Sirius XM Holdings Q4 2025 Sirius XM Holdings Inc Earnings Call | AllMind AI Earnings | AllMind AI
Q4 2025 Sirius XM Holdings Inc Earnings Call
Speaker #1: Greetings. Welcome to the SIRIUS XM fourth quarter and full year 2025 earnings conference call. participants will be in listen-only mode. At this time, all A question-and-answer session will follow the formal should require operator assistance, please press star zero on your telephone keypad.
Operator: Greetings! Welcome to the SiriusXM Q4 and full year 2025 earnings conference call. At this time, all participants will be in listen-only mode. A question-and-answer session will follow the formal presentation. If anyone should require operator assistance, please press star zero on your telephone keypad. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. Now, my pleasure to introduce Maggie Mitchell, Senior Vice President, Corporate Communications. Thank you, Maggie. You may begin.
Operator: Greetings! Welcome to the SiriusXM Q4 and full year 2025 earnings conference call. At this time, all participants will be in listen-only mode. A question-and-answer session will follow the formal presentation. If anyone should require operator assistance, please press star zero on your telephone keypad. As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. Now, my pleasure to introduce Maggie Mitchell, Senior Vice President, Corporate Communications. Thank you, Maggie. You may begin.
Speaker #1: As a reminder, this conference is being recorded. Now, my pleasure to introduce Maggie Mitchell, Senior Vice President, Corporate Communications. Thank you, Maggie. You may
Speaker #1: begin. Thank you, and good
Maggie Mitchell: Thank you, and good morning, everyone. Welcome to SiriusXM's Q4 and full year 2025 earnings conference call. Today, we will have prepared remarks from Jennifer Witz, our Chief Executive Officer, and Zach Coughlin, our Chief Financial Officer. Scott Greenstein, our President and Chief Content Officer, as well as Wayne Thorson, Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer, will join Jennifer and Zach to take your questions during the Q&A portion of this call. I would like to remind everyone that certain statements made during the call might be forward-looking statements as the term is defined in the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These and all forward-looking statements are based upon management's current beliefs and expectations and necessarily depend upon assumptions, data, or methods that may be incorrect or imprecise.
Maggie Mitchell: Thank you, and good morning, everyone. Welcome to SiriusXM's Q4 and full year 2025 earnings conference call. Today, we will have prepared remarks from Jennifer Witz, our Chief Executive Officer, and Zach Coughlin, our Chief Financial Officer. Scott Greenstein, our President and Chief Content Officer, as well as Wayne Thorson, Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer, will join Jennifer and Zach to take your questions during the Q&A portion of this call. I would like to remind everyone that certain statements made during the call might be forward-looking statements as the term is defined in the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995. These and all forward-looking statements are based upon management's current beliefs and expectations and necessarily depend upon assumptions, data, or methods that may be incorrect or imprecise.
Speaker #2: morning, everyone. Welcome to SIRIUS XM's fourth quarter and full year 2025 earnings conference call. Today, we will have prepared remarks from Jennifer Witz, our Chief Executive Officer, and Zach Coughlin, our Chief Financial Officer.
Speaker #2: Zach Greenstein, our President and Chief Content Officer, as well as Wayne Thorsen, Executive Vice President and Chief Operating Officer, will join Jennifer and Zach to take your questions during the Q&A portion of this call.
Speaker #2: I would like to remind everyone that certain statements made during the call might be forward-looking statements, as the term is defined in the Private Securities Litigation Reform Act of 1995.
Speaker #2: These and all forward-looking statements are based upon management's current beliefs and expectations, and necessarily depend upon assumptions, data, or methods that may be incorrect or imprecise.
Speaker #2: Such forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. For more information about those risks and uncertainties, please use SIRIUS XM's SEC filings and today's earnings release.
Maggie Mitchell: Such forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. For more information about those risks and uncertainties, please view SiriusXM's SEC filings and today's earnings release. We advise listeners to not rely unduly on forward-looking statements and disclaim any intent or obligation to update them. As we begin, I'd like to remind our listeners that today's call will include discussions about both actual results and adjusted results. All discussions of adjusted operating results exclude the effects of stock-based compensation. Additionally, we have posted a supplementary presentation on our investor relations website for your convenience. With that, I'll hand the call over to Jennifer.
Maggie Mitchell: Such forward-looking statements are subject to risks and uncertainties that could cause actual results to differ materially. For more information about those risks and uncertainties, please view SiriusXM's SEC filings and today's earnings release. We advise listeners to not rely unduly on forward-looking statements and disclaim any intent or obligation to update them. As we begin, I'd like to remind our listeners that today's call will include discussions about both actual results and adjusted results. All discussions of adjusted operating results exclude the effects of stock-based compensation. Additionally, we have posted a supplementary presentation on our investor relations website for your convenience. With that, I'll hand the call over to Jennifer.
Speaker #2: We advise listeners not to rely unduly on forward-looking statements and disclaim any intent or obligation to update them. As we begin, I'd like to remind our listeners that today's call will include discussions about results.
Speaker #2: All discussions of adjusted operating results exclude the effects of stock-based compensation. Additionally, we have posted a supplementary presentation on our investor relations website for your convenience.
Speaker #2: With that, I'll hand the call over
Speaker #2: With that, I'll hand the call over to Jennifer. Good morning,
Jennifer Witz: Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us today. In 2025, we delivered on our commitments and finished the year with strong Q4 results, exceeding our guidance and growing free cash flow year over year. We achieved this by strengthening our subscription offerings, growing our advertising business, and leveraging the power of our broader portfolio to drive meaningful efficiencies and harness new opportunities. Following the refocused strategy we laid out at the end of December 2024, we have remained laser-focused on bolstering our core SiriusXM in-car audience and expanding the reach of our ad network.
Jennifer Witz: Good morning, everyone. Thank you for joining us today. In 2025, we delivered on our commitments and finished the year with strong Q4 results, exceeding our guidance and growing free cash flow year-over-year. We achieved this by strengthening our subscription offerings, growing our advertising business, and leveraging the power of our broader portfolio to drive meaningful efficiencies and harness new opportunities. Following the refocused strategy we laid out at the end of December 2024, we have remained laser-focused on bolstering our core SiriusXM in-car audience and expanding the reach of our ad network.
Speaker #3: Everyone, thank you for joining us today. In 2025, we delivered on our commitment and finished the year with strong Q4 results, exceeding our guidance and growing free cash flow year over year.
Speaker #3: We achieved this by strengthening our subscription offering, growing our advertising business, and leveraging the power of our broader portfolio to drive meaningful efficiencies and harness new opportunities.
Speaker #3: Following the refocused strategy we laid out at the end of December 2024, we have remained laser-focused on bolstering our core Sirius XM in-car audience and expanding the reach of our ad network.
Speaker #3: As a result, we've exceeded our revised guidance, achieving 8.56 billion dollars in revenue, 2.67 billion dollars in adjusted EBITDA, and 1.26 billion dollars in free cash flow, with a clear path to our target of 1.5 billion dollars in free cash flow in 2027.
Jennifer Witz: As a result, we've exceeded our revised guidance, achieving $8.56 billion in revenue, $2.67 billion in Adjusted EBITDA, and $1.26 billion in free cash flow, with a clear path to our target of $1.5 billion in free cash flow in 2027. Now let's dive into our subscription business. Throughout the year, we continued to deliver unique programming that drives connection and passion with our subscribers. First, we signed a new three-year agreement with the king of all media, Howard Stern. Our long-standing relationship with Howard helped to define SiriusXM in its early days, and today, he's more relevant than ever, achieving 32% year-over-year increase in earned media with A-list interviews and must-hear moments. With this new agreement, we've cemented Howard's place in our lineup for years to come.
Jennifer Witz: As a result, we've exceeded our revised guidance, achieving $8.56 billion in revenue, $2.67 billion in Adjusted EBITDA, and $1.26 billion in free cash flow, with a clear path to our target of $1.5 billion in free cash flow in 2027. Now let's dive into our subscription business. Throughout the year, we continued to deliver unique programming that drives connection and passion with our subscribers. First, we signed a new three-year agreement with the king of all media, Howard Stern. Our long-standing relationship with Howard helped to define SiriusXM in its early days, and today, he's more relevant than ever, achieving 32% year-over-year increase in earned media with A-list interviews and must-hear moments. With this new agreement, we've cemented Howard's place in our lineup for years to come.
Speaker #3: Now, let's dive into our subscription business. Throughout the year, we continued to deliver unique programming that drives connection and passion with our subscribers. First, we signed a new three-year agreement with the king of all media, Howard Stern.
Speaker #3: Our long-standing relationship with Howard helped to define SIRIUS XM in its early days, and today, he's more relevant than ever, achieving 32% year-over-year increase in earned media, with A-list interviews and must-hear moments.
Speaker #3: With this new agreement, we've cemented Howard's place in our lineup for years to come. Simultaneously, we've continued to grow and strengthen our bench of influential voices across music, sports, news, culture, and more.
Jennifer Witz: Simultaneously, we've continued to grow and strengthen our bench of influential voices across music, sports, news, culture, and more. We super serve passionate fan bases with dedicated league and artist channels, intimate live events, and the ability to interact directly with on-air hosts, ranging from beloved personalities on daily formats, such as the Morning Mash-Up, to industry heavyweights, including John Mayer, Mad Dog, and many more. Our new Metallica channel is commanding a strong audience, outperforming our benchmarks. Additionally, we're seeing very positive engagement and passion from fans listening to our Unwell Music channel with Alex Cooper, part of our broader deal with the Call Her Daddy host. We also closed out the year with our fan favorite slate of holiday channels, with even more time spent listening to these channels than last year. Our unrivaled offering of sports audio content remains a key differentiator for us.
Jennifer Witz: Simultaneously, we've continued to grow and strengthen our bench of influential voices across music, sports, news, culture, and more. We super serve passionate fan bases with dedicated league and artist channels, intimate live events, and the ability to interact directly with on-air hosts, ranging from beloved personalities on daily formats, such as the Morning Mash-Up, to industry heavyweights, including John Mayer, Mad Dog, and many more. Our new Metallica channel is commanding a strong audience, outperforming our benchmarks. Additionally, we're seeing very positive engagement and passion from fans listening to our Unwell Music channel with Alex Cooper, part of our broader deal with the Call Her Daddy host. We also closed out the year with our fan favorite slate of holiday channels, with even more time spent listening to these channels than last year. Our unrivaled offering of sports audio content remains a key differentiator for us.
Speaker #3: We super-serve passionate fan bases with dedicated league and artist channels, intimate live events, and the ability to interact directly with on-air hosts, ranging from beloved personalities on daily formats such as The Morning Mashup to industry heavyweights including John Mayer, Mad Dog, and many more.
Speaker #3: Our new Metallica channel is commanding a strong audience, outperforming our benchmarks. Additionally, we're seeing very positive engagement and passion from fans listening to our unwell music channel with Alex Cooper, part of our broader deal with the Call Her Daddy host.
Speaker #3: We also closed out the year with our fan-favorite slate of holiday channels, with even more time spent listening to these channels than last year.
Speaker #3: Our unrivaled offering of sports audio content remains a key differentiator for us. With agreements with every major North American sports league and rights to more than 100 college teams, SIRIUS XM gives sports fans access to more live games and events than any other single media outlet or service.
Jennifer Witz: With agreements with every major North American sports league and rights to more than 100 college teams, SiriusXM gives sports fans access to more live games and events than any other single media outlet or service. Sports listening is up year-over-year, both in-car and on streaming, with audience gains in areas including NFL, NHL, and NBA play-by-play. In Q4, we extended our agreement with the NBA and launched new shows covering everything from the business of basketball to Italy's top soccer league. As we look ahead, we will continue to build programming around major events and milestones, including the Super Bowl and the World Cup. SiriusXM has always offered a broad set of perspectives across political lines.
Jennifer Witz: With agreements with every major North American sports league and rights to more than 100 college teams, SiriusXM gives sports fans access to more live games and events than any other single media outlet or service. Sports listening is up year-over-year, both in-car and on streaming, with audience gains in areas including NFL, NHL, and NBA play-by-play. In Q4, we extended our agreement with the NBA and launched new shows covering everything from the business of basketball to Italy's top soccer league. As we look ahead, we will continue to build programming around major events and milestones, including the Super Bowl and the World Cup. SiriusXM has always offered a broad set of perspectives across political lines.
Speaker #3: Sports listening is up year-over-year both in-car and on streaming, with audience gains in areas including NBA play-by-play. In Q4, we extended our agreement with the NBA and launched new shows covering everything from the business of basketball to Italy's top soccer league.
Speaker #3: As we look ahead, we will continue to build programming around major events and milestones, including the Super Bowl and the World Cup. And SIRIUS XM has always offered a broad set of perspectives across political lines, and Q4, we launched a full-time Megyn Kelly channel and, to help kick off 2026, Chris Cuomo has joined our lineup with an exclusive daily political show on the POTUS channel.
Jennifer Witz: In Q4, we launched a full-time Megyn Kelly channel, and to help kick off 2026, Chris Cuomo has joined our lineup with an exclusive daily political show on the POTUS channel. From a product and service perspective, our focus has been on enhancing what we do best. In the fourth quarter, we launched our new automotive Pandora app with a select set of partners, including GM, which builds the music streaming platform more directly into the vehicle where we have a leading position. 360L penetration further expands each year, now in more than half of new SiriusXM-enabled vehicle sales and representing an increasing portion of our self-pay subscribers and the 180 million enabled fleet on the road today.
Jennifer Witz: In Q4, we launched a full-time Megyn Kelly channel, and to help kick off 2026, Chris Cuomo has joined our lineup with an exclusive daily political show on the POTUS channel. From a product and service perspective, our focus has been on enhancing what we do best. In the Q4, we launched our new automotive Pandora app with a select set of partners, including GM, which builds the music streaming platform more directly into the vehicle where we have a leading position. 360L penetration further expands each year, now in more than half of new SiriusXM-enabled vehicle sales and representing an increasing portion of our self-pay subscribers and the 180 million enabled fleet on the road today.
