Q1 2025 Monogram Technologies Inc Earnings Call and Business Update
Okay.
Okay.
Unknown Executive: Good afternoon, everyone, and welcome to the Monogram Technologies first quarter 2025 financial results and business update.
Good afternoon, everyone and welcome to the Monogram Technologies' first quarter 2025 financial results and business update conference call. A question and answer session will follow the formal presentation webcast viewers can submit written questions for the Q&A portion of this presentation. As a reminder, this conferences call is being recorded.
Unknown Executive: question-and-answer session will follow the formal presentation.
Unknown Executive: Webcast viewers can submit written questions for the Q&A portion of this presentation.
Unknown Executive: As a reminder, this conference's call is being recorded.
Unknown Executive: Before we begin the formal presentation, I would like to remind everyone that statements made on the call and webcast may include predictions, estimates, or other information that might be considered forward-looking. While these forward-looking statements represent our current judgment on what the future holds, they are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. You are cautioned not to place undue reliance on these forward-looking statements, which reflect our opinions only as of the date of this presentation.
Before we begin the formal presentation I would like to remind everyone that statements made on the call and webcast may include predictions estimates or other information that might be considered forward looking while these forward looking statements represent our current judgment on what the future holds they are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to <unk>.
Differ materially you are cautioned not to place undue reliance on these forward looking statements, which reflect our opinions only as of the date of this presentation. Please keep in mind that we are not obligating ourselves to revise or publicly release the results of any revision to these forward looking statements in light of new information or future events.
Unknown Executive: Please keep in mind that we are not obligating ourselves to revise or publicly release the results of any revision to these forward-looking statements in light of new information or future events. Throughout today's discussion, we will attempt to present some important factors relating to our business that may affect our predictions.
Throughout today's discussion we will attempt to present some important factors relating to our business that may affect our predictions you should also review our most recent Form 10-K and Form 10-Q for a more complete discussion of these factors and other risks, particularly under the heading risk factors a press release detailing these results was issued.
Unknown Executive: You should also review our most recent Form 10-K and Form 10-Q for a more complete discussion of these factors and other risks, particularly under the heading risk factors.
Unknown Executive: Press release detailing these results was issued today, May 14, 2025, and is available in the Investor Relations section of the company's website, monogramtechnologies.com.
They may 14th 2025 and is available in the Investor Relations section of the company's website monogram technologies Dot com.
Unknown Executive: Your hosts today, Ben Sexson, Chief Executive Officer, and Noel Knape, Chief Financial Officer, will present results of operations for the first quarter ended March 31, 2025.
Mike Graham: Our host today, Ben <unk>, Chief Executive Officer, and Noel cannot be Chief Financial Officer will present results of operations for the first quarter ended March 31, 2025 at this time I will turn the call over to Mike Graham Chief Financial Officer, Noel cannot be.
Noel Knape: At this time, I will turn the call over to Monogram Chief Financial Officer, Noel Knape. Good afternoon, everyone. Great to be here with you this afternoon to go over our Q1 results and to discuss upcoming business activity that we're really excited about. We're going to go over the financial data today, then we'll go over the FDA clearance overview, our clinical trial update, remind you all of our investment thesis recap, and the upcoming milestones that we're going to achieve to get there. And then we'll have a short question session after all of that.
Yeah.
Mike Graham: Good afternoon, everyone great to be here with you. This afternoon to go over our Q1 results and discuss upcoming business activity that we're really excited about.
Mike Graham: To go over the financial data today, then we'll go over the FDA clearance overview, our clinical trial update remind you all of our investment thesis recap the upcoming milestones that we're going to achieve to get there.
Mike Graham: And then we will have a short question session. After after the all of that so let's move on to the financial data summary.
Noel Knape: So let's move on to the financial data summary. Most importantly, for the three months ended March 31, 2025, we had $13.3 million of cash, which is reflective of an operating cash flow of $2.3 million. for the quarter, which translates into a monthly cash burn of about $0.8 million. This is down from last year's monthly burn of about $1.1 to $1.2 million as we finalized the verification and validation phase of our robotic system development last year, and we've been able to leverage our highly variable cost structure and scale down some of those variable costs. We still have 27 full-time employees that are supporting our ongoing R&D and getting us ready for achieving the milestones that we have set out that Ben will go over shortly.
Mike Graham: Most importantly for the three months ended March 31, 2025, we had $13 $3 million of cash which is reflective of an operating cash flow of $2 3 million.
Mike Graham: Products for the core for the quarter, which translates into a monthly cash burn of about $8 million. This is down from last year's monthly burn of about $1, one to $1 $2 million as we finalize the verification and validation phase of our robotic system development last year.
Mike Graham: And we've been able to leverage our highly variable cost structure and we then scale down some of those variable costs.
Mike Graham: We still have 27 full time employees that are supporting our ongoing R&D in getting us ready for achieving the milestones that we have set out the ven will go over shortly.
Noel Knape: As you'll know with our results, from an expense perspective, we've been very cost conscious and we will continue to be so. We forecast a monthly cash burn of about a million dollars a month to keep us going through the milestones and through the remainder of the year. So we have more than a year worth of cash on the balance sheet. So we're in a good position. As we've stated before, we have no traditional debt and very minimal short term warrant obligations. So, again, we have a really strong balance sheet that will help us continue.
Mike Graham: As you will know with our results.
Mike Graham: From an expense perspective, we've been very cost conscious and we will continue to do so.
Mike Graham: We forecast the monthly cash burn of about $1 million a month.
Mike Graham: The cheapest going through the milestones and through the remainder of the year. So we have more than a year worth of.
Mike Graham: Cash on the balance sheet. So we're in a good position as we've stated before we have no traditional debt and very minimal short term warrant obligations. So again, we have a really strong balance sheet.
Mike Graham: It will help us continue.
Noel Knape: In addition to that one million dollar per month cash burn rate, we do anticipate about one point two million dollars to be spent over the clinical trial time period, which will be in the, you know.
Mike Graham: In addition to that $1 million per month cash burn rate.
Mike Graham: Dissipate about $1 $2 million to be spent over the clinical trial time period.
Mike Graham: Which will be in the <unk>.
Mike Graham: Six to nine month timeframe that'll there'll be kind of lumpy spend that's when that will go out.
