Q4 2024 Angi Inc and IAC Inc Earnings Call
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Please note today's event is being recorded.
Christopher: I would now like to turn the conference over to Christopher help them Executive Vice President and CFO M. C O L. L C.
Go ahead.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Good morning, everyone, Christopher helping here and welcome to the IAC and Angi, Inc. Fourth quarter earnings call.
Speaker Change: With me today are Barry Diller, senior executive and chairman of IAC, Joey Levin CEO of IAC, and Chairman of <unk>, Inc, and Jeff Kip CEO of Angi ink.
Speaker Change: Supplemental to our quarterly earnings releases IAC and Angi have each published shareholder letters, which are currently available on the investor relations sections of their respective websites, we will not be reading the shareholder letters on this call.
Speaker Change: I will shortly turn the call over to Barry and then Joey to make a few introductory remarks, followed by Q&A before we get to that I'd like to remind you that during this presentation. We may make certain statements that are considered forward looking under the federal Securities laws. These forward looking statements may include statements related to our outlook.
Speaker Change: <unk> and future performance and are based on our current expectations and on information currently available to us actual outcomes and results may differ materially from the future results expressed or implied in these statements due to a number of risks and uncertainties, including those contained in our most recent quarterly report on form.
Speaker Change: <unk> 10-Q are most easily met our most recent annual report on Form 10-K and in subsequent reports that we file with the SEC.
Speaker Change: The information provided on this conference call should be considered in light of such risks will also discuss certain non-GAAP measures, which as a reminder include adjusted EBITDA, which we will refer to today as EBITDA for simplicity during the call.
Speaker Change: I'll refer you to our earnings releases, the IAC and angi shareholder letters, our public filings with the SEC and again to the Investor relations sections of our respective websites for all comparable GAAP measures and full reconciliations for all material non-GAAP measures and now I will turn it over to our senior.
Speaker Change: Decorative and chairman Barry Diller.
Barry Diller: Thank you, Chris Yes, definitely the very senior executive, but it's nice to.
Barry Diller: Talk with you. This morning I haven't been on one of these calls and I think a little more than 10 years and.
Speaker Change: Hopefully you will not.
Speaker Change: I don't want me to wait for another 10 years before I do it again, but what I wanted to do really is to review.
Speaker Change: What's really happened in this company over the last couple of years.
Speaker Change: About.
Speaker Change: Two years ago.
Speaker Change: <unk>.
Speaker Change: Of course, we realized that our two two of our principal businesses.
Speaker Change: Angie and thought gosh, we're troubled here's what the troubles or.
Speaker Change: We had taken the Angie.
Speaker Change: Which.
Speaker Change: Prior year.
At about $260 million of EBIT.
Speaker Change: It's down to $35 million.
Speaker Change: Our capex shot up to 115 million.
Speaker Change: On top that Merit us.
Speaker Change: Uh huh.
Speaker Change: Initial plant.
Speaker Change: After the acquisition was we thought we would do $450 million.
Speaker Change: And EBITDA.
Speaker Change: Actually the clock for that particular year.
Speaker Change: And a half years ago three years ago.
Speaker Change: <unk> went from $3 35 down to 230.
Speaker Change: So.
Speaker Change: I felt as did Joey live in and our.
Speaker Change: Our colleagues that we were really in a crisis and we had to fix these two principal businesses.
Speaker Change: So we essentially stopped everything we did not want to do things that either.
Speaker Change: I either extended the amount of work we had to do into other areas that weren't as important.
Speaker Change: We.
Speaker Change: Knew that we had to hit the ground and really spend than we thought at the time it would take certainly a year maybe two.
Speaker Change: Get these businesses back to performing.
Speaker Change: And so we froze everything basically other than attending.
Speaker Change: The those two businesses and getting them back.
Speaker Change: Back on a track where they were where.
Speaker Change: They needed to be.
Speaker Change: At Angi <unk>.
Speaker Change: Some of this of course, you all know, but I I.
Speaker Change: I really want to put this in context, because I do think it is a it is at least.
Speaker Change: From my point of view.
Speaker Change: It clarifies what the company has been doing.
Speaker Change: In these last couple of years.
Speaker Change: And where we are now.
And where I think we will be in the future.
Speaker Change: First thing we did is we replace the CEO of Angi with Joe We live in.
Speaker Change: Who was.
Speaker Change: Kind of also obviously at that time he was the CEO of IC, but we said, okay. We will take all the other areas of IC you concentrate on fixing.
Speaker Change: Angie.
Speaker Change: We immediately got rid of the low quality and a low margin revenue.
Speaker Change: Which reduced our revenue book and we stopped the capital expenditures.
Speaker Change: At anything near that level I think we went from 115, if I recall correctly said correctly earlier.
Speaker Change: To about 50.
Speaker Change: And what happened is that of course, the profit and the cash flow.
Speaker Change: Went back onto a positive track.
Speaker Change: Uh huh.
Speaker Change: We also appointed Jeff Kip to be the C. E O. He had been running the international business is really well.
Speaker Change: And and at the essence and are you like all these entities, they're they're they're they're product companies and we have to fix the product.
Speaker Change: All of that work has has been in train for these last couple of years.
Speaker Change: And and she now is back as you can see from the figures. It is back from where it was a lot of the things that happened to angi, where you know.
Speaker Change: Some of them were self inflicted some of them work grandiose plans to get into the services business ourselves etcetera, which while good ideas were not executed well at all and so Joey and now Jeff.
Speaker Change: Went in.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: Took the thing down to I think kind of its subs and have built it back up where it can now perform and then hopefully.
Speaker Change: Next year, you'll see real revenue growth.
Speaker Change: No.
Speaker Change: That's the arc of ANZ.
Speaker Change: I'm Todd Meredith.
Speaker Change: Uh huh.
Speaker Change: Uh huh.
Speaker Change: We reversed the traffic declines they are up I think traffic's up about 8%.
Speaker Change: With the integration.
Speaker Change: We'll know when people talk about integration and.
Speaker Change: And the synergies and all of that they can talk a good game, but when you get right down to it it's it's a tough slog.
Speaker Change: And it was a very difficult year, and a half is and as potash.
Speaker Change: They've invested in.
Speaker Change: Great makes us get this whole thing and train.
Speaker Change: Especially I'd really put it into them, so well, which is the thing that got us to buy.
Speaker Change: It was we thought we had.
Speaker Change: Our game plan for <unk>.
