Q4 2026 Momentum Group Ltd Earnings Call

September 17, 2026

Speaker #1: Good morning, everyone.

Dan Moyane: Good morning, everyone. Good morning, everyone.

Speaker #2: Good morning, everyone. I'm in charge of the energy in this room. I thought I was going to receive a big, warm welcome. Thank you so much.

[Company Representative] (Momentum Group): Good morning.

[Unknown Attendee]: Good morning.

Dan Moyane: Judging by the energy in this room, I thought I was going to receive a big, warm welcome. Thank you so much. My name is Dan Moyane, just in case some of you have forgotten. Thank you very much. It's my pleasure and privilege to welcome you to the presentation of the annual financial results of the Momentum Group for the period ending 30 June 2026. Jeanette Marais, the energy in this room. Guys, give yourselves a round of applause. It's just a beautiful moment. I was telling Anneke now, I don't know what to do with all this energy. It's so palpable. It's beautiful to see. So we are coming to you live from the company's head offices here in Centurion, Tshwane.

Speaker #2: My name is Dan Moyane, just in case some of you have forgotten. Thank you very much. It's my pleasure and privilege to welcome you to the presentation of the annual financial results of the Momentum Group for the period ending 30 June 2026.

Speaker #2: Jeanette, the energy in this room—guys, give yourselves a round of applause. It's just a beautiful moment. I was telling Anek now, I was telling Anek, I don't know what to do with all this energy.

Speaker #2: It's so palpable. It's beautiful to see. So, we are coming to you live from the company's head offices here in Centurion, Tshwane. We welcome everyone who's joining us today.

Dan Moyane: We welcome everyone who's joining us today, the analysts, the investors, the shareholders, the journalists, and employees, of course, of the company who are watching us live, either on the mPulse platform, which is the internet of the group, or on BDTV, that's Business Day TV, which is on DStv, that's channel 412, or on our live webcast which is corpcam.com/mg, and today's date 17 September 2026. It just feels like a special day, the 17th of September. The full results, of course, are available for you as well. You want to check them out on the group's website. That's momentumgroupltd.co.za. Thanks to the Momentum Group Investor Relations team who have put together the presentation that you're about to see shortly, and the group marketing's PR and events team for their execution of today.

Speaker #2: The analysts, the investors, the shareholders, the journalists, and, of course, the employees of the company, who are watching us live either on the MPulse platform—which is the intranet of the Group—or on BDTV.

Speaker #2: That's Business Day Television, which is on DStv—that's Channel 412—or on our live webcast, which is copcam.com/mg. And today's date: 17/09/2026. It just feels like a special day, this 17th of September.

Speaker #2: Now, the full results, of course, are available for you as well. You can check them out on the group's website—that's momentumgroupltd.co.za. Thanks to the Momentum Group Investor Relations team, who have put together the presentation that you're about to see shortly.

Dan Moyane: The full results, of course, are available for you as well. You want to check them out on the group's website. That's momentumgroupltd.co.za. Thanks to the Momentum Group Investor Relations team who have put together the presentation that you're about to see shortly, and the group marketing's PR and events team for their execution of today.

Speaker #2: And the Group Marketing's PR and Events team for their execution of today. Now, as you'll hear shortly, this is a very strong set of results which you can all be proud of.

Dan Moyane: Now, as you will hear shortly, this is a very strong set of results, which we can all be proud of. It is, in fact, always good when a company that is called Momentum shows that it has plenty of it, and these results certainly suggest that it does. The Group CEO, Jeanette Marais, and the Group Finance Director, Risto Ketola, will present this set of results covering how the focused implementation of the group strategy has achieved the earnings target a year in advance of the completion of the Impact Strategy in 2027. As in the past, there will of course, be time after the presentation to get questions from analysts to get them responded to. Jeanette and Risto will do that. Now, let us put a round of warm welcome, really warm welcome, to Jeanette to begin the presentation. Before you start, Jeanette.

Speaker #2: It is, in fact, always good when a company that's called Momentum shows that it has plenty—plenty—of it. And these results certainly suggest that it does.

Speaker #2: The Group CEO, Jeanette Marais, and the Group Finance Director, Risto Ketola, will present this set of results, covering how the focused implementation of the group strategy has achieved the earnings target a year in advance of the completion of the Impact Strategy in 2027.

Speaker #2: So, as in the past, there will, of course, be time after the presentation to get questions from analysts and to have them responded to. Jeanette and Risto will do that.

Dan Moyane: As in the past, there will of course, be time after the presentation to get questions from analysts to get them responded to. Jeanette and Risto will do that. Now, let us put a round of warm welcome, really warm welcome, to Jeanette to begin the presentation. Before you start, Jeanette.

Speaker #2: Now, let's put a round of warm welcome—really warm welcome—to Jeanette to begin the presentation. Now, before you start, Jeanette—before you start—I don't know if you remember this.

Dan Moyane: Before you start, I do not know if you remember this, during COVID-19, countries were battling what to do, but there were three countries that did the right things. One of them is New Zealand, and in my book, the reason why they did so well is because they were led by women.

Speaker #2: During COVID-19, countries were battling with what to do, but there were three countries that did the right things. One of them is New Zealand. And in my book, the reason why they did so well is because they were led by women.

Speaker #3: We'll make sure your bonus reflects that comment. Good morning, everyone—especially to our colleague, where are you, Brant? Brant Pretorius, who is—again, I think the same happened last year—celebrating his birthday today.

Jeanette Marais: We will make sure your bonus reflect that, Colin. Good morning, everyone. Especially to our colleague. Where are you, Brand? Brand Pretorius, who is again, I think the same happened last year, celebrating his birthday today. So congratulations, Brand. It is wonderful that you are spending your birthday with us today, but I am sure we are going to make it worth your while. Then also from me and my team, it is wonderful to have my whole executive team here with me today to welcome you to the live results broadcast of our annual financial results for 2026. I really am excited to present record results to you today. So I will start by summarizing the key financial results, after which I will put a further spotlight on some of the individual business units and their contribution to our excellent set of results.

Speaker #3: So, congratulations, Brant. It's wonderful that you're spending your birthday with us today, but I'm sure we're going to make it worth your while. And then, also from me and my team, it's wonderful to have my whole executive team here with me today.

Jeanette Marais: Then also from me and my team, it is wonderful to have my whole executive team here with me today to welcome you to the live results broadcast of our annual financial results for 2026. I really am excited to present record results to you today. So I will start by summarizing the key financial results, after which I will put a further spotlight on some of the individual business units and their contribution to our excellent set of results.

Speaker #3: Welcome to the live broadcast of our annual financial results for 2026. I am really excited to present record results to you today.

Speaker #3: So, I'll start by summarizing the key financial results, after which I will put a further spotlight on some of the individual business units and their contribution to our excellent set of results.

Speaker #3: Now, when we communicated in 2024 that we had set an earnings target of $7 billion by FY 2027, many of our stakeholders, some of you in this room today, thought that it would be impossible to deliver those targets.

Jeanette Marais: Now, when we communicated in 2024 that we had set an earnings target of ZAR 7 billion by F 2027, many of our stakeholders, some of you in this room today, thought that it would be impossible to deliver those targets. At that point, market consensus and business unit projections forecasted earnings of ZAR 6.3 billion by F 2027. As an executive team, we decided to really challenge ourselves by setting what was then called an unreasonable target of ZAR 7 billion. Then we sat down, and we made sure that we had the plans in place to deliver. So I am very proud to stand here today and to announce that we have closed F 2026 with record normalized headline earnings of more than ZAR 7 billion, up 13% from last year. As Dan has said, a whole year earlier than planned.

Speaker #3: At that point, market consensus and business unit projections forecasted earnings of $6.3 billion by FY2027. So, as an executive team, we decided to really challenge ourselves by setting what was then called an unreasonable target of $7 billion.

Jeanette Marais: As an executive team, we decided to really challenge ourselves by setting what was then called an unreasonable target of ZAR 7 billion. Then we sat down, and we made sure that we had the plans in place to deliver. So I am very proud to stand here today and to announce that we have closed F 2026 with record normalized headline earnings of more than ZAR 7 billion, up 13% from last year. As Dan has said, a whole year earlier than planned.

Speaker #3: And then we sat down and made sure that we had the plans in place to deliver. So I am very proud to stand here today and to announce that we have closed FY2026 with record normalized headline earnings of more than $7 billion.

Speaker #3: Up 13% from last year, and as Dan has said, a whole year earlier than planned. This is also more than double the earnings we achieved in FY2023.

Jeanette Marais: This is also more than double the earnings we achieved in F 2023. We have seen stronger operational performance across most of our business units, and the quality of our earnings also improved year on year, with much fewer positive market impacts that helped us with our profitability. There are two extra facts that I want to share with you. It is the first time, Risto says in his 10 years, I would say probably ever, that every single one of our business units is profitable. Not just that, five of our individual businesses contributed more than ZAR 1 billion each in earnings this year. We have seen a 5% improvement in our VNB, from 469 last year to 491 this year, and we have seen an improvement in every single one of our business units except one.

Speaker #3: We've seen stronger operational performance across most of our business units, and the quality of our earnings also improved year-on-year, with far fewer positive market impacts contributing to our profitability.

Speaker #3: Now, there are two extra facts that I want to share with you. It is the first time Risto says in his 10 years, I would say probably ever, that every single one of our business units is profitable.

Jeanette Marais: It is the first time, Risto says in his 10 years, I would say probably ever, that every single one of our business units is profitable. Not just that, five of our individual businesses contributed more than ZAR 1 billion each in earnings this year. We have seen a 5% improvement in our VNB, from 469 last year to 491 this year, and we have seen an improvement in every single one of our business units except one.

Speaker #3: And not just that, five of our individual businesses contributed more than $1 billion each in earnings this year. We've seen a 5% improvement in our VNB from 469 last year to 491 this year.

Speaker #3: And we've seen an improvement in every single one of our business units except one. Momentum Investments had improved margins and higher volumes on their wealth platforms, but this, unfortunately, was again moderated by lower demand for guaranteed annuities and the market shift towards higher volume, lower margin living annuities.

Jeanette Marais: Momentum Investments had improved margins and higher volumes on their wealth platforms, but this unfortunately was again moderated by lower demand for guaranteed annuities and the market shift towards higher volume, lower margin living annuities. The focus on the quality and the profitability of our new business remains an important focus area for us as a business. It is the one that we know that we can still improve quite a lot. We have a clear action plan for each one of our businesses, and that is really to improve product commerciality, pricing discipline, advisor productivity, and make sure that we generate profitable growth. Our sales numbers of sales growth has really exceeded all of our expectations, with an 18% increase in our sales numbers to ZAR 94 billion of sales this year. We have done really well across all of our businesses. Africa delivered the strongest increase at 45%.

Speaker #3: The focus on the quality and the profitability of our new business remains an important focus area for us as a business. It's one that we know we can still improve quite a lot.

Speaker #3: But we have a clear action plan for each one of our businesses, and that is really to improve product commerciality, pricing discipline, advisor productivity, and make sure that we generate profitable growth.

Jeanette Marais: We have a clear action plan for each one of our businesses, and that is really to improve product commerciality, pricing discipline, advisor productivity, and make sure that we generate profitable growth. Our sales numbers of sales growth has really exceeded all of our expectations, with an 18% increase in our sales numbers to ZAR 94 billion of sales this year. We have done really well across all of our businesses. Africa delivered the strongest increase at 45%.

Speaker #3: Our sales numbers and sales growth have really exceeded all of our expectations, with an 18% increase in our sales numbers to $94 billion of sales this year.

Speaker #3: We've done really well across all of our businesses. Africa delivered the strongest increase at 45%. Momentum Corporate, at 38%, was mainly due to new business and funds at work, living annuity, and single-premium structured investments.

Jeanette Marais: Momentum Corporate, 38%, was mainly due to new business and funds at work, living annuity and single premium structured investments. Momentum Investments increased their sales by 16% overall, and our wealth platform new business is up by 24%. Momentum Retail's 8% growth was driven by Investo, our recurring premium savings product. In Metropolitan, it is the only business where we saw a decrease in sales, which decreased by 14%. This was a very deliberate focus we had on reducing our footprint by 33% over the last year. What we have seen, this difference is such that we have seen a significant improvement in our agent productivity and in the quality of new business in Metropolitan. I am very pleased to declare a final dividend of 120 cents, which brings our full year dividend to 230 cents per ordinary share.

Speaker #3: Momentum Investments increased their sales by 16% overall, and our wealth platform new business is up by 24%. Momentum Retail's 8% growth was driven by Investo, our recurring premium savings product.

Speaker #3: And the Metropolitan is the only business where we saw a decrease in sales, which decreased by 14%. But this was a very deliberate focus—we had on reducing our footprint by 33% over the last year.

Speaker #3: But what we have seen is that this difference has resulted in only an insignificant improvement in our agent productivity and in the quality of new business in Metropolitan.

Jeanette Marais: What we have seen, this difference is such that we have seen a significant improvement in our agent productivity and in the quality of new business in Metropolitan. I am very pleased to declare a final dividend of 120 cents, which brings our full year dividend to 230 cents per ordinary share.

Speaker #3: I'm very pleased to declare a final dividend of $120, which brings our full-year dividend to $230 per ordinary share. This is an excellent year-on-year growth of 31% on the final dividend we declared of $175 last year.

Jeanette Marais: This is excellent year-on-year growth of 31% on the final dividend we declared of 175 cents last year. This growth is definitely underpinned by our very strong capital position, and this dividend payment, even at this level, remains at the lower end of the target range that we set for ourselves in our dividend policy. So there is lots of room to do better. Return on equity remains one of our best performing measurements. As you can see, ROE increased further to 21.7%, and this again, driven by our strong earnings. Our ROE is already ahead of our target of 20% for F 2027, and it remains of the highest in the industry, if not the highest. This concludes what I wanted to say about the financial results. As you know, Risto will share a lot more about that.

Speaker #3: Now, this growth is definitely underpinned by our very strong capital position. And this dividend payment, even at this level, remains at the lower end of the target range that we set for ourselves in our dividend policy.

Speaker #3: So there's lots of room to do better. Return on equity remains one of our best-performing measurements. And, as you can see, ours increased further to 21.7%.

Jeanette Marais: As you can see, ROE increased further to 21.7%, and this again, driven by our strong earnings. Our ROE is already ahead of our target of 20% for F 2027, and it remains of the highest in the industry, if not the highest. This concludes what I wanted to say about the financial results. As you know, Risto will share a lot more about that.

Speaker #3: And this, again, is driven by our strong earnings. Our ROE is already ahead of our target of 20% for FY2027, and it remains one of the highest in the industry, if not the highest.

Speaker #3: Now, this concludes what I wanted to say about the financial results. As you know, Risto will share a lot more about that. But this time, I'm not going to focus on the delivery on specific impact strategy objectives like I always do.

Jeanette Marais: But this time, I am not going to focus on the delivery on specific Impact Strategy objectives like I always do. I am going to focus on how we delivered these excellent earnings. As I mentioned earlier, every single business unit is profitable. Five businesses are now in the ZAR 1 billion earnings stable, realizing the dream Risto had of having four unicorns when we launched the Impact Strategy. In these tough economic conditions, we have also managed to double our earnings in 3 years. We managed to more than double our share price and our market cap in less than 3 years. But it was not only market sentiment that shifted. There was a fundamental shift in the business itself. 3 years ago, we started by defining our purpose.

Speaker #3: I'm going to focus on how we delivered these excellent earnings. And as I mentioned earlier, every single business unit is profitable. Five businesses are now in the $1 billion earnings table, realizing the dream Risto had of having four unicorns when we launched the impact strategy.

Speaker #3: And in these tough economic conditions, we have also managed to double our earnings in three years, and we managed to more than double our share price and our market cap in less than three years.

Jeanette Marais: In these tough economic conditions, we have also managed to double our earnings in 3 years. We managed to more than double our share price and our market cap in less than 3 years. But it was not only market sentiment that shifted. There was a fundamental shift in the business itself. 3 years ago, we started by defining our purpose.

Speaker #3: But it wasn't only market sentiment that shifted. There was a fundamental shift in the business itself. Three years ago, we started by defining our purpose, we developed our impact strategy, and then we articulated the culture behaviors that we thought would help our people live our purpose and deliver on our strategy.

Jeanette Marais: We developed our Impact Strategy. Then we articulated the culture behaviors that we thought will help our people live our purpose and deliver on our strategy. Now, I believe that we are a very different organization today because purpose, strategy, culture, which was a massive, integrated, systemic change, has really all focused on people, our employees, our stakeholders, and our clients. I believe that when these overlap, results improve exponentially. The increase in our earnings is not the purpose. It was the outcome of the integration of purpose, strategy, and culture. I just believe that when an organization start to inherently change, that is when the magic happens because that takes you away from just thinking that you exist to chase targets. We have seen a very positive shift in our earnings and growth across the group.

Speaker #3: Now, I believe that we are a very different organization today because purpose, strategy, and culture—which was a massive, integrated systemic change—has really all focused on people: our employees, our stakeholders, and our clients.

Speaker #3: And I believe that we, in these overlap results, improve exponentially. The increase in our earnings is not the purpose; it was the outcome of the integration of purpose, strategy, and culture.

Jeanette Marais: I believe that when these overlap, results improve exponentially. The increase in our earnings is not the purpose. It was the outcome of the integration of purpose, strategy, and culture. I just believe that when an organization start to inherently change, that is when the magic happens because that takes you away from just thinking that you exist to chase targets. We have seen a very positive shift in our earnings and growth across the group.

