those aircraft, but I don't think it would be in the short term. There's no wood. No requirement for additional aircraft for the next two, three, four years. We were disappointed.

I think, by Boeing decision to look for a price increase for a follow-on order on Max 10. Particularly at a time when Boeing's order book is going nowhere in a hurry and, you know, their last few remaining customers in Europe, Norwegian of cancel, all their orders, even jet to, which was a significant Boeing customer here in Europe. Has now an ordered Airbus and iag, which really had signed up a an mou for 200 Max order. They've now open that up to invited.

Airbus to come back in and re tender for that in with the new Spanish management running iag, I would be astonished if that's not a that that order doesn't move to are Bose sometime in the next 12 or 24 months. So, Boeing's order book is called know where we don't need any aircraft onto the 2026 and you know, but where we remain a one of Boeing's largest customers worldwide. I think we're just having one of those marriages Tantrums at the moment and

until they see the rightness of our view of the world. There won't be another Boeing order either our Boeing doing other deliveries. I would be hopeful. Rather more than optimistic that we have 65 aircraft delivered by next summer. The deliveries are not going well, in Boeing of committee, delivering us eight aircraft a month from the period from September through to April. So far, the best they've managed been six in October or six in September 6 and October the talking about five in November like really,

Silly stuff, you know, there's not that many errands queuing up to take a lot of aircraft deliveries from Boeing and the fact that they're not even able to deliver us to a week is not good, but then I don't think we're overly impressed by the management locally in Seattle. And I think they need to get their <expletive> together. You know, I would we are Neil is meeting with the new Boeing CFO in the US this week. I continue to have, you know,

Be in regular contact with Dave Calhoun, who I think it's good guy and but on the ground in Boeing, they really are they got to get their act together and it's not together at the moment. Having said that I think, Boeing's deliveries will run late. But we're Boeing are committed to delivering US 65 aircraft by the end of April. I don't think they'll hit that by the end of April, but I'd be reasonably confident that, you know, as long as we work with them to resolve these delays. I think we get 65 aircraft in, probably by the end of June.

And so, we will have all of them there for the key Peak summer months. Next.

July August and September. But you know, on the ground at the, at the moment, things are not particularly good with Boeing. We would have expected a lot more delivery from them. Give them. They've been sitting there on the aircraft sitting on the ground for 18 months. But no we're work with them. We remain a very committed Boeing customer, but Rowley commission, Boeing customer when the Price Is Right.

Which I thought Michael, Thanks, James. Next question, please. That's from the line of Jaime rowbotham at Deutsche Bank.

Morning guys, to from me, the exit fuel cost performance was clearly very good in the September quarter on a per seat basis. I make it about 8% below the same quarter in 2019 around 26 Euros. It's that sort of year on two-year reduction sustainable. Now, over the winter. Do you think and anything to say on exfil unit cost expectations for the year to March 23? Second one was just slide nine in two days.

Presentation, there's lots of ways you could show your market share and how you along with perhaps wizard a close to running pre-crisis levels of capacity. Unlike many of the competitors. Was there a particular reason for showing this in terms of the ATC fees where we know you're expecting some Hefty inflation. Thanks.

I asked you to come into the extruder cost before we. Let me just to you but slide 9, let me slide. 9 is nothing. Just to give you other than a, snapshot of what, you know, what the how the recovery is going and who's recovering quickly, because I think they're fundamentally going to underpin market, share gains for the next two or three years and these are independent there, you know, eurocontrol figure September 21. Over September 19. I think the, the, underlying strength of this is we are operating at nine. Ninety one percent of our pre COVID-19 capacity the other

I reserve the impressive on his Wizz there who were operating as kind of 93% of their pre COVID-19 capacity. However, they've added something of the order about 40 aircraft to over that 18 month period, they should be doing if they were doing as well as us. They would be operating at above their pre COVID-19 capacity at the moment and everybody else is blowing their brains out running at about 60% to pretty cold. But now, a lot of that is labor issues. Clearly with the bigger guys. Look times are France, be a, it is the fact that the Long Haul try,

And the client occasion markets have collapsed a huge amount of their short whole recover or short whole traffic depends on long-haul connectivity and that's going there is not going to recover either this winter or I think it certainly won't recover fully Into Summer of next year. But if you look at us Ryanair win, exactly the same freak over that post as Post COVID-19 in September 20, 21 are operating at 91% EasyJet, you know, who's freezes? Actually got smaller over, the 18 months are only operating at four.

