Q4 2024 Ampco-Pittsburgh Corp Earnings Call
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Good morning everyone, and welcome to the Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation 4th quarter 2024, and as a result, it's conference call.
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Speaker Change: At this time I'd like to turn the floor over to Kim Knox, Corporate Secretary. Please go ahead.
Kim Knox: Thank you, Jamie, and good morning to everyone joining us on today's fourth quarter of 2024 conference call. Joining me today are Brett Nick Barrier, our Chief Executive Officer, and Mike McAuley, Senior Vice President, Chief Financial Officer and Treasurer.
Speaker Change: Also joining us on the call today are Sam Lyon, President of the Indian Electric Steel Corporation, and Dave Anderson, President of Air and Liquid Systems Corporation in collaboration.
Speaker Change: Before we begin, I would like to remind everyone that participants on this call may make statements or comments that are forward looking and may include financial projections or other statements of the corporations, plans, objectives, expectations or intentions.
Speaker Change: These matters involve certain risks and uncertainties, many of which are outside the corporation's control.
Speaker Change: The corporation's actual results may differ significantly from those projected or suggested in any forward looking statements.
Speaker Change: Due to various risk factors, including those discussed in the Corporation's Q4 2024 Ernie's press release, the most recently filed for M10K, and in subsequent filings with the Securities and Exchange Commission.
Speaker Change: We do not undertake any application to update or otherwise release publicly any revision to our forward looking statements.
Speaker Change: With that, I would like to turn the call over to Brett McAuley, Ampco-Pittsburgh CEO , Brett. Thank you. Thank you, Kim. Good morning and thank you for joining our call.
Brett Mcbrayer: As reported in our most recent press release, Ampco-Pittsburgh Corporation reported earnings for common share of 16 cents for the fourth quarter of 2024 and two cents for the full year.
Brett Mcbrayer: Our net cash flow from operating activities was $7.5 million for the fourth quarter, and $18 million for 2024.
Brett Mcbrayer: Income from Operations for 2024 was 12.2 million, which includes a 4.1 million non-cash as bestest related benefit.
Brett Mcbrayer: On a non-GAAP basis, we achieved the adjusted income from operations of eight men for the
Brett Mcbrayer: These results reflect a $3.7 million improvement from the prior year with lower revenues in 2024.
Brett Mcbrayer: For the air and liquid processing segment, we achieved record sales for 2024, improving 11% from the prior year, and we also had a great fourth quarter.
Brett Mcbrayer: Our Forest and Cast Engineer product segment achieved income from operations of $1.1 million in the fourth quarter of 2024 and $10.5 million for the full year.
Brett Mcbrayer: These results reflect a 38% improvement from 2023 despite lower cells.
Brett Mcbrayer: It is important to note that 2024 only reflects a partial year benefit from our newly installed equipment in our U.S. forged operations.
Brett Mcbrayer: Additionally, we've entered into a formal collective consultation process with our workforce in the UK.
Brett Mcbrayer: This location is weighed negatively on a results for several years addressing this deficiency would positively impact annual operating income by at least $5 million annually.
Brett Mcbrayer: For further details regarding our segment performance, I'll now turn the call over to David Anderson, President of Air and Liquid Systems.
Thank you, Brett. Good morning.
Brett Mcbrayer: Aaron Liquid's Q4 was not only the best quarter in 2024, it was also one of Aaron Liquid's best quarters in our history [inaudible]
Brett Mcbrayer: Operating income in Q4 was $7.6 million versus a loss of $38.5 million in the prior quarter, prior year.
Brett Mcbrayer: Eliminating asbestos-related credits and charges, Q4 operating income would be 3.5 million versus 2.5 million in the prior year.
Brett Mcbrayer: The Q4 improvement was driven by higher revenue, positive product mix, and improved efficiencies.
Brett Mcbrayer: Year-to-date operating income was 15.9 million versus the loss of 29.1 million prior year.