Speaker #3: And I just believe that when an organization starts to inherently change, that is when the magic happens. Because that takes you away from just thinking that you exist to chase targets.

Speaker #3: We've seen a very positive shift in our earnings and growth across the group. But today, I do want to use the three businesses that have just entered the unicorn stable as an example of the change that we've seen across our business.

Jeanette Marais: But today, I do want to use the three businesses that have just entered the unicorn stable as an example of the change that we have seen across our business. Now, when we started with the Impact Strategy, we penciled in ZAR 750 million of earnings in F2027 for Metropolitan. Yet, here they are. We also predicted that Momentum Investments and Guardrisk will reach ZAR 1 billion of earnings, but only in F2027. So let me share with you how we did this because it was not just luck. Let us start with Metropolitan. Let me have a sip of water. At the start of the Impact Strategy, we needed a fundamental shift in Metropolitan.

Speaker #3: Now, when we started with the impact strategy, we penciled in R750 million of earnings in FY2027 for Metropolitan, and yet, here they are. We also predicted that Momentum Investments and Guardrisk will reach R1 billion of earnings only in FY2027.

Jeanette Marais: We also predicted that Momentum Investments and Guardrisk will reach ZAR 1 billion of earnings, but only in F2027. So let me share with you how we did this because it was not just luck. Let us start with Metropolitan. Let me have a sip of water. At the start of the Impact Strategy, we needed a fundamental shift in Metropolitan.

Speaker #3: So let me share with you how we did this, because it wasn't just luck. Let's start with Metropolitan. Let me have a sip of water.

Speaker #3: At the start of the impact strategy, we needed a fundamental shift in Metropolitan. And the first thing the business did was define their 5-point turnaround plan to unlock their full potential, which is one of our strategic objectives, and to help them reach their $750 million of earnings by FY 2027.

Jeanette Marais: The first thing the business did was that they defined a five-point turnaround plan to unlock their full potential, which is one of our strategic objectives, and to help them reach their ZAR 750 million of earnings by F2027. What this did was it gave the business and its leaders strategic clarity of focus. They knew exactly what they needed to do. They were completely aligned on their execution. It helped them to visibly track their progress. You will remember that I repeatedly gave you feedback about how the business was doing against their five-point plan. Product commerciality was one of the most important levers in the five-point plan. Really, this focused on improved product design, new business quality.

Speaker #3: What this did was it gave the business and its leaders strategic clarity of focus. They knew exactly what they needed to do. They were completely aligned on their execution, and it helped them to visibly track their progress.

Speaker #3: And you will remember that I repeatedly gave you feedback about how the business was doing against their 5-point plan. Product commerciality was one of the most important levers in the 5-point plan.

Jeanette Marais: You will remember that I repeatedly gave you feedback about how the business was doing against their five-point plan. Product commerciality was one of the most important levers in the five-point plan. Really, this focused on improved product design, new business quality.

Speaker #3: And really, this focused on improved product design and new business quality. But on top of this, Metropolitan also looked at the cost of redistribution. This has helped them to improve their VNB from a negative R41 million by R100 million to R60 million now at the end of FY2026.

Jeanette Marais: But on top of this, Metropolitan also looked at the cost of their distribution. This has helped them to improve their VNB from a -ZAR 41 million by ZAR 100 million to ZAR 60 million now at the end of F2026. They also embarked on a multi-year digital transformation plan, which was a massive migration from their legacy systems onto more modern platforms. They expanded the automation and the digital self-service. It is important to remember that migration from the legacy system was one of the biggest of its kind ever done in South Africa. It required a lot of collaboration from across the group. At the same time, they had to execute it without any client disruption. This helped them to deliver efficiencies that structurally reduced their cost base on top of everything else. It helped them change the way in which they service their clients.

Speaker #3: They also embarked on a multi-year digital transformation plan, which was a massive migration from their legacy systems onto more modern platforms. They expanded their automation and their digital self-service.

Speaker #3: It's important to remember that the legacy migration from the legacy system was one of the biggest of its kind ever done in South Africa.

Jeanette Marais: It is important to remember that migration from the legacy system was one of the biggest of its kind ever done in South Africa. It required a lot of collaboration from across the group. At the same time, they had to execute it without any client disruption. This helped them to deliver efficiencies that structurally reduced their cost base on top of everything else. It helped them change the way in which they service their clients.

Speaker #3: It required a lot of collaboration from across the group, and at the same time, they had to execute it without any client disruption. Now, this helped them to deliver efficiencies that structurally reduced their cost base on top of everything else.

Speaker #3: And it helped them change the way in which they service their clients. Digital self-service has now increased to 32%. Manual work reduced by 50%, which means that our good people have time to focus more on client needs rather than doing administration.

Jeanette Marais: Digital self-service has now increased to 32%. Manual work reduced by 50%, which means that our good people have time to focus more on client needs rather than doing administration. Through their very disciplined cost savings program, Metropolitan managed to save costs of almost ZAR 160 million over the last two years. Focus on advice, very important, not only one of the levers of the five-point plan, but at the same time, also one of our group's strategic objectives. This for me, is one of the most beautiful examples of where strategy and culture behaviors actually start to overlap. It took a lot of courage for Peter and his team to rationalize and optimize their client agency. It was not an easy process. By doing that, they created a leaner and a much more productive sales force.

Speaker #3: And through their very disciplined cost savings program, Metropolitan managed to save costs of almost $160 million over the last two years. Focus on advice.

Speaker #3: This is very important—not only is it one of the levers of the five-point plan, but it is also one of our group strategic objectives.

Speaker #3: And this, for me, is one of the most beautiful examples of where strategy and cultural behaviors actually start to overlap. Because it took a lot of courage for Peter and his team to rationalize and optimize their client agency.

Jeanette Marais: This for me, is one of the most beautiful examples of where strategy and culture behaviors actually start to overlap. It took a lot of courage for Peter and his team to rationalize and optimize their client agency. It was not an easy process. By doing that, they created a leaner and a much more productive sales force.

Speaker #3: It was not an easy process. And by doing that, they created a leaner and a much more productive sales force. The agency force, and this is over the two years of the impact strategy, reduced by 42%, but their sales only reduced by 19%.

Jeanette Marais: The agency force, and this is over the two years of the Impact Strategy, reduced by 42%, but their sales only reduced by 19%. This advisor productivity also increased from 2.8 to 3.7 policies per week. Not only do we have much higher advisor productivity, but also much better quality of new business, which is again, good for our clients. Metropolitan remains an example to the rest of the group of what a group look like when you really, really are obsessed about how you make your clients feel. What always impressed me is that they always challenge themselves to find more ways to do better for their clients. What they have also done is that they have simplified product design by launching the No-Lapse Funeral Growth Plan.

Speaker #3: And this advisor productivity also increased from 2.8 to 3.7 policies per week. So, not only do we have much higher advisor productivity, but also much better quality of new business, which is again good for our clients.

Speaker #3: And then Metropolitan remains an example to the rest of the group of what a group looks like when you really, really are obsessed about how you make your clients feel.

Jeanette Marais: Metropolitan remains an example to the rest of the group of what a group look like when you really, really are obsessed about how you make your clients feel. What always impressed me is that they always challenge themselves to find more ways to do better for their clients. What they have also done is that they have simplified product design by launching the No-Lapse Funeral Growth Plan.

Speaker #3: And what always impressed me is that they always challenge themselves to find more ways to do better for their clients. What they've also done is that they've simplified product design by launching the No Lapse Funeral Growth Plan.

Speaker #3: This is a product that actually brings together a fully digital product with pricing discipline and much improved, longer-term client outcomes, which is exactly what our strategy and our cultural behaviors are all about.

Jeanette Marais: This is a product that actually bring together fully digital product with pricing discipline and much improved longer-term client outcomes, which is exactly what our strategy and our culture behaviors is all about. The numbers speak for itself. Client satisfaction increased to 94%. Metropolitan, again, was a winner of the Ask Afrika Orange Index Award for the 11th consecutive year in a time in 11 years. So Peter, you and the team, well done. It is important to note that none of this happened on its own. Metropolitan's people made it happen. They took the courageous decisions. They built the digital capability. They owned every outcome along the way. The next business I would like to use an example is Momentum Investments. Again, at the start of the Impact Strategy, Momentum Investments had a broad but quite fragmented portfolio of capabilities.

Speaker #3: And the numbers speak for themselves. Client satisfaction increased to 94%. And Metropolitan again was a winner of the Ask Afrika Orange Index Award for the 11th consecutive year in a time span of 11 years.

Speaker #3: So, Peter, you and the team—well done. But it's important to note that none of this happened on its own. Metropolitan's people made it happen.

Jeanette Marais: Metropolitan's people made it happen. They took the courageous decisions. They built the digital capability. They owned every outcome along the way. The next business I would like to use an example is Momentum Investments. Again, at the start of the Impact Strategy, Momentum Investments had a broad but quite fragmented portfolio of capabilities.

Speaker #3: They took courageous decisions. They built digital capability. And they owned every outcome along the way. The next business I'd like to use as an example is Momentum Investments.

Speaker #3: Again, at the start of the impact strategy, Momentum Investments had a broad but quite fragmented portfolio of capabilities. And what they have done is they made the fundamental shift to align all of these capabilities with a very focused strategy, and created a much more aligned and a much more connected business.

Jeanette Marais: What they have done is they made a fundamental shift to align all of these capabilities with a very focused strategy and created a much more aligned and a much more connected business. That had a profound income. You can see the total assets under management and administration increased to more than 1.2 trillion rand. I was told yesterday that when I say trillion and billion, I have to make sure people know it's not millions. The total net flows increased to 20 billion rand. Collaboration and vertical integration is really starting to unlock a lot of value across the group, but specifically for Momentum Investments, their stronger collaboration with the channels, MFP and MDS specifically, have really improved their sales, and specifically on the wealth platform, which is the first entry point for clients into our investment suite.

Speaker #3: And that had a profound income. You can see the total assets under management and administration increased to more than $1.2 trillion. I was told yesterday that when I say trillion and billion, I have to make sure people know it's not millions.

Speaker #3: And their total net flows increased to $20 billion. Collaboration and vertical integration are really starting to unlock a lot of value across the group.

Jeanette Marais: The total net flows increased to 20 billion rand. Collaboration and vertical integration is really starting to unlock a lot of value across the group, but specifically for Momentum Investments, their stronger collaboration with the channels, MFP and MDS specifically, have really improved their sales, and specifically on the wealth platform, which is the first entry point for clients into our investment suite.

Speaker #3: But specifically for momentum investments, their stronger MFP and MDS specifically have really improved their sales, and specifically on the Wealth platform, which is the first entry point for clients into our investment suite.

Speaker #3: You can see wealth assets and administration increased to more than $360 billion, and wealth net flows to over $16 billion for the year, which is no mean feat.

Jeanette Marais: You can see wealth assets under administration increased to more than 360 billion rand and wealth net flows to over 16 billion rand for the year, which is no mean feat. Vertical integration, one of my favorite topics, is also now starting to unlock a lot of value across the value chain. If you think of the value chain, it connects your channels with your platform, with your in-house propositions, and of course, to your asset management capabilities. Again, you can see there that now, in spite of the fact that our wealth platform is still mainly supported by IFAs, 23% of our wealth assets are now managed in in-house solutions. This business has also invested a lot in new revenue streams and capabilities to help them with their growth.

Speaker #3: Vertical integration, one of my favorite topics, is now also starting to unlock a lot of value across the value chain. If you think of the value chain, it connects your channels with your platform, with your in-house propositions, and of course, to your asset management capabilities.

Speaker #3: And again, you can see there that now, in spite of the fact that our wealth platform is still mainly supported by IFAs, 23% of our wealth assets are now managed in in-house solutions.

Jeanette Marais: Again, you can see there that now, in spite of the fact that our wealth platform is still mainly supported by IFAs, 23% of our wealth assets are now managed in in-house solutions. This business has also invested a lot in new revenue streams and capabilities to help them with their growth.

Speaker #3: This business has also invested a lot in new revenue streams and capabilities to help them with their earnings of $51 million for the last year.

Jeanette Marais: Momentum Securities delivered earnings of 31 million rand for the last year, and Curate, our new baby asset manager, had strong net inflows and now stands at assets under management of 52 billion rand. They also invested in technology to improve their processes and their operations, and this really has helped them with greater efficiency and with great client outcomes. That really is, for me, one of the most positive measurements, because our client Net Promoter Score has improved from 55 to 63 points, which really is a world-class number. Fadi, you and the team, well done on that as well. Then they had to make some courageous decisions themselves. Momentum Investments closed the Momentum Money product.

Speaker #3: And CURATE, our new baby asset manager, had strong net inflows and now stands at assets under management of $52 billion. They also invested in technology to improve their processes and their operations.

Speaker #3: And this really has helped them with greater efficiency and with great client outcomes. And that really has, for me, been one of the most positive measurements because our client Net Promoter Score has improved from 55 to 63 points, which really is a world-class number.

Jeanette Marais: That really is, for me, one of the most positive measurements, because our client Net Promoter Score has improved from 55 to 63 points, which really is a world-class number. Fadi, you and the team, well done on that as well. Then they had to make some courageous decisions themselves. Momentum Investments closed the Momentum Money product.

Speaker #3: So, Fadi, you and the team, well done on that as well. And then, they had to make some courageous decisions themselves. Momentum Investments closed the Momentum Money product.

Speaker #3: We restructured its UK business completely. And then, after a few years, and being very committed to the project, they had the courage to change the wealth platform project from the single provider we were looking at at that stage, to a far more agile, modular technology, while retaining the foundational improvements that they've made.

Jeanette Marais: We restructured its UK business completely. Then after a few years and being very committed to the project, they had the courage to change the Wealth Replatform project from the single provider we were looking at at that stage, to a far more agile modular technology while retaining the foundational improvements that they've made. These milestones demonstrate what can be achieved through strategic clarity, collaboration, and the courage to change course, and an outcome of earnings more than doubling in two years, as you can see on the earnings number at the bottom of the slide. Then Guardrisk. Another sip of water. I'm talking very fast because I want to give a lot of time to Risto.

Speaker #3: And these milestones demonstrate what can be achieved through strategic clarity, collaboration, and the courage to change course. And an outcome of earnings more than doubling in two years, as you can see on the earnings number at the bottom of the slide.

Jeanette Marais: These milestones demonstrate what can be achieved through strategic clarity, collaboration, and the courage to change course, and an outcome of earnings more than doubling in two years, as you can see on the earnings number at the bottom of the slide. Then Guardrisk. Another sip of water. I'm talking very fast because I want to give a lot of time to Risto.

Speaker #3: And then Guardrisk. And another sip of water. I'm talking very fast because I want to give a lot of time to Risto. So, Guardrisk is an acquisition that we made 12 years ago, and Guardrisk remains a strong entrepreneurial business, but supported by the financial strength and the capital backing of the Momentum Group.

Jeanette Marais: Guardrisk is an acquisition that we made 12 years ago, and Guardrisk remains a strong entrepreneurial business, but supported by the financial strength and the capital backing of the Momentum Group. This has really enabled them to take some selected underwriting risk and to pursue some bolt-on acquisitions, and help them invest in the capabilities that they need for growth. The underwriting profits, specifically through the underwriting choice they made, have increased from ZAR 605 million in F24 to more than ZAR 1 billion now, which remains the largest driver of the earnings growth in Guardrisk. Guardrisk is also a strategic partner for businesses seeking to participate in the insurance space. You might be surprised by the breadth of industries, products, and partnerships which Guardrisk plays a role in, and how often Guardrisk sits behind some very innovative insurance solutions across industries and markets.

Speaker #3: And this has really enabled them to take some selected underwriting risk and to pursue some bolt-on acquisitions and help them invest in the capabilities that they need for growth.

Speaker #3: The underwriting profit, specifically through the underwriting choices they made, has increased from $605 million in F24 to more than $1 billion now, which remained the largest driver of the earnings growth in Guardrisk.

Jeanette Marais: The underwriting profits, specifically through the underwriting choice they made, have increased from ZAR 605 million in F24 to more than ZAR 1 billion now, which remains the largest driver of the earnings growth in Guardrisk. Guardrisk is also a strategic partner for businesses seeking to participate in the insurance space. You might be surprised by the breadth of industries, products, and partnerships which Guardrisk plays a role in, and how often Guardrisk sits behind some very innovative insurance solutions across industries and markets.

Speaker #3: Guardrisk is also a strategic partner for businesses seeking to participate in the insurance space. And you might be surprised by the breadth of industries, products, and partnerships in which Guardrisk plays a role.

Speaker #3: And how often Guardrisk sits behind some very innovative insurance solutions across industries and markets. And you can clearly see, again, investing in technology and data specialist capabilities has helped them to strengthen the underwriting, create efficiencies, and support their growth.

Jeanette Marais: You can clearly see, again, investing in technology, data, specialist capabilities that has helped them to strengthen the underwriting, to create efficiencies and to support their growth. Guardrisk's size has really demonstrated. The scale is really demonstrated by the market share, and Guardrisk remains the leading South African cell captive insurer, and they are a top five non-life insurer by gross written premium and insurance income. Guardrisk also decided to deliberately diversify their earnings across revenue sources, clients, industries, channels, and geographies. Its capabilities span cell captives, specialized underwriting, risk sharing, reinsurance, embedded insurance, and alternative capital solutions. Bolt-on acquisitions, or specifically acquisitions, has made a significant contribution, not to just Guardrisk growth, but also to help them broaden the capabilities and the earnings that they have for that business.