Speaker Change: Oh properties surface properties.
Speaker Change: April could gain advertising grab a greater value than anyone else.
Speaker Change: And and she's done I'll just give you just just.
Speaker Change: Yes.
Speaker Change: I don't do stops very well so.
Speaker Change: So this is my one thing on stocks, which is.
Speaker Change: Digital revenue growth.
Speaker Change: We haven't found a very stark.
Speaker Change:
Speaker Change: This is Q2 of 'twenty two.
Speaker Change: I'm just going to read you a consecutive 67 quarters down seven down 13%.
Speaker Change: Around 15 down.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Speaker Change: Barry I think we.
Speaker Change: Operator, it looks like Mr. Builder, we have lost your audio Sir.
Speaker Change: Okay Barrington.
Speaker Change: Alright.
Speaker Change: Hopefully we will get there.
Speaker Change: The audio back there and the.
Speaker Change: Good news on that is Barry's remarks, where we're very consistent with some of the things that I was going to say, so hopefully I can pick up pick.
Speaker Change: Pick up where he left off.
Speaker Change: First of all.
Speaker Change: Thank you to Barry Thank you Chris.
Speaker Change: Thank you to Jeff and everybody for being on this call I looked in my first one of these calls was in Q4 of 2013. So I've been doing these calls for 12 years and this is I think nearly 50 as one of these calls but only actually one of those was ever with BD. So this is this is a treat for all of US if we can get him back on the line in the <unk>.
Speaker Change: Fixing that connection.
Speaker Change: Obviously, we have plenty of ups and downs.
Speaker Change: Gary took us through and businesses come and go since then but but it's nice to have the operations really on the upswing right. Now we finished the year 2024, very strong we added nearly $250 million increase in cash flow year on year to almost $300 million of cash flow.
Speaker Change: Horizon business is and the real momentum right now behind the business is especially that dash and Andy that they actually outgrowing the market and Angie is Andy is almost there are you know.
Speaker Change: We're looking at growth next year as we've discussed and the good news is we've had enough progress in the business in terms of just.
Speaker Change: Delivering the customer experience nailing the unit economics.
Speaker Change: Addressing the cost in Opex and Capex I think we've had enough to work with and AMG that we were really able to rip off this last quarter.
Speaker Change: Current quarter, sorry, Q1, we're really able to rip off that last band aid and and get the product experience are fully to where we want it to be and that means we can start building again and.
Speaker Change: That's what Jeff and I are.
Speaker Change: And the entire team at Angi are incredibly excited to do it in.
Speaker Change: As I've said for a quarter or two and now we're back on offense and I think that's true for both IAC and angi and I think.
Speaker Change: Barry and Chris and everybody at IC are incredibly excited about that and Jeff Knight, Andy as well are seem to be at angi as well incredibly excited to be back on offense and.
Speaker Change: That's a great place to be so.
Speaker Change: Unless.
We connected Barry <unk> secondary so let's go to questions.
Speaker Change: Yes, Sir.
Speaker Change: I'll just add that Mr. Griller back on yet.
Speaker Change: Okay, Let's go to the question queue, operator, and take the first question.
Absolutely and as a brief reminder to ask a question. Please press Star then one on your telephone keypad. Our first question today comes from Cory Carpenter with Jpmorgan. Please go ahead.
Cory Carpenter: Thanks, Good morning, I had one for each of you I think on LNG Julia start with you could you talk about your motivations for movie.
Speaker Change: With the spin.
Speaker Change: Maybe for Jeff, what's giving you confidence in terms of improving through the year. Despite the <unk> guide coming in below your prior expectations.
Chris: Chris could you just talk to the next steps in the spin process.
Speaker Change: Are you planning to take any cash from EG. Thank you.
Chris: Sure I'll start thanks Corey.
To answer your question Theres, both of course, a personal and professional element and a lot of overlap with those things, but on the personal side that I think there comes a point in life, where you start to optimize for freedom and in that time for me I decided it now and I'm incredibly excited about it and on the professional side. Andy you just still has asymmetrical.
Speaker Change: Upside I believe and I know how hard it's been hard it is in this business, but as I started to say before the good news is I think we've done most of the hard stuff. We've pulled out most of the challenging things and we know it's believe me no fun to sit in front of all of you and owns and big mistakes and rip out some sizeable chunks of revenue.
Chris: But.
Chris: That really especially with the changes you have talked about in the letter on January 13th is now behind us and.
Chris: That means we have the I think the pains in the rearview mirror and now we finally get to focus on building again and that building process with a product that makes us proud is a fun thing to do and I'm really excited to do it.
Speaker Change: Thanks, Cory I'll, just take the spin process questions.
Speaker Change: We filed the registration statement on January 27th once its declared effective we will continue to.
Speaker Change: Analyzed separation agreements between the companies will also make additional filings with the SEC as necessary.
Speaker Change: We are very focused on closing right now on March 31, but we continue to work through customary legal and tax considerations along with certain operational details at the end of the day. The goal is a seamless and successful transition to for AMG to being a standalone public company.
Speaker Change: And as we said we're on process for $3 31 regarding Amg's balance sheet. The current plan is not to make any dividends. So we would spin Angie with its current cash balance of $416 million and $500 million of attractively priced bonds with that I'll pass to Jeff. Thanks, Kris C Corps.
Speaker Change: I'll take your question in Q1, and the 2025 outlook I'll, probably throw in 2026, a little as well our Q1 outlook is a little below what we estimated about three months ago at the time, we assume that the first quarter would be a world framed by the FCC order and we got ready we fully implement.
Speaker Change: Good consumer choice consistent with the FCC order on January 13th that's a couple of weeks ahead of the orders effective date.
Speaker Change: Not just because of the order, but also because we know and we've known it is clearly the best thing for our customers in the business long term.
Speaker Change: We've been steadily moving towards this implementation of the FCC order really only accelerated our path.
Speaker Change: As we noted in the letter the experience.
Speaker Change: The improved experience has been evidenced for awhile homeowner NPS is double digits better when they choose the pro than when their auto matched and froze when the lead 60% more often when they are chosen then whether auto matched.
Speaker Change: So we looked at that data. We said this is clearly the right thing since we've made the change we've gotten very positive feedback from our customers.
We've observed the dynamics in the marketplace and the improvement in the market experienced only confirmed all of this prior analysis and our conviction in the change.
Speaker Change: On January 24th.
Speaker Change: At the last minute the court vacated the FCC rule change.