Brett Mcbrayer: The major variance versus prior year was the asbestos credit versus the prior year charge which improved by 44.9 million year-on-year [inaudible]
Brett Mcbrayer: Looking at 2024 by quarter shows that Q1 was Aaron Liquid's weakest quarter, and we continually improved as the year progressed, culminating in Aaron Liquid's best quarter in Q4.
Speaker Change: As I mentioned on the last earnings call, Aaron Liquid was approved by the US Navy to receive $4 million of additional funding to purchase more equipment for a Buffalo facility. This is in addition to the $1.6 million in equipment that we installed in Q3 of 2024.
Speaker Change: This funding will be used to further modernize the equipment in our Buffalo facility.
Speaker Change: The equipment is now on order and is expected to arrive in late 2025.
Speaker Change: The U.S. Navy continues to move forward with long-term plans to expand the size of the Navy fleet. The modernization of our plant will allow us to meet this increasing demand.
Speaker Change: We continue to see positive activity in the nuclear market for our heat exchanger product line, including the announcements to reopen two decommissioned US nuclear plants and the ongoing development of the small modular reactors.
Speaker Change: From record orders received in the pharmaceutical market for air handling equipment to the increasing activity in both the nuclear and military markets, man for our custom engineered products continues to be very strong.
Speaker Change: Three years ago we began to execute our new plans to turn Aaron Liquid into a growth-oriented business.
Speaker Change: As we ended our third year of this plan, I wanted to provide a comparison versus three years ago [inaudible]
For 2024, revenue was 56% higher than three years ago.
Speaker Change: Our year end backlog was 77% higher than three years ago and our operating income excluding asbestos-related items was 39% higher than three years ago.
Speaker Change: Operating income excluding asbestos items has been a record high for the last two years and we set new revenue records in both 2023 and 2024.
Speaker Change: Thank you, David. Sam Lyon, President of Force and Cast, Engineer, Product Segment will now share more details regarding his group's performance. Sam.
Thank you, Brett, and good morning.
Sam Lyon: For the fourth quarter of 2024, the Forge and Cast Engineer Product Segment reported total net sales of $66.5 million compared to $75.8 million in Q4 of 2023.
Sam Lyon: Segment operating income improved to 1.1 million to the fourth quarter up from break even in the prior year period primarily driven by improved profitability in our forged product lines.
Sam Lyon: Weaker volumes and the western cast plants mostly offset the increase in our forage product line profitability.
Sam Lyon: As a result of these continuing pressures on the cast side of the business, specifically underutilization due to market over capacity.
Sam Lyon: High energy costs and increased pressure from low priced imports. We've initiated a formal collective consultation process with the employees at our UK plant.
Brett Mcbrayer: As Brett mentioned, we've experienced losses of over $5 million in the UK in the prior two years and do not see much improvement as we look forward.
Brett Mcbrayer: We expect this collective consultation process to yield a clear path forward within the next six to eight weeks significantly stemming the losses currently experienced at that location.
Speaker Change: Full year 2024 operating income for the Forrest and Cast Engineer Product Segment.
Speaker Change: reached $10.5 million compared to $7.6 million in 2023 reflecting significant year-over-year improvement driven by strong operational performance and strategic pricing initiatives.
Speaker Change: Turning briefly to broader market conditions are two largest markets for roles North America get in your pre-manage table. [inaudible]
Speaker Change: Europe continues to experience market softness, although we are seeing some positive signs in hotmail activities [inaudible]
Speaker Change: We closely monitor the evolving terror situation, anticipating minimal direct impact but potential indirect effects through changing demand dynamics involving customers in Canada and Mexico.
Speaker Change: Overall, if the tariffs are implemented, we expect increased demand in the US, slightly offset by lower demand in Mexico and staple demand in Europe for our role business.
Speaker Change: For our FEP business, we expect increased demand as many of our largest competitors are outside the US. We are already seeing an improved order book for our FEP products in anticipation of the tariffs.