Speaker #3: And Guardrisk is really demonstrated—the scale is really demonstrated—by the market share. And Guardrisk remains the leading South African cell captive insurer.

Speaker #3: And they are a top five non-life insurer by gross written premium and insurance income. Guardrisk also decided to deliberately diversify their earnings across revenue sources, clients, industries, channels, and geographies.

Jeanette Marais: Guardrisk also decided to deliberately diversify their earnings across revenue sources, clients, industries, channels, and geographies. Its capabilities span cell captives, specialized underwriting, risk sharing, reinsurance, embedded insurance, and alternative capital solutions. Bolt-on acquisitions, or specifically acquisitions, has made a significant contribution, not to just Guardrisk growth, but also to help them broaden the capabilities and the earnings that they have for that business.

Speaker #3: Its capabilities span cell captives, specialized underwriting, risk sharing, reinsurance, embedded insurance, and alternative capital solutions. And BALTAN acquisitions, or specifically acquisitions, have made a significant contribution not just to Guardrisk's growth but also to help them broaden the capabilities and the earnings that they have for that business.

Speaker #3: Now, Guardrisk is often in the advantageous position of acquiring businesses that it already knows quite well because they’re already a client. And this supports them with more investment—more informed investment decisions.

Jeanette Marais: Guardrisk is often in the advantageous position of acquiring businesses that it really knows quite well because they are already a client. This supports them with more informed investment decisions and a much smoother transfer of the business. Zestlife was probably its boldest move at the time. It came when there was a lot of uncertainty in the market about healthcare reform, which raised a lot of questions about the future of medical gap cover. Yet, they had the courage to make the acquisition, and Zestlife and Adnet generated more than ZAR 300 million of net revenue in F26, which is up 54% year on year. The bolt-on transactions that they have done across their portfolio delivered a combined IRR of 31.4%. The integration of their Namibia short-term insurance business in F25 expanded their geographic reach.

Speaker #3: And a much smoother transfer of the business. ZEST Life was probably its boldest move at the time. It came when there was a lot of uncertainty in the market about healthcare reform, which raised a lot of questions about the future of medical gap cover.

Speaker #3: But yet, they had the courage to make the acquisition, and ZEST Life and ADNET generated more than $300 million of net revenue in F26, which is up 54% year on year.

Jeanette Marais: Yet, they had the courage to make the acquisition, and Zestlife and Adnet generated more than ZAR 300 million of net revenue in F26, which is up 54% year on year. The bolt-on transactions that they have done across their portfolio delivered a combined IRR of 31.4%. The integration of their Namibia short-term insurance business in F25 expanded their geographic reach.

Speaker #3: And then the BALTAN transactions that they have done across their portfolio delivered a combined IRR of 31.4%. The integration of the Namibia short-term insurance business in F25 expanded their geographic reach, and the earnings in that business increased by another 54% year-on-year to $74 million. I don't know what it is with 54%.

Jeanette Marais: Earnings in that business, I do not know what it is for 54%, increased by another 54% year on year to ZAR 74 million. Together, these choices enabled Guardrisk to deliver earnings of over ZAR 1 billion, achieving its Impact Strategy milestone one year ahead of target. Here is another reflection on the growth in this business, and you can see it reflected in how the valuation of the Guardrisk business has increased over the last 12 years. From ZAR 1.6 billion in 2014 at the time of the acquisition, to now a ZAR 9.2 billion valuation. They have also repaid their purchase price through dividends in 10 years. Guardrisk's journey demonstrates what is possible when a strong and supportive group provides the foundation, the capital for entrepreneurial leadership, disciplined risk-taking, and deliberate diversification.

Speaker #3: So together, these choices enabled Guardrisk to deliver earnings of over $1 billion, achieving its impact strategy milestone one year ahead of target. But here's another reflection on the growth in this business.

Speaker #3: And you can see it reflected in how the valuation of the Guardrisk business has increased over the last 12 years, from $1.6 billion in 2014 at the time of the acquisition to now a $9.2 billion valuation.

Jeanette Marais: From ZAR 1.6 billion in 2014 at the time of the acquisition, to now a ZAR 9.2 billion valuation. They have also repaid their purchase price through dividends in 10 years. Guardrisk's journey demonstrates what is possible when a strong and supportive group provides the foundation, the capital for entrepreneurial leadership, disciplined risk-taking, and deliberate diversification.

Speaker #3: They've also repaid their purchase price through dividends in ten years, and Guardrisk's journey demonstrates what is possible when a strong and supportive group provides the foundation—the capital—for entrepreneurial leadership, disciplined risk-taking, and deliberate diversification.

Speaker #3: Now, if you look across the entire group, we are where we are because there were different journeys for different businesses. Some had to focus on turnaround plans at the beginning of this period.

Jeanette Marais: Now, if you look across the entire group, we are where we are because there were different journeys for different businesses. Some had to focus on turnaround plans at the beginning of this period. There were others that were already successful, and they only needed to take it to the next level. There were areas that we identified where we needed exponential growth. The point is, many different journeys, but always exactly the same outcome. The first one is that we have a clear strategic focus. That help us to make deliberate choices about where to compete, how we can create value, and what needs to change. Secondly, collaboration and our connected capabilities are really starting to pay off across the group. The strength of our federation is showing.

Speaker #3: There were others that were already successful, and they only needed to take it to the next level. And then there were areas that we identified where we needed exponential growth.

Speaker #3: The point is many different journeys, but always exactly the same outcome. The first one is that we have a clear strategic focus. That helps us to make deliberate choices about where to compete, how we can create value, and what needs to change.

Jeanette Marais: The first one is that we have a clear strategic focus. That help us to make deliberate choices about where to compete, how we can create value, and what needs to change. Secondly, collaboration and our connected capabilities are really starting to pay off across the group. The strength of our federation is showing.

Speaker #3: Secondly, collaboration and our connected capabilities are really starting to pay off across the group. The strength of our federation is showing. So already, although we are bound together by the same strategy, the same culture, behaviors, and the same purpose, we are allowed to execute differently.

Jeanette Marais: Already, although we are bound together by the same strategy, the same culture behaviors, and the same purpose, we are allowed to execute differently. This connection is really starting to unlock a lot of value for us. Now I've just lost my slide. It's back. Then thirdly, although we are bound together as a group, our business units retain their autonomy. They get a lot of support from the group, and it is showing that our federated model is far more than the sum of its parts. Our earnings base is a lot broader, it's a lot more resilient across the group, and this is supported by diversified businesses and by diversified income streams. Our capital allocation, we provide that to all businesses in the group, and it helps all of them to create growth and to enable progress.

Speaker #3: But this connection is really starting to unlock a lot of value for us. And I've just lost my slides—it's back. Then, thirdly, although we are bound together as a group, our business units retain their autonomy.

Speaker #3: They get a lot of support from the group, and it is showing that our federated model is far more than the sum of its parts.

Speaker #3: Our earnings base is a lot broader. It's a lot more resilient across the group, and this is supported by diversified businesses and by diversified income streams.

Jeanette Marais: Our earnings base is a lot broader, it's a lot more resilient across the group, and this is supported by diversified businesses and by diversified income streams. Our capital allocation, we provide that to all businesses in the group, and it helps all of them to create growth and to enable progress.

Speaker #3: Our capital allocation—we provide that to all businesses in the group, and it’s helped all of them to create growth and to enable progress.

Speaker #3: We will not do an acquisition if it doesn't meet our hurdle rates. And I can assure you that for every transaction you see we do, there's at least five or six that we didn't do.

Jeanette Marais: We will not do an acquisition if it doesn't meet our hurdle rates. I can assure you that for every transaction you see we do, there's at least 5 or 6 that we didn't do if they don't meet these hurdle rates. I'm very happy with the excellent internal rates of return that was generated by all the acquisitions across the group. We have also demonstrated that we have the courage to make the right decisions, and that as executives, we keep each other accountable to make these decisions when they need to be made. To end off, I want to talk about the return on investment of being human. We see every time that it's the human aspect of a business that creates the exponential return.

Speaker #3: And I'm very happy with the excellent internal rates of return that were generated by all the acquisitions across the group. We have also demonstrated that we have the courage as executives to make the right decisions.

Jeanette Marais: We have also demonstrated that we have the courage to make the right decisions, and that as executives, we keep each other accountable to make these decisions when they need to be made. To end off, I want to talk about the return on investment of being human. We see every time that it's the human aspect of a business that creates the exponential return.

Speaker #3: And that, as executives, we keep each other accountable to make these decisions when they need to be made. And to end off, I want to talk about the return on investment of doing human.

Speaker #3: We see every time that it's the human aspect of a business that creates the exponential return. Our focus on people—including our clients, our advisors, and our employees—has resulted in the best return on investment for this group.

Jeanette Marais: Our focus on people, including our clients, our advisors, and our employees, has resulted in the best return on investment for this group. Businesses do not create value. People do. When people thrive, businesses thrive, too. To end off, 2 years ago, our target of ZAR 7 billion for S2027 seemed impossible. I'm incredibly proud that we managed to reach this impossible earnings target, for which I was labeled unreasonable at the time, a full year ahead of schedule. I'm even more proud of the driving force behind the success. It has nothing to do with luck. This is the result of deliberate choices, sustained effort, and a business that is increasingly operating at its full potential. These results also demonstrate what becomes possible when an organization starts changing itself rather than simply chasing targets.

Speaker #3: Businesses do not create value. People do. And when people thrive, businesses thrive too. So, to end off, two years ago our target of $7 billion for F2027 seemed impossible.

Speaker #3: I'm incredibly proud that we managed to reach this impossible earnings target, for which I was labeled unreasonable at the time, a full year ahead of schedule.

Speaker #3: But I'm even more proud of the driving force behind this success. It has nothing to do with luck. This is the result of deliberate choices, sustained efforts, and a business that is increasingly operating at its full potential.

Jeanette Marais: I'm even more proud of the driving force behind the success. It has nothing to do with luck. This is the result of deliberate choices, sustained effort, and a business that is increasingly operating at its full potential. These results also demonstrate what becomes possible when an organization starts changing itself rather than simply chasing targets.

Speaker #3: These results also demonstrate what becomes possible when an organization starts changing itself, rather than simply chasing targets. And this is when you see the magic—when purpose, strategy, and culture start to come together.

Jeanette Marais: And this is what you see, the magic when purpose, strategy, and culture start to come together. Our focus on our clients, our client obsession, as we call it inside this building, is really starting to bear fruit. I am seeing that the metrics are all moving in the right direction. But we can never deny that there is always a lot more that we need to do in this space. But our willingness to focus on it and the energy that that has created inside our building gives me great hope that it is only going to get better and better from here. In closing, thank you to our employees for living our purpose to build and protect our clients' financial dreams and for shaping a culture that we can be proud of.

Speaker #3: Our focus on our clients—our client obsession, as we call it inside this building—is really starting to bear fruit. And I'm seeing that the metrics are all moving in the right direction.

Speaker #3: But we can never deny that there’s always a lot more that we need to do in this space. But our willingness to focus on it, and the energy that has created inside our building, gives me great hope that it’s only going to get better and better from here.

Jeanette Marais: But our willingness to focus on it and the energy that that has created inside our building gives me great hope that it is only going to get better and better from here. In closing, thank you to our employees for living our purpose to build and protect our clients' financial dreams and for shaping a culture that we can be proud of.

Speaker #3: So, in closing, thank you to our employees for living our purpose—to build and protect our clients' financial dreams—and for shaping a culture that we can be proud of.

Speaker #3: Also, thank you to my executive team, who accepted unreasonable targets and are delivering on them every single day. To our board, thank you for all your support.

Jeanette Marais: Also, thank you to my executive team who accepted unreasonable targets and are delivering on it every single day. To our board, thank you for all your support, thank you for all your wisdom. And to our financial advisors and clients, thank you for trusting us with your financial dreams. That was a drum roll, I think. And with 2 minutes to spare, Risto, you have got extra time. I am handing over to Risto to take us through the financials. Thank you very much.

Speaker #3: Thank you for all your wisdom. And to our financial advisors and clients, thank you for trusting us with your financial dreams. That was a drumroll, I think.

Speaker #3: And with two minutes to spare, Risto, you've got extra time. I'm handing over to Risto to take us through the financials. Thank you very much.

Speaker #1: Thanks, Jeanette. My ball is the one without the lipstick. No, it is a pleasure to come and talk to you about the business. People who know me well know it's one of my favorite things—to talk about Momentum Group.

Risto Ketola: Thanks, Jeanette. My bottle is the one without the lipstick. No, it is a pleasure to come and talk to you about the business. People who know me well know it is one of my favorite things, is to talk about Momentum Group. Okay. Earnings are ZAR 7.1 billion. Jeanette covered that a little bit earlier. I will obviously give details just now. To preempt a question that will come up is, what do I think is like the normalized earnings if you take out a lot of the volatility in here? I would say it is about ZAR 6.6 billion. There is about ZAR 400 million of positive investment variances in the current year result. A lot lower than last year. So when we talk about the improvement in quality, a lot of that comment comes from lower positive investment variances this year.

Speaker #1: Okay, so earnings, $7.1 billion. Jeanette covered that a little bit earlier. I'll obviously give details just now. We pre-empt a question that will come up, which is: What do I think is the normalized earnings if you take out a lot of the volatility in here?

Risto Ketola: To preempt a question that will come up is, what do I think is like the normalized earnings if you take out a lot of the volatility in here? I would say it is about ZAR 6.6 billion. There is about ZAR 400 million of positive investment variances in the current year result. A lot lower than last year. So when we talk about the improvement in quality, a lot of that comment comes from lower positive investment variances this year.

Speaker #1: I would say it's about $6.6 billion, and there's about $400 million of positive investment variances in the current year result—a lot lower than last year.

Speaker #1: So, when we talk about the improvement in quality, a lot of that comment comes from lower positive investment variances this year. Assumption changes were a little bit positive for the year, maybe $100 million.

Risto Ketola: Assumption changes were a little bit positive for the year, maybe ZAR 100 million. Remember, a lot of that goes into CSM nowadays rather than coming through earnings. Also in my calculation, we adjusted the underwriting results to be a little bit closer to normal rather than very favorable the last year. But on the negative side, we did have VC fund losses again. Most investors, we do not talk about it too much, but investors might know that over the last 4 years, we have taken ZAR 1 billion of fair value losses on our VC investments through the P&L. So the strong results have been despite that sort of a headwind. We also had couple of operational events, fraud events and things like that you can add back as one-offs during the year. And we also had some experience variances, like unexpected reinsurance expenses during the year.

Speaker #1: Remember, a lot of that goes into CSM nowadays rather than coming through earnings. Also, in my calculation, we adjusted the underwriting results to be a little bit closer to normal rather than very favorable like last year.

Speaker #1: But on the negative side, we did have VC fund losses again. Most investors—we don't talk about it too much, but investors might know that over the last four years we've taken a billion in fair value losses on the VC investments through the P&L.

Risto Ketola: Most investors, we do not talk about it too much, but investors might know that over the last 4 years, we have taken ZAR 1 billion of fair value losses on our VC investments through the P&L. So the strong results have been despite that sort of a headwind. We also had couple of operational events, fraud events and things like that you can add back as one-offs during the year. And we also had some experience variances, like unexpected reinsurance expenses during the year.

Speaker #1: So the strong results have been despite that sort of a headwind. We also had a couple of operational events, afford events, and things like that, that you can add back as one-offs during the year.

Speaker #1: And we also had some experience variances, you know, like unexpected reinsurance expenses during the year. So net-net, maybe a $500 million round adjustment to get to $6.6 billion.

Risto Ketola: Net-net, maybe ZAR 500 million adjustment to get to ZAR 6.6 billion. Now, it is always nice when things add up. ZAR 6.6 billion times 10, ZAR 66 billion, that is our EV. The normalized earning number is pretty consistent with the EV number that we sort of show the investors. Also, ZAR 6.6 billion times 10 is ZAR 66 billion. It is a lot more than our market cap, but that is a topic for another day. Earnings per share up 18%. That extra 5% reflects the buyback that we completed during the year. Dividend up 31%. The 13% above the earnings growth comes from the new dividend policy. Our payout ratio did increase quite a bit over the year. ROE remains high, above our 20% target, close to 22% at the moment. Embedded value per share, one of the more pleasing aspects of the results, up 19% for the year.

Speaker #1: Now, it's always nice when things add up. So, 6.6 billion times 10 is 66 billion—that's our EV. You know, so the normalized earnings number is pretty consistent with the EV number that we show the investors.

Speaker #1: Okay. Also, 6.6 times 10 is $66 billion. It's a lot more than our market cap, but that's a topic for another time. Earnings per share is up 18%.

Speaker #1: That extra 5% reflects the buyback that we completed during the year. Dividend is up 31%. The 13% above the earnings growth comes from the new dividend policy.

Risto Ketola: The 13% above the earnings growth comes from the new dividend policy. Our payout ratio did increase quite a bit over the year. ROE remains high, above our 20% target, close to 22% at the moment. Embedded value per share, one of the more pleasing aspects of the results, up 19% for the year.

Speaker #1: So, our payout ratio did increase quite a bit over the year. ROE remains high, above our 20% target—close to 22% at the moment.

