Q3 2023 Enact Holdings Inc Earnings Call
Okay.
Good day and thank you for standing by welcome to the Q3 2023, and that's earnings conference call. At this time, all participants are in a listen only mode.
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I would now that you had the conference over to your Speaker today, Daniel Cole Vice President Investor Relations. Please go ahead.
Yeah.
Thank you and good morning, welcome to our third quarter earnings call. Joining me today are Rohit Gupta, President and Chief Executive Officer, and Dean Mitchell, Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer.
Rohit will provide an overview of our business performance and progress against our strategy.
Dean will then discuss the details of our quarterly results before turning the call back to Rohit for closing remarks.
We will then take your questions.
The earnings materials, we issued after market closed yesterday contained our financials for the quarter, along with a comprehensive set of financial and operational metrics.
These are available on the Investor Relations section of the company's website at www.
VW IR Doc enact MRI dot com.
Today's call is being recorded and will include the use of forward looking statements. These statements are based on current assumptions estimates expectations and projections as of today's date.
Additionally, they are subject to risks and uncertainties, which may cause actual results to be materially different and we undertake no obligation to update or revise such statements as a result of new information.
For a discussion of these risks and uncertainties. Please review the cautionary language regarding forward looking statements in today's press release as well as in our filings with the SEC, which will be available on our website.
Please keep in mind the earnings materials and management's prepared remarks today include certain non-GAAP measures reconciliations of these measures to the most relevant GAAP metrics can be found in the press release or earnings presentation at our upcoming SEC filings on our website with that I'll turn the.
Call over to Rohit.
Thanks, Daniel Good morning, everyone.
Our team delivered very strong results in the third quarter as we continued to execute against our strategy.
We reported adjusted operating income of $164 million or $1 <unk> per diluted share and generated a 15% adjusted operating return on equity.
Insurance enforce reached a record $262 billion.
Up 8% year over year, driven by new insurance written up $14 billion.
Enforced this tendency that remain elevated at 84%.
These are disciplined growth in our insured portfolio with stable new business production and higher persistently amid higher interest rates.
Investment income continued to accelerate and we continued to exercise expense discipline.
Credit performance remains strong accompanied by a seasonal uptick in new delinquencies and the seasoning of newer large box.
We remain confident in our strategy and our business.
And in the continued strength of the private mortgage insurance model.
The economy continues to be resilient supported by the strong labor market and household balance sheets that remain healthy.
Having said that macro factors, including geopolitical conflicts.
Inflation and higher interest rate and a lessening of the cash buffers consumers have had since the pandemic continued to be written.
However, delinquency rates are prime mortgage borrowers are consistent with pre pandemic levels.
Our manufacturing quality continues to be strong and credit risk remains well within our appetite.
Even as housing activity has slowed amid higher borrowing costs, we remain confident in the long term outlook for housing as well as demand for mortgage insurance.
Home prices continue to be supported by low housing inventory and strong demand.
Particularly among first time homebuyers and mortgage insurance will remain an important tool to help buyers qualify for a mortgage.
In addition, while higher interest rates have affected mortgage origination higher persistency has continued to support insurance enforced growth.
As of September 30th only 1% of the mortgages in our portfolio at rates at least 50 basis points above the prevailing market rate.
Pricing on new insurance written remain constructive in the quarter.
In response to continued macroeconomic uncertainty we increased our price on NSW, ensuring we continue to underwrite risks at the appropriate level, while remaining competitive.
The credit quality of our insured portfolio remains strong the weighted average FICO score was 744, the weighted average loan to value ratio was 93% and our layered risk remained level with the second quarter at one 3% of risk in force.
Our delinquency rate was 2% up 11 basis points sequentially flat year over year and consistent with pre pandemic levels.
The loss ratio in the quarter was 7%.
Continued strength in the labor market healthy household balance sheets, and our loss mitigation efforts helped drive strong cure activity and as a result, we released $55 million of results.
New delinquencies rose in the quarter, primarily driven by seasonality and the seasoning of newer large books.
Want me to take a prudent approach to loss reserves and believe we are well reserved for a range of scenarios.
We continue to operate from a position of financial strength and remain well capitalized relative to regulatory requirement.
P Myers sufficiently at the end of the quarter remained strong at 162%.
Or $2 billion of sufficiency, and 91% of our risk in force was covered by credit risk transfers.