Speaker Change: General Market Sediment in North America is generally bullish for 2025 with some of our major customers expecting improved volumes, which will ultimately result in higher future roll demand.
Speaker Change: In summary, our strategic initiatives continue to position us well for continued profitability and sustainable long-term performance improvement.
Speaker Change: I will turn the call back over to Brett. Thanks Sam. I will now turn the call over to Mike McCauley, our Chief Financial Officer for more details regarding our financial performance for the quarter near Mike.
Thank you, Brett.
Speaker Change: Ampco expects to issue its 2024 Form 10K early next week on or around March 17th. You will find more details there very soon.
Speaker Change: As indicated in our press release, issued last night on the quarter and full year, Ampco's consolidated net sales for the fourth quarter of 2024 were $100.9 million, a decline of 6.6% compared to net sales for the fourth quarter of 2023.
Do primarily to lower shift and volumes of mill rolls.
Speaker Change: which could not be offset by the higher shipments in the air and local processing segment.
Speaker Change: For a full year 2024, consolidated net sales declined 1% as record error in liquid processing segment sales and higher net pricing in the forest and gas engineering engineering processing
Speaker Change: non-GAAP adjusted income from operations of $1 million and $8 million for the three in 12 months ended December 31, 2024, respectively, improved from the prior year periods, despite the lower mill roll demand.
Speaker Change: This was due to higher role pricing, net-of-cost changes which move surcharges down, as well as improved operational efficiencies and better manufacturing cost absorption.
In terms of gap-reported results,
Speaker Change: There were some unusual items affecting comparability and I'd like to review those now.
Speaker Change: First, at the end of 2024, we completed an updated revaluation of our long-term as best-est-related liabilities and insurance receivables.
Speaker Change: The net result of this was a credit recorded in Q4 2024, a $4.1 million. Part of which related to lower projected indented liability, but most of which related to lower projected defense costs.
Speaker Change: Both effects are net of associated changes in the asbestos insurance receivables.
Speaker Change: This compares to net charge of $40.9 million for his best-est related revaluation of indemnity and defense estimates in Q4 of 2023. Again, net have associated his best-os insurance.
Speaker Change: Another significant item affecting comparability is that in the 12-month period ended December 31st, 2023, we received and recorded $1.9 million for a reimbursement of past energy costs from the local government of one of our foreign subsidiaries.
Speaker Change: Corporations total selling administrative expenses increased for 2024 compared to 2023. Primarily due to higher employee related expense, higher sales commissions expense in their unlikely processing, and due to higher professional fees in corporate.
Speaker Change: Appreciation and amortization expense rose primarily due to the completion of the US Sports Businesses' Capital Equipment Modernization Program.
Speaker Change: Interest expense for the three and twelve months ended December 31, 2024, increased in comparison to the same periods of the prior year, primarily due to higher equipment financing debt balance.
Speaker Change: Higher average revolving credit facility borrowings and higher average interest rates. But it should be noted, however, that the corporation's total debt balance of 128.6 million at December 31, 2024 was flat with prior year.
Other income net for Q4 versus prior year.
Speaker Change: Increased, primarily due to favorable changes in foreign exchange but was about flat for the full year.
Speaker Change: The income tax provision was higher for the three and twelve month ended December 31, 2024, primarily due to the establishment of a valuation allowance on the net-deferred tax assets of our UK operations at December 31, 2023, given its three-year cumulative loss history.
Due to Continued Softcast Roll Demand [inaudible]
Speaker Change: As a result, the income tax provision in 2024 does not include any income tax benefit on the operating losses of the UK.
Speaker Change: It's also noteworthy that the income tax provision for the three and twelve months ended December 31, 2023 included an approximate $1.3 million benefit associated with the charge for his bestos-related costs last year.
Speaker Change: That income attributable to Ampco-Pittsburgh for the three and twelve months ended December 31st, 2024 was $3.1 million or $16 cents per common share and $0.4 million or $2 cents per common share respectively.
for the fourth quarter [inaudible]
Speaker Change: This compares to net loss attributable Ampco-Pittsburgh of a $41.8 million or $2.12 per share and $39.9 million or $2.4 per share respectively.