Speaker #1: Embedded value per share, one of the more pleasing aspects of the results, was up 19% for the year. If you add back the dividend, the return on embedded value was 24% for the year.

Risto Ketola: If you add back the dividend, the return on embedded value was 24% for the year. Now, I think that is an exceptional result. I will actually expand on that just now, but maybe the short story there is that the return on embedded value on the core life business remains as good as it has always been. That is a very well-managed part of the business. Now our non-covered businesses, Guardrisk, Health, those things are starting to come through strongly, which is lifting the overall group embedded value growth. Business volumes up 18%. Jeanette spoke about one or two areas there. The value of new business, VNB, up 5%. To be honest, that is a little bit better than I thought coming into the last quarter of the year. I will show you later that annuity VNB dropped by ZAR 200 million literally.

Speaker #1: Now, I think that's an exceptional result. I'll actually expand on that in a moment, but maybe the short story there is that the return on embedded value on the core life business remains as good as it's always been.

Speaker #1: So that’s a very well-managed part of the business. And now, our non-covered businesses—Card, Risk, Health—those things are starting to come through strongly, which is lifting the overall group embedded value growth.

Risto Ketola: Now our non-covered businesses, Guardrisk, Health, those things are starting to come through strongly, which is lifting the overall group embedded value growth. Business volumes up 18%. Jeanette spoke about one or two areas there. The value of new business, VNB, up 5%. To be honest, that is a little bit better than I thought coming into the last quarter of the year. I will show you later that annuity VNB dropped by ZAR 200 million literally.

Speaker #1: Business volumes are up 18%. Jeanette spoke about one or two areas there. The value of new business (VNB) is up 5%. To be honest, that's a little bit better than I thought coming into the last quarter of the year.

Speaker #1: I'll show you later that annuity VMB dropped by $200 million, literally. It does mean that there's been a significant improvement in VMB and the other areas.

Risto Ketola: It does mean that there has been a significant improvement in VNB in the other areas. I would say that 90% of our VNB story is actually positive. But obviously, annuity is attractive product for us and a very sticky product. I would love annuity volumes to recover, but that has not been the market experience lately. New business margin is 0.5%, and I will talk more about that later again. Instead of jumping into the divisionals like I usually do, I will just stop on the EV briefly here. For the last five years, our return on embedded value is 16% per year. Comfortably above our cost of equity, cost of capital. I think we can tick a box on that.

Speaker #1: You know, I would say that 90% of our VMB story is actually positive. But obviously, annuities are an attractive product for us and a very sticky product.

Speaker #1: I would love annuity volumes to recover, but that has not been the market experience lately. New business margin is half a percent, and I'll talk more about that later again.

Risto Ketola: New business margin is 0.5%, and I will talk more about that later again. Instead of jumping into the divisionals like I usually do, I will just stop on the EV briefly here. For the last five years, our return on embedded value is 16% per year. Comfortably above our cost of equity, cost of capital. I think we can tick a box on that.

Speaker #1: Okay. So instead of jumping into the divisionals like I usually do, I'll just stop on the EV briefly here. So, for the last five years, our embedded value return on embedded value is 16% per year.

Speaker #1: Comfortably above our cost of equity, cost of capital. So, you know, I think we can tick a box on that. Also, I can't remember if Jeanette said it in her speech, but I know at one stage she was thinking about saying that our market cap has doubled. But the reality is that more of it's been EV growth—embedded value growth—than rerating in the market.

Risto Ketola: Also, I cannot remember if Jeanette said in her speech, but I know at one stage she was thinking about it, saying that our market cap has doubled. But the reality is that more of it has been EV growth, embedded value growth than rerating in the market. I think the market perception has improved, but majority of the return has actually been physical delivery in terms of return on capital, dividends, everything else. If you split that ROE into two components, the large block, which is the life insurance business, it sort of does steady 16% per year. People often say your VNB is modest. It could definitely be better. I mean, we are trying. My favorite question is, what are we doing to improve VNB? And I feel like answering, what are not we doing? People have always looked at the VNB is quite low-ish.

Speaker #1: You know, I sort of, I think the market perception has improved, but the majority of returns have actually been physical delivery in terms of return on capital, dividends, and everything else.

Speaker #1: And if you split that ROE into two components, the large block, which is the life insurance business, it sort of does a steady 16% per year.

Risto Ketola: If you split that ROE into two components, the large block, which is the life insurance business, it sort of does steady 16% per year. People often say your VNB is modest. It could definitely be better. I mean, we are trying. My favorite question is, what are we doing to improve VNB? And I feel like answering, what are not we doing? People have always looked at the VNB is quite low-ish.

Speaker #1: People often say your VMB is modest. You know, it could definitely be better. I mean, we're trying. My favorite question is, what are we doing to improve VMB?

Speaker #1: And I feel like answering, what aren't we doing? Okay. Okay. So, people have always looked at the VMB as quite lowish.

Speaker #1: Maybe true. But the experience variance in the enforce book is is very good. You know I think I think there's no doubt you can argue that we we do a good job at at getting optimal value out of the existing clients we have.

Risto Ketola: Maybe true, but the experience variance on the in-force book is very good. I think there is no doubt you can argue that we do a good job at getting optimal value out of the existing clients we have. I think we are a well-managed, mature life insurance company. Then you look at the blue block, where when I joined 10 years ago, even back then people said, "Good life business. But beyond that, what is happening? There is nothing happening there." I think in the last couple of years, you are really starting to get to this inflection point where something like Guardrisk is 15% of our total EV. It is growing rapidly. If you go look at the details, we use a discount rate of, I think, 15% for that business. If they can just deliver on budget, that is sort of 15% return on embedded value in there.

Speaker #1: I think we are a well-managed, mature life insurance company. Then you look at the blue block, where, when I joined 10 years ago, everybody—even back then—said, "Good life business, but beyond that, what's happening? There's nothing happening there."

Speaker #1: I think in the last couple of years, you're really starting to get through this inflection point where something like Guard Risk is 15% of our total EV.

Risto Ketola: I think in the last couple of years, you are really starting to get to this inflection point where something like Guardrisk is 15% of our total EV. It is growing rapidly. If you go look at the details, we use a discount rate of, I think, 15% for that business. If they can just deliver on budget, that is sort of 15% return on embedded value in there.

Speaker #1: It's growing rapidly. And if you go look at the details, we use a discount rate of, I think, 15% for that business. If they can just deliver on budget, that's sort of a 15% return on embedded value in there.

Speaker #1: And they generally tend to beat budget, Lawrence, thank you. So, I think we've gone in the last year or two from a situation where your non-covered operations were a bit of a drag on return on embedded value.

Risto Ketola: They generally tend to beat budget. Lawrence, thank you. I think we have gone in the last year or two from a situation where your non-covered operations were a bit of a drag on return on embedded value. They have now been a positive contributor. People often ask me, saying, what do I think is the underlying long-term return on embedded value? I think historically, I have generally said maybe 13%. You can probably now say more like 14%, conservatively. I do think that my internal gut feel for what is a sustainable ROEV has improved. Just gives you a bit more detail on some of the drivers. Guardrisk, good growth, 17% per year over that five years. Over that five years, the discount rate is probably averaged 16%. So delivery to budget and then a little bit more.

Speaker #1: So now being a positive contributor. So people often ask me say what what do I think is the is the underlying long-term return on embedded value.

Speaker #1: And I think, historically, I have generally said maybe 13%. You know, you can probably now say more like 14%, you know, conservatively. So I do think that my internal gut feel for what is a sustainable ROE has improved.

Risto Ketola: I think historically, I have generally said maybe 13%. You can probably now say more like 14%, conservatively. I do think that my internal gut feel for what is a sustainable ROEV has improved. Just gives you a bit more detail on some of the drivers. Guardrisk, good growth, 17% per year over that five years. Over that five years, the discount rate is probably averaged 16%. So delivery to budget and then a little bit more.

Speaker #1: This gives you a bit more detail on some of the drivers. So Guardrisk: good growth—17% per year over that five years.

Speaker #1: Over that five years, the discount rates probably averaged 16%. So, delivery to budget and then a little bit more. Insure, obviously, there's a bit of a cyclical recovery in the insurance market, but the business is in a much better state now.

Risto Ketola: Insure, obviously, there is a bit of a cyclical recovery in the insurance market, but the business is in a much better state now. Health. Big year for Health. I will talk about it later. They signed on Bonitas. They extended GEMS contract. Health4Me is doing well. I think Health operates in a very difficult segment, but they are a relative winner for sure in that space. Our Investments business. Obviously rising markets helps there, but I do think as well that some of the recent acquisitions have been good for us so far, and some of the startup ventures are showing promise as well. The other one that is worth highlighting upfront is the improvement in the solvency metrics since mid-year. There is no doubt that nobody expected. Nobody.

Speaker #1: Health had a big year for health. I'll talk about it later. They signed on Bonitas. They extended the GEMS contract. Health, for me, is doing well. You know, I think health operates in a very difficult segment, but they're ready to be a winner for sure in that space.

Speaker #1: And then our investments business – obviously, rising markets help there. But I do think as well that some of the recent acquisitions have been good for us so far.

Risto Ketola: Our Investments business. Obviously rising markets helps there, but I do think as well that some of the recent acquisitions have been good for us so far, and some of the startup ventures are showing promise as well. The other one that is worth highlighting upfront is the improvement in the solvency metrics since mid-year. There is no doubt that nobody expected. Nobody.

Speaker #1: And some of the startup ventures are showing promise as well. The other one that is worth highlighting up front is the improvement in the solvency metrics since midyear.

Speaker #1: There is no doubt that nobody expected—nobody—I want to find a person who expected the 3% decline in bond yield, you know, in a very brief period of time.

Risto Ketola: I want to find a person who expected the 3% decline in bond yields in a very brief period of time. The decline in bond yields did cause some, well, quite a rapid decline in our solvency cover ratio going into the interims. We spent a lot of time and effort in the second half of the year to address those factors, and it is pleasing that we are back in the situation where I think our solvency metrics are at a level where we have the optionality and the freedom to really deploy our capital in the most optimal way. Okay, coming back to the more standard programming, Core Life operations. I will briefly speak through each of these in a separate slide, but good to see all four South African life businesses doing over ZAR 1 billion.

Speaker #1: And the decline in bond yields did cause, well, quite a rapid decline in our solvency cover ratio going into the interims. So we spent a lot of time and effort in the second half of the year to address those factors.

Speaker #1: And it's pleasing that we are back in the situation where I think our solvency metrics are at the level where we have the optionality and the freedom to really, you know, deploy our capital in the most optimal way.

Speaker #1: Okay. Coming back to the more standard programming. So core life operations. I'll I'll I'll I'll briefly speak of through each of these in a separate slide.

Risto Ketola: Okay, coming back to the more standard programming, Core Life operations. I will briefly speak through each of these in a separate slide, but good to see all four South African life businesses doing over ZAR 1 billion.

Speaker #1: But good to see all four South African life businesses doing over a billion rand. You know, I haven't done the maths, but I think our—just the SA life business must be making close to five billion rand a year.

Risto Ketola: I haven't done the maths, but I think just the SA Life business must be making close to ZAR 5 billion a year. I'll start with Momentum Retail, down 26% for the year. If you look at the two lightly shaded bars, you'll see there's a ZAR 400 million swing in the investment variances. I think a more generic term would be asset liability matching outcome. The reality is that a big part of this business is our affluent market whole of life protection product, where you have, I don't know if Steven's here, but I don't know, a quarter to a third of our cash flows are beyond 30 years where there are no bonds. We can't hedge those cash flows. With the new inflation targets, we decided at interims to discount those cash flows at a lower rate, effectively raising our liabilities.

Speaker #1: Okay, I'll stop with Momentum Retail. Down 26% for the year. If you look at the two lightly shaded bars, you'll see there's a R400 million swing in the investment variances.

Speaker #1: You know I think a more more generic term would be sort of asset liability matching outcome. The reality is that a big part of this business is is our affluent market whole of life protection product.

Risto Ketola: The reality is that a big part of this business is our affluent market whole of life protection product, where you have, I don't know if Steven's here, but I don't know, a quarter to a third of our cash flows are beyond 30 years where there are no bonds. We can't hedge those cash flows. With the new inflation targets, we decided at interims to discount those cash flows at a lower rate, effectively raising our liabilities.

Speaker #1: I don't know if Stephen's here, but like, I don't know, a quarter to a third of our cash flows are beyond, like, 30 years, where they're on no bonds.

Speaker #1: We can't hedge those cash flows. And with the new inflation targets, we decided at interims to discount those cash flows at a lower rate.

Speaker #1: Effectively raising our liabilities. It is a reality that not all the cash flows can be matched. And lower yields do increase the present value of those outflows.

Risto Ketola: It is a reality that not all the cash flows can be matched, and lower yields do increase the PV of those outflows. Beyond that, unhedgable market variance results were flat year-on-year, so that's ZAR 1.3 billion, roughly. Within that, lots of interesting little themes. It's a big business. I'll spend a bit of time there. Firstly, mortality was exceptionally strong. It's probably the best mortality result we ever had. I can confirm that mortality now is better than pre-COVID-19. Where it stays, that's where the experts are debating. But as we speak, for the current year, I don't think mortality in the insurance population has been better in history in South Africa. We also continue to see positive alterations and persistency variance. So maybe linked to my earlier point about us being quite good at managing the in-force book.

Speaker #1: Beyond that, unhedgeable market variance results were flat year on year, so that's $1.3 billion, roughly. Within that, lots of interesting little themes, and it's a big business.

Speaker #1: I'll spend a bit of time there. Firstly, mortality was exceptionally strong. It's probably the best mortality result we ever had. I can confirm that mortality now is better than pre-COVID-19.

Speaker #1: Whether it stays, that's where the experts are debating. But as we speak, for the current year, I don't think mortality in the insurance population has been better in history in South Africa.

Risto Ketola: But as we speak, for the current year, I don't think mortality in the insurance population has been better in history in South Africa. We also continue to see positive alterations and persistency variance. So maybe linked to my earlier point about us being quite good at managing the in-force book.

Speaker #1: We also continue to see positive alterations and persistency variance, so maybe linked to my earlier point about us being quite good at managing the in-force book.

Speaker #1: We actually get clients buying up on average rather than buying down on average, so we make additional alteration profits most years, including this year.

Risto Ketola: We actually get clients buying up on average rather than buying down on average. So we make additional alteration profits most years, including this year. Now, those are all positive, so why is the result flat? There were also some negatives. The one that we did not budget for is we did have increases in our reinsurance rates during the year. They are temporary. I would argue that the very strong mortality results means that we would be expecting those increases to be temporary and to see a lower reinsurance expense next year. Steven, ask me to come to the negotiations with you. I'll talk about VNB a little bit later on, but because of the lower yields, the way our capital modeling works, we also allocated a lot more risk capital to this particular segment.

Speaker #1: Those are all positives. Once the results flatlined—well, there were also some negatives. The one that we did not budget for is that we had increases in our reinsurance rates during the year.

Speaker #1: They are temporary. I would argue that the very strong mortality results mean that we would be expecting those increases to be temporary, and to see a lower reinsurance expense next year.

Speaker #1: Okay, Stephen asked me to come to the negotiations with you. Okay. I'll talk about VMB a little bit later on, but because of the lower yields, the way our capital modeling works, we also allocate a lot more risk capital to this particular segment.

Risto Ketola: Steven, ask me to come to the negotiations with you. I'll talk about VNB a little bit later on, but because of the lower yields, the way our capital modeling works, we also allocated a lot more risk capital to this particular segment.

Speaker #1: On the earnings side, it's positive because you got more interest income on the additional capital. For VMB, it's negative because now you've got a higher cost of capital charge.

Risto Ketola: On the earnings side, it's positive because you've got more interest income on the additional capital. For VNB, it's negative because now you've got a higher cost of capital charge. Despite that, the VNB grew quite strongly. I don't think Jeanette Marais mentioned it, but a lot of the growth was from Investo, our savings business, where there's been significant redesign of that business over the last few years. Running a savings book at positive VNB is no mean feat. I think the guys have done exceptionally well. Momentum Investments, up 24%. There's three quite distinct businesses here. We've got the wealth platform, we've got asset management, and then we've got the annuities. I suppose the one common denominator, they're all asset-based businesses. Equity markets did well, bond markets did well. So all three of those areas would have been aided by the rising average asset values.

Speaker #1: Despite that, the VMB grew quite strongly. I don't think Jeanette mentioned it, but a lot of the growth was from the investor savings business, where there's been significant redesign of that business over the last few years.

Speaker #1: And running a savings book at positive VMBs is no mean feat. You know, I think the guys have done exceptionally well. Momentum Investments is up 24%.

Risto Ketola: Momentum Investments, up 24%. There's three quite distinct businesses here. We've got the wealth platform, we've got asset management, and then we've got the annuities. I suppose the one common denominator, they're all asset-based businesses. Equity markets did well, bond markets did well. So all three of those areas would have been aided by the rising average asset values.

Speaker #1: There are three quite distinct businesses here. We've got the wealth platform, we've got asset management, and then we've got the annuities. I suppose the one common denominator is that they're all asset-based businesses.

Speaker #1: So, rising equity markets did well. Bond markets did well. So, all three of those areas would have been aided by the rising average asset values.

Speaker #1: Beyond that, we continue to see good experience on their annuity book. I just went on about how good the mortality is in the insured population in the younger ages.

