Q4 2025 Viavi Solutions Inc Earnings Call
Good afternoon. My name is Bella and I will be your conference operator. Today at this time I would like to welcome everyone to the VAV solution, physical fourth quarter and full year 2025 earnings call. Today's conference is being recorded online. Have been placed on mute to prevent any background noise. After the speakers remarks, there will be a question and answer session at this time. I would like to welcome and turn the conference over to V in the year head of investor relations. Please go ahead
Thank you, Bella.
Good afternoon everyone and welcome to viavi Solutions, fourth quarter and fiscal 2025 earnings call.
Head of investor relations for viavi Solutions.
And with me on today's call is Olay hiken, our president and CEO and Ilan bascal. RC
Please note, this call will include forward-looking statements about the company's financial performance.
These statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to deform material from our current expectations and estimations.
We encourage you, to review our most recent annual report and SEC filings.
Particularly.
The risk factors.
Described in those filings.
The forward-looking statements including the guidance that we provide during this call are valid only as of today.
The AV undertakes. No obligation to update these statements.
please also note that unless we State otherwise
All results discussed on this call, except revenue, are non-GAAP.
We reconcile these non-gaap results to our preliminary Gap financials.
And discuss their usefulness and limitations in today's earnings release.
the release as well as our supplementary earning slides, which include historical Financial tables, our available on vavs website at www.investor.com
Finally, we are recording today's call and will make the recording available on our website by 4:30 p.m. Pacific time this evening.
Now, I would like to turn the call over to an
Thank you V. Good afternoon everyone.
Now, I would like to review the results of the fourth quarter of fiscal year 2025.
Net revenue for the quarter was 290.5 Million, which is at the, the high end of the, our guidance range of 278 to 290 million.
Revenue was up 2% sequentially and on a year-over-year basis was up 15.3%.
Operating margin for the fourth fiscal quarter was 14.4% at the high end of our guidance range of 12.5% to 14.5%.
Operating margin decreased 230 basis points from the prior quarter.
And on a year-over-year basis was up. 350 basis points.
Epps at 13 cents was also at a high end of our guidance range of 10 to 13 cents and was down 2 cents sequentially.
On a year-over-year basis. EPS was up 5 cents.
Moving on to our Q4 results by business segments.
Given the Aves, revenue, growth, and recent acquisition.
The service enablement Revenue as a percent of total revenue is lower and led us to combine Network, enablement, and E and service. Enablement. SE into 1 report, reportable segments, Network and service, enablement or NC.
The ongoing reportable 2 segments will be NC and OSP.
Tennessee, revenue for the fourth fiscal quarter came in at 2 0 9. 1 7,
On a year-over-year basis. NC Revenue was up 14.8% as a result of strong demand for fiber 11, production products mainly driven from the data center ecosystem as well as growth in Aerospace and defense products including the acquisition of inertial labs.
NC gross margin for the quarter was 6.
Which is 10 basis points higher on a year-over-year basis.
Tennessee's operating margin for the quarter was 4.7%, an increase of 290 basis points on a year-over-year basis.
Tennessee, operating margin was slightly lower than the midpoint of our guidance range of 4% to 6%, mainly as a result of fiscal year-end employee variable costs, as well as higher R&D expenses.
5 to 77 million.
And was up 16.6% on a year-over-year basis.
The increase in revenue for the quarter was primarily a result of strength in anti-counterfeiting and other products.
OSP. Gross margin was 54.7% up 170 basis points from the same period last year, and was, primarily driven by higher volume and favorable product mix.
Opiates margin was 39.4%, which is above our guidance range of 36 to 38%. And is an increase of 460 basis points, on a year-over-year basis, as a result of a higher fall through
moving on to the full year results of fiscal year 2025
For the full fiscal. Year Revenue was 1 billion and 84 million which is up 8.4% on a year-over-year basis.
The revenue growth was mainly driven by strong demand for 11 production and field products primarily from the data centers ecosystem.
This was partially offset by a decline in spent for wireless, cape and cable products by Nas and service providers.
We also saw growth in our aerospace and defense products, including the acquisition of Inertial Labs.
For OSB, we saw growth in our anti-counterfeiting and other products as the industry's inventory levels normalized.
Operating margin for the full year, was 14.2% up to 270 basis points from fiscal year 2024, and was driven by higher revenue and favorable product. Mix resulting in a higher fall through.