Speaker Change: which include approximately $2 per share and $2.02 per share respectively for the after-tax impact of the charge for as best as related costs.
Speaker Change: Please note that in addition, full year 2023 EPS benefited by approximately 10 cents per share for the foreign energy credit.
Speaker Change: Total backlog at December 31st, 2024 of $378.9 million was flat with December 31st, 2023.
Speaker Change: Net cash flows provided by operating activities was $18 million for full year 2024, which bears to a use of $3.7 million for full year 2023.
Speaker Change: The primary change factor was a reduction in trade working capital, which was a use in 2023, but a source in 2024.
Speaker Change: In addition, we had lower outflows for his bestest litigation in 2024, and customer deposits rose in 2024 compared to 2023.
Speaker Change: Capital expenditures for full year 24 ended at $12.2 million and includes final capitalization of the U.S. Ford's plant modernization capex from earlier in the year.
Speaker Change: However, this does not reflect government grant funding received during 2024 of $3.3 million which was and will be used to fund CAPEX machinery and air in the good processing.
Speaker Change: So netting the two brings the number down closer to what we had been guiding on previous calls for 2024 full year CapEx net of that grant funding
Speaker Change: At December 31, 2024, the corporation's liquidity position included cash on hand of $15.4 million and undrawn availability on our revolving credit facility of $20.6 million.
Thank you.
Speaker Change: Operator, at this time we would now like to open the line for questions
John Bair, John Bair, John Bair, John Bair,
Speaker Change: Ladies and gentlemen, at this time we'll begin that question and answer session. Ask a question, you may press star and then one using a touchstone telephone.
To withdraw your questions, you may press star in two [inaudible]
Speaker Change: If you are using a speaker phone, we do ask the police pick up the handset prior to pressing the keys to ensure the best sound quality.
Speaker Change: Once again, that is star and then one to join the question queue.
We'll pause momentarily to assemble the roster.
We...
Speaker Change: We have a question from John Bair, from Ascend Wealth Advisors. Please go ahead with your question.
Thank you for taking my question. A couple actually.
Speaker Change: You're referring to the UK situation. Can you clarify what kind of what your game plan is there? Are you just looking to?
Speaker Change: Um, reduce the workforce or operations in general, are you considering exiting that operation? And secondly, given
What we're hearing about European spending, perhaps going up...
Speaker Change: Particularly in Germany, I don't know how much of that operation supplies into Europe or not, but could that possibly improve your outlook for the operations of that plant?
Speaker Change: Thank you. Yeah, hi John , this is Sam Lyon. First of all, over the last three years really we've had significant losses in the UK and it's gotten to the point where
Speaker Change: Without some intervention or help, we don't see a sustainable path forward.
Speaker Change: So the formal process in the UK is to enter collective consultation, consultation which we have done.
Speaker Change: which allows the workforce as well as the local governments and governments of UK to decide how
Speaker Change: and if they can help us to stem these losses as we don't see normal market conditions such as you're mentioning in Germany significantly affecting the path forward for this operation.
Speaker Change: So that process takes several months once that's completed a conclusion will be rendered which could be anything from getting enough
Speaker Change: Support for new equipment, deal tax breaks, things like that that the normal government could do to help us to if they can't help us and the union can't see a path forward to stem the losses or return them to break even.
Could result in the complete closure of the plant.
Speaker Change: Okay, would that also, you say closure of the plant, but would you, if you got to that point where
Speaker Change: You weren't getting the government help or assistance or whatever that you would look to sell that facility and that operation to another player by any chance or would it just be shut down and write off.
All options are available, frankly. So anywhere from...
Speaker Change: You know, exactly what you mentioned will be available as well. Now one thing I will say is the the role market in general in Europe is is oversupplied, which is part of the issue, which I mentioned in my call. Secondly,
The cost of energy per role is about...