Speaker #3: From a product and service perspective, our focus has been on enhancing what we do best. In the fourth quarter, we launched our new automotive Pandora app with a select set of partners, including GM, which builds the music streaming platform more directly into the vehicle, where we have a leading position.
Speaker #3: 360L penetration further expands each year, now in more than half of new SIRIUS XM-enabled vehicle sales, and representing an increasing portion of our self-pay subscribers and the 180 million enabled fleet on the road grow with this next-generation platform now available in all new Volvos, standard on enabled Audis, and debuting in the 2026 Toyota RAV4.
Jennifer Witz: This year will continue to grow, with this next-generation platform now available in all new Volvos, standard on enabled Audis, and debuting in the 2026 Toyota RAV4. 360L, combined with our streaming platform, provides increased observability across listening, content, and product usage, with measurable insights allowing us to improve personalization and drive deeper engagement, leading to increased customer satisfaction. We've also made major strides in simplifying the overall customer experience and driving value. In Q4, we launched continuous service, a new capability which reduces the friction subscribers experience when changing vehicles as part of our efforts to remain consumer-centric. This functionality maintains the customer's listening history, account credentials, and other attributes, and also keeps their streaming service active, giving them the ability to continue enjoying the service while they move between vehicles.
Jennifer Witz: This year will continue to grow, with this next-generation platform now available in all new Volvos, standard on enabled Audis, and debuting in the 2026 Toyota RAV4. 360L, combined with our streaming platform, provides increased observability across listening, content, and product usage, with measurable insights allowing us to improve personalization and drive deeper engagement, leading to increased customer satisfaction. We've also made major strides in simplifying the overall customer experience and driving value. In Q4, we launched continuous service, a new capability which reduces the friction subscribers experience when changing vehicles as part of our efforts to remain consumer-centric. This functionality maintains the customer's listening history, account credentials, and other attributes, and also keeps their streaming service active, giving them the ability to continue enjoying the service while they move between vehicles.
Speaker #3: streaming platform, provides 360L, combined with our increased observability across listening, content, and product usage, with measurable insights allowing us to improve personalization and drive deeper engagement leading to increased customer satisfaction.
Speaker #3: We've also made major strides in simplifying the overall customer experience and driving value. In Q4, we launched continuous service, a new capability which reduces the friction subscribers experience when changing vehicles, as part of our efforts to remain consumer-centric.
Speaker #3: This functionality maintains the customer's listening history, account credentials, and other attributes, and also keeps their streaming service active, giving them the ability to continue enjoying the service while they move between vehicles.
Speaker #3: We expect this will have benefits in customer satisfaction and retention, while also laying the groundwork for future enhancements that make the process even easier, solving a pain point for many of our dedicated listeners.
Jennifer Witz: We expect this will have benefits in customer satisfaction and retention, while also laying the groundwork for future enhancements that make the process even easier, solving a pain point for many of our dedicated listeners. This quarter, we also introduced companion subscriptions, as we continually improve the value of our plans and packages and provide greater differentiation between tiers. Our version of the family plan, companion subscriptions, allow our most loyal full-price customers to add a vehicle or streaming login at no additional cost. This is another step towards offering a suite of family plans that make it easier than ever for our loyal customers to share what they love across their households. We've also seen positive growth in our newer tailored package offerings. Our multiyear automotive dealer subscription program, which first launched in 2024, is now in more than 15 brands across North America.
Jennifer Witz: We expect this will have benefits in customer satisfaction and retention, while also laying the groundwork for future enhancements that make the process even easier, solving a pain point for many of our dedicated listeners. This quarter, we also introduced companion subscriptions, as we continually improve the value of our plans and packages and provide greater differentiation between tiers. Our version of the family plan, companion subscriptions, allow our most loyal full-price customers to add a vehicle or streaming login at no additional cost. This is another step towards offering a suite of family plans that make it easier than ever for our loyal customers to share what they love across their households. We've also seen positive growth in our newer tailored package offerings. Our multiyear automotive dealer subscription program, which first launched in 2024, is now in more than 15 brands across North America.
Speaker #3: This quarter, we also introduced companion subscriptions, as we continually improve the value of our plans and packages and provide greater differentiation between tiers. Our version of the family plan, companion subscriptions allow our most loyal full-price customers to add a vehicle or streaming login at no additional cost.
Speaker #3: This is another step towards offering a suite of family plans that make it easier than ever for our loyal customers to share what they love across their our newer tailored package households.
Speaker #3: We've also seen positive growth in offerings. Our multi-year automotive dealer subscription program, which first launched in 2024, is now in more than 15 brands across North America.
Speaker #3: We've also continued the thoughtful rollout of Play, which is now being expanded to a broader set of our new trialers. We are seeing positive indicators that it is driving conversion interest and subscriptions across all packages, widening the top of the funnel.
Jennifer Witz: We've also continued the thoughtful rollout of Play, which is now being expanded to a broader set of our new trialers. We are seeing positive indicators that it is driving conversion interest and subscriptions across all packages, widening the top of the funnel. Additionally, our Podcast Plus subscription has scaled. It now includes new shows and is available for purchase across Apple, Spotify, and more. Moving to the topic of advertising, 2025 was the year we secured our leadership position in digital audio advertising across a scaled audience of 170 million listeners. Throughout the year, we continued to deepen our podcast bench with disciplined investments in top shows and creators. We are now the number one podcast network in the nation and proudly had half of the nominees in the first-ever best podcast category at the Golden Globes last month.
Jennifer Witz: We've also continued the thoughtful rollout of Play, which is now being expanded to a broader set of our new trialers. We are seeing positive indicators that it is driving conversion interest and subscriptions across all packages, widening the top of the funnel. Additionally, our Podcast Plus subscription has scaled. It now includes new shows and is available for purchase across Apple, Spotify, and more. Moving to the topic of advertising, 2025 was the year we secured our leadership position in digital audio advertising across a scaled audience of 170 million listeners. Throughout the year, we continued to deepen our podcast bench with disciplined investments in top shows and creators. We are now the number one podcast network in the nation and proudly had half of the nominees in the first-ever best podcast category at the Golden Globes last month.
Speaker #3: Additionally, our podcast plus subscription has scaled. It now includes new shows and is available for purchase across Apple, Spotify, and more. Moving to the topic of advertising, 2025 was the year we secured our leadership position in digital audio advertising across a scaled audience of 170 million listeners.
Speaker #3: Throughout the year, we continued to deepen our podcast bench with disciplined investments in top shows and creators. We are now the number one podcast network in the nation, and proudly had half of the nominees in the first-ever Best Podcast category at the Golden Globes last month.
Speaker #3: Our podcasting ad revenue grew 41% for the full year, on top of double-digit growth—a testament to all the work we've done to extend our lead in this arena.
Jennifer Witz: Our podcasting ad revenue grew 41% for the full year, on top of double-digit growth in 2024, a testament to all the work we've done to extend our lead in this arena. Additionally, podcast programmatic demand has continued to grow, up more than 92% over Q4 2024, as digital buyers recognize the channel's reach. Beyond our digital audio ad sales business, our advertising technology capabilities are expanding, offering services to major audio players around the world. Additionally, our cross-platform sales strategy, incorporating social and video components from top creators such as MrBallen, continued to scale, with video and social revenue up 4 times year-over-year. As audiences increasingly engage with podcasts through video and social platforms, we are able to effectively monetize this shift with our omni-channel capabilities, allowing us to tap into brand budgets beyond audio.
Jennifer Witz: Our podcasting ad revenue grew 41% for the full year, on top of double-digit growth in 2024, a testament to all the work we've done to extend our lead in this arena. Additionally, podcast programmatic demand has continued to grow, up more than 92% over Q4 2024, as digital buyers recognize the channel's reach. Beyond our digital audio ad sales business, our advertising technology capabilities are expanding, offering services to major audio players around the world. Additionally, our cross-platform sales strategy, incorporating social and video components from top creators such as MrBallen, continued to scale, with video and social revenue up 4 times year-over-year. As audiences increasingly engage with podcasts through video and social platforms, we are able to effectively monetize this shift with our omni-channel capabilities, allowing us to tap into brand budgets beyond audio.
Speaker #3: growth in 2024, a Additionally, podcast programmatic demand has continued to grow, up more than 92% over Q4 2024, as digital buyers recognized the channel's reach.
Speaker #3: Beyond our digital audio ad sales business, our advertising technology capabilities are expanding. Offering services to major audio players around the world, additionally, our cross-platform sales strategy incorporating social and video components from top creators such as Mr. Bolin continued to scale.
Speaker #3: With video and social revenue up four times year over year, as audiences increasingly engage with podcasts through video and social platforms, we are able to effectively monetize this shift with our omnichannel capabilities, allowing us to tap into brand budgets beyond audio.
Speaker #3: As we look ahead to 2026, we are maintaining our sharpened focus and are committed to strengthening our business and our leadership in audio. Our guidance anticipates mostly flat revenue on slightly lower subscribers, alongside stable adjusted EBITDA for the first time in three years, with further growth in free cash flow.
Jennifer Witz: As we look ahead to 2026, we are maintaining our sharpened focus and our commitment to strengthening our business and our leadership in audio. Our guidance anticipates mostly flat revenue on slightly lower subscribers, alongside stable Adjusted EBITDA for the first time in three years, with further growth in free cash flow. We are continuing to explore and capitalize on opportunities to leverage our assets moving forward, including our talent agreements, our ad sales expertise and ad tech, our 180 million vehicles in operation, and our 35 megahertz of contiguous spectrum. Overall, 2025 was a successful year, where we were able to achieve both immediate impact and lay the groundwork for long-term results across the business.
Jennifer Witz: As we look ahead to 2026, we are maintaining our sharpened focus and our commitment to strengthening our business and our leadership in audio. Our guidance anticipates mostly flat revenue on slightly lower subscribers, alongside stable Adjusted EBITDA for the first time in three years, with further growth in free cash flow. We are continuing to explore and capitalize on opportunities to leverage our assets moving forward, including our talent agreements, our ad sales expertise and ad tech, our 180 million vehicles in operation, and our 35 megahertz of contiguous spectrum. Overall, 2025 was a successful year, where we were able to achieve both immediate impact and lay the groundwork for long-term results across the business.
Speaker #3: We are continuing to explore and capitalize on opportunities to leverage our assets moving forward, including our talent agreements, our ad sales expertise and ad tech, our 180 million vehicles in operation, and our 35 megahertz of continuous spectrum.
Speaker #3: Overall, 2025 was a successful year where we were able to achieve both immediate impact and lay the groundwork for long-term results across the business.
Speaker #3: We delivered exceptional listener experiences and meaningful value to marketers, exceeded our cost-savings target, and drove disciplined execution that improved free cash flow and positions us for continued momentum.
Jennifer Witz: We delivered exceptional listener experiences and meaningful value to marketers, exceeded our cost savings target, maintained our dividends, strengthened our balance sheet, and drove disciplined executions that improved free cash flow and positions us for continued momentum. Enabling us to maintain our financial rigor and achieve our goals for 2026 is our new Chief Financial Officer, Zach Coughlin. Zach brings significant experience driving sustainable, profitable growth at a variety of public companies, and we're thrilled to have him leading our finance function here at SiriusXM. He has already hit the ground running and is focused on maintaining a strong balance sheet, driving margins, and optimizing our cash flows, all with the goal of increasing shareholder value. With that, I'll turn it over to Zach for more on the financial results.
Jennifer Witz: We delivered exceptional listener experiences and meaningful value to marketers, exceeded our cost savings target, maintained our dividends, strengthened our balance sheet, and drove disciplined executions that improved free cash flow and positions us for continued momentum. Enabling us to maintain our financial rigor and achieve our goals for 2026 is our new Chief Financial Officer, Zach Coughlin. Zach brings significant experience driving sustainable, profitable growth at a variety of public companies, and we're thrilled to have him leading our finance function here at SiriusXM. He has already hit the ground running and is focused on maintaining a strong balance sheet, driving margins, and optimizing our cash flows, all with the goal of increasing shareholder value. With that, I'll turn it over to Zach for more on the financial results.
Speaker #3: Enabling us to maintain our financial rigor and achieve our goals for 2026 is our new Chief Financial Officer, Zach Coughlin. Zach brings significant experience driving sustainable, profitable growth at a variety of public companies and we're thrilled to have him leading our finance function here at SIRIUS XM.
Speaker #3: He has already hit the ground running and is focused on maintaining a strong balance sheet, driving margins, and optimizing our cash flows, all with the goal of increasing shareholder value.
Speaker #3: With that, I'll turn it over to Zach for more on the financials.
Speaker #3: results.
Speaker #2: Thank you, Jennifer, and good
Zach Coughlin: Thank you, Jennifer, and good morning, everyone. Before I dive into the numbers, I wanted to start by saying how excited I am to be here speaking with you today on my first earnings call as SiriusXM's CFO. I officially joined on 1 January 2024, and I've been incredibly impressed by the depth of the team, the durability of this business, and the passion behind our brands. I look forward to getting to know many of you in the analyst and investor community in the weeks and months ahead. I also want to extend a sincere thank you to Tom Barry for his leadership, partnership, and for ensuring a thoughtful and seamless transition. Tom leaves this company in a position of strength, and I'm grateful for the foundation he and the rest of the finance team helped build.
Zach Coughlin: Thank you, Jennifer, and good morning, everyone. Before I dive into the numbers, I wanted to start by saying how excited I am to be here speaking with you today on my first earnings call as SiriusXM's CFO. I officially joined on 1 January 2024, and I've been incredibly impressed by the depth of the team, the durability of this business, and the passion behind our brands. I look forward to getting to know many of you in the analyst and investor community in the weeks and months ahead. I also want to extend a sincere thank you to Tom Barry for his leadership, partnership, and for ensuring a thoughtful and seamless transition. Tom leaves this company in a position of strength, and I'm grateful for the foundation he and the rest of the finance team helped build.