At 60 57%, to pre COVID-19 and Wizz there whose fleet has gone up by something of the order of 20% should be operating at above their pre COVID-19 capacity, but aren't there? Still operating at 7% below their pre COVID-19 capacity. So I think all we're trying to give you a favor to. It's like night is not a view of the ATC fees, but to show you who's responding who's recovering much more rapidly than everybody else in his Ryanair. And new with that. I can I ask you to do is give you a mirror inside on the Exane.

You unit cost performance and its sustainability. Yeah. Sure. Jamie. I think we will continue to perform. Well on the the unit costs your rival come in just over 32 on the tree tree Euro and the second quarter. I think on a foliar basis were probably just going to be a sliver under 35, on the unit cost six fuel but the unknown is what's gonna happen with ATC and on Route charges from from January. Onward took my best. Guess would be somewhere close to 35 in an annualized basis.

Thanks, dear. Next question, please.

Thank you. That's from the line of Hunter, kid wolf research.

Thanks. Good morning that you reference found the game on the, the new aircraft from Boeing. What Baseline is that also? Is that off what you paid for the GameChanger or is that up off of a prior conversation? You had? And then second question, is Michael. What is your outlook on the the recovery of business travel in Europe next year and Beyond thank you. So you and I didn't understand the first half of the question. Why don't buzz digit price.

I think you said earlier prepared remarks at Boeing, was looking at like double digit price increases. Did you not say that? I'm sorry. Oh, yeah. Yeah, but on the max tense, yes. Yeah, look my double digit price increase. I wouldn't go into any further detail than that. But you know, I would regard any price, increase, anything above zero would be unacceptable to us and him and Frank, you know, given that your existing customer base, including jet to Norwegian, iag are all switching out of Airbus, out of Boeing and into Airbus and new your last customer outside of North America. You'd

Be if anything cutting from 0 to a minus number in which case, you know, will happily sign up for an order of Mac-10. But these are for deliveries in 26 to Pier 26 to 30. So there's no particular pressure on us at the moment. I don't think the Quantum of the double digit is important is the fact that I think Boeing you're just misreading, the marketplace, the leasing companies and the other airlines are not ordering a lot of Boeing aircraft at the moment. We are very happy to order Boeing aircraft. But only if the price is right and the second half of the question.

I missed because most yeah, just kind of grow your business very strongly. In our Network. We're seeing lots of businesses out there meeting customers doing deals back to selling, you know, whatever it is. They sell, you know, there's a World Travel Market meeting in London, the all this week and there's huge volumes people moving in and out. I do think business travel on long-haul will be a much slower and more painful.

Every I do. But you know, I think the idea that people on will you know that business? What is it bloody Skype or corsia? Sumar going to replace short old business getting on a flight and going to meet a supplier or a customer, you know, 1 Hour 1 hour, 50 minutes away, whether that's across Europe that's back and I think it's going to recover very strongly. If anything like this pent-up demand. Again, there's lots of supply chain issues. People need to go out. I'm certain I speak from

Somebody in Ireland, you know, there's lots of supply chain issues, getting stuff from the UK. And we're seeing lots of people switching to sourcing, alternate suppliers in Portugal, and Germany, and Italy, Builders and all that kind of stuff. So, if anything, I think that's going to be good, we'll see growth in short or business. Travel personally. I want it's not a market. I mean, I think long-haul business travel will be much more challenge for longer. I think you see a lot of these multinationals now, you know who used to hold big conferences. Are everybody get together once a month.