Speaker Change: Roughly double what it is in our Sweden plant. So there's some fairly significant headwinds in that particular that particular plant.
Speaker Change: Okay, very good. And then turning there and look with division.
Speaker Change: You indicated that you've got pretty good strong order of trends and so forth. Do you feel that there's additional markets that you can enter into, or do you just think this?
Speaker Change: Market in general is expanding, perhaps because of getting more exposure to the Navy program.
and other nuclear activities.
Hi John , it's Dave, it's kind of both.
Speaker Change: We are seeing within our current markets more activity, the Navy certainly has embarked on a long-term plan to expand the size of the fleet, so there's continued activity there.
Speaker Change: The nuclear market really were seeing a lot of activity from different ways to achieve that power, the small modular reactors to
Speaker Change: bringing back facilities that have been closed down. So within the current markets there's a lot of opportunities and then the opportunity to
Speaker Change: Moore, outside of North America is also there for us. I think we're going to see the nuclear market in particular being embraced in a lot of areas as well.
Speaker Change: So I think there'll be some of our ability to expand beyond our traditional North American market as well.
Yeah, okay, that's good. And then the last question is, which, um,
Speaker Change: You said your debt levels were basically flat year-over-year with your CAPEX.
Speaker Change: in Equipment, Renewal and so forth pretty well. I'm assuming pretty well behind you then. Do you think that you can?
Address to that level and bring them down to more
Either eliminated, or more comfortable letters levels.
Speaker Change: Yeah, I think, you know, we have, the equipment financing is term debt.
Speaker Change: We have some, and if you look at what the composition of our debt balance [inaudible]
Speaker Change: We have some longer term structures in there, but the revolving credit facility is the place where we have, you know, that can go up and down with business activity.
Speaker Change: and I think what we'll see going forward, a lot of it depends on demand and supporting the business working capital needs. So I think working capital is one of the biggest drivers for you know, being able to
changed the outstanding on the credit line.
Speaker Change: If the man goes up, it's going to be hard to reduce the-
Speaker Change: The debt, the variable debt, and if demand comes down, it, it, it...
Speaker Change: It's bad for the income statement, of course, but it's it's good for liquidity. It it it means liquidated working capital and
Speaker Change: Reducing borrowings as that happens and in you know liquidity and the balance, she's start to look better .
Speaker Change: So those are the variables that stay here and then we've got to be thinking about whatever happens we need some contingency planning for whatever the outcome is in the UK because there's cost to manage things like that but
Speaker Change: But I think the main variable is his working capital and where where demand goes from here for you know the next couple years as we look forward.
Speaker Change: One thing we've been doing to to keep the death flat is and yet
In continued to invest is some of the things that
Speaker Change: We've done an error in liquid, for example, with available grants to kind of deep bottleneck the supply chain that we've been taking advantage of to fund our cat backs without with with government grant funding. That's a good way to keep the debt flat.
and then-
Speaker Change: When you get customer orders, is there a certain amount or percentage or whatever of prepayment that helps with that?
Speaker Change: with the cash flow. It does, yeah. In fact, in 24, we saw more customer deposits.
Speaker Change: Coming in, then we did in the prior year and that's been a source of cash flow for 2024 and was part of the story for the cash from operating activities being as high as it was in 2024 and yeah, that's a focal effort for us.
Speaker Change: It's been a good source of liquidity, sure. Just to be clear, that's mainly on the ALS business. So very little enough, we're just going to get sent to your product business.
Speaker Change: Very good. Well, thank you for taking my questions. Good luck going forward.
Thank you.
Operator/Moderator: Our next question comes from David Wright from Henry Investment Trust. Please go ahead with your question.
Hey, good morning everyone.
David, David.
Speaker Change: Hey Mike, do you have a, do you have urine backlog by business segment?
Mike Mcauley: Yes, David, we do. And you're going to see this in the 10K coming out on Monday, but I did say that the pack log was flat with 2023, 2023, 379 total.