Risto Ketola: Beyond that, we continue to see good experience on the annuity book. I just went on about how good the mortality is in the insured population in the younger ages. When it comes to annuities, we do allow for continuous mortality improvements, and those improvements have not been as big in the advanced ages as we expected. We are in quite an unusual and a good position where we are making mortality profits in the younger ages because there is less deaths, and then we are making mortality profits in the annuity population because mortality is not improving as quickly as we expected. It is almost like the best of both possible actuarial outcomes. Also, the annuity portfolio is very actively managed by Garth Kesa's team in BSM. Very good credit results for the year. Credit spreads are difficult in South Africa. There is not much good quality assets around.

Speaker #1: When it comes to annuities, we do allow for continuous mortality improvements. And those improvements have not been as significant in the advanced ages as we expected.

Speaker #1: So we're in quite an unusual and good position, where we're making mortality profits in the younger ages because there are fewer deaths. And then we're making mortality profits in the annuity population because mortality is not improving as quickly as we expected.

Risto Ketola: We are in quite an unusual and a good position where we are making mortality profits in the younger ages because there is less deaths, and then we are making mortality profits in the annuity population because mortality is not improving as quickly as we expected. It is almost like the best of both possible actuarial outcomes. Also, the annuity portfolio is very actively managed by Garth Kesa's team in BSM. Very good credit results for the year. Credit spreads are difficult in South Africa. There is not much good quality assets around.

Speaker #1: So it's almost like the best of both possible actuarial outcomes. Also, the annuity portfolio is very actively managed by Khakiso's team in BSM.

Speaker #1: Very good credit results for the year. I mean, credit spreads are difficult in South Africa; there's not much good quality assets around. But it's pleasing that our origination activities were reasonably successful.

Risto Ketola: It is pleasing that our origination activities were reasonably successful, and I think we had zero defaults for the year on the book. Also the active management, the trading activities also contributed positively to the result. Jeanette mentioned Momentum Money. That closure is almost complete, so the impact on earnings is now negligible. Metropolitan Life, up 32%. You will notice here this business actually had a positive market variance year-on-year. I am digressing from the script a little bit because it illustrates the very different nature of the book in Metropolitan and Momentum Life. Metropolitan is mainly funeral, where the book runs off a lot quicker. So you have very little of those cash flows 30, 40 years away that is unhedgeable, like in the affluent book. Even though they both sell life insurance, their sort of interest rate risk is very different because of the client behavior being so different.

Speaker #1: And I think we had zero defaults for the year on the book. Also, the active management—the trading activity—also contributed positively to the result.

Speaker #1: Jeanette mentioned Momentum Money, that closure is almost complete. So the impact on earnings is non-negligible. Metropolitan Life is up 32%. You'll notice here this business actually had a positive market variance year on year.

Speaker #1: I'm digressing from the script a little bit because it illustrates the very different nature of the book in Metropolitan and in MOM Life. Metropolitan is mainly funeral.

Risto Ketola: I am digressing from the script a little bit because it illustrates the very different nature of the book in Metropolitan and Momentum Life. Metropolitan is mainly funeral, where the book runs off a lot quicker. So you have very little of those cash flows 30, 40 years away that is unhedgeable, like in the affluent book. Even though they both sell life insurance, their sort of interest rate risk is very different because of the client behavior being so different.

Speaker #1: Where the book runs off a lot quicker. So you have very little of those cash flows 30, 40 years away that are unhedgeable, like in the affluent book.

Speaker #1: So even though they both sell life insurance, their sort of interest rate risk is very different because the client behavior is so different.

Speaker #1: Okay, coming back to the script. New business. Besides, people often associate better quality of sales with VMB, and it's true, but it also has an immediate earnings impact in some scenarios, like here.

Risto Ketola: Okay, coming back to the script. New business. People often associate better quality of sales with VNB, and it is true, but it also has an immediate earnings impact in some scenarios like here. A good example is when we had 3,000 agents 3 years ago. We had 300 branch managers, 30 regional managers, 6 provincial managers. Now that we have shrunk the sales force to more like 2,000, there has also been quite a big reduction in that management layer, and those savings are tens of millions that drop straight to bottom line. Also, because of the more focused sales force, we are also incurring less commission losses. These are where we pay a commission to an agent who then resigns, and we cannot recover the commissions if the book goes bad. With the lower turnover and a higher proportion of experienced agents, those losses have come down.

Speaker #1: A good example is, when we had 3,000 agents three years ago, we had 300 branch managers, 30 regional managers, and six provincial managers. Now that we have shrunk the sales force to more like 2,000, there's also been quite a big reduction in the management layer.

Speaker #1: And those savings are tens of millions that drop straight to the bottom line. Also, because of the more focused sales force, we are also incurring less commission losses.

Risto Ketola: Also, because of the more focused sales force, we are also incurring less commission losses. These are where we pay a commission to an agent who then resigns, and we cannot recover the commissions if the book goes bad. With the lower turnover and a higher proportion of experienced agents, those losses have come down.

Speaker #1: These are cases where we pay a commission to an agent who then resigns, and we can't recover the commissions if the book goes bad. You know, with the lower turnover and a higher proportion of experienced agents, those losses have come down.

Speaker #1: So the activities on the channel not only helped VMB, they also had an immediate positive impact on earnings. Persistency remains favorable, and mortality remains favorable.

Risto Ketola: The activities on the channel not only helped VNB, they also had an immediate positive impact on earnings. Persistence remains favorable and mortality remains favorable, so similar to what we saw in the more affluent part of the book. Jeanette mentioned performance optimization has been big here. Proportionately, I think they have done the most savings out of any business unit. Probably like a 10% reduction in their cost base out of optimization, self-servicing, the sales force optimization. The last item, it is a bit cryptic, but I thought I would mention it because it is over ZAR 100 million positive to earnings. It is one of those positive one-offs. We migrated the savings business from the old mainframe system onto a more modern platform in the last 18 months. While we were preparing for that, you always pick up issues where, are these policy values 100% right? Is the reserve correct?

Speaker #1: So, similar to what we saw in the more affluent part of the book, Jeanette mentioned performance optimization has been big here. Proportionately, I think they've achieved the most savings out of any business unit.

Speaker #1: Probably like a 10% reduction in their cost base, out of automatization, self-servicing, and the sales force optimization. The last item is a bit cryptic, but I thought I'd mention it because it's over $100 million positive to earnings.

Risto Ketola: The last item, it is a bit cryptic, but I thought I would mention it because it is over ZAR 100 million positive to earnings. It is one of those positive one-offs. We migrated the savings business from the old mainframe system onto a more modern platform in the last 18 months. While we were preparing for that, you always pick up issues where, are these policy values 100% right? Is the reserve correct?

Speaker #1: So it's one of those positive one-offs. We migrated the savings business from the old mainframe system onto a more modern platform in the last 18 months.

Speaker #1: While we were preparing for that, you always pick up issues like, are these policy values 100% right? Is the reserve correct? In typical actuarial fashion, when you pick up a problem, you reserve, you put a big reserve.

Risto Ketola: Typical actuarial fashion, when you pick up a problem, you put a big reserve, what we call working process or data reserves. As we've been working through those legacy matters, generally, we find that the reserves are prudent. There were two quite big projects we ran during the year, and on completion, the reserves held were probably. Well, I knew they were. They were more than ZAR 100 million higher than we actually needed to address the issue. There are still a couple of legacy things across the group we're looking at. I am comfortable that the provisions we're holding are prudent, but I think ZAR 100 million release in one business unit is a bit outside the usual expectation. Momentum Corporate, it is down year-on-year, but ZAR 1.4 billion is a very strong result for this business. You could say results went from exceptional to just good. Where is Duma?

Speaker #1: What we call working process or data reserves—as we’ve been working through those legacy matters, generally, we find that the reserves are prudent. There were two quite big projects we ran during the year.

Speaker #1: And on completion, the reserves held were—well, I knew they were. They were more than $100 million higher than we actually needed to address the issue.

Risto Ketola: There are still a couple of legacy things across the group we're looking at. I am comfortable that the provisions we're holding are prudent, but I think ZAR 100 million release in one business unit is a bit outside the usual expectation. Momentum Corporate, it is down year-on-year, but ZAR 1.4 billion is a very strong result for this business. You could say results went from exceptional to just good. Where is Duma?

Speaker #1: I mean, there are still a couple of legacy things across the Group we're looking at. You know, I'm comfortable that the provisions we're holding are prudent.

Speaker #1: But I think a $100 million release in one business unit is, is, is a bit outside the usual expectation. Momentum Corporate, it is down year on year.

Speaker #1: But $1.4 billion is a very strong result for this business. So, you could say results went from exceptional to just good, whereas Duma—okay.

Risto Ketola: Okay, very good. From exceptional to very good. A lot of the profit here, majority of profit comes from underwriting. Death cover, disability cover, temporary disability for your employees. The cash profits. It is a bit like short-term insurance, premiums in, claims out. At that sort of cash flow level, we actually had a better year this year than last year. You could say that we're still riding quite a good cycle in corporate. However, last year, we had more reserve-related releases. As an example, we hold an IBNR reserve, sort of incurred but not yet reported claims. Last year, there was a significant release compared to this year. The non-cash items explain quite a bit of this year-on-year decline. I mentioned our balance sheet investment solutions here. We offer a variety of products where we utilize our balance sheet.

Speaker #1: Very good. From exceptional to very good. Now, a lot of the profit here—the majority of the profit—comes from underwriting. You know, death cover, disability cover, temporary disability, if for your employees.

Speaker #1: The cash profits, we—it's a bit like short-term insurance: premiums in, claims out. At that sort of cash flow level, we actually had a better year this year than last year.

Speaker #1: So you could say that we're still riding quite a good cycle in corporate. However, last year we had more reserve-related releases. So, as an example, we hold an IBNR reserve.

Risto Ketola: However, last year, we had more reserve-related releases. As an example, we hold an IBNR reserve, sort of incurred but not yet reported claims. Last year, there was a significant release compared to this year. The non-cash items explain quite a bit of this year-on-year decline. I mentioned our balance sheet investment solutions here. We offer a variety of products where we utilize our balance sheet.

Speaker #1: Sort of incurred but not yet reported claims. Last year, there was a significant release compared to this year. So, the non-cash items explain quite a bit of this.

Speaker #1: This year-on-year decline—I mentioned our balance sheet investment solutions here. We offer a variety of products where we utilize our balance sheet.

Speaker #1: A good example is our guaranteed index solutions, where we guarantee clients the index return exactly. We obviously hold hedging assets, and any surplus or deficit to matching the index.

Risto Ketola: A good example is our guaranteed index solutions, where we guarantee clients the index return exactly. We obviously hold hedging assets and any surplus or deficit to matching the index. That is our source of profit. It's a nice concept for a client. We guarantee you 100% tracking at no cost. But we do tend to make a margin on the hedging assets, and that book has grown quite nicely over the last few years. The one negative, again, big enough worth mentioning, it's over ZAR 100 million negative. It wasn't all positive. A very popular choice for employers is a continuation option. They will pay us a small, too small? I do not know. They pay us a small monthly fee, to allow their retirement fund members, when they leave the scheme, to convert the group life cover into individual cover with no underwriting.

Speaker #1: That is our source of profit. You know, it's a nice concept for a client: we guarantee you 100% tracking at no cost. But we do tend to make a margin on the hedging assets.

Speaker #1: And that book has grown quite nicely over the last few years. The one negative, again big enough to be worth mentioning—it's over $100 million negative.

Risto Ketola: The one negative, again, big enough worth mentioning, it's over ZAR 100 million negative. It wasn't all positive. A very popular choice for employers is a continuation option. They will pay us a small, too small? I do not know. They pay us a small monthly fee, to allow their retirement fund members, when they leave the scheme, to convert the group life cover into individual cover with no underwriting.

Speaker #1: It wasn't all positives. A very popular choice for employers is a continuation option. So they will pay us a small, too small.

Speaker #1: I don't know. They pay us a small monthly fee to allow their retirement fund members, when they leave the scheme, to convert the group life cover into individual cover with no underwriting.

Speaker #1: Now, obviously, when you offer an option like that, you think to yourself there might be a little bit of selection against you here—that people who are very healthy, when they leave the employer, might be able to get cheaper cover somewhere else.

Risto Ketola: Now, obviously, when you offer an option like that, you think to yourself, there might be a little bit of selection against you here, that people who are very healthy when they leave the employer, they might be able to get cheaper cover somewhere else. But the guys who are less healthy, that's probably the only option they can get for a reasonable premium rate. I am not going to go into details, but historically, we assumed mortality in this book would be like four times higher than normal. It's worse than that. So now we're going to five times normal mortality. That's a big hit to P&L for the current year. So obviously, a very valuable option. That's why I was joking with Duma. You must take me with to do your meetings as well. Somebody has to be looking after the shareholder here. Yeah.

Speaker #1: But the guys who are less healthy, that's probably the only option they can get for a reasonable premium rate. I'm not going to go into details, but historically, we assumed mortality in this book would be like four times higher than normal.

Risto Ketola: I am not going to go into details, but historically, we assumed mortality in this book would be like four times higher than normal. It's worse than that. So now we're going to five times normal mortality. That's a big hit to P&L for the current year. So obviously, a very valuable option. That's why I was joking with Duma. You must take me with to do your meetings as well. Somebody has to be looking after the shareholder here. Yeah.

Speaker #1: It's worse than that. So now we're going to five times normal mortality. That's a big hit to the P&L for the current year.

Speaker #1: So, obviously, a very valuable option. That's why I was joking with Duma—you must take me with you to your meetings as well. Somebody has to be looking after the shareholder here.

Speaker #1: Yeah. Okay. Momentum Africa is definitely trending in the right direction. I think the one problem in Africa is it is still quite distinct businesses. So, so often when you tell a story, it's a bit different in different countries.

Risto Ketola: Okay, Momentum Africa, definitely trending in the right direction. I think the one problem in Africa is it is three quite distinct businesses. Often when you tell a story, it is a bit different in different countries. But the two positives for the year were Botswana and Lesotho. Botswana, obviously a very tough economy at the moment. But we have a strong market presence in annuities, also corporate business. I think we have done well in the context of what is happening there. Lesotho, we are the dominant insurer, and we signed up some very profitable and large corporate schemes in the last year or 2. Namibia, on the other hand, I think operationally the business is doing quite well, but the global minimum tax came into effect this year. Most of you will know that OECD now has a 15% global minimum tax.

Speaker #1: But the two positives for the year were Botswana and Lesotho. Botswana, obviously, is a very tough economy at the moment, but we have a strong market presence in annuities.

Speaker #1: Also, corporate business. So I think we've done well in the context of what's happening there. In Lesotho, we are the dominant insurer, and we signed up some very profitable and large corporate schemes in the last year or two.

Risto Ketola: I think we have done well in the context of what is happening there. Lesotho, we are the dominant insurer, and we signed up some very profitable and large corporate schemes in the last year or 2. Namibia, on the other hand, I think operationally the business is doing quite well, but the global minimum tax came into effect this year. Most of you will know that OECD now has a 15% global minimum tax.

Speaker #1: Now, maybe on the other hand, I think operationally the business is doing quite well. But the global minimum tax came into effect this year.

Speaker #1: And most of you will know that the OECD now has a 15% global minimum tax. Humana is nodding her head because, obviously, it's an issue in Guernsey as well.

Risto Ketola: Gimna is nodding her head because obviously it is an issue in Guernsey as well, but Namibia actually taxes life insurance profits very favorably. Now having to tax them at 15% was almost a ZAR 60 million hit to the Namibia earnings year on year. Now, obviously it sets a new base, but it does mean that Namibia earnings for the year were down, largely because of that. Onerous contracts. I am not sure how many more times we will show this, but it has been an area of significant focus for us. So at Momentum Investments, we redesigned the back-to-back product to make sure that both the whole life and annuity components fund themselves. Metropolitan Life, the focus on quality has reduced onerous contract percentage. I think it is really Momentum Africa that remains one further potential area of improvement.

Speaker #1: But Namibia actually taxes life insurance profits very favorably. So now, having to tax them at 15%, was almost a R60 million hit to the Namibia earnings.

Speaker #1: Year on year. Now, obviously, it sets a new base. But it does mean that the Namibia earnings for the year were down, largely because of that.

Speaker #1: Honoris contracts. I'm not sure how many more times we will show this. But it's been an area of of significant focus for us. So momentum investments we redesigned the back to back product to make sure that both the whole life and annuity components you know fund themselves.

Risto Ketola: Onerous contracts. I am not sure how many more times we will show this, but it has been an area of significant focus for us. So at Momentum Investments, we redesigned the back-to-back product to make sure that both the whole life and annuity components fund themselves. Metropolitan Life, the focus on quality has reduced onerous contract percentage. I think it is really Momentum Africa that remains one further potential area of improvement.

Speaker #1: Metropolitan Life, to focus on quality, has reduced Honoris Honoris contract percentage. I think it's really Momentum Africa that remains one further potential area of improvement.

Speaker #1: So I think that might add another $100 million to earnings once we get to address that. New business volumes—I always like showing this to scale, because people mustn’t forget that two thirds of our business comes from the Wealth segment, Momentum Investments.

