Q3 2023 Gevo Inc Earnings Call

And there'll be a question and answer session.

We would like to ask a question. Please press star one on your telephone you will then hear an automated message advising that your hand has been raised.

If you would like to remove yourself from the queue. Please press star one again, please be advised that today's conference call is being recorded I would now like to turn the conference over to your speaker for today, Dr. Eric <unk>, Vice President of Finance and strategy you May go ahead.

Good afternoon, everyone. This is Eric <unk>, Vice President of Finance and strategy I'm responsible for Investor relations here at <unk> as well thanks for joining us to discuss <unk> third quarter results for the period ended September 32023, I would like to start by introducing today's participants from the company.

With us today are Dr. Patrick Gruber, <unk>, Chief Executive Officer, and Lynn Smull, <unk> Chief Financial Officer.

Earlier today, we issued a press release that outlines the topics we plan to discuss the <unk>.

Copy of this press release is available on our website at Www Dot <unk> Dot com. Please be advised that our remarks today, including answers to your questions contain forward looking statements within the meaning of the private Securities Litigation Reform Act. These forward looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to be materially different from those currently anticipated.

Those statements include projections about the timing development engineering financing and construction of our sustainable aviation fuel projects. Our recently executed agreements Ah renewable natural gas project and other activity as described in our filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission, which are incorporated by reference we disclaim any obligation to update these.

We're looking statements. In addition, we may provide certain non-GAAP financial information on this call the relevant definitions and GAAP reconciliations may be found in our earnings release, which can be found on our website at www Dot <unk> dot com in the Investor Relations section.

Following the prepared remarks, we'll open the call for questions I would like to remind everyone that this conference call is open to the media and we are providing a simultaneous webcast to the public a replay will be available via the company's investor Relations page I'd now like to turn the call over to the CEO of <unk>, Dr. Patrick Gruber.

Thanks, Eric and good afternoon, everyone and thanks for joining us on our call.

We are filing our 10-Q today and we ask that you refer to it for more detailed information after this call.

On our last earnings call <unk>.

I explained what we have been investing in what it means how.

How we think about further investments or use of capital.

And progress against milestones.

We remain focused on that execution plan.

Hey, I would like to focus on recent events in the third quarter and provide an update on how things are progressing.

First our net zero one alcohol to jet SaaS plant is three months into the formal due diligence in term sheet negotiation phase for our U S Department of energy loan guarantee.

We said in August that it would take up to 12 months to complete the process and based upon the positive progress. We have made this quarter. We believe we are on track second.

[music].

Our dairy manure R&D business completed its expansion to 400000 million btu per year of capacity are.

<unk> is sharing positive standalone adjusted EBITDA. This is in spite of the fact that California <unk> prices are low in the $70 to $80 per metric ton range versus around $200 per metric ton. A couple years ago. It is also in spite of the fact that we are operating under our temporary Lcs.

C F S pathway of negative $1 50 carbon intensity.

So we expect our R&D cash flows to improve next year, when we get our anticipated permanent pathway of a minus $3 50 carbon intensity. We also expect R&D cash flows to improve as we ramp up volumes and Debottleneck the plant.

Third let's.

Let's talk about Verity carbon solutions.

Last quarter, we entered into an agreement with our third.

Ethanol producer customers, bringing our total customer capacity to over 300 million gallons per year of ethanol production, that's about 2% of the <unk>.

Higher U S ethanol market. That's good work considering we have.

Our first customer agreement was announced announced in March and so lots of progress that the <unk> team has made.

<unk> measure report verify for MRV business for carbon tracking. This also falls under the industry nomenclature of software as a service or SaaS.

This is a rapidly growing capital light business of ours, where we see a lot of potential on its own in addition to being strategically complimentary to our net zero alcohol to jet projects.

Finally, we are pleased to announce some key new members of our team last quarter. Dr. Angelo Amorality was appointed to our board of Directors. Angelo recently retired from BP, where he held innovation roles for 35 years focused on development of clean fuels of all types is a Cambridge University graduate and holds a Phd in chemistry is a.