Mike Mcauley: 2024 being flat, it's $379,231.24, the composition of which is Fortune Cast Engineered Products $250.5 million.
and Aaron the Good Processing 128.4 million.
Mike Mcauley: Okay, thank you. The asbestos I'm going to call them re-valuations.
Speaker Change: They were getting done every two years and now you've done them a couple years in a row. Is that a change? Is it going to be an annual thing going forward?
Mike Mcauley: I think we I think yes I think you know won't we though I thought only the one we did last year I think it had been maybe three years since we had previously done one
Mike Mcauley: And we learn from that, that, you know, that as trends change, you know, it's probably better to just do the manually.
Mike Mcauley: to try to stay on top of incremental changes as they come and go. So it's more likely that we will probably increase the free, you know, maintain the frequency at a regular annual pace probably.
Yeah.
Okay. Damn, you said that, um,
Speaker Change: Good news, the tariffs you didn't see as much of a concern. I had a couple of questions there.
Mike Mcauley: Thinking about tier of slas time around, are mill roles, terrifying items, or do you get exclusion sometimes?
They're classified as a component of a rowing mill [inaudible]
Mike Mcauley: Also, as things stand now, you can bring rolls in from Europe to the US and there's no tariff on them.
Speaker Change: That's correct. Oh, great. Okay. Well, good. That's the end of the question, then. Really good year-end level of detail, breath. Thanks for the time you and the team put into preparing for the call.
Thank you, David.
[inaudible]
Speaker Change: Once again, if you would like to ask a question, please press star in one. Our next question comes from Dennis, Dennis Scannell from Rudevega Capital. Please go ahead with your question.
Yes, great. Good morning.
Speaker Change: A couple of things for me, to circle back to the UK plant.
Speaker Change: I'm kind of curious, what kind of roles are they making, you know, cast or forge, or they are they large diameter or small and you know, is it is that capacity that you're just going to walk away from or can you replace it with your existing facilities and then I've got a few other kind of faults.
Speaker Change: Yeah, Dennis, this is Sam, so it's a cast-roll facility, which primarily serves.
Two product lines, Hot Mill, Work Rules. [inaudible]
We make...
Speaker Change: Yeah, anywhere from 100 to 130 of those a year.
Speaker Change: and then the higher volume rolls are the work rolls, spun cast rolls. The spun cast rolls, a high percentage of those can be absorbed.
Speaker Change: If we get to the point where we need to close, it can be absorbed into our Sweden facility.
Speaker Change: Static cast backups, the majority of those are probably 70% of those would go away 30% or so we could potentially convert to forged backup rules.
Okay.
Speaker Change: Okay, interesting. And just out of curiosity, have you had discussions with customers on say the at least the portions, you know, those that 30% that you probably couldn't absorb any concern about.
Speaker Change: Customer Relations, or are they are they are they concerned at all about their their ability to meet their needs from other suppliers?
Speaker Change: You know, it's a mixed bag. We're having this conversations now because it's a public process when you go through this collective consultation process and we are starting to have discussions with customers on 2026 business.
Speaker Change: So most of them are saying just keep us informed of what's going on and as soon as you know something please let us know and most of our customers have
multiple, multiple suppliers, [inaudible]
Thank you.
Speaker Change: So we're just trying to be as transparent and as clear as we can be so that we don't have the problem that you're talking about to adversely affect our customers.
Speaker Change: Yeah, got it. Okay, and then just want the, you know, the comparison to Sweden is really striking in terms of the the costs are about double
Speaker Change: Relative to what you're able to achieve in Sweden, and so is that is that is that due to labor energy costs? Or you know that the equipment is ex-annigated? I mean any anything that you can point to specifically that makes it so on an economic?
What's specifically the energy? What's the double? Not...
Speaker Change: Not even sometimes it's even more and we track it on a monthly basis and the main issue is that the UK is a net importer of energy and over the years you know a lot of Europe went away from their cool fire power plants they
Speaker Change: Gut rid of their natural gas storage and we're very, very reliant many of them on Russia.