Speaker Change: <unk>.
Speaker Change: We however, still going ahead, we're sticking with the change we're making our competition is not this is creating some short term disruption in the market had an impact on our first quarter, but long term.
Speaker Change: We consider ourselves very well competitively positioned.
Speaker Change: In the marketplace with a significantly better customer experience.
Speaker Change: So going forward.
Speaker Change: We're obviously real time adjusting to the changes in the marketplace, given the regulatory shift, but theres a number of factors that give us high confidence or build through 2025 and back to growth in 2026 first the first quarter is our toughest comp of the year.
Speaker Change: We're sunsetting, a few hundred basis points of non choice revenue in our proprietary channels that we got rid of at the end of the first quarter last year, and we don't have to compare to that for the rest of 2025. Secondly, we have a number of product builds impacting marketing efficiency matching and monetization that we have clear data behind that will add revenue and.
Speaker Change: Profit as we build through the year.
Speaker Change: Thirdly, our single pro product initiatives referenced in the letter on the last call was going to lead to growth in revenue per monetized transaction by the second half of the year as we sunset our legacy ads pricing structures.
Speaker Change: Fourthly, we expect to steadily returned to growth in our proprietary ESR channels. This year be fully growing in 2026, RCM unbranded Srs are growing today <unk> dot com SCO is only down single digits. Today. It is 90% of our own brand of organic traffic and so we expect to continue building through the year.
Speaker Change: Air and reach growth in 2026.
Speaker Change: On the flip side, our third party.
Speaker Change: <unk> are going to take a significant step down in 2025, but because we're doing it at the beginning of the year, we expect it to be flat in 2026 and the two together gives you growth.
Speaker Change: Finally.
Speaker Change: We expect increased homeowner repeat and pro retention because of the impact of homeowners choice on the experience.
Speaker Change: On both sides of the marketplace. So net.
Speaker Change: Q1 is going to be down a little versus what we said a few months ago and down in the low 20% year over year, but we've got even more confidence in revenue improvement across the year and a return to growth in 2026 and very much have confidence in the competitive position, we are able to take in the quality of the customer experience, we're going to be able to deliver over the long term.
Speaker Change: So we think that this is going to deliver value to our customers value to our shareholders and our strong next couple of years.
Jeff: Thank you Jeff.
Speaker Change: Operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. Our next question today comes from John Blackledge with TV Cowen. Please go ahead.
John Blackledge: Great Thanks, and Joe Good luck with the move.
Speaker Change: Two questions for Chris <unk>.
Speaker Change: First could you talk about the drivers of <unk> revenue and EBITDA and maybe walk through the <unk> 25 in fiscal 'twenty five puts and takes for Tdm revenue and EBITDA Guide and then second question would be kind of given IAC strong balance sheet and the ramping free cash flow how should we think about capital al.
Speaker Change: Occasion, and then what the upcoming angi spend enjoying Joey moving over to Angie as executive Chairman, how should we think about kind of the management transition at IAC. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yes. Thank you John so starting with <unk> on our last earnings call, we talked about how sluggish both consumer traffic and advertiser spend we're headed up to and through the U S election.
Speaker Change: We are cautiously optimistic at the time, both would ramp back up after the political landscape with sorted.
Speaker Change: And we saw that November traffic was excellent for us most notably on our food sites as Neil Vogel likes to say Thanksgiving as the Super Bowl for all recipes traffic in December was slower mainly due to a lack of celebrity and entertainment news at people and some less robust holiday momentum in the home category on the advertising.
Speaker Change: Rising front, we saw many advertisers come back into the premium and programmatic markets in mid November net result of all that for the third quarter, we posted 3% core sessions growth and 3% digital advertising growth a real bright spot in the quarter was performance marketing.
Speaker Change: Which grew 22% led by exceptional ecommerce performance. It was great to see this area grow strongly after a couple of sluggish quarters and it highlights <unk> industry, leading ability to convert consumer interest.
Speaker Change: Into sales for our retail partners and then finally licensing continued its strong growth led by our open AI and Apple news partnerships.
Speaker Change: Gather these three revenue lines blended 10% digital revenue growth above the range. We were forecasting looking to 2025, we view all three digital revenue growth areas as healthy and strongly positioned.
In aggregate, we're expecting 10% plus digital revenue growth for the year with high single digit growth in Q1, a few factors contribute to a slightly lower first quarter growth in those high single digits. It's more challenging January and February comps Easter, which is a key holiday for a shift this year into Q2 from <unk>.
Speaker Change: Q1 last year and there is one less day due to the leap year, the second quarter, Conversely sets up stronger with easier comps in the Easter benefit.
Speaker Change: On the digital advertising front, we're expecting mid single digit traffic growth for the year.
Speaker Change: And mid single digit monetization growth will also generate incremental revenue from the launch of decipher plus where we will be seen third part we'd be selling third party inventory using our proprietary targeting technology. We're testing this with select advertisers this quarter and we'll scale it up throughout the year, and then performance marketing and our licensees.
Speaker Change: Both grow solidly for the year.
Speaker Change: <unk> continues to manage its cost structure thoughtfully as shown by the severance in the fourth quarter due to head count reductions to reallocate resources.
Speaker Change: For the year, we're forecasting 40% plus digital incremental EBITDA margins, which combined with 10% digital revenue growth and then 10% revenue declines in our print segment lead to our guide of $3 30 to $3 50 of total EBITDA $3 million of total EBITDA.
Speaker Change: One accounting note as noted in the release, we will have a significant gain a Barry you hit it over new ones that we will have a significant gain in the first quarter of 2025 of approximately $36 million associated with a highly favorable lease buyout, our adjusted EBITDA guidance excludes this gain.
Speaker Change: Barry I'll turn it over to you.
We just got the question about capital allocation and how that changed in the context of our strong balance sheet.
Speaker Change: Right. This is all very odd for me because youll have to I've been.
Speaker Change: Did you hear my opening remark.
Speaker Change: We got your opening remarks up through angi in the very beginning of DBM and then we started last you. When you were going through the quarterly growth rates of DM, starting with 22, that's where we lost you.
Speaker Change: Oh nice.
Speaker Change: Ah, yes, well technology Uber Alex.
So about how how how many minutes in cause I went on for about 20 minutes and then.
Speaker Change: I heard nothing.
Speaker Change: I think the key would be to pivot to pivot to the capital allocation section and talk through thoughts on M&A and buyback because we didn't get to that and that's.