Risto Ketola: I think that might add another ZAR 100 million to earnings, once we get to address that. New business volumes. I always like showing this to scale because people must not forget that two-thirds of our business comes from the wealth segment, Momentum Investments. By its nature, it is quite a low-margin area. It is a very intermediated market, very knowledgeable policyholders, very knowledgeable intermediaries. A lot of it is investment business where the fees are clear and obvious. So by nature, I personally think our margin there is actually quite good. I think it is more the mix of business than anything else. Also in Metropolitan, for a 33% reduction in average sales force to have a 14% reduction in sales, that is a good outcome. I know Peter always feels terrible about sales going backwards, but, I think from a value creation perspective, it has been a very clear positive outcome.

Speaker #1: Now, by its nature, it's quite a low-margin area. You know, it's a very intermediate market—very knowledgeable policyholders, very knowledgeable intermediaries. A lot of it is investment business, where the fees are clear and obvious.

Risto Ketola: A lot of it is investment business where the fees are clear and obvious. So by nature, I personally think our margin there is actually quite good. I think it is more the mix of business than anything else. Also in Metropolitan, for a 33% reduction in average sales force to have a 14% reduction in sales, that is a good outcome. I know Peter always feels terrible about sales going backwards, but, I think from a value creation perspective, it has been a very clear positive outcome.

Speaker #1: Yeah, so by nature, I personally think our margin there is actually quite good. You know, I think it's more the mix of business than anything else.

Speaker #1: Also, in Metropolitan, for a 33% reduction in average sales force to have a 14% reduction in sales—that's a good outcome. I know Peter always feels terrible about sales going backwards.

Speaker #1: But I think from a from a from a value creation perspective it's it's been a very clear clear positive outcome. I'm now also starting to rush a bit.

Risto Ketola: I am now also starting to rush a bit. It is like when you are having fun, time just flies. Value of new business. I sort of mentioned in the beginning that I actually think the ZAR 30 million increase is a good outcome. If you look at the Momentum Investments, that is down ZAR 150 million. Wealth platform profit VNB is actually up. The decline in annuities is nearly ZAR 200 million. But despite the annuity VNB declining by ZAR 200 million, we are up for the year. So we had ZAR 200 million, ZAR 250 million additional VNB for everywhere else. Momentum Retail did ZAR 50 million extra. Wealth platform did extra. Metropolitan Life, up ZAR 80 million. Momentum Corporate, up. Some very good funded workflows towards the end of the year. So I think we are trending in the right direction. We always knew annuities.

Speaker #1: It's like when you're having fun—time just flies. I don't know. Yeah. Okay. Value of new business: I sort of mentioned in the beginning that I actually think the $30 million increase is a good outcome.

Speaker #1: Now, if you look at the momentum investments, that's down $150 million. Wealth platform profit VMB is actually up. The decline in annuities is nearly $200 million.

Speaker #1: So, despite annuity VMB declining by $200 million, we're up for the year. So we had $200 million to $250 million additional VMB from everywhere else.

Risto Ketola: So we had ZAR 200 million, ZAR 250 million additional VNB for everywhere else. Momentum Retail did ZAR 50 million extra. Wealth platform did extra. Metropolitan Life, up ZAR 80 million. Momentum Corporate, up. Some very good funded workflows towards the end of the year. So I think we are trending in the right direction. We always knew annuities.

Speaker #1: MOM Retail did $50 million extra. Wealth Platform did extra. MetLife up 80. MOM Corporate up—some very good funds that work flows towards the end of the year.

Speaker #1: So I think we're trending in the right direction. I mean, we always knew annuities—we were very exposed to it because of our market share in annuities; we're the leader in the market.

Risto Ketola: We were very exposed to it because of our market share in annuities. We are the leader in the market. ZAR 491 is not where we want to stop. I am just trying to make the point that there are some green shoots behind this very negative picture created by the annuity trends. On life operations, I feel like I will not be able to do justice to this in my remaining 10 minutes. Jeanette said, nobody made a loss, which is a first time in 10 years I have been here. Guardrisk, it has become such a big business. I will have to stop here a little bit. Underwriting results are a big part of the growth in the last, let us say, six years or so. Jeanette sort of mentioned having a supportive parent with risk appetite and capital.

Speaker #1: And 491 is not where we want to stop. All I'm trying to do is make the point that there are some green shoots behind this very negative picture created by the annuity trends.

Speaker #1: On life operations, I feel like I won't be able to do justice to this in my remaining 10 minutes, but like Jeanette said, nobody made a loss—which is a first time in the 10 years I've been here.

Risto Ketola: Jeanette said, nobody made a loss, which is a first time in 10 years I have been here. Guardrisk, it has become such a big business. I will have to stop here a little bit. Underwriting results are a big part of the growth in the last, let us say, six years or so. Jeanette sort of mentioned having a supportive parent with risk appetite and capital.

Speaker #1: Guard risk—it's become such a big business. I'll have to stop here a little bit. Underwriting results are a big part of the growth in the last, let's say, six years or so.

Speaker #1: Jeanette sort of mentioned having a supportive parent with risk appetite and capital. I think that's where there's been alignment between Momentum Group and Guardrisk in terms of deployment of capital and sources of growth.

Risto Ketola: I think that is where there has been alignment between Momentum Group and Guardrisk in terms of deployment of capital and sources of growth. Whenever you are doing underwriting, it can go against you. I think the underwriting margin here remains 10% plus. The guys have been very good at selecting business lines that they are active in. In this year, there is a good example where there is one particular asset book that has been very profitable the last few years. I have been quite nervous that eventually that is not going to last forever. It did not last forever this year. That profit is halved. At the same time, we had good results coming from corporate, motor insurance, gap cover, life underwriting. I think like a good diversified specialist insurer, you sort of always are like one book having an issue, and then two books actually do very well.

Speaker #1: Now, whenever you're doing underwriting, it can go against you. I think the underwriting margin here remains at 10% plus. So, the guys have been very good at selecting the business lines that they're active in.

Speaker #1: This year, there's a good example where there's one particular asset book that has been very profitable the last few years. So I've been quite nervous that eventually that's not going to last forever.

Risto Ketola: In this year, there is a good example where there is one particular asset book that has been very profitable the last few years. I have been quite nervous that eventually that is not going to last forever. It did not last forever this year. That profit is halved. At the same time, we had good results coming from corporate, motor insurance, gap cover, life underwriting. I think like a good diversified specialist insurer, you sort of always are like one book having an issue, and then two books actually do very well.

Speaker #1: And it did not last forever this year. That profit's halved. At the same time, we had good results coming from Corporate, Momentum Motor, Insurance GAP cover, and Life underwriting.

Speaker #1: So I think, like a good, diversified specialist insurer, you sort of always have one book having an issue and then two books actually doing very well.

Speaker #1: So, diversification has come through strongly. Fee income is up 11%, despite that one bank that got its own license. Their fees were still in last year.

Risto Ketola: Diversification has come through strongly. Fee income is up 11%, despite that one bank that got its own license. Their fees were still in last year, so we had good fee income growth beyond that client. Also the early signs of moving Namibia to Guardrisk is very encouraging. Momentum Insure, the claims ratio of 47%, it is obviously excellent, but we must also not forget that we did have some weather events during the year. I do not know, ZAR 60 million maybe for the year. I do not think the claims ratio can get much better than this, Brent. It is exceptionally strong. The only negative, it is Brent's birthday, so I feel bad. The only negative I can think about is the top-line growth has not been there the last year or two. The business actually kept their own expenses flat year on year, zero growth.

Speaker #1: So we had good fee income growth beyond that client. Also, the early signs of moving Namibia to guard risk are very encouraging.

Speaker #1: Momentum Insurer: The claims ratio is 47%. It's obviously excellent. But we must also not forget that we did have some weather events during the year.

Risto Ketola: I do not know, ZAR 60 million maybe for the year. I do not think the claims ratio can get much better than this, Brent. It is exceptionally strong. The only negative, it is Brent's birthday, so I feel bad. The only negative I can think about is the top-line growth has not been there the last year or two. The business actually kept their own expenses flat year on year, zero growth.

Speaker #1: You know, I don't know—$60 million maybe, for the year. So I don't think the claims ratio can get much better than this, Brent. It is exceptionally strong.

Speaker #1: The only negative—it's Brent's birthday, so I feel bad—but the only negative I can think about is the top line growth has not been there the last year or two.

Speaker #1: The business actually kept their own expenses flat year-on-year—zero growth. Despite that, the expense ratio went up a little bit because of shrinkage in the in-force book.

Risto Ketola: Despite that, the expense ratio went up a little bit because of shrinkage in the in-force book. Majority, it is a complex business, but a big part of the focus is now on getting more quotes out there, getting more leads. Our conversion rate is actually quite good. When clients see what we have to offer, we actually convert them quite well. It is more about just getting more people to see that. Health. This business had a lot going on. Bonitas got all the focus. Very proud of getting that contract. For the year, it actually created a loss for us in the accounts. We incurred heavy take-on costs. We hired more than 500 people, had to buy 500 laptops, we had to furnish offices in Sandton. We incurred substantial take-on costs against one month of revenue.

Speaker #1: Majority, I mean, it's a complex business. But a big part of the focus is now on getting more quotes out there, getting more leads.

Speaker #1: Our conversion rates are actually quite good. You know, when clients see what we have to offer, we actually convert them quite well. It's more about just getting more people to see that.

Speaker #1: Health. This business had a lot going on. Bonitas got all the focus. We're very proud of getting that contract, but for the year, it actually created a loss for us in the accounts.

Risto Ketola: Bonitas got all the focus. Very proud of getting that contract. For the year, it actually created a loss for us in the accounts. We incurred heavy take-on costs. We hired more than 500 people, had to buy 500 laptops, we had to furnish offices in Sandton. We incurred substantial take-on costs against one month of revenue.

Speaker #1: So we incurred heavy take-on costs. We hired more than 500 people, had to buy 500 laptops, and had to furnish offices in Sandton.

Speaker #1: Yeah. So we incurred substantial take-on costs against one month of revenue, so there is quite a big negative from Bonitas in that 367.

Risto Ketola: There is quite a big negative from Bonitas in that C67. Next year, we expect the scheme to make some profits. I think there will be quite a big delta in the health earnings coming from Bonitas. Beyond Bonitas, there is also good news in that the GEMS contract has now been renewed, that it is in good shape. Health4Me, which is our low-income product, was growing still rapidly at decent underwriting margins. Even Momentum Health, it has grown a little bit, and a little bit is a win in the current environment in the open scheme market. India looks small here, but psychologically very important that we now have profits in India for the first time. This is net of about ZAR 40 million of overhead costs we incur in South Africa to support this initiative.

Speaker #1: Obviously, next year we expect the scheme to make some profits. So I think there'll be quite a big delta in the health earnings coming from Bonitas.

Speaker #1: But beyond Bonitas, there's also good news in that the James contract has now been renewed and that it's in good shape. Health4Me, which is our low-income product, is still growing rapidly at decent underwriting margins.

Speaker #1: And even Momentum Health—it's grown a little bit. And a little, little, little bit is a win in the current environment in the open scheme market.

Risto Ketola: Even Momentum Health, it has grown a little bit, and a little bit is a win in the current environment in the open scheme market. India looks small here, but psychologically very important that we now have profits in India for the first time. This is net of about ZAR 40 million of overhead costs we incur in South Africa to support this initiative.

Speaker #1: India looks small here, but psychologically it's very important that we now had profits in India for the first time. And this is net of about $40 million of overhead costs we incur in South Africa to support this initiative.

Speaker #1: I wasn't sure if I would joke about this, but I keep telling Johan, thanks for the business class flights to Mumbai, because I sit on the board there.

Risto Ketola: I was not sure if I would joke about this, but I keep telling Johan thanks for the business class flights to Mumbai because I sit on the board there, but okay. I am a tiny bit of the ZAR 40 million, trust me. Okay. These are under IFRS 17 as well, quite important. These numbers are comparable to the way we look at the business. Maybe, again, being quite brief for such an important business, top-line growth continues to be fantastic. In local currency, nearly 40% last year. I think our budget for this year is a similar growth rate, and I think it is very doable. Combined ratio is coming down nicely because of the scale benefits. Our expense ratio is coming down fast because of that top-line growth. Be a nice problem to have, eh? Right. Okay.

Speaker #1: But okay, I'm a tiny bit of the 40 million, trust me. Yeah, okay. But these are under FS17 as well, which is quite important. So these numbers are comparable to the way we look at the business.

Speaker #1: Maybe, again, being quite brief for such an important business. Top line growth continues to be fantastic. In local currency, it was nearly 40% last year.

Risto Ketola: In local currency, nearly 40% last year. I think our budget for this year is a similar growth rate, and I think it is very doable. Combined ratio is coming down nicely because of the scale benefits. Our expense ratio is coming down fast because of that top-line growth. Be a nice problem to have, eh? Right. Okay.

Speaker #1: I think our budget for this year has a similar growth rate, and I think it's very doable. Combined ratios are coming down nicely because of the scale benefits.

Speaker #1: Our expense ratios are coming down fast because of the top-line growth. We had a nice problem to have, Brent. Yeah, okay. But on the claims, on the loss ratio side...

Risto Ketola: On the loss ratio side, claims ratio side, there has been some pressure, and it is a bit of a global thing with medical inflation, utilization rates, and India is facing similar problems. The long-term success of this business, well, I think it is almost guaranteed to be successful, but the degree of success, a lot of it is going to be the claims ratio management. I think the top-line growth and expense management, I am almost taking as a given. Also, for the technical guys who wonder why we make a profit with 103% combined ratio, it is because it is annually written premiums. We get the money up front, so it is actually a very big float. It is quite different to South Africa, where premiums are paid monthly. Shareholders. Two items worth noting here for the improvement. One thing is that our shareholder fees were down significantly.

Speaker #1: Claims ratio side, there has been some pressure. And it's a bit of a global thing, with medical inflation, utilization rates, and India's facing similar problems.

Speaker #1: So, the long-term success of this business—well, I think it's almost guaranteed to be successful. But the degree of success, a lot of it's going to be the claims ratio management.

Speaker #1: I think the top-line growth and expense management I'm almost taking on as a given. Also, for the technical guys who wonder why we make a profit with a 103% combined ratio...

Risto Ketola: Also, for the technical guys who wonder why we make a profit with 103% combined ratio, it is because it is annually written premiums. We get the money up front, so it is actually a very big float. It is quite different to South Africa, where premiums are paid monthly. Shareholders. Two items worth noting here for the improvement. One thing is that our shareholder fees were down significantly.

Speaker #1: It's because it's annually written premiums, so we get the money upfront. So it's actually a very big float. It's quite different to South Africa, where premiums are paid monthly.

Speaker #1: Shareholders, two items are worth noting here for improvement. One thing is that our shareholder fees were down significantly, with about a $100 million reduction in consulting fees.

Risto Ketola: About ZAR 100 million reduction in consulting fees. We used consultants extensively in the early part of our performance optimization project. Secondly, the VC funds. We had a loss this year, but substantially lower than last year. Those two items explain about ZAR 250 million of the ZAR 274. Capital management. As I said, very happy with the improvement. It was caused by the yield curve declining substantially. One thing, I am not so nervous about another decline. I was telling Jan that I do not see our bond yields going below Japan, so I think we are okay for now. This is an important slide to stop on. Had we not done anything, the required minimum capital would have increased by ZAR 4 billion, mainly because of the lower yields. You cannot run the business on one times minimum. You take two times minimum, that is ZAR 8 billion.

Speaker #1: So, we use consultants extensively in the early part of our performance optimization project. And then, secondly, the VC funds. We had a loss this year, but it was substantially lower than last year.

Speaker #1: And those two items explain about $250 million of the $274 million. Capital management—as I said, very happy with the improvement. It was caused by the yield curve declining substantially.

Speaker #1: One thing—I'm not so nervous about another decline. I was telling Jan that I don't see our bond yields going below Japan, so I think we're okay for now.

Risto Ketola: One thing, I am not so nervous about another decline. I was telling Jan that I do not see our bond yields going below Japan, so I think we are okay for now. This is an important slide to stop on. Had we not done anything, the required minimum capital would have increased by ZAR 4 billion, mainly because of the lower yields. You cannot run the business on one times minimum. You take two times minimum, that is ZAR 8 billion.

Speaker #1: But this is important slide to stop on. Had we not done anything the required minimum billion. Mainly because of the low yields. Now you can't run the business on one time's minimum.

Speaker #1: You take two times minimum—that's R8 billion. For a company with a R50 billion market cap to tie up an extra R8 billion in risk capital, that's a big, big event.

Risto Ketola: For a company with a ZAR 50 billion market cap to tie up extra ZAR 8 billion in risk capital, that's a big event. Clearly, we had to take some action here. Through our capital optimization project, we have increased available capital through Tier 2 issuance and lower dividends from the Life Co. We also redid the calculations of the required capital, which then resulted in only a ZAR 1 billion increase to the required capital. Things we did. We remodeled our reinsurance utilization. We apply various reinsurance structures. For example, Mass Lapse reinsurance. We looked at the way we model those. We look at the tax implication of that. We also introduced deferred tax assets under certain stress scenarios where we remain a going concern from our accounting basis. We also relooked at modeling of the way our subsidiaries are dealt with.

Speaker #1: Okay, so clearly we had to take some action here. And through our capital optimization project, we have increased the available capital through Tier 2 issuance and lower dividends from the Life Co.

Speaker #1: But we also redid the calculations of the required capital, which then resulted in only a R1 billion increase to the required capital. Things we did—we remodeled our reinsurance, utilized optimal reinsurance.