Full year EPS was 47, cents up, 14 cents from the prior year.
Moving on, to the balance sheet and cash flow.
Total cash and short-term Investments. At the end of Q4 were 429 million compared to 400.2 million in the third quarter of fiscal 2025.
Cash flow from operating activities for the quarter was 23.8 Million versus 26.2 million in the same period last year.
During the quarter, we did not purchase any shares of our stocks.
For the full year. We purchased 2 million shares for about 16.4 million.
We have almost 200 million dollars remaining under our current authorized share repurchase program.
in fiscal year 2025, we prioritized our Capital allocation towards m&a with the acquisition of inertial labs, and depending acquisition of spyran high speed, ethernet network, security and channel, emulation business lines,
The fully diluted share count for the quarter was 227 million shares up from 224.2 million shares in the prior year and versus 227.4 million shares in our guidance. For the fourth fiscal quarter,
Capex for the quarter was 5.5 million versus 3.8 million in the same period last year.
Capex for the full fiscal year was 27.8 Million versus 19.5 million in the prior year.
Moving on to our first quarter guidance.
Historically, q1 is a software quarter relative to Q4. However, we expect the first fiscal quarter Revenue to be slightly up sequentially.
For NC, we expect first fiscal quarter revenue to be slightly up relative to the prior quarter, which reflects the seasonally strong quarter driven mainly by the data center ecosystem, as well as aerospace and defense, and offset by continued weakness in wireless.
For OSP. We also expect quarter over quarter Revenue to be slightly higher driven by seasonally stronger 3D sensing products.
for the first fiscal quarter of 2026, we expect Revenue in the range of 290 and 298 million
operating margin is expected to be 15% plus or minus 40 basis points.
And EPS to be between 13 cents and 14 cents.
Plus plus, or minus.
With an operating margin of 5.8% plus or minus 40 basis points.
OSP revenue is expected to be approximately 83 million plus or minus 1 million.
With an operating margin of 38.3% plus or minus 20 basis points.
Our tax expenses for the first quarter are expected to be around 8.5 million plus, or minus 500,000 is a result of jurisdictional mix.
We expect other income and expenses to reflect and net expense of approximately 5 million.
And the share count is expected to be around 228.6 million shares.
Our guidance does not include financial performance. From our announced acquisition of certain aspirants business lines.
And we currently estimate the transaction to close by the end of September.
During the fourth quarter, we successfully priced and allocated a $600 million Term Loan B, which will be used to fund the transaction at close as well as General Corporate purposes.
The term loan B will close concurrently with the transaction.
Over the long term. We target a 4 times. Gross leverage and Below. 3 times net, Leverage.
with that, I will turn the call over to
Thank you, Elon.
Fiscal 25 ended on a strong note with vavi revenue and EPS coming at the high end of our guidance.
NC Revenue in fiscal Q4 grew approximately. 15% year-over-year primarily driven by strong demand from the data center, ecosystem and Aerospace and defense customers more specifically, fiber 11 Productions. So another strong quarter driven by continued strong and growing demand from the data center ecosystem.
With further extended our leadership. In this segment, with the launch of the second generation, 1.6, terabit test solution. We expect the strong demand from the data center ecosystem to continue well into calendar 26.
Our Aerospace and defense business. So in other strong quarter of growth during by high demand for our positioning navigation and timing products.
We expect this trend to continue throughout fiscal 26.
Field instruments business continued on its gradual trajectory recovery trajectory driven by Leading service providers. Fiber deployment and growing demand from the data center ecosystem.
Furthermore, we expect the gradual recovery to accelerate during the this fiscal year driven by anticipated stronger, fiber cap expand by Leading North North American service providers.
Wireless business continues to remain a mixed bag.
While we have seen, we have been seeing healthy demand for wireless field instruments. The recovery in the infrastructure test continues to get pushed out due to the business weakness at leading Wireless NS.
We expect the infrastructure test demand to remain sluggish in the medium term.
And lastly, service enablement results were in line with our expectations.
Looking ahead. We expect NC Revenue to be slightly up quote on quarter during by continued. Strong demand from the data center ecosystem and the Aerospace and defense customers.
This is stronger than the traditional seasonality in the first quarter.
Our diversification and growth in the data center, ecosystem, and Aerospace. And defense businesses is of setting the and mitigating the traditional Revenue, seasonality driven by service provider demand Dynamics
Now, turning on to op.