Follow up the Royal Society of chemistry. He is actually an expert in all types of renewable businesses and technologies is a great addition to our board we're pleased to have him.

Andy Schaffer joined Us as our chief marketing customer and brand Officer Anna.

Andy previously worked as leader in the bio based polymers company now known as nature works a number of US here at G. But worked with Andy when we invented poly lactic acid or <unk>, which use fermentation technology and chemistry to produce sustainable biobased substitute to fossil based products.

And we do track it all the way from the farm to the end customer and it's very much like what we're doing today at Jabil, except for Rajeev of course, we're doing sustainable sustainable aviation fuel, it's a pleasure to have Andy with US again he gets it he knows what the problem is he knows how to work with the customers.

Now I'll pass it off to lend to talk through the operations of the numbers.

Thanks Pat.

<unk> Q3, combined revenue and interest income was $9 8 million with the interest income benefiting from higher interest rates.

Our corporate spend that as SG&A was $6 4 million for the quarter.

Excluding noncash stock based compensation of $4 1 million, which is a 3 million dollar decrease from Q2 as a result of our cost control efforts.

Debt related to the northwest style RMG project with $67 8 million, consisting of $68 2 million face value plus unamortized.

Four.

Premium and issuance costs.

We ended the third quarter of 2023 with a strong liquidity position of $401 3 million in cash restricted cash and other liquid investments.

Strictly cash portion is associated with our northwest style RMG bonds and certain collateral related to the development of net zero, one and totaled $77 8 million.

During the third quarter of 2023, we invested in capitalized 12 million cash and capital projects comprised of $8 7 million into net 011 7 million into the expansion of our northwest, Iowa RMG project, one 4 million into other net zero projects.

And $2 million into our hydrocarbon skid.

We also invested $19 9 million of capital with a zero six related.

E to allow the purchase of wind and hydrogen equipment to support net zero one.

Net zero one we are working to Derisk the project to nonrecourse standards to obtain the Doe loan guarantee and track the third party equity capital necessary to finance the construction budget and all the project finance elements such as interest during construction various reserves and transaction costs.

The infrastructure and energy transition private equity market as well as certain strategic investors are reacting well to the process of delivering an investment package that is financeable. The equity process will ramp up next year from the current information sharing and preliminary due diligence to full due diligence and negotiations which we.

Expect will occur in parallel with closing in on the Doe loan guarantee terms.

Our dairy RMG project in northwest, Iowa has been injecting into the pipeline since June of 2022. During Q3 2023, we sold 81200 71 million Btu of RMG revenue of $4 5 million for the quarter included RMG sales of <unk> 2 million.

$4 3 million net proceeds from the sale of environmental attributes.

During the quarter. We also completed our previously announced expansion to 400000 btu per annum of capacity.

And I am pleased to tell you that we have proven that annualized run rate.

We are now working through optimization of the whole system and we expect the operational improvements, we're making will further increase production.

Increase reliability and reduce O&M costs.

Finally, I'd like to emphasize the comment from the last earnings call, we see a pathway to positive cash flow for the company.

This is independent from and in addition to net sort of one being financed and operating this is based on our view of the growth of our LNG business and our Verity business, our cost trimming and our flexibility on the pace of discretionary growth related spending.

It is too soon to provide exact guidance and timing, but we look forward to doing so when we have our permanent carbon intensity pathway at northwest, Iowa, RMG and when we have more information around verity.

Now I'll turn the call back over to Pat.

Thanks Lynn.

Let me wrap up our prepared remarks by saying, even though it feels slow while we're waiting for the IRS rules to be clarified we are not sitting idle.

[music].

We're making progress moving ahead were laser focused on being good stewards of our capital.

We believe <unk> was undervalued, given our balance sheet and growth potential.

Frustrating. However, we know we are living through a once in a generation transition of our entire economy towards a focus on carbon abatement and <unk> is one of the companies on the forefront of that energy transition.

For this reason we have been seizing the moment to deploy well placed capital into the net zero plant designs for atg in ethanol.

Which <unk> owns and of course, we've been developing site locations because we plan on growing further plans.