Risto Ketola: We remodeled our reinsurance utilization. We apply various reinsurance structures. For example, Mass Lapse reinsurance. We looked at the way we model those. We look at the tax implication of that. We also introduced deferred tax assets under certain stress scenarios where we remain a going concern from our accounting basis. We also relooked at modeling of the way our subsidiaries are dealt with.

Speaker #1: We apply various reinsurance structures. For example, mass lapse reinsurance. We looked at the way we model those. We look at the tax implications of that.

Speaker #1: We also introduced

Speaker #4: Deferred tax assets under certain stress scenarios, where we remain a going concern from an accounting basis. Also, we looked at the modeling of the way our subsidiaries are dealt with.

Speaker #4: Do we treat them as private equity, or do we actually look at the underlying nature of the business? So, a lot of work was done to minimize the impact of the lower yields.

Risto Ketola: Do we treat them as private equity, or do we actually look at the underlying nature of the business? A lot of work was done to minimize the impact of the lower yields. Because of that, our internal assessment of high-quality liquid assets we want to hold. I always joke this is the money I can bring here tomorrow, but Cathista tells me it's not quite. It might be difficult to liquidate some of those corporate bonds for tomorrow. Anyway. The high-quality liquid assets, we would have increased it to ZAR 18.6 billion, a ZAR 7 billion increase. Now the increase is to ZAR 16 billion under the new capital modeling. Obviously, when you change the modeling, you also look at the ratios sometimes. That's why it's not exactly one for one.

Speaker #4: Because of that, our internal assessment of high-quality liquid assets we want to hold—I always joke this is the money I can bring in tomorrow, but Risto tells me it's not quite. It might be difficult to liquidate some of those corporate bonds for tomorrow.

Speaker #4: But anyway, so the high-quality liquid assets—we would have increased it to $18.6 billion, a $7 billion increase. But now the increase is to $16 billion under the new capital modeling.

Risto Ketola: The high-quality liquid assets, we would have increased it to ZAR 18.6 billion, a ZAR 7 billion increase. Now the increase is to ZAR 16 billion under the new capital modeling. Obviously, when you change the modeling, you also look at the ratios sometimes. That's why it's not exactly one for one.

Speaker #4: Obviously, when you change the modeling, you also look at the ratios sometimes, so that's why it's not exactly one-for-one. But the pleasing outcome there is that that's the difference between having $2.5 billion of surplus capital, which creates the flexibility, versus not having it.

Risto Ketola: The pleasing outcome there is that that's the difference between having ZAR 2.5 billion of surplus capital, which creates that flexibility, versus not having it. I think the project was definitely worthwhile. Cash flow slide. This is a very popular one always. You can see that the dividend inflows into group ZAR 4 billion. About ZAR 1 billion lower than last year. The main difference is the life business. To strengthen the capital ratio, we did pay quite a small dividend from the Life Co. That should go back next year. I think that ZAR 4 billion, normal scenario, about ZAR 5 billion. Where did we spend the money? India. We're supporting the capital. Well, they need growth capital. Some money went there. Consult is important. One of our stated strategic objectives is to invest aggressively in advice and distribution.

Speaker #4: So, I think the project was...

Speaker #5: definitely worthwhile.

Speaker #4: Cash flow slide—this is always a very popular one. You can see that the dividend inflows into the group were $4 billion, about a billion rand lower than last year.

Speaker #4: The main difference is the life business. So, to strengthen the capital ratio, we did pay quite a small dividend from the life co. That should go back next year.

Risto Ketola: The main difference is the life business. To strengthen the capital ratio, we did pay quite a small dividend from the Life Co. That should go back next year. I think that ZAR 4 billion, normal scenario, about ZAR 5 billion. Where did we spend the money? India. We're supporting the capital. Well, they need growth capital. Some money went there. Consult is important. One of our stated strategic objectives is to invest aggressively in advice and distribution.

Speaker #4: So I think that's R4 billion; normal scenario, about R5 billion. Where did we spend the money? India. We’re supporting the capital bond issuance—they need growth capital.

Speaker #4: Some money went there. Consult is important. One of our stated strategic objectives is to invest aggressively in advice and distribution, so we have provided capital to Momentum Consult to increase their footprint.

Risto Ketola: We have provided capital to Momentum Consult to increase their footprint. The other interesting item, and maybe good for the staff to hear, is that ZAR 204 million positive on the preference shares. When we did our staff scheme, Isabella, a few years ago, we had to provide the financing for the scheme to buy the shares. Now, the shares have done well enough that they deepen the money, so they were able to get third-party bank funding and pay the group back. We had a nice couple hundred million debt repayment from the staff scheme. After the dividend, we still had ZAR 700 million surplus capital, cash flows to the group. Combining the surplus capital, the 725, I'm trying to just explain that things are looking quite comfortable right now. Shareholder value, Jeanette Marais already spoke about this.

Speaker #4: Another interesting item, and maybe good for the staff to hear, is that $204 million positive on the preference shares. When we did our staff scheme, Isabella, years ago, we had to sort of provide the financing for the scheme to buy the shares.

Speaker #4: Now, the shares have done well enough that they're deep in the money, so they were able to get third-party bank funding and pay the group back.

Risto Ketola: Now, the shares have done well enough that they deepen the money, so they were able to get third-party bank funding and pay the group back. We had a nice couple hundred million debt repayment from the staff scheme. After the dividend, we still had ZAR 700 million surplus capital, cash flows to the group. Combining the surplus capital, the 725, I'm trying to just explain that things are looking quite comfortable right now. Shareholder value, Jeanette Marais already spoke about this.

Speaker #4: So, we had a nice couple hundred million debt repayment from the staff scheme. And, after the dividend, we still had $700 million surplus cash flows to the group.

Speaker #4: So, combining the surplus capital—the $725 million—you know, I'm just trying to explain that things are looking quite comfortable right now. Shareholder value: Jeanette already spoke about this.

Speaker #4: The payout ratio in the second half was 48%, so that was a bit higher—a bit closer to the midpoint of our 40% to 60%—but for the year, it is still 43%.

Risto Ketola: The payout ratio in the H2 was 48%. So that was a bit higher, a bit closer to the midpoint of our 40% to 60%. But for the year, it is still 43%. I see some analysts wrote about the low payout ratio. Anyway, H2 was a bit better. ROEs. This chart is more meaningful if you have the history. I think we showed this first time six years ago at a capital markets day. One thing that has remained constant is our mature life businesses, Momentum Corporate, Metropolitan Life, Momentum Retail, they always have high ROEs. Running a mature, well-run life company is a high return on capital business. There are a few reasons for it. One of them is you paid the commissions 15, 20 years ago, and now you are sort of harvesting the profits from the in-force book. So we have maintained good returns on those.

Speaker #4: I see some analysts wrote about the low payout ratio. But anyway, the second half was a bit better.

Speaker #5: ROEs.

Speaker #4: This chart is more meaningful if you have the history. I think we showed this for the first time six years ago at a Capital Markets Day.

Speaker #4: One thing that's remained constant is our mature life businesses— corporate, MetLife, Retail, they always have high ROEs. Running a mature, well-run life company is a high return on capital business.

Risto Ketola: One thing that has remained constant is our mature life businesses, Momentum Corporate, Metropolitan Life, Momentum Retail, they always have high ROEs. Running a mature, well-run life company is a high return on capital business. There are a few reasons for it. One of them is you paid the commissions 15, 20 years ago, and now you are sort of harvesting the profits from the in-force book. So we have maintained good returns on those.

Speaker #4: There are a few reasons for it. One of them is that you paid the commissions 15 or 20 years ago, and now you're sort of harvesting the profits from the in-force book.

Speaker #4: So, we have maintained good returns on those. The difference here is GuardRisk used to be close to 20; now it's 30. Insure used to be close to 10; now it's 20.

Risto Ketola: The difference here is Guardrisk used to be close to 20%, now it is 30%. Momentum Insure used to be close to 10%, now it is 20%. India used to be -20%, now it is positive a couple of percent. So we are sort of maintaining our ROEs on mature businesses, but all the smaller businesses have seen steady improvement over that period, which explains the group ROE improvement. The only other topical matter. I knew I am going to run out of time, so there is only one this time. I will try to think of something new for interims. But the performance optimization is going well. Now, when we started, we had a target of ZAR 1 billion, and we said that we had tangible plans for ZAR 883 million, and we said, "We will figure it out.

Speaker #4: India used to be negative 20, now it's positive a couple of percent. So we're sort of maintaining our ROEs on mature businesses, but all the smaller businesses have seen steady improvement over that period.

Speaker #4: Which explains the group ROE improvement. The only other topical matter— I know I'm going to run out of time, so there's only one this time.

Risto Ketola: I knew I am going to run out of time, so there is only one this time. I will try to think of something new for interims. But the performance optimization is going well. Now, when we started, we had a target of ZAR 1 billion, and we said that we had tangible plans for ZAR 883 million, and we said, "We will figure it out.

Speaker #4: Yeah, I'll try to think of something new for interims. But the performance optimization is going well. Now, when we started, we had a target of $1 billion, and we said that we had tangible plans for $883 million.

Speaker #4: And we said, we'll figure it out, we'll find it. And every six months, people come up with new ideas, we update numbers, we sort of get some plans together.

Risto Ketola: We will find it." And every six months, people come with new ideas, we update numbers, we sort of get some plans together. We are now for the first time in a situation that just by delivering on existing projects, we will get to the ZAR 1 billion. There is a good chance we will get to the ZAR 1 billion by interims. We are not going to stop. We will try and find another ZAR 50 million in the next six months beyond that, okay? But things are going well. Some of the stuff we are actively working on, we are moving more sort of infrastructure from on-prem to cloud. There are some small corporate health schemes that we need to deal with. We are also moving from using PCs to tablets in the Metropolitan sales force. I was telling you, because Robin makes so many memes, we cannot afford GPUs and CPUs anymore. Okay. Then on conclusion.

Speaker #4: We're now, for the first time, in a situation where just by delivering on existing projects, we'll get to the billion. There is a good chance we'll get to the billion by interims.

Speaker #4: We're not going to stop. We'll try to find another $500 million in the next six months beyond that, okay? But things like—

Speaker #5: going well.

Speaker #4: Some of the things we're actively working on: we're moving more infrastructure from on-prem to the cloud. There are also some small corporate health schemes that we need to deal with.

Risto Ketola: Some of the stuff we are actively working on, we are moving more sort of infrastructure from on-prem to cloud. There are some small corporate health schemes that we need to deal with. We are also moving from using PCs to tablets in the Metropolitan sales force. I was telling you, because Robin makes so many memes, we cannot afford GPUs and CPUs anymore. Okay. Then on conclusion.

Speaker #4: We're also moving from using PCs to tablets in the metropolitan sales force. I was saying that because Robin makes so many memes, we can't afford GPUs and CPUs anymore.

Speaker #5: Okay. Then on conclusion,

Speaker #4: Firstly, for me, maybe my view of the highlights is a little bit different to Jeanette's. They're both positive, luckily, but the excellent EV growth says something to me.

Risto Ketola: Firstly, for me, maybe my view of the highlight is a little bit different to Jeanette Marais'. They are both positive luckily. But the excellent EV growth says something to me. It does show that we have been able to continue strong returns in the core businesses and seeing sort of breakthrough of the smaller operations and the solvency metrics improving, basically giving us the flexibility to do as we please. Earnings are ahead of targets. Right in the beginning, I said, I think normalized earnings are ZAR 6.6 billion. When we started this project two years ago, the three-year strategy, I actually thought we could get to ZAR 5.8 billion this year. Last year, similarly. We keep being about 10% ahead of our own internal plans. So let us hope we can keep that momentum going.

Speaker #4: It does show that we have been able to continue strong returns in the core businesses, and seeing sort of a breakthrough of the smaller operations, and the solvency metrics improving—basically giving us the flexibility to do as we please.

Speaker #4: Earnings are ahead of targets. Right in the beginning, I said I think normalized earnings are $6.6 billion. When we started this project two years ago, this three-year strategy, I actually thought we could get to $5.8 billion this year.

Risto Ketola: Right in the beginning, I said, I think normalized earnings are ZAR 6.6 billion. When we started this project two years ago, the three-year strategy, I actually thought we could get to ZAR 5.8 billion this year. Last year, similarly. We keep being about 10% ahead of our own internal plans. So let us hope we can keep that momentum going.

Speaker #4: Last year, similarly, we kept being about 10% ahead of our own internal plans. So let's hope we can keep that momentum going. Also, in my opinion—maybe there should be an 'H' there; in my honest opinion—our liquidity and market risk management remain world-class.

Risto Ketola: Also, in my opinion, maybe there should be an H there, in my honest opinion, our liquidity and market risk management remains world-class. It has been pretty volatile out there. We had some geopolitical events. We had some bond yield movements. The level of activity in our sort of derivatives area, risk management is significant, and it is very sophisticated, thank goodness. Profitable growth. This is VNB and non-covered. It has probably come through in lots of the conversations today. I think we are doing exceptionally well running our business as it is. We need to find those incremental growth areas. We need to find some profitable growth. Then lastly, like Jeanette, I have to say congratulations and thank you to all the employees. There are more than 10,000 people here. I can say that the vast majority are pointing in the right direction here. You know what?

Speaker #4: It's been pretty volatile last year. You know, we had some geopolitical events; we had some bond yield movements.

Speaker #5: I mean,

Speaker #4: The level of activity in our derivatives area risk management is significant, and it's very sophisticated—thank goodness. Yeah, profitable growth. This is VNB and non-covered.

Speaker #4: It's probably come through in lots of the conversations today. I think we're doing exceptionally well running our business as it is. We need to find those incremental growth areas.

Risto Ketola: I think we are doing exceptionally well running our business as it is. We need to find those incremental growth areas. We need to find some profitable growth. Then lastly, like Jeanette, I have to say congratulations and thank you to all the employees. There are more than 10,000 people here. I can say that the vast majority are pointing in the right direction here. You know what?

Speaker #4: We need to find some profitable growth. And then lastly, like Jeanette, I have to say congratulations and thank you to all the employees. There are more than 10,000 people here.

Speaker #5: You know.

Speaker #4: I can say that the vast majority are pointing in the right direction here. And you know what, it's not always easy to grow the business while you're having a big optimization project at the same time.

Risto Ketola: It is not always easy to grow the business while you are having a big optimization project at the same time. It requires resilience and real commitment. So thank you to all of you guys. Then obviously our clients and advisors. We will not be able to do it without you either. Thank you, and I will hand over to Dan.

Speaker #4: It requires resilience and real commitment, so thank you to all of you guys. And then, obviously, our clients and advisors—we wouldn't be able to do it without you either.

Speaker #4: Thank you, and I'll hand over to Dan.

Dan Moyane: Well done. Thank you. Thank you very much, Risto, as well as to Jeanette. Let us give them another round of applause for their presentation today. We have a couple of questions from our analysts. I am sure some more might come. We have got a bit of time while we are still on air, on Business Day Television, just to address a few questions. So if you want to send some more, you can. But first up, I am going to start with a question for Jeanette, which is from a staff member, one of those 10,000 people you have mentioned now, Risto. Jeanette, how do we see all the work going into building our culture coming through in the financial results? How is it actually coming through, building the culture?

Speaker #5: Thank you.

Speaker #6: Thank you very much, Risto, as well as to Jeanette. Let's give them another round of applause for their presentation today. We have a couple of questions from our analysts.

Speaker #6: I'm sure some more might come. We've got a bit of time while we're still on air on Business Day Television, just to address a few questions.

Speaker #6: So, if you want to send some more, you can. But first up, I'm going to start with a question for Jeanette, which is from a staff member.

Dan Moyane: So if you want to send some more, you can. But first up, I am going to start with a question for Jeanette, which is from a staff member, one of those 10,000 people you have mentioned now, Risto. Jeanette, how do we see all the work going into building our culture coming through in the financial results? How is it actually coming through, building the culture?

Speaker #6: One of those 10,000 people you've mentioned now, Risto. Jeanette, how do we see all the work going into building our culture coming through in the financial results?

Speaker #6: How is it actually coming through?

Speaker #4: Building the culture. I spoke about that for 20 minutes, did I not? I mean, for me, it's literally just— I think what you see is when...

Jeanette Marais: I spoke about that for 20 minutes. Did I not?

Dan Moyane: Yes.

Jeanette Marais: For me, it's literally just I think what you see is when you give people a reason to get out of bed in the morning. When you, like we did, define a purpose, in our case, how we exist to build and protect our clients' financial dreams. People are motivated by a lot more than just money, are motivated by a lot more than just chasing an unreasonable target of ZAR 7 billion. I think it's playing through really because people really do care about our clients and what we do for our clients, and being part of that journey to making that come through. Thank you.

Speaker #7: You give people a reason to get out of bed in the morning. When you, when you, like we did, define a purpose—in our case, you know, we exist to build and protect our clients' financial dreams.

Speaker #7: People are motivated by a lot more than just money—motivated by a lot more than just chasing an unreasonable target of R7 billion. And I think it's playing through really, because people really do care about our clients, and what we do for our clients, and being part of that journey to making that come true.

Speaker #6: Thank you. They wanted to hear from the leader again. Thank you very much, Jeanette. Not the role for me. Thank you. That's it. Risto, from Michael Christelis at UBS.

Dan Moyane: They wanted to hear from the leader again. Thank you very much, Jeanette.

Jeanette Marais: Nothing more from me.