Once every two weeks that's all going to move to zoom. I do believe, you know, this idea that

That you know business travel will never recover our ever. Never ever. Never really works. Ultimately business travel will recover. We are social animals, we do best when we're doing business, whether that's sales are buying stuff meeting people having dinner with them, you know, bonding with people personally, I think, but I think they are Recovery in Long Haul. Would be much slower. It'll be idea. I don't see anything about a 50% recovery. Long Haul into the summer 2022 because fundamental think the Asians won't travel the

Ian's probably will to Europe but they'll be slow and reluctant and I think it's going to be summer 23 before you going to see the full recovery of long-haul travel Long Haul business travel. I think we're taking a bit longer than that and you take four or five years I think for long-haul business travel to recover because some of that is long as I think structurally going to move to zoom and chose zoom and Skype and all that kind of stuff. Short hole people are already back. I would say our business dog. Certainly an our numbers are business, Travelers back up and we see that already ate.

I think we're entering November, just 1% with a load factor, for load Factor 1 percent down where we entered know that October October is hugely driven by the school midterm break, which was phenomenally strong. And yet, we're now going into November today. One percentage Point behind in load Factor where we were, that's really business travel across Europe. There's not a lot of leisure travel. I mean, there might be a better Christmas Market stuff going on there, but fundamentally, I think a lot of that is business. Travel, Italian, domestic Spanish domestic back on.

Move again.

Thank you, baby.

Yeah. Hi Michael just in terms of page 13 and you just go through that again in terms of the Italian Mark. And I know there's a big opportunity there. You've added 20 aircraft to New and existing basis. And as ITA is or the yeah, you Alitalia smaller. Are you seeing any when you do these deals, are you seeing any competition from anyone else? Whether it's Wizz or anyone else for that kind of market growth opportunity. Thanks a lot.

I just I get back to Eddie first and I'll come back in at the end of it. Eddie. Yeah, it's a Stephen. It's not just a Alitalia that are withdrawing from that marks like EasyJet as well. Have started to exist, you know, take you from places like Naples and Venice, but certainly I have seen the appetite for because don't forget when we looked at where we're going to allocate capacity in the middle of the pandemic. A lot of it was driven by where we talk. People were still going to be able to move with some certainty in the

Guidance domestics and Spain and domestics, particularly initially, we're Italians continue to travel and our ability to sort of close out deals in places. Like Treviso was one chiren is another and you look at some of the basis that we have down there. Whereby we're able to have longer term deals there and the ability to get into places like bologna or Treviso, where we have. They're pretty much maxed out now, like there are no early morning departure slots in terms of physical infrastructure down there. So the

Be difficult for anyone as the base aircraft and those places. So you're only looking at the same in Bergamo as well. So you're looking at places that have come I suppose laser to the low cost model which is Venice, malpensa and places like that and Rome fiumicino to a lesser extent. Still a very relatively expensive expensive airport. So we have the capacity. We're really the only show in town and people know that if we commit to going there we are. We're going to stay there some of the airports.

Remark to us that those that are making an announcement.

You know, our don't have the aircraft to do is are putting in at least an aircraft that are smaller than what they have in their Fleet and leaving passengers at the airport and that we have weaved the presence and we've got the frequency and I think we've got the sort of street cred down there over the last 20 years. That when we say we're going to deliver, we're going to deliver and we're going to be there for the long term. Yeah, I agree that any atsm summarize. It very well. It means of the one point I'd make it with the Italian market. It's not just the collapse of Alitalia has capacity from 110 aircraft.