Op so strong year-on-year. Growth driven by recovery in anti-counterfeiting and other products. We expect fiscal q1 to be slightly upon quarter. Mostly driven by seasonally stronger demand, for 3D sensing products.
During the fourth quarter, some of our Revenue was subject to newly imposed tariffs. However, we were able to largely mitigate our initial concerns over the tariffs and a comfortable in our ability to continue manage the ongoing impact of tariffs.
After 2 years of decline, fiscal 25 was a growth year for VAV.
Our diversification strategy into the data center, ecosystem, and aerospace and defense, combined with the stabilization and beginning of recovery in our traditional businesses, drove the growth. We expect the strategy to continue driving our growth in fiscal 26.
Their strong execution and successfully navigating the volatile macroeconomic environment during this past quarter. Additionally, I would also like to thank our customers and shareholders for their continued support.
With that, I will now turn it back over to the operator for questions and answers.
Telephone keypad. We do request for today's session that you please limit to 1 question and 1 follow up.
We will pause for just a moment to compile the Q&A roster.
Your first question comes from the line of Ruben Roy with stifle, your line is now open. Please go ahead.
Thank you. Uh hi guys, Oleg. Um, first question on the uh and and nice to see the results and the guidance, by the way, but the first question on the guidance. So um, the just reported quarter of there were some tariff impacts and and you know just wanted to start with the revenue side of the Tariff impacts with some of the uh pose that got sent back Etc. You know how did that progress? And you know as some of that accounted for on the guidance for September, you know, relative to the strength that you're seeing in data center, in Aerospace and defense. Maybe you could just parse that out for us. Thank you.
Sure. Well, I mean, first of all, the impact is only. Um, mostly on the North American uh, sales. But we also have some impact, uh, from Chinese tariffs when we send some material to some of our factories in China overall. I mean, the whole tier of impact is around 1 and a half million dollars, which we have more than mitigated. And, um, at this point in time, uh, the terrorists are fully built in into our, uh, pricing and um, you know, uh, also the, um, supply chain realignment to minimize the tariffs. So, I think at this point, you know, uh, provided nothing has changed in the last 24 hours. Um, I mean really if we take Europe Thailand, and, um, you know, um, uh, China tariffs as somewhat fixed at this point in time, we feel we are fairly comfortable. We've got it all mitigated.
Great, thank you for that. And then uh I guess a little bit of a longer term question just on the data center strengths and uh at 1.6 T Test, you know, it sounded like from, um, your prepared remarks that, you know, this is, um, something that you've got some visibility and to continuing well into next year, maybe you can just talk about the competitive dynamics that you're seeing at this point and, you know, sort of customer conversations uh, relative to 1.6. T. I mean it seems like that's, you know, something that's still on the come as we think about, you know, next year and even even the year after. So, you know, just wondering if you can talk about. Yeah, no, no, no.
Thank you. Well, I mean um 1.16 is what you kind of lead with, right? That's our kind of Leading Edge Products, where you engage in advanced development and things like that. The bulk of uh, Revenue today is, you know, 800 gig and 400 gig, right? So, um, uh, that's what's shipping today, uh, in production and a lot, but I think 1.6 is gets you in the door and kind of locks up all the, um, follow-on activity, um, uh, as the business scales. And I think demand is just crazy from what we are seeing. And it's, that's why we talk about data center ecosystem because it's the leading semiconductor vendors. It's leading Optical module developers. It's all the equipment manufacturers and developers, right? And then last but not the least, all the production, uh, capacity in the world, in China, Thailand, Vietnam. There is building these Optical modules Optical switches Optical products. So, um, it's pretty much playing up and down the entire
Um, uh, value chain and you generally get an anchor and you win with the Leading Edge with, with the, you know, kind of bleeding edge performance. So, I mean, we have just released our, um, in the June quarter, our second generation 1.6 terabytes, much of our compare competition. Just barely release their first generation. So we, uh, feel very good about, um, our performance, um, in that space. So,
Becoming leading customers for a lot of our, what are called field instrumentation or a fiber monitoring equipment that we traditionally sold into the carriers and service providers. And uh, that percentage has been rising, uh, quarter over quarter. And um, that's actually very positive thing because it's, uh, I mean, they view Network performance as core to their, uh, business model. And um, you know, uh, they're not the types that are being Penny wise and pound foolish and uh, they believe in investing significantly into monitoring and optimizing Network performance. So we feel pretty good about this. That's why, you know, I'm starting we I'm going to use a lot more uh, the data center uh, ecosystem because that's pretty much captures. A whole new segment that is growing very rapidly for us and I wouldn't be surprised that in couple years, it will be um, a bigger Market than the uh the traditional service provider business.