Dan Moyane: Thank you. That's it. Risto, from Michael Christelis at UBS. Can you give more color on why you have declared a dividend at the low end of your payout range and no additional buybacks? Are you worried about solvency, or do you have other use for the excess capital?

Speaker #6: Can you give more color on why you have declared a dividend at the low end of your payout range and no additional buybacks? Are you worried about solvency, or do you have other use for the excess capital?

Speaker #4: Yeah, Mark, thanks for that. No way it's an easy question, no way it's a hard question. So I think, first of all, there's a bit of a practical issue in that, as a regulated insurer, we just can't wake up in the morning and say, 'Let's go for a buyback.'

Risto Ketola: Yeah. Mike, thanks for that. In a way, it is an easy question, in a way it is a hard question. I think first of all, there is a bit of a practical issue in that, as a regulated insurer, we just cannot wake up in the morning and say, "Let us go for a buyback." There is a process. As an example, some of the modeling changes were made to the SCR. They were only discussed at the actuarial committee for finality a couple of weeks ago. I think there is a bit of a timing issue there. But on the other hand, you are also right that success does breed success in a way. We are currently in a very privileged position that we have number of opportunities that we want to explore. Like Jeanette Marais said, it is not like we are going to do a deal just because we have got money.

Speaker #4: I mean, there's a process. As an example, some of the modelling changes we made to the SCR—they were only discussed at the Actuarial Committee for finality a couple of weeks ago.

Speaker #4: So, I think there's a bit of a timing issue there. But, on the other hand, you also write that success does breed success, in a way.

Risto Ketola: I think there is a bit of a timing issue there. But on the other hand, you are also right that success does breed success in a way. We are currently in a very privileged position that we have number of opportunities that we want to explore. Like Jeanette Marais said, it is not like we are going to do a deal just because we have got money.

Speaker #4: So, we're currently in a very privileged position, in that we have a number of opportunities that we want to explore. Like Jeanette said, it's not like we're going to do a deal just because we've got money, but we want to actually explore those opportunities first before we decide on what to do with the surplus capital.

Risto Ketola: But we want to actually explore those opportunities first before we decide on what to do with the surplus capital. We took the view that we will deal with the normal dividend as ordinary course of business. But with the surplus capital, we will probably take another three to six months to decide exactly what is the best course of action. Right now, the current discount to EV buybacks makes sense, but we also want to explore the other opportunities.

Speaker #4: So, we took the view that we'll deal with the normal dividend as ordinary course of business, but with the surplus capital, we'll probably, you know, take another three to six months to decide exactly what's the best course of action.

Speaker #4: You know, right now the current discount to EV buybacks makes sense, but we also want to explore the other options.

Speaker #6: Opportunities. Okay, hang on, Risto, I've got two more questions from François now. François Dutoit from Anchor Stockbrokers. The first one is: Does part of the R764 million increase in cost of capital—that's the EV impact—relate to increasing cost of reinsurance and hedging associated with actions taken to reduce SCR following the yield curve movement?

Dan Moyane: Okay. Hang on, Risto Ketola. I have got two more questions from Francois du Toit from Anchor Stockbrokers. The first one is, does part of the ZAR 1,764 million increase in cost of capital, that is the EV impact, relate to increasing cost of reinsurance and hedging associated with actions taken to reduce SCR following the yield curve movement? Should we model lower investment returns on capital in future as a result of actions to reduce risk?

Speaker #6: Should we model lower investment returns on capital in the future as a result of actions to reduce risk?

Speaker #4: Again, a complex question, but the short answer is no. The majority of the increase in cost of capital is really additional capital allocated to the businesses.

Risto Ketola: Again, complex question, but the short answer is no. Majority of the increase in cost of capital is really additional capital allocated to the businesses.

Risto Ketola: Again, complex question, but the short answer is no. Majority of the increase in cost of capital is really additional capital allocated to the businesses. Within Momentum Metropolitan Life, we do a notional allocation into Momentum Life, Metropolitan Life Corporate, and some sits in shareholders. There's actually very little sitting in shareholders now because we allocated more to the operating businesses.

Speaker #4: So within Momentum Metropolitan Life, we do a notional allocation into Mom Life, MetLife Corporate, and some sits in shareholders. There's actually very little sitting in shareholders now, because we allocated more to the operating businesses.

Risto Ketola: Within Momentum Metropolitan Life, we do a notional allocation into Momentum Life, Metropolitan Life Corporate, and some sits in shareholders. There's actually very little sitting in shareholders now because we allocated more to the operating businesses.

Speaker #4: The reinsurance modeling, um, it doesn't have an impact on VNB. Also, the investment strategy on the capital is unchanged. So, it's really increasing the allocation towards business units.

Risto Ketola: The reinsurance modeling, it doesn't have an impact on VNB. Also, the investment strategy on the capital is unchanged. It's really increasing the allocation towards business units. That will explain, I think, all of the ZAR 765.

Speaker #4: That will explain, I think, all of the 765.

Speaker #6: Okay, last question from Francois Dutoit, Anchor Brokers. Can you quantify the cost associated with onboarding Bonitas, and therefore the swing in earnings you expect from Bonitas?

Dan Moyane: Okay, last question from Francois du Toit, Anchor Stockbrokers. Can you quantify the cost associated with onboarding Bonitas, and therefore the swing in earnings you expect from Bonitas for FY27?

Speaker #6: Q4 FY27.

Speaker #4: Yeah, the health CFO is shaking her head there, but I mean, these are confidential client matters, but I think it's fair to say it's tens of millions.

Risto Ketola: Yeah. The health CFO is shaking her head there, but these are confidential client matters. But I think it's fair to say it's tens of millions. It's under ZAR 100 million, but it's tens of millions. It's a big number for this, yeah. We expect the scheme to be profitable going forward. So if you go from tens of millions of losses to tens of millions of profits, I think the impact will be noticeable.

Speaker #4: It's under $100 million, but it's tens of millions. It's a big number for this year. We expect the scheme to be profitable going forward.

Speaker #4: So if you go from tens of millions of losses to tens of millions of profits, I mean, I think the impact will be noticeable.

Speaker #4: Okay, um, from Investec wants to know from you, Risto, how do you think about the...

Dan Moyane: Okay. Thapelo Mokonyane from Investec wants to know from you, Risto, how do you think about the share price discount to your EVPS, and how this can unlock over time?

Speaker #6: Share price discount to your EV/PS and how this can unlock over time? Yeah, with patience.

Risto Ketola: Yeah. With patience. Yeah. We keep driving the embedded value growth as much as we can.

Risto Ketola: Yeah. With patience. Yeah. We keep driving the embedded value growth as much as we can. On the share price, we try to tell our story as coherently as we can. Hopefully, people appreciate it. I do think the embedded value is accurate in the way that it hasn't got any heroic assumptions or unusually high values for unlisted subsidiaries or anything like that. So I think the R15 EV is a real number to think about.

Speaker #4: Yeah, I mean, we keep driving the embedded value growth as much as we can. On the share price, we try to tell our story as coherently as we can—hopefully people appreciate it.

Risto Ketola: On the share price, we try to tell our story as coherently as we can. Hopefully, people appreciate it. I do think the embedded value is accurate in the way that it hasn't got any heroic assumptions or unusually high values for unlisted subsidiaries or anything like that. So I think the R15 EV is a real number to think about.

Speaker #4: I do think the embedded value is accurate in the way that it hasn’t got any heroic assumptions or unusually high values for unlisted subsidiaries or anything like that.

Speaker #4: So I think the R15 EV is a real number to think about. I mentioned earlier that we have been doing buybacks for quite a lengthy period of time.

Dan Moyane: Okay.

Risto Ketola: I mentioned earlier that we have been doing buybacks for quite a lengthy period of time. We stopped buybacks at interim because of the yields fell so sharply and the SCR ratio fell. Now, again, remember, we need to go and get regulatory approval, everything else to restart the buyback program. So by stopping the program in December, it means that it takes a little bit of time now to restart the program. That is a natural way of deploying surplus capital at the current discount to EV. So maybe that will help unlock the value a little bit, but the markets must be the markets, and we drive earnings, dividends, and embedded value.

Speaker #4: We stopped buybacks at Interrence because the yields fell so sharply and the SCR ratio fell. Again, remember, we need to go and get regulatory approval and everything else to restart the buyback program.

Speaker #4: So, by stopping the program in December, it means that it takes a little bit of time now to restart the program. That is a natural way of deploying surplus capital at the current discount to EV.

Risto Ketola: So by stopping the program in December, it means that it takes a little bit of time now to restart the program. That is a natural way of deploying surplus capital at the current discount to EV. So maybe that will help unlock the value a little bit, but the markets must be the markets, and we drive earnings, dividends, and embedded value.

Speaker #4: So maybe that, maybe that will help unlock the value a little bit. But the markets must be the markets, and we drive earnings, dividends, and embedded value.

Speaker #4: Okay. From Marius Svedum.

Dan Moyane: Okay. From Marius Strydom now, Austin Lawrence, Guidon. "Risto, well done with another clean set of results with superior disclosure." That is from Marius. One, why did you hold off on significantly writing up your India valuation? How does your alternative DCF compare with sunken costs and peer-based valuations? Finally, when will you reassess a buyback? Could this be after the H1 2027 results?

Speaker #6: Austin Lawrence. Guidon, Risto, well done with another clean set of results with superior disclosure. That's from Marius. One, why did you hold off on significantly writing up your India valuation?

Speaker #6: How does the alternative DCF compare with sunk costs and peer-based valuations? And, finally, when will you reassess a buyback?

Speaker #4: Could this be after the first half of the year 2027 results? Yeah, obviously buybacks are a big theme. Denise is laughing because we had one or two board members.

Risto Ketola: Yeah. Obviously, buybacks are a big theme. Jeanette is laughing because we had one or two board members quick question why we did not maybe speed up some of these things. Anyway. Now they are going to say, "I told you so." Okay. Yeah. Part of it is a practical timing. Even if we wanted to do it now, it would have been quite a tight squeeze. So we could have maybe announced it today and then started in a couple of months. The other one is, like I said, there is a couple of attractive opportunities that could really generate good returns. Then the India one, the DCF is substantially higher than historic cost. So I would agree that there is a bit of a gap in EV, in that we are carrying India at a historic cost. If you use listed peer multiples, you are talking about billions of rands.

Speaker #4: Quick question—why didn’t we maybe speed up some of these things? But anyway, now they’re going to say, “I told you so.” Okay. Yeah.

Speaker #4: So, it's part of—it's a practical timing issue. Even if we wanted to do it now, it would have been quite a tight squeeze.

Speaker #4: So, we could have maybe announced it today and then started in a couple of months. The other one is, like I said, there are a couple of attractive opportunities that could really generate good returns.

Risto Ketola: The other one is, like I said, there is a couple of attractive opportunities that could really generate good returns. Then the India one, the DCF is substantially higher than historic cost. So I would agree that there is a bit of a gap in EV, in that we are carrying India at a historic cost. If you use listed peer multiples, you are talking about billions of rands.

Speaker #4: Uh, then the India one. The DCF is substantially higher than historic cost. So, so I would agree that there's a bit of a gap in EV, in that we're carrying India at a historic cost.

Speaker #4: If you use peer multiples, listed peer multiples, you're talking about billions of rands. You're talking about our own DCF—maybe a little bit less.

Risto Ketola: You are talking about our own DCF, maybe a little bit less. But remember, our own DCF is largely to justify the historic cost.

Risto Ketola: You are talking about our own DCF, maybe a little bit less. But remember, our own DCF is largely to justify the historic cost. So I would not put too much focus on that. I do not think we will move to a DCF anytime soon. I think there is a reasonable possibility that we will get a market value for that asset in due course. We will probably carry that market value.

Speaker #4: But remember, our own DCF is largely to justify the historic cost. So, I wouldn't put too much focus on that. I don't think we will move to a DCF anytime soon.

Risto Ketola: So I would not put too much focus on that. I do not think we will move to a DCF anytime soon. I think there is a reasonable possibility that we will get a market value for that asset in due course.

Speaker #4: I think there's a reasonable possibility that we'll get a market value for that asset in due course, and then we'll probably carry that market value.

Risto Ketola: We will probably carry that market value.

Speaker #4: Okay, thank you very much, Risto. That's all for you.

Dan Moyane: Okay. Thank you very much, Risto. That is all for you.

Dan Moyane: Okay. Thank you very much, Risto. That is all for you. The final question from Michael Christelis, UBS, goes to Peter T. Peter T, he calls you, Peter. Peter T. How has the new Metropolitan No-Lapse policy done since launch? Would you mind coming up to just answering that, Peter? Have we got a roving mic for Peter? Thank you.

Speaker #6: Final question from Michael Christelis, UBS, goes to Peter T. He calls you Peter. Peter T, how has the new Metropolitan no-lapse policy done since launch?

Risto Ketola: Yeah.

Dan Moyane: The final question from Michael Christelis, UBS, goes to Peter T. Peter T, he calls you, Peter. Peter T. How has the new Metropolitan No-Lapse policy done since launch? Would you mind coming up to just answering that, Peter? Have we got a roving mic for Peter? Thank you.

Speaker #6: Would you mind coming up then to sign, answering that, Peter? Have we got a remote—a roving mic for Peter? Thank you. Thank you, Mike.

Peter Tshiguvho: Thank you, Mike.

Speaker #6: Yeah, it's okay.

Dan Moyane: Yeah, it's okay.

Speaker #7: So at the Capital Market Day, that's when we launched the...

Peter Tshiguvho: At the capital market date, that's when we launched the No-Lapse Funeral Growth Plan. Then for two months, we received a whole lot of leads from clients who were really interacting with the system, and there were also a lot of lessons. In the last six to seven weeks, we spent a lot of time to try and improve the client journey, as well as to ensure that we give other alternatives to be able to sell. From the beginning of October, you will see a lot of activities. One, to educate. Two, to also sell a lot more. Then there are some of the partners who would like to engage with us to make sure that we can be able to reach a lot of clients, which we will take advantage of.

Speaker #4: No lapse. Final growth plan, and then for two months.

Speaker #6: We received a whole lot of leads.

Speaker #4: From clients who were really interacting with the system, and there were also a lot of lessons.

Speaker #6: In the last six to seven weeks, we spent a lot of time trying to improve the client journey, as well as to ensure that we give other alternatives to be able to sell. From the beginning of October, you will see a lot of activities.

Peter Tshiguvho: In the last six to seven weeks, we spent a lot of time to try and improve the client journey, as well as to ensure that we give other alternatives to be able to sell. From the beginning of October, you will see a lot of activities. One, to educate. Two, to also sell a lot more. Then there are some of the partners who would like to engage with us to make sure that we can be able to reach a lot of clients, which we will take advantage of.

Speaker #6: One, to educate. Two, to also sell a lot more. And then there are some of the—

Speaker #8: Partners who would like to engage with us to make sure that we are able to reach a lot of clients, which we will take advantage of.

Speaker #8: From the people who engaged with us through the system, it's more than 8,000 people engaged with us through the system. Yes, we have sold more than 1,000 policies, whereas we were only targeting 500 policies during the peak season.

Peter Tshiguvho: From the people who engaged with us through the system, it's more than 8,000 people engaged with us through the system. Yes, we have sold more than 1,000 policies, whereas we were only targeting 500 policies during the POC. Out of that, just over 1,200 policies, more than 300 of them have already paid the minimum required amount of money. So from October, we should be able to see quite a lot of improvement. I see someone is doing clock it.

Speaker #8: Out of that, just over 1,200 policies—more than 300 of them—have already paid the minimum required amount of money. In October, we should be able to see quite a lot of improvement.

Speaker #8: I see someone is doing clock it. Clock it, Peter. Thank you so much.

Dan Moyane: Clock it, Peter. Thank you so much.

Speaker #6: Thank you, Peter. Thank you for that. Thank you. Let's give him a round of applause. Thank you very much, Peter. Thank you. Well, this is how we conclude.

Peter Tshiguvho: Thank you.

Dan Moyane: Thank you, Peter. Thank you for that. Thank you. Let's give him a round of applause. Thank you very much, Peter. Thank you. Well, this is how we conclude the presentation. Once again, thank you, Jeanette Marais. Thank you, Risto Ketola, and thank you to everyone who's participated as well, the analysts in today's question and answer session. As you know, as we conclude, these results, as Jeanette Marais has said, reflecting a strong execution, disciplined leadership, and meaningful progress in delivering the Impact Strategy. Well done again to everyone who joined us here and also across all our various platforms. You can go now and enjoy the rest of the day. Well done. Have a wonderful rest of 17 September. Thank you.

Speaker #6: This is how we conclude the presentation. Once again, thank you, Jeanette. Thank you, Risto. And thank you to everyone who has participated as well, including the analysts in today's question and answer session.

Speaker #6: Now, as you know, as we conclude, these results, as Jeanette has said, reflect strong execution, disciplined leadership, and meaningful progress in delivering the impact strategy.

Dan Moyane: As you know, as we conclude, these results, as Jeanette Marais has said, reflecting a strong execution, disciplined leadership, and meaningful progress in delivering the Impact Strategy. Well done again to everyone who joined us here and also across all our various platforms. You can go now and enjoy the rest of the day. Well done. Have a wonderful rest of 17 September. Thank you.

Speaker #6: Well done again to everyone who joined us here and also across all our various platforms. You can now go and enjoy the rest of the day.

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Q4 2026 Momentum Group Ltd Earnings Call

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