Device, it's at EasyJet have been closing bases and we're drawing aircraft from markets. Like Italy and Portugal, right? Yeah, I think they're focusing back on. If you like. They're kind of their fortresses in gastric and Charles de Gaulle and Orly and Switzerland. They re don't want to compete with us in these other markets like Italy and Portugal, but also a Wizz have been out there a little, you know, they're great for making announcements about new basis and you roots and almost as soon as they made the announced a new base and new routes day and now

Voiceover. They don't announce that just been quartered a deferred the openings. They cancel the flights. They take out huge capacity and it never it just kind of surface. It doesn't appear now, you know, I think a lot of that is that kind of operation chaos that they'd be dealing with for the last three or four months frequently denied yet, you know, never yet explained. And I think they will struggle as they have done in Germany and in Norway and they're struggling and easily is that they owe their labor models. Simply is not sustainable in a western European.

Good, they're certainly under I think intense pressure for the German unions in the Italian unions about this labor scam. They operate with Hungarian contracts and paved pink red, a baby from a Swiss pay Point while trying to base them in Germany. Italy. It's not sustainable. It's not going to survive but you know, they're reasonably small in the Italian market. They don't have much awareness. It is really the three big ones. Initially would be Alitalia, EasyJet and Ryanair, and all of those tours in Retreat and one.

Has growing very aggressively got to thank me the lower classes. Thanks, Stephen. Next question, please.

Thank you. It's from such a stupid come out of City, Italy. So you actually bought it about 422 million of revenues into to on and 58 thoroughfare. It's like 7 million passenger and I literally used to carry about 22 million given you're adding about seven new basis. Would it be more like a normal market, share gains, or do you actually see that low price point would steal?

I travel. Do you see an opportunity in terms of offering some transfer traffic connectivity here?

And you faded in and out there on the other side. I think there's going to be very dramatic market, share gains in the next two years for Ryanair. We do not see our expansion being driven by low price stimulation for the next year or two. There isn't much there's no cap. I mean, I ne'er overall capacity across Europe, is going to be in Decline. I think by a double digit, number for summer 22, maybe a high single digit low double-digit for summer 23 and therefore we roll these.

Craft out ingenue airports, where sloths and capacity have been.

Did To Us by, you know, they did the shrinking of Alitalia, sleaze, T, AP sleet, the bankruptcy of Thomas Cook fly bi-level germanwings. You name it. And the Legacy, guys. I have all significally caught by the short haul capacity because they don't have the Long Haul fee to. And from so I think I don't see we're using low fares to grow the overall Market. I think for the next two or three years, it's to we're taking market share, and it's my personal view that we do that.

The summer of 2022, are higher fares. I think, actually prices. And we saw that certainly in the October midterm. Break last week. Yo, Pedro booking late were paying very high one-way fares nor 200 Euros. One way. I think that's going to record again and Christmas by. I urge everybody book early for Christmas, because if you're booking at the end of November early December, you're going to be paying very high airfares, and I think that will encourage people again to book for earlier, for spring midterm, break for Easter, and for next summer.

And you know, the figure I gave you this morning as of last Friday, the average fares Into Summer of twenty, twenty two are about 5% of where they were headed pre COVID-19. Now. It's a reasonably small number of forward bookings. But the fact that they're, you know, we're not having to price discount at all into summer 2022. I think. Shows, I think the potential demand that's out there over that period. Does that answer the question or did I not a god idea? Thanks, Michael, okay.

Okay, on the load factor. I do you actually see any pockets of strength and weakness across the market, like, juicy UK, under performing versus strong. And then for August September, October, we've been north of 80%. Don't tell anybody. But you know, we

Announcing, our October traffic numbers tomorrow morning, and the load factors from 81 percent in September and August. We did 11.3 million passenger. So now, you know, we're not back at the Pre-K COVID-19 numbers yet, which was kind of 92 93 percent. But, you know, I don't think it makes sense to do that. We'd be. We're happy to wait for the overall Market recovery, but also last

Weekend of the school midterm break the system. Wide load Factor was in the 90s. So I don't see any. We pockets of weakness in load factor out there. I you know, we've and that's because we tend to use years to fix load factors, you know, where load Factor acted year passes, but I would be very surprised if we don't see load factors next summer. Go back up to pre COVID-19 levels, 91 92. And I think, with shortness of capacity are with capacity, reductions in Europe for the next two or three years. I would be surprised.