Noel Knape: Unknown Executive, Thomas Kerr, Benjamin Sexson, Noel Knape, Larry Hollub, Monogram Technologies So with that, I'll hand it over to Ben and he'll give you the updates of the company and where we're going from here.
Mike Graham: Overall, we expect to have cash to capital in the near term and we are bullish for the future.
Mike Graham: So with that I'll hand, it over to Ben who will give you the updates of the company and where we're going from here.
Benjamin Sexson: Thank you, Noel, and thank you, everybody, for joining today's call. This has been an extremely eventful and rewarding quarter for Monogram.
Ben: Thank you Nolan and thank you everybody for joining today's call.
Ben: This has been an extremely eventful and rewarding quarter for monogram.
Benjamin Sexson: On March 17, we were pleased to announce that we had received 510k clearance from the FDA for our embossed total TKA system, which was a truly defining milestone for our company's history. This clearance represents the culmination of years of effort, innovation, determination and technical advancement by our incredible team. We believe our system is well positioned to make a meaningful impact on the future of orthopedic surgery over the years to come. In parallel with this clearance, we have applied for our first pilot placement with a major institution in the United States, which will involve approximately four surgeons to start.
Ben: On March 17th we were pleased to announce that we had received five 10-K clearance from the FDA for our <unk> total.
Ben: Teekay system.
Which was a truly defining milestone for our company's history.
Ben: This clearance represents the culmination of years of effort innovation determination and technical advancement by.
Ben: Our incredible team.
Ben: We believe our system is well positioned to make a meaningful impact on the future of orthopedic surgery over the years to come.
Ben: In parallel with this clearance we have applied for our first pilot placement with a major institution in the United States.
Ben: Which will involve approximately for surgeons to start.
Benjamin Sexson: This program is designed to demonstrate the value proposition with real world clinical performance of the system on live patients and will serve as a platform for demonstrating surgeon training and broader commercial interest.
Ben: This program is designed to demonstrate the value proposition with real world clinical performance of the system on live patients.
Ben: And will serve as a platform for demonstrating.
Ben: Surgeon training and broader commercial interest.
Benjamin Sexson: We are not standing still. We have made substantial hardware and software improvements since the July 2024 submission, and we fully intend to launch with these enhancements included. Validation work for those improvements is actively underway. To support these efforts, we are actively showcasing the system with key opinion leaders here in Austin. as well as in other geographic areas and preparing for additional placement. While we anticipate a slow and methodical initial rollout, this approach is by design. It ensures we maintain a very high level of service, surgeon support, and importantly, system utilization. Once the foundation is set, we anticipate that our commercial growth could accelerate meaningfully.
Ben: We are not standing still we have made substantial hardware and software improvements since the July 2020 for submission and we fully intend to launch with these enhancements included.
Ben: Validation work for those improvements is actively underway.
Ben: To support these efforts we are actively showcasing the system with key opinion leaders.
Ben: Here in Austin.
Ben: As well as in other geographic areas and preparing for additional placements.
Ben: While we anticipate a slow and methodical initial rollout.
Ben: This approach is by design. It ensures we maintain a very high level of service surgeon support and importantly system utilization.
Ben: Once the foundation is set we anticipate that our commercial growth.
Ben: Could accelerate meaningfully.
Benjamin Sexson: Another major milestone occurred for the company on April 29, when we announced that we had received regulatory approval from CDSCO, the Central Drug Standard Control Organization, to initiate our multicenter clinical trial in India in collaboration with Shalby Hospitals. This will be the world's first clinical investigation involving autonomous saw-based robotic total knee surgeries on live patients.
Ben: Another major milestone occurred for the company.
Ben: On April 29, when we announced that we had received regular regulatory approval from <unk> the <unk>.
Ben: Central drug standard control organization.
To initiate a multicenter clinical trial in India in collaboration with Xiaomi hospitals.
Ben: This will be the world's first clinical investigation involving autonomous saw based robotic total knee surgeries on life patients.
Benjamin Sexson: Let me be clear, this is not just a milestone for Monogram, it is a watershed moment for the entire field of orthopedic surgery. We are on the brink of performing a revolutionary surgery that will push the limits of automation in surgical robotics. While results remain to be seen, we believe this trial will showcase the potential of robotic precision, reduce surgeon fatigue, faster learning curves, and increased operating room efficiency over time, all without compromising safety or accuracy.
Ben: Let me be clear. This is not just a milestone for monogram is a watershed moment for the entire field of orthopedic surgery. We are on the brink of performing a revolutionary surgery that will push the limits of automation in surgical robotics.
Ben: While our results remain to be seen we believe this trial will showcase the potential of robotic precision reduce surgeon fatigue.
Ben: Faster learning curves and increased operating room efficiency overtime, all without compromising safety or accuracy.
Benjamin Sexson: These achievements are not isolated, they are strategic proof points in our broader investment thesis. We believe orthopedic surgeries will be robotic in the future. We believe that surgeons, patients and hospitals will increasingly demand solutions that are more personalized, more accurate and more efficient.
Ben: These achievements are not isolated.
Ben: They are strategic proof points and our broader investment thesis we.
Ben: We believe orthopedic surgeries will be robotic in the future. We believe that surgeons patients and hospitals will increasingly demand solutions that are more personalized more accurate and more efficient.
Benjamin Sexson: So with that, I want to briefly reiterate our rather simple investment thesis. We believe we are at the forefront of a paradigm shift in orthopedic surgery. We are commercializing what we believe is the first autonomous saw-based cutting robot for total knee arthroplasty and eventually other applications as well. The system is no longer just a concept.
Ben: So with that I want to briefly reiterate are rather simple investment thesis.
Ben: We believe we are at the forefront of a paradigm shift in orthopedic surgery.
Ben: We are commercializing what we believe is the first autonomous saw based cutting robot for total knee arthroplasty and eventually other applications as well.
Ben: Our system is no longer just a concept we are now on the cusp of demonstrating its capabilities in life patient cases, which.
Benjamin Sexson: We are now on the cusp of demonstrating its capabilities in live patient cases, which we believe will represent a major inflection point for our company, as well as the industry. The current market is highly consolidated with one dominant player, Striker. holding significant market share with its Mako robot. Mako has created enormous value for Stryker by solving a clear clinical problem. enabling patient-specific planning and safe, efficient bone cuts with haptic boundaries that protect surrounding soft tissue. In our view, it remains the only system on the market that enables efficient, accurate, total knee execution with built-in safety boundaries.