We're also executing complementary strategies that will create value for us long term such as verity in R&D.

And ethanol for olefins or E mail, which not only support our net zero <unk> strategy.

But have potential to generate maximum value for shareholders separate than SaaS opportunities.

As Lynn alluded to we recognize the importance of being good stewards of our cash and getting to positive cash flow as a company. We can do more than one thing at a time, so even <unk>.

As we are pushing ahead on net zero, one, which we all believe will unlock substantial long term value for US. We are also pushing the development opportunities RMG and Verity, which we expect would get us to positive cash flow long before NZ one comes into operation.

And of course that should unlock value as well.

Let's open it up for questions.

Operator.

Thank you.

Reminder, if you would like to ask a question. Please press star one on your telephone as well wait to hear your name announced before you proceed with your question one moment, while we compile the Q&A roster.

Okay.

The first question for today will be coming from Derrick Whitfield of Stifel. Your line is open.

Thanks, and good afternoon patent team and congrats on your progress with the northwest all of the R&D project.

Start starting on Saf more broadly given the benefit of a completed feed study and the reset we've experienced in RIN pricing.

Could you share your thoughts on the economics of bringing product to market and the current environment I know that net zero, one will be focus on SaaS and that's better than R&D.

But again I would love your thoughts on that more broadly, yes, well the big question around the economics of SaaS is all around for the ruling for the IR ABL under section 45, 40, <unk> and 45 Z and those rules aren't out yet because that's the part that actually will describe how it is that the IRS is supposed to take into account the carbon reductions from our <unk> or <unk>.

<unk> 50, and less and remember as <unk> per Ci point per gallon. So we're waiting to see what that everything else is transient and will go up and down the rins that go up and down and stuff, but we got to see what that rule looks like and it's been overdue almost a year already and so.

We're waiting to see what happens and then we'll be able to adjust from there. The thing Thats interesting about SaaS is that it is a full drop in its proven to work airlines need it and so we believe we have the lowest cost route to make SaaS, we end up with particularly when you take into account the Ci score.

So we know Theres a market here for our stuff.

We just got to be able to finalize pricing, we'll be able to do that until we see that IRA overall, so it's not about rins at all it's about the IRA Bill.

And Pat maybe just stay on that point, because when you think about the bill and the importance of de Carbonization VLCC.

That should inherently make a greenfield project in some ways more economics in a brownfield or is that a fair assessment.

It is so the way to think of it as that carbon capturing or we're talking about is carbon capturing.

The <unk> directly off the fermentation of the alcohol that's worth about 30 Ci points 30, Ci points is quite a lot there now for us and our net zero one design.

We would hope you will take full advantage of that.

And it's very helpful.

Throw money.

And there is it's a competitive marketplace in the states. So a lot of states are saying, we're for sure going to half Ccs and Theres lots of discussions in other states as to what should happen and how should it happen.

But ccs is going to be important in long run game and a matters economically now here's the thing about ethanol plants. If you have an existing ethanol plant you don't have access to Ccs you have zero chance I believe.

Producing a crew.

Producing a jet fuel SaaS with a low Ci score. The reason for that is most ethanol plants are probably in the 70 Ci score range, so knocking off 30 points.

Is helpful, but it doesn't get you over the hump.

What it takes to make competitive SaaS.

So you have to do something about Decarbonize energy well of course, that's what we did in the approach we took up with net zero, one where you arrange to wind its way ECS.

We're doing the green hydrogen too.

<unk>.

Doing biogas, so we have multiple levers multiple shots on goal and Thats, how we would approach a brownfield plant as well and so when we look at several of those opportunities that we see and we would look at them for their full ability to BD carbonized of which ccs's apart.

That's great and maybe staying on.

Again part of the question, but maybe shifting that over to there and when you think about the outlook for ethanol.

What's that near and long term value proposition look like for Verity.

Well, it's interesting there is actually several.

And the one way to think of Verity is is the proof.

And really Super documented proof that in fact, there really was a carbon abatement and attracts it all the way across the whole of the business system all the way from.