Little things. It doesn't creep up to 94. 95 percent it.

Both, were it was pretty COVID-19. Okay. Yeah. Thanks, Michael. And that's on the aircraft would 4% more seats. Burning 16 percent less fuel, good for the environment, and good for shareholders.

Thanks ethics question, please. That's from the line of Jarrod castle at UPS Jared height. Hi, Michael. I lost to that. You welcome to answer one given us nearly eleven just on your next date. I mean, it's coming down quite nicely. Now. How do how should we think about kind of the balance sheet going forward? You've got these Fleet deals, but you know, you're throwing off decent levels of cash. Would you require an even stronger? Balance sheet, you know, given kind of a

since from COVID-19 or should, you know, investors still think about, you know, the old way, in terms of cash returns, you'll give it back if you got excess cash and then just just again, you know, said, oh, you're welcome to answer, whichever one if you don't have time, but also just some color on the customer advisory panel and now you spoke about it on the prepared remarks, but you know, what are some of the areas that you will listen to the customer panel on and what are some of those areas that you know, if thanks but no things, you know, it's a enhancing the product which

Leads to increased costs, Etc. So, just some flavor and, you know, we're taking away from it.

Billion at the end of September, very strong. I think the balance sheet will repair itself, very quickly going forward. I don't think we need any more cash, more cash at man. I think we would do as a company want to continue to operate his zero, net desk. That's always been, I think a very comfortable position. It's where we generally been over a 20-year period. When we get above zero net. We return those funds to shareholders. I see us getting back to zero net debt in the next 12 or 18 months, reducing.

From 1.5 billion are down to zero. I point out of the fact again. We entered COVID-19 where the product is zero. Net debt, and we've come through COVID-19. Very strongly. Yes. We went, we went back to shareholders for but it's a reasonably small Equity, REITs, 400 million. I think that was more to send a signal to the markets that we are shareholders, put their hands in their pockets first before we went to the bond market or anybody else. And I would contrast that with the likes of Heathrow who expect to go to their, put their hands in their customers pocket force and never ask their shareholders.

To come up with any cash thereafter. So once we go back to zero, net debt, I think we're back into shareholder returns. I think going forward, though, that the recovery, if it is going to be strong and as profitable as we think it would be, I think the challenge in the next two years. What firstly? We want to restore pay, you know, we're conscious of the fact that deal management and staff of all taken pay cuts in the last two years and we owe it first to them to restore. Those pay cuts next year and in the next two and three.

Years and thereafter. Then. I think we would want to see returning money to shareholders.

I am going forward. I suspect. We're probably going to be more open to a mix of dividends and share BuyBacks. I think given our size and scale shareback become much more difficult because they need to be big and lumpy but I think you know unusually, I think we look at probably once we've restored the day it will restore the balance sheet is zero net debt and restored pay. I think then shareholders would be next in line with. It makes of dividends and share, BuyBacks Tracy, you have you anything else you want to add there on the balance sheet and the

Cash returns thereafter. Yeah, so probably just on the balance sheet may not be as optimistic as you to get to net debt within a year. So I think a little bit longer probably closer to 18 to 24 months before we get to that m-net at zero, but I think it is all about repairing the violent. She Force, you know, and getting to where we like to be, which is closer to zero and probably be mindful. We have two bonds to be repaid and FY, 23 and 20.

And then we speak capex pencil again. It all depends on how we Finance the capex over the next two years.

Goodbye, Tracy Eddie color on the customer panelists, but we did invite you to the Core.

Particularly on how we are. The number of emails that we send people some useful issues on the website. But also they really want to Communications on day of travel. And last week. We launched today, a travel app and gives you really good information on, you know, your gate terminal and we're going to continue to grow that me, just just sensible information that people that people will want in terms of making that experience. Go much, much better. And I mean, we also have

Have the issue of having over 300 airports. We don't have our own people on the ground. And even though it goes right for 99.95 percent of people, all of the time in terms of the lowest fare, get you there on time when it goes wrong and it goes wrong in a, in an airport where we don't have people on the ground are ability to actually recover the situation. While our operations people are very very good at recovering, the aircraft and that's their job and recovering. The crew are speed. I communicating with passengers is something that the day and travel app.