Ben: Which we believe will represent a major inflection point for our company as well as the industry.
Ben: The current market is highly consolidated with one dominant player Stryker.
Ben: Holding significant market share with its Mako robot.
Ben: <unk> has created enormous value for stryker by solving a clear clinical problem, enabling.
Ben: Enabling patient specific planning and safe efficient bone cuts with haptic boundaries that protect surrounding soft tissues.
Ben: In our view it remains the only system on the market that enables efficient accurate total and the execution with built in safety boundaries.
Benjamin Sexson: However, the execution of cuts still relies entirely on the surgeon's hand. We believe this leaves the door open for a next generation solution, autonomous saw based cutting, which could address the same clinical needs while further improving, potentially improving consistency, efficiency and potentially reducing the burden on the surgeon.
Ben: However, the execution of cuts still relies entirely on the surgeon's hand.
Ben: We believe this leaves the door open for a next generation solution.
Ben: <unk> saw based cutting which can address the same clinical needs, while further improving potentially improving consistency efficiency and potentially reducing the burden on the surgeon.
Benjamin Sexson: We view this opportunity as highly significant and largely untapped, and we intend to be the company that capitalizes on this.
Ben: This opportunity is highly significant and largely untapped and we intend to be the company that capitalizes on this.
Benjamin Sexson: We believe this next slide really underscores the magnitude of the challenge and the opportunity that faces companies operating in orthopedic robotics. The market is undergoing a generational shift. Most new surgeons entering the field are being trained on robotic systems, and among fellowship-trained programs, Stryker's Mako system currently enjoys an estimated 70% market share. That level of early exposure, we believe, translates into long-term loyalty and entrenched market behavior. What this slide illustrates is the demographic impact or potential demographic impact of that trend. As the current generation of orthopedic surgeons, 60% of whom will be over the age of 65 by 2031, begin to retire, they will be replaced by a new cohort that is overwhelmingly robotic trained.
Ben: We believe this next slide really underscores the magnitude of the challenge and the opportunity that faces companies operating in orthopedic robotics the.
Ben: The market is undergoing a generational shift.
Ben: Most new surgeons entering the field are being trained on robotics systems.
Ben: And among fellowship trained programs strikers Mako system currently enjoys an estimated 70% market share.
Ben: That level of early exposure, we believe translates into long term loyalty and entrenched market behavior.
Ben: This slide illustrates is the demographic impact or potential demographic impact of that trend.
Ben: As the current generation of orthopedic surgeons, 60% of whom will be over the age of 65 by 2031 begin to retire they.
Ben: They will be replaced by a new cohort that is overwhelmingly robotic trained.
Benjamin Sexson: If we assume that surge in preferences remain constant and model with no change in adoption behavior, demographic trends alone could result in Stryker gaining up to 9% market share over the next decade without doing anything differently.
Ben: If we assume that surgeon preferences remain constant and model with no change in adoption behavior demographic trends alone could result in stryker, gaining up to 9% market share over the next decade without doing anything differently.
Benjamin Sexson: And this we believe is the opportunity for Monogram in our orthopedic space. This is the momentum we aim to disrupt with EMBUS surgical system. Our system is designed to be the most advanced robotic platform in orthopedic medicine. is the only hands-free, autonomous, saw-based, total knee robot cleared by the FDA. While the data is still forthcoming, we believe we have the potential to demonstrate that cutting that is more efficient, accurate, and safe than any other robotic system currently on the market.
Ben: And this we believe is the opportunity for monogram and our orthopedic space.
Ben: This is a momentum we ended disrupt lithium bus surgical system.
Ben: Our system is designed to be the most advanced robotic platform in orthopedic medicine.
Ben: It is the only hands free autonomous saw based total knee robot cleared by the FDA.
Ben: While the data is still forthcoming we believe we have the potential to demonstrate that cutting that is more efficient accurate and safe with any than any other robotic system currently on the market.
Benjamin Sexson: Again, these are not clinical claims, but these are the reasons that we are here. We are here to try and develop a robot that executes on those objectives.
Ben: Again these are not clinical claims but these are the reasons that we are here. We are here to try and develop a robot that executes on those objectives.
Benjamin Sexson: We expect to perform our first live patient surgeries with the MBOS system sometime later this summer or early this fall. These procedures will represent a key inflection point in validating our product in clinical practice.
Ben: We expect to perform our first live patient surgeries with the <unk> system sometime later this summer or early this fall.
Ben: These procedures will represent a key inflection point in validating our product and clinical practice.
Benjamin Sexson: In closing, I want to acknowledge the incredible efforts of our engineering team, our regulatory team, and clinical teams. The milestones we have achieved this quarter are foundational, not just for Monogram, but for, we believe, the future of orthopedic robotics.
Ben: In closing I want to acknowledge the incredible efforts of our engineering team, our regulatory team and clinical teams.
Ben: Milestones, we have achieved this quarter, our foundational not just for monogram, but for we believe the future of orthopedic robotics.
Benjamin Sexson: We want to thank our investors, partners, and employees for their continued belief in our mission.
Ben: We want to thank our investors partners employees for their continued belief in our mission.
Benjamin Sexson: We appreciate you joining today's call.
Ben: We appreciate you joining today's call.
Benjamin Sexson: And we look forward to providing more updates as we continue progressing through 2025.
Ben: And we look forward to providing more updates as we continue progressing through 2025 with that I'll turn the call back over to Larry to to help field investor questions.
Larry Hollub: With that, I'll turn the call back over to Larry to help field investor questions.
Unknown Executive: Brooks. I think I think Brooks is taking those. Perfect. All right.
Ben: Brooks I think I think Brooks is taking those.
Ben: Perfect.
Ben: Yeah.
Ben: Alright.
Jason Wittes: And do we want to bring up Jason Wittes from Roth Capital first? Sure. Hi guys. Can you hear me? Yes. How you doing, Jason? Hey, good. Thanks. Nice, nice, nice regulatory progress this quarter.
Ben: And we want to bring up Jason.
Ben: Jason Wittes.
Ben: Roth capital partners.
Ben: Sure.
Ben: Hey, guys can you hear me yes.
Ben: Yes, how are you doing Jason Hey, good thanks.
Speaker Change: Nice nice nice regulatory progress this quarter, maybe if I could just get a little more detail in terms of timelines.