We remain disciplined with respect to capital allocation and focus on our three pillars supporting our policy holders.
Vesting to enhance and diversify our platform and returning capital to our shareholders.
As previously announced during the second quarter, we launched an app right.
Reinsurer that expands our franchise, who access to new business opportunities, including the GSE credit risk transfer market.
I'm pleased to note that an accurate participated in all six of the GSC deals that came to market since its launch.
Between its quota share agreement with <unk> and its successful participation in the GSE transaction and accurate continues to utilize the capital initially contributed by <unk> and we are pleased with our strong underwriting and attractive risk adjusted returns we have seen from this transaction.
We continue to see <unk> as a long term capital and expense efficient growth opportunity.
We also continue to pursue ways to expand <unk> platform into new related opportunity.
During the quarter, we entered into an agreement with core specialty too rich and that will provide underwriting advisory and expertise market intelligence and portfolio analysis in support of core specialty entrants into the mortgage reinsurance market through GSE credit risk transfer.
Core specialty closed its first transaction during the quarter leveraging <unk> mortgage expertise and we look forward to continuing to support core specialty and expanding on this market opportunity.
We also continue to return capital to our shareholders.
I am pleased to note that yesterday, we announced the board's approval of a special cash dividend of approximately $113 million or.
Or <unk> 71 per share.
As well as the authorization of our <unk> per share quarterly dividend.
And we continue to repurchase shares during the quarter.
We remain committed to returning $300 million of capital to shareholders in 2023 through a combination of quarterly and special dividend and our share repurchase program.
On the whole our distributions to shareholders reflect our commitment to our capital allocation goals.
The strength of our balance sheet, the sustainability of our cash flows and the confidence we have in our business.
We are very pleased with the performance we have delivered in 2023 to date and remain confident in our business as the year comes to a close.
Our portfolio is strong with significant risk protection through our CRT program as of our balance sheet and ability to deliver return.
I will now turn the call over to Dee.
Thanks, Ralph Good morning, everyone. We again delivered very strong results in the third quarter of 2023 gap.
GAAP net income was $164 million or $1 two per diluted share as compared to $1 17 per diluted share in the same period last year and $1 four per diluted share in the second quarter of 2023.
Return on equity was 15%.
Adjusted operating income was also a $164 million or $1 <unk> per diluted share as compared to $1 17 per diluted share in the same period last year and $1 10 per diluted share in the second quarter of 2023 adjusted operating return on equity was 15%.
Turning to revenue drivers primary insurance in force increased in the third quarter to a new record of 262 billion up $4 billion, or 2% sequentially and up $20 billion or 8% year over year.
New insurance written in 2000, 14 billion was down 1 billion or 5% sequentially and down 1 billion or 4% year over year, primarily driven by lower mortgage originations, resulting from continued elevated interest rates.
Persistency remained elevated at 84% in the third quarter flat sequentially and up two percentage points year over year.
Given that approximately 1% of the mortgages in our portfolio had rate at least 50 basis points above the prevailing market rate. We anticipate continued strength in persistency, which will help hedge against lower production from higher mortgage rates.
Net premiums earned were $243 million up $5 million, or 2% sequentially and up $8 million or 4% year over year.
The increase in net premiums earned sequentially was driven primarily by insurance in force growth and slightly lower ceded premiums.
Our base premium rate was 42 basis points down one basis points sequentially and eight basis points year to date.
As a reminder, based premium rate is impacted by a variety of factors intends to modestly fluctuate from quarter to quarter.
Year to date the decline in our base premium rate continues to stabilize and is in line with our expectations.
Our net earned premium rate was 37 three basis points flat sequentially, reflecting changes to the base rate. In addition to modestly lower ceded premiums in the current quarter.
Investment income in the third quarter was $55 million up $4 million or 8% sequentially and up $15 million or 39% year over year.
The rising interest rates in the current rate environment are favorable for our investment portfolio as our new money yield was over 5% and our portfolio book yield increased to three 5% for the quarter.
As of quarter end unrealized losses in our investment portfolio increased by 58 million to $497 million.
As I've mentioned, we generally do not expect to realize these losses, given our ability to hold the securities to maturity.
Turning to credit losses in the quarter were $18 million as compared to a benefit of $4 million last quarter and a benefit of $40 million in the third quarter of 2022.
Our loss ratio for the quarter was 7% compared to negative 2% last quarter and negative 17% in the third quarter of 2022.