Great detail. Thank you, Alex.
Your next question comes from the line of right.
Ryan. Thanks for the question, and congrats on the quarter I guess within NSC. Could you unpack a little bit about, uh, what's going on, in the end markets there, across Broadband, Optical and Wireless in the quarter and then how you're thinking about that? Going into FY, 26.
Well, so I would say it's pretty much 5 or 5 and more fiber, all right? And um,
And within NSC, there is the, you know, I said there's a data center ecosystem so that your Sam is module systems and, uh, production. So, uh, that's all pulling in a volume today, 400 gig 800 gig and um, on the advanced development 1.6, terabytes shifting to service providers. Um, I would say cable, uh, I think is being pushed out by maybe a 1, to 2 quarters, um, you know, given all the other Dynamics going on with their upgrades, um, but it's very much a fiber and I would say um what we are seeing is it's a lot of the what I call uh, kind of specialty. Um, fiber companies that are focusing on data center interconnect and the hyperscale data center. Operators themselves that are now also, uh, popping up on the horizon. And of course there is the um, uh, the major fiber. Um, uh, interconnect and uh, 5.
Uh, service providers like the, the big North American Europeans that are, um, um, rolling out it, you know, their steady state deployments. And if I also then overlay, uh, the aggressive pronouncements, the number of North American fiber players been making about accelerating investment.
We actually starting to see uh, this verbage, migrating into the Supply Chain management and operations. And we already have number of customers engaging on, um, um, you know, significant order growth in the coming, um, 1 2 quarters. So, uh, that's why we're feeling much more positive, that, that across the board from the traditional, you know, uh, network carriers, um, you know, uh, rolling out fiber to the home all the way to the Specialists, who are optimizing their networks for, um, uh, hyperscale data center interconnect and AI data center. Interconnect all the way to the data centers on that, uh, filled space is looking pretty promising. I would say cable is probably going to be maybe some of it in December and then, uh, March quarter. I think they're clearly plans that I just kind of being pushed out due to, some of the, um, Financial dynamics of these operators.
And um, um I would say Wireless is the only kind of, um, a lagger in our portfolio. Um, I was thinking, you know, December quarter seeing nice pick up in the field instruments, that, you know, expansion is coming and so far, it's been really much about Network optimization and, you know, uh, improve getting more from what they've got. We haven't seen that much, uh, new deployment and uh, does our um um, infrastructure test, you know?
Which goes into the major um, names. Uh, has been somewhat anemic and I would have expected it to be picking up in the June quarter. Um, it doesn't seem like it's uh really moving that fast and I think we probably got another couple quarters of uh sluggishness until um it starts uh materializing, hope that helps.
To hear uh as a follow-up on that, as you mentioned, in your prepared remarks and given guidance uh 1 Q is going to be off from typical seasonality. How should we think about the rest of the year um, compared to regular seasonality?
well, you know, uh,
You know.
Three quarters does not make a trend.
We saw a much stronger, um, uh, March quarter because usually, if you look at kind of a traditional historically, the September quarter and the March quarter have been down quarters. Because, you know, if you purely follow the service provider, spend, they, you know, uh, they kind of release their budgets at the end of February, and then they just kind of goes through the year and so usually, some of them end, their fiscal year in June some if ended in the summer and there's usually where stronger Q uh, June and December quarters. All right, interesting, why is when we look at the data center ecosystem,
Uh, it's almost counter-cyclical. Um, they have a stronger, uh, demand. It seems to be uh, in the March quarter in September. Uh, they digest some of the deliveries in the June in December. So, in the way, this thing has kind of offset it but also with the um data center now becoming a buyer for field instruments. That's further. Um, mitigates that thing
So, for us, the only kind of cyclical thing left that I see is the, um, our Optical business where, you know, you follow the cyclicality of, uh, 3D sensing for the consumer. And there's a cyclicality for anti-counterfeiting with certain parts of the Year Stronger versus the other. So I'd say, we are we going to is our cyclicality over? I don't think so. I think it's just going to be more muted and, um, uh, more balanced. And if I look at the, um, Aerospace and defense, it's a design win driven business. So once you win platform and customer goes in production, it's actually fairly predictable linear, uh, orders that, uh, come in, uh, for these, uh, major programs. So I do expect, um, as both all these new businesses are growing for us, we probably would see less, you know, volatility, um, quarter on quarter than uh, has been in the past when we were heavily exposed to the service providers.