Speaker #2: Morning, everyone. Before I dive into the numbers, I wanted to start by saying how excited I am to be here speaking with you today on my first earnings call as Sirius XM's CFO.
Speaker #2: I officially joined on January 1, and I've been incredibly impressed by the depth of the team, the durability of this business, and the passion behind our brands.
Speaker #2: I look forward to getting to know many of you in weeks and months ahead. I also want to extend a sincere thank you to Tom Berry for his leadership, partnership, and for ensuring a thoughtful and seamless transition.
Speaker #2: Tom leaves his company in a position of strength, and I'm grateful for the foundation he and the rest of the finance team helped build.
Speaker #2: Turning to the business, we closed out 2025 with solid priorities. We sustained healthy margins, generated strong and growing free cash flow, continued to make disciplined investments in our platform and distribution, and delivered another year of meaningful cost efficiencies.
Zach Coughlin: Turning to the business, we closed out 2025 with solid execution against our financial and strategic priorities. We sustained healthy margins, generated strong and growing free cash flow, continued to make disciplined investments on our platform and distribution, and delivered another year of meaningful cost efficiencies. At the same time, we sharpened our focus on subscriber profitability and higher return marketing and technology initiatives. For the full year, we delivered revenue of $8.56 billion, modestly ahead of our raised revenue guidance, which we'd increased on our Q3 call. Total subscription revenue was $6.49 billion, down 2% year-over-year. Results reflected the benefit of our March rate increase, offset by a slightly smaller average self-pay subscriber base.
Zach Coughlin: Turning to the business, we closed out 2025 with solid execution against our financial and strategic priorities. We sustained healthy margins, generated strong and growing free cash flow, continued to make disciplined investments on our platform and distribution, and delivered another year of meaningful cost efficiencies. At the same time, we sharpened our focus on subscriber profitability and higher return marketing and technology initiatives. For the full year, we delivered revenue of $8.56 billion, modestly ahead of our raised revenue guidance, which we'd increased on our Q3 call. Total subscription revenue was $6.49 billion, down 2% year-over-year. Results reflected the benefit of our March rate increase, offset by a slightly smaller average self-pay subscriber base.
Speaker #2: At the same time, we sharpened our focus on subscriber profitability and higher-return marketing and technology initiatives. For the full year, we delivered revenue of $8.56 billion, modestly ahead of our raised revenue guidance, which we'd increased on our third quarter call.
Speaker #2: Total subscription revenue was $6.49 billion, down 2% year over year. Results reflected the benefit of our March rate increase, offset by a slightly smaller average self-pay subscriber base.
Speaker #2: Advertising revenue was $1.77 billion, roughly flat year over year, driven primarily by strength in podcasting and improving programmatic demand late in the year, offsetting ongoing weakness in streaming music advertising.
Zach Coughlin: Advertising revenue was $1.77 billion, roughly flat year-over-year, driven primarily by strength in podcasting and improving programmatic demand late in the year, offsetting ongoing weakness in streaming music advertising. Full-year Adjusted EBITDA was $2.67 billion, resulting in a margin of 31% and modestly ahead of our most recent guidance, which we also increased during the Q3 call. Net income was $805 million, marking a significant increase from prior year's -$2.1 billion, driven by the impairment charge associated with the Liberty Media transaction. Earnings per diluted share was $2.23, also significantly up from -$6.14 in the prior year. In the fourth quarter, we delivered $2.19 billion in total revenue, largely flat year-over-year.
Zach Coughlin: Advertising revenue was $1.77 billion, roughly flat year-over-year, driven primarily by strength in podcasting and improving programmatic demand late in the year, offsetting ongoing weakness in streaming music advertising. Full-year Adjusted EBITDA was $2.67 billion, resulting in a margin of 31% and modestly ahead of our most recent guidance, which we also increased during the Q3 call. Net income was $805 million, marking a significant increase from prior year's -$2.1 billion, driven by the impairment charge associated with the Liberty Media transaction. Earnings per diluted share was $2.23, also significantly up from -$6.14 in the prior year. In the Q4, we delivered $2.19 billion in total revenue, largely flat year-over-year.
Speaker #2: Full year adjusted EBITDA was $2.67 billion, resulting in a margin of 31% and modestly ahead of our most recent guidance, which we also increased during the third quarter call.
Speaker #2: Net income was $805 million, marking a significant increase from the prior year's negative $2.1 billion, driven by the impairment charge associated with the Liberty Media transaction.
Speaker #2: Earnings per diluted share was $2.23, also significantly up from negative $6.14 in the prior year. In the fourth quarter, we delivered $2.19 billion in total revenue, largely flat year over year.
Speaker #2: Subscription revenue totaled $1.63 billion, down slightly year over year, while advertising revenue was $491 million, up 3% compared to 2024's fourth quarter, reflecting strong growth on top of elevated political spending last year.
Zach Coughlin: Subscription revenue totaled $1.63 billion, down slightly year over year, while advertising revenue was $491 million, up 3% compared to 2024's fourth quarter, reflecting strong growth on top of elevated political spending last year. Overall, growth was driven by continued strength in podcasting and improving demand trends late in the quarter. Adjusted EBITDA for the quarter was $691 million, up slightly year over year from $688 million in 2024. As expected, free cash flow remained heavily back weighted. Fourth quarter free cash flow was $541 million, a Q4 record, and up 5% year over year, bringing full year free cash flow to $1.26 billion.
Zach Coughlin: Subscription revenue totaled $1.63 billion, down slightly year-over-year, while advertising revenue was $491 million, up 3% compared to 2024's Q4, reflecting strong growth on top of elevated political spending last year. Overall, growth was driven by continued strength in podcasting and improving demand trends late in the quarter. Adjusted EBITDA for the quarter was $691 million, up slightly year-over-year from $688 million in 2024. As expected, free cash flow remained heavily back weighted. Q4 free cash flow was $541 million, a Q4 record, and up 5% year-over-year, bringing full year free cash flow to $1.26 billion.
Speaker #2: Overall, growth was driven by continued strength in podcasting and improving demand trends late in the quarter. Adjusted EBITDA for the quarter was $691 million, up slightly year over year from $688 million in 2024.
Speaker #2: As expected, free cash flow remained heavily backweighted. Fourth quarter free cash flow was $541 million, a Q4 record, and up 5% year over year.
Speaker #2: Bringing full-year free cash flow to $1.26 billion. This means we finished ahead of our original $1.15 billion guidance by over $100 million, reflecting continued operating discipline, lower cash taxes, and lower capital spend following the completion of our two most recent satellites.
Zach Coughlin: This means we finished ahead of our original $1.15 billion guidance by over $100 million, reflecting continued operating discipline, lower cash taxes, and lower capital spend following the completion of our two most recent satellites. Our full year free cash flow conversion was 47%, reflecting improved cash efficiency relative to the prior year, which included Liberty transaction-related impacts. Turning to the segments. In the SiriusXM segment, we generated $1.61 billion of revenue in Q4 and $6.42 billion for the full year, including $5.96 billion of subscriber revenue. Full year revenue declined by 2%, as the benefit of the March rate increase was more than offset by a slightly lower average self-pay subscriber base, and plan mix changes within our base.
Zach Coughlin: This means we finished ahead of our original $1.15 billion guidance by over $100 million, reflecting continued operating discipline, lower cash taxes, and lower capital spend following the completion of our two most recent satellites. Our full year free cash flow conversion was 47%, reflecting improved cash efficiency relative to the prior year, which included Liberty transaction-related impacts. Turning to the segments. In the SiriusXM segment, we generated $1.61 billion of revenue in Q4 and $6.42 billion for the full year, including $5.96 billion of subscriber revenue. Full year revenue declined by 2%, as the benefit of the March rate increase was more than offset by a slightly lower average self-pay subscriber base, and plan mix changes within our base.
Speaker #2: Our full year free cash flow conversion was $47%, reflecting improved cash efficiency relative to the prior year, which included Liberty transaction-related impacts. Turning to the segments, in the SIRIUS XM segment, we generated $1.61 billion of revenue in Q4 and $6.42 billion for the full year, including $5.96 billion of subscriber revenue.
Speaker #2: Full-year revenue declined by 2%, as the benefit of the March rate increase was more than offset by a slightly lower average self-pay subscriber base and planned mix changes within our base.
Speaker #2: Segment gross profit for the fourth quarter was $955 million, and $3.82 billion for the full year, both representing a gross margin of 59%, close to last year's 60% for Q4 and full year.
Zach Coughlin: Segment gross profit for the fourth quarter was $955 million and $3.82 billion for the full year, both representing a gross margin of 59%, close to last year's 60% for Q4 and full year. On subscriber metrics. Fourth quarter self-pay net adds were a positive 110,000. That reflects contributions from the continuous service initiative that Jennifer mentioned earlier, as well as the earlier than planned introduction of companion subscriptions, which contributed approximately 80,000 incremental self-pay net adds during the quarter. These benefits were more than offset by the expected reductions in streaming subscribers and lower conversion rates, resulting in net adds this quarter that were approximately 39,000 lower than last year's fourth quarter.
Zach Coughlin: Segment gross profit for the Q4 was $955 million and $3.82 billion for the full year, both representing a gross margin of 59%, close to last year's 60% for Q4 and full year. On subscriber metrics. Q4 self-pay net adds were a positive 110,000. That reflects contributions from the continuous service initiative that Jennifer mentioned earlier, as well as the earlier than planned introduction of companion subscriptions, which contributed approximately 80,000 incremental self-pay net adds during the quarter. These benefits were more than offset by the expected reductions in streaming subscribers and lower conversion rates, resulting in net adds this quarter that were approximately 39,000 lower than last year's Q4.
Speaker #2: On subscriber metrics, fourth quarter self-pay net ads were a positive 110,000. That reflects contributions from the continuous service initiative that Jennifer mentioned earlier, as well as the earlier-than-planned introduction of companion subscriptions which contributed approximately $80,000 incremental self-pay These benefits were more than offset by the expected reductions in streaming net ads during the quarter.
Speaker #2: subscribers and lower conversion rates, resulting in net ads this quarter that were approximately $39,000 lower than last year's fourth quarter. Our core subscriber base remained stable as reflected in full year churn of 1.5%, one of the lowest levels in our history, and an improvement from 1.6% last year, supported by a durable subscriber base with over half of our subscribers having been with SIRIUS XM for more than 10 years.
Zach Coughlin: Our core subscriber base remains stable, as reflected in full-year churn of 1.5%, one of the lowest levels in our history, and an improvement from 1.6% last year, supported by a durable subscriber base, with over half of our subscribers having been with SiriusXM for more than 10 years. We view our strong churn performance as a key result of improving our value proposition and overall customer satisfaction, and looking forward, we expect it to remain in the 1.5% to 1.6% range. From an ARPU perspective, Q4 ARPU was up $0.06 to $15.17 as rate increases rolled through the base, partially offset by an increase in subscribers on promotional plans. For the full year, ARPU was $15.11, down $0.10 from last year.
Zach Coughlin: Our core subscriber base remains stable, as reflected in full-year churn of 1.5%, one of the lowest levels in our history, and an improvement from 1.6% last year, supported by a durable subscriber base, with over half of our subscribers having been with SiriusXM for more than 10 years. We view our strong churn performance as a key result of improving our value proposition and overall customer satisfaction, and looking forward, we expect it to remain in the 1.5% to 1.6% range. From an ARPU perspective, Q4 ARPU was up $0.06 to $15.17 as rate increases rolled through the base, partially offset by an increase in subscribers on promotional plans. For the full year, ARPU was $15.11, down $0.10 from last year.
Speaker #2: We view our strong churn performance as a key result of improving our value proposition and overall customer satisfaction, and looking forward, we expect it to remain in the 1.5% to 1.6% range.
Speaker #2: From an ARPU perspective, fourth quarter ARPU was up $0.06 to $15.17 as rate increases rolled through the base, partially offset by an increase in subscribers on promotional plans.
Speaker #2: For the full year, ARPU was $15.11, down $0.10 from last year. Turning to the Pandora and off-platform segment, fourth quarter revenue was $582 million, and full year revenue totaled $2.14 billion.
Zach Coughlin: Turning to the Pandora and off-platform segment, Q4 revenue was $582 million, and full-year revenue totaled $2.14 billion. Advertising revenue continued to show momentum during the year, growing 1% year over year, driven by strong podcasting and programmatic growth. As Jennifer mentioned, podcast revenue grew 41% in 2025. Segment gross profit in Q4 was $208 million, reflecting a gross margin of approximately 36% compared to last year's 34%. For the full year, gross profit was $670 million, a margin of around 31%, representing a slight decline from last year's 33%. For 2025, we also achieved approximately $250 million of incremental gross cost savings, significantly exceeding our $200 million in-year cost savings target.
Zach Coughlin: Turning to the Pandora and off-platform segment, Q4 revenue was $582 million, and full-year revenue totaled $2.14 billion. Advertising revenue continued to show momentum during the year, growing 1% year-over-year, driven by strong podcasting and programmatic growth. As Jennifer mentioned, podcast revenue grew 41% in 2025. Segment gross profit in Q4 was $208 million, reflecting a gross margin of approximately 36% compared to last year's 34%. For the full year, gross profit was $670 million, a margin of around 31%, representing a slight decline from last year's 33%. For 2025, we also achieved approximately $250 million of incremental gross cost savings, significantly exceeding our $200 million in-year cost savings target.