And those you know where it's gone wrong. We've been able to do that, Trudy Ops through video to the hundred eighty nine people sitting in be rich last Saturday. When the weather closed in on the aircraft was diverted the sunshine there and somebody's on within five minutes equally, we had some cancellations in Lisbon over the weekend, able to get to people, like directly to people, rather than doing it in the twittersphere, where everyone's got an opinion, get to the PQ account or your customer. So, the day of travel app, I think, is going to something that's going to grow and the functionality

We that we put on the add the website in terms of wallets and all that sort of good stuff, in terms of what we learned throughout the whole COVID-19 crisis, in terms of refunds where we had to get through 25 million plus, we leverage that sort of proprietary knowledge that we now have. And were able to put that out there for a cuss words, got to continue to grow. And actually, it'll be a softer way of doing it as well in terms of leveraging extra sales on the ancillary sides. You know what I had a bag, you know, I'm going to the airport and security Hughes or

As long as you want to actually buy.

You know, a fast pass, whatever you get through. So it's the start of it, but I think it's really functional and it's useful for customers. Okay. And conscience I've ever tried for time or if I pass 11, so I'm going to limit this to more individual two more questions, please. And then I'm afraid. We'd have to cut it off because we have an investor meetings of investor standing outside the door here. So can we do two more questions? And then if you haven't got a question, please route them directly back to Peter or we will

See you. I'm know that we have an extensive Road Show. Going on the next week. So next question, please. The next is from Mark Simpson. A good buddy, Mark. Yeah, I bought one and the other one which I think is more customers onto your flights in the next couple of years. You've got a good

Places to do that. Will you be overly aggressive in? Pushing that message?

Thanks, Brittany as you want to hit the capex and I was doing the green opportunity. No opportunity. Mark has been no change on the guide. And so we're still guiding 1.2 billion this year, including maintenance capex and peak capex of 2.3 billion next year and then we will start to see it coming down again. Okay, great. Thank you interest on the green opportunity. I mean, I, you know, I think it's a very strong message, will communicate to the market. Now, if people wanted to really travel in an environmentally friendly

Be way switching from Europe's Legacy carriers to Ryan, a reduces your emissions by 50% on the short old place across Europe and as we can add more and more of the gamechangers, you know, you'll be flying on aircraft. Now that will significantly reduce emissions 4% more seats, but burn 16 percent less fuel. We are determined to take our our emissions down from 60 8 grams per passenger, kilometer below 60 in the next five years.

And the GameChanger be very much the way we do that. Yeah. Mobile, you know, the fans are Air France and others, but we getting customers to come to you.

I think I mean, I'll see Mark if you look at our traffic recovery, in the last three or four months. We have no difficulty getting customers to come to us. They're, you know, cry, they're beating each other over the head, to get come to us. And I think that will continue and we it is a longer sale, but we have a, I think pivoted our Communications much more towards an environmentally message, you know, and in every communication we have now, we keep stressing our commitment to the environment and to more responsible flying in an environmentally friendly way.

Close that. Mark, I think our continued Improvement. Was it like to CDP sustained analytics, and others is getting us more positive pick up on the media. And with the customers, the message of you can coach her carbon footprint by 50%, but moving to us is getting out there. Absolutely, and I'm Erika Thomas. I think of Eco label comes in across Europe with the acid that will show our stocks compared to the other airlines of every year long times up to it.

I told you to add from an environmental point of view. Sorry, I should have brought you in on the call earlier.

Okay, okay.

Last question then, please and apologies for cutting it short, but we can only really handle one more. That's from Savi size at Raymond. James, Savi. Hey, hey, good morning everyone. Hey, good morning. Just to, for me. I was a bit surprised to see the sale of aircraft in the September quarter. And I was just, I was at before the accelerating kind of growth targets and just curious what you were thinking of in terms of kind of lease returns an aircraft sales over the next couple of years.