Our losses and loss ratio was driven by an uptick in the current quarter delinquencies, partially offset by favorable share performance, primarily on 2022 and earlier delinquencies. They remained above our expectations and resulted in a $55 million reserve release in the quarter.
New delinquencies increased sequentially to 11100 from 9200.
Our new delinquency rate for the quarter was one 2% reflective of ongoing positive credit trends and primarily driven by historical seasonality and the normal loss development of new large books we.
We continue to book, New delinquencies at an approximate 10% claim rate, reflecting our prudent and measured approach to reserving in this dynamic environment.
Total delinquencies in the third quarter increased by approximately 1100 to about 19200 <unk>.
Associated delinquency rate increased 11 basis points to 2%.
We continued to delivered solid expense performance that reflects the ongoing benefits of our cost reduction actions.
Operating expenses in the quarter were $55 million, approximately flat sequentially and down $3 million or 5% year over year.
The expense ratio for the quarter was 23% flat compared to the second quarter of 2023 and down two percentage points year over year.
We continue to expect cost for the full year to declined 6%.
Two $225 million.
Moving to capital and liquidity, we continue to operate from a position of financial strength and flexibility. Our pmiers sufficiency remains strong at 162% or $2 billion above <unk> requirement, which is flat to our second quarter 2023 results.
At quarter end, we had $1 5 billion of P. Myers capital credit and $2 9 billion of ceded risk provided by our third party CRT program.
Which currently covers 91% of our risk in force.
Turning now to capital allocation, we remain committed to our capital prioritization framework, which balances maintaining a strong balance sheet investing in our business and returning capital to shareholders.
As Rohit mentioned, we are pleased with the solid initial progress we've seen from an accuray since its launch last quarter.
Million dollars or 16 cents per share the special dividend of $113 million or 71 cents per share both payable on December 5th 2023.
Overall, we had another strong quarter and are well positioned as we enter the final quarter of 2023.
Going forward, we will remain focused on prudently managing our risk driving cost efficiencies and maintaining a strong balance sheet, while executing against our capital prioritization framework.
With that I'll turn it back to her of it.
Thanks <unk>.
Looking forward, we will continue to pursue proven growth opportunities and disciplined capital allocation that balances financial strength and policyholders support investment in the business and capital return.
Overall and act as well positioned to continue to serve our customers under borrowers drove our franchise and deliver a strong performance and value creation for our shareholders.
I'll close by saying, thank you to our talented team for all you do and for driving those forward.
Operator, we are now ready for Q&A.
Cash or questions.
Taiwan, one and your telephone.
To be announced.
You can reach all your questions.
Taiwan again.
<unk> well welcome Patty <unk> excuse me roster.
Yeah. Our first question comes from the line up I was charged with can you. Please help me your line is now okay.
Hey, everyone. Good morning Unkept.
Capital return going forward is the plan to target a certain level of capital return like the 300 million you talked about this year and then the split between buybacks and dividends.
Ends up being more opportunistic or just you know what kind of the philosophy going forward.
Yeah. Good morning. Thanks for the question I think you hit it kind of on the head in terms of.
The mix.
Capital return I think it's really going to be dictated by the opportunity provided in our share repurchase plan.
The level of share buybacks will ultimately kind of dictate ultimately what.
What gets returned via special dividend at the end of the year I think when we think about our quarterly dividend, we think about it across a bunch of different dimensions, certainly competitive, but also and probably most importantly, what is what is durable not just in our base case forecasting but.
Through some level of stress, we want to make sure that.
The quarterly dividend had that level of durability, and we have that confidence to do to return that through cycles.
Okay, great. Thanks that makes sense and then just switching to the investment portfolio, what's the time frame in which your portfolio kind of rolls into the new money yield assuming rates.
<unk> remained stable going forward.
Yeah, well we have a.
And effective duration of less than four years I think it's about three and a half years. So you know as you see today Uhm, we're investing our new money yields are roughly 5.5% I think we exited the quarter.
Just under 6% and you are seeing that have an effect on the overall way.
Average book yield on the portfolio is picked up about 10 basis points.
Sequentially so.
But more specific to your question the duration of the portfolios about three and a half years.
Okay, great. Thanks.
One moment so your next question.
And your next question comes from the line I see here that yeah with Bank of America. Your line is now.
Good morning. Thank you for taking my question what does it start maybe just on vintage performance and.