Speaker #2: Advertising revenue continued to show momentum during the year, growing 1% year over year, driven by strong podcasting and programmatic growth. As Jennifer mentioned, podcast revenue grew 41% in 2025, segment gross profit in Q4 was $208 million, reflecting a gross margin of approximately 36% compared to last year's 34%.
Speaker #2: For the full year, gross profit was $670 million, a margin of around 31%, representing a slight decline from last year's 33%. For 2025, we also achieved approximately $250 million of incremental gross cost savings, significantly exceeding our $200 million in year cost savings expenses declined 16% year over year, as we reduced streaming marketing target.
Zach Coughlin: Sales and marketing expenses declined 16% year over year as we reduced streaming marketing and leaned further into an ROI-based subscriber acquisition strategy, and we tightly controlled product and technology spending, which decreased 9% year over year, driven by lower hosting and labor costs. These savings not only establish a solid cost foundation heading into 2026, but also create additional capacity for reinvestment. In 2025 and continuing into 2026, we have continued to deploy capital selectively in key areas, such as the in-car customer experience, platform technology, and ad monetization tools.
Zach Coughlin: Sales and marketing expenses declined 16% year-over-year as we reduced streaming marketing and leaned further into an ROI-based subscriber acquisition strategy, and we tightly controlled product and technology spending, which decreased 9% year-over-year, driven by lower hosting and labor costs. These savings not only establish a solid cost foundation heading into 2026, but also create additional capacity for reinvestment. In 2025 and continuing into 2026, we have continued to deploy capital selectively in key areas, such as the in-car customer experience, platform technology, and ad monetization tools.
Speaker #2: and leaned further into an ROI-based subscriber acquisition strategy. And we tightly controlled product, sales and marketing, and technology spending, which decreased 9% year over year, driven by lower hosting and labor costs.
Speaker #2: These savings not only establish a solid cost foundation heading into 2026, but also create additional capacity for reinvestment. In 2025 and continuing into 2026, we have continued to deploy capital selectively in key areas, such as the in-car customer experience, platform technology, and ad monetization tools.
Speaker #2: As part of our ongoing efforts to simplify the business and sharpen our focus on higher-return initiatives, we recorded $436 million of year-to-date impairment, restructuring, and other fourth quarter charges, driven largely by non-cash impairment charges related to certain content-related agreements and charges, including $272 million in the terminated software projects.
Zach Coughlin: As part of our ongoing efforts to simplify the business and sharpen our focus on higher return initiatives, we recorded $436 million of year-to-date impairment, restructuring, and other charges, including $272 million in Q4, driven largely by non-cash impairment charges related to certain content-related agreements and terminated software projects. We also continued to actively manage our balance sheet and return capital to shareholders. During 2025, we returned $501 million to shareholders, including $365 million in dividends and $136 million in share repurchases. We reduced total debt by $669 million during the year, including nearly $371 million in Q4.
Zach Coughlin: As part of our ongoing efforts to simplify the business and sharpen our focus on higher return initiatives, we recorded $436 million of year-to-date impairment, restructuring, and other charges, including $272 million in Q4, driven largely by non-cash impairment charges related to certain content-related agreements and terminated software projects. We also continued to actively manage our balance sheet and return capital to shareholders. During 2025, we returned $501 million to shareholders, including $365 million in dividends and $136 million in share repurchases. We reduced total debt by $669 million during the year, including nearly $371 million in Q4.
Speaker #2: We also continue to actively manage our balance sheet and return capital to shareholders. During 2025, we returned $501 million to shareholders, including $365 million in dividends and $136 million in share repurchases.
Speaker #2: We reduced total debt by $669 million during the year, including nearly $371 million in the fourth quarter. We ended 2025 with a net debt to adjusted EBITDA ratio of approximately 3.6 times, continuing our path towards our long-term target range of low to mid 3 times.
Zach Coughlin: We ended 2025 with a net debt to adjusted EBITDA ratio of approximately 3.6x, continuing our path towards our long-term target range of low to mid-3x, which we expect to reach by late this year. Liquidity remains strong, with continued access to our $2 billion revolving credit facility, which remains largely undrawn. Looking ahead to 2026, based on current trends, we are introducing the following outlook. We expect revenue of approximately $8.5 billion and adjusted EBITDA of approximately $2.6 billion, both largely flat to last year, and we are expecting to grow our free cash flow to approximately $1.35 billion as we take another important step towards our target of $1.5 billion in 2027.
Zach Coughlin: We ended 2025 with a net debt to adjusted EBITDA ratio of approximately 3.6x, continuing our path towards our long-term target range of low to mid-3x, which we expect to reach by late this year. Liquidity remains strong, with continued access to our $2 billion revolving credit facility, which remains largely undrawn. Looking ahead to 2026, based on current trends, we are introducing the following outlook. We expect revenue of approximately $8.5 billion and adjusted EBITDA of approximately $2.6 billion, both largely flat to last year, and we are expecting to grow our free cash flow to approximately $1.35 billion as we take another important step towards our target of $1.5 billion in 2027.
Speaker #2: Which we expect to reach by late this year. Liquidity remained strong, with continued access to our credit facility, which remains largely undrawn at our $2 billion revolving line.
Speaker #2: Looking ahead to 2026, based on current trends, we are introducing the following outlook. We expect revenue of approximately $8.5 billion, and adjusted EBITDA of approximately flat to last year.
Speaker #2: Expecting to grow our free cash flow, and we are to approximately $1.35 billion, as we take another important $2.6 billion, both largely step towards our target of $1.5 billion in 2027.
Speaker #2: We also expect to capture an additional $100 million of gross cost savings exiting 2026, for a cumulative run rate impact of $350 million, driven by continued platform efficiencies, customer service automation, and G&A rationalization.
Zach Coughlin: We also expect to capture an additional $100 million of gross cost savings exiting 2026 for a cumulative run rate impact of $350 million, driven by continued platform efficiencies, customer service automation, and G&A rationalization. Separately, while we're not providing specific guidance on self-pay net adds, we do expect reported self-pay net adds to be modestly lower than 2025, primarily reflecting the timing impact of the earlier than planned introduction of companion subscriptions, which contributed approximately 80,000 incremental net adds in the Q4 of 2025. As always, we will remain disciplined in balancing shareholder returns, deleveraging, and investments that drive sustainable long-term cash flow. In closing, I'm incredibly excited about the opportunity ahead at SiriusXM. This is a business with strong competitive positioning, durable cash flow, and a clear roadmap for continued efficiency and profitability.
Zach Coughlin: We also expect to capture an additional $100 million of gross cost savings exiting 2026 for a cumulative run rate impact of $350 million, driven by continued platform efficiencies, customer service automation, and G&A rationalization. Separately, while we're not providing specific guidance on self-pay net adds, we do expect reported self-pay net adds to be modestly lower than 2025, primarily reflecting the timing impact of the earlier than planned introduction of companion subscriptions, which contributed approximately 80,000 incremental net adds in the Q4 of 2025. As always, we will remain disciplined in balancing shareholder returns, deleveraging, and investments that drive sustainable long-term cash flow. In closing, I'm incredibly excited about the opportunity ahead at SiriusXM. This is a business with strong competitive positioning, durable cash flow, and a clear roadmap for continued efficiency and profitability.
Speaker #2: Separately, while we're not providing specific guidance on self-pay net adds, we do expect reported self-pay net adds to be modestly lower than 2025, primarily reflecting the timing impact of the earlier-than-planned introduction of companion subscriptions.
Speaker #2: Which contributed approximately $80,000 incremental net ads in the fourth quarter of 2025. As always, we will remain disciplined in balancing shareholder returns, deleveraging, and investments that drive sustainable long-term cash flow.
Speaker #2: In closing, I'm incredibly excited about the opportunity ahead at SIRIUS XM. This is a business with strong competitive positioning, durable cash flow, and a clear roadmap for continued efficiency and profitability.
Speaker #2: I look forward to working with this talented team and engaging with all of you as we execute on that strategy. With that, I'll turn it back to the operator for Q&A.
Zach Coughlin: I look forward to working with this talented team and engaging with all of you as we execute on that strategy. With that, I'll turn it back to the operator for Q&A. Thank you to everyone for joining.
Zach Coughlin: I look forward to working with this talented team and engaging with all of you as we execute on that strategy. With that, I'll turn it back to the operator for Q&A. Thank you to everyone for joining.
Speaker #2: Thank you to everyone for joining. Thank you. We will now be conducting a question and answer session. If you'd like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad, and a confirmation tone will indicate your line is in the question queue.
Operator: Thank you. We'll now be conducting a question-and-answer session. If you'd like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad, and a confirmation tone will indicate your line is in the question queue. You may press star two to remove yourself from the queue. For participants that are using speaker equipment, it may be necessary to pick up the handset before pressing the star keys. One moment please, while we poll for questions. Thank you, and our first question comes from the line of Cameron Mansson-Perrone with Morgan Stanley. Please proceed with your question.
Operator: Thank you. We'll now be conducting a question-and-answer session. If you'd like to ask a question, please press star one on your telephone keypad, and a confirmation tone will indicate your line is in the question queue. You may press star two to remove yourself from the queue. For participants that are using speaker equipment, it may be necessary to pick up the handset before pressing the star keys. One moment please, while we poll for questions. Thank you, and our first question comes from the line of Cameron Mansson-Perrone with Morgan Stanley. Please proceed with your question.
Speaker #2: The queue. For participants that are using speaker equipment, you may press star two to remove yourself. It may be necessary to pick up the handset before pressing the star keys.
Speaker #2: One moment, please, while we pull for questions. Thank you. And our first question comes from the line of Cameron Manson Perrone with Morgan Stanley.
Speaker #2: Please receive their question.
Speaker #3: Good morning and thanks for taking the questions. Jennifer, encouraging to see the positive subgrowth in the period. Taking a step back, just wondering if you could elaborate on where you think SIRIUS XM sits competitively today and where we are really in the evolution to provide your customers with more pricing and packaging
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: ... Morning, and thanks for taking the questions. Jennifer, encouraging to see the positive sub growth in the period. Taking a step back, just wondering if you could elaborate on, on where you think SiriusXM sits competitively today, and where we are really in the evolution to provide your customers with more pricing and packaging flexibility?
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: ... Morning, and thanks for taking the questions. Jennifer, encouraging to see the positive sub growth in the period. Taking a step back, just wondering if you could elaborate on, on where you think SiriusXM sits competitively today, and where we are really in the evolution to provide your customers with more pricing and packaging flexibility?
Speaker #3: flexibility. Sure.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Thanks, Cam. We were really pleased with the Q4 results, to start off. We added 110,000 net adds, and so this is a reflection of not only continued low churn, but contribution from our new acquisition programs and the benefit of continuous service and companion plans that we launched in the Q4. So going forward, our competitive positioning, I think, is incredibly strong. It's complementary to the music streaming services, especially because we have a unique position in the car. And remember, the vast majority of listening in the car is still to AM/FM, and we are opening up new packages, including music only at $9.99, and low cost of ads at $7 that goes squarely off against that AM/FM listening, and we think we have more opportunities to take share there.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Thanks, Cam. We were really pleased with the Q4 results, to start off. We added 110,000 net adds, and so this is a reflection of not only continued low churn, but contribution from our new acquisition programs and the benefit of continuous service and companion plans that we launched in the Q4. So going forward, our competitive positioning, I think, is incredibly strong. It's complementary to the music streaming services, especially because we have a unique position in the car. And remember, the vast majority of listening in the car is still to AM/FM, and we are opening up new packages, including music only at $9.99, and low cost of ads at $7 that goes squarely off against that AM/FM listening, and we think we have more opportunities to take share there.
Speaker #4: Thanks, Cam. We're really pleased with the fourth quarter results, to start off. We added $110,000 in net ads and this is a reflection of not only continued low churn, but contribution from our new acquisition programs, and the benefit of continuous service and companion plans that we launched in the fourth quarter.
Speaker #4: So going forward, our competitive positioning, I think, is incredibly strong as complementary to the music streaming services. Especially because we have a unique position in the car.
Speaker #4: the vast majority of listening in the car is still And remember, to AM/FM. And we are opening up new packages, including music only at $9.99 and low cost of ads at $7, that go squarely off against that AM/FM listening.
Speaker #4: And we think we have more opportunities to take share there. So we're really welcome competitively positioned. Against the DSPs to be complementary. And against AM/FM, in the car, which is our primary point of leverage.
Jennifer Witz: So we're really well competitively positioned against the DSPs to be complementary and against AM/FM in the car, which is our primary point of leverage.
Jennifer Witz: So we're really well competitively positioned against the DSPs to be complementary and against AM/FM in the car, which is our primary point of leverage.
Speaker #3: Thanks. And if I could follow up on churn just for a second—I think Zach mentioned an expectation for it to be in the $1.5 to $1.6 range in '26.
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: Thanks. And if I could follow up on churn just for a second. I think Zach mentioned an expectation for it to be in the 1.5 to 1.6 range in 2026. As we think about that within the kind of 1.4 record low churn in the fourth quarter, what drove the Q4? You talked about it a little bit, but maybe elaborate on, you know, what drove the outperformance in Q4, and then, why you expect that to kind of edge back a little bit as we look forward into 2026.
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: Thanks. And if I could follow up on churn just for a second. I think Zach mentioned an expectation for it to be in the 1.5 to 1.6 range in 2026. As we think about that within the kind of 1.4 record low churn in the Q4, what drove the Q4? You talked about it a little bit, but maybe elaborate on, you know, what drove the outperformance in Q4, and then, why you expect that to kind of edge back a little bit as we look forward into 2026.
Speaker #3: As we think about that within the 1.4% kind of record low churn in the fourth quarter, what drove the Q4? You talked about it a little bit, but maybe elaborate on what drove the outperformance in Q4 and then why you expect that to kind of edge back a little bit as we look forward into '26.
Speaker #4: Yeah. We did have a one-time benefit from continuous service in Q4, which reduced our vehicle-related churn. And this program allows our subscribers to continue their service while they're moving between vehicles.