Speaker Change: Does.
Speaker Change: This is all because we're not in the same room so.
Speaker Change: And the easiest but did did I cover the turnaround Andrey and Doctor.
Speaker Change: Yes, yes got through angi and most of that debt.
Speaker Change: Not entirely.
Speaker Change: And did I talk about the anti spam.
Speaker Change: No we didnt get the anti Smith, alright, So let me pick up there than I'm, sorry, everybody, but.
Speaker Change: The technology.
Speaker Change: Sales in just a moment youre kind of depend upon it.
Speaker Change: So uh huh.
Speaker Change: Whether you heard or not.
Speaker Change: We spent those.
Speaker Change: Two years, turning around these businesses, which is why I froze everything.
Speaker Change: You didn't want to be distracted during this period.
Speaker Change: Sure.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: As you certainly know about our.
Speaker Change: Okay.
Speaker Change: Decades of spinning off companies or conglomerate, that's an anti conglomerate kind of like that.
That concept, which I believe that business is when they get to be of sufficient size, they ought to be spun off and be independent.
Speaker Change: There was nothing more further that is he could do.
Speaker Change: For Angi, Joey and Jeff running the business.
Speaker Change: Complete confidence in them they've done a very good job in getting it to the state we're going to grow.
Speaker Change: And also Joey come to me and said I really like a business of my own I'd like my own store and I.
Speaker Change: I totally respect that and encourage that and we had the vehicle to do so it made no sense for us to keep Angie partially to have its own majority, but still be a public company, either where innerwear out.
Speaker Change: Think that.
Speaker Change: It is the perfect time to do the spin.
Sure.
Speaker Change: And I'm glad that I think it will happen.
Speaker Change: Somebody correct me, but I think it's March 30, <unk> to date correct that it'll happen.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: So as I said before I did freeze everything we were running burning cash in 'twenty two.
Speaker Change: We've gone from burning cash now having $352 million of cash flow this year.
Speaker Change: We purify the company we've sold assets.
Speaker Change: We bought MGM before this period.
Speaker Change: I believe that MGM is.
Speaker Change: Okay.
Speaker Change: I'm, sorry, I missed it.
Speaker Change: It is run like a product Felipe watch it has superb management.
Speaker Change: No one will ever duplicate Las Vegas.
Speaker Change: Anywhere else in the World, we have 40 plus percent of the market.
Speaker Change: It cannot be disintermediation by any technology.
Speaker Change: There is nothing between it and its customer and serving its customers as you know these hotels run at 90 plus percent capacity.
Speaker Change: And the the the.
Future for MCM building, a 10 plus billion dollar resort in Japan, the only gaming resort in the entire country in Osaka, which will open.
Speaker Change: So take some years to build it but Ah is.
<unk> is a great flag for MGM is going to plant other flags around the world, it's going to simplify itself over the next period I think it's been complicated a little overly complex for people to understand.
Speaker Change: It's wildly undervalued.
Speaker Change: And I think that it's just.
Speaker Change: It's just that.
Speaker Change: How lucky to get to be able to have found a company at a time when it was.
Speaker Change: It was all shutdown in Las Vegas, when we came upon it wasn't open were able to buy and advantageously to.
Speaker Change: <unk> bought back a lot of it stock continued to do so.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: I just couldnt I think the idea of having DBM.
Speaker Change: And the position of the DD Amazon.
Speaker Change: Outperforming its.
Speaker Change: Its competitors.
Speaker Change: Yes.
Speaker Change: I'm going to ask you one more question.
Speaker Change: Did I get to the thing Thats, giving you the stats of the traffic digital traffic D D.
Speaker Change: Okay.
Speaker Change: I think you were halfway halfway through that one which is exactly when we last year right alright, well good halfway.
Speaker Change: The worst of it so let me go from the halfway back to that next halfway good.
Speaker Change: For six quarters, we went down 713, 14 15, 10%.
Speaker Change: Beginning in the fourth quarter of 'twenty, three plus nine fourth quarter first quarter 13, then 12% then 60% in the fourth quarter, just announced 10% I mean, that's an incredible reversal in the medium is as is.
Speaker Change: It is in it.
Speaker Change: It has to go through this difficult.
Speaker Change: Integration and trans.
Speaker Change: And also hit by.
Speaker Change: AD market itself, having a decline but.
It is an excellent asset for us.
Speaker Change: Get the bedrock right now of IC.
Speaker Change: Tdm and MTM plus we have.
Speaker Change: Uh huh.
Speaker Change: Obviously.
Speaker Change: You all know our balance sheet is very strong.
Speaker Change: As I said earlier we.
Speaker Change: I froze everything it's mean that we're not buying stock back during this period.
Speaker Change: Because I didn't think we deserve to until we've gotten our businesses in shape and Cochrane confidence about our business not going to talk about what we will do but I will talk about one thing which is the fact that I did stop it that's stopping has ended.
Speaker Change: And I'm not going to foresee things because what I've just said I hope it is fairly obvious but.
Speaker Change: I Hope you understand the reason I did stop it and wanted us to freeze and only pay attention to our businesses and getting them straightened out getting the whole corporate structure straightened out.
Speaker Change: Now in a situation where that phase has finished I think we are pressuring bye bye bye bye. These recently announced event as far as what are we going to do with our capital there.
Speaker Change: There are areas I think of DBM invest in.
Speaker Change: There are also all sorts of opportunities whether it's buy build the history of this company has been God knows.
Speaker Change: Endless starts of buys of businesses.
Speaker Change: And that landscape, while I think you know the internet field is fairly covered but.
Speaker Change: We're going to look at anything that talks walks or whatever.
Speaker Change: We're not anxious.
Speaker Change: Well, we will do this as we've done it before tell us a good idea.
Speaker Change: And if we think it makes sense.
Speaker Change: We will go forward with it and we've at least our history have shown.
Speaker Change: <unk> been doing that.
Speaker Change: We built assets and value.
Speaker Change: That's what me and Chris.
Speaker Change: Russell <unk>, our head of M&A are dedicating themselves to do in addition to.
Speaker Change: Work will continue to do with.
Speaker Change: Our principal asset of DBM and our involvement with MGM. So okay, I hope still im with you after having yes.
Speaker Change: Almost done this twice now.
Speaker Change: That was perfect you answered and you answered John's question, while there Barry Thank you.