Great. Thank you.
Your next question comes from the line of meta Marshall with Morgan Stanley. Please go ahead.
Great, thanks. Um, and congrats Oleg just a couple of questions. Um, just can we just get like a, a rough size of the data center business? Um, you know, uh, in Q4, would be helpful and then just kind of the contribution of inertial labs, to kind of the q1 guide would be helpful. Thanks.
So um, let's just talk about NC just we take purely NC live, op out. Um as it stands right now, you know, uh with this thing, roughly uh, 50% of our Revenue comes from service provider and its way down from close to 90%. You know, when I joined this company and about 30% is what I would call the, um, um, uh, the data center ecosystem. So it's semis modules, um, you know, equipment vendors, um, and um, um, data center operators, right? And also includes some of the Enterprise, uh, customers. And I'll say, 20% is the Aerospace and defense. If I look back even like a year ago, the 50% was probably closer to 60 and uh, the, you know, uh, or even over 60 and the others were probably uh, around 20, and Below, 20% for Aerospace and defense. So um uh all segments have grown.
Um, I would say the service provider, I would say, gradual recovery thus far, and we do think it's going to accelerate, um, in the coming quarters with the number of these big uh fiber. Uh, deployments that are being planned, uh, but it's really the outside Data Center and Aerospace have grown quite significantly and with the acquisition of inertial labs. Um, we really have that segment, um, growing very, very rapidly. So, um, I would say so it's as of, you know, as you know, exiting June quarter, I say 503020.
And I would expect if you look at the year from now, if I had to look, um, I would say, maybe it will be a bit less than 50 and the other segments will be a bit bigger because they're just growing faster, uh, than, uh, the service provider sector.
The.
Sorry. Yeah, regarding your question, uh, International apps. You know, if you recall, when we announced the transaction, um, we mentioned around 50 million run rate a year, it's tracking above this number. Um, however, both you know, the fourth quarter and the number that we baked into the first quarter, um, is uh, also kind of, including some growth from the base Aerospace and defense business. It's not all about inertial EDS,
Okay, great. Thank you.
Your next question comes from the line of Andrew Panola with UBS. Please go ahead.
Thanks. Um, wanted to ask a similar question for q1, I guess, you know, if the normal seasonality would have been down, I don't know, 5%, something like that from Q4 to q1, how would you sort of describe the upside to that? Um, you know, which was the bigger contributor between Data Center and Aerospace, and defense can you can you split out which you know, how big the contribution was to that upside?
No, I think it's kind of getting into the segmentation that we don't disclose. So I mean they were both um, uh, very strong.
Okay, fair enough. Just trying to understand but um, want to ask it a margin question on NSC. Um, it was still in in kind of the low, I guess what? Mids single digits here for q1, trying to, what, what do you think you can get that? That margin to an NSC. You know what sort of Revenue do you need to get there? What what, what's your longer term thinking? Um, on the upside to that March
So, um, NSC as, uh, that business, uh, kind of recovers, you know, if you look at it. Um, uh, just prior to the Telecom meltdown in the September of, uh, calendar 22. Uh, we have, um, approached 20% operating margin on the NC business unit and that is before it had, um, um, significant uh, data center, exposure, and um, Aerospace and defense so data center. Uh uh margins are somewhat higher than the uh, service kind of the field instrumentation.
However, the Aerospace defense um is a bit lower. So it's a. So in the way they kind of offset each other. So net, net NSE will probably stay in the low 60s. Um uh gross margin. Uh but I would say um um I think that's pretty much I would say the profile of the uh, the margin. So when we look at that and we um, obviously made some Acquisitions, I think um, as we continue to grow in Data Center, and
Military airspace and, um, recovery continued recovery in the service provider. I think, um, our first goal is move comfortably into mid to high teens and then, um, into the, uh, 20s,
Longer term.
Great. Thank you.
Your next question comes from the line of mehdi Hazen.
Please go ahead.