Jennifer Witz: Yeah, we did have a one-time benefit from continuous service in Q4, which reduced our vehicle-related churn.
Jennifer Witz: Yeah, we did have a one-time benefit from continuous service in Q4, which reduced our vehicle-related churn.
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: Mm-hmm.
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: Mm-hmm.
Jennifer Witz: And this program allows our subscribers to continue their service while they're moving between vehicles. It removes a lot of friction in the process. This has been one of the points of leakage, in terms of, you know, managing those vehicle changes, and we have more functionality coming, likely later this year to make that even easier. So I do think we could continue to see some tailwinds in churn related to that functionality and expanding it. But otherwise, we've seen, you know, strong non-pay results. Our voluntary churn has been flat year-over-year, even though we did a rate increase last year. So we're just, we're being cautiously optimistic.
Jennifer Witz: And this program allows our subscribers to continue their service while they're moving between vehicles. It removes a lot of friction in the process. This has been one of the points of leakage, in terms of, you know, managing those vehicle changes, and we have more functionality coming, likely later this year to make that even easier. So I do think we could continue to see some tailwinds in churn related to that functionality and expanding it. But otherwise, we've seen, you know, strong non-pay results. Our voluntary churn has been flat year-over-year, even though we did a rate increase last year. So we're just, we're being cautiously optimistic.
Speaker #4: It removes a lot of friction in the process. This has been one of the points of leakage in terms of managing those vehicle changes, and we have more functionality coming likely later this year to make that even easier.
Speaker #4: So, I do think we could continue to see some tailwinds in churn related to that functionality and expanding it. But otherwise, with results, our voluntary churn has been flat year-over-year.
Speaker #4: Even seen strong non-pay though we did a rate increase last cautiously optimistic. We think there's a lot more we year. So we're being can do with the data and the capabilities we're building on the marketing side to put the right content in front of the right customers.
Jennifer Witz: We think there's a lot more we can do with the data and the capabilities we're building on the marketing side to put the right content in front of the right customers, not only to build demand, but also to enhance retention as well.
Jennifer Witz: We think there's a lot more we can do with the data and the capabilities we're building on the marketing side to put the right content in front of the right customers, not only to build demand, but also to enhance retention as well.
Speaker #4: Not only to build demand, but also to enhance retention as
Speaker #3: That's all helpful. Thanks,
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: That's all helpful. Thanks, Jennifer.
Cameron Mansson-Perrone: That's all helpful. Thanks, Jennifer.
Speaker #2: Thank Jennifer. you. The next question is from the line of Stephen Cahill with Wells Fargo. Please receive their questions.
Operator: Thank you. The next question is from the line of Steven Cahall with Wells Fargo. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: Thank you. The next question is from the line of Steven Cahall with Wells Fargo. Please proceed with your questions.
Speaker #5: Thank you, good morning, Jennifer. I was just wondering if you on the outlook for self-pay net ads in 2026. I think you said that you expect those to be modestly lower than 2025 due to the introduction of companion.
Steven Cahall: Thank you. Good morning, Jennifer. I was just wondering if you could, and Zach, elaborate on the outlook for self-pay net adds in 2026. I think you said that you expect those to be modestly lower than 2025 due to the introduction of Companion, and I think Companion was additive in Q4, so it sounds like it's more of a drag in 2026. So maybe you can just help us understand kind of how that flows in. And also, does it contribute to any trade down at the household level, or is it additive at the household level? And then second, just wanted to ask about the go-to-market strategy with the OEM dealers. You know, can you talk about what that does for churn? I imagine it's pretty positive.
Steven Cahall: Thank you. Good morning, Jennifer. I was just wondering if you could, and Zach, elaborate on the outlook for self-pay net adds in 2026. I think you said that you expect those to be modestly lower than 2025 due to the introduction of Companion, and I think Companion was additive in Q4, so it sounds like it's more of a drag in 2026. So maybe you can just help us understand kind of how that flows in. And also, does it contribute to any trade down at the household level, or is it additive at the household level? And then second, just wanted to ask about the go-to-market strategy with the OEM dealers. You know, can you talk about what that does for churn? I imagine it's pretty positive.
Speaker #5: was additive in the fourth quarter. So it And I think companion sounds like it's more of a drag in 2026. So maybe you can just help us understand kind of how that flows in and also does it contribute to any trade-down at the household level or is it additive at the household level?
Speaker #5: And then second, just wanted to ask about the go-to-market strategy with the OEM dealers. Can you talk about what that does for churn? I imagine it's pretty positive and do you have any meaningful SAC related to those subscribers as well?
Steven Cahall: Do you have any meaningful SAC related to those subscribers as well? Thanks.
Steven Cahall: Do you have any meaningful SAC related to those subscribers as well? Thanks.
Speaker #4: Sure.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Thanks, Steven. So in terms of self-pay net adds for 2026, we have guided modestly lower. Companion subscriptions launched a bit earlier than we expected in December, which has been very successful, and I would expect to continue to drive solid performance there going into and through this year. That is adding value for our most loyal subscribers and positions us well for a rate increase this year. So we've seen nice results there and better than we would expect. But because we pulled it forward, it actually delivered better than expected performance on self-pay net adds in Q4 and for 2025. So I think that... Look, we understand the importance of subscribers. We're very focused on improving the trends.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Thanks, Steven. So in terms of self-pay net adds for 2026, we have guided modestly lower. Companion subscriptions launched a bit earlier than we expected in December, which has been very successful, and I would expect to continue to drive solid performance there going into and through this year. That is adding value for our most loyal subscribers and positions us well for a rate increase this year. So we've seen nice results there and better than we would expect. But because we pulled it forward, it actually delivered better than expected performance on self-pay net adds in Q4 and for 2025. So I think that... Look, we understand the importance of subscribers. We're very focused on improving the trends.
Speaker #4: Thanks, Thanks. Stephen. So in terms of self-pay net ads for 2026, we have guided modestly lower companion subscriptions, launched a bit earlier than we expected in December, which has been very successful.
Speaker #4: And I would expect to continue to drive solid performance there going into and through this year. That is adding value for our most loyal subscribers and positions us well for a rate increase this year.
Speaker #4: So we've seen nice results there, and better than we would expect. But because we pulled it forward, it actually delivered better-than-expected performance on self-pay net adds in the fourth quarter and for 2025.
Speaker #4: So I think that, look, we understand the importance of subscribers. We're very focused on improving the trends. We believe we have a number of initiatives that will enable us to do so.
Jennifer Witz: We believe we have a number of initiatives that will enable us to do so. But I would say that even if we don't, we have incredibly strong and growing free cash flow generation, for years to come, and we're being very disciplined about the interaction between subs and free cash flow. But just, you know, turning back to more specifically on 2026, we also are guiding for relatively stable revenue, which, you know, in the face of slightly lower subs, obviously indicates that we believe we have more room in ARPU and pricing. So, so again, we have a number of initiatives in flight. Hopefully, we'll talk more about those this morning.
Jennifer Witz: We believe we have a number of initiatives that will enable us to do so. But I would say that even if we don't, we have incredibly strong and growing free cash flow generation, for years to come, and we're being very disciplined about the interaction between subs and free cash flow. But just, you know, turning back to more specifically on 2026, we also are guiding for relatively stable revenue, which, you know, in the face of slightly lower subs, obviously indicates that we believe we have more room in ARPU and pricing. So, so again, we have a number of initiatives in flight. Hopefully, we'll talk more about those this morning.
Speaker #4: But I would say that even if we don't, we have incredibly strong and growing free cash flow generation. For years to come. And we're being very disciplined about the interaction between subs and free cash flow.
Speaker #4: But just turning back to more specifically on 2026, we also are guiding for relatively stable revenue, which in the face of slightly lower subs, obviously indicates that we believe we have more room in our pool and pricing.
Speaker #4: So again, we have a number of initiatives in flight. Hopefully, we'll talk more about those this morning. Some of them we highlighted on the prepared remarks.
Jennifer Witz: Some of them we highlighted on the prepared remarks, but we are continuing to expand demand through our broader pricing, packaging, and personalization in marketing. And we are launching with more and more OEMs our dealer three-year subscription program, as you mentioned, and we expect to see more demand there, where dealers are ordering SiriusXM, and customers get the benefit of that three-year subscription in their vehicles at point of purchase. And we are already in 15 brands, and we expect to continue to expand in new and used this year.
Jennifer Witz: Some of them we highlighted on the prepared remarks, but we are continuing to expand demand through our broader pricing, packaging, and personalization in marketing. And we are launching with more and more OEMs our dealer three-year subscription program, as you mentioned, and we expect to see more demand there, where dealers are ordering SiriusXM, and customers get the benefit of that three-year subscription in their vehicles at point of purchase. And we are already in 15 brands, and we expect to continue to expand in new and used this year.
Speaker #4: But we are continuing to expand demand through our broader pricing and packaging and personalization in marketing. And we are launching with more and more OEMs our dealer three-year subscription program.
Speaker #4: As you mentioned, we expect to see more demand there, where dealers are ordering SiriusXM and customers get the benefit of that three-year subscription in their vehicles at the point of purchase.
Speaker #4: And we are already in 15 brands and we expect to continue to expand in new and used this year.
Speaker #2: Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kakan Mural with Evercore ISI. Please receive your questions.
Operator: Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kutgun Maral with Evercore ISI. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: Thank you. The next question is from the line of Kutgun Maral with Evercore ISI. Please proceed with your questions.
Speaker #6: Good morning and thanks for taking the questions. First, Jennifer, you just touched on ARPU and pricing in your response to Steve's question. So can you help unpack your ARPU expectations for 2026 in a bit more detail?
Kutgun Maral: Good morning, and thanks for taking the questions. First, Jennifer, you just touched on ARPU and pricing in your response to Steve's question. So can you help unpack your ARPU expectations for 2026 in a bit more detail? And then on Spectrum, I appreciate that it's difficult to get too granular on any process, but is there anything you can share on whether you're still actively engaged in evaluating the portfolio and how you see the opportunity set ahead for at least parts of the 35 megahertz? Thanks.
Kutgun Maral: Good morning, and thanks for taking the questions. First, Jennifer, you just touched on ARPU and pricing in your response to Steve's question. So can you help unpack your ARPU expectations for 2026 in a bit more detail? And then on Spectrum, I appreciate that it's difficult to get too granular on any process, but is there anything you can share on whether you're still actively engaged in evaluating the portfolio and how you see the opportunity set ahead for at least parts of the 35 megahertz? Thanks.
Speaker #6: And then on spectrum, I appreciate that it's difficult to get too granular on any process, but is there anything you can share on whether you're still actively engaged in evaluating the portfolio and how you see the opportunity set ahead for at least parts of the 35 megahertz?
Speaker #6: Thanks.
Wayne Thorson: Great. Thanks, Kutgun. Maybe I'll take the first one on ARPU. I think ARPU is a great story for us. In Q4, we were up $0.06 to $15.17, driven by the flow-through of the pricing we had taken earlier in the year. And importantly, I think beyond just Q4, if you pull back a little bit, it's our third straight quarter of sequential improvement when comparing to last year and our second straight quarter higher than 2024. So as you look forward to 2026, that momentum we do see is carrying forward into the year, and expect to see strong ARPU performance in 2026 as well.
Wayne Thorson: Great. Thanks, Kutgun. Maybe I'll take the first one on ARPU. I think ARPU is a great story for us. In Q4, we were up $0.06 to $15.17, driven by the flow-through of the pricing we had taken earlier in the year. And importantly, I think beyond just Q4, if you pull back a little bit, it's our third straight quarter of sequential improvement when comparing to last year and our second straight quarter higher than 2024. So as you look forward to 2026, that momentum we do see is carrying forward into the year, and expect to see strong ARPU performance in 2026 as well.
Speaker #3: Thanks, Kakan. Maybe I'll take the first one on Okay. Great. ARPU. I think ARPU is a great story for us in the fourth quarter.
Speaker #3: We were up 6 cents to $15.17 driven by the flow-through of the pricing we had taken earlier in the year. And importantly, I think beyond just the fourth quarter, if you pull back a little bit, it's our third straight quarter of sequential improvement when comparing to last year and our second straight quarter higher than 2024.
Speaker #3: So as we look forward to 2026, that momentum we do see is carrying forward into the year. And expect to see strong ARPU performance in
Jennifer Witz: Do you want to take second?
Jennifer Witz: Do you want to take second?
Speaker #6: Yeah, thanks. 20 seconds, Kakan. And just as a reminder, the total 35 megahertz of contiguous spectrum, with the 25 megahertz, is currently used for our core broadcast operations.
Wayne Thorson: Yeah. Thanks, Kutgun. Just as a reminder, the total 35MHz of contiguous spectrum with the 25MHz is currently used for our core broadcast operations, and then we have 5 on either side for 10MHz of the recently acquired spectrum, which is the WCS licenses. So, you know, as a reminder, we noted last quarter that we are evaluating multiple approaches to creating value with these assets, including new products or enhancements to our services, you know, either ourselves or with partners, and building on core strengths, in particular in the car. This has been a key focus for us overall, and with a bit more attention being paid to the C and D licenses within WCS, that's where the most near-term opportunities are. We're looking forward to talking more as our thinking and the opportunities evolve.
Scott Greenstein: Yeah. Thanks, Kutgun. Just as a reminder, the total 35MHz of contiguous spectrum with the 25MHz is currently used for our core broadcast operations, and then we have 5 on either side for 10MHz of the recently acquired spectrum, which is the WCS licenses. So, you know, as a reminder, we noted last quarter that we are evaluating multiple approaches to creating value with these assets, including new products or enhancements to our services, you know, either ourselves or with partners, and building on core strengths, in particular in the car. This has been a key focus for us overall, and with a bit more attention being paid to the C and D licenses within WCS, that's where the most near-term opportunities are. We're looking forward to talking more as our thinking and the opportunities evolve.