And I was curious on what you're seeing particularly the pandemic vintages are they performing.
In line with your expectations I suspect, it's better than what you underwritten too, but I was just curious more in terms of your expectations on how they would perform maybe even compare them. Most of the 28th 2019 vintages, where you know where they are in the lifecycle or the other vintage clothes or the loss goes on top of the 20th.
19, the reason I ask is because obviously on the unsecured lending side, we've heard a lot about you know cycle inflation and some and some underperforming from these.
Pandemic Robin digits I was curious if you're seeing anything similar yobbo car on the housing credit site.
Yeah, I think no here. Thanks for the question you know.
I think row hidden in his prepared remarks colored credit performance has a very strong overall I think that would characterize our our view of the credit environment credit performance. The day, obviously, that's exemplified and some of the portfolio metrics that we publish delinquency rate of 2% new desk right.
Of 1.2%.
Reflective of pre pandemic levels, which is indicative of against strong performance kind of more to your question. When we look more granularly F performance by attribute Uhm, we don't see any deterioration in performance across the credit spectrum that.
Really ranging from.
The embedded risk characteristics bike O L. T V D T I.
But also on a on a vintage basis.
There's really no deterioration that that we're seeing relative to our expectations.
And May I, just <unk> I would agree that credit performance across the board continues to be very strong as Dean said don't see any deterioration in any credit cohort I would keep in mind that when we are talking about 18 19 versus 22 vintages, they're just teasing and different.
Environments macroeconomic environment and housing environment. So that is going to have an embedded difference.
And your question was how is it performing against our expectation that I would say that's generally in line with our expectations because our expectations incorporated the most recent economic view, but if you're basically the normalized for that that would be the primary factor driving the difference.
Got it.
Maybe.
Back to the capital returning question <unk>.
Is there a rule of thumb like in terms of what what what will drive that going forward.
Percent of net income or.
Or anything like that that we should be thinking about as you you know.
Think about 2024, alright, <unk>, making about four capital returns.
Yeah, I'm here I think it's less target based and maybe more principles based you know we look at things like the current macroeconomic environment, the prospective macroeconomic environment, our view on a business.
Business trajectory business results on both and and expected case of stress case, uhm with obviously look at the regulatory environment as well.
What standards were held to how those standards might change through time. So I think it's more you know kind of a triangulation of.
Those considerations than a prescriptive formula.
And then just switching to the core specialty agreement you called out I think they also mentioned you guys on the website is managing helping manage their reinsurance.
<unk> is this like a new entry for them like they didn't do this before and like.
B U.
<unk> was this a competitive <unk>.
They were using someone else and now they're using you I'm just trying to understand the.
The plan, which I guess.
Right right right.
Is the idea that you're going to try to sign up more of these types of agreements, where you're managing it Sir reinsure looking to come in already.
Reinsurance.
Are you looking to also put more of your own capital to work here.
Yeah. Thank you for the question I would say this is more of an outcome of using our expertise that'd be already have and the mortgage insurance business and we're beginning to deploy and.
Mortgage reinsurance pace the G. S. A C. R. T. So core speciality was not participating in the mortgage reinsurance space N V essentially started talking to them about their participation.
They liked our expertise or depth, our market intelligence not only in the mortgage reinsurance space, but also what we do everyday which is look at the front end of the market.
Mortgage originators different attribute and obviously intelligence that'd be using a risk based pricing also in terms of depth.
At a very general level and loan attribute level. So all of that led to core speciality using us to essentially start participating in the GSE reinsurance market I would say that this is much more of a validation point for us forces to kind of substantial contribution to our P&L.
I would still take off <unk> primary kind of goal to be participating in non.
Private mortgage insurance kind of space and G. S. C V insurance based primarily and then adding that advisory service that'd be provided the core speciality being an add on and if you are able to expand that to other companies who might be using somebody else who.
Who are not in the space.
That would be a plus in a validation of our expertise in the area.
Mmm got it. Thank you. Thank you for taking my questions I'll get back in queue.
Thank you ma'am.
One moment for the next question.
So your next question comes from the line is <unk> J P. Morgan.
Okay.
Good morning, guys. Thanks for taking my questions back, but for an unique environment D. E purchase purchase is a historically high percentage of mortgage originations given the constraints in homes for sale.