Casualty carbon on the field at a farm threw the production facilities. Although we are talking of an airplane actually all the way out to the seat at an airplane so someone who is buying that seat.

Could in theory.

When the product is fully implemented.

You can know what it is that.

The exact carpet of payment pathway throughout that's the beauty of this technology uses blockchain or DLT technology.

You've already got it working in the field and production facilities.

So it's pretty darn interesting for the whole SaaS chain think of it as a really super.

Sustainability certificates that bullet proofed.

And that's valuable that's going to be valuable and key because that's the proof that in fact, you got what you paid for now when it comes to ethanol. We also we have been working with these ethanol plants one of the public ones, we announced with side, but we've done to others is that we're working on verifying their data taking taking there.

Process instrumentation data.

Transforming it into the data that's used for tackling Ci scores so that they can actually see what's going on in their plant that is also valuable. Because then we can use it to lower Ci score of ethanol and measure it and monitor it. The team is working now to figure out how to monetize that and they're making good progress. There is another project. Another part of this which is around the fee.

Attributes, we have $30 million grant from the USDA and that is all about documenting field feels not farms not regions fields, and we actually have a tool thats working with farmers.

Out in the fields, which have been in operation now development and operation for three years, and we just got it onto the handheld form and farmers can tell field by field, what's different that's all.

A huge deal because that allows them to have the information available to them to say make better different and.

Hopefully better decisions about how to improve the sustainability on their farm. It's in those avenues that we see the potential and.

There'll be multiple ways of making money from it some of it would be providing a service some of the profit share some of it might be actual <unk> of carbon or something like that in the future.

That's helpful. Thanks.

And it's a big it's a huge potential market the potential market. We are told we just had mckinsey and who are doing the study and it's in the billions.

So we're going to get a little more work on this I got to see the exact business plan someone Linda is referring to the guidance of what should happen and when should it happen the team there.

They're doing a good job this is a huge project and.

It's a software and.

Data collection.

Field work, a bunch of things, it's definitely not heavy duty capital, but the market potential we're being told is really big.

That lot.

Thank you one launch of our next question.

Okay.

Our next question will be coming from EMEA chassis.

H C. Wainwright your line is open.

Hey, Matt.

Thanks for taking my questions.

Sure.

So on the on the <unk> loan process I know it is it seems to be on track.

Will you be providing any.

Mommy stones or any new enables that.

During the quarter, how should we look at it.

Jackie.

You know.

No we won't we don't plan on it the thing that we're watching for is getting to the close or the I guess theres a final notice that they're going to give you the money that will take a while to get to that but doing the little details I don't want to know where theres just too many things they have to go do the diligence they have their own consultants are on their timeline they control the timelines we control nothing.

All we do is help and provide information and input so I can't see any kind of a win that's constructive for shareholders here.

Because theyre continuing to make progress and we'll report on it.

It's the very best thing.

Also.

So part of the reason for that question.

The equity partners.

Is it that you.

We're working with now track that.

<unk> information will you be sharing information with those kind of partners.

We are and have been yes there.

There's a quite a long queue of them and stay in touch with us and so the big variables that we have here are the same as what we've talked about before everyone wants to know what the 40 fives and <unk> is going to say we need number one.

What any number is better than no number because I think you could get on with figuring out the margin and what's going on and what the gaps are and how to fill the gaps. So thats just we got to have that and then the Doe.

The <unk>.

Program or project is solid we've done more engineering.

We have never in my life in mining the product I've ever been involved with my guys have ever been involved with have we done this much engineering on a project to pin it to and this is partly because were inflationary environments Roes have an update stuff, but it's like never ever done this much engineering in it. So it is derisked as we can possibly make it on every front you can think of and so.

We're pumped through it and get it done.

Understood.

On the Eto, the ethanol to listen.

Yes.

The government work that is going on like is there.

What exactly is happening on that front sure. So that's we have licensed the technology to LG and their partner with us in helping to develop but in their particular interest as they want to make propylene for polypropylene. That's a plastic it goes novel things from all the way from diapers to car bumpers, and consumer goods and the whole bit right in the proposition.