Speaker #6: And then we have five on either side for 10 megahertz, of the recently acquired spectrum, which is the WCS licenses. And so as a reminder, we noted last quarter that we are evaluating multiple approaches to creating value with these assets, including new products or enhancements to our services.
Speaker #6: our sales or with partners. And building Either on core strengths in particular in the car. This has been a key focus for us overall.
Speaker #6: And with a bit more attention being paid to the CMD licenses within WCS, more as we are thinking in the opportunities evolve. Thank you both.
Kutgun Maral: Thank you both.
Kutgun Maral: Thank you both.
Speaker #2: Our next question is in the line of Jessica Wright with Bank of America Securities. Please receive your questions.
Operator: Our next question is in the line of Jessica Reif with Bank of America Securities. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: Our next question is in the line of Jessica Reif with Bank of America Securities. Please proceed with your questions.
Jessica Reif: Good morning. I have two topics, I guess. First, on the podcasting advertising growth has been phenomenal. I mean, really strong. And Zach just said, you're seeing improving ad trends later in the quarter. I mean, it would be great to get some color on what, what you're seeing in the overall advertising market. And, you know, will 2026 be driven maybe by the market or more a function of specific podcast inventory you're onboarding? And then on that topic, on podcast profitability, I don't think you've ever said what it is. Can you talk about, if you don't want to give a number, like, how should we think about the swing factor on that? And then I have another question.
Speaker #8: Good morning. I have two topics, I guess. First, on the podcasting advertising growth has been phenomenal. I mean, really strong. And Jack just said you're seeing improving air translators in the quarter.
Jessica Reif: Good morning. I have two topics, I guess. First, on the podcasting advertising growth has been phenomenal. I mean, really strong. And Zach just said, you're seeing improving ad trends later in the quarter. I mean, it would be great to get some color on what, what you're seeing in the overall advertising market. And, you know, will 2026 be driven maybe by the market or more a function of specific podcast inventory you're onboarding? And then on that topic, on podcast profitability, I don't think you've ever said what it is. Can you talk about, if you don't want to give a number, like, how should we think about the swing factor on that? And then I have another question.
Speaker #8: I mean, it would be great to get some color on what you're seeing in the overall advertising market and to build 26 be driven maybe by the market inventory you're onboarding.
Speaker #8: And then on that topic, or more a function of specific podcast podcast profitability, I don't think you've ever said what it is. Can you talk about if you don't want to give a number, how should we think about the swing factor on that?
Speaker #8: And then I have another question.
Speaker #4: Sure. I'll take that, Jessica. So we did see really strong growth in podcasting in Q4 and last year in total. And Q4 in particular was incredibly strong based on improvement in metrics across the board.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. I'll take that, Jessica. So we did see really strong growth in podcasting in Q4 and last year in total. And Q4, in particular, was incredibly strong based on improvement in metrics across the board. So higher podcast audio RPM, driven by really record sell-through, higher CPMs, and a significant uptick in programmatic, as well as growth in our Creator Connect product, which allows us to sell video and social also. So we think there's continued tailwinds here in the industry, not only because of you know, listening trends and our particular portfolio, but our ability to continue to improve monetization. We have incredibly high RPMs here, well above what we see on the music streaming side. And I think there's you know, continues to be room for growth. We have great relationships with talent.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. I'll take that, Jessica. So we did see really strong growth in podcasting in Q4 and last year in total. And Q4, in particular, was incredibly strong based on improvement in metrics across the board. So higher podcast audio RPM, driven by really record sell-through, higher CPMs, and a significant uptick in programmatic, as well as growth in our Creator Connect product, which allows us to sell video and social also. So we think there's continued tailwinds here in the industry, not only because of you know, listening trends and our particular portfolio, but our ability to continue to improve monetization. We have incredibly high RPMs here, well above what we see on the music streaming side. And I think there's you know, continues to be room for growth. We have great relationships with talent.
Speaker #4: So higher podcast audio RPM driven by really record sell-through, higher CPMs, and a significant uptick in programmatic. As well as growth in our creator connect product, which allows us to sell video and social also.
Speaker #4: So we think there's continued tailwinds here in the industry, not only because of listening trends and our particular portfolio, but our ability to continue to improve monetization.
Speaker #4: We have incredibly high RPMs here. Well above what we see on the music streaming side. And I think there's continues to be room for growth.
Speaker #4: We have great relationships with talent. We had half of the Golden Globe nominees, the first time they've had a best podcast category. And Scott and his team continue to actively discuss relationships with new talent there.
Jennifer Witz: We had, you know, half of the Golden Globes nominees, you know, the first time they've had a best podcast category. And Scott and his team continue to actively discuss, you know, relationships with new talent there. So we feel really well positioned in the podcast business. And just to touch on profitability, so this is a good business for us. It stands on its own. The margin has increased over time, and we think that the industry dynamics, you know, are in our favor here. And we also get added value from what we do on SiriusXM. You know, not only with things like the Unwell Music Channel or, you know, Conan O'Brien's channel, but working with the creators, we've been able to define exclusive content for our SiriusXM subscribers as well.
Jennifer Witz: We had, you know, half of the Golden Globes nominees, you know, the first time they've had a best podcast category. And Scott and his team continue to actively discuss, you know, relationships with new talent there. So we feel really well positioned in the podcast business. And just to touch on profitability, so this is a good business for us. It stands on its own. The margin has increased over time, and we think that the industry dynamics, you know, are in our favor here. And we also get added value from what we do on SiriusXM. You know, not only with things like the Unwell Music Channel or, you know, Conan O'Brien's channel, but working with the creators, we've been able to define exclusive content for our SiriusXM subscribers as well.
Speaker #4: So we feel really well positioned in the podcast business. And just to touch on profitability, so this is a good business for us. It stands on its own.
Speaker #4: The margin has increased over time. And we think that the industry dynamics are in our favor here. And we also get added value from what we do on Sirius XM.
Speaker #4: the Unwell Music Channel or Conan O'Brien's channel, Not only with things like but working with the creators. We've been able to define exclusive content for our Sirius XM subscribers as well.
Jessica Reif: Thanks. Any commentary on, on advertising, and then I'll go to the next question?
Jessica Reif: Thanks. Any commentary on, on advertising, and then I'll go to the next question?
Speaker #8: advertising? And then I'll go to the next question.
Speaker #4: Sure. Yes. So we're cautiously optimistic for 2026 and the year has started out solid. I think it has a lot to do with our trends in podcasting.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Yes. So we're cautiously optimistic for 2026, and the year has started out solid. You know, I think it has a lot to do with our trends in podcasting, but there's a few areas where we see sort of unique opportunity. Our events business, you know, we are building great packages around things like the Super Bowl with our Noah Kahan event tonight, or the World Cup. We also have a broader set of programmatic DSPs. We launched Amazon, and we're seeing a nice uptick there. And just in terms of the categories, I mean, it's recent, but, you know, what we're seeing is tech is up the most, financial services and pharma have been strong, as well as CPG. And then where we're seeing some pressure is on retail, QSR, and education.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. Yes. So we're cautiously optimistic for 2026, and the year has started out solid. You know, I think it has a lot to do with our trends in podcasting, but there's a few areas where we see sort of unique opportunity. Our events business, you know, we are building great packages around things like the Super Bowl with our Noah Kahan event tonight, or the World Cup. We also have a broader set of programmatic DSPs. We launched Amazon, and we're seeing a nice uptick there. And just in terms of the categories, I mean, it's recent, but, you know, what we're seeing is tech is up the most, financial services and pharma have been strong, as well as CPG. And then where we're seeing some pressure is on retail, QSR, and education.
Speaker #4: But there are a few areas where we see sort of unique opportunity—our events packages around things like the Super Bowl, with our Noah Kahan event tonight.
Speaker #4: business, we are building great Or the World Cup, we also have a broader set of programmatic DSPs. We launched Amazon, and we're seeing a nice uptick there.
Speaker #4: And just in terms of the categories, I mean, it's recent, but what we're seeing is tech is up the most. Financial services and pharma have been strong.
Speaker #4: As well as CPG. And then where we're seeing some pressure is on retail. QSR and education.
Jessica Reif: Great. I'm not sure if you said Scott is on the call or not, so I don't know if this is for Scott or Jennifer, for you.
Jessica Reif: Great. I'm not sure if you said Scott is on the call or not, so I don't know if this is for Scott or Jennifer, for you.
Speaker #8: said Scott is on the call or not, so I don't know if Great. I'm not sure if you this is for Scott or Jennifer for you.
Wayne Thorson: Yeah.
Scott Greenstein: Yeah.
Speaker #8: But you did just oh, hi, Scott. So you just resigned from Howard Stern for an additional three years. How should we think about the calendar?
Jessica Reif: But, you did just resign, oh, hi, Scott. So you just resigned Howard Stern for an additional 3 years. How should we think about the 2026, 2027 content renewal calendar? The puts and takes, the content expense growth. Like, where do you feel you have negotiating leverage? Where do you think you should invest more to protect your franchise?
Jessica Reif: But, you did just resign, oh, hi, Scott. So you just resigned Howard Stern for an additional 3 years. How should we think about the 2026, 2027 content renewal calendar? The puts and takes, the content expense growth. Like, where do you feel you have negotiating leverage? Where do you think you should invest more to protect your franchise?
Speaker #8: '26, '27 content renewal takes the content expense growth. Where do you feel you have negotiating leverage? Where do you think you should invest more to protect your
Speaker #8: franchise? So that's a
Scott Greenstein: ... So, you know, that's a moving target. As you know, our lineup shifts due to many factors. You know, people could go on to other parts or careers; the economic and business models may not make sense. So it's really a shifting target. So we look at it. We feel really good where the lineup is right now, both on Sirius and for sure in podcasting. But, you know, we're opportunistic where we need to be, but we're also conservative. If the podcast market or anything else gets too frothy, and we're not gonna, you know, get into that, especially with the lineup we have right now.
Scott Greenstein: ... So, you know, that's a moving target. As you know, our lineup shifts due to many factors. You know, people could go on to other parts or careers; the economic and business models may not make sense. So it's really a shifting target. So we look at it. We feel really good where the lineup is right now, both on Sirius and for sure in podcasting. But, you know, we're opportunistic where we need to be, but we're also conservative. If the podcast market or anything else gets too frothy, and we're not gonna, you know, get into that, especially with the lineup we have right now.
Speaker #3: moving target. As our lineup shifts due to many factors, people could go on to other parts of careers. The economic and business models may not make sense.
Speaker #3: So, it's really a shifting target. So we look at it. We feel really good where the lineup is right now, both on Sirius and, for sure, in podcasting.
Speaker #3: But where opportunistic, where we need to be, but we're also conservative if the podcast market or anything else gets too fraught in, we're not going to get into that, especially with the lineup we have right I'm most pleased where we now.
Scott Greenstein: The place that I'm most pleased where we stand right now is in sports live sports rights, because we're the only place where all the league rights, college, and many other sports are under one roof. So, you know, down the road, sure, there could be pressure on that, but we're in a pretty good spot right now where our deals stand on that.
Scott Greenstein: The place that I'm most pleased where we stand right now is in sports live sports rights, because we're the only place where all the league rights, college, and many other sports are under one roof. So, you know, down the road, sure, there could be pressure on that, but we're in a pretty good spot right now where our deals stand on that.
Speaker #3: stand right now is in sports, live sports rights because The place that we're the only place where all the league rights and college and many other sports are under one roof.
Speaker #3: So down the road, sure, there could be pressure on that, but we're in a pretty good spot right now where our deals stand on that.
Speaker #4: And I just say, Jessica, we have so much more data than we've ever had before. So we can make better decisions about what's in the portfolio based on that data in terms of engagement, but also how we're increasingly using it in marketing for acquisition and retention because the real objective is to get the right content in front of the right customers.
Stephen Laszczyk: I'd just say, Jessica, we have so much more data than we've ever had before, so we can make better decisions about what's in the portfolio based on that data in terms of engagement, but also how we're increasingly using it in marketing for acquisition and retention. Because the real objective is to get the right content in front of the right customers. And that kind of data and analytics will be supported clearly by perceived value as well.
Jennifer Witz: I'd just say, Jessica, we have so much more data than we've ever had before, so we can make better decisions about what's in the portfolio based on that data in terms of engagement, but also how we're increasingly using it in marketing for acquisition and retention. Because the real objective is to get the right content in front of the right customers. And that kind of data and analytics will be supported clearly by perceived value as well.
Speaker #4: And that kind of data and analytics will be supported clearly by perceived value as
Speaker #4: well. Great.
Jessica Reif: Great. Thank you.
Jessica Reif: Great. Thank you.
Speaker #8: Thank you.
Speaker #1: The next question is from the line of Barton Crockett with Rosenblatt Securities. Please just hear your questions.
Operator: The next question is from the line of Barton Crockett with Rosenblatt Securities. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: The next question is from the line of Barton Crockett with Rosenblatt Securities. Please proceed with your questions.
Speaker #9: Okay. Great. Thank you for taking the question. I was curious about if you could talk a little bit about how you think about what seems to be a little bit of a new development in the podcasting sector.
Barton Crockett: Okay, great. Thank you for taking the question. You know, I was curious about if you could talk a little bit about how you think about what seems to be a little bit of a new development in the podcasting sector, and that is the idea of, you know, doing deals with another party, like a Netflix, to give kind of an expanded kind of presence for your podcast. You know, Spotify's got a deal there and iHeart, that's new. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit, Jennifer, about how you guys think about that in terms of the opportunity to do something like that and, you know, how important that could be, specifically in this, you know, and then maybe segue into the idea of bundling.