New home purchases are disproportionately high as a percentage of purchase volumes that means that a great deal of originations are being driven by homebuilders can you talk a little bit about how that impacts the business. How you look at things like.
<unk> provided by the builders, whether there temporary or permanent and ships in terms of how you work with builders to drive business.
Yeah. Thank you.
So I'll take this question I think from our perspective first we agree with your points in terms of origination market being impacted by higher rates as well as brought her inflation in in this market obviously, given the number of consumers who are locked in at very low interest rates. We also have a <unk>.
<unk> inventory, which means there is more focus on new homes and those new homes are basically driving more of the origination market. So first thing from a market participation prospective that is a good thing for our business.
As you know private mortgage insurance is much more tied to the purchase market and that is essentially means that gives us a bigger origination market to participate in and also provides new inventory now it's coming down to a better performance our build a portfolio performance more kind of from both perspectives re.
<unk> performance and historic performance has been very similar to our overall portfolio specifically on the topic of laid Buydowns B look at those programs each program at a diamond approve it for our own guidelines and essentially we see the same performance consumers are appropriately qualified there are no payment.
<unk> and I know that there has been a topic of permanent trade by dance discussed we don't see a prevalence of formula and trade <unk> V. C. More short term rate Buydowns, one year, two year, which are more economical.
For a mortgage originator to fund compared to a permanent trade by down and the way that consumers qualified that gives us kind of a good performing and well qualified loan on our books.
Okay, so and so what you're suggesting is that to the extent your scenery I downs from.
Uhm loans available through either the originators or through the homebuilders.
<unk>, you're seeing more short term buy downs as opposed to permanent by doubts.
Yes.
We are seeing short term buy downs and even for those short term buydowns. The consumer is actually qualified at the full no trade not at the Bot downgrade.
So if a consumer had a 1% buy-down upfront the consumer is still basically being qualified at the prevailing market rate.
Got it Okay second question and then this is.
Follow on to that.
<unk> <unk>.
The industry is.
Or the mortgage industry is.
Increasingly concentrated around developments from those builders is there any concern like if you think about purchase volume ordinarily, it's gotta be very disparate across the country fine we're gonna see regional concentrations due to migration, but is there any thing within.
Your model that says okay wait a second it were.
Increasingly focused on these.
45, or hundred developments that we're creating more correlation risk within the portfolios.
Yeah. So I would say in terms of concentration down to that level, we try color concentration at the state level at M. S. N level as you said in the past. We also have an ability to slice of of loans on an ongoing basis down to them as they level and we do in that view is driven by.
The economic conditions and that city and that MSA, both on a current basis in our view moving forward and it includes of you into home prices and housing conditions I would say in terms of tightness of inventory or too many homes coming to market, we subscribe to several different market views to make sure that we have a.
Pretty well rounded viewer down to the MSA level and that's how we control our appetite I don't believe that we see you have a concentration in specific developments kind of controlling a risk appetite because by the time our share of that development shows up on our books, you're talking about like if I might penetrate.
<unk> on purchase loans is somewhere between 20 to 25 per cent and we have 16% to 18% of that portion. We are talking about small numbers of loans that actually make it your portfolio from any specific development and and the builder segment I would say our participation is very proportionate to our overall chair. So it's not that we are.
Taking on a specific subdivision <unk>, ensuring a lot of loans down to that level.
Got it okay. Thank you very much.
Absolutely.
[noise] one moment for the next question.
And your next question comes from the line of <unk> B T G.
Now okay.
Good morning, and a couple of follow ups here I mean, how much did the recent.
Recent increase in interest rates you feel like play a part in the level of a special dividend you just declared and then can you share what kinds of returns you think you're getting the G. S. C. C. R. T deals and maybe just how much capital you feel I could could be directed there next year.
Thanks.
Yes.
Let me start off Eric so.
As it relates to the interest rate environment and the special dividend I I don't really think those are highly correlated I don't I'm failing to see the correlation I think really.
More than anything I'll go back I think it was both this question.
On a mix.
Of of returns of capital in the special dividend was really size based on the opportunity. We saw on the share repurchases there was much more directly attributable.
You know interest rates, obviously I guess, if you you know maybe time that question to an earlier question. When we think about how we're thinking about returning with capital in the future interest rates are certainly part of our economic view or perspective economic view that effect.
You know both the macro as well as argue with our expectations around business performance. So maybe that's the connection that you're trying to draw and I think in that case as we look forward that will certainly be a consideration.