It would be in a massively negative polypropylene and people are interested in chemicals, so that would be pretty cool no one was ever seen a.

Polypropylene.

This kind of negative carbon values, so thats whats interesting about it and you'll have to go through the discovery of how much people will pay and all that kind of stuff, but theyre great partner. They are doing a lot of work on doing development right now I was in.

Korea here with Paul Blum.

Recently and.

You know what these guys are making great progress, they're really good at the catalysts and things and of course those proprietary catalysts are really important and this is stuff that we have our patents filed on so it's all really good and then also that technology.

But we believe cuts out large quantities of capital from making jet fuel from ethanol.

And it also cuts operating cost now it won't be ready in time for net zero. One. So we're going to go ahead with net zero on any way, maybe it's ready for net zero too.

We will see we have to go through the work and find out what it is we don't know yet we're scaling it up so to answer your question directly. The next stage is to get those catalysts scaled up that's part of it and then scale up the process itself and we'll be doing that over the next six months eight months something like that no doubt will run into something we don't know yet and then we'll have to overcome that.

But I'd say.

It's looking pretty good and we'll also bring in other partners to help develop it and get it implemented fast because the potential is huge.

Got it thanks for that and one last one and this is a clarification.

<unk> thousand and then btu per quarter.

Is that.

<unk> or the actual.

And that will be achieved by the Ian just wanted to make sure.

Well, where they've already demonstrated for running through several weeks at that run rate. So that the system is capable of it now there's other things we were looking at to see whether bottlenecks.

Equipment and whatever it needs to be adjusted so we're doing some of that so I think I would expect that like I don't know probably no.

Winter is never easy to run one of these plants, but let's say next year I would expect that to be more of the run rate.

100000 million Btu's.

Got it.

Hit our targets this year, we will hit our targets for what we had projected.

At whatever it was about 300000 million Btu is we'll accomplish that goal formulated Nicholas yes. It may be that there was a hiccup.

If a freeze gets us or something.

That can happen and that might.

Doing it but it will be and there will be right in there.

Got it.

Thanks, and good luck.

Thanks.

Thank you.

He would like.

To ask a question. Please press star one on your telephone one moment for the next question.

Our next question will be coming from Shaun Stevenson of water Tower Research. Your line is open.

Great. Thank you Pat I wanted to go back to guarantee for a moment and try to understand is is there. Another is there any sort of the de facto solution then that would be used for this.

In other words for an ethanol plant to use.

Any of the feedstock in terms of their Ci score and how it's coming in well.

We're going to have to use verity in order to quantify that and be able to use it in their ci calculations.

As far as calculating ICI score.

People can do that in multiple different ways, where we're trying to do is bring together incredibly high quality data along with the methodologies that are incredibly high quality and then it's put onto DLT technology now DLT technology is the technology behind blockchain. It allows it to no one can mess with it at all.

<unk> traceable.

Completely detailed when you can't mess with it it's put down on data you can't change. It. So there is no game playing involved here that's what makes it attractive so theres two parts and an ethanol plant theres. The plant there is a part that when you're running a plant itself, how one does ci reduction or carbon reductions or call. It.

They may have choices about whatever they are doing in their plant that's part of what needs to be documents and then of course, it's documented the feedstock that comes in.

The way that we view this is that these make for very high quality carbon credits in sets that people are willing to pay for it they tell us well, we got to go prove that out and see if there really are really willing to pay for these high quality insert credits.

Ill insert credits versus an offset credits insert credit means it's something directly relate to a separate supply chain that you're involved in an offset would be <unk>.

On an airplane and you go plant a tree that's offset this is actually in sets that are done in our supply chain that means youre tracking it all the way to gasoline and things like that so there's lots of interesting things that can be done on carbon and different plants have different ci scores and this goes into great detail about.

Those things and allows us to be documented and it makes them such a high quality that people people appear to be willing to pay for it.

This also was true then.