Benjamin Sexson: Maybe if I could just get a little more detail in terms of timelines, both in the US and India, both in terms of technical and regulatory hurdles remaining and maybe timelines in terms of when you see them hitting. So, Right now we were in the process of what we've said is that We had a press release when we announced the clinical trial clearance and we said that we expected to be doing live patient surgeries in India within 90 business days. That timeline remains on track. The clinical trial system that will be actually performing the surgeries.
Speaker Change: Both in the U S and India, both in terms of technical and regulatory hurdles.
Ben: Remaining and maybe timelines in terms of when you see them hitting.
Ben: Sure.
Ben: So.
Ben: Right now we are we're in the process of what we've said is that Ah.
Ben: We had a press release, when we announced the clinical trial clearance and we said that we expected to be do lie.
Ben: <unk> patient surgeries in India within 90 business days.
Ben: That timeline remains on track.
Ben: The.
Ben: The clinical trial system that will be actually performed the surgeons surgeries.
Benjamin Sexson: is on its way to India. We were actively preparing to Star Patient Enrollment. So that's a tremendously exciting time for the company. And we're doing everything we can to start our first patient surgeries on a very aggressive timeframe. In the United States, we, our first placement is underway. It's been through a review committee by the orthopedic surgeons that would be using it and we're just in the process of kind of going through with the with the hospital all of the logistics that'll be involved.
Ben: <unk> is.
Ben: On its way to India.
Ben: We.
Ben: Or.
Ben: Actively preparing to start.
Ben: Star patient enrollment.
Ben: So that's a tremendously exciting time for the company.
Ben: And we're doing everything we can to two.
Ben: To start our first patient surgeries on a very aggressive time timeframe.
Ben: In the United States.
Ben: We.
Ben: Our first placement.
Ben: This is underway.
Ben: It's been through.
Ben: Okay Review committee by the.
Ben: The orthopedic surgeons that would be using it and we're just in the process of kind of going through with the with the hospital all of the.
Ben: The logistics that it'll be involved so.
Jason Wittes: We anticipate that that's a Q3 story for the company. So, sometime either Q2, early Q3, we anticipate that this will be reality in the operating room and live patients will be getting treated with robots. Okay, thank you for that detail.
Ben: We anticipate that that's a Q3 story for the company.
Ben: So.
Ben: Sometime either Q2 early Q3, we anticipate that.
Ben: This will be a reality in the operating room and.
Ben: Life patients, we'll be getting treated with the robot.
Speaker Change: Okay. Thank you for that detail.
Benjamin Sexson: I guess maybe just also you mentioned Striker, they're pretty entrenched, both in terms of their tip and knee share, or specifically knee share for you guys right now. And obviously, the robotics business is quite well entrenched. So maybe just discuss maybe the differentiators is really what's going to allow Monogram to win, especially those initial placements and how surgeon adoption might go, I guess, both in the US and India, although you India sounds like it's largely going to be dependent on Shalvi. Sure. Yeah, so and I should say in parallel, we, for India, the commercial launch We are in the process of getting clearance for the the FDA cleared version of the robot.
Ben: I guess, maybe just also you mentioned stryker.
Ben: Pretty entrenched both in terms of their <unk>.
Ben: Any share specifically knee share for you guys right now and.
Ben: Obviously, the robotics business.
Ben: This is quite well entrenched so.
Ben: Maybe just discuss may be the differentiator is really what's going to allow monogram to win, especially those initial placements and how.
Ben: Surgeon adoption might go I guess, both in the U S in India, <unk>, India, It sounds like its largely dependent on Shelby.
Ben: Sure.
Ben: Yes, so and I should say in parallel we are for India. The commercial launch.
Ben: We are in the process of getting clearance for the the FDA cleared version with a robot.
Benjamin Sexson: And I should say the the version of the robot is that is cleared is upgradable will be upgradable to the next gen version. So we were eagerly pushing launch overseas as well. So, in terms of key differentiators versus MAKO, I would start by saying there would be no higher honor to us for somebody to say that the Monogram system is competitive with MAKO. We think there's a huge opportunity for a system that's even comparable competitive equivalent to MAKO. We think that would be a tremendous accomplishment and, you know, sometimes we hear it as a pejorative well, you know.
Ben: I should say the.
Ben: The version of the robot that is cleared is upgradable.
Ben: It will be upgradable to the the next Gen version so.
Ben: We.
Ben: We're eagerly pushing launch overseas as well.
Ben: So in terms of key Differentiators versus Mako I would I would start by saying there would be no higher honor to us for somebody to to say that.
Ben: The monogram system is competitive with Mako.
Ben: We think there's a huge opportunity.
Ben: For our system that's even.
Ben: Comparable competitive equivalent to Mako.
Ben: I think that would be.
Ben: A tremendous accomplishment.
Ben: Sometimes we hear it as a pejorative.
Ben: Well.
Benjamin Sexson: make us better at this or that or whatever. I mean, it would be incredible to have a system that is frankly competitive with theirs. I will say that we, when we started this project, we thought that that was going to be very difficult to do. The Mako platform is an incredibly robust robot. It does a lot of things really well. And we thought it would be very difficult to perform their system. I'll say that I have become increasingly confident that there are technical opportunities to potentially exceed the performance. And I'll just I'll describe areas of focus without actually calling out specific.
Ben: Makos are better at this or that or whatever I mean, it would be.
Ben: Incredible to have a system that is frankly competitive with theirs.
Ben: I will say that.
Ben: When we started this project we thought that that was going to be very difficult to do the Mako platform is an incredibly robust robot with it does a lot of things really well.
Ben: And we thought it would be very difficult to perform their system.
Ben: I'll say that.
Ben: I have become increasingly confident that there are.
Ben: Technical opportunities to potentially exceed the performance.
Ben: And I'll, just I'll describe areas of focus without actually calling out specific.
Ben: Oh I'll focus more on what what monogram is aiming to do and less on what Mako does but.
Benjamin Sexson: I'll focus more on what what Monogram is aiming to do and less on what Mako does, but A major focus for us is accuracy. So we believe that it's essential for us to have what we want to have the most accurate robot in the world. And we believe the data that's out there on various the accuracy of various systems has some pretty significant flaws. and we are working on research to actually quantify what the accuracy of various systems is in literature that will hopefully become published and then compare that to what the accuracy of our system is.
Ben: A major focus for us is accuracy.
Ben: So we believe that.
Ben: It's essential for us to have what we we want to have the most accurate robot in the world.