Barton Crockett: Okay, great. Thank you for taking the question. You know, I was curious about if you could talk a little bit about how you think about what seems to be a little bit of a new development in the podcasting sector, and that is the idea of, you know, doing deals with another party, like a Netflix, to give kind of an expanded kind of presence for your podcast. You know, Spotify's got a deal there and iHeart, that's new. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit, Jennifer, about how you guys think about that in terms of the opportunity to do something like that and, you know, how important that could be, specifically in this, you know, and then maybe segue into the idea of bundling.
Speaker #9: And that is the idea of doing deals with another party, like a Netflix, to give kind of an expanded kind of presence for your podcast, Spot, if I've ve got a deal there and iHeart.
Speaker #9: That's new. I was wondering if you could talk a little bit Jennifer about how you guys think about that in terms of the opportunity to do something like that and how important that could be specifically.
Speaker #9: And then maybe segue into the idea that one of the things that's been very prominent in video, of bundling, streaming, is guys coming up, I mean, it would seem, with bundle deals with other services like Disney Plus, HBO Max, and that working.
Barton Crockett: I mean, it would seem that, you know, one of the things that's been very prominent in, like, video streaming is guys coming up with bundle deals with other services like Disney+, HBO Max, and that working. We don't see so much of that in audio and certainly, you know, maybe less prominently with you guys. So if you could talk about partnerships, bundling, podcasts, that'd be interesting.
Barton Crockett: I mean, it would seem that, you know, one of the things that's been very prominent in, like, video streaming is guys coming up with bundle deals with other services like Disney+, HBO Max, and that working. We don't see so much of that in audio and certainly, you know, maybe less prominently with you guys. So if you could talk about partnerships, bundling, podcasts, that'd be interesting.
Speaker #9: We don't see so much of that in audio and certainly maybe less prominently with you guys. So if you could talk about partnerships, bundling, podcasts, that'd be interesting.
Speaker #3: Thanks. I'll take the first part on that. So our podcast network reaches one in two podcast listeners in the US. And we're number one on Edison.
Scott Greenstein: Thanks. I'll take the first part on that. So, you know, our podcast network reaches 1 in 2 podcast listeners in the US, and we're number one on Edison, and it's been well documented about how dominant we are in that position. So it's been written about. It's no secret that, you know, any company looking to have our podcast, you know, we're open for business. It's just we like our position where we are. We're able to maximize a lot of money for curators and us going wide with what we're doing. If they become another platform that we can monetize on, we're always open to that. If it becomes narrower or more exclusive, the economics have to dictate that for both us and the creator. So it's a work in progress, but it's something we pay attention to regularly.
Scott Greenstein: Thanks. I'll take the first part on that. So, you know, our podcast network reaches 1 in 2 podcast listeners in the US, and we're number one on Edison, and it's been well documented about how dominant we are in that position. So it's been written about. It's no secret that, you know, any company looking to have our podcast, you know, we're open for business. It's just we like our position where we are. We're able to maximize a lot of money for curators and us going wide with what we're doing. If they become another platform that we can monetize on, we're always open to that. If it becomes narrower or more exclusive, the economics have to dictate that for both us and the creator. So it's a work in progress, but it's something we pay attention to regularly.
Speaker #3: how dominant we are in that position. So it's been written about. It's no secret that any company looking to have our business. It's just we like our position where we are.
Speaker #3: We're able to maximize a lot of money for curators and us And it's been going wide with what we're doing. If they become another platform that we can monetize on, podcast, we're open for we're always open to that.
Speaker #3: If it becomes narrower or more exclusive, the economics have to dictate that for both us and the creator. So it's a work in progress, but it's something we pay attention to regularly.
Speaker #9: Thanks. And this is Wayne. And on the partnership side, I think the key work that we've been doing to do things such as fixing our identity stack, we're key in order to do more effective distribution partnerships such as hard bundles.
Wayne Thorson: Thanks. This is Wayne. On the partnership side, I think the key work that we've been doing to do things such as fixing our identity stack were key in order to do more effective distribution partnerships such as hard bundles. Because, you know, when the main identity ends up being the vehicle versus the customer, it gets very clunky to put together a partnership where you have a hard bundle and the two services are joined. The other piece that we really needed, of course, was to have a lower overall persistent price point so that we weren't swamping our partners when we're putting together these joined up offerings.
Wayne Thorson: Thanks. This is Wayne. On the partnership side, I think the key work that we've been doing to do things such as fixing our identity stack were key in order to do more effective distribution partnerships such as hard bundles. Because, you know, when the main identity ends up being the vehicle versus the customer, it gets very clunky to put together a partnership where you have a hard bundle and the two services are joined. The other piece that we really needed, of course, was to have a lower overall persistent price point so that we weren't swamping our partners when we're putting together these joined up offerings.
Speaker #9: Because when the main identity ends up being the vehicle versus the customer gets very clunky, to put together a partnership where you have a hard bundle and the two services are joined.
Speaker #9: The other piece that we really needed, of course, was to have a lower overall persistent price point so that we weren't swamping our partners when we're putting together these joined-up offerings.
Speaker #9: And so now that these are in place, there's a lot of discussions that are of course being evaluated and underway. So more to talk through in the coming
Wayne Thorson: And so now that these are in place, there's a lot of discussions that are, of course, being evaluated and underway, so more to talk through in the coming months.
Wayne Thorson: And so now that these are in place, there's a lot of discussions that are, of course, being evaluated and underway, so more to talk through in the coming months.
Speaker #9: months. Okay.
Barton Crockett: Okay, that's great. Thank you.
Barton Crockett: Okay, that's great. Thank you.
Speaker #1: That's great, thank you. The next question is from the line of Steven Lisic with Goldman Sachs. Please go ahead with your questions.
Operator: The next question is from the line of Stephen Laszczyk with Goldman Sachs. Please proceed with your question.
Operator: The next question is from the line of Stephen Laszczyk with Goldman Sachs. Please proceed with your question.
Speaker #10: Hey, great. Thanks for taking the questions. Two, if I could. Maybe first for a combination of Jennifer and Wayne, we've seen some nice execution on the cost savings program this past year.
Stephen Laszczyk: Hey, great. Thanks for taking the questions. Two, if I could. Maybe first, for a combination of Jennifer and Wayne, you've been seeing some nice execution on the cost savings program this past year. I'm curious if you could talk a little bit more about the opportunity you see to take costs out of the business here over the next year or so. And then within that, some of the high ROI investments you're making with reallocating resources within the business, where you see the most opportunity on that front.
Stephen Laszczyk: Hey, great. Thanks for taking the questions. Two, if I could. Maybe first, for a combination of Jennifer and Wayne, you've been seeing some nice execution on the cost savings program this past year. I'm curious if you could talk a little bit more about the opportunity you see to take costs out of the business here over the next year or so. And then within that, some of the high ROI investments you're making with reallocating resources within the business, where you see the most opportunity on that front.
Speaker #10: more about the opportunity you see to I'm curious if you could talk a little bit take costs out of the business here over the next year or so.
Speaker #10: And then within that, some of the high ROI investments, you're making with reallocating resources within the business where you see the most opportunity. On that front, and then second for Zach, I'm curious just with this being your first earnings call, I would love to get your thoughts around leverage and capital allocation, maybe here over the next year or so, but also too over the longer term, what gives you confidence in the low to mid three times leverage ratio and then how should investors expect capital allocation to evolve from here?
Stephen Laszczyk: And then, second for Zach, I'm curious, just with this being your first earnings call, I would love to get your thoughts around leverage and capital allocation, maybe here over the next year or so, but also too, over the longer term, what gives you confidence in the low- to mid-3x leverage ratio? And then how should investors expect capital allocation to evolve from here? Okay. So just on high ROI investments, I think Wayne's team's been doing a fantastic job sort of rationalizing our product and tech spend and focusing on where we have the most opportunity, so on our in-car subscription business and our ads business. So I'll let Wayne talk a little bit about that, and then Zach can address the others.
Stephen Laszczyk: And then, second for Zach, I'm curious, just with this being your first earnings call, I would love to get your thoughts around leverage and capital allocation, maybe here over the next year or so, but also too, over the longer term, what gives you confidence in the low- to mid-3x leverage ratio? And then how should investors expect capital allocation to evolve from here?
Jennifer Witz: Okay. So just on high ROI investments, I think Wayne's team's been doing a fantastic job sort of rationalizing our product and tech spend and focusing on where we have the most opportunity, so on our in-car subscription business and our ads business. So I'll let Wayne talk a little bit about that, and then Zach can address the others.
Speaker #4: Okay, so just on high-ROI investments, I think Wayne's team has been doing a fantastic job—so, rationalizing our product and tech spend and focusing on where we have the most opportunity.
Speaker #4: So on our in-car subscription business and our ads business. So I'll let Wayne talk a little bit about that and then Zach can address the others.
Speaker #3: Yeah. There's three main areas we're focused on. As you can see, this is where some of the identity work comes in, things like companion.
Wayne Thorson: Yeah, there's three main areas we're focused on. It's, you know, as you can see, this is where some of the identity work comes in, things like Companion. It's really improving the overall go-to-market. The second is, of course, improving the experience in the car, and this, you know, all of these are tied to the sharpened focus from December of 2024. And then I'd say the third big area where we're continuing to make a lot of investments is improving the way we merchandise the breadth of our content. So that's search, that's recommendation, and other ways we're gonna push out recommendations and let people know all the wonderful things we have, which we have a huge opportunity to improve on. And of course, that helps with churn and conversion through trial.
Wayne Thorson: Yeah, there's three main areas we're focused on. It's, you know, as you can see, this is where some of the identity work comes in, things like Companion. It's really improving the overall go-to-market. The second is, of course, improving the experience in the car, and this, you know, all of these are tied to the sharpened focus from December of 2024. And then I'd say the third big area where we're continuing to make a lot of investments is improving the way we merchandise the breadth of our content. So that's search, that's recommendation, and other ways we're gonna push out recommendations and let people know all the wonderful things we have, which we have a huge opportunity to improve on. And of course, that helps with churn and conversion through trial.
Speaker #3: It's really improving the overall go-to-market. The second is, of course, improving the experience in the car. And all of these are tied to the sharpened focus from December of 2024.
Speaker #3: And then I'd say the third big area that we're continuing to make a lot of investments is improving the way we merchandise the breadth of our content.
Speaker #3: So that's search, that's recommendation, and other ways we're going to push out we have, which we have a huge opportunity to improve on. And of course, that helps with churn recommendations and let people know all the wonderful things and conversion through trial.
Speaker #3: Yeah. And Steven, maybe I'll sort of reorder the question just a little bit to dovetail what Wayne had to say. I think we're really clear on our capital return strategy.
Zach Coughlin: Yeah, and Steven, maybe I'll sort of reorder the question just a little bit to dovetail what Wayne had to say. You know, I think we're really clear on our capital return strategy. As Wayne had said, we're first focused on investing in those initiatives that drive our strategy. We've got plenty of opportunities for that. That's. We'll feed that first. I think the good news is then with the OpEx efficiency work we're doing, which I'll talk about in a moment, we're able to create the capacity to both invest and improve free cash flow. So that's well underway. So on the deleveraging piece, you know, we made significant progress in 2025, going down to 3.6 times. And we do expect to get into our guided range of low to mid-3s by later this year.
Zach Coughlin: Yeah, and Steven, maybe I'll sort of reorder the question just a little bit to dovetail what Wayne had to say. You know, I think we're really clear on our capital return strategy. As Wayne had said, we're first focused on investing in those initiatives that drive our strategy. We've got plenty of opportunities for that. That's. We'll feed that first. I think the good news is then with the OpEx efficiency work we're doing, which I'll talk about in a moment, we're able to create the capacity to both invest and improve free cash flow. So that's well underway. So on the deleveraging piece, you know, we made significant progress in 2025, going down to 3.6 times. And we do expect to get into our guided range of low to mid-3s by later this year.
Speaker #3: As Wayne had said, we're first focused on investing in those initiatives that drive our strategy. We've got plenty of opportunities for that. We'll feed that first.
Speaker #3: I think the good news efficiency work we're doing, which I'll talk about in a is then with the OPEX to both invest and improve free moment, we're able to create the capacity cash flow.
Speaker #3: So on the deleveraging piece, we made significant progress in 2025, going down to 3.6 times, so that's well underway. We do expect to get into our guided range of low to mid-threes by later this year.
Zach Coughlin: And so then if you sort of walk all the way down from there, the third return is to shareholders. Today, that's been more heavily weighted toward dividends, and that will remain important to us. And so as we achieve our target leverage later this year, that'll open up additional opportunities for us. So then just to talk a little bit about cost reductions, and I think first and foremost, obviously, it helps us to create that capacity to invest for the things that Wayne had talked about. And, you know, we're really focused on reducing complexity, getting more agile. So we'll call it getting lighter. There's always opportunities to do that.
Speaker #3: And so then if you sort of walk all the way down from there, the third return is the shareholders. Today, that's been more heavily weighted toward dividends, and that will remain important to us.
Zach Coughlin: And so then if you sort of walk all the way down from there, the third return is to shareholders. Today, that's been more heavily weighted toward dividends, and that will remain important to us. And so as we achieve our target leverage later this year, that'll open up additional opportunities for us. So then just to talk a little bit about cost reductions, and I think first and foremost, obviously, it helps us to create that capacity to invest for the things that Wayne had talked about. And, you know, we're really focused on reducing complexity, getting more agile. So we'll call it getting lighter. There's always opportunities to do that.
Speaker #3: And so as we achieve our target leverage later this year, that'll open up additional opportunities for us. So then just to talk a little bit about cost reductions, and I think first and foremost, obviously, it helps us to create that capacity to invest for the things that Wayne had talked about.
Speaker #3: And we're really focused on reducing complexity, lighter. There's always opportunities to do that. The most obvious piece we see is getting more agile. in satellite CAPEX.