Speaker Change: and the Pipelines and Sweden is a energy exporter and has a lot of hydro-nuclear .
Speaker Change: and other methods so it varies by month but you know it's several thousand dollars a rule difference just in energy cost.
Speaker Change: God, I just was understood so that it's the double not the total cost, okay, yeah, correct, correct.
Speaker Change: So, and then looking at your North American business, can you guys talk about, you know, at least, you know, on the role side percentage of your the roles that are shipped to Canada versus in the US and versus Mexico? Just kind of curious whether that's kind of how that mix works out.
Yeah, we're roughly 50s.
Speaker Change: Like we're 55% typically domestic or North America and 45% Europe and others. The total business
Speaker Change: in the U.S. I'm sorry, the total business overall cast and forged that we ship to Canada
Ranged from...
Roughly 4 million to 10 million from 22 to 24 [inaudible]
Speaker Change: and 13 to 15 in Mexico. So the total is about $25 million total business shipped to Mexico and Canada for our business. If you give me one second.
Speaker Change: I can look up the boards versus cast, I have that information handy here.
Here we go.
So, on the fourth side, [inaudible]
Pinto, Canada, [inaudible]
Speaker Change: Roughly, it was roughly about $5 million, and then in the Mexico on the four side.
Speaker Change: Roughly anywhere from $7 to $10 million, Tony, I'm being one of our larger customers in Canada, and then just to keep in the perspective, I don't have the Mexico numbers, but Canada ships.
Speaker Change: Roughly 6 million tons into the US out of a total demand of about 120 million tons and then US shipped 3 million back so it's not a big number Mexico would be a little larger. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yes, right, right. Okay. Good. Now that's helpful, helpful color. And then let's see, I think we said 12 million was spent in total on cat-backs and I'm amiss this, but Mike, did you talk about what what our plan is for 2025?
Speaker Change: thank everyone so much. Thank you. Bye-bye. Thank you. Bye-bye. Bye. Thank you. Goodbye. Goodbye. Goodbye. Goodbye. Our 2025 Capex. Yeah.
Speaker Change: Dennis, it's not going to be too different, but we do have some grant funding coming to help mitigate that down, so it's going to be kind of flatish.
Speaker Change: Yes, that's good, that's good. So I would say, again, I would echo the previous scholars comment about a nice detailed report.
Speaker Change: But I have to say, and maybe this is the analyst in me, it's really helpful to get the 10K beforehand. You actually have a lot of data on orders and backlogs by product line in there that...
Speaker Change: Again, it's really nice to be able to review before these calls. So I'm just speaking for myself, I would say the call is all
Speaker Change: Always more valuable to me after I've had a chance to go through either your 10k or 10k.
Speaker Change: I'd rather wait until Monday after I've had a chance to have reviewed it to listen to your conference call. Instead, I'll probably be scheduling a call with Mike next week to follow up on some other stuff, but so that's just one editorial comment, but it does look like nice trends and look forward to it to a strong 2025. Thank you.
Thanks, Dennis. Thank you.
Speaker Change: and ladies and gentlemen at this time in showing additional questions I'd like to turn the floor back over to
Brett Mcbrayer: Thank you. I want to recognize the positive improvements made by our employees in 2024.
Brett Mcbrayer: Thank you for your hard work and focus on continuous improvement. Also want to thank our shareholders and boarded directors for your continued support.
Brett Mcbrayer: Although I am encouraged by our progress, I remain dissatisfied with our results.
Brett Mcbrayer: We will continue to focus our full efforts to deliver significantly improved returns to our shareholders. Thanks again for joining our call.
Justin Bergner, John Blair, John Blair, John Blair, John Blair, John Blair, John
Brett Mcbrayer: Ladies and gentlemen, with that, we'll conclude today's conference call-in presentation. We do thank you for joining. You may now disconnect your lines.