Cultural system and I remember in the agricultural system like we have you have the farms and we want people doing sustainable agricultural practices as our premise that our farmers get rewarded and paid for improving the sustainability of their farm, including the carbon reductions or carbon capture in their soil that benefits the whole supply chain, but bringing for the corn.

That is very low carbon score, but it is also producing protein and oil as well and so.

In it we like it because it takes away the arguments that we hear from some of the environmental groups that say Oh farming as bad well I've got news, we got data says farming very very very good and so we should reward the farmers. They do very very well there's lots of interest in this now the technique that we're doing it applies not just to corn farming complies to beans. It.

<unk> to not just an ethanol plant applies to any biofuel plant and so verity is interesting on all of those fronts and it's not so it's a way bigger that way bigger potential than just what we're doing what ethanol plants are doing. It also includes biofuels, but also can track into the food markets with protein and such.

We will have to stay focused and get this thing commercialized I want to see the money our see people pay us for the products itself.

We will get paid for services I want to see the product carbon reduction value osseous get paid for that.

How much can sustainable farming practices reduce that Ci score. If you look at the value chain, obviously, you're most familiar with with yours and ethanol in SaaS, but.

Is it a material impact that.

Farming practices can have on the Ci score and hence the value.

And about that is it's kind of mind boggling of what's possible. So one of the assumptions that whenever youre seeing these people.

And broadly espouse about row crops and crops are bad and blah blah blah, they're using really outdated data. They have no. They are out of touch with what really is done in real life and modern farming equipment, nowadays where like <unk>.

<unk> has appealed.

Thank you one moment for the next question.

Oh excuse me I was I was answering John's question.

Yes, Sean.

So what happens is that imagine the potential is that.

Right now we're at about.

We've seen farms with positive positive.

The increased carbon incrementally we've seen very negative carbon there is all kinds of new techniques that are available to drive carbon score down.

And we've seen things that have potential like minus 100.

And so we're at the very beginning I think.

And evolution Slash Revolution in farming, as we get better and better at looking at the data at collecting the data management data paying people to drive the carbon abatement down and you get other benefits too in the whole sustainability arena. So for example, I was mentioning.

That you get a John.

John Deere has a tractor that can go.

As cameras on it for herbicide and instant herbicide acquire you're driving along at 50 miles an hour in the machine recognizes a particular kind of weed and sprays particular kind of herbicide on that we'd at 15 miles an hour. So guess what huge amount of reduction in the amount of herbicide that's applied to that field that's huge.

And same thing you can do that with fertilizer and all the rest so the techniques.

People have misunderstood.

Our thought that agriculture is mature it's not mature there's a data revolution equipment revolution occurring.

And we're paying attention and that's what our verity is leveraging.

Okay. Thank you one moment for the next question.

And our next question will be coming from.

How big fit.

Sinha of Northland capital markets. Your line is open.

Yeah, Hi, Thanks for taking my question.

If you could remind us how much capital do you need actually right now to build the project.

And.

How much do you actually expect from daily.

Lynne do you want to take that one.

Sure.

Cost for those projects are.

Tracking as we do the detailed engineering and work through the remainder of the year and into Q1 to finalize the lump sum pricing tracking at about one to $1 $3 billion for the hard costs.

As far as the Doe loan that's a function of the debt service coverage ratios and other terms.

Maturity of the optics.

And we're modifying certain features of the project to allow for a higher debt capacity, we've applied for $950 million.

All of that and we think we will we will succeed at that level.

But there are other costs associated with our project financing like you have to pay you have to prepay or.

Sorry to provide for the interest during construction and other reserves associated with the debt so that adds to the total finance the installed cost.

Got it and how much heavier in that in.

Finance and accounting the equipment and materials and how much more you would think of an acquired and when do you expect that capital to be deployed.

Well, we've spent about $100 million to date on the development of net zero one out of that $100 million. It's comprised of site control permitting a lot of engineering, which is not a hard asset but its IP.

And then a certain amount of that is equipment.

Equipment deposits. So by the time, we get to financial close we could be $150 million, including more equipment deposits.

And we would then choose depending on the structure of the equity whether how much of that we leave in the project as equity in Con.

But.