Zach Coughlin: The most obvious piece we see is in satellite CapEx we've talked about, but even inside of OpEx, one example is the significant work in modernizing the tech stack that Wayne and the team are leading. And here, we expect to both be able to reduce OpEx and deliver more for our customers. So I think we see that as a win-win.
Zach Coughlin: The most obvious piece we see is in satellite CapEx we've talked about, but even inside of OpEx, one example is the significant work in modernizing the tech stack that Wayne and the team are leading. And here, we expect to both be able to reduce OpEx and deliver more for our customers. So I think we see that as a win-win.
Speaker #3: We've talked about, So we'll call it getting but even inside of OPEX, one example is the significant work in modernizing the tech stack that Wayne and the team are leading.
Speaker #3: And here we expect to deliver more for our customers. So I think we see that as a
Jessica Reif: That's great. Thank you very much.
Stephen Laszczyk: That's great. Thank you very much.
Speaker #10: That's
Speaker #10: great. Thank you very win-win.
Speaker #10: much. Our next question comes from the line of David
Operator: Our next question comes from the line of David Joyce with Seaport Research Partners. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: Our next question comes from the line of David Joyce with Seaport Research Partners. Please proceed with your questions.
Speaker #1: Joyce with Seaport Research. Please just hear.
Speaker #1: your questions. Thank
David Joyce: Thank you. Could you please update us on the early learnings from your Amazon DSP relationship? Anything that contributed in the quarter, you know, what, what do you think that can do for you in 2026? Thanks.
David Joyce: Thank you. Could you please update us on the early learnings from your Amazon DSP relationship? Anything that contributed in the quarter, you know, what, what do you think that can do for you in 2026? Thanks.
Speaker #11: on the early learnings from you. Could you please update us your Amazon DSP relationship? Anything that contributed in the quarter? What do you think that can do for you in 2026?
Speaker #4: Sure. Thanks. So we're really pleased with our programmatic partnerships. We've had a longstanding relationship with the trade desk, but we also have a significant business with DB360, Yahoo, Verizon, and growing with Amazon.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. So we're really pleased, by the way, with our programmatic partnerships. We've had a long-standing relationship with The Trade Desk, but we also have a significant business with DV360, Yahoo, Verizon, and growing with Amazon. So you know, the diversification is really important. Certain brands work with certain platforms for various reasons. So we are seeing an expansion of marketers as we work with Amazon, and we've seen really nice growth there in Q4 and continuing into Q1. So I think it'll be a nice contribution to overall programmatic business. And again, we have a lot of runway here because, as you know, with sort of CTV or video, programmatic represents a healthy share of overall ad revenue.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. So we're really pleased, by the way, with our programmatic partnerships. We've had a long-standing relationship with The Trade Desk, but we also have a significant business with DV360, Yahoo, Verizon, and growing with Amazon. So you know, the diversification is really important. Certain brands work with certain platforms for various reasons. So we are seeing an expansion of marketers as we work with Amazon, and we've seen really nice growth there in Q4 and continuing into Q1. So I think it'll be a nice contribution to overall programmatic business. And again, we have a lot of runway here because, as you know, with sort of CTV or video, programmatic represents a healthy share of overall ad revenue.
Speaker #4: So the diversification is really important. Certain brands work with certain platforms for various reasons. So we are seeing an expansion of marketers as we work with Amazon and we've seen really nice growth there in the fourth quarter and continuing into the first quarter.
Speaker #4: So I think it'll be a nice contribution to our overall programmatic business. And again, we have a lot of runway here because as you know, with sort of CTV or video, programmatic represents a healthy share of overall ad revenue.
Speaker #4: And for us, on the streaming side of our business, it's been a longstanding component, but we're just starting to build on the podcasting side.
Jennifer Witz: For us, you know, on the streaming side of our business, it's been a long-standing component, but we're just starting to build on the podcasting side. I think there's a lot of room to continue to invest and see returns there.
Jennifer Witz: For us, you know, on the streaming side of our business, it's been a long-standing component, but we're just starting to build on the podcasting side. I think there's a lot of room to continue to invest and see returns there.
Speaker #4: So I think there's a lot of room to continue to invest and see returns
Speaker #4: So I think there's a lot of room to continue to invest and see returns there.
David Joyce: All right. Thank you.
David Joyce: All right. Thank you.
Speaker #11: you. Thank
Speaker #1: you. All right. Brian Craft with Deutsche Bank. Please just hear
Operator: Thank you. Our last and final question will be from the line of Bryan Kraft with Deutsche Bank. Please proceed with your questions.
Operator: Thank you. Our last and final question will be from the line of Bryan Kraft with Deutsche Bank. Please proceed with your questions.
Speaker #1: your questions.
Speaker #12: Oh, hi. Thanks. Good morning. This Thank morning, if you could comment on where conversion rates have been running for both new and used vehicles and as well if you could talk about how they compare between 360L and non-360L, is 360L helping there?
Bryan Kraft: Oh, hi. Thanks. Good morning. I was wondering if you could comment on where conversion rates have been running for both new and used vehicles, and as well, if you could talk about how they compare between 360L and non-360L, you know, is 360L helping there? And then separately, I was wondering if you could just talk about the trends you're seeing in used car trials. Are those still growing? Are there macro pressures? Would they be growing but for macro pressures? Any color you could provide there would be really helpful. Thank you.
Bryan Kraft: Oh, hi. Thanks. Good morning. I was wondering if you could comment on where conversion rates have been running for both new and used vehicles, and as well, if you could talk about how they compare between 360L and non-360L, you know, is 360L helping there? And then separately, I was wondering if you could just talk about the trends you're seeing in used car trials. Are those still growing? Are there macro pressures? Would they be growing but for macro pressures? Any color you could provide there would be really helpful. Thank you.
Speaker #12: And then separately, I was wondering if you could just talk about the trends you're seeing in used car trials? Are those still growing? Are there macro pressures?
Speaker #12: Would they be growing but for macro pressures? Any color you could provide there would be really helpful. Thank you.
Speaker #4: Sure. So I'll start with the first one. Obviously, a healthy trial funnel is great for the business, and we saw that throughout last year.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. So I'll start with the first one. Obviously, a healthy trial funnel is great for the business, and, you know, we saw that throughout last year. You know, I think there is some pull forward, perhaps because of tariffs and just general consumer demand. In 2026, there does look to be perhaps the first year of reductions in consumer purchases of new vehicles, at least from the third-party estimates, the first time since 2022. So we may be facing a bit of a headwind there. But, you know, again, expansion of penetration rates and expansion of 360L are helping offset that to some extent, and I'll come back around to that. On the used car side, you know, organically, obviously penetration rates continue to grow there.
Jennifer Witz: Sure. So I'll start with the first one. Obviously, a healthy trial funnel is great for the business, and, you know, we saw that throughout last year. You know, I think there is some pull forward, perhaps because of tariffs and just general consumer demand. In 2026, there does look to be perhaps the first year of reductions in consumer purchases of new vehicles, at least from the third-party estimates, the first time since 2022. So we may be facing a bit of a headwind there. But, you know, again, expansion of penetration rates and expansion of 360L are helping offset that to some extent, and I'll come back around to that. On the used car side, you know, organically, obviously penetration rates continue to grow there.
Speaker #4: I think there's some pull forward perhaps because of tariffs and just general consumer demand. In '26, there does look to be perhaps the first year of reductions in consumer purchases of new vehicles, at least from the third-party estimates.
Speaker #4: The first time since 2022. So we may be facing a bit of a headwind there. But again, expansion of penetration rates and expansion of 360L are helping offset that to some extent.
Speaker #4: And I'll come back around to that. On the used car side, organically, obviously, penetration rates continue to grow there. We're at about 60%. And we have really strong relationships across our dealer network to be able to make sure that when a customer gets that the radio is working for them.
Jennifer Witz: We're at about 60%, and we have really strong relationships across our dealer network to be able to make sure that when a customer gets into their new used car, that the radio is working for them. So we continue to invest in those programs to ensure that they can have the best consumer experience on the used car side. I'd say, overall, we're not quite at 50/50 in terms of trial starts across new and used, but it's getting closer as used grows. So on conversion rates, we're seeing, you know, some similar trends that we've seen in the past. We have really strong programs and initiatives in place to, as Wayne even addressed, to address demand through the trial funnel.
Jennifer Witz: We're at about 60%, and we have really strong relationships across our dealer network to be able to make sure that when a customer gets into their new used car, that the radio is working for them. So we continue to invest in those programs to ensure that they can have the best consumer experience on the used car side. I'd say, overall, we're not quite at 50/50 in terms of trial starts across new and used, but it's getting closer as used grows. So on conversion rates, we're seeing, you know, some similar trends that we've seen in the past. We have really strong programs and initiatives in place to, as Wayne even addressed, to address demand through the trial funnel.
Speaker #4: So we continue to invest in those programs. To ensure that they can have the best consumer experience on the used car side, say overall, we're not quite at 50/50 in terms of trial starts across new and used.
Speaker #4: But it’s getting closer as used grows. So on conversion rates, we’re seeing some similar trends that we’ve seen in the past. We have really strong programs and initiatives in place to, as Wayne even addressed, to address demand through the trial funnel, and those include things like the expansion of the pricing and packaging that we’ve put in place, whether it’s low-cost with ads or music only at $9.99.
Jennifer Witz: You know, those include things like the expansion of the pricing and packaging that we've put in place, whether it's low-cost ads or music only at $9.99. We're seeing healthy take rates on when we put those price points in front of customers on our full price packages. So again, it's opening the top of the funnel and getting people on the best package for them. But what's even more important is getting the right content in front of the right customer. So we have an incredible portfolio, but it's extensive, and we need to make sure customers can find the content they love. When we've tested this in smaller ways, we see meaningful lift in conversion. So it's really about the capabilities that Wayne's team has been building.
Jennifer Witz: You know, those include things like the expansion of the pricing and packaging that we've put in place, whether it's low-cost ads or music only at $9.99. We're seeing healthy take rates on when we put those price points in front of customers on our full price packages. So again, it's opening the top of the funnel and getting people on the best package for them. But what's even more important is getting the right content in front of the right customer. So we have an incredible portfolio, but it's extensive, and we need to make sure customers can find the content they love. When we've tested this in smaller ways, we see meaningful lift in conversion. So it's really about the capabilities that Wayne's team has been building.
Speaker #4: We're seeing healthy take rates on when we put those price points in front of customers on our full price packages. So again, it's opening the top of the funnel and getting people on the best package for them.
Speaker #4: More important is getting the right content in front of the right customers. So we have an incredible portfolio, but it's extensive.
Speaker #4: And we need to make sure customers can find the content they love when we've tested this in smaller ways. We see meaningful lift in conversion.
Speaker #4: So it's really about the capabilities that Wayne's team has been building this is taking our it's taken longer than I would like. Admittedly, we've been on this path for two or three years, but a lot of things are coming over the finish line this year that I believe will help us to really drive personalization in marketing.
Jennifer Witz: This is taking longer than I would like, admittedly. You know, we've been on this path for two or three years, but a lot of things are coming over the finish line this year that I believe will help us to really drive personalization in marketing. We do see, because with 360L, we get that data back on listening, even if you are listening or aren't listening, and how much you're listening and what you're listening to. We can design our marketing, and even in some cases, product recommendations, to address that. So that's really core. We see, you know, 360L conversion rates better than non-360L.
Jennifer Witz: This is taking longer than I would like, admittedly. You know, we've been on this path for two or three years, but a lot of things are coming over the finish line this year that I believe will help us to really drive personalization in marketing. We do see, because with 360L, we get that data back on listening, even if you are listening or aren't listening, and how much you're listening and what you're listening to. We can design our marketing, and even in some cases, product recommendations, to address that. So that's really core. We see, you know, 360L conversion rates better than non-360L.
Speaker #4: And we do see because with 360L, we get that data back on listening. Even if you are listening or aren't listening, and how much you're listening and what you're listening to.
Speaker #4: And we can design our marketing and even in some cases, product recommendations to address that. So that's really core. We see 360L conversion rates better than non-360L.
Speaker #4: We even see it’s pretty early, but we launched 360L on AAOS, which is a platform that we can more easily update, and it comes at launch fully featured.
Jennifer Witz: We even see, it's pretty early, but we launched 360L on AOS, which is a platform that we can more easily update and comes, you know, at launch, fully featured. So we even see better conversion rates there. So we know there's something here to unlock. It's just about getting some of these capabilities across the finish line this year to support it.
Jennifer Witz: We even see, it's pretty early, but we launched 360L on AOS, which is a platform that we can more easily update and comes, you know, at launch, fully featured. So we even see better conversion rates there. So we know there's something here to unlock. It's just about getting some of these capabilities across the finish line this year to support it.
Speaker #4: So we even see better conversion rates there. So we know there's something here to unlock. It's just about getting some of these to support it.
Speaker #11: Thank
Speaker #11: you.
Jessica Reif: Thank you.
Bryan Kraft: Thank you.
Speaker #1: Okay. And so with that, is the last question I want to thank wrapped up 2025 and report out there, I everybody for joining and as we're capabilities across the finish line this year to think just to close by thanking the SIRIUS XM employees all around the world.
Zach Coughlin: Okay. So with that as the last question, I wanna thank everybody for joining. As we're wrapped up 2025 and report out there, I think just to close by thanking the SiriusXM employees all around the world. It was a good year, and that was obviously driven by the contribution of all of you, and we're off to a good start in 2026 as well. So thank you.
Scott Greenstein: Okay. So with that as the last question, I wanna thank everybody for joining. As we're wrapped up 2025 and report out there, I think just to close by thanking the SiriusXM employees all around the world. It was a good year, and that was obviously driven by the contribution of all of you, and we're off to a good start in 2026 as well. So thank you.
Speaker #1: It was a good year, and that was obviously driven by the contribution of all of you. We're off to a good start in 2026 as well.