Ben: And we believe the data that's out there on various of the accuracy of various systems has some pretty significant flaws.
Ben: And we are we are working on research to actually quantify what the accuracy of various systems is.
Ben: In literature that will hopefully become published and then compare that to what the accuracy of our system is.
Benjamin Sexson: So that's a big area of focus for us. Another area of focus is the safety. So we really don't wanna have, we want minimal surgeon skills required to actually execute the cuts. We want minimal surgeon fatigue. We don't want the surgeon to be sweaty and tired after doing five knees in a day. So we think that's going to be a significant advantage over time. You know, you don't have to worry about any soft tissue, regardless of whether you're a resident or an experienced surgeon. We really want it to be pretty bulletproof in that respect. We see opportunities around laxity planning, so there's no system on the market, for example, today that does a very good job with for example, estimating the impact of osteophyte removal, giving surgeons tools to predictive tools to assess the impact of help guide them, for example, the impact for fixing the flexion contracture, that kind of stuff.
Ben: So that's a big area of focus for us.
Ben: We another area of focus is.
Ben: The.
Ben: Safety.
Ben: So we really don't want to have we want minimal surgeon skills required to actually execute the cuts.
Ben: We want minimal surgeon fatigue.
Ben: We don't want the surgeon to be sweaty and tired after doing five means in a day.
Ben: So we think that's gonna be a significant advantage over time.
Ben: You don't have to worry about any soft tissue.
Ben: Regardless of whether you're a resident or an experienced surgeon, we really wanted to be pretty bulletproof in that respect.
Ben: We see opportunities around laxity planning so.
Ben: There's no system on the market for example, today that does a very good job with.
Ben: For example, estimating the impact of Osteophyte removal.
Ben: Giving surgeons tools to predictive tools to assess the impact.
Speaker Change: Pact of Hell.
Ben: Help guide them for example, the impact for fixing of flexion contracture that kind of stuff, we think theres opportunities for improved tension in more efficient tension Inc.
Benjamin Sexson: We think there's opportunities for improved tensioning, more efficient tensioning. We think that the number of joins for MAKO requires, they only have four joins. So for the distal femur and posterior chamfer cuts, it requires a tool change to a right angle adapter that takes time, it's a different tool. A lot of times that introduces a second blade which adds cost for the hospital. So that's an opportunity. So there's a lot of kind of marginal things around the fringes. Our pipeline is vertically vertically streamlined. So the preoperative pipeline is all AI based, the segmentation algorithm. Our understanding is that MAKO for landmark placement relies on the operator and operator skill to place those landmarks which can have a pretty significant impact on system accuracy and how accurate the planned resection is versus the actual resection if the landmark is not well chosen.
Ben: We think that the.
Ben:
Ben: The number of of joins for Mako requires they only have a.
Ben: <unk> joins.
Ben: So for the distal femur and posterior chamfer cuts.
Ben: It requires a tool change to a right angle adapter that takes time, it's a different tool.
Ben: A lot of times that introduces a second blade, which adds cost for the hospital.
That's.
Ben: An opportunity so there's a lot of kind of marginal things around.
Ben: On the fringes of our pipeline is.
Ben: Vertically.
Ben: Particularly streamlines so the preoperative pipeline is all all AI based though the segmentation algorithm.
Ben: Our understanding is that May go for landmark placement.
Ben: Relies on the operator, and operator skill to place those landmarks, which can have a pretty significant impact on our system accuracy.
Ben: And how.
Ben: How accurate the plant resection is versus the actual resection, if the landmark is not well chosen.
Benjamin Sexson: So our landmark identification is fully automated AI based so we think over time that's going to be just another little small advantage. Where MAKO has some I would say still has some competitive advantage over us is Because they have a tool change, their workspace is pretty large, so robot positioning is pretty efficient with Mako. That's been a huge area of focus for us, maximizing the workspace. so that it's very quick and efficient to position the robot. getting pretty technical here in a lot of areas. But I will say, and I will say that, you know, the NACO platform knee, the Stryker Triathlon, it's a fantastic knee.
Ben: So we are.
Ben: Our landmark identification is fully automated AI based so we think over time, that's going to be.
Ben: Just another little small advantage.
Speaker Change: Where where Mako has some.
Speaker Change: I would say still has some competitive advantage over us is up.
Speaker Change: Because they have a tool change their workspace is pretty large so.
Speaker Change: Robot positioning is pretty efficient with Mako.
Speaker Change: That's been a huge area of focus for us are maximizing the workspace.
Speaker Change: So that it's very quick and efficient to position the robot.
Speaker Change: Getting pretty cycles, a year and a lot of areas, but I will say and I will say that.
Speaker Change: The.
Speaker Change: The Mako platform, neither Stryker for triathlon, its a fantastic knee it's got a.
Benjamin Sexson: It's got, I think, more than 20 years of history. I believe it has over a million patients with the knee. But we think that it's, versus other players in the market, probably not the most competitive knee on the market. It's a single radius femur, symmetric tibia, and they have a cemented press fit partial knee. So we think on the implant side, they've left a lot of opportunity open for competition.
Speaker Change: With more than 20 years of history I believe it has over a million patients with the knee.
Speaker Change: But we think that it's oh.
Speaker Change: Versus other players in the market probably not the most competitive knee on the market. It's a single radio streamers from metric to be.
Speaker Change: And they have a cemented press fit partial knee. So we think on the implant side they've left a lot of opportunity open for competition.
Benjamin Sexson: and so those and then we think about multi application and scaling a system to other clinical applications, hips, shoulders, etc. We think that the dexterity of our system will really start to shine and and our understanding of active and autonomous robotics. We'll start to give us a pretty compelling opportunity. I would say it would be an incredible compliment to be competitive with them and if we were able to have a superior system that would be tremendous.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: And so those and then when you think about multi application and scaling assist.
Speaker Change: Our system to our other clinical applications hips shoulders et cetera.
Speaker Change: We think that the dexterity of our system will really start to shine.
Speaker Change: And our understanding of active and autonomous robotics will start to.
Speaker Change: Give us a.
Speaker Change: <unk>.
Speaker Change: Pretty compelling opportunities so.
Speaker Change: I would say.
Speaker Change: It'll be an incredible complement to be competitive with them and if we if we were able to have a superior system that would be tremendous so.
Jason Wittes: Well, that's a lot of detail. I really appreciate it.