Speaker Change: Thank you John Operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. Our next question comes from Eric Sheridan with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead.
Eric Sheridan: Thank you so much for taking the question maybe two if I could first for the AMG team understood on the three pillar dynamic with respect to 25 going into 'twenty six wanted to if we get a little bit more color on what investors should expect in terms of some of the headwinds turning into potential tailwind for the business that we should be monitoring from the outside.
In terms of that transformation of coal across those three pillars, and then specifically with the transition to a single product and platform how to think about some of the integration dynamics are moving towards that and what it might mean for sort of improving the quality overall on the platform that would be number one and then Barry maybe following up on your App.
Eric Sheridan: Great to have the opportunity to speak.
Eric Sheridan: IEC has changed over the years in terms of taking stakes in companies and continued rubbing operating businesses. When you think about the framework you just laid out about investing for the long term at IAC, how should we be thinking about what your priorities are with respect to operating businesses as opposed to maybe investing in businesses like we saw examples like MGM and Toro.
Eric Sheridan: Thank you.
Eric Sheridan: Joe.
Eric Sheridan: With your first question, Eric I'm going to try and sum up a little bit what I said before which is we have been progressively improving the product.
Eric Sheridan: And building our proprietary traffic back to growth.
Eric Sheridan: Our SCM proprietary RCM has returned to growth, we expect our proprietary growth to move and improve through the year and get to growth in 2026.
Consented choices taken a big chunk out of our third party business, but that business is now going to be stable going forward. So the two together get us to growth going forward on the pro side, our retention has improved materially.
Eric Sheridan: Literally bringing 700 basis points more of the pros active in 'twenty, we brought 700 basis points more of the pros active in 2023 into 2024 compared to what we brought from 'twenty two into 'twenty three.
Eric Sheridan: While our acquisition is coming down and thus, we're not netting network growth yet those forces will cross going forward, particularly with the incremental changes in customer experience. So we expect the pro network to inflect to growth again as well so the two of those things when combined.
Eric Sheridan: And that we will take our trajectory back to growth in 2026 in terms of single pro product Theres a couple of pieces to it one is.
Eric Sheridan: Moving all of our pros to a single platform with a single product and pricing structure is going to allow us to run our operations far more efficiently reduce time to market reduce overhead and make our acquisition and marketing more efficient.
Eric Sheridan: Secondly, it's going to as I said before sunset some pricing structures, it's going to pave the way to grow our revenue per monetized transaction in the second half of the year, which will be another lift in our incremental progress back to growth in terms of integration risk. We've now done five migrations of a comparable size in Europe, we're pretty.
Eric Sheridan: Seasoned at this will likely take a little disruption, but we'll also get back pros from the old product. We do it every time, we do it in Europe.
Eric Sheridan: Sure.
Eric Sheridan: This is this is basic operations for us and so we expect of course, there to be a little noise in the system, but we actually expect to come out better and move forward well there.
Barry Diller: I think I covered all of the pieces of your question I think that's very well said, let's go to Barry.
Eric Sheridan: Tom.
Barry Diller: As far as operating businesses.
Eric Sheridan: We will take it any way it comes.
Eric Sheridan: I believe.
Eric Sheridan: So forever.
Eric Sheridan: Once the business gets up to.
Eric Sheridan: To sufficient scale it ought to be spun out and be independent and on its own.
Eric Sheridan: I think companies that have multiple operating businesses and trying to operate each of them I think.
Eric Sheridan: So less advantageously.
Eric Sheridan: Then they would have those companies were.
Eric Sheridan: Standing on their own.
Eric Sheridan: And and and.
Eric Sheridan: As we look into the into the future possibilities.
Eric Sheridan: I'm sure there'll be operating businesses.
Eric Sheridan: We will operate for a period of time, but actually the operator.
Eric Sheridan: For too long I think probably pay will have failed and we will dispose of them. If they succeed we will spin them out.
Eric Sheridan: Thank you. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. The next question comes from Jason <unk> with Oppenheimer. Please go ahead.
Jason: Hey, Thanks for taking my questions.
Speaker Change: Two questions.
Speaker Change: Maybe the first one bearing and the second is a follow up for Joe and Chris.
Speaker Change: Maybe I'll ask in that order. So just Barry I think one of the questions. We keep getting from investors would would be how would you characterize it.
Speaker Change: <unk>.
Kind of post now the angi is spending you're poised to lean more into multiyear back or.
Speaker Change: Or are you more focused on realizing the Carlsbad and returning kind of the maximum amount of cash and value to shareholders. So just let's start with that question and then I have just a follow up on the Meredith.
Speaker Change: Digital times.
Speaker Change: Well.
Speaker Change: You'll see what we do in the next period as I say I stopped us from from.
Speaker Change: Using our capital to return it to shareholders for the reasons I've said before.
Speaker Change: That period has ended.
Speaker Change: And so it's always going to be a balance.
Speaker Change: You take the first opportunity.
Speaker Change: Investing in your current business I think there's a real opportunity.
Speaker Change: Inside D DM and all sorts of areas and I think that May take some capital I think also.
Speaker Change: Again, we have a clean slate, we don't have any drag on us we don't have any problem so to speak.
Speaker Change: All of that stuff has been solved so all of our attention couldn't go to seeking new opportunities and they always come if you're not.
Speaker Change: In patient and I'm not patient.
Speaker Change: We will see.
Speaker Change: Clearly a mix between returning.
Speaker Change: Capital to shareholders and seeking opportunity.
Speaker Change: Thank you and then Joey Chris now that digital revenue is growing double digits at Meredith that digital what are your plans to transition.
Speaker Change: Focus on top of funnel and find ways to further leverage our content and drive more engagement and impression and how do you and do you think that can accelerate revenue over the next few years.
Jason: Yes, thanks, Jason.
Speaker Change: We always look at the business is advancing two key drivers in parallel.
Speaker Change: <unk> as you are talking about and monetization quantity and price.
Speaker Change: For traffic there is definitely top of funnel elements.
Speaker Change: A few key stripe strategic priorities. One is we talked about in the letter and we've talked about previously is direct consumer relationships.
Speaker Change: Where we engender traffic through new products E mail and marketing.
Speaker Change: Another is continuing to offer premium content.
Speaker Change: Behind our industry, leading brands that we optimize for different platforms. So think Apple news, Google discover social media things like that.
Speaker Change: And the last one which you mentioned a little bit earlier as decipher plus.