We don't.

I think the total financed installed cost.

I, just mentioned will be substantially more than the $100 million of $150 million. So we have to go get third party capital for that.

That's why we're in process with the Doe and third.

Third party equity investors at the project level.

Sure got it.

And then in terms of your.

Project financing I mean, you have to get the EPC wrapped up and then I understand.

To get EBIT that you had to get the lump sum turnkey pricing right and when does that I mean, if I need to put my hat on like we were.

Exactly I need to put like in terms of where she will latch on like where do we get some good pricing by when should we assume that so now youre asking questions that sort of is another another track of what was asked earlier in terms of milestones, but I don't think we're prepared to talk a lot about those in detail yet we'll assess a key milestone.

<unk> as it occurs and disclose that but I don't want to dates.

Based on those activities.

It's one of these things that we can't win at this and from a standpoint of communicating those kind of milestones publicly because youre going to change everything changes because we find something different there I don't know like it's an inflationary environment anyway. So you're constantly updating the things you've got the deal over here with their questions and we have to adjust to them and we have equity people that were working with.

And so it's coming together Mcdermott has been a very good partner I can tell you that much.

And we've already negotiated a contract we got to finalize the numbers BIOLASE and never depend upon timing and we're working through it and keeping it updated theyre going through extra details. We're looking at the scope of the project and stuff, but it's it's all going along on a on a good schedule and so we like what we see we're trying to bring it all together, but the rate.

Limiting step is right.

Right now.

Sure. Thanks last one please.

Have you, having I mean have you heard anything.

Ending cash.

And in terms of your.

Our portfolio of offtake agreements I mean are you getting any questions from those guys has anything changed in terms of.

Doug I missed there.

No. The airlines that we work with are all co-operative partners for us to recognize the time rents will have to change now some of them had.

Conditions precedence at the end of the year and stuff, but they're all everyone is cooperative and working on.

Extending modifying them into whatever they recognize that a T. J is a very low cost route to make jet fuel that matters. In this space. It also is the most scalable one more so than any other technology. That's out there we believe and I think they will too we will be talking more about this with people more publicly we just wrapped.

Up a study that we did with Mckinsey here.

For the last few months and they verify what we thought they did it independently we like that and so we just got it just there is so much noise in this space. There's only a few things that can work do you think about it you've got something that's cost effective check you got us up and scalable check.

Something that leverages existing infrastructure right drop in pre.

Greenstock wise and on the product side check check.

So getting everyone to understand this that this is the game of foot and heifer is a that's the stuff that's made from oilseeds or problem waste fats and oils. That's made from renewable diesel that has potential to but it's got its own issues because it takes away from renewable diesel or competes and it adds cost renewable diesel in order to make <unk>.

And it's limited on feedstock supply so it's a.

A T J, so really really good product and we're more confident about it every single day about that.

Okay. That's helpful.

Yeah.

Thank you at this time there are no more questions in the queue I would like to turn the call back over to Pat Gruber for closing remarks. Please go ahead.

Thanks, Thanks, everybody's support and I'll tell you. It's been it has been frustrating I mentioned that in the prepared remarks, but it's a it hasn't pressuring waiting for 45 years. They had never believed it would take this long, but we need to know the number so we can get out and figure out the rest of the details for the projects.

And overall the pieces are here, they're coming together you heard me just talk about.

US doing a study of really look at ourselves in the mirror is do we havent right do we have a thoughtful we had bringing in consultants and stuff.

We have it right and it's the right thing I really this point that <unk> made in his prepared remarks about.

We are not going to be we're not going to wait to be profitable until NZ want us up we're going to try and be profitable long before that that's our duty and responsibility and that's we're going to try to make happen towards not a one trick pony betting all of it.

It's not a one trick pony. So anyway, we are keeping I honest, it's an exciting time disparity is particularly exciting.

R&D, where we liked that a lot and.

It's.

I think we have all the pieces here.

Getting it down and put them in the right places and get on with it.

Thank you everybody for joining us.

Thank you all for joining today's conference call.

And the conclusion of the call you may all disconnect.