Yes sir. Thanks for taking my follow-up questions, Oleg is great that you have the fiber and helps you with a bed and seasonal turn into the new fiscal year, but I'm a little bit. Um,
um,
Um, um, I'm a little bit cautious as to, what happens to the March quarter when um, cloud service providers. Uh, close the calendar year? Should we see the typical seasonality that happens in September or q1 fiscal year for you happens in the March quarter?
you know, I I I fully expect, you know, if I purely take the, um, service provider by without any, uh, kind of bluebirds where they have some big program, they want to spend, I think, um, you know, uh, but it, I mean, there's always going to be some cyclicality with that because you know, let's assume a steady state, the service providers will always buy a bit less in September and March but what we are having
To believe all these aggressive spend pronouncements that are coming from. Um you know, fiber operators and um others. Uh I think um I would imagine um there's going to be some strength in their spend, uh, that may spill over into the March quarter. So it may be a bit more muted but it's too early to talk because I really don't have any visibility in too much. I do have some visibility in December and it looks uh, very healthy in that respect.
Yeah, okay. And then, uh, double-clicking on OSB.
It seems to me that there is still a little bit of a lingering ASP pressure especially on the 3D sensing and then I'm looking at the margin profile for the q1 fiscal year. Um am I right with that thought process and what are the things that you do, you're doing to mitigate that? And and given as the following to it, given the fact that overall uh, OS smartphone unit Shipment has been kind of a low single digit over the past couple of years.
Could could we be hitting the bottom in terms of the 3D sensing opportunities for you? And if there is any uptake in OS, uni shipment could that also help mitigate the ASB pressure. Thank you.
Well, so, I mean, when we, when we think about the, um, ASP pressure on the let's say a 3D sensing consumer business, right? I mean, we've been uh, taking down costs, uh, pretty good. I mean, the reality is our margins have been able to maintain, um, margins in that business. I mean, the challenge there is volume. You know, we are very highly penetrated in that market segment and um and it's it's kind of uh fully saturated. So um the margins don't suffer um because we are able to reduce the cost to keep up with the ASP. Um, reduction. I think what's probably has been bigger problem. There is the the volume hasn't really grown because, you know, it's a, it's a good news, bad news, when you are highly penetrated at the particular customer, it's 1 on good news. You, you have the customer on the bad news. If the customer is not seeing much volume growth here on the year, uh, then it's not happening. So I think that's not the case. I think what you're seeing,
Um, the bigger impact on margins is really the mix and the anti-counterfeiting uh products between the older, um pigment Technologies and the newer. And depending on the, um,
Time of the year or major customers. Um, you are building either the lower margin mix product or the higher margin next product. And, um, that's the, um, um, I'd say that's probably a bigger swing factor in the quarter to quarter gross margin, um, on OSP. The second 1 is, um, I do believe ASP has stabilized Ops around rate. Uh, we are starting to grow a little bit, we have diversifying into new segments, we have a number of very promising applications and um market segments that we are entering that in the 2 to 3 years, will start bringing in some meaningful uh revenue and we'll see that segment to start growing again. So I think um um I'd say for op I think this fiscal year is kind of stabilization and gradual growth and then um um you know, a growing faster um as a new segment start materializing for that business and maybe just to Echo what to
Said, I mean, OSP generally is is a high falls through business. Yeah, and it's all volume based. I mean, the ASP is, is is not a factor or not in our projection right now. It's it's all about the and that's where we have our biggest fixed costs. I mean, if you see what those those factories, it's a lot of iron sitting on the floor.
But, but go, like just as a quick follow-up, you're not dialing.
Any impact from a changing form, factor, thinner, phone or foldable your. Um, and it's to me, if you're not factoring that in there, maybe there's no change in 3D sensing or
Or you're just being conservative, yeah.
Well, I mean, we're talking about today. I mean, clearly there's a road map, we have, um, a new products on a road map. I don't want to get into the specifics, but there's a lot of new engineering, which will probably, uh, result in some of the, um, ASP appreciation. Um, um, as we implement, this new form factors and some of these new opportunities because that's a, it's basically a new product that need to be, um, developed. And I don't want to go into, uh, specifics on that. So, right now we're talking about, mainly, what we're shipping in production, not, what's on the road now?
Okay, great. Thanks for details.
Sure, thank you.
That concludes our Q&A session. I will now turn the call back over to the booty near.
Thank you, Bella.
This concludes our earnings call for today. Thank you all for joining. Have a good afternoon.
ladies and gentlemen, that concludes today's call, thank you all for joining me now, disconnect everyone have a great night