Speaker Change: In our partnership with open AI and also on our own we've mapped comparable third party sites.
Speaker Change: That have the same signal of intent that decipher utilizes from the signals developed on our own properties to target and deliver ads with the launch and decipher plus we will now be offering our advertisers and agencies the ability to increase thereby by using our targeting off platform.
Speaker Change: We believe this will provide additional value and utility to advertisers. While also opening up new budgets for <unk>. We're ramping this up steadily and believe it can be a large and attractive business on the monetization side of the equation. There are three core elements continuing to be best in class on premium direct sales and that's all about performance.
Speaker Change: Service et cetera for our advertisers the second is improve and continue to broaden our programmatic efforts to take advantage of the auction market.
Speaker Change: And then continue to innovate and lead the market on performance marketing, we felt great about the last quarter with 22% growth keep chugging.
Speaker Change: Thus drive as much traffic and grow revenue per session in terms of.
Speaker Change: Higher growth rates that you asked about our guide is 10% plus digital revenue growth this year and going forward, but we believe in the power of our platform.
Speaker Change: Any incremental growth opportunities. It provides so we will keep pushing.
Speaker Change: Thank you Jason Operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. Our next question today comes from James.
James: Jefferies. Please go ahead.
Speaker Change: Great. Thanks, guys can you break down the results at <unk> Dot Com is there any additional detail you can get.
Speaker Change: <unk> results between enterprise and consumer and what you expect going forward in a nice kind of a follow up question.
Speaker Change: Okay, Yes.
Speaker Change: So we broke out carries its own segment. This quarter. This is a business. We bought in 2020 and have spent a lot of time and energy.
Speaker Change: Rebuilding the platform.
Speaker Change: And advancing it and we will talk about our further efforts. There. There is two main business lines, it's consumer business, where individuals and families directly subscribed to care dot com to be matched with caregivers and find home care and then its enterprise business where companies pay care to provide.
Speaker Change: Benefits to their employees the company's can purchase backup care days that employees can use to get emergency care for their child or senior if needed. They can access specialists to help support different care different needs at home with their family and they can also pay for their employees to have full access to the care Dot com.
Place the last few years at care have seen ups and downs driven by Covid, then followed by post pandemic adjustment the enterprise business experienced a major boost during the pandemic as companies sought to help employees manage care needs with differing work arrangements and get them back in the.
Speaker Change: The office that leveled out post pandemic right now the enterprise business has a nice tailwind behind it.
Speaker Change: As employer provided support for care needs is increasingly becoming a standard benefit sort of table Stakes in some ways similar to health insurance. The enterprise line grew last year and should continue to be a solid performer going forward.
Speaker Change: We're one of the real leaders in that category on the consumer side, we saw greater macro tailwind into 'twenty two period than we realized and it frankly mass some deficiencies in the core product experience consumer declined last year as we lap challenging comps.
Speaker Change: Struggled on marketing and the product lagged on conversion and renewals new CEO, Brad Wilson and his team have been actively working to improve the product and focused on areas like messaging and matching and we believe the impacts will be seen throughout this year it'll be a slow return to growth given the subscription.
Speaker Change: And the nature of ramping back up in reversing trends, but we love care Dot coms positioning as the industry leader with the most care seekers and caregivers in the market. We also know that consumer demand is there. The company recently released its annual state of the industry report and the challenges of finding good child in senior care are only growing.
Speaker Change: Are the costs, so with an improved experience and better marketing.
Speaker Change: We think the team can seize on that opportunity and returned to growth.
Speaker Change: And then James next question Yeah.
Speaker Change: Great just one quickly on the corporate costs, just curious what's driving that elevated level in 2025, and then how should we think about that on a normalized run rate going forward.
Speaker Change: Yes.
Speaker Change: We guided obviously, you're a much higher number this year, there's a number of nonrecurring things going on in corporate this year first or are associated with joey's separation from IAC and.
Speaker Change: Movement to Angi is six year consulting agreement will be recognized at the time of the angi spin all at once.
Speaker Change: <unk> costs associated with the angi spend tax legal filing et cetera.
Speaker Change: Additionally, we have legacy matters that are hitting the P&L. This year, such as ongoing litigation relating to the match group separation that will drive expenses. This year and then finally as I talked about.
Speaker Change: In the prior quarter.
Speaker Change: Have taken actions to streamline costs at corporate.
Speaker Change: And that's created onetime expenses this year.
Speaker Change: Flag when you look at 'twenty for the run rate costs were artificially masked in the reported number was lower due to a $10 million out of period insurance payment that we received in 2004. So in sum we are incurring roughly $50 million.
Speaker Change: Nonrecurring costs this year that will not be in the cost structure in 2006 and beyond.
And we will provide more clarity on that as we move forward.
Speaker Change: Thanks, James Operator next question.
Absolutely. Our next question today comes from Ross Sandler of Barclays. Please go ahead.
Ross Sandler: Great very thanks for hopping on the call here I guess a question for you is how involved do you want to be in the day to day at IAC and how do you feel about the management structure.
Ross Sandler: Pop with with Joey moving over to Angi, and then Chris just a follow up on the.
Ross Sandler: <unk>, four <unk> plus and <unk>.
Ross Sandler: Non owned and operated inventory could that be material in 'twenty, five and what kind of impact could that have on profitability.
Speaker Change: All right I'll start quickly I have great confidence in my colleagues.
Ross Sandler: In terms of the day to day.
Speaker Change: And Russell are both going to help me with that.
Ross Sandler: But we really have.
Ross Sandler: We have one operating business, which goes superb management does not need us day to day.
Ross Sandler: And.
Ross Sandler: Again I think this is a group that just by the nature of the changed at all of these things I think it was.
Ross Sandler: Is this a fresh and eager.
Ross Sandler: And I'm Gonna do what I've always thought hopefully stimulate the process drive people crazy and.
Ross Sandler: And and and.
Ross Sandler: And pay attention to the things that I think are important which obviously.
Ross Sandler: I mean, it's obviously too much today, I don't know why but whatever anyway obviously.
Ross Sandler: It involves capital allocation, and and and and and seeking out new opportunities.
Ross Sandler: Yes.
Ross Sandler: Thank you and then Ross decipher plus we're excited about.
Ross Sandler: We think it can be a powerful growth driver it really increases the company's access to two types of inventory that advertisers want. The first is look alike premium inventory in our core categories food health home, others, where we see consumer intent at scale, So dms off.