Speaker Change: Well, that's a lot of detail IRA appreciate it if I could just do one last follow up and related to that in terms of Youre now you've been demo with some kols.
Benjamin Sexson: If I could just do one last follow up and related to that, in terms of you're now you've been demoing with some KOLs. What are they saying, especially in regards to a lot of the comments you just made in terms of how the monogram system is set up. Sure.
Speaker Change: What are they saying, especially in regards to a lot of the comments you just made in terms of.
Speaker Change: How how the monograph system is set up.
Benjamin Sexson: So, you know, when it, when we started out, so we've been at this for, for nine years now. I would say really developing in earnest. It's been about five years of real serious engineering development. I would say when we first started bringing surgeons in, you know, The feedback was, you know, whoa, you know, this is pretty interesting. It's too slow, you know, the planning wasn't dialed in. it, you know, it's, there was a a sense of you guys are onto something, but there's a lot of work here. I would say over time, you know, we've just continued to make the system better, better, better, faster.
Speaker Change: Sure so when it when we started out so we've been at this for nine years now.
Speaker Change: We are I would say really developing in earnest. It's been a it's been about a five years a real serious engineering development I would say when we first started bringing surgeons in you know.
Speaker Change: The feedback was well you know this is pretty interesting.
Speaker Change: It's too slow.
Speaker Change: The planning wasn't dialed in.
Speaker Change: There was a.
Speaker Change: A sense of you guys are onto something but there's a lot of work here.
I would say over time, you know, we've just continued to make the system better better better faster I mean now.
Benjamin Sexson: I mean, now. I would say our feed rates are competitive with manual surgery. We can cut exceptionally fast. I think our, like, bone and blade time, which was kind of the biggest barrier, potential barrier to adoption now we're competitive with any system on the market, including manual. So now when surgeons come in, I think... To be honest with you, I think some of them have their jaw on the floor. I think they did not fully appreciate how far we've come. I think I think a lot of players in the market potentially haven't appreciated how far we've we've taken this.
Speaker Change: I would say our feed rates are a competitive with manual surgery, we can cut exceptionally fast.
Speaker Change: I think are like.
Speaker Change: Bone and blade time, which was kind of the biggest barrier potential barrier to adoption now we're competitive with with any system on the market including manual.
Speaker Change: So now when surgeons come in I think.
Speaker Change: To be honest with you I think some of them have their draw on the floor I think they.
Speaker Change:
Speaker Change: <unk> did not fully appreciate how far we've come I think.
Speaker Change: I think a lot of players in the market potentially haven't appreciated how far we've we've taken this.
Benjamin Sexson: So, uh, I think that, um, now the thing that's exciting is that it's, it's like, okay, how do you, Yeah, you brought this up in the past, Jason. How do we now make the implant competitive? Because that's I think we can really drive meaningful adoption, let's say, to a certain amount of scale with the implant platform we have. But I think where this starts to really become the killer app is if it's coupled with a really compelling implant. And so you could just see surgeons sort of getting excited about it and seeing the potential. for where this could go and wanting to be involved so.
Speaker Change: So I think that now.
Now the thing that's exciting is that it's it's like okay. How do you.
Jason: And you brought this up in the past Jason.
Jason: How do we now make the implant competitive because that's.
I think I think we can really drive meaningful adoption, let's say to a certain amount of scale with with the implant platform we have.
Jason: But.
Jason: Where this starts to really become the killer App is if it's coupled with.
Speaker Change: Oh really.
Speaker Change: Compelling implant.
Speaker Change: And so you can just see surgeons sort of getting excited about it and seeing the potential.
Speaker Change: For where this could go and wanting to be involved so.
Benjamin Sexson: I would say in terms of surgeons that get it the quickest, it's generally surgeons that have used Mako before. So for them, it's just kind of a very intuitive. workflow.
Speaker Change: Oh, I would say our.
Speaker Change: In terms of surgeons that get into quickest. It's generally surgeons that have used may go before.
Speaker Change: So for them, it's just kind of a very intuitive.
Speaker Change: Hello.
Jason Wittes: Great, thank you.
Speaker Change: Great. Thank you I appreciate all the detail I will jump back in queue.
Jason Wittes: I appreciate all the detail. I will jump back in queue.
Unknown Executive: Sure. Thanks Jason.
Speaker Change: Sure. Thanks, Jason.
Speaker Change: I do want to bring it back to Tom Curran from Zacks.
Unknown Executive: do we want to bring up Tom Kerr from ZEX?
Benjamin Sexson: Hi guys. Good. You guys just covered a lot, but a couple of detailed ones. Are you able to provide more color on the system enhancements that are going on, or is that proprietary, or what exactly are you doing to finish it up? Sure. So, You know, we we applied to the FDA, the robot, the what's called the version of the robot that was cleared, we applied for that in July. uh so almost hard to believe but it's you know it's it's now May And we have, subsequent to that submission, made very significant enhancements to the feed rate of the robot.
Tom Curran: Hi, guys.
Speaker Change: Good morning.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Speaker Change: You guys covered a lot, but a couple of detailed ones are you able to provide more color on the system enhancements that are going on or is that proprietary or what exactly are you doing to finish it up.
Speaker Change: Sure.
Speaker Change: So.
Speaker Change: We we applied to the F D a.
Speaker Change: The robot the.
Speaker Change: Lets called the version of the robot that was cleared we applied for.
Speaker Change: So that in July.
Speaker Change: So it's almost hard to believe but it's you know it's it's now may.
And we have subsequent to that submission made a very significant enhancements to.
Speaker Change: The feed rate of the robot so are we.
Benjamin Sexson: So, we have a completely upgraded end effector, upgraded blade, upgraded And there's a whole book. number of software improvements. And so we have been able to make the cutting much, much faster. So, uh, in terms of, uh, we, you know, we could launch with, um, the system that's cleared, uh, and, uh, that's what we're doing, but we can do what's called a letter to file, which is, uh, it's not a whole new submission, but it's just testing, uh, internal testing to demonstrate that. for example, upgrading the end effector to the new end effector that we want to commercialize with is safe and fully tested and get surgeon feedback on that.
Speaker Change: We have a completely upgraded.
Speaker Change: And effector upgraded blade upgraded Hum.
Number of software improvements.
Speaker Change: And so we are we have been able to make the cutting much much faster.
Speaker Change: So in terms of.