Okay.
Yeah, I'm just curious what kind of insurance are you guys are expecting to see arterioles. Thank you guys.
Sure.
The G S. A C. R. T deals we have not given any specific guidance Eric on type of write downs, what we have set as we'd like the quality of underwriting and we'd like the returns on those transactions and the way, we actually structured and actually right out of the gate was and actually is structured in every capital efficient expense efficient way and it'll.
<unk> the ratings the scale of <unk> and diet insurance operations. So we expect <unk> to be very much in line with the market returns on those transactions.
Uhm via continuously participating and as I said in my prepared remarks in every deal at least up to this point that has been coming to market. So that hopefully shows you that we find the returns attractive.
Yep that's helpful.
Lots of attention on the market around lenders, having to you know.
Buyback loans from the G. S. He is when there's a breach in the underwriting process of any sort.
Scratch and done kind of loans.
Can you describe how that maybe impacts you guys and and and just how do you see that maybe developing going forward.
Yeah, Eric it's for US that process has limited applicability to us we have our own independent processes, both for Nondelegated underwriting and four delegated underwriting where we do essentially quality assurance checks at different frequencies for different lenders segments.
And we have our own view of loan quality for each lender in each customer segment I would say that'd be keep an eye on so if a lender performance is deteriorating from a manufacturing quality perspective, we work with that Linda to go through training to remediate whatever the reason was and if the quality is spelled doesn't approve you move them.
From delegated to Nondelegated as far as GSE buybacks are concerned I think those are more driven by rules. The G. S. C is used to determine that loans have significant defects and then there was an entire process around early notification and then putting the loan back which has a very I would say a disproportionate impact on lender economics.
Because not only are you getting a loan back on your books more than likely that loan has a three per cent not right in an environment where market rate is 7% to 8%. So you also take them off the market hit on that asset so from a quality perspective, as I said I'm not prepared remarks, we liked the manufacturing quality in the market, we actually calibrate our.
Processes, <unk> and give them feedback. So we are satisfied with manufacturing quality N. B C. This much more as a secondary market issue between <unk> and <unk>.
That's really helpful. Thank you guys.
That's it okay.
One moment for the next question.
And your next question comes from the line of <unk> Your lines now okay.
Thanks, Good morning.
I'm curious what your thoughts are is for me to adopt this 15 per cent tax rate you know, obviously, they might be pluses and minuses around that but how do you think that'll affect the returns and competition and the Jesse Sierra T. Margaret.
Morning, Jeff very good question. So as we said last quarter to clarify our expectations that an accurate inaccurate does not benefit from any kind of tax efficiency based in Bermuda because taxes are consolidated in the U S. As far as Bermuda participants are concerned.
With a higher taxes in Bermuda, if it's implemented those participants might need higher returns from the transactions everything else being held constant that could actually lead the prices to be higher and for us that would mean higher returns. So I would expect that to be good for us we are very happy with the quality and.
The return so if there is less capacity from others and that means more capacity or higher prices for us I think we see that as a net positive.
Okay and I know.
This following up with prior question can you <unk>.
Qualify those returns right now are they at least on par with the the primary <unk>.
[laughter] <unk>.
Very good question and Unfortunately, we also haven't given guidance on the use of primary returns recently, we generally describe all returns as attractive in the primary business and I think the toughest thing in this environment as we see a lot of uncertainty in the market in terms of what scenario plays out I know the market has been talking about some kind of weakness.
An economy or at least the majority of the economist for almost 18 months and that hasn't happened. So instead of picking a point estimate I'm, giving you returns. We believe that our returns are very much in line with our expectations and we believe the price increases we have done including the price increases in the third quarter and the primary business make the primary.
Business attractive and we do think that for the CRT business via writing those returns are also attractive to us and especially via talking about different structure, there and the CRT market via writing mezzanine risk. So that obviously increases the attractiveness of those returns because in base case scenarios <unk>.
She has her not attaching from a loss perspective.
Okay alright. Thanks.
Yes.
Mmm, Yeah sounds further questions at this time I will not trying to call back <unk>.
Thank you <unk>.
And thank you everyone. We appreciate your interest in an act and I look forward to seeing some of you next week at the J P. Morgan Conference in Florida.
Thank you.
<unk>. Thank you for your participation you may now disconnect.
Mmm Mmm.
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