Ross Sandler: And limited by inventory and our own premium pricing on on highly performing inventory in these categories and we can do use decipher plus to identify similar performing inventory on those third party sites and by efficiently. This inventory today is being monetized on programmatic platform.
Ross Sandler: <unk> at lower rates.
Ross Sandler: Where current buyers lack the powerful intent driven signal that decipher provides to <unk>. The second set of inventory is undervalued, yet performing impressions in our categories.
Ross Sandler: So we have core advertisers, who were being priced out of <unk> inventory because of the performance and CPI is so high.
Ross Sandler: And they're looking for some lower price volume to be included in their buys we can do that and still have the decipher performance guarantee so think about it is as.
Ross Sandler: Aiding both elements of the price curve because of these factors. We believe we can substantially increase our supply of impressions and do it at attractive margins.
Ross Sandler: While providing our advertisers with exceptional performance, we're ramping this offering up across 25 selling it into accounts and believe it can grow rapidly on a revenue basis on the incremental margin point.
Ross Sandler: We said, we're targeting 40 plus.
Ross Sandler: Digital incremental EBITDA or adjusted EBITDA margins, we believe that strikes the right balance between investment in products and content on the one hand and profit growth on the other end.
Ross Sandler: And decipher plus we believe will be supportive of.
Ross Sandler: Of those types of incremental margins.
Ross Sandler: Thank you Ross operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. Our next question today comes from Justin Patterson with Keybanc. Please go ahead.
Justin Patterson: Great. Thank you good morning.
Justin Patterson: The hit on Jason's Dot Dash question, a different way what do you see it as a key steps to grow direct traffic more and eliminates the middleman and then as you execute on these initiatives how might the financial profile of the business differ versus what we see today. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Thanks, Thanks, Jason Justin.
Speaker Change: So the direct to consumer effort is one that Neil and team have been driving for awhile and it's an offensive plan.
Speaker Change: We know our brands are exceptional we know their trusted and we know they are sought after by consumers we.
Speaker Change: We've also talked for a few quarters about our efforts to expand our content to as many platforms as possible to engage our customers and to grow our touch points with consumers to be able to interact with it directly.
Speaker Change: Some of that has been through E mail marketing.
Speaker Change: Social.
Speaker Change: Media and also live events, which have worked very well from <unk>.
Speaker Change: Both engagement and monetization perspective.
Speaker Change: This year, we're looking to continue to invest in these areas and also rollout new products initially centered on people.
Speaker Change: And our industry, leading food brands to engage consumers directly and then further enhanced loyalty, which drives even deeper engagement and repeat engagement.
Speaker Change: These products, which will be providing more information as we go take advantage of video personalization utility and our breadth of content and storytelling and we think we're going to offer experiences in these categories that no one else has today with.
Speaker Change: With respect to financial impact.
Speaker Change: The monetization models are similar.
Speaker Change: And so we don't view them, well, we view them as advancing and not dilutive.
Speaker Change: To our to our overall financial efforts with EDM.
Speaker Change: Thanks, Jeff did you have another question.
Speaker Change: No that's it thank you.
Speaker Change: Okay. Thank you operator next question.
Speaker Change: Absolutely. Our next question comes from Youssef Squali with Securities. Please go ahead.
Speaker Change: Excellent. Thank you one question for Chris and one for Barry. Please so Chris back to decipher now that you've integrated open AI Tech and there can you maybe talk about the impact on Kpis that you've seen like version at pricing et cetera, and how much of that is left.
Speaker Change: In your view I'm not talking about the soccer plus just the soccer on the owned and operated and then Barry.
Speaker Change: I guess now that I know that.
Speaker Change: He is going to be spun off how do you see.
Speaker Change: <unk> and GM posted that does that compel you to want to do more in that category.
Speaker Change: Or how they're being a bunch of news coming out that at Gms I think other JV partner <unk> seems to have had some changes at the top so just how do you think about that opportunity.
Speaker Change: Now that.
Speaker Change: You seem to have gotten some flexibility in your corporate structure. Thank you.
Peter: Peter you want to go first.
Peter: Yes sure.
Peter: What I've said before which is I think MGM is in excellent shape excellent operating results.
Peter: And superb management team.
Peter: Yes.
Peter: MGM is going to continue to.
Peter: Opportunistically.
Peter: Certainly it's been buying bracket sockets.
Peter: Do so knowing how undervalued what it is which will increase our ownership we may increase our ownership as I said before I consider it to be a four ever asset.
Peter: Conducive of course, possibly could change I can't fathom that.
Peter: And I think it's in.
Peter: Is it.
Peter: I also said earlier.
Peter: Uh huh.
Peter: I think we'll see it.
Peter: Something that is.
Peter: Somewhat less complex going forward.
Peter: But.
Peter: Hi.
Peter: I just think it's.
Peter: It's ours is ever going away.
Speaker Change: Thank you Abby and then you said with respect to decipher.
Speaker Change: We've talked before about the case studies.
Speaker Change: That we've executed with.
Speaker Change: Our advertisers and we have over 30 case studies that.
Speaker Change: Prove it out what's interesting is we.
Speaker Change: We target or optimize different metrics.
Speaker Change: Based on what the advertisers' goals are in the given campaign and as you know decipher today is all premium.
Speaker Change: Direct campaigns.
Speaker Change: So for some for some advertisers thats click through for others its efficiency for others, it's actually sales conversion and then some.
Speaker Change: In store visits we have.
Speaker Change: We are quite confident we've outperformed in all of these case studies.
Speaker Change: And then blow away non cookie based solutions, we've seen the we talked about this last quarter that.
Speaker Change: Campaigns that orders that include decipher.
Speaker Change: Our over provide over half of the direct digital revenue and EDM that trends continued as has we said last quarter that.
Speaker Change: Orders with decipher are over 50% larger than orders without decipher.
Speaker Change: And that trend will continue.
Speaker Change: It is an important feature in an overall direct advertising campaign. We also are thrilled that being able to integrate open AI technology, we can.
Speaker Change: Utilize video and images in our targeting and our scoring for even better contextual perf.
Performance and we expect to continue in advance that Youssef on your question on that MGM is going out the <unk>.
Speaker Change: You saw the announcements from bet MGM.
Speaker Change: Two ago, nice really nice momentum in the business. The things we were talking about on the product side for a while they talked about how that has materialized into the business.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: MGM and bet MGM bodes very great relationship with <unk>, both at the CEO and the chair chair person level is so David So we wouldn't expect anything to change there.