We could launch with.
Speaker Change: The system that's cleared.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: That's what we're doing but we.
Speaker Change: We can do what's called a letter to file.
Speaker Change: Which is a it's not a whole new submission, but its just testing internal testing to demonstrate that.
Speaker Change: For example, upgrading the end effector to the new one effect or that we want to commercialize with.
Speaker Change: It is safe and fully tested and get surgeon feedback on that so.
Benjamin Sexson: So that's actively underway as we speak. In fact, there's a surgeon right now today in the lab that is using the upgraded So it's not really a blocker, but it's more of a just a statement that what we're launching with we think is going to be pretty competitive right out of the gate. Okay, and then just to clarify on a launch domestically, is that? still considered some type of trial or is it a full commercial launch or is there a combination of both? Sure, so it's a We're calling it a pilot launch, just because You know, we're, we're a small company.
Speaker Change: Is that that's actively underway as we speak in fact, there's a surgeon right right now today in the lab.
Speaker Change: That is using the upgraded hardware.
Speaker Change: So.
Speaker Change: It's sort of coincidence with getting with getting clearance are to actually keep with it from a hospital. So its not really a a blocker, but it's more of a just a.
Speaker Change: A statement that out.
Speaker Change: What we what were lunching with we think is going to be pretty competitive right out of the gate.
Speaker Change: Okay, and then just to clarify on a launch domestically.
Speaker Change: Is that.
Speaker Change: Gil considered some type of trial or is that a.
Speaker Change: Full commercial launch or is that a combination of both.
Speaker Change: Sure. So it's.
Speaker Change: We're calling it a pilot launch just because.
Speaker Change: You know, we're we're a small company and you know we have 27 people.
Benjamin Sexson: And, you know, we have 27 people. And the next step, right, so a lot of times in terms of what a surgeon would want to see to use the system, they would want to see it in the real world. Nobody wants to be the first to use the robot on their patients. So, The first hospital has been, is going to be with a couple of KOLs that have been with us for quite a while, understand the technology, have seen the evolution of the company. They're going to do surgeries and the hospital, you know, there's no benchmark for them.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: The next step right. So a lot of times in terms of what a surgeon who would want to see to use the system.
Speaker Change: They would want to see it in the real world.
Speaker Change: Nobody wants to be the first to use the robot on their patients. So.
Speaker Change: The first hospital has been it's gonna be with a cup of Kols that have been with us for quite a while understand the technology I've seen the evolution of the company.
Speaker Change: They're gonna do surgeries ER and the hospital you know Theres no benchmark for them. So the hospital needs to evaluate to a value analysis of our system.
Benjamin Sexson: So the hospital needs to evaluate, do a value analysis of our system versus other competitive systems on the market before pulling the trigger. And so we're going to use that as an opportunity to demo the surgeon for surgeons that are interested, that we're actively talking to, be able to bring them into the operating room, see the surgery in real life. and as as we tool up with, you know, distributors, sales reps, training, making sure that we have everything we need to provide an excellent standard of care. So, you know, for us to really push on the gas pedal and grow kind of let's go say go parabolic, we really need to make sure that we have all of the infrastructure in place, support in place, take care of our surgeons.
Speaker Change: Versus other competitive systems on the market before.
Speaker Change: Pulling the trigger.
Speaker Change: And so we're going to use that as an opportunity to.
Speaker Change: Demo the surgeon for surgeons.
Speaker Change: Are interested that were actively talking to be able to bring them into the operating room see the see the surgery in real life.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: We tool up with.
Speaker Change: Distributor sales reps training.
Speaker Change: Making sure that we have everything we need to provide an excellent standard of care. So.
Speaker Change:
Speaker Change: For us to really push on the gas pedal.
Speaker Change: And grow kind of let's say go parabolic.
Speaker Change: We really need to make sure that we.
Speaker Change: Have all of the.
Speaker Change: Infrastructure in place support in place to take care of our surgeons.
Benjamin Sexson: It's a very The orthopedic market is a lot about customer service. So we don't wanna be in a position where we're not supporting surgeons, we're not making sure that they are well taken care of. So our goal is to have very high utilization of the robots that we place. and and so we think that this is the kind of smart way to scale as we as we and we think we can grow faster overseas initially than in the U.S. and then we think in the U.S. we're going to start to grow faster than overseas. Hope that makes sense.
Speaker Change: It's a very.
Speaker Change: The orthopedic market is a lot about customer service.
Speaker Change: So we don't want to be in a position, where we're not supporting our surgeons where were not.
Speaker Change: Making sure that they are well taken care of so our goal is to have very high utilization of the robots that we place.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: And so we think that this is the kind of smart way to scale as we as we are and we think we can grow faster overseas initially than the U S. And then how do we think in the U S. We're going to start to grow faster than overseas. So hope that makes sense. So yeah.
Benjamin Sexson: So yeah, we're starting out in two key geographies here in Austin. and then on the East Coast. and then we'll scale from there. Got it.
Speaker Change: We're starting out in two key geographies here in Austin.
Speaker Change: And then on the East coast.
Speaker Change: And then we will scale from there.
Got it and when it makes sense one last quick one are there any more actions or interactions with the FDA. I mean, you mentioned a letter to file but once you get these type of approval is it pretty much done with the F. D. A yes, we're done so it's already cleared.
Benjamin Sexson: Makes us one last quick one. Are there any more actions or interactions with the FDA? I mean, you mentioned a letter to file, but once you get these type of approvals, is it pretty much done with the FDA? Yeah, we're done. So it's already cleared. You know, the next interaction with the FDA will be once we have the clinical data from India, we would be submitting that to the FDA and getting clearance on our next gen system. got it. Makes sense.
Speaker Change: You know the next interaction with the F D a will be.
Speaker Change: Once we have the clinical data from India, we would be submitting that to the F D. A in and getting clearance on our nexgen system.
Speaker Change: Got it makes sense okay. Thanks, yeah. So.
Benjamin Sexson: Okay, thanks. And the system that's cleared is going to be upgradable to that version. So It's not like, uh...
Speaker Change: And the system. That's cleared is gonna be upgradeable to to that version so.
Speaker Change: It's not like.
Benjamin Sexson: So really, a lot of how our sales funnel works right now is... We're showing surgeons, you know, both both versions of the system and They're getting pretty excited about where this is going. Great.
Speaker Change: So really are a lot of how our sales funnel works right now is.