I was their second question. I'm sorry and the second question. Yeah. Second question as just, if you could provide, you know, quick update on, you know, how outstanding fight credits looks compared to historical norms. And and if you expect the air traffic liability and so you can be more normal historical patterns going forward. Thanks. Okay, Neal, you want to talk about the refunds. There are standing fight credits. Okay. Well, Savi, these are the oldest 10 aircraft in, in the feet.

We're starting to become expensive to maintain. We were somewhat opportunistic. And after there is high demand for dasha age of aircraft for cogs conversion. Its surface travel to decision on the breakdown in the negotiations with Boeing on the mic tan as well. So we're fairly happy to get these older aircraft out there. Going to a good home. We're to improve their environmental story that were to replacing 737-400 on these returns. We have returned all of the Boeing 737-800. This point in time.

Time that we 2983 twenties on these. First of those are jutes. Go back in the winter of next year, but it's Michael said, you know, we talked to the lab doors if it makes sense economically to extend, we look at that equally if there were other opportunities on the on the NG side sir to enter into cheap, leases will look at that.

Yeah, I think just answer, that means intend that you've seen in the September quarter. We're kind of pre-sold before. The max tens had broke or discussion broken down. And before we had stepped up the growth profile 2 and 25 million passengers. Tracy, want to give it a quick update on the situation. So we've received over 1.6 billion in refunds given back to

Customers as of today, there's a few customers still sitting there were folks that we're starting to see a very high Redemption rate on them. So I think as Fabia will start to see it, you know, return to normalize my ability. So pretty much all the refunds are cleared as of today. And the new customer service Wallace will allow people get a refund within five days, a cash refund, if they which so pretty much everything is cleared and I think Savi you're starting to see a build now and future fly on the balance sheet.

That's pretty obvious. I think, or at least a half year end and it's graph Tracy, Kennedy here. And those Services here just to add to that as well.

For hours. And I think again.

Have you know, gone above and beyond and relationship commitment. Then, in terms of cashing out that that we fund so we should be in a position where we have future-proofed, you know, the growth in the in the airline's. Make sure that we have no future big challenges. The way we would have experienced to the COVID-19 crisis. Yeah. I think the commitment we rolled out last week is that, you know, going forward, refunds will be issued within 5 working days. Once the refund has been cleared, the payment will take place within 5, working days, back to the original method of payment will be, you know, faster than

any other airline has committed to but clearly we can't envisage a circumstance where all our offices are closed as they were in COVID-19 Labs you which caused the big backlog of refunds. But on an ongoing steady state basis, those pastors that there's not many pastors are on an ongoing basis who are entitled to refunds, because we have so few cancellations, but once the refund is approved, They will receive it in five working days, back to their credit card and into their bank accounts. Okay, at least seven. Thank you very much for participating in the call. I'm sorry we can't take anymore.

We have extensive Road shows going across the u.s. The UK and content Europe for the remainder of this week. If you'd like a meeting with any of us, please talk to Davies or city. They'll be happy to arrange a meeting. If we haven't answered those questions. I'm sure we get to it at the individual meets with you over the next four or five days. Thank you, sincerely, for all your support over the last very difficult, traumatic 18-month, but I hope you'll agree with. Certainly me that, you know, we take it very sensible decisions during

During COVID-19, we've reduce costs. We have expanded our aircraft orders opportunistically and I have never seen a growth opportunity that like the one that is unveiled a before us to the next four or five years. I cannot remember in the last 25 years where we could take up so much growth, and I think so much, that was that growth will be profitable and at very low costs and I think will deliver lower fares to our customer base for the next five years. So thank you for your time and for your support. We look forward to meet you at a

Over the next five days. Thank you, bye-bye. Thanks, bye-bye snapping. Please. The conference. Thank you all very much for attending. You may now disconnect your lines.