Speaker Change: Thank you.
Speaker Change: Operator next question.
Speaker Change: Our next question today comes from Nick Jones at citizens A&P. Please go ahead.
Nick Jones: Great. Thanks for taking the question I guess, just a couple on.
Nick Jones: Learnings from AI.
Nick Jones: And is focused on kind of improving our questioning and matching.
Nick Jones: And then touch on five there is an increased focus on kind of a gentle AI.
Speaker Change: You think about the kind of A&D playbook going forward is that going to play a role in kind of improving matching and I guess the same question for care Dot com.
Nick Jones: Yes, I'll start.
Nick Jones: Our view is yes on improving matching which Jeff talked about that a little bit in his letter I think I've said for a while and we're not sure whether this happens or not but is it for a while one of them.
Speaker Change: Best thing that could happen to Angie Angie user interface would be if consumers adopt.
Nick Jones: Conversational UI.
Nick Jones: Obviously theyre doing that it is two <unk>.
Nick Jones: We're a significant extent with chat GPT in similar but that's.
Nick Jones: That's the ideal UI for us to get.
Nick Jones: The right information from consumers about a job and of course, the better information, we get about a job the better matching we can do and then on top of that AI is better technology for four.
Nick Jones: Sorting data to allow for better matching but if we can get that conversational UI adopted broadly and consumers are comfortable with that I think that that is.
Nick Jones: Net very positive for angi and the user experience there yeah, I would just say effectively that.
Nick Jones: That becomes agenda.
Nick Jones: Where we're effectively serving aviation we're matching with the pro and so that's where we see this going as we leverage those tools and technology.
Nick Jones: And Nick I would just say broadly across the portfolio. We said this for a while.
Nick Jones: Where you have proprietary datasets.
Nick Jones: The application of AI optimization and analysis.
Nick Jones: You will have it will enhance things like matching on our marketplaces be at Angi care Vivian elsewhere.
Nick Jones: And we are seeing those those applications and then secondly, onboarding sign ups service request generation nurse.
Nick Jones: Information it Vivian.
Nick Jones: All of these these open information entry activities as well as classic customer service functions, you can see where the puck is going.
Nick Jones: Due to the AI.
Nick Jones: Opportunities.
Nick Jones: And do you have another question.
Operator last question.
Speaker Change: And our last question today comes from Tom Champion with Piper Sandler. Please go ahead.
Tom Champion: Hi, good morning, Thanks for all the candor and the.
Speaker Change: The comments I guess.
Speaker Change: Chris I'd love to hear a little bit more about.
Speaker Change: The verticals within DDS, and just maybe the trends that unfolded in <unk> and what youre seeing thus far.
Speaker Change: An interesting comment on.
Speaker Change: Digital AD revenue, taking place via spend commitments and maybe that portion overlaps with decipher.
Speaker Change: And so with with decipher seemingly growing well.
Speaker Change: Kind of curious if you have more revenue visibility.
Speaker Change: Hopefully that makes sense, maybe just a final question for Joe if I can.
Speaker Change: Joey I think you ran the search business way back when and.
Speaker Change: I'd just be curious as you have observed open AI and search evolve.
Speaker Change: Think about the future of search broadly thank you.
Speaker Change: Oh, that's a big one it's a big one.
Speaker Change: Then just just wanted to let slip in there Tom.
Chris: First Chris Yes, why not.
Speaker Change: The answer to that question, yes, that's fine.
Chris: Point, you had it and then we can go to the big concepts.
Tom Champion: So Tom a few things.
Tom Champion: We describe the AD market as fine right now.
Tom Champion: We definitely saw the momentum pick back up after the.
Tom Champion: After the political freeze.
Tom Champion: People broadly or so advertisers agencies broadly I think we'd say are our more.
Tom Champion: Short term and their commitments move quickly, but they've got things to sell and brands to build and we're seeing that.
Tom Champion: Across categories No no major.
Tom Champion: The.
Tom Champion: Trends that we would note from the past, we've got clearly health home.
Tom Champion: The food and beverage.
Tom Champion: Finance others.
Tom Champion: We'd love to see some some momentum returned in finance over time.
Tom Champion: <unk>.
Tom Champion: Health is fine.
Tom Champion: And we will continue to monitor how the economy grows.
Speaker Change: Decipher plays in the in the direct premium Advair.
Speaker Change: Advanced cell area, our goal is to roll it into more through product enhancements into.
Speaker Change: More.
Speaker Change: On demand.
Speaker Change: AD buying and Thats something that the team is working on.
Speaker Change: And be able to serve advertisers in both places so we are.
Speaker Change: Constructive on the current ad market.
Speaker Change: But cautious as always given the geopolitical volatility and everything that has been a hallmark of the last few years.
Speaker Change: Yes, so I'll answer a little bit anecdotally and.
Speaker Change: And then maybe broader but.
Speaker Change: As I.
Speaker Change: Start.
Speaker Change: <unk> is now and as many people I know start searches now and increasing share is certainly going to.
Speaker Change: The AI platforms.
Speaker Change: And that's because it's a good efficient experience and I expect that experience to continue to gain share.
Speaker Change: It's a meaningful evolution from the 10 blue links and we've been looking for that meaningful evolution to the ton bluelinx for a long time and I think that is.
Speaker Change: Profound advancement I think that one of the keys in that is those user interfaces whether there.
Speaker Change: Voice or or sort of a.
Speaker Change: AI conversation I think that we're used to.
Speaker Change: <unk> have space for fewer answers and that.
Speaker Change: That means that what's it going to be important there and we think about that in the context of of IAC in DDS and in the context of care and in the context of Angi is you got to be the best in the category with the best content and for those I think you're in a very good position and if you're.
Speaker Change: You're you're further into the tail I think that's a much harder position and and so I think that these models are this all ends and those user interfaces continue to take share for awhile, and then sort of concentrate audience around the very best in the in a more meaningful way.
Speaker Change: Yes.
Speaker Change: Yes.
Speaker Change: Thank you. Thank you Tom Thank you operator and everyone. Thank you all for.
Speaker Change: A decade or more of these and.
Speaker Change: Good luck from here. Thank you.
Speaker Change: You've been an honor.
Speaker Change: Thank you. This concludes today's conference call. We thank you all for attending today's presentation. You may now disconnect your lines and have a wonderful day.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Speaker Change: [music].
Speaker Change: Hum.