Speaker Change: We're showing surgeons.
Speaker Change: Both both versions of the system.
Speaker Change: There theyre getting pretty excited about about where this is going.
Unknown Executive: All right. Thanks. Sure, thank you.
That sounds great alright. Thanks.
Speaker Change: Sure. Thank you.
Speaker Change: Yeah.
Benjamin Sexson: All right, and just a couple other questions that were submitted here. How should we think about capital needs in light of the upcoming clinical trial, pilot placements and commercialization efforts? Do you expect to raise additional capital in 2025? Sure. Uh, yeah, so that's, um, uh, we, um. We actively we've been actively exploring capital opportunities.
Speaker Change: Right.
Speaker Change: Just a couple of other questions that were submitted here.
Speaker Change: Yeah, how should we think about capital needs in light of the upcoming clinical trial pilot placements and commercialization efforts.
Speaker Change: You have to raise additional capital in 2025.
Speaker Change: Sure.
Speaker Change: Yeah. So that's.
Speaker Change: If we.
Speaker Change: We actively we have been actively exploring capital opportunities.
Benjamin Sexson: And we're going to, in order to really accelerate the business, you know, as Noel said, we have the capital we need to execute the clinical trial and in a, uh, the growth in a kind of conservative fashion, um, but to really accelerate the growth, which is exactly what we want to do. Uh, we are going to need, uh, additional capital. Uh, and so, you know, the, um, uh, we, we've been talking to a number of, uh, investors and I would say, you know, there's, strong interest. I think a lot of folks are starting to see the opportunity.
Speaker Change: And.
Speaker Change: We're going to in order to really accelerate the business.
Speaker Change: As Noel said, we have the capital we need to execute the clinical trial.
Speaker Change:
Kind of continue in a the growth in a conservative fashion.
Speaker Change: But to really accelerate the growth, which is exactly what we want to do.
Speaker Change: We are going to need additional capital.
Speaker Change: And so you know the.
Speaker Change: We've been talking to a number of our investors.
Speaker Change: Investors and I would say you know there's strong interest.
Speaker Change: I think a lot of folks are starting to see the opportunity.
Speaker Change:
Benjamin Sexson: So we're being very thoughtful about who we partner with, how we partner, and how aggressive the REMP would look. But we're going to continue to validate and de-risk the opportunity.
Speaker Change: So we're being very thoughtful about who.
Speaker Change: Who who we partner with OE Parker and how how aggressive.
Speaker Change: The ramp would look.
Speaker Change: But we're going to continue to validate and derisk the opportunity in the next major Derisking milestone is going to be having life patient surgeries under our belt.
Benjamin Sexson: The next major de-risking milestone is going to be having live patient surgeries under our belt, having those go smoothly and demonstrating that we have a very compelling system. So we think that that's a for the company to to do actually be in the operating room.
Speaker Change: Having those goes smoothly and demonstrating that we have a very compelling system. So.
Speaker Change: We think that that's a.
Speaker Change: A very accretive for the company to to do actually be in the operating room.
Benjamin Sexson: Once we're in the operating room, I think it's it's really from a de-risking perspective, the last hurdle for our company before to validate what we've been working on.
Speaker Change: Once we're in the operating room I think it's.
Speaker Change: That's really from a derisking perspective, the last hurdle for our company.
Speaker Change: Before to.
Speaker Change: To validate what we've been working on.
Benjamin Sexson: And finally, how do you plan to manage the balance just between a, you know, more slow controlled rollout and the need to drive commercial traction and revenue growth? Sure, I think a lot of that's going to be. you know, access to capital. So, you know, the growth trajectory really does depend a little bit on a capital partners and kind of the strategic direction of the company. And so, but I will say that we.
Speaker Change: And finally.
Speaker Change: How do you.
Speaker Change: To manage the balance between us.
Speaker Change: You know my slow.
Speaker Change: Controlled rollout.
Speaker Change: Got it.
Commercial traction in memory.
Speaker Change: Sure I think a lot of that's going to be.
Speaker Change: Access to capital are so you know the growth trajectory.
Speaker Change: Does depend a little bit on.
Speaker Change: Our capital partners and kind of the strategic direction of the company.
Speaker Change: And so but I will say that we.
Benjamin Sexson: We never will compromise the quality of service and support that we provide to our surgeons. And we are extremely focused on the utilization of the system. So we're not interested in just placing robots without them being used and well used. So our investment thesis is that the robot effectively is an ATM machine, it's like a cash register. And if we place the system. uh with buy-in from surgeons who understand what the value proposition is and if we can convert a hundred you know our goal is to convert a hundred percent of their business or as much as possible to the robot we want to basically be doing every single surgery they do on our system.
Speaker Change: We never will compromise the.
Speaker Change: The quality of service and support that we provide to our surgeons.
Speaker Change: And we are extremely focused on the utilization of the system.
Speaker Change: So we're not interested in just.
Speaker Change: Placing robots are without them being used and and well use so our investment thesis is that the robot effectively as an ATM machine.
Speaker Change: The cash register.
Speaker Change: And if we place the system.
Speaker Change: With buying from surgeons, who understand what the value proposition is.
Speaker Change: And if we can convert.
Speaker Change: All of us to convert 100% of their business or as much as possible to the robot.
Speaker Change: We want to basically be doing every single surgery, they do on our system.
Benjamin Sexson: And so that's really the focus is making sure that we have those key high quality accounts. And from there, once you have high utilization, it doesn't take too many robots, placed robots that are well utilized to start to you know, ultimately hit breakeven and go from there. So that's, that's our focus.
Speaker Change: And so Uh huh.
Speaker Change: That's really the focus is making sure that we are.
Speaker Change: Have those key high quality accounts and from there once you have high utilization it doesn't take.
Too many robots placed robots that are well utilized to start to.
Speaker Change: Ultimately hit breakeven and go from there. So that's that's our focus.
Great. Thanks.
Benjamin Sexson: That looks like we're good for our questions, so Ben, back to you for any closing remarks. Perfect. Well, thanks, everybody. We really appreciate you joining us today and we look forward to updating you on our progress in the coming quarter.
Speaker Change: It looks like we would sit for questions. So and then back to you for any closing remarks.
Speaker Change: Perfect well thanks, everybody. We really appreciate you joining us today and we look forward to updating you on our progress in the coming quarter.
Speaker Change: Okay.